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View Full Version : Amani Toomer... 100% Accurate.



Shockeyitus
05-04-2012, 10:26 AM
http://profootballtalk.nbcsports.com/2012/05/03/amani-toomer-kurt-warner-is-trying-to-trash-the-game-of-football/

Kurt Warner... go away.

Easy-Duz-It
05-04-2012, 10:53 AM
i wish he threw in a jab about how warner is bitter about eli as well...but i love hearing amani say this.

kurt warner has been beyond obnoxious ever since he retired.

B&RWarrior
05-04-2012, 11:25 AM
IDK on one hand I agree with Toomer. On the other hand IF Seau's death was related to CTE then you begin to ask yourself serious questions. I believe Seau's kids would trade any amount of money and luxury in the world right now to have their father back.

yoeddy
05-04-2012, 11:39 AM
I don't have a problem with what Warner said...yes, he has benefitted from football, but perhaps if he knew the risks beforehand, he might have made different choices.

Rudyy
05-04-2012, 11:57 AM
I didn't see a problem with what Kurt Warner said. It IS a violent sport, and you can get seriously hurt. He's not demeaning the game itself, but it is a huge risk. He's played before, he would know. Amani should know too.

burier
05-04-2012, 11:59 AM
Holy ****.

Seau commited suicide...What the hell does that have to do with football beyond perhaps some men struggling to cope without the game?

Do we have any basis to support that concussions lead to suicide???

What if the guy was suffering from major depressive disorder? We have far FAR more evidence to support that diagnosis leading to suicide than head trama which is beside the point as we have no data to quantify Seau's supposed head trauma in the first place.

Warner talking about being scared for his kids to play football is just Lime Light whoring at its finest.

What the hell is Warner (or Toomer for that matter) doing talking about anything that isn't X and O related?

Who cares who Warner thinks is going into the HOF or what he does with his own kids. The season hasn't started yet so...WHO TURNED THIS MAN'S MICROPHONE ON???

And all this stuff about concussions is the most gross example of wag the dog ever exhibited.

Goodell is responding to a lawsuit backlog when in actuality that major majority of the complaintants are just players who played in an era where football wasn't as lucrative and financially rewarding and these suits are a way of getting their peice of the multi-billion dollar pie. Goodell should just settle the suits and leave our god damn game alone.

Goodell is playing us fans an himself by responding to these suits by fouling up the essence of the game.

JDE123
05-04-2012, 12:15 PM
Holy ****.

Seau commited suicide...What the hell does that have to do with football beyond perhaps some men struggling to cope without the game?

Do we have any basis to support that concussions lead to suicide???

What if the guy was suffering from major depressive disorder? We have far FAR more evidence to support that diagnosis leading to suicide than head trama which is beside the point as we have no data quantify Seau's supposed head trauma in the first place.

Warner talking about being scared for his kids to play football is just Lime Light whoring at its finest.

What the hell is Warner (or Toomer for that matter) doing talking about anything that isn't X and O related?

Who cares who Warner thinks is going into the HOF or what he does with his own kids. The season hasn't started yet so...WHO TURNED THIS MAN'S MICROPHONE ON???

And all this stuff about concussions is the most gross example of wag the dog ever exhibited.

Goodell is responding to a lawsuit backlog when in actuality that major majority of the complaintants are just players who played in an era where football wasn't as lucrative and financially rewarding and these suits are a way of getting their peice of the multi-billion dollar pie. Goodell should just settle the suits and leave our god damn game alone.

Goodell is playing us fans an himself by responding to these suits by fouling up the essence of the game.
Seriously? If you've watched ESPN at all over the past 48 hours you've heard the statistic that the suicide rate among former NFL players is 6 times the national average. Is your hypothesis that the game just happens to attract depressives?

What bothers me about Toomer's comment is that he's not questioning the validity of Warner's stance, he's basically saying "it doesn't matter if what you're saying is true, keep your mouth shut and protect the game." It's hard for me to respect that sort of ignorance.

bELIeve_in_Giants
05-04-2012, 12:34 PM
Got to side with Kurt on this one. He didn't say no one should play the game. He said he's nervous about it for his own kids. He's a dad first. He's had a history of concussions himself. Absoultely nothing wrong with what he said.

burier
05-04-2012, 12:42 PM
Holy ****.

Seau commited suicide...What the hell does that have to do with football beyond perhaps some men struggling to cope without the game?

Do we have any basis to support that concussions lead to suicide???

What if the guy was suffering from major depressive disorder? We have far FAR more evidence to support that diagnosis leading to suicide than head trama which is beside the point as we have no data quantify Seau's supposed head trauma in the first place.

Warner talking about being scared for his kids to play football is just Lime Light whoring at its finest.

What the hell is Warner (or Toomer for that matter) doing talking about anything that isn't X and O related?

Who cares who Warner thinks is going into the HOF or what he does with his own kids. The season hasn't started yet so...WHO TURNED THIS MAN'S MICROPHONE ON???

And all this stuff about concussions is the most gross example of wag the dog ever exhibited.

Goodell is responding to a lawsuit backlog when in actuality that major majority of the complaintants are just players who played in an era where football wasn't as lucrative and financially rewarding and these suits are a way of getting their peice of the multi-billion dollar pie. Goodell should just settle the suits and leave our god damn game alone.

Goodell is playing us fans an himself by responding to these suits by fouling up the essence of the game.
Seriously? If you've watched ESPN at all over the past 48 hours you've heard the statistic that the suicide rate among former NFL players is 6 times the national average. Is your hypothesis that the game just happens to attract depressives?

What bothers me about Toomer's comment is that he's not questioning the validity of Warner's stance, he's basically saying "it doesn't matter if what you're saying is true, keep your mouth shut and protect the game." It's hard for me to respect that sort of ignorance.

No but why is the presumption the head trauma is the link?

I think being praised on a daily basis and having fans cheer your name on daily basis and then suddenly hearing nothing might be a good recipe for depression.

If you look at the Suicide rates for any star/public figures in general you'll see they blow alway the national avarage.

Some people can't cope with the limelight...some people can't cope without the limelight once they've tasted it...some people deal just fine...doesn't mean football should be changed to a non-contact sport.

GOBIGBLUE52
05-04-2012, 12:52 PM
Got to side with Kurt on this one. He didn't say no one should play the game. He said he's nervous about it for his own kids. He's a dad first. He's had a history of concussions himself. Absoultely nothing wrong with what he said.

I came into this topic to say EXACTLY this. There is nothing, absolutely nothing wrong with what Kurt Warner said. All he said is that he'd worry for his kids if they wanted to play football. There is more to life.

yoeddy
05-04-2012, 12:52 PM
Holy ****.

Seau commited suicide...What the hell does that have to do with football beyond perhaps some men struggling to cope without the game?

Do we have any basis to support that concussions lead to suicide???

What if the guy was suffering from major depressive disorder? We have far FAR more evidence to support that diagnosis leading to suicide than head trama which is beside the point as we have no data quantify Seau's supposed head trauma in the first place.

Warner talking about being scared for his kids to play football is just Lime Light whoring at its finest.

What the hell is Warner (or Toomer for that matter) doing talking about anything that isn't X and O related?

Who cares who Warner thinks is going into the HOF or what he does with his own kids. The season hasn't started yet so...WHO TURNED THIS MAN'S MICROPHONE ON???

And all this stuff about concussions is the most gross example of wag the dog ever exhibited.

Goodell is responding to a lawsuit backlog when in actuality that major majority of the complaintants are just players who played in an era where football wasn't as lucrative and financially rewarding and these suits are a way of getting their peice of the multi-billion dollar pie. Goodell should just settle the suits and leave our god damn game alone.

Goodell is playing us fans an himself by responding to these suits by fouling up the essence of the game.
Seriously? If you've watched ESPN at all over the past 48 hours you've heard the statistic that the suicide rate among former NFL players is 6 times the national average. Is your hypothesis that the game just happens to attract depressives?

What bothers me about Toomer's comment is that he's not questioning the validity of Warner's stance, he's basically saying "it doesn't matter if what you're saying is true, keep your mouth shut and protect the game." It's hard for me to respect that sort of ignorance.

No but why is the presumption the head trauma is the link?

I think being praised on a daily basis and having fans cheer your name on daily basis and then suddenly hearing nothing might be a good recipe for depression.

If you look at the Suicide rates for any star/public figures in general you'll see they blow alway the national avarage.

Some people can't cope with the limelight...some people can't cope without the limelight once they've tasted it...some people deal just fine...doesn't mean football should be changed to a non-contact sport.

I think Dave Duerson's suicide (along with his suicide note citing his desire that his brain be studied for CTE) is what's driving the head trauma link. Seau shot himself in the chest, same as Duerson, which would indicate that he didn't want to put a bullet in his brain...so that it could be studied...

fletch842
05-04-2012, 12:58 PM
As much as I don't like ot say it, I'm totally with Warner on this topic. Football is an inherently dangerous, violent game. most kids who play it long term will end up with some sort of serious injury, and for him as both a parent and paid analyst, it behooves him to speak truthfully. That's what NFL Network pays him for.

G-Man67
05-04-2012, 01:00 PM
I think Dave Duerson's suicide (along with his suicide note citing his desire that his brain be studied for CTE) is what's driving the head trauma link. Seau shot himself in the chest, same as Duerson, which would indicate that he didn't want to put a bullet in his brain...so that it could be studied...</P>


hmmm, that is interesting</P>


very sad stuff</P>

GameTime
05-04-2012, 01:06 PM
http://profootballtalk.nbcsports.com/2012/05/03/amani-toomer-kurt-warner-is-trying-to-trash-the-game-of-football/
</P>


Warner makes a benign comment in reference to his kids not getting injured playing a sport and Toomer jumps all over him??. IMO....Toomer is the one who should STFU. I love Toomer but he way over reacted.</P>


</P>


</P>

yoeddy
05-04-2012, 01:07 PM
Does Toomer have kids?

burier
05-04-2012, 01:33 PM
Holy ****.

Seau commited suicide...What the hell does that have to do with football beyond perhaps some men struggling to cope without the game?

Do we have any basis to support that concussions lead to suicide???

What if the guy was suffering from major depressive disorder? We have far FAR more evidence to support that diagnosis leading to suicide than head trama which is beside the point as we have no data quantify Seau's supposed head trauma in the first place.

Warner talking about being scared for his kids to play football is just Lime Light whoring at its finest.

What the hell is Warner (or Toomer for that matter) doing talking about anything that isn't X and O related?

Who cares who Warner thinks is going into the HOF or what he does with his own kids. The season hasn't started yet so...WHO TURNED THIS MAN'S MICROPHONE ON???

And all this stuff about concussions is the most gross example of wag the dog ever exhibited.

Goodell is responding to a lawsuit backlog when in actuality that major majority of the complaintants are just players who played in an era where football wasn't as lucrative and financially rewarding and these suits are a way of getting their peice of the multi-billion dollar pie. Goodell should just settle the suits and leave our god damn game alone.

Goodell is playing us fans an himself by responding to these suits by fouling up the essence of the game.
Seriously? If you've watched ESPN at all over the past 48 hours you've heard the statistic that the suicide rate among former NFL players is 6 times the national average. Is your hypothesis that the game just happens to attract depressives?

What bothers me about Toomer's comment is that he's not questioning the validity of Warner's stance, he's basically saying "it doesn't matter if what you're saying is true, keep your mouth shut and protect the game." It's hard for me to respect that sort of ignorance.

No but why is the presumption the head trauma is the link?

I think being praised on a daily basis and having fans cheer your name on daily basis and then suddenly hearing nothing might be a good recipe for depression.

If you look at the Suicide rates for any star/public figures in general you'll see they blow alway the national avarage.

Some people can't cope with the limelight...some people can't cope without the limelight once they've tasted it...some people deal just fine...doesn't mean football should be changed to a non-contact sport.

I think Dave Duerson's suicide (along with his suicide note citing his desire that his brain be studied for CTE) is what's driving the head trauma link. Seau shot himself in the chest, same as Duerson, which would indicate that he didn't want to put a bullet in his brain...so that it could be studied...

interesting point.

What I find confusing about Dave Duerson is if he was so sure he had an issue with his brain why didn't he go get it looked at? Same goes for Seau if we're going to link the two.

And when did Duerson retire? 93 was it? He killed himself in 2011. Duerson was a productive citizen for another decade and a half after he retired. He had enough of his faculties to conduct himself has a successful businessman but not enough sense to go get looked at if he felt something was wrong.

In my opinion Seau's first attemp was a couple years ago when he drove his truck off a cliff...he had just retired at that point.

either way there a saying that goes..."once is happenstance, twice a coincidence, three times a trend"

If someone else does the same thing we can talk.

Also both of these guys played defense. What are we going to do to protect players on D?

Call be barbaric but the day you stop a ballcarrier by way of two-hand touch is the day I stop watching.

Kruunch
05-04-2012, 01:40 PM
http://profootballtalk.nbcsports.com/2012/05/03/amani-toomer-kurt-warner-is-trying-to-trash-the-game-of-football/
</P>


Warner makes a benign comment in reference to his kids not getting injured playing a sport and Toomer jumps all over him??. IMO....Toomer is the one who should STFU. I love Toomer but he way over reacted.</P>


*</P>


*</P>

I think both of them over estimate the worth of their opinions.

Yes, Kurt Warner does have a point. Yes, he does sound like a total schmuck since he's made his living and CURRENTLY makes his living off of the game of football.

Amani Toomer seems to have a lot to say about what everyone else says. He really should just keep his opinion self focused. But he's always been mouthy that way.

DVision
05-04-2012, 01:43 PM
I don't have a problem with what Warner said...yes, he has benefitted from football, but perhaps if he knew the risks beforehand, he might have made different choices.

You think he would have turned down the NFL to continue stocking shelves in the supermarket? I doubt it!

GameTime
05-04-2012, 01:53 PM
http://profootballtalk.nbcsports.com/2012/05/03/amani-toomer-kurt-warner-is-trying-to-trash-the-game-of-football/
</P>


Warner makes a benign comment in reference to his kids not getting injured playing a sport and Toomer jumps all over him??. IMO....Toomer is the one who should STFU. I love Toomer but he way over reacted.</P>


</P>


</P>


I think both of them over estimate the worth of their opinions. Yes, Kurt Warner does have a point. Yes, he does sound like a total schmuck since he's made his living and CURRENTLY makes his living off of the game of football. Amani Toomer seems to have a lot to say about what everyone else says. He really should just keep his opinion self focused. But he's always been mouthy that way.</P>


so Warner played football and now make money as a football talking head. Why should that have anything to do with not wanting his kids to poay football?? He isnt saying for the game of football to be stopped he is just saying I would rather my kids not play football. Also with all this new info coming out about head trauma players Warne'rs age and older really didnt know how bad all this head bashing wold be later in life. Or maybe Warner was willing to take the risk of serious permenant injury but would prefer his childer not to.</P>

GameTime
05-04-2012, 01:54 PM
I don't have a problem with what Warner said...yes, he has benefitted from football, but perhaps if he knew the risks beforehand, he might have made different choices. You think he would have turned down the NFL to continue stocking shelves in the supermarket? I doubt it!</P>


what does that have to do with not wanting his kids to risk serious permenant injury playing football???</P>

B&RWarrior
05-04-2012, 02:03 PM
We're all just making assumptions. We'll have more answers once the autopsy report is released.

Most people saw the Duerson special on CTE and given the fact of how long Seau played the game and the way he played the game it's logical to wonder if CTE came into play in his problems with depression.

Toomer has a great point.

Still, football is known as a dangerous sport, but in regards to CTE nobody goes into football thinking it can be fatally dangerous. As fans we say don't change the game but for the families of the victims of CTE the game won't ever be the same.

chasjay
05-04-2012, 03:48 PM
For various reasons, including his own hard work, Kurt got the opportunity to display his football talents and to amass enough money to ensure the long-term financial comfort of his family. If the breaks hadn't gone his way and he was still slogging out a living for his family, busting his a** at a dead-end job, I'd bet that he would be less sure that he wouldn't want his sons playing football. That's not a criticism - just an observation.

Although I don't see that it was Amani's place to chime in with his opinion, I do think I understand the point he was trying to get across. That point being, in a nutshell, that once you get rich playing football, it is much easier to say that you don't want your kids taking that risk. I'm sure there are some inner-city streets where the odds of getting your brains blown out are far higher than the odds of having your brain scrambled on a crossing route by a free safety.

We have to remember that both of these guys are now getting paid to voice opinions. Neither of them would keep their jobs very long if they just shrugged their shoulders at each topic presented to them and said that it wasn't their place to comment.

GMENAGAIN
05-04-2012, 04:11 PM
Do any of you know what Warner actually said, because it seems like you are just making assumptions about what he said based off of Toomer's response.</P>


Warner's kids actually play football and they have dreams to play in the NFL. He said that the thought of them playing football is "scary" to him as a parent and when asked point blank if he’d prefer they not play the sport, Warner said “Yes, I would.” He never "trashed" the sport or said that he would forbid his children from playing football. He just answered questions honestly as a parent.</P>


If you've ever had a child play football, the word "scary" is the perfect word to describe your son getting hit hard on the field.</P>


I love Toomer, but his comments here are just idiotic. </P>




</P>

Kruunch
05-04-2012, 04:17 PM
http://profootballtalk.nbcsports.com/2012/05/03/amani-toomer-kurt-warner-is-trying-to-trash-the-game-of-football/
</P>


Warner makes a benign comment in reference to his kids not getting injured playing a sport and Toomer jumps all over him??. IMO....Toomer is the one who should STFU. I love Toomer but he way over reacted.</P>


*</P>


*</P>


I think both of them over estimate the worth of their opinions. Yes, Kurt Warner does have a point. Yes, he does sound like a total schmuck since he's made his living and CURRENTLY makes his living off of the game of football. Amani Toomer seems to have a lot to say about what everyone else says. He really should just keep his opinion self focused. But he's always been mouthy that way.</P>


so Warner played football and now make money as a football talking head. Why should that have anything to do with not wanting his kids to poay football?? He isnt saying for the game of football to be stopped he is just saying I would rather my kids not play football. Also with all this new info coming out about head trauma players Warne'rs age and older really didnt know how bad all this head bashing wold be later in life. Or maybe Warner was willing to take the risk of serious permenant injury but would prefer his childer not to.</P>

I don't begrudge Warner the desire to keep his kids away from football (even though they currently play it lol). Just for announcing it so publically. As Toomer suggested, it comes across as diengenuous as the whole portion of that was tied to the topic of "is football dangerous".

You'd have to be an absolute donut not to realize football is dangerous. There have been plenty of high profile players with debilitating football related injuries/conditions, from John Mackey to Earl Cambell.

Finally, the whole topic is stupid and self serving. Warner is involved to get face time in the media and if there is any question of whether a sport where 200+ pound professional athletes (some of whom comprise the strongest and fastest men in the world) throw themselves at each other while going full speed is dangerous: the answer is yes.

I would have thought that was self evident (as is the reason for its popularity and the popularity of sports like it).

Conversely, Toomer seems to want to play the role of media police to the point of stupidity.

The president of the United States may think white people suck; and he'd be right in many cases. It still behooves him not to say it.

Both of them should stfu.

JMFP2
05-04-2012, 04:40 PM
Holy ****.

Seau commited suicide...What the hell does that have to do with football beyond perhaps some men struggling to cope without the game?

Do we have any basis to support that concussions lead to suicide???

What if the guy was suffering from major depressive disorder? We have far FAR more evidence to support that diagnosis leading to suicide than head trama which is beside the point as we have no data quantify Seau's supposed head trauma in the first place.

Warner talking about being scared for his kids to play football is just Lime Light whoring at its finest.

What the hell is Warner (or Toomer for that matter) doing talking about anything that isn't X and O related?

Who cares who Warner thinks is going into the HOF or what he does with his own kids. The season hasn't started yet so...WHO TURNED THIS MAN'S MICROPHONE ON???

And all this stuff about concussions is the most gross example of wag the dog ever exhibited.

Goodell is responding to a lawsuit backlog when in actuality that major majority of the complaintants are just players who played in an era where football wasn't as lucrative and financially rewarding and these suits are a way of getting their peice of the multi-billion dollar pie. Goodell should just settle the suits and leave our god damn game alone.

Goodell is playing us fans an himself by responding to these suits by fouling up the essence of the game.
Seriously? If you've watched ESPN at all over the past 48 hours you've heard the statistic that the suicide rate among former NFL players is 6 times the national average. Is your hypothesis that the game just happens to attract depressives?

What bothers me about Toomer's comment is that he's not questioning the validity of Warner's stance, he's basically saying "it doesn't matter if what you're saying is true, keep your mouth shut and protect the game." It's hard for me to respect that sort of ignorance.

No but why is the presumption the head trauma is the link?

I think being praised on a daily basis and having fans cheer your name on daily basis and then suddenly hearing nothing might be a good recipe for depression.

If you look at the Suicide rates for any star/public figures in general you'll see they blow alway the national avarage.

Some people can't cope with the limelight...some people can't cope without the limelight once they've tasted it...some people deal just fine...doesn't mean football should be changed to a non-contact sport.

I'm not sure if you saw Harry Carson's latest comments on this, but if not, check it out.

This has nothing to do with "coping".....this has to due with a guys brain taking such a ****ing pounding that it leads to permanent damage.

Bottom line: the NFL needs to take a HUGE LEAP in terms of player safety.

And for what it's worth, nobody took more of a pounding than Kurt Warner.....I don't agree with eveything he says, but he's earned the right to talk about player safety.

chasjay
05-04-2012, 04:40 PM
Both of them should stfu.

I can buy into that.

GameTime
05-04-2012, 04:41 PM
http://profootballtalk.nbcsports.com/2012/05/03/amani-toomer-kurt-warner-is-trying-to-trash-the-game-of-football/
</P>


Warner makes a benign comment in reference to his kids not getting injured playing a sport and Toomer jumps all over him??. IMO....Toomer is the one who should STFU. I love Toomer but he way over reacted.</P>


</P>


</P>


I think both of them over estimate the worth of their opinions. Yes, Kurt Warner does have a point. Yes, he does sound like a total schmuck since he's made his living and CURRENTLY makes his living off of the game of football. Amani Toomer seems to have a lot to say about what everyone else says. He really should just keep his opinion self focused. But he's always been mouthy that way.</P>


so Warner played football and now make money as a football talking head. Why should that have anything to do with not wanting his kids to poay football?? He isnt saying for the game of football to be stopped he is just saying I would rather my kids not play football. Also with all this new info coming out about head trauma players Warne'rs age and older really didnt know how bad all this head bashing wold be later in life. Or maybe Warner was willing to take the risk of serious permenant injury but would prefer his childer not to.</P>


I don't begrudge Warner the desire to keep his kids away from football (even though they currently play it lol). Just for announcing it so publically. As Toomer suggested, it comes across as diengenuous as the whole portion of that was tied to the topic of "is football dangerous". You'd have to be an absolute donut not to realize football is dangerous. There have been plenty of high profile players with debilitating football related injuries/conditions, from John Mackey to Earl Cambell. Finally, the whole topic is stupid and self serving. Warner is involved to get face time in the media and if there is any question of whether a sport where 200+ pound professional athletes (some of whom comprise the strongest and fastest men in the world) throw themselves at each other while going full speed is dangerous: the answer is yes. I would have thought that was self evident (as is the reason for its popularity and the popularity of sports like it). Conversely, Toomer seems to want to play the role of media police to the point of stupidity. The president of the United States may think white people suck; and he'd be right in many cases. It still behooves him not to say it. Both of them should stfu.</P>


I hear ya.....</P>

JMFP2
05-04-2012, 04:41 PM
Maybe the fans should shut the **** up about player safety.

http://www.newjerseynewsroom.com/professional/nfl-hall-of-famer-harry-carson-mentor-to-junior-seau-makes-head-trauma-a-priority


Harry Carson:

“When I was playing football, I played with concussions. Back then, we called it getting your bell rung or getting dinged. It was typical of that time. We all played with head injuries and we all just dealt with it. But now we are seeing the by-product of brain injuries,” Carson told me in an exclusive one-on-one interview inside Jersey Shore University Medical Center.....


"You have these deep bouts of depression, and people think you're depressed because you're not playing anymore. You're depressed because you're having neurological issues that are very difficult to describe. “There’s no way to make the game any safer,” says Carson. “Parents should be aware of what their kids are getting into. It’s vicious and we cannot change the game. People want the hits. It’s still the same game, but players today are bigger and stronger and there is more emphasis on head injuries than when I was playing the game.”

GameTime
05-04-2012, 04:43 PM
Holy ****. Seau commited suicide...What the hell does that have to do with football beyond perhaps some men struggling to cope without the game? Do we have any basis to support that concussions lead to suicide??? What if the guy was suffering from major depressive disorder? We have far FAR more evidence to support that diagnosis leading to suicide than head trama which is beside the point as we have no data quantify Seau's supposed head trauma in the first place. Warner talking about being scared for his kids to play football is just Lime Light whoring at its finest. What the hell is Warner (or Toomer for that matter) doing talking about anything that isn't X and O related? Who cares who Warner thinks is going into the HOF or what he does with his own kids. The season hasn't started yet so...WHO TURNED THIS MAN'S MICROPHONE ON??? And all this stuff about concussions is the most gross example of wag the dog ever exhibited. Goodell is responding to a lawsuit backlog when in actuality that major majority of the complaintants are just players who played in an era where football wasn't as lucrative and financially rewarding and these suits are a way of getting their peice of the multi-billion dollar pie. Goodell should just settle the suits and leave our god damn game alone. Goodell is playing us fans an himself by responding to these suits by fouling up the essence of the game. Seriously? If you've watched ESPN at all over the past 48 hours you've heard the statistic that the suicide rate among former NFL players is 6 times the national average. Is your hypothesis that the game just happens to attract depressives? What bothers me about Toomer's comment is that he's not questioning the validity of Warner's stance, he's basically saying "it doesn't matter if what you're saying is true, keep your mouth shut and protect the game." It's hard for me to respect that sort of ignorance. No but why is the presumption the head trauma is the link? I think being praised on a daily basis and having fans cheer your name on daily basis and then suddenly hearing nothing might be a good recipe for depression. If you look at the Suicide rates for any star/public figures in general you'll see they blow alway the national avarage. Some people can't cope with the limelight...some people can't cope without the limelight once they've tasted it...some people deal just fine...doesn't mean football should be changed to a non-contact sport. I'm not sure if you saw Harry Carson's latest comments on this, but if not, check it out. This has nothing to do with "coping".....this has to due with a guys brain taking such a ****ing pounding that it leads to permanent damage. Bottom line: the NFL needs to take a HUGE LEAP in terms of player safety. And for what it's worth, <FONT color=#000080 size=4>nobody took more of a pounding than Kurt Warner</FONT>.....I don't agree with eveything he says, but he's earned the right to talk about player safety.</P>


There are many players who would argue that point.....</P>


he was hit but come on...."nobody"??????</P>

JMFP2
05-04-2012, 04:45 PM
Holy ****. Seau commited suicide...What the hell does that have to do with football beyond perhaps some men struggling to cope without the game? Do we have any basis to support that concussions lead to suicide??? What if the guy was suffering from major depressive disorder? We have far FAR more evidence to support that diagnosis leading to suicide than head trama which is beside the point as we have no data quantify Seau's supposed head trauma in the first place. Warner talking about being scared for his kids to play football is just Lime Light whoring at its finest. What the hell is Warner (or Toomer for that matter) doing talking about anything that isn't X and O related? Who cares who Warner thinks is going into the HOF or what he does with his own kids. The season hasn't started yet so...WHO TURNED THIS MAN'S MICROPHONE ON??? And all this stuff about concussions is the most gross example of wag the dog ever exhibited. Goodell is responding to a lawsuit backlog when in actuality that major majority of the complaintants are just players who played in an era where football wasn't as lucrative and financially rewarding and these suits are a way of getting their peice of the multi-billion dollar pie. Goodell should just settle the suits and leave our god damn game alone. Goodell is playing us fans an himself by responding to these suits by fouling up the essence of the game. Seriously? If you've watched ESPN at all over the past 48 hours you've heard the statistic that the suicide rate among former NFL players is 6 times the national average. Is your hypothesis that the game just happens to attract depressives? What bothers me about Toomer's comment is that he's not questioning the validity of Warner's stance, he's basically saying "it doesn't matter if what you're saying is true, keep your mouth shut and protect the game." It's hard for me to respect that sort of ignorance. No but why is the presumption the head trauma is the link? I think being praised on a daily basis and having fans cheer your name on daily basis and then suddenly hearing nothing might be a good recipe for depression. If you look at the Suicide rates for any star/public figures in general you'll see they blow alway the national avarage. Some people can't cope with the limelight...some people can't cope without the limelight once they've tasted it...some people deal just fine...doesn't mean football should be changed to a non-contact sport. I'm not sure if you saw Harry Carson's latest comments on this, but if not, check it out. This has nothing to do with "coping".....this has to due with a guys brain taking such a ****ing pounding that it leads to permanent damage. Bottom line: the NFL needs to take a HUGE LEAP in terms of player safety. And for what it's worth, <FONT color=#000080 size=4>nobody took more of a pounding than Kurt Warner</FONT>.....I don't agree with eveything he says, but he's earned the right to talk about player safety.</P>


There are many players who would argue that point.....</P>


he was hit but come on...."nobody"??????</P>

My point is that Kurt Warner has earned the right to speak his mind about player safety.

gumby742
05-04-2012, 05:53 PM
I don't see what's so wrong about what Warner said. I don't think I'll let my kids play football either. Or, at least I'll worry about it.

Rat_bastich
05-04-2012, 05:58 PM
Holy ****.

Seau commited suicide...What the hell does that have to do with football beyond perhaps some men struggling to cope without the game?

Do we have any basis to support that concussions lead to suicide???

What if the guy was suffering from major depressive disorder? We have far FAR more evidence to support that diagnosis leading to suicide than head trama which is beside the point as we have no data quantify Seau's supposed head trauma in the first place.

Warner talking about being scared for his kids to play football is just Lime Light whoring at its finest.

What the hell is Warner (or Toomer for that matter) doing talking about anything that isn't X and O related?

Who cares who Warner thinks is going into the HOF or what he does with his own kids. The season hasn't started yet so...WHO TURNED THIS MAN'S MICROPHONE ON???

And all this stuff about concussions is the most gross example of wag the dog ever exhibited.

Goodell is responding to a lawsuit backlog when in actuality that major majority of the complaintants are just players who played in an era where football wasn't as lucrative and financially rewarding and these suits are a way of getting their peice of the multi-billion dollar pie. Goodell should just settle the suits and leave our god damn game alone.

Goodell is playing us fans an himself by responding to these suits by fouling up the essence of the game.
Seriously? If you've watched ESPN at all over the past 48 hours you've heard the statistic that the suicide rate among former NFL players is 6 times the national average. Is your hypothesis that the game just happens to attract depressives?

What bothers me about Toomer's comment is that he's not questioning the validity of Warner's stance, he's basically saying "it doesn't matter if what you're saying is true, keep your mouth shut and protect the game." It's hard for me to respect that sort of ignorance.

No but why is the presumption the head trauma is the link?

I think being praised on a daily basis and having fans cheer your name on daily basis and then suddenly hearing nothing might be a good recipe for depression.

If you look at the Suicide rates for any star/public figures in general you'll see they blow alway the national avarage.

Some people can't cope with the limelight...some people can't cope without the limelight once they've tasted it...some people deal just fine...doesn't mean football should be changed to a non-contact sport.

I think Dave Duerson's suicide (along with his suicide note citing his desire that his brain be studied for CTE) is what's driving the head trauma link. Seau shot himself in the chest, same as Duerson, which would indicate that he didn't want to put a bullet in his brain...so that it could be studied...

interesting point.

What I find confusing about Dave Duerson is if he was so sure he had an issue with his brain why didn't he go get it looked at? Same goes for Seau if we're going to link the two.

And when did Duerson retire? 93 was it? He killed himself in 2011. Duerson was a productive citizen for another decade and a half after he retired. He had enough of his faculties to conduct himself has a successful businessman but not enough sense to go get looked at if he felt something was wrong.

In my opinion Seau's first attemp was a couple years ago when he drove his truck off a cliff...he had just retired at that point.

either way there a saying that goes..."once is happenstance, twice a coincidence, three times a trend"

If someone else does the same thing we can talk.

Also both of these guys played defense. What are we going to do to protect players on D?

Call be barbaric but the day you stop a ballcarrier by way of two-hand touch is the day I stop watching.

Just because you suffer from depression, PTSD or any mental disorder doesn't mean that you cannot be a productive citizen. What were these guys like and what was going through their minds when they were alone. When you are out and about with others as someone that suffers from both of the disorders I mentioned then everything is fine, but it is when you are by yourself that things begin to pop into your head.

Both Duerson and Seau may have just had enough and not been able to deal with it anymore. If you heard Marcellus Wiley's statement he met with Seau just before and sensed something wrong. He asked him if everything was okay and Seau told him yes.

And asking for help isn't as easy as it seems. I am a vet and these guys are in a macho sport. Asking for help as a vet was seen for the most part as a weakness. I am sure football is the same. It sounds crazy, but alot of times if you even seem like you are talking "deep" or expressing any emotion other than anger or hate with someone then you get funny looks.

As many people that think Roger Goodell is an *** and a dictator, one thing that he has pushed is research into concussions and how they affect the brain. They are actually connecting concussions with depression and other mental disorders.

fletch842
05-04-2012, 06:09 PM
Holy ****.

Seau commited suicide...What the hell does that have to do with football beyond perhaps some men struggling to cope without the game?

Do we have any basis to support that concussions lead to suicide???

What if the guy was suffering from major depressive disorder? We have far FAR more evidence to support that diagnosis leading to suicide than head trama which is beside the point as we have no data quantify Seau's supposed head trauma in the first place.

Warner talking about being scared for his kids to play football is just Lime Light whoring at its finest.

What the hell is Warner (or Toomer for that matter) doing talking about anything that isn't X and O related?

Who cares who Warner thinks is going into the HOF or what he does with his own kids. The season hasn't started yet so...WHO TURNED THIS MAN'S MICROPHONE ON???

And all this stuff about concussions is the most gross example of wag the dog ever exhibited.

Goodell is responding to a lawsuit backlog when in actuality that major majority of the complaintants are just players who played in an era where football wasn't as lucrative and financially rewarding and these suits are a way of getting their peice of the multi-billion dollar pie. Goodell should just settle the suits and leave our god damn game alone.

Goodell is playing us fans an himself by responding to these suits by fouling up the essence of the game.
Seriously? If you've watched ESPN at all over the past 48 hours you've heard the statistic that the suicide rate among former NFL players is 6 times the national average. Is your hypothesis that the game just happens to attract depressives?

What bothers me about Toomer's comment is that he's not questioning the validity of Warner's stance, he's basically saying "it doesn't matter if what you're saying is true, keep your mouth shut and protect the game." It's hard for me to respect that sort of ignorance.

No but why is the presumption the head trauma is the link?

I think being praised on a daily basis and having fans cheer your name on daily basis and then suddenly hearing nothing might be a good recipe for depression.

If you look at the Suicide rates for any star/public figures in general you'll see they blow alway the national avarage.

Some people can't cope with the limelight...some people can't cope without the limelight once they've tasted it...some people deal just fine...doesn't mean football should be changed to a non-contact sport.

I think Dave Duerson's suicide (along with his suicide note citing his desire that his brain be studied for CTE) is what's driving the head trauma link. Seau shot himself in the chest, same as Duerson, which would indicate that he didn't want to put a bullet in his brain...so that it could be studied...

interesting point.

What I find confusing about Dave Duerson is if he was so sure he had an issue with his brain why didn't he go get it looked at? Same goes for Seau if we're going to link the two.

And when did Duerson retire? 93 was it? He killed himself in 2011. Duerson was a productive citizen for another decade and a half after he retired. He had enough of his faculties to conduct himself has a successful businessman but not enough sense to go get looked at if he felt something was wrong.

In my opinion Seau's first attemp was a couple years ago when he drove his truck off a cliff...he had just retired at that point.

either way there a saying that goes..."once is happenstance, twice a coincidence, three times a trend"

If someone else does the same thing we can talk.

Also both of these guys played defense. What are we going to do to protect players on D?

Call be barbaric but the day you stop a ballcarrier by way of two-hand touch is the day I stop watching.
Currently there is no test for the syndrome for a live person. They can only check posthumously.

FroZeNx31x
05-04-2012, 06:10 PM
I agree with Amani

Easy-Duz-It
05-04-2012, 06:20 PM
I don't have a problem with what Warner said...yes, he has benefitted from football, but perhaps if he knew the risks beforehand, he might have made different choices.

yet he still benefits from the game by constantly appearing on the nfl network.

B&RWarrior
05-04-2012, 06:26 PM
I don't have a problem with what Warner said...yes, he has benefitted from football, but perhaps if he knew the risks beforehand, he might have made different choices.

yet he still benefits from the game by constantly appearing on the nfl network.

and the NFL benefited from him with all the ticket sales and merchandise sold due to his play with the Rams, Giants, and the Cardinals.

GMENAGAIN
05-04-2012, 07:38 PM
I don't see what's so wrong about what Warner said. I don't think I'll let my kids play football either. Or, at least I'll worry about it.</P>


You're right, but I don't think that anyone on this thread has any ideawhat Warner actually said . . . . </P>

NYG 5
05-04-2012, 11:19 PM
why is it that whenever Toomer speaks, he's throwing someone under the bus? he's trashing Trey Junkin, he's trashing Jim Fassel, he's trashing Jeremy Shockey, he's trashing Tiki Barber, now he's trashing Kurt Warner.

I think Kurt is primarily more worried about his kids playing advanced levels of football: NCAA, pro. I think less so with pee wee and high school, since its proven that young kids recover faster and more completely from head trauma.

regardless, he's assuming too much from Warner's statements. he isn't trying to ruin the game for anyone else, he's trying to make people aware of the necessary danger.

example: Kurt Warner made a lot of money in the coal mines, and is on a committee on coal mines. now he's trying to ruin coal mining for everyone because he's saying breathing in coal is dangerous, and that workers should be better protected. they're all going to breathe in coal dust anyway, lets not even worry about it. I hope my son works in coal mines, that's what the Toomers do.

yoeddy
05-05-2012, 06:10 AM
Holy ****.

Seau commited suicide...What the hell does that have to do with football beyond perhaps some men struggling to cope without the game?

Do we have any basis to support that concussions lead to suicide???

What if the guy was suffering from major depressive disorder? We have far FAR more evidence to support that diagnosis leading to suicide than head trama which is beside the point as we have no data quantify Seau's supposed head trauma in the first place.

Warner talking about being scared for his kids to play football is just Lime Light whoring at its finest.

What the hell is Warner (or Toomer for that matter) doing talking about anything that isn't X and O related?

Who cares who Warner thinks is going into the HOF or what he does with his own kids. The season hasn't started yet so...WHO TURNED THIS MAN'S MICROPHONE ON???

And all this stuff about concussions is the most gross example of wag the dog ever exhibited.

Goodell is responding to a lawsuit backlog when in actuality that major majority of the complaintants are just players who played in an era where football wasn't as lucrative and financially rewarding and these suits are a way of getting their peice of the multi-billion dollar pie. Goodell should just settle the suits and leave our god damn game alone.

Goodell is playing us fans an himself by responding to these suits by fouling up the essence of the game.
Seriously? If you've watched ESPN at all over the past 48 hours you've heard the statistic that the suicide rate among former NFL players is 6 times the national average. Is your hypothesis that the game just happens to attract depressives?

What bothers me about Toomer's comment is that he's not questioning the validity of Warner's stance, he's basically saying "it doesn't matter if what you're saying is true, keep your mouth shut and protect the game." It's hard for me to respect that sort of ignorance.

No but why is the presumption the head trauma is the link?

I think being praised on a daily basis and having fans cheer your name on daily basis and then suddenly hearing nothing might be a good recipe for depression.

If you look at the Suicide rates for any star/public figures in general you'll see they blow alway the national avarage.

Some people can't cope with the limelight...some people can't cope without the limelight once they've tasted it...some people deal just fine...doesn't mean football should be changed to a non-contact sport.

I think Dave Duerson's suicide (along with his suicide note citing his desire that his brain be studied for CTE) is what's driving the head trauma link. Seau shot himself in the chest, same as Duerson, which would indicate that he didn't want to put a bullet in his brain...so that it could be studied...

interesting point.

What I find confusing about Dave Duerson is if he was so sure he had an issue with his brain why didn't he go get it looked at? Same goes for Seau if we're going to link the two.

And when did Duerson retire? 93 was it? He killed himself in 2011. Duerson was a productive citizen for another decade and a half after he retired. He had enough of his faculties to conduct himself has a successful businessman but not enough sense to go get looked at if he felt something was wrong.

In my opinion Seau's first attemp was a couple years ago when he drove his truck off a cliff...he had just retired at that point.

either way there a saying that goes..."once is happenstance, twice a coincidence, three times a trend"

If someone else does the same thing we can talk.

Also both of these guys played defense. What are we going to do to protect players on D?

Call be barbaric but the day you stop a ballcarrier by way of two-hand touch is the day I stop watching.

I'm not sure you can assume that Duerson didn't see doctors before deciding to kill himself.

OX1
05-05-2012, 09:46 AM
Seriously? If you've watched ESPN at all over the past 48 hours you've heard the statistic that the suicide rate among former NFL players is 6 times the national average.

So do dentists, supposedly. Does not mean anything. Suicide studies are a crock at best.
Hope Warner is not encouraging his kids to be dentists, that we be completely irresponsible as a parent.

" Dentists' odds of suicide "are 6.64 times greater than the rest of the working age population,"

http://www.straightdope.com/columns/read/2301/do-dentists-have-the-highest-suicide-rat (http://www.straightdope.com/columns/read/2301/do-dentists-have-the-highest-suicide-rate)e (http://www.straightdope.com/columns/read/2301/do-dentists-have-the-highest-suicide-rate)

JDE123
05-05-2012, 12:38 PM
Seriously? If you've watched ESPN at all over the past 48 hours you've heard the statistic that the suicide rate among former NFL players is 6 times the national average.

* So do dentists, supposedly. Does not mean anything. Suicide studies are a crock at best.
Hope Warner is not encouraging his kids to be dentists, that we be completely irresponsible as a parent.

" Dentists' odds of suicide "are 6.64 times greater than the rest of the working age population,"

http://www.straightdope.com/columns/read/2301/do-dentists-have-the-highest-suicide-rat (http://www.straightdope.com/columns/read/2301/do-dentists-have-the-highest-suicide-rate)e (http://www.straightdope.com/columns/read/2301/do-dentists-have-the-highest-suicide-rate)

That's because young dentists aren't taught to wrap up when they tackle, they just launch head first into...j/k

Just for the record, if a retired dentist made a public statement suggesting that he wouldn't want his children to become dentists I don't believe it would elicit the mafia mentality "keep it in the family" reaction that Toomer had.

Nothing is definitive either way at this point - I'll certainly concede that to you, burier, and anyone else. That being said, there seems to be a link between head trauma and brain disorders, as well as a link between brain disorders and depression/suicide. I don't like what's going on with the sissifying of the NFL, but I believe that players should have as much information as possible to make informed decisions about their potential future quality of life.