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NYFan221
03-26-2012, 04:46 PM
I have the golden opportunity to write a persuasive essay for one of my classes here at college, in West Chester, PA (eagle's central). We went around the room telling our teacher what we were going to write about, and I said my topic was "Is Eli Elite?," which received a unanimously resounding "no" from the class. We are going to present the papers in class, so I'm really trying to shut all the "no's" up, make them HAVE to agree with me that he is elite, which he obviously is of course.

SO, If anyone could throw out stats, or websites, or any information I could use in order to help "persuade" these stupid fans it would be much appreciated. I'm talking deeper than 2 SB's, 2 SB MVP's, etc.

(im not asking for someone to write my paper, jus help me come up with some facts to support my case)

NYG4lifeNYK
03-26-2012, 04:48 PM
Oh thought you were asking

NYFan221
03-26-2012, 04:53 PM
?

Roxersboxers
03-26-2012, 04:59 PM
6th all time for passing yards in a single season...first all time for most 4th quarter touchdowns...all i can think of off top of my head

Dydigital
03-26-2012, 05:02 PM
watch this video. Tells you some records he has

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=q1JCMFWDW4U&list=FLdH7zDba-JhFp1BEEfDwcXg&feature=mh_lolz

GameTime
03-26-2012, 05:06 PM
I have the golden opportunity to write a persuasive essay for one of my classes here at college, in West Chester, PA (eagle's central). We went around the room telling our teacher what we were going to write about, and I said my topic was "Is Eli Elite?," which received a unanimously resounding "no" from the class. We are going to present the papers in class, so I'm really trying to shut all the "no's" up, make them HAVE to agree with me that he is elite, which he obviously is of course.

SO, If anyone could throw out stats, or websites, or any information I could use in order to help "persuade" these stupid fans it would be much appreciated. I'm talking deeper than 2 SB's, 2 SB MVP's, etc.

(im not asking for someone to write my paper, jus help me come up with some facts to support my case)
</P>


dude....</P>


the internet is FILLED with stats and other info.</P>


Do the reasearch...thats part of writing ......</P>

pino
03-26-2012, 05:06 PM
http://www.pro-football-reference.com/play-index/comeback.cgi?player=MannEl00

A listing of Eli's fourth quarter comebacks. Compare those numbers to the "elite" and I'm sure it will just how clutch Eli really is.

NYFan221
03-26-2012, 05:08 PM
I have the golden opportunity to write a persuasive essay for one of my classes here at college, in West Chester, PA (eagle's central). We went around the room telling our teacher what we were going to write about, and I said my topic was "Is Eli Elite?," which received a unanimously resounding "no" from the class. We are going to present the papers in class, so I'm really trying to shut all the "no's" up, make them HAVE to agree with me that he is elite, which he obviously is of course.

SO, If anyone could throw out stats, or websites, or any information I could use in order to help "persuade" these stupid fans it would be much appreciated. I'm talking deeper than 2 SB's, 2 SB MVP's, etc.

(im not asking for someone to write my paper, jus help me come up with some facts to support my case)
</p>


dude....</p>


the internet is FILLED with stats and other info.</p>


Do the reasearch...thats part of writing ......</p>

this message board can be considered a resource on anything giants, since almost all of it's members are knowledgable about this team. so shut it :P

BlueBlooded1979
03-26-2012, 05:15 PM
I have the golden opportunity to write a persuasive essay for one of my classes here at college, in West Chester, PA (eagle's central). We went around the room telling our teacher what we were going to write about, and I said my topic was "Is Eli Elite?," which received a unanimously resounding "no" from the class. We are going to present the papers in class, so I'm really trying to shut all the "no's" up, make them HAVE to agree with me that he is elite, which he obviously is of course.

SO, If anyone could throw out stats, or websites, or any information I could use in order to help "persuade" these stupid fans it would be much appreciated. I'm talking deeper than 2 SB's, 2 SB MVP's, etc.

(im not asking for someone to write my paper, jus help me come up with some facts to support my case)


To answer the question simply it is yes. 4th QTR comebacks are what this kid does and without the numbers in from of me he probably wins 80%-85% of games when tied or down by 1 score in the last 5 mins.

From a strategy standpoint if your professor is an Eagles fan then change your topic. In my experience college professors grade more harshly when they don't agree with you. While I never experienced it in sports I have seen it when it comes to other feverish topics like politics, religion or morality.

Drez
03-26-2012, 05:18 PM
<ul> He holds the single season record for 4Q TD passes at 15, passing Johnny U and Peyton. He is one of only a handful of QBs to have thrown for at least 3k yards and 20 TDs in 7 consecutive seasons. Granted, this is old (only current through the '09-'10 season), but Eli had the highest Adjusted Comeback Efficiency Rating. Link (http://www.footballoutsiders.com/ramblings/2010/guest-column-adjusted-comeback-efficiency) Joins HoFers Bart Starr (2), Terry Bradshaw (2), Joe Montana (3), and current, and likely first ballot HoFer, QB Tom Brady (2) as only QBs with multiple Super Bowl MVP awards.
Runs a "check with me" type offense, where he calls at least 2 plays in the huddle and checks into the one he believes is best dependent upon defensive alignment. Also has total audible control at the line of scrimmage. Runs one of the most complicated offenses in the NFL. Is required to make presnap reads to check into a play (see above), sets protections for the linemen. On passing plays, both he and the WRs must read the defense as the routes may adjust at several different points dependent upon how the defense is playing the WRs. Only one of two QBs to lead 2 come from behind TD drives in the 4Q of a SB ('07). The other being Joe Montana. His numbers since becoming a full season starter stack up against those of other elite QBs, such as Brees, Brady, and Peyton at similar points in their careers. I don't have the numbers on hand anymore, but you can easily add it up by going to nfl.com or espn.com and looking up their stats.[/list]

If I can think of more, I'll come back and post them.
</p>

Drez
03-26-2012, 05:19 PM
I have the golden opportunity to write a persuasive essay for one of my classes here at college, in West Chester, PA (eagle's central). We went around the room telling our teacher what we were going to write about, and I said my topic was "Is Eli Elite?," which received a unanimously resounding "no" from the class. We are going to present the papers in class, so I'm really trying to shut all the "no's" up, make them HAVE to agree with me that he is elite, which he obviously is of course.

SO, If anyone could throw out stats, or websites, or any information I could use in order to help "persuade" these stupid fans it would be much appreciated. I'm talking deeper than 2 SB's, 2 SB MVP's, etc.

(im not asking for someone to write my paper, jus help me come up with some facts to support my case)
</p>


dude....</p>


the internet is FILLED with stats and other info.</p>


Do the reasearch...thats part of writing ......</p>
Isn't this the internet? [;)]

pino
03-26-2012, 05:24 PM
http://www.pro-football-reference.com/play-index/pgl_finder.cgi

Here is the URL to run queries. I ran a few for example:

http://pfref.com/tiny/LnK9E

In multiple seasons, from 1970 to 2011, in the NFL, in the regular season and playoffs, QB credited with 4th quarter comeback, QB credited with game-winning drive, is active, not a member of the Hall of Fame, sorted by most games matching criteria.

Eli is #4 in active players. He's #15 if you include retired and hall of fame players from 1970.

Oh by the way. He's still has PLENTY of football ahead of him.

FDNY Fitzy
03-26-2012, 05:32 PM
You are going to have to define, as part of your dictation an arbitrary term.

You are going to have to put a stamp on exactly what qualifies "Elite" and then showing how Eli is within that is the second step.

It isn't enough to just throw factoids and then say that A+B+C = Elite

Joe Morrison
03-26-2012, 05:33 PM
This thread was dead after the Dallas, 49er, Packer, Patriot domintation.</P>

NYG55nwo
03-26-2012, 05:38 PM
<UL>
<LI>He holds the single season record for 4Q TD passes at 15, passing Johnny U and Peyton.
<LI>He is one of only a handful of QBs to have thrown for at least 3k yards and 20 TDs in 7 consecutive seasons.
<LI>Granted, this is old (only current through the '09-'10 season), but Eli had the highest Adjusted Comeback Efficiency Rating. Link (http://www.footballoutsiders.com/ramblings/2010/guest-column-adjusted-comeback-efficiency)
<LI>Joins HoFers Bart Starr (2), Terry Bradshaw (2), Joe Montana (3), and current, and likely first ballot HoFer, QB Tom Brady (2) as only QBs with multiple Super Bowl MVP awards.

<LI>Runs a "check with me" type offense, where he calls at least 2 plays in the huddle and checks into the one he believes is best dependent upon defensive alignment. Also has total audible control at the line of scrimmage.
<LI>Runs one of the most complicated offenses in the NFL. Is required to make presnap reads to check into a play (see above), sets protections for the linemen. On passing plays, both he and the WRs must read the defense as the routes may adjust at several different points dependent upon how the defense is playing the WRs.
<LI>Only one of two QBs to lead 2 come from behind TD drives in the 4Q of a SB ('07). The other being Joe Montana.
<LI>His numbers since becoming a full season starter stack up against those of other elite QBs, such as Brees, Brady, and Peyton at similar points in their careers. I don't have the numbers on hand anymore, but you can easily add it up by going to nfl.com or espn.com and looking up their stats.</LI>[/list]


If I can think of more, I'll come back and post them.
</P>



</P>


This</P>

dsd28
03-26-2012, 08:25 PM
compare eli's current stats with other elite qb's through the same number of seasons/games. i think there was a thread doing just that a few months ago.

Drez
03-26-2012, 08:42 PM
compare eli's current stats with other elite qb's through the same number of seasons/games. i think there was a thread doing just that a few months ago.

Yeah, I think I was the one that actually posted his stats next to Brees', Brady's, and Peyton's through their first 7 years as full season starters. Eli's are pretty comparable.

NYFan221
03-26-2012, 08:45 PM
thanks everyone!

giantsd fan
03-26-2012, 09:27 PM
Eli has never missed a game in his career thus far.</P>

GameTime
03-26-2012, 10:23 PM
I have the golden opportunity to write a persuasive essay for one of my classes here at college, in West Chester, PA (eagle's central). We went around the room telling our teacher what we were going to write about, and I said my topic was "Is Eli Elite?," which received a unanimously resounding "no" from the class. We are going to present the papers in class, so I'm really trying to shut all the "no's" up, make them HAVE to agree with me that he is elite, which he obviously is of course.

SO, If anyone could throw out stats, or websites, or any information I could use in order to help "persuade" these stupid fans it would be much appreciated. I'm talking deeper than 2 SB's, 2 SB MVP's, etc.

(im not asking for someone to write my paper, jus help me come up with some facts to support my case)
</P>


dude....</P>


the internet is FILLED with stats and other info.</P>


Do the reasearch...thats part of writing ......</P>



Isn't this the internet? [;)]
</P>


touche' Drez....</P>


but to something as simple as gathering stats and info about a player like Eli and he, as a student, has to ask for help? Come on man......do the work and do your own paper.....[B]</P>

GameTime
03-26-2012, 10:25 PM
I have the golden opportunity to write a persuasive essay for one of my classes here at college, in West Chester, PA (eagle's central). We went around the room telling our teacher what we were going to write about, and I said my topic was "Is Eli Elite?," which received a unanimously resounding "no" from the class. We are going to present the papers in class, so I'm really trying to shut all the "no's" up, make them HAVE to agree with me that he is elite, which he obviously is of course.

SO, If anyone could throw out stats, or websites, or any information I could use in order to help "persuade" these stupid fans it would be much appreciated. I'm talking deeper than 2 SB's, 2 SB MVP's, etc.

(im not asking for someone to write my paper, jus help me come up with some facts to support my case)
</P>


dude....</P>


the internet is FILLED with stats and other info.</P>


Do the reasearch...thats part of writing ......</P>




this message board can be considered a resource on anything giants, since almost all of it's members are knowledgable about this team. so shut it :P


</P>


thats one way to look at it. I look at as you are a lazy little ******* and dont want to do the research yourself. Good luck with your paper.......[B]</P>

GmenFan1980
03-26-2012, 10:37 PM
http://cache.gawkerassets.com/assets/images/valleywag/2008/11/let_me_google_that_for_you_demonstrates_how_to_use _google.jpg

chasjay
03-26-2012, 11:11 PM
You are going to have to define, as part of your dictation an arbitrary term.

You are going to have to put a stamp on exactly what qualifies "Elite" and then showing how Eli is within that is the second step.

It isn't enough to just throw factoids and then say that A+B+C = Elite

the flip side of Fitzy's post (which I agree with) is that saying Eli is <u>not</u> elite is just as arbitrary as saying that he is - in the end you are stating an opinion and those that disagree with you are also stating an opinion - there is no firm, objective definition of an elite QB - nor is there one for a urologist or of an automobile mechanic

Drez
03-26-2012, 11:34 PM
I have the golden opportunity to write a persuasive essay for one of my classes here at college, in West Chester, PA (eagle's central). We went around the room telling our teacher what we were going to write about, and I said my topic was "Is Eli Elite?," which received a unanimously resounding "no" from the class. We are going to present the papers in class, so I'm really trying to shut all the "no's" up, make them HAVE to agree with me that he is elite, which he obviously is of course.

SO, If anyone could throw out stats, or websites, or any information I could use in order to help "persuade" these stupid fans it would be much appreciated. I'm talking deeper than 2 SB's, 2 SB MVP's, etc.

(im not asking for someone to write my paper, jus help me come up with some facts to support my case)
</p>


dude....</p>


the internet is FILLED with stats and other info.</p>


Do the reasearch...thats part of writing ......</p>



Isn't this the internet? [;)]
</p>


touche' Drez....</p>


but to something as simple as gathering stats and info about a player like Eli and he, as a student, has to ask for help? Come on man......do the work and do your own paper.....[B]</p>
No doubt. But, notice, save for the HoF QB bullet and the FO link, I didn't provide any concrete info, lol. Or at least nothing that he could use directly. He'd still have to research what I said to have verifiable sources. Pointing someone in the right direction isn't a bad thing.

jomo
03-26-2012, 11:46 PM
I have the golden opportunity to write a persuasive essay for one of my classes here at college, in West Chester, PA (eagle's central). We went around the room telling our teacher what we were going to write about, and I said my topic was "Is Eli Elite?," which received a unanimously resounding "no" from the class. We are going to present the papers in class, so I'm really trying to shut all the "no's" up, make them HAVE to agree with me that he is elite, which he obviously is of course.

SO, If anyone could throw out stats, or websites, or any information I could use in order to help "persuade" these stupid fans it would be much appreciated. I'm talking deeper than 2 SB's, 2 SB MVP's, etc.

(im not asking for someone to write my paper, jus help me come up with some facts to support my case)
Don't waste your time with trying to convince that sub-human species. (PS you should have know better) You've got a better shotat convincing themthat Wawahas better coffee than Starbucks!

JJC7301
03-26-2012, 11:56 PM
6th all time for passing yards in a single season...first all time for most 4th quarter touchdowns...all i can think of off top of my head
Yep, he's ELIte.

I couldn't care what other fans and "experts" say either. I'll be laughing at them even more when the Giants eventually win at least a 3rd SB with Eli at the helm before he retires.

giantsfan420
03-27-2012, 12:32 AM
To go along with drez post;

Eli has the best road playoff record all time.

Since he became starter he has the highest win % out of any qb in the nfc.

And thats an impressife stat with eli being one of 6 i believe qbs to throw for 3000 or more yards and 20tds or more for six straight seasons or more, the rest that did it r like the best qbs of all time.

The 15 4th quarter tds most all time in reg season is huge too.

I think u should focus on how consistently winning is a huge part of defining what elite is and eli is a bigtime winner.

Bohemian
03-27-2012, 12:46 AM
I would certainly focus on his character and leadership, and the fact that he does not play for some small market team, where the media are soft. He plays in the toughest place possible, and had never relied on trying to mislead with propaganda, but has always backed it up with on-field results. He has the admiration of all the important league players and management alike. The only people out there still bickering about his quality, are those very players whose quality pales to Eli.

He is clearly the greatest QB the Giants have ever had... and that is not easy to say, as the franchise has had some great ones, including hall of famers Frank Tarkenton and Y.A. Tittle.

Is in not the question of how elite amongst active QBs today, but rather, how elite he is amongst those who have played the game.

nygsb42champs
03-27-2012, 08:02 AM
The most come from behind 4th qtr. wins in NFL history.

GameTime
03-27-2012, 08:38 AM
I have the golden opportunity to write a persuasive essay for one of my classes here at college, in West Chester, PA (eagle's central). We went around the room telling our teacher what we were going to write about, and I said my topic was "Is Eli Elite?," which received a unanimously resounding "no" from the class. We are going to present the papers in class, so I'm really trying to shut all the "no's" up, make them HAVE to agree with me that he is elite, which he obviously is of course.

SO, If anyone could throw out stats, or websites, or any information I could use in order to help "persuade" these stupid fans it would be much appreciated. I'm talking deeper than 2 SB's, 2 SB MVP's, etc.

(im not asking for someone to write my paper, jus help me come up with some facts to support my case)
</P>


dude....</P>


the internet is FILLED with stats and other info.</P>


Do the reasearch...thats part of writing ......</P>



Isn't this the internet? [;)]
</P>


touche' Drez....</P>


but to something as simple as gathering stats and info about a player like Eli and he, as a student, has to ask for help? Come on man......do the work and do your own paper.....[B]</P>



No doubt. But, notice, save for the HoF QB bullet and the FO link, I didn't provide any concrete info, lol. Or at least nothing that he could use directly. He'd still have to research what I said to have verifiable sources. Pointing someone in the right direction isn't a bad thing.
</P>


I hear ya....</P>


I am just being a ballbuster to thekid. I am not that old but old enough to where college kids are now just young punks to me.....lol. Just having some fun.......</P>

BeatYale
03-27-2012, 11:19 AM
Anyone else tired of this same topic coming up over and over again?

NYFan221
03-27-2012, 11:31 AM
I have the golden opportunity to write a persuasive essay for one of my classes here at college, in West Chester, PA (eagle's central). We went around the room telling our teacher what we were going to write about, and I said my topic was "Is Eli Elite?," which received a unanimously resounding "no" from the class. We are going to present the papers in class, so I'm really trying to shut all the "no's" up, make them HAVE to agree with me that he is elite, which he obviously is of course.

SO, If anyone could throw out stats, or websites, or any information I could use in order to help "persuade" these stupid fans it would be much appreciated. I'm talking deeper than 2 SB's, 2 SB MVP's, etc.

(im not asking for someone to write my paper, jus help me come up with some facts to support my case)
</p>


dude....</p>


the internet is FILLED with stats and other info.</p>


Do the reasearch...thats part of writing ......</p>



Isn't this the internet? [;)]
</p>


touche' Drez....</p>


but to something as simple as gathering stats and info about a player like Eli and he, as a student, has to ask for help? Come on man......do the work and do your own paper.....[B]</p>



No doubt. But, notice, save for the HoF QB bullet and the FO link, I didn't provide any concrete info, lol. Or at least nothing that he could use directly. He'd still have to research what I said to have verifiable sources. Pointing someone in the right direction isn't a bad thing.
</p>


I hear ya....</p>


I am just being a ballbuster to thekid. I am not that old but old enough to where college kids are now just young punks to me.....lol. Just having some fun.......</p>

lol young punk. Just as young punk stated im just trying to be lead in the right direction. I obviously can't use you "not old, but old enough" people as sources [:P] just trying to get my background knowledge up to par, before I start my research. Less of a young punk, and more of an intuitive student if you ask me[^o)]

MattMeyerBud
03-27-2012, 11:38 AM
I have the golden opportunity to write a persuasive essay for one of my classes here at college, in West Chester, PA (eagle's central). We went around the room telling our teacher what we were going to write about, and I said my topic was "Is Eli Elite?," which received a unanimously resounding "no" from the class. We are going to present the papers in class, so I'm really trying to shut all the "no's" up, make them HAVE to agree with me that he is elite, which he obviously is of course.

SO, If anyone could throw out stats, or websites, or any information I could use in order to help "persuade" these stupid fans it would be much appreciated. I'm talking deeper than 2 SB's, 2 SB MVP's, etc.

(im not asking for someone to write my paper, jus help me come up with some facts to support my case)


never had a losing record in the NFL

giants are always top 5 of the NFL in dropped passes

develops young WRs, even last year when his whole receiving core was hurt he still put up great numbers

This year he threw for the 6th most amount of yards that any QB has ever thrown.

He'll finish top 10 most TDs thrown all time EASY

...and he does this all on the east cost not in a dome

GameTime
03-27-2012, 11:44 AM
I have the golden opportunity to write a persuasive essay for one of my classes here at college, in West Chester, PA (eagle's central). We went around the room telling our teacher what we were going to write about, and I said my topic was "Is Eli Elite?," which received a unanimously resounding "no" from the class. We are going to present the papers in class, so I'm really trying to shut all the "no's" up, make them HAVE to agree with me that he is elite, which he obviously is of course.

SO, If anyone could throw out stats, or websites, or any information I could use in order to help "persuade" these stupid fans it would be much appreciated. I'm talking deeper than 2 SB's, 2 SB MVP's, etc.

(im not asking for someone to write my paper, jus help me come up with some facts to support my case)
</P>


dude....</P>


the internet is FILLED with stats and other info.</P>


Do the reasearch...thats part of writing ......</P>



Isn't this the internet? [;)]
</P>


touche' Drez....</P>


but to something as simple as gathering stats and info about a player like Eli and he, as a student, has to ask for help? Come on man......do the work and do your own paper.....[B]</P>



No doubt. But, notice, save for the HoF QB bullet and the FO link, I didn't provide any concrete info, lol. Or at least nothing that he could use directly. He'd still have to research what I said to have verifiable sources. Pointing someone in the right direction isn't a bad thing.
</P>


I hear ya....</P>


I am just being a ballbuster to thekid. I am not that old but old enough to where college kids are now just young punks to me.....lol. Just having some fun.......</P>




lol young punk. Just as young punk stated im just trying to be lead in the right direction. I obviously can't use you "not old, but old enough" people as sources [:P] just trying to get my background knowledge up to par, before I start my research. Less of a young punk, and more of an intuitive student if you ask me[^o)]
</P>


ok.....see you have formed an adult and mature response explaining your postion. Congratulations!!.....[B] (assuming you are old enough to legally drink a beer.....[:D])</P>

Lambeau12
03-27-2012, 11:51 AM
I tip my hat off to Eli. At first in his career I thought he was going to be mediocre. He has really developed into a great quarterback. He put up alot of passing yards this last season.

GameTime
03-27-2012, 11:54 AM
I have the golden opportunity to write a persuasive essay for one of my classes here at college, in West Chester, PA (eagle's central). We went around the room telling our teacher what we were going to write about, and I said my topic was "Is Eli Elite?," which received a unanimously resounding "no" from the class. We are going to present the papers in class, so I'm really trying to shut all the "no's" up, make them HAVE to agree with me that he is elite, which he obviously is of course.

SO, If anyone could throw out stats, or websites, or any information I could use in order to help "persuade" these stupid fans it would be much appreciated. I'm talking deeper than 2 SB's, 2 SB MVP's, etc.

(im not asking for someone to write my paper, jus help me come up with some facts to support my case)
</P>


dude....</P>


the internet is FILLED with stats and other info.</P>


Do the reasearch...thats part of writing ......</P>



Isn't this the internet? [;)]
</P>


touche' Drez....</P>


but to something as simple as gathering stats and info about a player like Eli and he, as a student, has to ask for help? Come on man......do the work and do your own paper.....[B]</P>



No doubt. But, notice, save for the HoF QB bullet and the FO link, I didn't provide any concrete info, lol. Or at least nothing that he could use directly. He'd still have to research what I said to have verifiable sources. Pointing someone in the right direction isn't a bad thing.
</P>


I hear ya....</P>


I am just being a ballbuster to thekid. I am not that old but old enough to where college kids are now just young punks to me.....lol. Just having some fun.......</P>




lol young punk. Just as young punk stated im just trying to be lead in the right direction. I obviously can't use you "not old, but old enough" people as sources [:P] just trying to get my background knowledge up to par, before I start my research. Less of a young punk, and more of an intuitive student if you ask me[^o)]
</P>


ok.....see you have formed an adult and mature response explaining your postion. Congratulations!!.....[B] (assuming you are old enough to legally drink a beer.....[:D])</P>


</P>


Hell...I'll even give you some material to write about.</P>


When the whole mess with Eli being drafted and traded went down his refusal to play for AJ Smith and Chargers was of course the big news. All the nay sayers were blasting Eli for letting his "Daddy" Archie make his decisons for him.</P>


Well....you have the unique perspective of being around the same age as when Eli was coming into the NFL. Put yourself in that circumstance.....If you were about to make a life changing decison worth millions of dallars and encompass the next several years of your life and reputation would you rely on the input of your Mom or Dad at such a young age?/ I know I would. Assuming of course one is fortunate enough to have a stable family unit with parents who are available to help with such decsions.</P>


there you go......</P>

ashleymarie
03-28-2012, 03:34 PM
Eli will be elite someday after he wins a couple of superbowls and a MVP award.

Yonks
03-28-2012, 03:43 PM
Is water wet?

chasjay
03-28-2012, 04:22 PM
Anyone else tired of this same topic coming up over and over again?

Yes, but there was a little different slant to this one - the O.P. was talking about making the argument instead of a post defending or denying the proposition. Hopefully, this is the last one until the Giants win another SB.

And just so's you know, I'm unstable even before the games, not just after the ones we lose.

giantsaz
03-28-2012, 05:25 PM
Also, do not forget to mention the intangibles such as:

1. Never complains about taking a beating unlike Vick-since you are in eagle territory
2. Never gets rattled no matter how rough the beating is. Just get's up and wins games.
3. He is all class: Never any off the field controversies.

Yeah, I know it is all about Character and it seems that the younger generation couldn't give a rat's *** about it. But it does matter.

JPP
03-28-2012, 07:56 PM
You are going to have to define, as part of your dictation an arbitrary term.

You are going to have to put a stamp on exactly what qualifies "Elite" and then showing how Eli is within that is the second step.

It isn't enough to just throw factoids and then say that A+B+C = Elite

the flip side of Fitzy's post (which I agree with) is that saying Eli is <u>not</u> elite is just as arbitrary as saying that he is - in the end you are stating an opinion and those that disagree with you are also stating an opinion - there is no firm, objective definition of an elite QB - nor is there one for a urologist or of an automobile mechanic


That is not true, if he can take the stats of what many people believe to be "elite QBs" and show that Eli is on the same plane as even the top QBs then to argue anyone is elite would also count towards Eli.

Drez
03-28-2012, 09:19 PM
never had a losing record in the NFL <font color="#0000FF">This needs to be qualified as a full season starter. Wasn't he 1-6 as a starter in his rookie year?</font>

giants are always top 5 of the NFL in dropped passes <font color="#0000FF">This one is touchy and I'd leave it alone in a persuasive argument, as it can be argued that Eli himself is the cause of many of those passes. It's a box best left unopened, if you ask me.</font>

...and he does this all on the east cost not in a dome <font color="#0000FF">Along with this, he plays in the NFCE, one of the toughest divisions in football since his arrival in '04. </font>

Drez
03-28-2012, 09:23 PM
lol young punk. Just as young punk stated im just trying to be lead in the right direction. I obviously can't use you "not old, but old enough" people as sources [:P] just trying to get my background knowledge up to par, before I start my research. Less of a young punk, and more of an intuitive student if you ask me[^o)]


Something you could also address is that Eli tends to fall victim of the moving the goalpost fallacy, which essentially means that someone will ask for criteria that Eli is elite. You furnish evidence that fulfills those criteria, then the person decides that that is not enough and more is needed (see Gumby).

chasjay
03-28-2012, 09:44 PM
You are going to have to define, as part of your dictation an arbitrary term.

You are going to have to put a stamp on exactly what qualifies "Elite" and then showing how Eli is within that is the second step.

It isn't enough to just throw factoids and then say that A+B+C = Elite

the flip side of Fitzy's post (which I agree with) is that saying Eli is <u>not</u> elite is just as arbitrary as saying that he is - in the end you are stating an opinion and those that disagree with you are also stating an opinion - there is no firm, objective definition of an elite QB - nor is there one for a urologist or of an automobile mechanic


That is not true, if he can take the stats of what many people believe to be "elite QBs" and show that Eli is on the same plane as even the top QBs then to argue anyone is elite would also count towards Eli.

Yeah? Well, I'm an Eli homer and try to be PC to a fault. I need to quit that.

Mohann
03-29-2012, 01:21 AM
The reason this will always come up is because Eli's intangibles are so high and that doesn't show up any stat except wins. The book on Eli coming out of college was that he had magic, that something special. He could lead a team to improbable wins. I think we can agree that's true. Now prove it without using numbers.

Bashum_Blue
03-29-2012, 09:34 AM
Another way to look at this is the OP is doing a social experiment and trying to stoke the fires of this board and do his paper on the polarizing character that is Eli Manning.

Either way, If people are still saying Eli doesn't deserve the Elite moniker then you should just point them to the two Superbowl MVPs and the two Superbowl Rings.

Oh and the haters who are still hung up on the draft? Why don't you ask Phillip "cry me a river" Rivers how his contract negotiations went with that parasite A.J. Smith when he had to hold out
untll the last week in training camp because A.J. Smith is a cheap *******.

Redeyejedi
03-29-2012, 09:53 AM
After this Super Bowl it isnt debatable anymore. Im convinced not another QB in the NFL could of taken that beating against the 49ers and not A.Turned the ball over or B.Left the game from Injury.
A lot of fans of other teams think just because he looks goofy he isnt tough.
Eli Manning is the Toughest QB in the NFL mentally and physically.