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JimC
03-31-2012, 01:13 PM
I believe around 30% of a team roster represents your core. Core players that really represent the essence of your team and would be hard pressed to trade. What 15 players do you think represent the CORE of the Giants?

I think:
Eli, Nicks, Snee, Bradshaw, Cruz, Webster, Philips, Boley, Rolle, Weatherford, Tuck, JPP, Osi?, Thomas?, Diel?

ny06
03-31-2012, 01:22 PM
This is a difficult question. </P>


You pretty much said every player that would be hard pressed to trade. </P>


I would add Osi to the list, also a player who does soo much for this team and you would never know on the stat sheet. Kevin Boothe. Now would Boothe really be hard pressed to trade? I would think not, but he is a player that is valuable to this team. How many guys can play LG,C,RG on any team? I amguessing not much. </P>


Another player who does alot for us is Linval Joseph. He is a wall in the inside of the line. Strong at the point, young. And I feel will only get better. </P>

JimC
03-31-2012, 01:25 PM
This is a difficult question. </p>


You pretty much said every player that would be hard pressed to trade. </p>


I would add Osi to the list, also a player who does soo much for this team and you would never know on the stat sheet. Kevin Boothe. Now would Boothe really be hard pressed to trade? I would think not, but he is a player that is valuable to this team. How many guys can play LG,C,RG on any team? I amguessing not much. </p>


Another player who does alot for us is Linval Joseph. He is a wall in the inside of the line. Strong at the point, young. And I feel will only get better. </p>

Yes, I would like to add Osi to that group, but I'm still undecided. To your point, I understand the value of Boothe, but is he really a core player? There should be 1 or two more.

B&RWarrior
03-31-2012, 01:39 PM
I believe around 30% of a team roster represents your core.* Core players that really represent the essence of your team and would be hard pressed to trade.* What 15 players do you think represent the CORE of the Giants?

I think:
Eli, Nicks, Snee, Bradshaw, Cruz, Webster, Philips, Boley, Rolle, Weatherford, Tuck, JPP, Osi?, Thomas?, Diel?


MM was a part of our core, much more so than Weatherford. I think Deihl is replaceable as well. I think Jacobs was a part of the core. We run a 2 back system. IMO, I don't think we have 15 that are irreplaceable. I think the way the league is set up teams will have to replace 2-3 core players due to salary cap restrictions.

JimC
03-31-2012, 01:42 PM
I totally disagree that Jacobs was a core player. Perhaps MM was, but only marginally so. He was definitely not more of a core player than Weatherford.

JPizzack
03-31-2012, 02:17 PM
Perhaps MM was, but only marginally so. He was definitely not more of a core player than Weatherford.
</P>


This.

Weatherford was an unsung hero of the 2011 season. Couldn't ask for a better season from a guy we didn't have high expectations of.</P>

B&RWarrior
04-01-2012, 11:16 PM
Perhaps MM was, but only marginally so.* He was definitely not more of a core player than Weatherford.*
</P>


This.

Weatherford was an unsung hero of the 2011 season. Couldn't ask for a better season from a guy we didn't have high expectations of.</P>

I disgree. Weatherford is a punter. He only plays a certain number of downs. For most of our victories we were outscoring the opponent. So even when he pinned the opposing teams deep in their own territory often times we still let them score.

If you had to list the one consistently dominant force on last year's SB team everybody should say it was the offense, and MM was a top threat in that offense (when healthy). I think a loss of MM would have definitely hurt us more than a Weatherford injury during last year's SB run.

A healthy MM made us a different team on offense, in a way more impactful than a good punter could ever do. If we won games with our defense an argument for Weatherford might be possible, but we outscored people last year.

Drez
04-02-2012, 12:18 AM
Perhaps MM was, but only marginally so. He was definitely not more of a core player than Weatherford.
</p>


This.

Weatherford was an unsung hero of the 2011 season. Couldn't ask for a better season from a guy we didn't have high expectations of.</p>
Weatherford was a core player. That's why we franchised him and signed him to a long term deal. If MM was a core player, we would have found a way to resign him.

Drez
04-02-2012, 12:20 AM
Perhaps MM was, but only marginally so. He was definitely not more of a core player than Weatherford.
</p>


This.

Weatherford was an unsung hero of the 2011 season. Couldn't ask for a better season from a guy we didn't have high expectations of.</p>

I disgree. Weatherford is a punter. He only plays a certain number of downs. For most of our victories we were outscoring the opponent. So even when he pinned the opposing teams deep in their own territory often times we still let them score.

If you had to list the one consistently dominant force on last year's SB team everybody should say it was the offense, and MM was a top threat in that offense (when healthy). I think a loss of MM would have definitely hurt us more than a Weatherford injury during last year's SB run.

A healthy MM made us a different team on offense, in a way more impactful than a good punter could ever do. If we won games with our defense an argument for Weatherford might be possible, but we outscored people last year.
If you don't think that Weatherford was a core player, then you obviously weren't watching the games this season, particularly the NFCCG and the Super Bowl.

Again, if MM was a core player then he would have been resigned.

slipknottin
04-02-2012, 12:29 AM
Eli, JPP. The end.

gmen0820
04-02-2012, 12:32 AM
Da'Rel Scott, Ramses Barden, and Spencer Paysinger.

B&RWarrior
04-02-2012, 01:20 AM
Perhaps MM was, but only marginally so.* He was definitely not more of a core player than Weatherford.*
</p>


This.

Weatherford was an unsung hero of the 2011 season. Couldn't ask for a better season from a guy we didn't have high expectations of.</p>

I disgree. Weatherford is a punter. He only plays a certain number of downs. For most of our victories we were outscoring the opponent. So even when he pinned the opposing teams deep in their own territory often times we still let them score.

If you had to list the one consistently dominant force on last year's SB team everybody should say it was the offense, and MM was a top threat in that offense (when healthy). I think a loss of MM would have definitely hurt us more than a Weatherford injury during last year's SB run.

A healthy MM made us a different team on offense, in a way more impactful than a good punter could ever do. If we won games with our defense an argument for Weatherford might be possible, but we outscored people last year.
If you don't think that Weatherford was a core player, then you obviously weren't watching the games this season, particularly the NFCCG and the Super Bowl.

Again, if MM was a core player then he would have been resigned.


In today's league you can't resign all your core players due to salary cap restrictions. If your arguing that Weatherford played a larger role than MM in our SB run you just don't know anything about football. I guy that lines up for 5-10 plays a game in most instances can't have the impact a productive #3 WR has in a prolific passing attack.

Weatherford was a core player, but he is the most replaceable of the core players. We couldn't afford to resign MM, while franchising Weatherford was in line with his value. It doesn't mean we thought he was a more important part of our SB run than MM.

giantsfan420
04-02-2012, 02:15 AM
I loved the contribution MM gave us, but no I dont believe he is a core player. he is a role player. his role, make plays when defenses key in on Nicks and last season, Cruz.

MM success came directly from defenses playing Nicks and Cruz, for all the positives MM gave us, he wasnt the kinda WR to beat double teams and be our central focus on offense.

My core players list:
Eli
Nicks
*Cruz-last year was definitely, unsure of the future although I believe he can sustain his level of play (not stats, but level of play)
Snee

Tuck
JPP
Boley
Webster
Phillips

I don't add Rolle bc last season he played a role, nickel DB. If he goes back to strictly a S, then his play could add him to my list.

Weatherford
Tynes

I only add those two bc when we win/lose, they play big factors in it. The SB, Weatherford was absolutely HUGE. Making an offense go 90 yards is MUCH MUCH more difficult than making them go 60.

While we have a solid, nay, elite group of core players, Reese doesn't get enough credit for his acquiring of role players. Guys like Canty, Boothe, Ballard,MM, Bradshaw, Hyno, JWill, Kiwi, T2/Ross/Prince, he just builds exceptional rosters.

for once, i'd love to not be decimated by injuries. we've yet to see Reese's true roster, and usually get a mix of his core signings and players added to just be able to field as competitive team as possible...

dave56dj
04-02-2012, 03:59 AM
The problem is how and why you define someone as a core player. The truth is ANYONE can be let go if we think there replacement is better - or we are getting more bang for the buck.

We all know weatherford righted a position of huge need after feagles left - and matt dodge showed us how important that was - so i suppose if you want you can say he is in our core.

Manningham is a very good wideout - but with 2 even better wideouts ahead of him I suppose you could say he fell out of the core and the Giants feel like they can replace his production with a combo of bennett and jernigan/ barden/ hixon.

Now Jpp will force out another very good d end in the next few years - if its not osi it may be kiwi. And Both of those guys WERE in our core - but JPP is cheaper and better then both. If you're not sure know that jpp's second year was a better year then any d end of ours has had since strey - 86 tackles 16.5 sacks INCREDIBLE.

Jacobs, another core member, the giants felt as the number 2 behind ab they will be able to replace his production as well (if it were up to me it would be with wilson in the draft - but we will see).

Steve Smith a core guy as was boss - but the gmen felt they could be replaced. Sadly almost everyone fits in this category except maybe nicks cruz eli jpp and tuck for now. But many more players are invaluable - like joseph, boley, canty, j will, c webb, t2, rolle, kp and so many more.

This is a business and the commodities dont last long - sadly you have to sap every great year you can out of them for the cheapest prices. cold but true.

JimC
04-02-2012, 09:27 AM
<font color="#0000FF" size="4">The problem is how and why you define someone as a core player. </font>The truth is ANYONE can be let go if we think there replacement is better - or we are getting more bang for the buck.

We all know weatherford righted a position of huge need after feagles left - and matt dodge showed us how important that was - so i suppose if you want you can say he is in our core.

Manningham is a very good wideout - but with 2 even better wideouts ahead of him I suppose you could say he fell out of the core and the Giants feel like they can replace his production with a combo of bennett and jernigan/ barden/ hixon.

Now Jpp will force out another very good d end in the next few years - if its not osi it may be kiwi. And Both of those guys WERE in our core - but JPP is cheaper and better then both. If you're not sure know that jpp's second year was a better year then any d end of ours has had since strey - 86 tackles 16.5 sacks INCREDIBLE.

Jacobs, another core member, the giants felt as the number 2 behind ab they will be able to replace his production as well (if it were up to me it would be with wilson in the draft - but we will see).

Steve Smith a core guy as was boss - but the gmen felt they could be replaced. Sadly almost everyone fits in this category except maybe nicks cruz eli jpp and tuck for now. But many more players are invaluable - like joseph, boley, canty, j will, c webb, t2, rolle, kp and so many more.

This is a business and the commodities dont last long - sadly you have to sap every great year you can out of them for the cheapest prices. cold but true.


My definition of a core player is one that embodies the essence of Giants football (physical, team player). They generally have some longevity with the team but not always. Their contribution on the field is recognized by players on other teams as well as their own team mates and coaches. Their level of performance is consistently high. When the game reaches its critical stages they usually are playing their best. They make players around them better.