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View Full Version : Has our dominant pass rush influenced the draft?



Toadofsteel
04-27-2012, 03:48 AM
It seems that way... 10 defensive linemen taken in the first round (3 DT, 7 DE). Not to mention the Patriots trading up TWICE (something they almost never do even once) and selecting Chandler Jones and Dont'a Hightower.

It seems as though pass rushers are in high demand. Was it just trending towards this, or did our epic run have something to do with it?

Either way, after seeing Eli strut his adamantium skeleton in the NFCCG, i'm no longer afraid of any pass rush.

Spider-Man
04-27-2012, 04:35 AM
It seems that way... 10 defensive linemen taken in the first round (3 DT, 7 DE). Not to mention the Patriots trading up TWICE (something they almost never do even once) and selecting Chandler Jones and Dont'a Hightower.

It seems as though pass rushers are in high demand. Was it just trending towards this, or did our epic run have something to do with it?

Either way, after seeing Eli strut his adamantium skeleton in the NFCCG, i'm no longer afraid of any pass rush.

I don't think so, teams have always highly valued pass rushers.

New England needed to add playmakers to their defense and they did just that.

GMenNY21
04-27-2012, 04:40 AM
It seems that way... 10 defensive linemen taken in the first round (3 DT, 7 DE). Not to mention the Patriots trading up TWICE (something they almost never do even once) and selecting Chandler Jones and Dont'a Hightower.

It seems as though pass rushers are in high demand. Was it just trending towards this, or did our epic run have something to do with it?

Either way, after seeing Eli strut his adamantium skeleton in the NFCCG, i'm no longer afraid of any pass rush.

I don't think so, teams have always highly valued pass rushers.

New England needed to add playmakers to their defense and they did just that. their secondary is still very weak ... Chandler jones was nice & Hightower paired with mayo fairly menacing but that secondary is Swiss cheese.

ToneZak
04-27-2012, 08:27 AM
I thought the same thing. Its a copycat league. There's always been a premium on explosive pass rushers, but seems like teams are going to follow the giants blueprint towards success.

I laugh at myself now, because for years i would always yell, another DE????? Are we going to just start 11 DEs on D? So silly i was back then. I've learned not to question this organization.

NYG 5
04-27-2012, 09:51 AM
they should have began copying them 4 years ago. its the blueprint on how to beat the spread offense.

GGTM_1977
04-27-2012, 09:57 AM
LOL...I was thinking something along the same lines. I actually came up with 2 theories to this years draft. Either teams wanted to follow our "blue print" with pass rushers, OR the 31 other teams were/are so sick of seeing us being successful with our pass rush, that they basically said there is no way we are letting the NYG get any 1st round talent at DL!!!

titwio
04-27-2012, 10:00 AM
I think Jerry Reese in general has influenced the draft. BPA, pass rushers etc...I see teams following trend and looking more at depth than need...which I think is Reese's style.

nhpgiantsfan
04-27-2012, 10:03 AM
I think Jerry Reese in general has influenced the draft. BPA, pass rushers etc...I see teams following trend and looking more at depth than need...which I think is Reese's style.</P>


Jerry Reese??? Don't forget who taught JR everything he knows. Ernie Acorrsi coined the phrase "you can never have enough pass rushers"! This has been our way long before JR has been here. It's not a knock on Jerry, just a compliment to his mentor.</P>

B&RWarrior
04-27-2012, 10:07 AM
I dont think it has anything to do with us in particular. The NFL is becoming a pass first league. The last three SB champions NO, GB, andNYG have won with pass heavy offenses. The best way to negate the pass is with an effective pass rush. </P>


Every draft is deep at different positions. This draft has been noted for its depth at several positions including DE, but not as many superstar players as other drafts. I think next year the LBs are supposed to be deep. It changes from year to year.</P>

burier
04-27-2012, 10:07 AM
of course it has.

Copy cat league and teams are figuring out that you don't have to bow down to the Brady Breese or Rogers (Peyton?)...You just have to pressure them.

Seattle took a situational pass rusher in the first round? Mayock says the guy can't play on first down and at like 245lbs he'll never be an every down DE which in the past would have elimiated him from first round contentions,...maybe first two round contention.

The Giants have definately altered the trend.

Morehead State
04-27-2012, 10:09 AM
It seems that way... 10 defensive linemen taken in the first round (3 DT, 7 DE). Not to mention the Patriots trading up TWICE (something they almost never do even once) and selecting Chandler Jones and Dont'a Hightower. It seems as though pass rushers are in high demand. Was it just trending towards this, or did our epic run have something to do with it? Either way, after seeing Eli strut his adamantium skeleton in the NFCCG, i'm no longer afraid of any pass rush.</P>


The answer in my view is <U>yes</U>. But it really started with Ernie. It was Ernie who said "you can't have enough pass rushers".</P>


JR is continuing the philosophy of his mentor.</P>

titwio
04-27-2012, 10:10 AM
I think Jerry Reese in general has influenced the draft. BPA, pass rushers etc...I see teams following trend and looking more at depth than need...which I think is Reese's style.</P>


Jerry Reese???* Don't forget who taught JR everything he knows.* Ernie Acorrsi coined the phrase "you can never have enough pass rushers"!* This has been our way long before JR has been here.* It's not a knock on Jerry, just a compliment to his mentor.</P>

Of course but when Reese took over the Giants won two Superbowls...just saying what other teams tend to do in a copycat league. Reese sort of becomes the guy to watch...much like Belechick for a good portion of the 00's.

nhpgiantsfan
04-27-2012, 10:18 AM
I think Jerry Reese in general has influenced the draft. BPA, pass rushers etc...I see teams following trend and looking more at depth than need...which I think is Reese's style.</P>


Jerry Reese??? Don't forget who taught JR everything he knows. Ernie Acorrsi coined the phrase "you can never have enough pass rushers"! This has been our way long before JR has been here. It's not a knock on Jerry, just a compliment to his mentor.</P>


Of course but when Reese took over the Giants won two Superbowls...just saying what other teams tend to do in a copycat league. Reese sort of becomes the guy to watch...much like Belechick for a good portion of the 00's.</P>


You're giving Jerry all of the credit for the first SB???</P>

titwio
04-27-2012, 10:25 AM
I think Jerry Reese in general has influenced the draft. BPA, pass rushers etc...I see teams following trend and looking more at depth than need...which I think is Reese's style.</P>


Jerry Reese???* Don't forget who taught JR everything he knows.* Ernie Acorrsi coined the phrase "you can never have enough pass rushers"!* This has been our way long before JR has been here.* It's not a knock on Jerry, just a compliment to his mentor.</P>


Of course but when Reese took over the Giants won two Superbowls...just saying what other teams tend to do in a copycat league. Reese sort of becomes the guy to watch...much like Belechick for a good portion of the 00's.</P>


You're giving Jerry all of the credit for the first SB???</P>

No! I'm saying what OTHER teams tend to follow after teams win Superbowls. It's a copycat league. Reese had one of the best drafts the year they won the Superbowl in 07" and one of the best in 11" the year they won the Superbowl again.

I'm not discrediting Accorsi at all! Just the fact that Jerry Reese is the guy teams have become very aware of when they think about the draft and modeling their teams for the "the run" and the big game. Also doesn't hurt with all the praise Bill Poilian has been giving him as well.

Us Giants fans will credit Ernie, Jerry and others all we like because we're fans of the team. Other teams are more concerned in the here and now...IMO. Teams eyes right now are on Jerry Reese. That's all I'm saying.

B&RWarrior
04-27-2012, 10:29 AM
of course it has. Copy cat league and teams are figuring out that you don't have to bow down to the Brady Breese or Rogers (Peyton?)...You just have to pressure them. Seattle took a situational pass rusher in the first round? Mayock says the guy can't play on first down and at like 245lbs he'll never be an every down DE which in the past would have elimiated him from first round contentions,...maybe first two round contention. The Giants have definately altered the trend.</P>


At first Ithought Seattle was thinking of JPP with that pick, but they are clearly two very different players.There scouts had to know that he doesn't compare toany of the DEwe have.If you include the off field issues the guy has it was a very risky pick. I'd say it was just bad. </P>


We're not the first team with a dominant defensive line. In fact I can't remember a SB winning team that didn't have a good/decent pass rush. A good pass rush was not some secret sauce that the Giants new about before everybody else. </P>

B&RWarrior
04-27-2012, 10:34 AM
I think Jerry Reese in general has influenced the draft. BPA, pass rushers etc...I see teams following trend and looking more at depth than need...which I think is Reese's style.</P>


Jerry Reese??? Don't forget who taught JR everything he knows. Ernie Acorrsi coined the phrase "you can never have enough pass rushers"! This has been our way long before JR has been here. It's not a knock on Jerry, just a compliment to his mentor.</P>


Of course but when Reese took over the Giants won two Superbowls...just saying what other teams tend to do in a copycat league. Reese sort of becomes the guy to watch...much like Belechick for a good portion of the 00's.</P>


You're giving Jerry all of the credit for the first SB???</P>


No! I'm saying what OTHER teams tend to follow after teams win Superbowls. It's a copycat league. Reese had one of the best drafts the year they won the Superbowl in 07" and one of the best in 11" the year they won the Superbowl again. I'm not discrediting Accorsi at all! Just the fact that Jerry Reese is the guy teams have become very aware of when they think about the draft and modeling their teams for the "the run" and the big game. Also doesn't hurt with all the praise Bill Poilian has been giving him as well. Us Giants fans will credit Ernie, Jerry and others all we like because we're fans of the team. Other teams are more concerned in the here and now...IMO. Teams eyes right now are on Jerry Reese. That's all I'm saying.</P>


I'll give a lot of the credit to JR for the '07 SB, not all but a lot. Of the 8 players drafted in 2007 all 8 started games for the Giants that season. Bradshaw, SS, and Boss were the lynchpins of our offense that year and in the playoff run. All 8 players started at least one game. That is sick!</P>

burier
04-27-2012, 10:45 AM
of course it has. Copy cat league and teams are figuring out that you don't have to bow down to the Brady Breese or Rogers (Peyton?)...You just have to pressure them. Seattle took a situational pass rusher in the first round? Mayock says the guy can't play on first down and at like 245lbs he'll never be an every down DE which in the past would have elimiated him from first round contentions,...maybe first two round contention. The Giants have definately altered the trend.</P>


At first I*thought Seattle was thinking of JPP with that pick, but they are clearly two very different players.*There scouts had to know that he doesn't compare to*any of the DE*we have.*If you include the off field issues the guy has it was a very risky pick.** I'd say it was just bad.** </P>


We're not the first team with a dominant defensive line.* In fact I can't remember a SB winning team that didn't have a good/decent pass rush.* A good pass rush was not some secret sauce that the Giants new about before everybody else.* </P>

Not that we invented the pass rush but we definately revolutionized it by putting 4 Pro Bowl quality DEs on the line and saying look...We'll rush 4 and I double dog dare you to block it.

Other teams just don't have that type of personel or at least they haven't in the past. Now we're seeing the trend change were people aren't thinking about having 2 bookend DEs but seeing exactly how many pass rushers they can actually get on the field at once.

Morehead State
04-27-2012, 11:13 AM
I think Jerry Reese in general has influenced the draft. BPA, pass rushers etc...I see teams following trend and looking more at depth than need...which I think is Reese's style.</P>


Jerry Reese??? Don't forget who taught JR everything he knows. Ernie Acorrsi coined the phrase "you can never have enough pass rushers"! This has been our way long before JR has been here. It's not a knock on Jerry, just a compliment to his mentor.</P>


Of course but when Reese took over the Giants won two Superbowls...just saying what other teams tend to do in a copycat league. Reese sort of becomes the guy to watch...much like Belechick for a good portion of the 00's.</P>


You're giving Jerry all of the credit for the first SB???</P>


No! I'm saying what OTHER teams tend to follow after teams win Superbowls. It's a copycat league. Reese had one of the best drafts the year they won the Superbowl in 07" and one of the best in 11" the year they won the Superbowl again. I'm not discrediting Accorsi at all! Just the fact that Jerry Reese is the guy teams have become very aware of when they think about the draft and modeling their teams for the "the run" and the big game. Also doesn't hurt with all the praise Bill Poilian has been giving him as well. Us Giants fans will credit Ernie, Jerry and others all we like because we're fans of the team. Other teams are more concerned in the here and now...IMO. Teams eyes right now are on Jerry Reese. That's all I'm saying.</P>


I'll give a lot of the credit to JR for the '07 SB, not all but a lot. Of the 8 players drafted in 2007 all 8 started games for the Giants that season. Bradshaw, SS, and Boss were the lynchpins of our offense that year and in the playoff run. All 8 players started at least one game. That is sick!</P>


</P>


No they didn't. Adam Koets didn't play.</P>


And while the 07 draft had an impact on our team in 07, that was Ernie's team. The list is huge. Starting with Eli, Plaxico, Peirce, Tuck etc...</P>


Not that we are more removed from that draft, I would say it wasn't really a great draft at all. It was still pretty good, especially Smith and Bradshaw. But not great by any stretch.</P>

LT_was_good
04-27-2012, 11:23 AM
I think it's a combination of this team winning two SB's with a superior pass rush, with the fact that teams are simply passing a lot more.

nhpgiantsfan
04-27-2012, 11:24 AM
I think Jerry Reese in general has influenced the draft. BPA, pass rushers etc...I see teams following trend and looking more at depth than need...which I think is Reese's style.</P>


Jerry Reese??? Don't forget who taught JR everything he knows. Ernie Acorrsi coined the phrase "you can never have enough pass rushers"! This has been our way long before JR has been here. It's not a knock on Jerry, just a compliment to his mentor.</P>


Of course but when Reese took over the Giants won two Superbowls...just saying what other teams tend to do in a copycat league. Reese sort of becomes the guy to watch...much like Belechick for a good portion of the 00's.</P>


You're giving Jerry all of the credit for the first SB???</P>


No! I'm saying what OTHER teams tend to follow after teams win Superbowls. It's a copycat league. Reese had one of the best drafts the year they won the Superbowl in 07" and one of the best in 11" the year they won the Superbowl again. I'm not discrediting Accorsi at all! Just the fact that Jerry Reese is the guy teams have become very aware of when they think about the draft and modeling their teams for the "the run" and the big game. Also doesn't hurt with all the praise Bill Poilian has been giving him as well. Us Giants fans will credit Ernie, Jerry and others all we like because we're fans of the team. Other teams are more concerned in the here and now...IMO. Teams eyes right now are on Jerry Reese. That's all I'm saying.</P>


It's a little early to say he had a great draft in 2011.</P>


We can't judge Prince yet. We will find out soon.</P>


Ausin hasn't played football in three years.</P>


Jernigan will be thrown into the fire this year, but he is an unknown right now.</P>


Brewer hasn't played yet.</P>


Jones and Williams definately contributed last year but lets see if one can becomea real starting force.</P>


Sash shows potential, but who knows.</P>


Scott obviously has physical ability, but we havent seen enough.</P>


There is definate potential in his 2011 draft but it's too early to call it a "great" draft.</P>


Actually so far, the move that has paid off the most was the Hynoski signing.</P>

titwio
04-27-2012, 11:36 AM
It's a little early to say he had a great draft in 2011.</P>


We can't judge Prince yet.* We will find out soon.</P>


Ausin hasn't played football in three years.</P>


Jernigan will be thrown into the fire this year, but he is an unknown right now.</P>


Brewer hasn't played yet.</P>


Jones and Williams definately contributed last year but lets see if one can become*a real starting force.</P>


Sash shows potential, but who knows.</P>


Scott obviously has physical ability, but we havent seen enough.</P>


There is definate potential in his 2011 draft but it's too early to call it a "great" draft.</P>


Actually so far, the move that has paid off the most was the Hynoski signing.</P>

Just in terms of value and what his contemporaries were saying about the draft was me reiterating it was great...but yeah, your right...it is a little too early to say.

miked1958
04-27-2012, 11:41 AM
It seems that way... 10 defensive linemen taken in the first round (3 DT, 7 DE). Not to mention the Patriots trading up TWICE (something they almost never do even once) and selecting Chandler Jones and Dont'a Hightower.

It seems as though pass rushers are in high demand. Was it just trending towards this, or did our epic run have something to do with it?

Either way, after seeing Eli strut his adamantium skeleton in the NFCCG, i'm no longer afraid of any pass rush.In a word......


YES!!!

BluGiantPies
04-27-2012, 12:25 PM
of course it has. Copy cat league and teams are figuring out that you don't have to bow down to the Brady Breese or Rogers (Peyton?)...You just have to pressure them. Seattle took a situational pass rusher in the first round? Mayock says the guy can't play on first down and at like 245lbs he'll never be an every down DE which in the past would have elimiated him from first round contentions,...maybe first two round contention. The Giants have definately altered the trend.</P>


At first I*thought Seattle was thinking of JPP with that pick, but they are clearly two very different players.*There scouts had to know that he doesn't compare to*any of the DE*we have.*If you include the off field issues the guy has it was a very risky pick.** I'd say it was just bad.** </P>


We're not the first team with a dominant defensive line.* In fact I can't remember a SB winning team that didn't have a good/decent pass rush.* A good pass rush was not some secret sauce that the Giants new about before everybody else.* </P> compare Bruce Irvin athletically to Von miller and there virtually the same. Irvin wasn't used the right way at wvu he was playing at five tech or 3/4 defensive end most of this past year. If Seattle uses him like Denver used Von miller last year I think Bruce will do fine. I'm not sure he could ever be an every down lber tho BC he would have major issues with coverage having never had to do that as a mountaineer.

SweetZombieJesus
04-27-2012, 02:43 PM
It's a copycat league. Our formula will be hot this year.

Kruunch
04-27-2012, 02:46 PM
It seems that way... 10 defensive linemen taken in the first round (3 DT, 7 DE). Not to mention the Patriots trading up TWICE (something they almost never do even once) and selecting Chandler Jones and Dont'a Hightower.

It seems as though pass rushers are in high demand. Was it just trending towards this, or did our epic run have something to do with it?

Either way, after seeing Eli strut his adamantium skeleton in the NFCCG, i'm no longer afraid of any pass rush.

People tend to copy greatness. [b]

Kruunch
04-27-2012, 02:53 PM
I think Jerry Reese in general has influenced the draft. BPA, pass rushers etc...I see teams following trend and looking more at depth than need...which I think is Reese's style.</P>


Jerry Reese???* Don't forget who taught JR everything he knows.* Ernie Acorrsi coined the phrase "you can never have enough pass rushers"!* This has been our way long before JR has been here.* It's not a knock on Jerry, just a compliment to his mentor.</P>


Of course but when Reese took over the Giants won two Superbowls...just saying what other teams tend to do in a copycat league. Reese sort of becomes the guy to watch...much like Belechick for a good portion of the 00's.</P>


You're giving Jerry all of the credit for the first SB???</P>


No! I'm saying what OTHER teams tend to follow after teams win Superbowls. It's a copycat league. Reese had one of the best drafts the year they won the Superbowl in 07" and one of the best in 11" the year they won the Superbowl again. I'm not discrediting Accorsi at all! Just the fact that Jerry Reese is the guy teams have become very aware of when they think about the draft and modeling their teams for the "the run" and the big game. Also doesn't hurt with all the praise Bill Poilian has been giving him as well. Us Giants fans will credit Ernie, Jerry and others all we like because we're fans of the team. Other teams are more concerned in the here and now...IMO. Teams eyes right now are on Jerry Reese. That's all I'm saying.</P>


I'll give a lot of the credit to JR for the '07 SB, not all but a lot.* Of the 8 players drafted in 2007 all 8 started games for the Giants that season.* Bradshaw, SS, and Boss were the lynchpins of our offense that year and in the playoff run.* All 8 players started at least one game.* That is sick!*</P>


</P>


No they didn't.* Adam Koets didn't play.</P>


And while the 07 draft had an impact on our team in 07, that was Ernie's team.* The list is huge.* Starting with Eli, Plaxico, Peirce, Tuck etc...</P>


Not that we are more removed from that draft, I would say it wasn't really a great draft at all.* It was still pretty good, especially Smith and Bradshaw.* But not great by any stretch.</P>

Going to disagree with you there .... it's rare that an ENTIRE draft class makes an impact on the team (the majority of which in the year they were drafted no less).

You could say that the draft isn't standing the test of time for the Giants specifically which would be true, but it was an amazing draft for the first contract of those players by and large.

B&RWarrior
04-27-2012, 03:09 PM
No they didn't. Adam Koets didn't play.</P>


And while the 07 draft had an impact on our team in 07, that was Ernie's team. The list is huge. Starting with Eli, Plaxico, Peirce, Tuck etc...</P>


Not that we are more removed from that draft, I would say it wasn't really a great draft at all. It was still pretty good, especially Smith and Bradshaw. But not great by any stretch.</P>


</P>


Accorsi's draft in 2005- Tuck, C-Web, aand BJis better in terms of impact players, espcailly when you consider we didn'thave a first rounder. If you count Eli as a draft pick 2004 is better with Eli, Snee, and Wilson. </P>


At worst it's the 3rd best draft in Giants history. Just speaking for what it meant for that 2007 team it meant a whole lot.</P>


Alford: would be starting now if he didn't blow out his knee.</P>


Ross: was a starter on both SB winnning teams- regardless of what you think of him.</P>


SS: Star, no explanation needed</P>


Boss: starter Old reliable soft made Eli look good on numerous occasions</P>


Bradshaw:Starter no explanation needed</P>


Coates is still on the team and made signifigant contribution last year. Zack Deossie is a special teams standout and long snapper still on the team. Micheal Johnson was a starter his rookie year and did well until we upgraded to Rolle.</P>


Factoring out injury this is the best draft I've seen for any team in terms of getting something out of every pick. Give JR his props! He owned that draft!</P>


5 fulltime starters from their rookie year on making them immediate impact players. Give JR his props. </P>


</P>


</P>