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View Full Version : Absence of Phillips was felt...



NYGiant92
12-12-2011, 01:06 AM
I am not to worried about our secondary even though there is obvious concern when it comes to our inexperienced LB's, but i see that improving with time. I think todays game was an indication. Jason Witten only had 3 catches for 12 yards.

We also have a reliable/shutdown corner in Corey Webster although Ross and Prince giveth and taketh away (hopefully prince will clean up rookie mistakes). That wont matter if our pass rush returns to full force (the return of Osi).

The return of Phillips will instantly eliminate those big plays down field (today being the only game i've seen that all season and maybe saints). I hope now some fans feel Kenny's value to this team.

DJloves
12-12-2011, 01:10 AM
I wish Tuck's presence was MORE felt.

NYGiant92
12-12-2011, 01:15 AM
Did you notice that when he left the game, how much worse our D played as a whole? It's crazy. I really hope this toe thing is minor because if hes anywhere close to 100%, then our D is be beastly.


I wish Tuck's presence was MORE felt.

JJC7301
12-12-2011, 01:33 AM
I am not to worried about our secondary even though there is obvious concern when it comes to our inexperienced LB's, but i see that improving with time. I think todays game was an indication. Jason Witten only had 3 catches for 12 yards.

We also have a reliable/shutdown corner in Corey Webster although Ross and Prince giveth and taketh away (hopefully prince will clean up rookie mistakes). That wont matter if our pass rush returns to full force (the return of Osi).

The return of Phillips will instantly eliminate those big plays down field (today being the only game i've seen that all season and maybe saints). I hope now some fans feel Kenny's value to this team.
The D stunk before KP got hurt, they stunk with him hurt. I did not notice that KP wasn't on the field.

T-Murda84
12-12-2011, 01:47 AM
Yea I didnt notice KP not playing either...the secondary still miscommunicates and leave opposing receivers wide open. I dont know how Fewell can get creative with a secondary who is always puzzled. Its crazy...if its man coverage they forget to cover the guy in front of them. And forget cover 2...or safeties seem to worried looking at tight ends and in the backfield.

NYGiant92
12-12-2011, 01:48 AM
Then you're a fool if u didn't notice those deep balls flying 60 yards downfield. Kenny Phillips is assigned the "deep safety" role for the most part and nothing flys that dar down the field. He is even getting pro bowl consideration.

http://www.nfl.com/probowl/story/09000d5d824dd8d4/article/analysts-share-their-picks-for-the-pro-bowl?module=HP11_content_stream



I am not to worried about our secondary even though there is obvious concern when it comes to our inexperienced LB's, but i see that improving with time. I think todays game was an indication. Jason Witten only had 3 catches for 12 yards.

We also have a reliable/shutdown corner in Corey Webster although Ross and Prince giveth and taketh away (hopefully prince will clean up rookie mistakes). That wont matter if our pass rush returns to full force (the return of Osi).

The return of Phillips will instantly eliminate those big plays down field (today being the only game i've seen that all season and maybe saints). I hope now some fans feel Kenny's value to this team.
The D stunk before KP got hurt, they stunk with him hurt. I did not notice that KP wasn't on the field.

NYGiant92
12-12-2011, 01:50 AM
There are some obvious miscommunications, but you cannot doubt the fact that there were plenty of them today and even when Phillips is playing, he is never the one that is out of position. He shuts it down.


Yea I didnt notice KP not playing either...the secondary still miscommunicates and leave opposing receivers wide open. I dont know how Fewell can get creative with a secondary who is always puzzled. Its crazy...if its man coverage they forget to cover the guy in front of them. And forget cover 2...or safeties seem to worried looking at tight ends and in the backfield.

JJC7301
12-12-2011, 01:50 AM
Then you're a fool if u didn't notice those deep balls flying 60 yards downfield. Kenny Phillips is assigned the "deep safety" role for the most part and nothing flys that dar down the field. He is even getting pro bowl consideration.

http://www.nfl.com/probowl/story/09000d5d824dd8d4/article/analysts-share-their-picks-for-the-pro-bowl?module=HP11_content_stream



I am not to worried about our secondary even though there is obvious concern when it comes to our inexperienced LB's, but i see that improving with time. I think todays game was an indication. Jason Witten only had 3 catches for 12 yards.

We also have a reliable/shutdown corner in Corey Webster although Ross and Prince giveth and taketh away (hopefully prince will clean up rookie mistakes). That wont matter if our pass rush returns to full force (the return of Osi).

The return of Phillips will instantly eliminate those big plays down field (today being the only game i've seen that all season and maybe saints). I hope now some fans feel Kenny's value to this team.
The D stunk before KP got hurt, they stunk with him hurt. I did not notice that KP wasn't on the field.
It doesn't take a fool to notice the Giants D getting lit up when KP is in the game, or when he's injured. I'm not even knocking KP -- I just believe that something is seriously and fundamentally wrong with this D regardless of WHO is in it.

NYGiant92
12-12-2011, 01:53 AM
Most of the miscommunication is opposite of Phillips (Grant and Rolle). I guess this is where the Thomas injury kills cause Rolle said himself that they had chemistry. That's still no excuse considering how far we are into the season. There has been plenty of time to build chemistry with the other corners.

NYGiant92
12-12-2011, 01:57 AM
I understand that, but i think today we were getting lit up from a safety perspective and thats due to his absence. In games past, it was mostly the LB's and somtimes safety.

I would just really like an explanation for all this. Is our D really that complex?




Then you're a fool if u didn't notice those deep balls flying 60 yards downfield. Kenny Phillips is assigned the "deep safety" role for the most part and nothing flys that dar down the field. He is even getting pro bowl consideration.

http://www.nfl.com/probowl/story/09000d5d824dd8d4/article/analysts-share-their-picks-for-the-pro-bowl?module=HP11_content_stream



I am not to worried about our secondary even though there is obvious concern when it comes to our inexperienced LB's, but i see that improving with time. I think todays game was an indication. Jason Witten only had 3 catches for 12 yards.

We also have a reliable/shutdown corner in Corey Webster although Ross and Prince giveth and taketh away (hopefully prince will clean up rookie mistakes). That wont matter if our pass rush returns to full force (the return of Osi).

The return of Phillips will instantly eliminate those big plays down field (today being the only game i've seen that all season and maybe saints). I hope now some fans feel Kenny's value to this team.
The D stunk before KP got hurt, they stunk with him hurt. I did not notice that KP wasn't on the field.
It doesn't take a fool to notice the Giants D getting lit up when KP is in the game, or when he's injured. I'm not even knocking KP -- I just believe that something is seriously and fundamentally wrong with this D regardless of WHO is in it.

NYGiant92
12-12-2011, 01:19 PM
bump

Tony Bruno
12-12-2011, 01:22 PM
I guess Sash is just worthless??? He seems like the type that can play in Grandpas position though stacking the box...

NYGiant92
12-12-2011, 06:46 PM
Surprisingly, there was a lot more of Grant than Sash when it was initially reported that Sash would get the start. I'm pretty sure Sash is much faster than Grant at this point. I think Grant should remain a situational LB on passing downs and in the box safety.



I guess Sash is just worthless??? He seems like the type that can play in Grandpas position though stacking the box...

Gianthunter
12-12-2011, 06:56 PM
Surprisingly, there was a lot more of Grant than Sash when it was initially reported that Sash would get the start. I'm pretty sure Sash is much faster than Grant at this point. I think Grant should remain a situational LB on passing downs and in the box safety.



I guess Sash is just worthless??? He seems like the type that can play in Grandpas position though stacking the box...Who reported Sash would start? Or even be effective forthat matter. Well other thansome sash baggers. Sure missed Kenny in run support.

53canton
12-12-2011, 07:23 PM
yeah, Witten would have caught 10 balls had KP played. Like he usually does.....

Gianthunter
12-12-2011, 07:37 PM
yeah, Witten would have caught 10 balls had KP played. Like he usually does.....It's like shooting no nothings in a barrel.

NYGiant92
12-12-2011, 08:01 PM
Made a mistake. Not start, but see "significant playing time" via rotoworld

<div class="report">Giants rookie S Tyler Sash is expected to see significant playing time with Kenny Phillips (MCL sprain) ruled out this week.</div> <div class="impact">Sash,
a sixth-round pick, saw limited action in last week's game against
Green Bay, but looks to be the preferred option to Deon Grant in pass
coverage. After primarily playing on special teams this season, he'll
matchup with Jason Witten and be spelled on obvious running downs. <span class="date">Dec 10 - 8:00 PM</span></div>



Surprisingly, there was a lot more of Grant than Sash when it was initially reported that Sash would get the start. I'm pretty sure Sash is much faster than Grant at this point. I think Grant should remain a situational LB on passing downs and in the box safety.



I guess Sash is just worthless??? He seems like the type that can play in Grandpas position though stacking the box...Who reported Sash would start? Or even be effective forthat matter. Well other thansome sash baggers. Sure missed Kenny in run support.

53canton
12-12-2011, 09:40 PM
yeah, Witten would have caught 10 balls had KP played. Like he usually does.....It's like shooting no nothings in a barrel.

What he dont?! Is that what your implying?

cowboysblow
12-12-2011, 10:15 PM
I don't think we missed Phillips at all, in fact I'd ready to cut him loose and move on after this season. The 2 games prior to this were absolute debacles in the secondary. So was pretty much every game last season where we didn't get an effective pass rush. This secondary has been awful since 2008, no matter who's healthy. Even with Terrell Thomas in there.
And I wouldn't call Webster a shut down corner either. NO ONE in the Giants secondary is all that good. I don't care what round they were drafted in.

Elmore253
12-12-2011, 10:40 PM
I don't think we missed Phillips at all, in fact I'd ready to cut him loose and move on after this season. The 2 games prior to this were absolute debacles in the secondary. So was pretty much every game last season where we didn't get an effective pass rush. This secondary has been awful since 2008, no matter who's healthy. Even with Terrell Thomas in there.
And I wouldn't call Webster a shut down corner either. NO ONE in the Giants secondary is all that good. I don't care what round they were drafted in.

Are you guys insane? To say that Kenny Phillips is not missed on this defense is laughable.

heavyhitter
12-13-2011, 01:06 AM
As much as I hate to say it, KP hasn't been the same since that major injury to his knee. He's my favorite player on the team, but that knee is still hurting him IMO (regardless of the surgery).

Firenugget
12-13-2011, 05:15 AM
Then you're a fool if u didn't notice those deep balls flying 60 yards downfield. Kenny Phillips is assigned the "deep safety" role for the most part and nothing flys that dar down the field. He is even getting pro bowl consideration.

http://www.nfl.com/probowl/story/09000d5d824dd8d4/article/analysts-share-their-picks-for-the-pro-bowl?module=HP11_content_stream



I am not to worried about our secondary even though there is obvious concern when it comes to our inexperienced LB's, but i see that improving with time. I think todays game was an indication. Jason Witten only had 3 catches for 12 yards.

We also have a reliable/shutdown corner in Corey Webster although Ross and Prince giveth and taketh away (hopefully prince will clean up rookie mistakes). That wont matter if our pass rush returns to full force (the return of Osi).

The return of Phillips will instantly eliminate those big plays down field (today being the only game i've seen that all season and maybe saints). I hope now some fans feel Kenny's value to this team.
The D stunk before KP got hurt, they stunk with him hurt. I did not notice that KP wasn't on the field.

@NYGiant92 Uhh...He didnt stop Brees or Rodgers from tossing any of those bombs now did he? Sorry but our secondary is just bad this year. Oh yes, the great KP too.

buddy33
12-13-2011, 07:57 AM
The secondary didn't play well against the Saints or Green Bay but I don't remember any really long pass plays.

cowboysblow
12-13-2011, 08:02 AM
I don't think we missed Phillips at all, in fact I'd ready to cut him loose and move on after this season. The 2 games prior to this were absolute debacles in the secondary. So was pretty much every game last season where we didn't get an effective pass rush. This secondary has been awful since 2008, no matter who's healthy. Even with Terrell Thomas in there.
And I wouldn't call Webster a shut down corner either. NO ONE in the Giants secondary is all that good. I don't care what round they were drafted in.

Are you guys insane? To say that Kenny Phillips is not missed on this defense is laughable.


Again, did his presence in the secondary do anything to slow down the passing attack in the previous two games? This has been a bad secondary for some time. If we don't get a pass rush, we're toast, it's that simple, and that's been the case for awhile. Would we have been better defensively with Phillips in there? Probably, but minimally. Let's not talk like he's had a particularly good year. He's been fairly lousy. My gut tells me that injury and surgery in '09 really stopped him from becoming the player that maybe he would've been. It's very rare that he makes any kind of impact play. He's usually pretty invisible out there.

shockeyg
12-13-2011, 08:05 AM
I didn't miss him much . I mean we've givin up 4 passing TD's to the last 3 teams we've played and he played in some of those games.

michaelkhan3
12-13-2011, 08:20 AM
I don't think we missed Phillips at all, in fact I'd ready to cut him loose and move on after this season. The 2 games prior to this were absolute debacles in the secondary. So was pretty much every game last season where we didn't get an effective pass rush. This secondary has been awful since 2008, no matter who's healthy. Even with Terrell Thomas in there.
And I wouldn't call Webster a shut down corner either. NO ONE in the Giants secondary is all that good. I don't care what round they were drafted in.

Are you guys insane? To say that Kenny Phillips is not missed on this defense is laughable.


Again, did his presence in the secondary do anything to slow down the passing attack in the previous two games? This has been a bad secondary for some time. If we don't get a pass rush, we're toast, it's that simple, and that's been the case for awhile. Would we have been better defensively with Phillips in there? Probably, but minimally. Let's not talk like he's had a particularly good year. He's been fairly lousy. My gut tells me that injury and surgery in '09 really stopped him from becoming the player that maybe he would've been. It's very rare that he makes any kind of impact play. He's usually pretty invisible out there.

That was the saints and the Packers they are in a different league to the cowboys. Just watch that play where Prince was covering Robinson and he got beat deep, we were playing man with 2 deep safeties who are meant to stay behind everyone and neither of them thought of staying behind Robinson

buddy33
12-13-2011, 08:40 AM
Who does stop Brees or Rogers? The last game I do think they missed KP on that long play against Prince and maybe he would have been able to let Rolle know where he needed to be on that one blown coverage. I don't know. Just saying, defense this year stink. Eli has thrown for over 1,100 yards th last 3 games. How are those defenses? At least with the Giants we know about their numerous injuries on the defensive unit. Those teams I'm not sure but I think they at a lot healthier than the Giants.

NYGiant92
12-13-2011, 09:45 AM
Exactly my point. Our secondary looked twice as bad against the cowboys and no one likes to see those deep balls flying down the field for easy TD's. The cowboys game plan was probably attacking us deep knowing Phillips was out of the lineup.



The secondary didn't play well against the Saints or Green Bay but I don't remember any really long pass plays.

GMENAGAIN
12-13-2011, 10:04 AM
I don't think we missed Phillips at all, in fact I'd ready to cut him loose and move on after this season. The 2 games prior to this were absolute debacles in the secondary. So was pretty much every game last season where we didn't get an effective pass rush. This secondary has been awful since 2008, no matter who's healthy. Even with Terrell Thomas in there. And I wouldn't call Webster a shut down corner either. NO ONE in the Giants secondary is all that good. I don't care what round they were drafted in.

Are you guys insane? To say that Kenny Phillips is not missed on this defense is laughable.
</P>


How did the defense look when KP actually played against GB and the Saints? The defense is horrible when he's in there and it's horrible when he's out. So it's hard to make a case that his absence had any effect on the game . . . . . </P>

GMENAGAIN
12-13-2011, 10:05 AM
I am not to worried about our secondary even though there is obvious concern when it comes to our inexperienced LB's, but i see that improving with time. I think todays game was an indication. Jason Witten only had 3 catches for 12 yards. <FONT size=4>We also have a reliable/shutdown corner in Corey Webster</FONT> although Ross and Prince giveth and taketh away (hopefully prince will clean up rookie mistakes). That wont matter if our pass rush returns to full force (the return of Osi). The return of Phillips will instantly eliminate those big plays down field (today being the only game i've seen that all season and maybe saints). I hope now some fans feel Kenny's value to this team.</P>


I am more of a shutdown corner than Webster . . . . . </P>

cowboysblow
12-13-2011, 02:37 PM
Yes I suppose he likely wouldn't have made that mistake, he's a veteran and a starter who knows the drill... if you want to argue on that ONE PARTICULAR PLAY he may have had an impact, fine. I suspect it just would've taken them a few more plays, and another couple minutes off the clock to score on that drive if Phillips had been in there.
We're not just talking about the Saints and Packers. This secondary has been awful for AWHILE. Every game last year where we didn't get a real good pass rush, our secondary got torched. Even by lousy QB's like Jon Kitna. IMO this secondary needs a complete overhaul. Other than Webster (who I'm not even especially in love with) and Prince (who we can't judge by this season), everyone else is very expendable and replacable.