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View Full Version : hmmm osi for a third?



craigjr007
04-24-2012, 05:59 PM
Jason La Canfora JasonLaCanfora

@

If a team came a callin' the Giants this week, offering say a 3rd round pick for Osi, can't help but think things could get interesting

Drez
04-24-2012, 07:23 PM
I'd say we'd want more than a 3rd.

Pa1jintfan
04-24-2012, 07:29 PM
Unless I could predict the future and find the biggest stud ever in the 3rd round, I would keep osi, let him play out his days here. Worth more than a 3rd! Plus I'm confident that we would get a compensatory pick for him??? Right..... That would be no less than a 4th.. So were better off that road

Drez
04-24-2012, 07:33 PM
Unless I could predict the future and find the biggest stud ever in the 3rd round, I would keep osi, let him play out his days here. Worth more than a 3rd! Plus I'm confident that we would get a compensatory pick for him??? Right..... That would be no less than a 4th.. So were better off that road
I'm thinking we'd need at least a 2 and a 5, or a 3++ to deal Osi. Otherwise, it's worth more to us keeping him and then taking whatever comp pick we might get for him after he leaves in FA.

Warchild
04-24-2012, 07:37 PM
No way we trade him for less than a 2nd

TheEnigma
04-24-2012, 07:45 PM
An early 3rd would be a fair starting point in discussions for Osi. The biggest thing that holds him back is his age. He doesn't offer a team a long term solution at rushing the passer so it would have to be a playoff caliber team that shows interest.

We're probably better off keeping Osi for his contract year and taking a DE in the early to mid rounds unless a team offers a 1st which you absolutely have to take.

GMENAGAIN
04-24-2012, 07:53 PM
Couldn't we get a 3rd (or at least a 4th) as a compensatory pick if he walks after his contract is up at the end of the season? If so, why would we trade him for a3rd now?</P>


</P>

byron
04-24-2012, 08:06 PM
Couldn't we get a 3rd (or at least a 4th) as a compensatory pick if he walks after his contract is up at the end of the season? If so, why would we trade him for a3rd now?</P>


</P> I tried to figure this out "what the rule is for comp picks" There is a fomula....but I'm with you here they will get some kind of comp pick.....Play him

b_ELI_eve
04-24-2012, 08:16 PM
No way the FO can afford to give in if he decides to hold out. Make him play out his final year and part ways next year. He can go finish his career in Oakland

Redeyejedi
04-24-2012, 08:28 PM
Couldn't we get a 3rd (or at least a 4th) as a compensatory pick if he walks after his contract is up at the end of the season?* If so, why would we trade him for a*3rd now?</P>


*</P>yes its stupid to trade him for anything less then a 2nd.He is going to play and play hard if he wants to get paid next season

JJC7301
04-24-2012, 10:01 PM
No way. He's worth a lot more than a 3rd to this team. He's a big piece in trying to repeat. Nothing less than a # 1, which means that he won't be traded.

I'd rather keep him this year in attempting to repeat and let him walk next (would we get a comp pick?).

NYG4lifeNYK
04-24-2012, 10:01 PM
A 3rd round pick for one of the best pass rushers in the NFL..........?


I wouldn't take anything but a 1st... and I don't want him traded PERIOD.

For the record he won't be traded, Osi will be a Giant this season and get an extension.

BigBlue1971
04-24-2012, 10:06 PM
An early 3rd would be a fair starting point in discussions for Osi. The biggest thing that holds him back is his age. He doesn't offer a team a long term solution at rushing the passer so it would have to be a playoff caliber team that shows interest. We're probably better off keeping Osi for his contract year and taking a DE in the early to mid rounds unless a team offers a 1st which you absolutely have to take.</P>


</P>


a real early 3rd like top 5!</P>


i agree i rather keep Osi for the upcoming year! but without a raise of some sort he wont be happy!</P>

Drez
04-24-2012, 10:16 PM
A 3rd round pick for one of the best pass rushers in the NFL..........?


I wouldn't take anything but a 1st... and I don't want him traded PERIOD.

For the record he won't be traded, Osi will be a Giant this season and get an extension.

A first would be nice, but a lot for a player that probably only has 3 or 4 more top flight seasons in him

Unless Osi has a serious change of heart about how much money he's worth there's no way we can extend him.

speedman
04-24-2012, 10:22 PM
Reese will not trade Osi for a 3rd.

chizz
04-24-2012, 11:24 PM
would you guys really be that upset if osi stayed. I want him to retire a giant. Our line plays better when he is in the rotation.

TheEnigma
04-24-2012, 11:29 PM
would you guys really be that upset if osi stayed. I want him to retire a giant. Our line plays better when he is in the rotation.No but if the right price is offered for him, then trade him. Heck, I'm open to any player being traded as long as we get just compensation.

G-Men Surg.
04-24-2012, 11:33 PM
Jason La Canfora JasonLaCanfora

@

If a team came a callin' the Giants this week, offering say a 3rd round pick for Osi, can't help but think things could get interesting

This guys are incredible. How the heck do they come up with those remarks. I guess there's more to come in this next 48 hrs.

giantsfan420
04-24-2012, 11:34 PM
would you guys really be that upset if osi stayed. I want him to retire a giant. Our line plays better when he is in the rotation.
my thought exactly. he was pivotal to our 2 SB runs, he would make the best role player as a pass rush specialist. longest tenured giant. and he still has a ton left in the tank...

IF i were the GM, i would only trade him for an early 2nd round pick or a 1rst...

Martyr
04-24-2012, 11:44 PM
Reese makes the call, if he reworks Osi contract to keep him happy or make him play out his last year upset and leave for good. Is it that hard to believe that Reese might agree to trade him if they can't come to terms?

I like Osi but if he's gonna pout all year like last year then IMO trade him.

miked1958
04-25-2012, 12:18 AM
Jason La Canfora JasonLaCanfora

@

If a team came a callin' the Giants this week, offering say a 3rd round pick for Osi, can't help but think things could get interestingI know we can't afford to give him what he wants with our Cap issues but " Pay the man!!!"

NY_Eli
04-25-2012, 12:23 AM
Osi is worth far more than a third round pick. You're talking about trading an ELITE pass rusher for a 3rd round prospect?

Take a look at this link http://www.draftmetrics.com/files/Starts.pdf

You'll see that 12% of 3rd rounders end up starting in the NFL. Is giving up Osi really worth those odds?

Rat_bastich
04-25-2012, 12:24 AM
The guy is in his 30's, has been injury "plagued" the last couple of years and on the last year of his contract. I doubt at this point the Giants would get anything for him. Better for every team to let him play out the last year of his contract and see what happens.

I'm not denying his production when he has his mind on it, but......

RichGiants81
04-25-2012, 01:20 AM
It's only worth trading osi for a top 10 first round pick, even that might not be worth it. He's too valuable to the team in my opinion

giantsfan420
04-25-2012, 01:53 AM
It's only worth trading osi for a top 10 first round pick, even that might not be worth it. He's too valuable to the team in my opinion

no gm would be that stupid,,,and if some one did, we would 100% trade him.

Flip Empty
04-25-2012, 06:20 AM
Ugh, hurry up draft day/s. It's just the same topics repeating themselves.

Bigbluereckingcrew
04-25-2012, 06:54 AM
No way. He's worth a lot more than a 3rd to this team. He's a big piece in trying to repeat. Nothing less than a # 1, which means that he won't be traded.

I'd rather keep him this year in attempting to repeat and let him walk next (would we get a comp pick?).

The Pats do have 2 #1's, that would be an interesting situation, If they can't beat us than have us join them???

Firenugget
04-25-2012, 07:16 AM
A 3rd isn't bad if he wants to hold out. If he does we either don't have him on the field and don't benefit or we trade for a 3rd and at least get something before he walks away the following year.

G-Man67
04-25-2012, 09:17 AM
that is probably his market value and that is exactly why we keep him, he is worth more to us for next season ... he may have a career year b/c he will be playing for a new contract</P>


then u throw in the compensatory pick factor and to me keeping him is an absolute no brainer</P>

chizz
04-25-2012, 11:06 AM
ok and when he came back from his injury was he not productive?

VegasGmen
04-25-2012, 11:10 AM
that is probably his market value and that is exactly why we keep him, he is worth more to us for next season ... he may have a career year b/c he will be playing for a new contract</P>


then u throw in the compensatory pick factor and to me keeping him is an absolute no brainer</P>


</P>


Why does everyone think its good to let him walk next season and get a compensatory pick. Compensatory picks have many factors involved too many to take that chance. If we sign more FA's next season than walk from our team we get zero picks! Trade him now and get some youth. Lets not stunt the growth of JPP on the right side. I love what Osi has done for us but sometimes its best to move on. </P>

Spedracer
04-25-2012, 11:22 AM
I'd rather have an average hard working rookie on the roster over a half-hearted, prima donna, good(not great) DE.

Trade him, lots of great 3rd rounders out there.

G-Man67
04-25-2012, 12:01 PM
that is probably his market value and that is exactly why we keep him, he is worth more to us for next season ... he may have a career year b/c he will be playing for a new contract</P>


then u throw in the compensatory pick factor and to me keeping him is an absolute no brainer</P>


</P>


Why does everyone think its good to let him walk next season and get a compensatory pick. Compensatory picks have many factors involved too many to take that chance. If we sign more FA's next season than walk from our team we get zero picks! Trade him now and get some youth. Lets not stunt the growth of JPP on the right side. I love what Osi has done for us but sometimes its best to move on. </P>


</P>


well you have to decide what's more valuable</P>


is a 3rd or a 4thand no Osi next year more valuable than a contract seeking Osi for this season ... i guess if we were like the Raiders and had no picks ... then the value of any pick in any round goes way up ... but the reality is that as valuable as picks are ... we will still have trouble having every player we pick make the team</P>


i mean, forget the compensatory pick ... to me i want that Osi playing like a man possessed this season</P>


that's why we locked him up for 7 years ... why should we not get our 7th year out of him?</P>


and we can't extend him b/c he wants Mathis money</P>


finally, and while we all know we won't do it, what prevents us from being the highest bidder for him in FAs?</P>


and extra finally, so many things can change in a year ... he could get hurt another player could emerge on our roster, etc.</P>

Spedracer
04-25-2012, 12:03 PM
By the way...

A report just came out that Osi said he would play out his current deal as a prove it type situation if a team traded the Giants for him.

Essentially, he wants out. Bad.

nygsb42champs
04-25-2012, 12:33 PM
I would want more than just a 3rd round pick for him.

burier
04-25-2012, 02:53 PM
We won't take a third...and no one will offer a third so.....

Redeyejedi
04-25-2012, 04:04 PM
Why does the majority of Giant fans want to give away the best pas rusher on the team for a 3rd round pick. I cant comprehend that way of thinking because it makes no sense

Spedracer
04-25-2012, 04:36 PM
Why does the majority of Giant fans want to give away the best pas rusher on the team for a 3rd round pick. I cant comprehend that way of thinking because it makes no sense

I think the best situation would be trading Osi to move up in the first round. Ofcourse, it could require the Giants to give up Osi and another late round pick to move up depending on how far. But I really see this as the most likely.

craigjr007
04-25-2012, 04:44 PM
well lets put it like this... there is probably no way osi is going to end up resigning with us after this season..do we

a) trade him and get best offer/draft pick or

b) keep him, he could cause drama, some animosity or he could play out the season no problems...he ends up not resigning and we may, may not get good compensatory pick...

whats the better situation for the giants.

TheEnigma
04-25-2012, 04:48 PM
Osi is not an easy player to move through a trade. He's a pass rushing specialist who relies mostly on his ability to beat his opponents on his speed. He has 8 seasons tacked on his body and he wasn't able to play at all in his 2008 campaign. The safe bet is to say he has 1-2 more good seasons before he loses a step and becomes a shadow of himself.

You have to realize that he is a huge gamble for most teams at the 1-2 round draft pick range. Due to his age, I think it's safe to say rebuilding teams won't have much interest in him unless they can grab him at a decent deal in FA. It would have to be a playoff caliber team like the Ravens who could use someone opposite of Suggs to add an extra element to their D.

The problem is that Osi currently produces more than a 3rd but he's too much of a risk for other teams past an early 3rd. It's a very complex problem for both sides of the trade table.

RoanokeFan
04-25-2012, 04:52 PM
Just playing devil's advocate...Suppose there were a player in the draft Reese was willing to trade up for. Would Osi alone or Osi and say a 7th round pick next season get them to a pick between 5 and 15?

RoanokeFan
04-25-2012, 04:56 PM
Osi is not an easy player to move through a trade. He's a pass rushing specialist who relies mostly on his ability to beat his opponents on his speed. He has 8 seasons tacked on his body and he wasn't able to play at all in his 2008 campaign. The safe bet is to say he has 1-2 more good seasons before he loses a step and becomes a shadow of himself.

You have to realize that he is a huge gamble for most teams at the 1-2 round draft pick range. Due to his age, I think it's safe to say rebuilding teams won't have much interest in him unless they can grab him at a decent deal in FA. It would have to be a playoff caliber team like the Ravens who could use someone opposite of Suggs to add an extra element to their D.

The problem is that Osi currently produces more than a 3rd but he's too much of a risk for other teams past an early 3rd. It's a very complex problem for both sides of the trade table.

If they get Devon Still at 32, I think that seals Osi's future here. They will hold him to the last year of his contract and release him next season.

burier
04-25-2012, 05:01 PM
i'd take a third for him but I dont think reese will.

I wouldn't take a fourth.

Fact of the matter is Osi wants one more pay day and then he wants out of the NFL. He tipped his hand making him basically worthless.

TheEnigma
04-25-2012, 05:04 PM
If they get Devon Still at 32, I think that seals Osi's future here.* They will hold him to the last year of his contract and release him next season.I don't think taking a DT will have anything to do with Osi but more so Canty. Now if we got a guy like Nick Perry or Whitney Mercilus, it makes Osi a lot more expendable.

RoanokeFan
04-25-2012, 05:06 PM
If they get Devon Still at 32, I think that seals Osi's future here. They will hold him to the last year of his contract and release him next season.I don't think taking a DT will have anything to do with Osi but more so Canty. Now if we got a guy like Nick Perry or Whitney Mercilus, it makes Osi a lot more expendable.

With Tuck and JPP on the outisde, another play maker on the inside could be devastating to opposing offenses.

TheEnigma
04-25-2012, 05:11 PM
With Tuck and JPP on the outisde, another play maker on the inside could be devastating to opposing offenses.Depends on what you see Still doing for the Giants. To me, I see him eating up inside blockers and creating opportunities for other guys than making plays. If Marvin Austin could get back to form and make some decent contributions, we would then be set at DT and DE for the 2012 season.

little blue
04-25-2012, 05:18 PM
I'd say we'd want more than a 3rd.
I say go for it hopefully we can get the pot sweetin and get a 6th rounder wit that ??

Drez
04-25-2012, 09:42 PM
that is probably his market value and that is exactly why we keep him, he is worth more to us for next season ... he may have a career year b/c he will be playing for a new contract</p>


then u throw in the compensatory pick factor and to me keeping him is an absolute no brainer</p>


</p>


Why does everyone think its good to let him walk next season and get a compensatory pick. Compensatory picks have many factors involved too many to take that chance. If we sign more FA's next season than walk from our team we get zero picks! Trade him now and get some youth. Lets not stunt the growth of JPP on the right side. I love what Osi has done for us but sometimes its best to move on. </p>

Because if the deal isn't right, then it it's worth taking a chance on the comp pick.

hungrrrry
04-25-2012, 09:48 PM
a second rounder yes...not sure about a third but it depends on who is there but more importantly, how early in the third round.

hungrrrry
04-26-2012, 07:19 AM
a second rounder yes...not sure about a third but it depends on who is there but more importantly, how early in the third round.Thinking about that now, if we drafted Chandler Jones somehow, Reese may just let Osi go for as low as a fourth rounder but to a team not likely to play us very soon...like the Jets, Patriots or Dolphins

Redeyejedi
04-26-2012, 07:51 AM
a second rounder yes...not sure about a third but it depends on who is there but more importantly, how early in the third round.Thinking about that now, if we drafted Chandler Jones somehow, Reese may just let Osi go for as low as a fourth rounder but to a team not likely to play us very soon...like the Jets, Patriots or DolphinsI dont think Chandler Jones is a pure pass rusher like Osi. If the giants are really willing to let him go i think they should go after a more of an edge rusher. People are sleeping on Andre Brach I think. He has the measurements the Giants are looking for and fits in the mold of a 3rd down rusher

Redeyejedi
04-26-2012, 07:53 AM
that is probably his market value and that is exactly why we keep him, he is worth more to us for next season ... he may have a career year b/c he will be playing for a new contract</P>


then u throw in the compensatory pick factor and to me keeping him is an absolute no brainer</P>


</P>


Why does everyone think its good to let him walk next season and get a compensatory pick. Compensatory picks have many factors involved too many to take that chance. If we sign more FA's next season than walk from our team we get zero picks! Trade him now and get some youth. Lets not stunt the growth of JPP on the right side. I love what Osi has done for us but sometimes its best to move on. </P>Id rather have Osi for a year and the opportunity for a comp pick then a 3rd rounder in this draft.
I cant believe the value u guys place on Osi its like the guys worthless

T.Rice57
04-26-2012, 07:58 AM
Osi is worth a lot more than a third. If we trade him we better get a 2nd and 4th, or something close to that.

I don't know if the stats back me up, but I felt our D was underachieving until Osi stepped back on the field. Once he was back, we got consistent pressure w/ our front four and our DB's started looking better because of it.

Osi is still one of the leagues best, if not the best, pass rusher. We better not give him up for the sake of giving him up.

DelawareGiants
04-26-2012, 08:28 AM
I think it depends on who is available at Pick 32 in the first if the GMen pull the string on a trade. Couple the fact that Osi is suggesting he wants a deal upwards of 40 million for 4 years at his age- if some team is interested and possibly pads a top of round 3 pick with a 5th round as well and if someone like Nick Perry is available----it could happen. I don't think Branch fits our system- they say he may be better in 3-4. Chandler Jones would be great but he will be gone by Pick 20 IMO.

Morehead State
04-26-2012, 08:59 AM
Osi is worth a lot more than a third. If we trade him we better get a 2nd and 4th, or something close to that.

I don't know if the stats back me up, but I felt our D was underachieving until Osi stepped back on the field. Once he was back, we got consistent pressure w/ our front four and our DB's started looking better because of it.

Osi is still one of the leagues best, if not the best, pass rusher. We better not give him up for the sake of giving him up.
</P>


Our back up, part time DE is worth more than a third?</P>


If you say so.</P>

CDN_G-FAN
04-26-2012, 09:11 AM
Osi's onfield value is worth more than a 3rd, but no GM in their right mind will pay a 3rd for him.</P>


</P>


It doesn't make any sense.</P>

Redeyejedi
04-26-2012, 09:18 AM
Osi is worth a lot more than a third.* If we trade him we better get a 2nd and 4th, or something close to that.*

I don't know if the stats back me up, but I felt our D was underachieving until Osi stepped back on the field.* Once he was back, we got consistent pressure w/ our front four and our DB's started looking better because of it.*

Osi is still one of the leagues best, if not the best, pass rusher.* We better not give him up for the sake of giving him up.*
</P>


Our back up, part time DE is worth more than a third?</P>


If you say so.</P> We get it U hate Osi.

Redeyejedi
04-26-2012, 09:20 AM
Osi's onfield value is worth more than a 3rd, but no GM in their right mind will pay a 3rd for him.</P>


*</P>


It doesn't make any sense.</P>If Osi would take a 4 year 28 Million dollar deal someone would. He is scaring away teams by asking for the money he is is seeking

hungrrrry
04-26-2012, 09:24 AM
Osi is worth a lot more than a third.* If we trade him we better get a 2nd and 4th, or something close to that.*

I don't know if the stats back me up, but I felt our D was underachieving until Osi stepped back on the field.* Once he was back, we got consistent pressure w/ our front four and our DB's started looking better because of it.*

Osi is still one of the leagues best, if not the best, pass rusher.* We better not give him up for the sake of giving him up.*
</P>


Our back up, part time DE is worth more than a third?</P>


If you say so.</P>Very good point...however, if Osi is playing a part time role and produce overtime numbers then that HAS to be taken into account. I have a feeling his premadonna actions are going to push him out of NY which will make it more likely we take less for him in trade, not so much his lack of playing time. If Osi isn't worrying about his contract he is a great player, no question. To your point, however, since he is the #3 DE, he can't realistically expect $10 mil/year.

On top of that...

So he does have the value, to another team, as a starter....for sure!!! But for the G-men, as much as I would love to see him play out his contract, he doesn't fit at his price...maybe average 6-7 mil/yr, but it would be backloaded. Then that causes us grief signing critical players. So that is where the balance needs to lie, but it can't...we can't risk losing a #1 WR for a #3 DE

Redeyejedi
04-26-2012, 09:27 AM
Osi is worth a lot more than a third.* If we trade him we better get a 2nd and 4th, or something close to that.*

I don't know if the stats back me up, but I felt our D was underachieving until Osi stepped back on the field.* Once he was back, we got consistent pressure w/ our front four and our DB's started looking better because of it.*

Osi is still one of the leagues best, if not the best, pass rusher.* We better not give him up for the sake of giving him up.*
</P>


Our back up, part time DE is worth more than a third?</P>


If you say so.</P>Very good point...however, if Osi is playing a part time role and produce overtime numbers then that HAS to be taken into account. I have a feeling his premadonna actions are going to push him out of NY which will make it more likely we take less for him in trade, not so much his lack of playing time. If Osi isn't worrying about his contract he is a great player, no question. To your point, however, since he is the #3 DE, he can't realistically expect $10 mil/year.

So he does have the value, to another team, as a starter....for sure!!! But for the G-men, as much as I would love to see him play out his contract, he doesn't fit at his price...maybe average 6-7 mil/yr, but it would be backloaded. Then that causes us grief signing critical players. So that is where the balance needs to lie, but it can't...we can't risk losing a #1 WR for a #3 DE 3rd best DE on a team with 3 All Pro's. The Giants value a great Pass Rush correct. Osi is the best pass rusher on the team

MikeIsaGiant
04-26-2012, 09:32 AM
No way 3rd for Osi.

Teams in desperate need for a DE should give a 2nd

Morehead State
04-26-2012, 09:38 AM
Osi is worth a lot more than a third. If we trade him we better get a 2nd and 4th, or something close to that.

I don't know if the stats back me up, but I felt our D was underachieving until Osi stepped back on the field. Once he was back, we got consistent pressure w/ our front four and our DB's started looking better because of it.

Osi is still one of the leagues best, if not the best, pass rusher. We better not give him up for the sake of giving him up.
</P>


Our back up, part time DE is worth more than a third?</P>


If you say so.</P>


We get it U hate Osi.</P>


I certainly don't hate Osi and would be glad to have him for this next season in the role that has been slotted for him. That is a pass rush specialist who plays essentially only in passing situations. (Although I do admit that it moves JPP toleft DE which makes him much less effective).</P>


But I would also take a third for him, free up almost $5MM in cap space and work towards the future. Its six of one, half a dozen the other for me.</P>


But yes,...I don't like Osi. His act of being a perpetual malcontent has grown old with me.</P>

G-Man67
04-26-2012, 10:04 AM
Osi is worth a lot more than a third. If we trade him we better get a 2nd and 4th, or something close to that.

I don't know if the stats back me up, but I felt our D was underachieving until Osi stepped back on the field. Once he was back, we got consistent pressure w/ our front four and our DB's started looking better because of it.

Osi is still one of the leagues best, if not the best, pass rusher. We better not give him up for the sake of giving him up.
</P>


Our back up, part time DE is worth more than a third?</P>


If you say so.</P>


</P>


come on morehead, he is way more than a backup, part time DE ... he got more sacks than most starting DEs and he was out for 4+ games</P>


with the D-line there is constant rotation ... think about how many snaps Tolly got and by your words he would be a 4th string insurance policy... let's face it your 3rd DB and 3rd DE get way more snaps than your 3rd LB to put it in perspective</P>


we would miss Osi a lot and god forbid Tuck goes down and he has been banged up the last few seasons</P>

Morehead State
04-26-2012, 10:40 AM
Osi is worth a lot more than a third. If we trade him we better get a 2nd and 4th, or something close to that.

I don't know if the stats back me up, but I felt our D was underachieving until Osi stepped back on the field. Once he was back, we got consistent pressure w/ our front four and our DB's started looking better because of it.

Osi is still one of the leagues best, if not the best, pass rusher. We better not give him up for the sake of giving him up.
</P>


Our back up, part time DE is worth more than a third?</P>


If you say so.</P>


</P>


come on morehead, he is way more than a backup, part time DE ... he got more sacks than most starting DEs and he was out for 4+ games</P>


with the D-line there is constant rotation ... think about how many snaps Tolly got and by your words he would be a 4th string insurance policy... let's face it your 3rd DB and 3rd DE get way more snaps than your 3rd LB to put it in perspective</P>


we would miss Osi a lot and god forbid Tuck goes down and he has been banged up the last few seasons</P>


</P>


If I believed that Osi was willing to be a good soldier next season I'm fine with his staying. But I don't see that. He wants out before this season (or he wants an extention). I doubt he wants to play this year for a new contract being 30 and being injury prone. I believe HE thinks this is his best chance. RIGHT NOW. And maybe he's right.</P>


But either way, I don't see him being anything but a problem this season without a new contract.</P>

T.Rice57
04-26-2012, 10:50 AM
Osi is worth a lot more than a third. If we trade him we better get a 2nd and 4th, or something close to that.

I don't know if the stats back me up, but I felt our D was underachieving until Osi stepped back on the field. Once he was back, we got consistent pressure w/ our front four and our DB's started looking better because of it.

Osi is still one of the leagues best, if not the best, pass rusher. We better not give him up for the sake of giving him up.
</p>


Our back up, part time DE is worth more than a third?</p>


If you say so.</p>

Our 3rd best DE would be the #1 on most teams. Yes, he's worth a 3rd or more. Reese won't move for the sake of moving, and with Osi being under contract, I doubt he'd trade for simply a 3rd. I may be wrong.

I agree GM's wouldn't pay much more than a 3rd b/c of age, but Tuck and JPP were noticeably better when Osi played. He's more valuable to our D's success than people are giving him credit for.

Morehead State
04-26-2012, 11:04 AM
Osi is worth a lot more than a third. If we trade him we better get a 2nd and 4th, or something close to that.

I don't know if the stats back me up, but I felt our D was underachieving until Osi stepped back on the field. Once he was back, we got consistent pressure w/ our front four and our DB's started looking better because of it.

Osi is still one of the leagues best, if not the best, pass rusher. We better not give him up for the sake of giving him up.
</P>


Our back up, part time DE is worth more than a third?</P>


If you say so.</P>




Our 3rd best DE would be the #1 on most teams. Yes, he's worth a 3rd or more. Reese won't move for the sake of moving, and with Osi being under contract, I doubt he'd trade for simply a 3rd. I may be wrong.

I agree GM's wouldn't pay much more than a 3rd b/c of age, but Tuck and JPP were noticeably better when Osi played. He's more valuable to our D's success than people are giving him credit for.
</P>


In passing situations I'm as happy or even a little more happy to have JPP in his natural position at right DE. When Osi is on the field he has to move to left DE.</P>


What <U>does </U>concern me is our D line depth. Losing Osi would be a blow in that regard. But its not much of a challenge to pick up a vet after some post draft cuts to enhance our depth. Or of course draft a D lineman (or both)</P>


I would submit that JPP at right DE on passing downs will be as effective or more effective than Osi.</P>

G-Man67
04-26-2012, 11:21 AM
If I believed that Osi was willing to be a good soldier next season I'm fine with his staying. But I don't see that. He wants out before this season (or he wants an extention). I doubt he wants to play this year for a new contract being 30 and being injury prone. I believe HE thinks this is his best chance. RIGHT NOW. And maybe he's right.</P>


But either way, I don't see him being anything but a problem this season without a new contract.</P>


</P>


but in his Osi way, he was a good soldier last year when hefinally got on the field</P>


yes he huffed and he puffed like he is doing now, but playersdo this all the time ... every team is dealing with, at least, one Osi-like situation... look at Brees, Forte, Wallace ... the list goes on and on</P>


but this is far from unusualand it hasn't distracted the team, IMO ... modern players draw the line between business and football</P>


what Osi knows is that the Giants won't extend him for anything close to Mathis money, he knows he isn't beating out JPP or Tuck to be "starter in name" (yes, in name, b/c he will see as many snaps as he can handle)</P>


but most of all he knows that he has to play this year to get the money he wants and he has to have a career year and he is fully prepared to play for us, but would prefer to play as a starter elsewhere</P>


so what he has done and he has every right to do this ... is he has tried to increase his market value by basically saying i will start and play great for you for 1 year at $4MM ... so if you are a win now team and want a Pro Bowl DE, then offer up a good 2 or a 1 and you can rent my services</P>


it will be interesting to see how it plays out ... but i just fear that if we take a deal for a 2nd ... which is more than fair ... we might end up regretting it short term ... i'd rather let it play out and have fate decide it all ... afterall, in the NFL so many things change from year to year</P>


i think many are trying to look at this like a decision a small payroll baseball team might have to make with a star player ... they know they can't afford the player and so they are compelled to trade him before his contract expires so they, at least, get some compensation for finding a stud player</P>


i don't view this as the same b/c we are a win now team and injuries are such a big part of the sport and so many things change year to year</P>


yes, draft picks are extremely valuable, but you also have to consider that we have a good number and will be challenged to fit all our drafted players on the roster as it is</P>


and you can't dismiss the potential for a compensatory pick even though that is a bit of a crap-shoot</P>

CDN_G-FAN
04-26-2012, 11:25 AM
Osi's onfield value is worth more than a 3rd, but no GM in their right mind will pay a 3rd for him.</P>


</P>


It doesn't make any sense.</P>


If Osi would take a 4 year 28 Million dollar deal someone would. He is scaring away teams by asking for the money he is is seeking</P>


Exactly, which is why no team will trade for him.</P>


he wants money he's not worth, and he won't find that out until he tests FA.</P>


And if he needs to test FA to find out his value is not top 5 money, then you're wasting a pick to acquire him.</P>

Morehead State
04-26-2012, 11:26 AM
If I believed that Osi was willing to be a good soldier next season I'm fine with his staying. But I don't see that. He wants out before this season (or he wants an extention). I doubt he wants to play this year for a new contract being 30 and being injury prone. I believe HE thinks this is his best chance. RIGHT NOW. And maybe he's right.</P>


But either way, I don't see him being anything but a problem this season without a new contract.</P>


</P>


but in his Osi way, he was a good soldier last year when hefinally got on the field</P>


yes he huffed and he puffed like he is doing now, but playersdo this all the time ... every team is dealing with, at least, one Osi-like situation... look at Brees, Forte, Wallace ... the list goes on and on</P>


but this is far from unusualand it hasn't distracted the team, IMO ... modern players draw the line between business and football</P>


what Osi knows is that the Giants won't extend him for anything close to Mathis money, he knows he isn't beating out JPP or Tuck to be "starter in name" (yes, in name, b/c he will see as many snaps as he can handle)</P>


but most of all he knows that he has to play this year to get the money he wants and he has to have a career year and he is fully prepared to play for us, but would prefer to play as a starter elsewhere</P>


so what he has done and he has every right to do this ... is he has tried to increase his market value by basically saying i will start and play great for you for 1 year at $4MM ... so if you are a win now team and want a Pro Bowl DE, then offer up a good 2 or a 1 and you can rent my services</P>


it will be interesting to see how it plays out ... but i just fear that if we take a deal for a 2nd ... which is more than fair ... we might end up regretting it short term ... i'd rather let it play out and have fate decide it all ... afterall, in the NFL so many things change from year to year</P>


</P>


If some GM is dumb enough to offer us a 2nd for Osi we should jump on it as fast as we can. But it will never happen. The most we could ever hope for is a third round pick....Maybe!!</P>


As I said, I am concerned about our D line depth. Losing Tolly was big. So it would concern me to deal Osi for that reason. But it still may be in our interest. The cap savings are huge also and that would really help our ability to get some better depth all over the football team.</P>


</P>


And ultimately I think he simply doesn't want to play here because of his limited role.</P>

CDN_G-FAN
04-26-2012, 11:28 AM
No way 3rd for Osi. Teams in desperate need for a DE should give a 2nd</P>


why give a 2nd for him when you can pick him up in FA, save the 2nd, and pay less for him then than he's insisting he's worth right now?</P>


why even give a 3rd for that?</P>


What 31 yr old often injured player who wants $10 million a season are we willing to give a 2nd round pick for?</P>

slipknottin
04-26-2012, 11:29 AM
Now it seems Freeney is on the market too, a year older than Osi, could argue which is a better player, but anytime you have multiple players on the market the value of the players drops.

Morehead State
04-26-2012, 11:32 AM
Now it seems Freeney is on the market too, a year older than Osi, could argue which is a better player, but anytime you have multiple players on the market the value of the players drops.</P>


A couple of very similar players. I guess the only difference is that Freeney has a better motor and attitude.</P>


But as far as the type and talent, they are very similar.</P>

CDN_G-FAN
04-26-2012, 11:39 AM
Now it seems Freeney is on the market too, a year older than Osi, could argue which is a better player, but anytime you have multiple players on the market the value of the players drops.</P>


A couple of very similar players. I guess the only difference is that Freeney has a better motor and attitude.</P>


But as far as the type and talent, they are very similar.</P>


</P>


with freeney having a little better injury history.</P>


but yeah, surprisingly similar players.</P>

Morehead State
04-26-2012, 11:41 AM
Now it seems Freeney is on the market too, a year older than Osi, could argue which is a better player, but anytime you have multiple players on the market the value of the players drops.</P>


A couple of very similar players. I guess the only difference is that Freeney has a better motor and attitude.</P>


But as far as the type and talent, they are very similar.</P>


</P>


with freeney having a little better injury history.</P>


but yeah, surprisingly similar players.</P>


</P>


A little better but not much. He's had his share of missed games in the past several years. But his build is a little better for staying healthy.</P>

giantman8493
04-26-2012, 12:02 PM
Osi is worth a lot more than a third.* If we trade him we better get a 2nd and 4th, or something close to that.*

I don't know if the stats back me up, but I felt our D was underachieving until Osi stepped back on the field.* Once he was back, we got consistent pressure w/ our front four and our DB's started looking better because of it.*

Osi is still one of the leagues best, if not the best, pass rusher.* We better not give him up for the sake of giving him up.*
</P>


Our back up, part time DE is worth more than a third?</P>


If you say so.</P>


We get it U hate Osi.</P>


I certainly don't hate Osi and would be glad to have him for this next season in the role that has been slotted for him.* That is a pass rush specialist who plays essentially only in passing situations.* (Although I do admit that it moves JPP to*left DE which makes him much less effective).</P>


But I would also take a third for him, free up almost $5MM in cap space and work towards the future.* Its six of one, half a dozen the other for me.</P>


But yes,...I don't like Osi.* His act of being a perpetual malcontent has grown old with me.</P>Your a hater then, making you logic biased, meaning your argument has no validity at all.

giantman8493
04-26-2012, 12:02 PM
Osi is worth a lot more than a third.* If we trade him we better get a 2nd and 4th, or something close to that.*

I don't know if the stats back me up, but I felt our D was underachieving until Osi stepped back on the field.* Once he was back, we got consistent pressure w/ our front four and our DB's started looking better because of it.*

Osi is still one of the leagues best, if not the best, pass rusher.* We better not give him up for the sake of giving him up.*
</P>


Our back up, part time DE is worth more than a third?</P>


If you say so.</P>


We get it U hate Osi.</P>


I certainly don't hate Osi and would be glad to have him for this next season in the role that has been slotted for him.* That is a pass rush specialist who plays essentially only in passing situations.* (Although I do admit that it moves JPP to*left DE which makes him much less effective).</P>


But I would also take a third for him, free up almost $5MM in cap space and work towards the future.* Its six of one, half a dozen the other for me.</P>


But yes,...I don't like Osi.* His act of being a perpetual malcontent has grown old with me.</P>Your a hater then, making you logic biased, meaning your argument has no validity at all.

RoanokeFan
04-26-2012, 12:37 PM
With Tuck and JPP on the outisde, another play maker on the inside could be devastating to opposing offenses.Depends on what you see Still doing for the Giants. To me, I see him eating up inside blockers and creating opportunities for other guys than making plays. If Marvin Austin could get back to form and make some decent contributions, we would then be set at DT and DE for the 2012 season.

We lost Tollefson and may lose Osi. In order to keep NASCAR we need an above average DL rotation. The purpose of the internal lineman is to push the offensive line back into the QB by collapsing the pocket. Eating up inside blockers is what makes sacks happen a lot of the time.

RoanokeFan
04-26-2012, 12:39 PM
Osi is worth a lot more than a third. If we trade him we better get a 2nd and 4th, or something close to that.

I don't know if the stats back me up, but I felt our D was underachieving until Osi stepped back on the field. Once he was back, we got consistent pressure w/ our front four and our DB's started looking better because of it.

Osi is still one of the leagues best, if not the best, pass rusher. We better not give him up for the sake of giving him up.
</p>


Our back up, part time DE is worth more than a third?</p>


If you say so.</p>


We get it U hate Osi.</p>


I certainly don't hate Osi and would be glad to have him for this next season in the role that has been slotted for him. That is a pass rush specialist who plays essentially only in passing situations. (Although I do admit that it moves JPP toleft DE which makes him much less effective).</p>


But I would also take a third for him, free up almost $5MM in cap space and work towards the future. Its six of one, half a dozen the other for me.</p>


But yes,...I don't like Osi. His act of being a perpetual malcontent has grown old with me.</p>Your a hater then, making you logic biased, meaning your argument has no validity at all.

Why does someone have to be a hater or homer just because they express their opinion?

Firenugget
04-26-2012, 01:18 PM
By the way...

A report just came out that Osi said he would play out his current deal as a prove it type situation if a team traded the Giants for him.

Essentially, he wants out. Bad.

That makes no sense. If we're trading him he isn't playing out his contract. This year is his last.

Morehead State
04-26-2012, 01:24 PM
Osi is worth a lot more than a third. If we trade him we better get a 2nd and 4th, or something close to that.

I don't know if the stats back me up, but I felt our D was underachieving until Osi stepped back on the field. Once he was back, we got consistent pressure w/ our front four and our DB's started looking better because of it.

Osi is still one of the leagues best, if not the best, pass rusher. We better not give him up for the sake of giving him up.
</P>


Our back up, part time DE is worth more than a third?</P>


If you say so.</P>


We get it U hate Osi.</P>


I certainly don't hate Osi and would be glad to have him for this next season in the role that has been slotted for him. That is a pass rush specialist who plays essentially only in passing situations. (Although I do admit that it moves JPP toleft DE which makes him much less effective).</P>


But I would also take a third for him, free up almost $5MM in cap space and work towards the future. Its six of one, half a dozen the other for me.</P>


But yes,...I don't like Osi. His act of being a perpetual malcontent has grown old with me.</P>


Your a hater then, making you logic biased, meaning your argument has no validity at all.

Why does someone have to be a hater or homer just because they express their opinion?
</P>


A question for the ages RF.</P>


Some people just can't handle the truth.</P>


http://1.bp.blogspot.com/-v1GT_zPs27Y/TrdQpkQI9FI/AAAAAAAAAUM/7OjR5yQ9PBQ/s1600/fewg.jpg</P>

GMENAGAIN
04-26-2012, 01:26 PM
By the way... A report just came out that Osi said he would play out his current deal as a prove it type situation if a team traded the Giants for him. Essentially, he wants out. Bad.

That makes no sense. If we're trading him he isn't playing out his contract. This year is his last.
</P>


He'd play out the last year of his deal with his new team . . . . not sure how that statement helps his trade value, since the other team would be trading for a one year player . . . . . but that's Osi . . . I don't think that he puts a lot of thought into his statements . . . . </P>

GMENAGAIN
04-26-2012, 01:29 PM
The thing that sticks in my craw about Osi is that he tried to force the Giants to extend him last year knowing that he had a knee injury . . .. it wasn't until the Giants forced his hand and he came into camp that he revealed that he had the injury and needed surgery.</P>


It certainly felt like he was trying to pull a fast one on the FO. I'm pretty sure that didn't sit to well with them either . . . . </P>

Redeyejedi
04-26-2012, 01:32 PM
Osi is worth a lot more than a third.* If we trade him we better get a 2nd and 4th, or something close to that.*

I don't know if the stats back me up, but I felt our D was underachieving until Osi stepped back on the field.* Once he was back, we got consistent pressure w/ our front four and our DB's started looking better because of it.*

Osi is still one of the leagues best, if not the best, pass rusher.* We better not give him up for the sake of giving him up.*
</p>


Our back up, part time DE is worth more than a third?</p>


If you say so.</p>


We get it U hate Osi.</p>


I certainly don't hate Osi and would be glad to have him for this next season in the role that has been slotted for him.* That is a pass rush specialist who plays essentially only in passing situations.* (Although I do admit that it moves JPP to*left DE which makes him much less effective).</p>


But I would also take a third for him, free up almost $5MM in cap space and work towards the future.* Its six of one, half a dozen the other for me.</p>


But yes,...I don't like Osi.* His act of being a perpetual malcontent has grown old with me.</p>Your a hater then, making you logic biased, meaning your argument has no validity at all.

Why does someone have to be a hater or homer just because they express their opinion?
He constantly dogs Osi every chance he gets. I dont think its logical at all to want to trade the best pass rusher on the team for a 3rd round pick .Maybe u do but I certainly dont.

Morehead State
04-26-2012, 01:38 PM
Osi is worth a lot more than a third. If we trade him we better get a 2nd and 4th, or something close to that.

I don't know if the stats back me up, but I felt our D was underachieving until Osi stepped back on the field. Once he was back, we got consistent pressure w/ our front four and our DB's started looking better because of it.

Osi is still one of the leagues best, if not the best, pass rusher. We better not give him up for the sake of giving him up.
</P>


Our back up, part time DE is worth more than a third?</P>


If you say so.</P>


We get it U hate Osi.</P>


I certainly don't hate Osi and would be glad to have him for this next season in the role that has been slotted for him. That is a pass rush specialist who plays essentially only in passing situations. (Although I do admit that it moves JPP toleft DE which makes him much less effective).</P>


But I would also take a third for him, free up almost $5MM in cap space and work towards the future. Its six of one, half a dozen the other for me.</P>


But yes,...I don't like Osi. His act of being a perpetual malcontent has grown old with me.</P>


Your a hater then, making you logic biased, meaning your argument has no validity at all.

Why does someone have to be a hater or homer just because they express their opinion?
He constantly dogs Osi every chance he gets. I dont think its logical at all to want to trade the best pass rusher on the team for a 3rd round pick .Maybe u do but I certainly dont.</P>


Don't be so sensitive. He's just one of those players that rub me the wrong way. He's just such a "me" guy. Really isn't anyone else on the team I feel that way about. </P>


I already said that I'd be OK if he played out his contract as long as he was willing to play hard. </P>


I understand its logical that it would be best for us if he was a Giant this season. But I think he's prepared to be a pain. He's done it before in smaller doses.</P>


And speaking strictly football, I don't like moving our best defensive player out of position when Osi takes the field. (Moving JPP to left DE). Takes away a bit of his impact.</P>


</P>