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View Full Version : The drought (1957-1985)



Bohemian
03-29-2012, 01:40 AM
Hello all,

I am looking for stories about the lean years from 57' to 85'.
What are your favorite, and least favorite memories from that period?
Who were the great players that dedicated themselves to improving the team?
How was the Giants-Jets rivalry perceived those days?

Plus just add anything else that comes to mind.

I am really looking to learn more about our team`s history.

Thanks, Go Blue!

NYG4ME
03-29-2012, 01:45 AM
This is actually a great topic to bring up. Gives alot of us some perspective on what it was like LONG for a title. My dad always talks about these years.. Said he earned his stripes as a fan. Also said he was at the "miracle at the meadowlands game" didn't talk to anyone after the game until the following Saturday. lol

Bohemian
03-29-2012, 01:54 AM
I have been itching at posting this topic for a while. I am very intrigued about how our collective memory deals with such a tough time. We seemed to have had some good teams, but there also seemed to have existed a complete inability to compete after looking to Baltimore in 58`, finally completely imploding after the 63`season. I am just going from what I read in wikipedia, but I am sure that there are tons of stories that can set the record straight.

RagTime Blue
03-29-2012, 03:07 AM
I don't remember life before LT, but I'll say that in the early 80's, this organization was akin to how most people think of the Cleveland Browns now. . .once in a while contenders, but never a threat.

Meanhothead
03-29-2012, 03:42 AM
it sucked

BlueSanta
03-29-2012, 07:24 AM
You should be banned for bringing this up.

Gimaniac
03-29-2012, 07:41 AM
I actually became a Giant fan during this era. Tickets were a lot easier to come by, lol.

CTLadyBlue
03-29-2012, 08:50 AM
This sums up my misery from 1978. Probably the lowest of low depths they could've sunk.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ML1Ixd3jiGU

firstgamein49
03-29-2012, 09:29 AM
The drought started in '64, not '57. The teams from 58--63 were super. They won no championships, but they were more than competitive, they were feared! Consider in 58-9, they were beaten by the Colts. In 61-2, by the Pack, and in 63 by the Bears. It took 3 different teams to beat them. '58 was really special. The team didn't have much in the way of offense, but the D was, imho, the best in NFL history. They throttled the best RB in NFL history for 3 games. They held the Colts, the highest scoring team that year, to well under their ave., and keep in mind that the deciding play of that game was a blown call by the line judge. Also in that game, Gifford lost 3 fumbles! Giff didn't fumble much during his career, but 3....! The following year, Giff wanted to try out at the QB spot to take Conerly's place. He felt that a mobile QB would help the O put more ponts on the board. He didn't really get a shot. '60 was a tough yr. I was in college at Lafayette, and most of my friends were Eagle fans, and of course they won it that year. '61, the Giants were back, and gave the Pack a run for their $. I could go on and on.....

SweetZombieJesus
03-29-2012, 09:48 AM
The last championship in 1956 was actually the beginning of a golden era. The Giants had just moved into Yankee Stadium, they had Lombardi and Landry on the same staff, and were loaded with star players. Coincidentally the Yankees were in one of several golden eras in that same time, so Yankee Stadium was the center of the sports universe, with the Yankees always in the World Series and the Giants always in the NFL Championship game.

The Giants would make the NFL Championship Game 6 times in 8 years (56 58 59 61 62 63) but unfortunately they would only win that one in 1956. The 1958 game vs. the Colts is "The Greatest Game Ever Played", which the Colts won in overtime and it shot the NFL into the national spotlight and lead directly to the creation of the AFL in 1960.

After the 1963 season the team was picked apart (Sam Huff was sent to Washington where he remains to this day)... Wellington's loyalty to head coaches Allie Sherman and Alex Webster meant a decade of misery, and then they tried the Jets' solution of bringing in big names to fix the team (guys like Fran Tarkenton and Larry Czonka) throughout the 1970s. I think they had two non-losing seasons in the 70s, it was bad. The Giants, once a crown jewel of the NFL, were the laughing stock.

It culminated with the 1978 "Miracle at the Meadowlands". Winning against the Philadelphia Eagles, all they needed to do was drain the clock. But back then there was no "victory formation", they ran a running play which Larry Czonka fumbled, the Eagles recovered, and won the game, it sent a good season into a tailspin and wrecked it.

That dark moment gave birth to the modern era. The league intervened and forced them to take a GM, George Young of the Colts... He brought in a new coaching staff that contained a guy named Bill Parcells as linebacker coach, and he drafted a young QB named Phil Simms. The current organization and its successes are built on what those guys did 30+ years ago.

The "classic" Giants (before the Super Bowl) are actually a very proud and successful franchise that gets lost because they lost in the big game so much, and because the team was so bad as the NFL exploded in popularity in the 1970s. Unfortunately that stretch of 6 championship games in 8 years and only winning one is a microcosm of Giants History. The Giants played in the NFL Championship Game in 1933, 1934, 1935, 1938, 1939, 1941, 1943, 1944, 1946, 1950, 1956, 1958, 1959, 1961, 1962, 1963, <font size="4">16 times</font>, only winning 3. They were good enough to play in the Championship Game all those times.

GameTime
03-29-2012, 10:05 AM
The last championship in 1956 was actually the beginning of a golden era. The Giants had just moved into Yankee Stadium, they had Lombardi and Landry on the same staff, and were loaded with star players. Coincidentally the Yankees were in one of several golden eras in that same time, so Yankee Stadium was the center of the sports universe, with the Yankees always in the World Series and the Giants always in the NFL Championship game.

The Giants would make the NFL Championship Game 6 times in 8 years (56 58 59 61 62 63) but unfortunately they would only win that one in 1956. The 1958 game vs. the Colts is "The Greatest Game Ever Played", which the Colts won in overtime and it shot the NFL into the national spotlight and lead directly to the creation of the AFL in 1960.

After the 1963 season the team was picked apart (Sam Huff was sent to Washington where he remains to this day)... Wellington's loyalty to head coaches Allie Sherman and Alex Webster meant a decade of misery, and then they tried the Jets' solution of bringing in big names to fix the team (guys like Fran Tarkenton and Larry Czonka) throughout the 1970s. I think they had two non-losing seasons in the 70s, it was bad. The Giants, once a crown jewel of the NFL, were the laughing stock.

It culminated with the 1978 "Miracle at the Meadowlands". Winning against the Philadelphia Eagles, all they needed to do was drain the clock. But back then there was no "victory formation", they ran a running play which Larry Czonka fumbled, the Eagles recovered, and won the game, it sent a good season into a tailspin and wrecked it.

That dark moment gave birth to the modern era. The league intervened and forced them to take a GM, George Young of the Colts... He brought in a new coaching staff that contained a guy named Bill Parcells as linebacker coach, and he drafted a young QB named Phil Simms. The current organization and its successes are built on what those guys did 30+ years ago.

The "classic" Giants (before the Super Bowl) are actually a very proud and successful franchise that gets lost because they lost in the big game so much, and because the team was so bad as the NFL exploded in popularity in the 1970s. Unfortunately that stretch of 6 championship games in 8 years and only winning one is a microcosm of Giants History. The Giants played in the NFL Championship Game in 1933, 1934, 1935, 1938, 1939, 1941, 1943, 1944, 1946, 1950, 1956, 1958, 1959, 1961, 1962, 1963, <FONT size=4>16 times</FONT>, only winning 3. They were good enough to play in the Championship Game all those times.
</P>


Nice SZJ......very concise and informative summary. </P>


I became a "real" fan probably around '78 or so. When I was a little kid I was into the Vikings. Probably because they were good at the time, although Dallas used to beat them in the big games it seemed. I may not have always been a Giants fan but I have always hated Dallas!!!.....lol</P>

LT_was_good
03-29-2012, 10:54 AM
Kind of makes me glad I was born in 1985. Although enduring all those years must have made 1986 that much sweeter.

It must have actually been frustrating to be a fan in 33-63, because if they had won even a decent percentage of the championship games they played in, their success would have rivaled that of the Yankees during that stretch.

Kruunch
03-29-2012, 11:00 AM
Hello all,

I am looking for stories about the lean years from 57' to 85'.*
What are your favorite, and least favorite memories from that period?
Who were the great players that dedicated themselves to improving the team?
How was the Giants-Jets rivalry perceived those days?

Plus just add anything else that comes to mind.

I am really looking to learn more about our team`s history.

Thanks, Go Blue!


We had great teams all the way into the mid 60s. It was at that point that we became perennial losers.

I started being a Giants fan in the mid 70s, but as a kid routing for the underdog was cool. Stuff like the Miracle at the Meadowlands just made you shake your head and say "same ole Giants" (yes that used to be a catch phrase well before the Jets). My favorite saying of the time ... "Welcome to year 18 of the 5 year plan."

Me (and many Giants at the time) didn't know what to do with ourselves when we were actually considered a force by the mid 80s.

Sort of like seeing yourself as Ernest Borgnine and then being told you're Robert Redford.

Dorothy
03-29-2012, 11:02 AM
You should be banned for bringing this up.


+1

TuckYou
03-29-2012, 11:06 AM
I was born in 81' so dont really know. But, I do know about the 90's... Long decade.

Kruunch
03-29-2012, 11:10 AM
I was born in 81' so dont really know. But, I do know about the 90's... Long decade.

Imagine a decade where you have two winning seasons and no play off appearances.

Or pretend you're the Browns.

Either works.

burier
03-29-2012, 11:13 AM
This sums up my misery from 1978. Probably the lowest of low depths they could've sunk.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ML1Ixd3jiGU

Jesus Christ how old are you?!

Kruunch
03-29-2012, 11:20 AM
This sums up my misery from 1978. Probably the lowest of low depths they could've sunk.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ML1Ixd3jiGU

Jesus Christ how old are you?!

And to think you're still single.

burier
03-29-2012, 11:25 AM
This sums up my misery from 1978. Probably the lowest of low depths they could've sunk.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ML1Ixd3jiGU

Jesus Christ how old are you?!

And to think you're still single.


Krunch I thought we already concluded that it was in your best interest to refrain from addressing me.

Funny how you seem to have insight into my marital status.

Peeking in my window perhaps?

(I am single by the way. But keep that between us. Your wife has a different impression.)

If you continue to stalk me I'll have no choice but contact the authorities.

(Lets all wait while Krunch racks his brain only to come up with an inadequate retort)

CTLadyBlue
03-29-2012, 11:26 AM
This sums up my misery from 1978. Probably the lowest of low depths they could've sunk.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ML1Ixd3jiGU

Jesus Christ how old are you?!

You want to know because..........??

burier
03-29-2012, 11:28 AM
This sums up my misery from 1978. Probably the lowest of low depths they could've sunk.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ML1Ixd3jiGU

Jesus Christ how old are you?!

You want to know because..........??

Oh I'm just curious assuming that's recent you in your avi you look too young to be miserable in 78.

CTLadyBlue
03-29-2012, 11:45 AM
This sums up my misery from 1978. Probably the lowest of low depths they could've sunk.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ML1Ixd3jiGU

Jesus Christ how old are you?!

You want to know because..........??

Oh I'm just curious assuming that's recent you in your avi you look too young to be miserable in 78.

That pic is about....3 -4 years old. Don't have a recent one to upload, but considering people think I'm 38 when I'm really 10 years older than that, I pretty much look the same.

Regular gym workouts, clean eating, no smoking, no drinking and no sun exposure is the key, my friends.

BTW - I was a freshman in HS when I witnessed that '78 debacle. Actually, (and I wrote this story under another thread) it was the very first Giants game I got a taste of. I was in my room for most of the afternoon, came out in time to see my very happy dad get out of his chair, clap his hands together and say, 'well, Giants won another won'. This was with still 30+ seconds to go, Giants had the ball, the lead and Eagles had no times outs. Then.....it happened. The stunned look on my dad's face is burned in my brain for an eternity. The following week there was my dad, in his chair, Sunday, 1pm, Channel 2 watching the Giants again. When I asked him how he could stomach watching them after what happened last week, I got read the riot act on being a 'true fan' - you support your team no matter what.

From that day forward, I never looked back - joining my dad to watch these dreadful Giants every week, the dinner my mom hosted prior to SB 21 so we could forget all those miserable years, sitting on the edge of my couch in my apt all by myself when Norwood went in for that kick as I readied to dial my dad who had moved to FL the prior July, made reservations to visit my parents after the Giants obliterated the Vikings in the 2000 CG so my dad and I could watch SB 35 together (which I went to bed and curled into a fetal position at halftime), and called my dad directly after SB 42 & 46 after the last second ticked off - that's my long winded history.

I still call my dad after every Giants game. Hubby isn't into sports at all - Christmas Eve I was watching Giants/Jets while he was frosting cookies to take to dinner (yes, he IS VERY secure in his masculinity). He'd rather watch news, sci-fi or Discovery Science. He just doesn't get it. Oh well!

Dang, I'm chatty

burier
03-29-2012, 12:10 PM
This sums up my misery from 1978. Probably the lowest of low depths they could've sunk.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ML1Ixd3jiGU

Jesus Christ how old are you?!

You want to know because..........??

Oh I'm just curious assuming that's recent you in your avi you look too young to be miserable in 78.

That pic is about....3 -4 years old. Don't have a recent one to upload, but considering people think I'm 38 when I'm really 10 years older than that, I pretty much look the same.

Regular gym workouts, clean eating, no smoking, no drinking and no sun exposure is the key, my friends.

BTW - I was a freshman in HS when I witnessed that '78 debacle. Actually, (and I wrote this story under another thread) it was the very first Giants game I got a taste of. I was in my room for most of the afternoon, came out in time to see my very happy dad get out of his chair, clap his hands together and say, 'well, Giants won another won'. This was with still 30+ seconds to go, Giants had the ball, the lead and Eagles had no times outs. Then.....it happened. The stunned look on my dad's face is burned in my brain for an eternity. The following week there was my dad, in his chair, Sunday, 1pm, Channel 2 watching the Giants again. When I asked him how he could stomach watching them after what happened last week, I got read the riot act on being a 'true fan' - you support your team no matter what.

From that day forward, I never looked back - joining my dad to watch these dreadful Giants every week, the dinner my mom hosted prior to SB 21 so we could forget all those miserable years, sitting on the edge of my couch in my apt all by myself when Norwood went in for that kick as I readied to dial my dad who had moved to FL the prior July, made reservations to visit my parents after the Giants obliterated the Vikings in the 2000 CG so my dad and I could watch SB 35 together (which I went to bed and curled into a fetal position at halftime), and called my dad directly after SB 42 & 46 after the last second ticked off - that's my long winded history.

I still call my dad after every Giants game. Hubby isn't into sports at all - Christmas Eve I was watching Giants/Jets while he was frosting cookies to take to dinner (yes, he IS VERY secure in his masculinity). He'd rather watch news, sci-fi or Discovery Science. He just doesn't get it. Oh well!

Dang, I'm chatty

Good job by you. I'm extremely impressed. You're highly disciplined. I on the other hand get as much sun as I want and eat whatever I want.... but I've got great genetics. Giants fans would say I got hot at the right time.

Sounds like your dad learned the hard way...the game is not over until the clock is all round. Premature celebration is the second strongest jinx there is. But please accept my apologies. I'm sorry you had to live through the drought.

I was unfortunate enough to witness SB 35 and though I sat through the whole thing I did engage in some regrettable activities afterward if that makes you feel any better. (Lol how many times does 17 go into 30? All night it seems)

You're husband was frosting cookies ey? I have to say I'm impressed by him. If you haven't converted him yet he must have an Iron will. I turned out ever girl I ever dated for any length of time. My ex-wife is still a card carrying Giants fan and she's from New Zealand.

YATittle1962
03-29-2012, 12:10 PM
the Giants were arguably the best team in the NFL from '56 to '63....they just happened to only win one championship while playing in 6

I to this day truly believe that '63 game was ours......very unfortunate



after Tittle retired and Allie Sherman had traded away everything Jim Lee Howell had built it was all down hill until Alex Webster arrived

Webster seemed to revive some fight in the team and in 1970 put together one of the toughest Giant teams I have ever seen.

that 9-5 season felt like 14-0 to me...that team was not very talented but fought and clawed with some of the best teams at the time.
a late season loss to the Eagles kept them from the post season.

that too lost its shine and times were pretty lean through Arnsparger, McVay, and Perkins.

this wasn't all on the coaching
the front office was in absolute shambles in these years .
Tim and Wellington Maras in house feuds took its toll on the team.
their old school style started to get passed by and the league was starting to be run differently than it was when the NY Giants were a powerhouse

poor decisions, and bad football operations were rampant

and as we all know....Pisarcik to Csonka in '78 sort of broke the camels back ...Pete Rozelle stepped in and convinced Mara to hire George Young

and the rest is history

Kruunch
03-29-2012, 12:41 PM
This sums up my misery from 1978. Probably the lowest of low depths they could've sunk.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ML1Ixd3jiGU

Jesus Christ how old are you?!

And to think you're still single.


Krunch I thought we already concluded that it was in your best interest to refrain from addressing me.

Funny how you seem to have insight into my marital status.

Peeking in my window perhaps?

(I am single by the way. But keep that between us. Your wife has a different impression.)

If you continue to stalk me I'll have no choice but contact the authorities.

(Lets all wait while Krunch racks his brain only to come up with an inadequate retort)

And you continue to be comedic gold [b]

THE_New_York_Giants
03-29-2012, 01:00 PM
My grandfather got tickets in 1938 and they went to every game from there on out. I forget when they became season ticket holders. I remember me and my dad went to a game against Oakland and it was the coldest game I'd ever been to. It was in the mid to late 70's. The Giants were just getting crushed by Oakland and it was at most -2 degrees out after windchill and raining. It was the only game my dad ever left early from and he went to every Giants home game from 1940 to 2003 (he just can't do it anymore). We walked around Giants stadium just to try to get warm. The 70's and early 80's are probably the closest you can get to being a Browns fan today. We just got crushed every single game.
Also, after the tragedy at the meadowlands.. they were throwing stuff at Gibson on the way out and Piczarik needed a police escort to his car. I will forever hate Gibson for that decision only capable from someone with an IQ of -245.

Bohemian
03-29-2012, 01:19 PM
It is great to learn, not only about how our Giants have evolved through thick and thin. Most importantly of all, is that in the process of learning about the history of a team, we are learning about how this team unites fans from all over, and from all generations. I am very proud to be a Giants' fan, mainly because they have such a rich and proven history.

There are some great people on this board with great stories, no so much about their team, but about how their team brought them closer to their family and friends. I think back to the Super Bowl XXI highlights, and a fan in the crow with a sign mentioning his father's dream of living a NYG championship. I would love for someone to post that pick on this thread, because that is why the 'drought' is so important. The 80s was a renaissance for all those fans that held on to hope during the dark ages of the franchise.

I am having a great time reading about how our community was so resilient. I am sure that the Giants organization never takes their fans from granted, and reflecting back on tough times makes every cheer ever invested on our team worth it.

I am certainly learning a lot through you, and perhaps in the future a book should be published about the history of the Giants from the perspective of the fans.

Bohemian
03-29-2012, 01:25 PM
You should be banned for bringing this up.


I understand you, but I am a believer in knowing and appreciating the forgotten heroes. There are just too many great players, coaches and fans, that should not be overshadowed and forgotten because we are a winning organization. The Giants are a big part of my life, and I look at the big picture, all that is good and bad for defining our character and potential. Football is not life, but it is a great medium from which we can learn to appreciate life's moments and prospects.

JimC
03-29-2012, 04:16 PM
<font color="#0000FF" size="6">Kind of makes me glad I was born in 1985. Although enduring all those years must have made 1986 that much sweeter.</font>


Some of us know how much truth there is to that statement. That game against Washington for the NFC Championship was the most fantastic game I ever saw. It took us to our very first super bowl. You could actually feel all those years of pain fading away. It was unbelievable!!!!

Now just imagine how the Eagles fans feel with 51 years of no championships! I know exactly how they feel.

killerblue8787
03-29-2012, 05:21 PM
Very nice to know about giants history. Born in 1987. To tell you the truth i was never a fan of any team until about 2000 (my grandma was a huge yankee fan to the point her mood during the season depended on them winning or losing thus i became a met fan ultimately) but looking at her i never wanted to be like that lol. but for so many years I watched tapes on football including the 57 and 58 championship games not many games live at the time besides the superbowl I would watch and I got addicted to it and finally when I had cable I started watching the giants loved the blue color became an instant fan and it grew from there.

dave56dj
03-29-2012, 05:42 PM
For bringing this up you should be commended not banned. We are Giants fans through thick and thin. And many youngster on these boards (I am only 33 myself) do no realize how incredible winning in 07 and now again in 11 is. Some fans wait an entire lifetime and never see one. As a mets/ knicks/ ranger fan i am used to lean times as well. And I am so thankful I have witnessed an incredible 4 superbowl titles - 86/ 90/ 07 and 11. I have never been anything but thankful for the men in blue. A class organization from top to bottom.

Its also given me a chance to step away from the typical NOW NFL fan -who wants Coughlin fired mid season - who called Nicks out for having bad hands because of 2 games - who question Justin Tucks stamina - who gripe about Gilbride. The lean times have given me a chance to realize this stuff is about years and careers - not one game or one play. It all adds up.

So if I never see a Giants SB again (god forbid) I will always be a New York Giants fan - through thick and thin. And its a real pleasure to know there are Giants fans on these boards who suffered through those lean times and came out shiny on the other end in 86 90 07 and 11 - GOOD FOR YOU
ALWAYS AND FOREVER GO BLUEEEEEEEEEE!!!!!!!!!!!!

jjj45
03-29-2012, 05:59 PM
That pic is about....3 -4 years old. Don't have a recent one to upload, but considering people think I'm 38 when I'm really 10 years older than that, I pretty much look the same.

Regular gym workouts, clean eating, no smoking, no drinking and no sun exposure is the key, my friends.

BTW - I was a freshman in HS when I witnessed that '78 debacle. Actually, (and I wrote this story under another thread) it was the very first Giants game I got a taste of. I was in my room for most of the afternoon, came out in time to see my very happy dad get out of his chair, clap his hands together and say, 'well, Giants won another won'. This was with still 30+ seconds to go, Giants had the ball, the lead and Eagles had no times outs. Then.....it happened. The stunned look on my dad's face is burned in my brain for an eternity. The following week there was my dad, in his chair, Sunday, 1pm, Channel 2 watching the Giants again. When I asked him how he could stomach watching them after what happened last week, I got read the riot act on being a 'true fan' - you support your team no matter what.

From that day forward, I never looked back - joining my dad to watch these dreadful Giants every week, the dinner my mom hosted prior to SB 21 so we could forget all those miserable years, sitting on the edge of my couch in my apt all by myself when Norwood went in for that kick as I readied to dial my dad who had moved to FL the prior July, made reservations to visit my parents after the Giants obliterated the Vikings in the 2000 CG so my dad and I could watch SB 35 together (which I went to bed and curled into a fetal position at halftime), and called my dad directly after SB 42 &amp; 46 after the last second ticked off - that's my long winded history.

I still call my dad after every Giants game. Hubby isn't into sports at all - Christmas Eve I was watching Giants/Jets while he was frosting cookies to take to dinner (yes, he IS VERY secure in his masculinity). He'd rather watch news, sci-fi or Discovery Science. He just doesn't get it. Oh well!

Dang, I'm chattyYou basically just described my mom lol. She also looks much younger then she really is. Unfortunately, I have been cursed with this as well. I dont look my age at all.

but as she always used to tell me, 'when everybody is old and wrinkled, you'll look great.'

Your husband basically described my dad as well. Doesn't watch football.... doesn't really like it. How weird is that? Although he did watch the SB and kinda got into it. He doesn't make cookies lol but he bakes bread and enjoys listening to folk music. And sometimes watches shows that I would never think anybody would watch. I guess you become more secure in your old age.


Are you from Jersey?

jomo
03-29-2012, 06:42 PM
You should be banned for bringing this up.


I understand you, but I am a believer in knowing and appreciating the forgotten heroes. There are just too many great players, coaches and fans, that should not be overshadowed and forgotten because we are a winning organization. The Giants are a big part of my life, and I look at the big picture, all that is good and bad for defining our character and potential. Football is not life, but it is a great medium from which we can learn to appreciate life's moments and prospects.
I'm thinking that BlueSanta was being sarcastic and assumed that red font was not necessary.

firstgamein49
03-29-2012, 07:19 PM
I can name some names, but keep in mind that in under 2 weeks, I'll be 71, even tho' I don't look a day over 69!
C- Ray Wietecha, smallish but had the unique ability to snap on FG's so that the laces were ALWAYS facing forward.
Rosie Brown, LT, about 6'4, 260, very fast for a big man, he was a devastating downfield blocker. Get pass blocker as well, some think the best LT of all time, a perennial all pro.
Kyle Rote, drafted as an RB, tore up his knee I think his R yr. Wound up as a flanker, and teamed w/ Gifford, Webster, Bob Schnelker, and others, formed a good receiver corps, albeit, lacking speed.
Rote always seemed to get open for Conerly, the QB. He was an accurate passer, with a soft touch to his passes. Early on, late 40's, early 50's, his best passes were into the ground to avoid a sack, and prevent an early demise. Was the Marlboro Man!
Eddie Price, their FB was the last Giant to lead the league in rushing, I think it was '51, w/ around 900 yds. They used the draw play very well with him running.
During the golden era, Lombardi came up with some new wrinkles on O. Play action passes were new! The Browns were the best team in the NFL, and in '58, the Giants beat them 3 times, and basically stopped Jim Brown. I'll write more about the D later. It's time for dinner!

swimeasy
03-29-2012, 07:55 PM
<font color="#0000FF" size="6">Kind of makes me glad I was born in 1985. Although enduring all those years must have made 1986 that much sweeter.</font>


Some of us know how much truth there is to that statement. That game against Washington for the NFC Championship was the most fantastic game I ever saw. It took us to our very first super bowl. You could actually feel all those years of pain fading away. It was unbelievable!!!!

Now just imagine how the Eagles fans feel with 51 years of no championships! I know exactly how they feel.


IA. 86 was MAGICAL!

GmanSenior
03-29-2012, 09:06 PM
I started watching the Giants in 1971 at the age of six. I haven't missed a game since. I've been lucky to always live in areas where the Giants were always the televised game on Sunday. The Giants were absolutely brutal in the 70's . We had Joe Pisarcik at QB. I always remember watching the NFL On CBS pre game show with Brent Musberger, Phyllis George, Irv Cross and Jimmy "The Greek". Jimmy the Greek would go through each game and make his predictions every week. He would NEVER pick the Giants. it actually started to became a sort of on going joke on the show. Even though we were the laughing stock of the league there were still some all time Giant greats to root for like Harry Carson, Brad Van Pelt, Dave Jennings, Bob Tucker and the late Doug Kotar. Things started turning around in 1981 when we drafted Phil Simms (remember Rozelle laughing at us when he announced the pick). In 1983 Parcells became coach and we drafted Lawrence Taylor (thank you Saints for taking George Rogers with the first pick so we could take L.T.). All three of those guys led us to two super bowls. For you younger fans who want to know what it's like to be a Jet fan with no hope of a title we older guys can tell you. I never would have believed we would make the playoffs let alone win a super bowl growing up. Now I've seen four Lombardi's hoisted. Thanks for letting a 46 year old, almost bald guy reminisce about the "good 'old days.

krygny
03-29-2012, 10:48 PM
I was born in '55 and became a fan in the early-mid '60s. That's when the Giants really started to stink. From '64-'84, I don't remember them ever being competitive. I'd have to check but I don't think they ever went better than 9-7 in those 20 years. And there were several years that were completely hopeless like 2-12 or 3-12-1 in 1983.

Does anybody remember 1983? Late in the season, they were playing the St. Louis Cardinals at Giants Stadium and it was one of the rare instances I was able to get tickets. A meaningless game between two awful teams. My [then future] father-in-law got the tickets and he couldn't go so I went with my [then future] wife. It poured rain the entire game. A deluge. A torrent. I don't even remember the game. We didn't even bother to go to our seats in the upper deck just to sit there and get soaked. We sat under the overhang on the lower deck and nobody cared because there were only about 5,000 people who attended the game. Like almost all games at Giants Stadium, the game was a sellout but I think it set a record that was never broken for the lowest attended game at Giants Stadium.

Does anybody remember the Miracle in the Meadowlands? It changed the way the game was played. Nowadays, whenever a winning team is running out the clock, the ball is snapped and the QB takes a knee. I don't remember that being done before the M in M. Everybody blames Pizarcik for that play but I still think it was Czonka's fault.

My first 20 years as a Giants fan I wandered aimlessly in the football wasteland. It's been pretty good ever since.

Bohemian
03-30-2012, 12:54 AM
I was born in '55 and became a fan in the early-mid '60s. That's when the Giants really started to stink. From '64-'84, I don't remember them ever being competitive. I'd have to check but I don't think they ever went better than 9-7 in those 20 years. And there were several years that were completely hopeless like 2-12 or 3-12-1 in 1983.

Does anybody remember 1983? Late in the season, they were playing the St. Louis Cardinals at Giants Stadium and it was one of the rare instances I was able to get tickets. A meaningless game between two awful teams. My [then future] father-in-law got the tickets and he couldn't go so I went with my [then future] wife. It poured rain the entire game. A deluge. A torrent. I don't even remember the game. We didn't even bother to go to our seats in the upper deck just to sit there and get soaked. We sat under the overhang on the lower deck and nobody cared because there were only about 5,000 people who attended the game. Like almost all games at Giants Stadium, the game was a sellout but I think it set a record that was never broken for the lowest attended game at Giants Stadium.

Does anybody remember the Miracle in the Meadowlands? It changed the way the game was played. Nowadays, whenever a winning team is running out the clock, the ball is snapped and the QB takes a knee. I don't remember that being done before the M in M. Everybody blames Pizarcik for that play but I still think it was Czonka's fault.

My first 20 years as a Giants fan I wandered aimlessly in the football wasteland. It's been pretty good ever since.



Great story. It is great to hear how we can reflect on such amazing companions during such difficult times.

firstgamein49
03-30-2012, 06:49 AM
Hey Bo - you want to hear about some of the D back in the day? Had dinner, working on my first cup of java.

CTLadyBlue
03-30-2012, 08:30 AM
I started watching the Giants in 1971 at the age of six. I haven't missed a game since. I've been lucky to always live in areas where the Giants were always the televised game on Sunday. The Giants were absolutely brutal in the 70's . We had Joe Pisarcik at QB. I always remember watching the NFL On CBS pre game show with Brent Musberger, Phyllis George, Irv Cross and Jimmy "The Greek". Jimmy the Greek would go through each game and make his predictions every week. He would NEVER pick the Giants. it actually started to became a sort of on going joke on the show. Even though we were the laughing stock of the league there were still some all time Giant greats to root for like Harry Carson, Brad Van Pelt, Dave Jennings, Bob Tucker and the late Doug Kotar. Things started turning around in 1981 when we drafted Phil Simms (remember Rozelle laughing at us when he announced the pick). In 1983 Parcells became coach and we drafted Lawrence Taylor (thank you Saints for taking George Rogers with the first pick so we could take L.T.). All three of those guys led us to two super bowls. For you younger fans who want to know what it's like to be a Jet fan with no hope of a title we older guys can tell you. I never would have believed we would make the playoffs let alone win a super bowl growing up. Now I've seen four Lombardi's hoisted. Thanks for letting a 46 year old, almost bald guy reminisce about the "good 'old days.

Yes! Thank you for reminding me about that loud mouthed Jimmy The Greek. YOu're right - he NEVER picked the Giants. Wasn't he a Cowboys homer?

Actually, we drafted Simmsin '79 and LT in '81 (someone correct me if I'm wrong, but I believe Simms came before LT). Then everything started to come together after that. I don't remember what year it was, but wasn't there a Joe Danelo FG in the closing seconds of a Cowboys game which was huge??

BK07071
03-30-2012, 09:28 AM
Hello all,

I am looking for stories about the lean years from 57' to 85'.
What are your favorite, and least favorite memories from that period?
Who were the great players that dedicated themselves to improving the team?
How was the Giants-Jets rivalry perceived those days?

Plus just add anything else that comes to mind.

I am really looking to learn more about our team`s history.

Thanks, Go Blue!


My least favorite memory of that era was the infamous "fumble".; I was at the game and that game cost me a surf and turf dinner for two and they were Eagles fans. But that was the begining of the end of the Giants lackluster tewams. John Mcvay was the head coach at the time. Bob Gibson the offensive coordinator of the Giants called for a running play when all they had to do is just snap the ball and run out the clock to beat the Eagles. Instead Joe Pisarcik tried handing the ball off to Larry Csonka and they fumbled the snap the and Herman Edwards picked up the ball and ran it into the end zone to score.
Needless to say Bob Gidson was immediately fired the next day and John Mcvay and his entire coaching staff was let go within a week. Than the riff came between Wellington Mara and his nephew which owned the other half of the Giants and Pete Rozelle had to step in and recommended Geoge Young as a general manager to run the Giants. Mara's nephew was fed up with the way Mara was picking the players and the coaches and heput the kabash on anyone that Wellington wanted to hire and Wellington wouldn't agree to hiring anyone that his nephew wanted to hire so they were at a stale mate. The fued carried on for weeks until Rozelle stepped in and recommended George Young and that's when the Giants started to turn around.
Once George Young was hired he was given full control of the Giants and he was hired to run the entire football organization and pull the Giants out of their doldrums. First thing he did was hire an offensive minded coach as the head coach and that was Ray Perkins. Ray than picked Phil Simms in the up coming draft as his new QB. Everyone one that was at the draft questioned his judgement on picking an unknown. You could hear them saying "Phil who"???? Than Young and Perkins built the team and that started the ball rolling.

CTLadyBlue
03-30-2012, 09:50 AM
That pic is about....3 -4 years old. Don't have a recent one to upload, but considering people think I'm 38 when I'm really 10 years older than that, I pretty much look the same.

Regular gym workouts, clean eating, no smoking, no drinking and no sun exposure is the key, my friends.

BTW - I was a freshman in HS when I witnessed that '78 debacle. Actually, (and I wrote this story under another thread) it was the very first Giants game I got a taste of. I was in my room for most of the afternoon, came out in time to see my very happy dad get out of his chair, clap his hands together and say, 'well, Giants won another won'. This was with still 30+ seconds to go, Giants had the ball, the lead and Eagles had no times outs. Then.....it happened. The stunned look on my dad's face is burned in my brain for an eternity. The following week there was my dad, in his chair, Sunday, 1pm, Channel 2 watching the Giants again. When I asked him how he could stomach watching them after what happened last week, I got read the riot act on being a 'true fan' - you support your team no matter what.

From that day forward, I never looked back - joining my dad to watch these dreadful Giants every week, the dinner my mom hosted prior to SB 21 so we could forget all those miserable years, sitting on the edge of my couch in my apt all by myself when Norwood went in for that kick as I readied to dial my dad who had moved to FL the prior July, made reservations to visit my parents after the Giants obliterated the Vikings in the 2000 CG so my dad and I could watch SB 35 together (which I went to bed and curled into a fetal position at halftime), and called my dad directly after SB 42 & 46 after the last second ticked off - that's my long winded history.

I still call my dad after every Giants game. Hubby isn't into sports at all - Christmas Eve I was watching Giants/Jets while he was frosting cookies to take to dinner (yes, he IS VERY secure in his masculinity). He'd rather watch news, sci-fi or Discovery Science. He just doesn't get it. Oh well!

Dang, I'm chattyYou basically just described my mom lol. She also looks much younger then she really is. Unfortunately, I have been cursed with this as well. I dont look my age at all.

but as she always used to tell me, 'when everybody is old and wrinkled, you'll look great.'

Your husband basically described my dad as well. Doesn't watch football.... doesn't really like it. How weird is that? Although he did watch the SB and kinda got into it. He doesn't make cookies lol but he bakes bread and enjoys listening to folk music. And sometimes watches shows that I would never think anybody would watch. I guess you become more secure in your old age.


Are you from Jersey?




Nope - CT

Manning2Niks
03-30-2012, 10:23 AM
Did Rozelle really laugh at the Simms pick? What were the circumstances surrounding the pick (draft slot, the thoughts on Simms' college career, etc)?

I was born in 1985 and though was raised a giants fan don't remember much until Danny kanell became our starter. U remember the playoff game we blew against the Vikings pretty vividly too, but the start of the fassle era was when my tenure started. Hated the redskins and Stephen Davis, loved sehorn, loved Joe Montgomery (lol!).

I remember crying and leaving the room upon Jamal Lewis game sealing TD in the super bowl. Remember going nuts at my brothers wedding in my Lucky red giants sweatshirt right after tunes kicked us to the super bowl in GB and FREAKING out after tyrees catch and telling everyone to calm down bc the ball hit the ground and they were gonna call it back (just felt it was our luck alla kiwi vs v. Young type shtuff).

Obviously everything about this season is still so fresh and it will be forever as my grandfather passed in December and I watched every game upto the pats game with him (he went to the hospital the following week and never came back :/).

So yeah, I started late and missed the first 2 bowls (or at least wasn't aware of anything and didn't follow every single game as I started to do during those kanell years) but I'm as strong a fan as you'll find. I'd do just about everything and anything to support this team. They mean more to me than most things in this world and am blessed for everything we were able to experience these past few years.

Go blue!

GmanSenior
03-30-2012, 11:39 AM
I started watching the Giants in 1971 at the age of six. I haven't missed a game since. I've been lucky to always live in areas where the Giants were always the televised game on Sunday. The Giants were absolutely brutal in the 70's . We had Joe Pisarcik at QB. I always remember watching the NFL On CBS pre game show with Brent Musberger, Phyllis George, Irv Cross and Jimmy "The Greek". Jimmy the Greek would go through each game and make his predictions every week. He would NEVER pick the Giants. it actually started to became a sort of on going joke on the show. Even though we were the laughing stock of the league there were still some all time Giant greats to root for like Harry Carson, Brad Van Pelt, Dave Jennings, Bob Tucker and the late Doug Kotar. Things started turning around in 1981 when we drafted Phil Simms (remember Rozelle laughing at us when he announced the pick). In 1983 Parcells became coach and we drafted Lawrence Taylor (thank you Saints for taking George Rogers with the first pick so we could take L.T.). All three of those guys led us to two super bowls. For you younger fans who want to know what it's like to be a Jet fan with no hope of a title we older guys can tell you. I never would have believed we would make the playoffs let alone win a super bowl growing up. Now I've seen four Lombardi's hoisted. Thanks for letting a 46 year old, almost bald guy reminisce about the "good 'old days.

Yes! Thank you for reminding me about that loud mouthed Jimmy The Greek. YOu're right - he NEVER picked the Giants. Wasn't he a Cowboys homer?

Actually, we drafted Simmsin '79 and LT in '81 (someone correct me if I'm wrong, but I believe Simms came before LT). Then everything started to come together after that. I don't remember what year it was, but wasn't there a Joe Danelo FG in the closing seconds of a Cowboys game which was huge??

Thanks for the correction Lady Blue. You're right on those draft years. I think that Danelo game came in 1981. I think that was the game that got us into the playoffs for the first time in what seemed like forever. Wasn't that also the year we traded the then Houston Oilers (now the Titans) for Rob Carpenter?

Redeyejedi
03-30-2012, 11:41 AM
Im glad i was born in the Good years. The worst I saw was the Danny Kannel Kent Graham ,Dave Brown era.

Actually Ray Handley was worse but it was shorter

YATittle1962
03-30-2012, 11:51 AM
Did Rozelle really laugh at the Simms pick? What were the circumstances surrounding the pick (draft slot, the thoughts on Simms' college career, etc)?

I was born in 1985 and though was raised a giants fan don't remember much until Danny kanell became our starter. U remember the playoff game we blew against the Vikings pretty vividly too, but the start of the fassle era was when my tenure started. Hated the redskins and Stephen Davis, loved sehorn, loved Joe Montgomery (lol!).

I remember crying and leaving the room upon Jamal Lewis game sealing TD in the super bowl. Remember going nuts at my brothers wedding in my Lucky red giants sweatshirt right after tunes kicked us to the super bowl in GB and FREAKING out after tyrees catch and telling everyone to calm down bc the ball hit the ground and they were gonna call it back (just felt it was our luck alla kiwi vs v. Young type shtuff).

Obviously everything about this season is still so fresh and it will be forever as my grandfather passed in December and I watched every game upto the pats game with him (he went to the hospital the following week and never came back :/).

So yeah, I started late and missed the first 2 bowls (or at least wasn't aware of anything and didn't follow every single game as I started to do during those kanell years) but I'm as strong a fan as you'll find. I'd do just about everything and anything to support this team. They mean more to me than most things in this world and am blessed for everything we were able to experience these past few years.

Go blue!

Mr. Rozelle snickers at the crowds reaction

CTLadyBlue
03-30-2012, 12:46 PM
Im glad i was born in the Good years. The worst I saw was the Danny Kannel Kent Graham ,Dave Brown era.

Actually Ray Handley was worse but it was shorter

Okay, it was bad enough you had to mention Kannel, Grham and Brown, but the boxing gloves come on when the dreaded 'RH' name is dropped. I would've rather had the horrid late 70's back then relive those cringe-worthy two years under his tenure. At least in the late 70's, no one expected anything from us because. But to have those two years of H-E-double hockey sticks following our first ever Superbowl victory was sickening.

Oh, and don't forget out RH chose Hostetler over Simms. That was the first WRONG move. The one thing I gave Dan Reeves credit for was instilling Simms as the starter when RH was booted and, in his first year, brought us to that now infamous Cowboys finale game where we battled against Emmit Smith playing with a separated shoulder for the division. I still remember that game. Even though we lost, I remember most a woman holding a sign up in the stands that said 'Thank you Dan Reeves' - for bringing the Giants back from the brink.

SweetZombieJesus
03-30-2012, 02:09 PM
Okay, it was bad enough you had to mention Kannel, Grham and Brown, but the boxing gloves come on when the dreaded 'RH' name is dropped. I would've rather had the horrid late 70's back then relive those cringe-worthy two years under his tenure. At least in the late 70's, no one expected anything from us because. But to have those two years of H-E-double hockey sticks following our first ever Superbowl victory was sickening.

Oh, and don't forget out RH chose Hostetler over Simms. That was the first WRONG move. The one thing I gave Dan Reeves credit for was instilling Simms as the starter when RH was booted and, in his first year, brought us to that now infamous Cowboys finale game where we battled against Emmit Smith playing with a separated shoulder for the division. I still remember that game. Even though we lost, I remember most a woman holding a sign up in the stands that said 'Thank you Dan Reeves' - for bringing the Giants back from the brink.

I think that era is so bad because we fell from grace so quickly (no slow decay there) and our pride was wounded. Parcells bailed on us like a rat (AFTER the draft and rookie mini camp) and all of a sudden our head coach is a guy who's blurry in the background of all the team photos. It was like winning the lottery and then coming home to find out your house burned down and your family was murdered.

Bohemian
03-30-2012, 03:34 PM
Okay, it was bad enough you had to mention Kannel, Grham and Brown, but the boxing gloves come on when the dreaded 'RH' name is dropped. I would've rather had the horrid late 70's back then relive those cringe-worthy two years under his tenure. At least in the late 70's, no one expected anything from us because. But to have those two years of H-E-double hockey sticks following our first ever Superbowl victory was sickening.

Oh, and don't forget out RH chose Hostetler over Simms. That was the first WRONG move. The one thing I gave Dan Reeves credit for was instilling Simms as the starter when RH was booted and, in his first year, brought us to that now infamous Cowboys finale game where we battled against Emmit Smith playing with a separated shoulder for the division. I still remember that game. Even though we lost, I remember most a woman holding a sign up in the stands that said 'Thank you Dan Reeves' - for bringing the Giants back from the brink.

I think that era is so bad because we fell from grace so quickly (no slow decay there) and our pride was wounded. Parcells bailed on us like a rat (AFTER the draft and rookie mini camp) and all of a sudden our head coach is a guy who's blurry in the background of all the team photos. It was like winning the lottery and then coming home to find out your house burned down and your family was murdered.


I would certainly like to learn more about he circumstances that forced Parcells to bail. It sounds like the organization was not headed in the right direction for the better part of that decade. I was one of the few that saw the Reeves hire as a desperate, but all together positive move... as he would likely put an end to the bleeding. RH was an abomination, I wonder if there are any recorded interviews with him, because he seemed to be very anonymous during his time as head coach... specially considering the NY Giants. It is definitely the worst time that I have every experienced as a fan, so much so, that I actually stopped watching the games until the hiring of Reeves caught my attention. I have to say that between RH, Reeves and Fassel, the organization was really unstable. Fassel had some good teams, but really never anything that you could count on. Fassel was like a good magician, full of moments and charisma, but never really living much lasting substance. Don't get me wrong, our Super Bowl appearance was great, but it was a game that I remember not believing that the team believed that they could win. I never believed in Fassel, and his ineptitude really showed in how the team completely cried about Coughlin's demands and expectations. I really hope that we don't ever have to see such a disgraceful display again.

I have to agree that the decline of the 90s is tough... but from what I gather, we were a great organization until the early 60s (1963, 11W-3L). So it is probably fair to say that 20 years (64'-83') meant that a whole generation passed without seeing the recovery to greatness. Even those horrific 90s decade had 5 teams that won 8 games or more.

RH was the absolute manifestation of the term 'ineptitude'.

http://www.pro-football-reference.com/teams/nyg/

SweetZombieJesus
03-30-2012, 05:25 PM
Parcells was a rat.

We all deify him (and rightly so for what he did for this organization and bringing it back to respectability and winning). But he has a dark side. Bill does hit-and-run coaching stints. He doesn't stick around very long.

After winning Super Bowl XXI, he tried to quit (I think he was trying to go to Atlanta, not sure on the team). Wellington wouldn't allow him out of his contract and he had to stay.

People have said that he told people in the building before Super Bowl XXV that he was "out of here". After winning XXV, the coaching staff was raided -- Belichick left for Cleveland, Coughlin left for Boston College, etc. Parcells wouldn't commit to whether he would stay or quit. He lead the Giants organization to believe he would stay, but he wasn't bringing in new staff to replace the ones that left. He stayed through the draft, and he stayed for rookie mini camp (which is in late May). THEN he quit. After it was far too late to bring in a new staff. Ray Handley is a scapegoat -- he was one of the few remaining people when Parcells bailed and even though he sucked give him credit for trying to fill some really big shoes.

It's not just the Giants. He resurfaced in New England and publicly fought with Bob Kraft over "shopping for the groceries" and not wanting Terry Glenn. He quit after losing the Super Bowl and took his staff to the Jets.

And somewhere in there he had a handshake agreement to coach the Bucs, but broke his word; I think that was when he went to the Pats.

Then with the Jets he brought them back to respectability. He retired from coaching again and named Bill Belichick his successor. That lasted literally 24 hours as he quit to defect to the Patriots (and we all know how that turned out). Parcells didn't step up and retake the coaching reigns; instead he installed stooge Al Groh and Parcells bailed, leaving the team a wreck.

Then he resurfaced in Dallas as the Cowboys coach, turned them around, and then retired again (largely over disagreements with Jerry Jones).

Then he shows up in Miami in a GM type of role and didn't even restore them, every Miami fan I know says he didn't even try this time and made the team a wreck that will take years to recover.

Now he's talking about taking the Saints job while Payton is suspended.

Bill has ants in the pants. Great coach, terrible loyalty and long-term commitment. Everywhere he goes, he may restore glory but he leaves them a smouldering heap of wreckage.

Bohemian
03-30-2012, 05:34 PM
Parcells was a rat.

We all deify him (and rightly so for what he did for this organization and bringing it back to respectability and winning). But he has a dark side. Bill does hit-and-run coaching stints. He doesn't stick around very long.

After winning Super Bowl XXI, he tried to quit (I think he was trying to go to Atlanta, not sure on the team). Wellington wouldn't allow him out of his contract and he had to stay.

People have said that he told people in the building before Super Bowl XXV that he was "out of here". After winning XXV, the coaching staff was raided -- Belichick left for Cleveland, Coughlin left for Boston College, etc. Parcells wouldn't commit to whether he would stay or quit. He lead the Giants organization to believe he would stay, but he wasn't bringing in new staff to replace the ones that left. He stayed through the draft, and he stayed for rookie mini camp (which is in late May). THEN he quit. After it was far too late to bring in a new staff. Ray Handley is a scapegoat -- he was one of the few remaining people when Parcells bailed and even though he sucked give him credit for trying to fill some really big shoes.

It's not just the Giants. He resurfaced in New England and publicly fought with Bob Kraft over "shopping for the groceries" and not wanting Terry Glenn. He quit after losing the Super Bowl and took his staff to the Jets.

And somewhere in there he had a handshake agreement to coach the Bucs, but broke his word; I think that was when he went to the Pats.

Then with the Jets he brought them back to respectability. He retired from coaching again and named Bill Belichick his successor. That lasted literally 24 hours as he quit to defect to the Patriots (and we all know how that turned out). Parcells didn't step up and retake the coaching reigns; instead he installed stooge Al Groh and Parcells bailed, leaving the team a wreck.

Then he resurfaced in Dallas as the Cowboys coach, turned them around, and then retired again (largely over disagreements with Jerry Jones).

Then he shows up in Miami in a GM type of role and didn't even restore them, every Miami fan I know says he didn't even try this time and made the team a wreck that will take years to recover.

Now he's talking about taking the Saints job while Payton is suspended.

Bill has ants in the pants. Great coach, terrible loyalty and long-term commitment.


Wow, that is certainly a different take on things. But it is also a take that makes a lot of sense.

I am a big Parcells' fan, as most of us are, but it is really difficult to explain the violent nature of the team's collapse during the RH age. I can definitely see how RH is undeserving for such wrath, and that whole Greek tragedy meant that RH was set for failure from the get-go. I really appreciate your version of things, which makes more sense than any narrative that I ever tried to formulate... because I was frustrated with no real understanding why things got so bad so quickly.

stormblue
03-30-2012, 11:25 PM
the worst years..late 60's thru very early 80's
was painful beyond description.
every game was like watching a street gang come on to your lawn in front of your house and beat your dog with their sticks and boots while you remained helpless chained to the front porch.

i am scarred beyond repair , no amount of rings can make up for almost 2 decades of mental anguish.

that's freakin' new york for ya......they kill John Lennon but let Herm Edwards stalk us on every television and radio NFL talk show until the end of time.

allentown PA
03-30-2012, 11:46 PM
You should be banned for bringing this up.


+1

why? this is a great topic...stop being spoiled...and learn a little history about ur team..u two are ignorant fans imo.

allentown PA
03-30-2012, 11:49 PM
Hello all,

I am looking for stories about the lean years from 57' to 85'.*
What are your favorite, and least favorite memories from that period?
Who were the great players that dedicated themselves to improving the team?
How was the Giants-Jets rivalry perceived those days?

Plus just add anything else that comes to mind.

I am really looking to learn more about our team`s history.

Thanks, Go Blue!


well im 31 so im spoiled when it comes to this team...my first memory of football was them winning superbowl 21...then again in 90...i had to deal with like 3 down years in the 90's thats it...the giants have always been relevant in my lifetime...since 2000 this team has had numerous runs...i hope we all appreciate what this team has done in recent years and how well run this organazation is...im proud to be a giants fan.

Tuckit91
03-31-2012, 12:05 AM
I became a fan in 1982 thanks to my step moms brother...Man am I glad my Dad married her so i got to met him..if I would have never met him and went with the rest of my family I would have been a *Sigh* Bills fan..Oh the horror!!

miked1958
03-31-2012, 12:25 AM
The last championship in 1956 was actually the beginning of a golden era.* The Giants had just moved into Yankee Stadium, they had Lombardi and Landry on the same staff, and were loaded with star players.* Coincidentally the Yankees were in one of several golden eras in that same time, so Yankee Stadium was the center of the sports universe, with the Yankees always in the World Series and the Giants always in the NFL Championship game.

The Giants would make the NFL Championship Game 6 times in 8 years (56 58 59 61 62 63) but unfortunately they would only win that one in 1956.* The 1958 game vs. the Colts is "The Greatest Game Ever Played", which the Colts won in overtime and it shot the NFL into the national spotlight and lead directly to the creation of the AFL in 1960.*

After the 1963 season the team was picked apart (Sam Huff was sent to Washington where he remains to this day)...* Wellington's loyalty to head coaches Allie Sherman and Alex Webster meant a decade of misery, and then they tried the Jets' solution of bringing in big names to fix the team (guys like Fran Tarkenton and Larry Czonka) throughout the 1970s.* I think they had two non-losing seasons in the 70s, it was bad.* The Giants, once a crown jewel of the NFL, were the laughing stock.

It culminated with the 1978 "Miracle at the Meadowlands".* Winning against the Philadelphia Eagles, all they needed to do was drain the clock.* But back then there was no "victory formation", they ran a running play which Larry Czonka fumbled, the Eagles recovered, and won the game, it sent a good season into a tailspin and wrecked it.

That dark moment gave birth to the modern era.* The league intervened and forced them to take a GM, George Young of the Colts...* He brought in a new coaching staff that contained a guy named Bill Parcells as linebacker coach, and he drafted a young QB named Phil Simms.* The current organization and its successes are built on what those guys did 30+ years ago.

The "classic" Giants (before the Super Bowl) are actually a very proud and successful franchise that gets lost because they lost in the big game so much, and because the team was so bad as the NFL exploded in popularity in the 1970s.* Unfortunately that stretch of 6 championship games in 8 years and only winning one is a microcosm of Giants History.* The Giants played in the NFL Championship Game in 1933, 1934, 1935, 1938, 1939, 1941, 1943, 1944, 1946, 1950, 1956, 1958, 1959, 1961, 1962, 1963, <font size="4">16 times</font>, only winning 3.* They were good enough to play in the Championship Game all those times.*
Wow. I knew we had a bad record in CGs. Didn't realize it was that bad. Surprised with all those great teams they only seal the deal less then 20% of all the times they were there.

miked1958
03-31-2012, 12:27 AM
Actually this record rivals the Vikings and buffalo. However in the ones that are called SBs we are 4-5 and both Minny and bills are winless.

miked1958
03-31-2012, 12:29 AM
The last championship in 1956 was actually the beginning of a golden era.* The Giants had just moved into Yankee Stadium, they had Lombardi and Landry on the same staff, and were loaded with star players.* Coincidentally the Yankees were in one of several golden eras in that same time, so Yankee Stadium was the center of the sports universe, with the Yankees always in the World Series and the Giants always in the NFL Championship game.

The Giants would make the NFL Championship Game 6 times in 8 years (56 58 59 61 62 63) but unfortunately they would only win that one in 1956.* The 1958 game vs. the Colts is "The Greatest Game Ever Played", which the Colts won in overtime and it shot the NFL into the national spotlight and lead directly to the creation of the AFL in 1960.*

After the 1963 season the team was picked apart (Sam Huff was sent to Washington where he remains to this day)...* Wellington's loyalty to head coaches Allie Sherman and Alex Webster meant a decade of misery, and then they tried the Jets' solution of bringing in big names to fix the team (guys like Fran Tarkenton and Larry Czonka) throughout the 1970s.* I think they had two non-losing seasons in the 70s, it was bad.* The Giants, once a crown jewel of the NFL, were the laughing stock.

It culminated with the 1978 "Miracle at the Meadowlands".* Winning against the Philadelphia Eagles, all they needed to do was drain the clock.* But back then there was no "victory formation", they ran a running play which Larry Czonka fumbled, the Eagles recovered, and won the game, it sent a good season into a tailspin and wrecked it.

That dark moment gave birth to the modern era.* The league intervened and forced them to take a GM, George Young of the Colts...* He brought in a new coaching staff that contained a guy named Bill Parcells as linebacker coach, and he drafted a young QB named Phil Simms.* The current organization and its successes are built on what those guys did 30+ years ago.

The "classic" Giants (before the Super Bowl) are actually a very proud and successful franchise that gets lost because they lost in the big game so much, and because the team was so bad as the NFL exploded in popularity in the 1970s.* Unfortunately that stretch of 6 championship games in 8 years and only winning one is a microcosm of Giants History.* The Giants played in the NFL Championship Game in 1933, 1934, 1935, 1938, 1939, 1941, 1943, 1944, 1946, 1950, 1956, 1958, 1959, 1961, 1962, 1963, <font size="4">16 times</font>, only winning 3.* They were good enough to play in the Championship Game all those times.*
Wow. I knew we had a bad record in CGs. Didn't realize it was that bad. Surprised with all those great teams they only seal the deal less then 20% of all the times they were there.Hey what about our 1927 Championship? You didn't count that one? Is it because they didn't actually have a CG per say? They were declared champions by winning the season and ending up in first as there were no other leagues or divisions to compete against yet

SweetZombieJesus
03-31-2012, 07:56 AM
Hey what about our 1927 Championship? You didn't count that one? Is it because they didn't actually have a CG per say? They were declared champions by winning the season and ending up in first as there were no other leagues or divisions to compete against yet

Up until 1932 you won the championship by outright standing -- whoever had the best winning percentage at the end of the season was champion, no playoffs existed.

That's where it got really weird because teams didn't even have regular schedules -- for example the game the Giants played against the Notre Dame All Stars counted towards their record. Some teams would play more games than others because of novelty matchups and things of that sort.

It was ridiculously easy to enter the league at the time and teams came and went like crazy. In 1926 for example there were 22 teams.

SweetZombieJesus
03-31-2012, 08:05 AM
Wow, that is certainly a different take on things. But it is also a take that makes a lot of sense.

I am a big Parcells' fan, as most of us are, but it is really difficult to explain the violent nature of the team's collapse during the RH age. I can definitely see how RH is undeserving for such wrath, and that whole Greek tragedy meant that RH was set for failure from the get-go. I really appreciate your version of things, which makes more sense than any narrative that I ever tried to formulate... because I was frustrated with no real understanding why things got so bad so quickly.


Well, in addition to Bill Parcells' treachery and the exodus of his staff, the team was getting old. And with free agency looming George Young did not adjust to that.

Bill Parcells is a great coach and we'll always be grateful to him. But he never leaves anywhere in good shape. All that anguish of the Ray Handley era was because of Bill. And he repeated the behavior again and again.

When he first resurfaced in New England, I was confused -- who was I supposed to be loyal to? The Giants or Bill Parcells? I never really knew the Giants before him. It's like watching your parents get divorced. I stayed loyal to the Giants but followed Parcells as a secondary pursuit. When he came to the Jets in 1997 I took the opportunity to follow very closely and relive some of the Parcells magic I didn't fully appreciate when he was with the Giants. I was still loyal to the Giants first, but followed the Parcells Jets second. Watching the way the whole Belichick succession exploded in his face and then as he refused to retake the coaching reigns and bailed, I soured on him very much and the pattern of abandonment was obvious. When he went to Dallas, that sealed it for me. Anywhere but Dallas.

SweetZombieJesus
03-31-2012, 08:36 AM
Actually this record rivals the Vikings and buffalo. However in the ones that are called SBs we are 4-5 and both Minny and bills are winless.

The Vikings and Buffalo never won anything. The Giants did manage to break through a few times but yes they must have suffered a lot of humiliation being so close so often.

miked1958
03-31-2012, 09:35 AM
Actually this record rivals the Vikings and buffalo. However in the ones that are called SBs we are 4-5 and both Minny and bills are winless.

The Vikings and Buffalo never won anything.* The Giants did manage to break through a few times but yes they must have suffered a lot of humiliation being so close so often.

True... Minny and buffalo are at the top when it comes to losing a big game.

However, for my grandfather and Dad it must have been very frustrating to make the big game that many times and only have a 3-13 record to show for it.

They must have been made fun of by friends and coworkers that were not giants fans

foxie
03-31-2012, 12:46 PM
Been a Giant fan since 1968, start of HS, thru college, Lancaster Pa., I never met another Giant fan for the first 10 years, they were Horrific, both sides of the ball. Tarkenton running for his life, saw him lose 40 yards on 5 cutbacks before getting tackled, first good player we got was Brad Van Pelt, you would root for players, &amp; Mendenhall. you would just like the Giants not to embarrass themselves, keep it close. Playing the other scrub team the Eagles would be your Super Bowl for keeping out of LAST place.....Ray Perkins, FINALLY gave the Giants hope building a defense, but we could never score, lose 10-0, 14-3, 17-7 . you rooted like hell for the defense &amp; it at least gave you a sense of Pride, you couldn't wait for the defense to come on the field, Ray Perkins laid the ground work, Parcells came in &amp; it was laughable for his first 2 years, Howard Cosell commented about how he had such a lost-in over his head look on his face roaming the sidelines...well, that the way it was, &amp; we know how it all turned out under Parcells. But I'm proud today to say I remember &amp; was a fan when.....I'm 57 &amp; just laugh @ my buddy Eagle fans here in Pa, because they still haven't been to the promised land in 51 years...GO BIG BLUE!!!!

Bohemian
03-31-2012, 02:31 PM
Been a Giant fan since 1968, start of HS, thru college, Lancaster Pa., I never met another Giant fan for the first 10 years, they were Horrific, both sides of the ball. Tarkenton running for his life, saw him lose 40 yards on 5 cutbacks before getting tackled, first good player we got was Brad Van Pelt, you would root for players, &amp; Mendenhall. you would just like the Giants not to embarrass themselves, keep it close. Playing the other scrub team the Eagles would be your Super Bowl for keeping out of LAST place.....Ray Perkins, FINALLY gave the Giants hope building a defense, but we could never score, lose 10-0, 14-3, 17-7 . you rooted like hell for the defense &amp; it at least gave you a sense of Pride, you couldn't wait for the defense to come on the field, Ray Perkins laid the ground work, Parcells came in &amp; it was laughable for his first 2 years, Howard Cosell commented about how he had such a lost-in over his head look on his face roaming the sidelines...well, that the way it was, &amp; we know how it all turned out under Parcells. But I'm proud today to say I remember &amp; was a fan when.....I'm 57 &amp; just laugh @ my buddy Eagle fans here in Pa, because they still haven't been to the promised land in 51 years...GO BIG BLUE!!!!


Great story. It is good to learn about the impact that Perkins had. I will definitely try and read up about it. I find it hard to believe that neither Lombardi or Landry were given a shot at coaching the team, specially considering that they were successful with the team during their years as assistants.

foxie
03-31-2012, 03:02 PM
TROY ARCHER, it was a name that escaped me when I wrote original post, Giant 1st round draft pick 1976, 13th overall, Univ of Colorado, man he was the JPP of his day (think about the loss!!!), REAL up &amp; comer, this guy was just what the defense needed, the G-men were FINALLY going to be a force to be reckoned with-NO doubt. He gets killed in a auto accident during training camp 1979, set us back several years, we were devastated. It was like here we go, what next, another lost decade coming up!, few people probably remember this story....feelings &amp; impact @ that time!

bigal1giant
03-31-2012, 03:09 PM
I too have been a lifelong Giants fan. I strarted "listening" ( few TV's back then) to the G-Men in the late 40's with my dad who used to go to the games when he was stationed at the Brooklyn Navy Yard at the end of WWII.

I guess his love of the Giants rubbed off and I've been bleeding blue ever since. He took me to my first game, December 30, 1956, and we watched our guys dismantle the Bears 47-7 fior the NFL Championship! I still have a warm feeling formany of the guys on that team. Gifford, Webster, Tunnell, Patton, Robustelli,Connerly, Triplett, etc., etc., etc.

After that it was a no-brainer who I'd watch and root for. I too was at the game in the Meadowlands when "The Play" occurred and Herm Edwards picked up that fumble. Almost lost my lunch on that one! I must have a mental block from the mid 60's to the early 80's!

Choose not to remember the bad days but, do as other posters have mentioned, have great memories of meeting the players in the early days of the Meadowlands when many of them parked way out in the back of Section 14 and walked in. John Mendenhall was one of the truly nice guys who stopped, on occasion, after the game to have a burger with me and the family. A top-notch gentleman! I was also fortunate to have won the lottery in 1986 for tickets for Super Bowl XXI in Pasadena! Another great day for all Giants fans!

I live in Florida now but do get up to at least one game per season since my sister is the administrator for our family tickets. Can't wait for this seaons schedule to be published so I can schedule my trip north. Hopefully the Bucaneers will be there in October and I can see us take some of the air out of their sails!.

GO GIANTS!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

THE_New_York_Giants
03-31-2012, 03:22 PM
Been a Giant fan since 1968, start of HS, thru college, Lancaster Pa., I never met another Giant fan for the first 10 years, they were Horrific, both sides of the ball. Tarkenton running for his life, saw him lose 40 yards on 5 cutbacks before getting tackled,* first good player we got was Brad Van Pelt, you would root for players, & Mendenhall. you would just like the Giants not to embarrass themselves, keep it close. Playing the other scrub team the Eagles would be your Super Bowl for keeping out of LAST place.....Ray Perkins, FINALLY gave the Giants hope building a defense, but we could never score, lose 10-0, 14-3, 17-7 . you rooted like hell for the defense & it at least gave you a sense of Pride, you couldn't wait for the defense to come on the field, Ray Perkins laid the ground work, Parcells came in & it was laughable for his first 2 years, Howard Cosell commented about how he had such a lost-in over his head look on his face roaming the sidelines...well, that the way it was, & we know how it all turned out under Parcells. But I'm proud today to say I remember & was a fan when.....I'm 57 & just laugh @ my buddy Eagle fans here in Pa, because they still haven't been to the promised land in 51 years...GO BIG BLUE!!!!

The Eagles deserve to be losers

firstgamein49
04-10-2012, 05:05 PM
I should have come back to this post earlier. Foxie, the difference between the Perkins' Giants and the ones in the late 50's is that they kept going to the big game. "58 and '9, they had no O. They should have won in '58. Two problems, Gifford fumbled 3 times, and the line judge made a horrible spot on the 3rd and 4 when Gif got the FD. The ref apologized to Gif after the game.
Interesting point made to me by a friend. What if the Giants had won the game.....it is possible that the pro game wouldn't have taken off the way it did! After all, the big bad NYG beat the lowly Balt. Colts. Interesting theory! Hope this post gets back on the board.

foxie
04-10-2012, 05:53 PM
Glad you brought this post/thread back, My only comment not knowing the '58 &amp; '59 Giants is there is a difference between no O &amp; DREADFUL!, Perkins "meat" year of 1981 We featured a 2nd year Phil Simms, splitting games with Scott Bruner, Handing off to feature back just acquired from Dallas FB Rob Carpenter. (terrible after this year), throwing to WR Johnny Perkins, (best year), &amp; TE Gary Shirk.....Like Butch Cassidy said to Sundance, "Who are these guys????". Needless to say NO offense Pro Bowl Players, we did go 9-7, Believe me, seemed like you had as good a chance scoring on D as the pitiful Offense we had. But MAN! did we play exciting, TOUGH D. !!! Ps. I think you are right about your theory.

firstgamein49
04-10-2012, 06:18 PM
I hear ya! I think if you go thru the records, you'll find that the difference between the winning team and the losing team in championship games (total points) will be the '58 NYG. I'm talking about points given up vs pts scored. The Colts were the highest scoring team in the league vs. 6yjr Gmen vaunted D. The problem was that the Gmen had to pl;ay an extra game just to get the C. game. They were tired, beaten up. and they still should have won if not for a ref. blah!

keyofgmen
04-10-2012, 06:23 PM
I'll have to respond to this one after a couple of snaps some night! It was basically my "early years" and foundation of my Giant psychosis.