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View Full Version : So far, the 2011 Draft is looking horrible.



joemorrisforprez
09-08-2012, 05:52 PM
So far, Jacquian Williams is the only guy who has stepped up.

The rest have spent more time in the tub and on the bench.

Eliscruzzz
09-08-2012, 05:53 PM
So far, Jacquian Williams is the only guy who has stepped up.

The rest have spent more time in the tub and on the bench.after one year they look terrible ok.....????

davepc
09-08-2012, 05:57 PM
lol, pro post.

BurnerNYG
09-08-2012, 05:57 PM
Yeah hopefully somebody else steps up... we already released Greg Jones. I was real high on that draft....add in Herzlich and I was batting my chest. Poor Prince never had any injuries until he joined us and Austin who I thought was a beast is just plain old missing too much time from the football field. What gives?

joemorrisforprez
09-08-2012, 05:58 PM
after one year they look terrible ok.....????

Like I said....so far, the 2011 Draft has produced one backup linebacker, and the rest are either unable to perform or no longer on the team.

Not sure what you'd call that.

Buddy333
09-08-2012, 06:02 PM
Well to date they have not shown much. I mean the 1st and 2nd round picks have hardly played.

Buddy333
09-08-2012, 06:03 PM
I still think they can be very good players. They just have to get healthy and stay that way.

Eliscruzzz
09-08-2012, 06:07 PM
Like I said....so far, the 2011 Draft has produced one backup linebacker, and the rest are either unable to perform or no longer on the team.

Not sure what you'd call that.I'd call to soon to tell let's wait to see Prince, Austin, Herzlich, before we say they are TERRIBLE!!

Crovaz
09-08-2012, 06:08 PM
So far, Jacquian Williams is the only guy who has stepped up.

The rest have spent more time in the tub and on the bench.

You're right, we should probably go ahead and cut our losses and let them go to free agency.

BurnerNYG
09-08-2012, 06:09 PM
You're right, we should probably go ahead and cut our losses and let them go to free agency.Are you kidding? I can't tell.

egyptian420
09-08-2012, 06:09 PM
Lack of patience much?

Crovaz
09-08-2012, 06:12 PM
Are you kidding? I can't tell.

Yes, I'm kidding. OP is apparently part of the xbox generation. All players must be hall of fame worthy by their 2nd preseason game or else they're garbage.

joemorrisforprez
09-08-2012, 06:12 PM
Yes, I'm kidding. OP is apparently part of the xbox generation. All players must be hall of fame worthy by their 2nd preseason game or else they're garbage.

Do you need me to explain what "so far" means?

slipknottin
09-08-2012, 06:14 PM
That draft class had no offseason their rookie year either. Brewer, J Will, and Prince have all shown plenty of potential. Jernigan is still adjusting, and Austin is an unknown, but certainly has talent. Have to really say all these guys are pretty much still rookies, this was their first full offseason with the team. Give them another two years to judge.

Buddy333
09-08-2012, 06:16 PM
I think Prince has shown he is a good player but just not enough. He was out most of last season and now is dealing with another injury.

joemorrisforprez
09-08-2012, 06:16 PM
That draft class had no offseason their rookie year either. Brewer, J Will, and Prince have all shown plenty of potential. Jernigan is still adjusting, and Austin is an unknown, but certainly has talent. Have to really say all these guys are pretty much still rookies, this was their first full offseason with the team. Give them another two years to judge.

I'm hoping we have more than just a backup linebacker to show for it in 2 years.

joemorrisforprez
09-08-2012, 06:18 PM
I'd call to soon to tell let's wait to see Prince, Austin, Herzlich, before we say they are TERRIBLE!!

When your entire draft class, outside a backup linebacker, cannot get on the field......that's just bad.

BurnerNYG
09-08-2012, 06:18 PM
The key words that he said was "so far" and so far, he has a point. It doesn't mean that one or two of em aren't gonna step up...it's just kind of frustrating waiting for them to. I would like to see a pro-bowler or ROY every now and then myself. Nicks almost did it but injuries plagued him too. Why is our team always injured? We got the great benefits of winning championships but some awful bad luck keeping our guys healthy.

slipknottin
09-08-2012, 06:18 PM
I'm hoping we have more than just a backup linebacker to show for it in 2 years.

J Will is already a starter. Prince is a starter when he was healthy. Jernigan was the primary kick returner last year during the playoff run. Brewer was the primary backup at both OT spots last year after Beatty got hurt.

When you have a good team, its not often that guys jump right into the starting lineup.

joemorrisforprez
09-08-2012, 06:21 PM
The key words that he said was "so far" and so far, he has a point. It doesn't mean that one or two of em aren't gonna step up...it's just kind of frustrating waiting for them to. I would like to see a pro-bowler or ROY every now and then myself. Nicks almost did it but injuries plagued him too. Why is our team always injured? We got the great benefits of winning championships but some awful bad luck keeping our guys healthy.

Exactly, and thank you.

Eliscruzzz
09-08-2012, 06:26 PM
J Will is already a starter. Prince is a starter when he was healthy. Jernigan was the primary kick returner last year during the playoff run. Brewer was the primary backup at both OT spots last year after Beatty got hurt.

When you have a good team, its not often that guys jump right into the starting lineup.this^^^^^^^^^don't exactly know how this is terrible

joemorrisforprez
09-08-2012, 08:04 PM
J Will is already a starter. Prince is a starter when he was healthy. Jernigan was the primary kick returner last year during the playoff run. Brewer was the primary backup at both OT spots last year after Beatty got hurt.

When you have a good team, its not often that guys jump right into the starting lineup.

Michael Boley is the starting weak side linebacker; Kiwanuka is the starting strong side linebacker, and Chase is the starting middle linebacker.

http://www.nfl.com/teams/newyorkgiants/depthchart?team=NYG

Don't get me wrong....I like Williams alot.

But again, so far, the most productive 2011 draft pick was a 6th rounder.....the 3rd guy in the 6th round, to be specific.

Here's the breakdown.....so far, completely underwhelming......

1st Round....Prince..... incomplete....huge pressure on this kid to step up after T2, and since they let Aaron Ross walk.
2nd Round.....Austin.....hasn't played football in what, 3 years now?.....I was high on this kid, but he's looking like a bust right now.
3rd Round.....Jernigan was, frankly, a waste of a pick considering how much help we need on the offensive line.....we could have picked up a decent OL prospect in the 3rd.
4th Round.....James Brewer....zero contribution, despite a banged up line that is clearly on the decline.
6th Round....Greg Jones....cut.
6th Round.....Tyler Sash....suspended backup.
6th Round.....J Williams.....most productive player, by far.
7th Round....DaRel Scott....another guy I had hopes for.....looks like he's buried on the depth chart.


The 2007 Draft Class was an "A".....those guys jumped in and contributed in their rookie season.
In comparison, at best, the 2011 class is "D" at this point.

Eli TO Shockey
09-08-2012, 08:07 PM
like a few others have stated..These players could have potentially (without injury) played 21 games....without OTA's and a shortened camp their rookie season. Far too soon to assess..

joemorrisforprez
09-08-2012, 08:13 PM
like a few others have stated..These players could have potentially (without injury) played 21 games....without OTA's and a shortened camp their rookie season. Far too soon to assess..

I respectfully disagree; as I mentioned, the 2007 draft class is a great example of how quickly contributors can step forward.

Right now, only 1 guy - Williams - is pulling his weight out of that entire class.

Even JR has called out Prince.....time to start playing like a #1 pick. So far, the dude is a piece of glass.

Again, over the long haul, the 2011 class might look alot better than how I'm grading it right now.

RoanokeFan
09-08-2012, 08:15 PM
So far, Jacquian Williams is the only guy who has stepped up.

The rest have spent more time in the tub and on the bench.

We draft players to develop their potential. One season does not give them enough time.

YATittle1962
09-08-2012, 08:18 PM
I think the UDFA Herzlich looks like he could be a contributor at a high level

the kid is a football player

CowboysSuck
09-08-2012, 08:27 PM
Since everyone is giving the OP ****, I'll say a few words here.

First of all, lets be realistic: If you are injured and can't get on the field you are worthless. Simple. You are the opposite of an asset.
That right there includes (SO FAR) Marvin Austin, James Brewer, and to an extent, Prince Amukamara. All three have essentialy done nothing in the NFL with the exception of Prince late last year.

Moving on... We run into Jernigan, Sash, and Scott. No major injury problems here but also nothing spectacular..or even something to get excited about. Scott and Jernigan have speed. Ok, i can accept that. But so dont 250 other NFL players. Sash can go with the group above for all I care. He played last year but didn't have an impact really (with exception of ST), and now hes suspended for 6 weeks.

We then run into Greg Jones. He got cut, need I say more?

Finally we have Jacquain Williams. He is by far the best pick of this draft SO FAR. He has contributed the most and made the most of his opportunity. And he was our 6th ROUND PICK. Remember that fumble he cause Kyle Williams that sent us to the SB? Yeah, no arguing here that hes been the best of the bunch.


So, review the list. Think of the contributions of each player. SO FAR, has this really been a good draft? Even a decent draft? I would say its sub-par at best until Prince and Austin take the field. But hey, you can't argue with the facts.

1st: Prince Amukamara (CB) Nebraska
2nd: Marvin Austin (DT) UNC
3rd: Jerrel Jernigan (WR) Troy
4th: James Brewer (OT) Indiana
6th: Greg Jones (ILB) Mich St
6th: Tyler Sash (S) Iowa
6th: Jacquian Williams (LB) S Florida
7th: Da'Rel Scott (RB) Maryland

G.I. Ants
09-08-2012, 08:30 PM
The 2007 Draft Class was an "A".....those guys jumped in and contributed in their rookie season.
In comparison, at best, the 2011 class is "D" at this point.I disagree with this statement. Yes, the '07 rookies made contributions to to the teams success that year, so did the '11 rookies. Herz, J-Will and Sash were rockstars on special teams last year, even making the big play that got the giants into the super bowl. Prince was hurt last year but made great contributions late in the season with solid play. To say that they were terrible is false. This season has just begun thus far and injuries has been an issue for some while Sash is currently suspended. Brewer made the roster and most likely will see some playing time this year. Austin is having back problems but he may finally make his debut next week.

slipknottin
09-08-2012, 08:33 PM
Ok first off, J Will plays as many snaps a game at LB as Kiwi, probably more. He is a psuedo starter just like how Deon Grant was. In fact, J Will is in fact playing the same position Grant was last year.

As for the others, Prince looked like a capable starter when healthy. Jernigan was a decent returner and is still learning. Brewer played on STs and was the primary backup his rookie year, but has had an injury issue this season. Was pretty solid at OT during preseason.

Sash is probably the best ST player on the team.

2007 draft class was great to you? How so? Ross was awful almost that entire season (and career) Never became anywhere near an elite player. Steve Smith missed most of the season with injuries. Alford had one tackle his rookie year. DeOssie was a long snapper (still is). Koets played on STs and was a backup, never developed into more than that. Boss was a solid player for a couple seasons. Michael Johnson was a decent player on STs, awful safety. Bradshaw was a steal as a 7th rounder.

I dont see how you could look back at the 07 draft and say it was a great draft. The players filled some roles for a couple years. Really only got one long term starter out of it (bradshaw) who is constantly injured himself. And DeOssie is a snapper.

CowboysSuck
09-08-2012, 08:39 PM
Ok first off, J Will plays as many snaps a game at LB as Kiwi, probably more. He is a psuedo starter just like how Deon Grant was. In fact, J Will is in fact playing the same position Grant was last year.

As for the others, Prince looked like a capable starter when healthy. Jernigan was a decent returner and is still learning. Brewer played on STs and was the primary backup his rookie year, but has had an injury issue this season. Was pretty solid at OT during preseason.

Sash is probably the best ST player on the team.

2007 draft class was great to you? How so? Ross was awful almost that entire season (and career) Never became anywhere near an elite player. Steve Smith missed most of the season with injuries. Alford had one tackle his rookie year. DeOssie was a long snapper (still is). Koets played on STs and was a backup, never developed into more than that. Boss was a solid player for a couple seasons. Michael Johnson was a decent player on STs, awful safety. Bradshaw was a steal as a 7th rounder.

I dont see how you could look back at the 07 draft and say it was a great draft. The players filled some roles for a couple years. Really only got one long term starter out of it (bradshaw) who is constantly injured himself. And DeOssie is a snapper.

Steve Smith, Kevin Boss, and Ahmad Bradshaw make that draft at least a B. More than we can say, to this point, about 2011 draft.

CowboysSuck
09-08-2012, 08:40 PM
You dont draft Tom Brady's in the 6th round every draft. You dont need an Adrian Peterson to make your draft a "good" one.

ShakeandBake
09-08-2012, 08:41 PM
Michael Boley is the starting weak side linebacker; Kiwanuka is the starting strong side linebacker, and Chase is the starting middle linebacker.

http://www.nfl.com/teams/newyorkgiants/depthchart?team=NYG

Don't get me wrong....I like Williams alot.

But again, so far, the most productive 2011 draft pick was a 6th rounder.....the 3rd guy in the 6th round, to be specific.

Here's the breakdown.....so far, completely underwhelming......

1st Round....Prince..... incomplete....huge pressure on this kid to step up after T2, and since they let Aaron Ross walk.
2nd Round.....Austin.....hasn't played football in what, 3 years now?.....I was high on this kid, but he's looking like a bust right now.
3rd Round.....Jernigan was, frankly, a waste of a pick considering how much help we need on the offensive line.....we could have picked up a decent OL prospect in the 3rd.
4th Round.....James Brewer....zero contribution, despite a banged up line that is clearly on the decline.
6th Round....Greg Jones....cut.
6th Round.....Tyler Sash....suspended backup.
6th Round.....J Williams.....most productive player, by far.
7th Round....DaRel Scott....another guy I had hopes for.....looks like he's buried on the depth chart.


The 2007 Draft Class was an "A".....those guys jumped in and contributed in their rookie season.
In comparison, at best, the 2011 class is "D" at this point.

You have to remember that Cruz had yet to "emerge" at the time of the draft, which would make the JJ pick seem like a good one at the time considering we did not have a definite starting slot receiver at the time.

TheEnigma
09-08-2012, 08:47 PM
I'm not really calling you out OP but who would you of drafted in 2011 without using hindsight?

1. Prince - Unexpected drop to #19, was almost as good as Patrick Peterson, a top 5 selection

2. Austin - Was considered a top 10 to 15 selection for the 2011 draft before he was suspended for a year.

3. Jernigan - Remember, Cruz didn't break out as our slot receiver yet.

4. Brewer - Has the feet to handle speed rushers but hasn't put it together so far.

6a. Jones - Good pick based on the production he made in college, athleticism was exposed in NFL though.

6b. Williams - He's good. Made some key plays for us last season.

7. Da'rel Scott - Has flashed special teams ability in both preseasons. Just gotta hope it works out in the regular season.

Now if you want to be upset with players who are constantly injured, TT would be a good candidate. Reese knew full well what he was getting into when he drafted him. Prince and Austin had clean medical history for the most part.

BlueSanta
09-08-2012, 08:55 PM
Steve Smith, Kevin Boss, and Ahmad Bradshaw make that draft at least a B. More than we can say, to this point, about 2011 draft.
Actually, statsistically none of those guys rookie campaign even remotely compared to Jwill's.

Furthermore, out of the entire 2007 Rookie class, only 2 guys (Bradshaw and DeOssie) have been resigned after their rookie contracts. That is NOT a ringing endorsement of that draft class.

Lastly, you have to consider the other moves made in 2007 as part of the overal draft itself. Bradshaw making the team was the reason we traded Ryan Grant to the packers for a 6th round pick which ended up being Andre Woodson. It is safe to say that was not a good move and the Packers came out on top.

GMENAGAIN
09-08-2012, 09:03 PM
Ok first off, J Will plays as many snaps a game at LB as Kiwi, probably more. He is a psuedo starter just like how Deon Grant was. In fact, J Will is in fact playing the same position Grant was last year.

As for the others, Prince looked like a capable starter when healthy. Jernigan was a decent returner and is still learning. Brewer played on STs and was the primary backup his rookie year, but has had an injury issue this season. Was pretty solid at OT during preseason.

Sash is probably the best ST player on the team.

2007 draft class was great to you? How so? Ross was awful almost that entire season (and career) Never became anywhere near an elite player. Steve Smith missed most of the season with injuries. Alford had one tackle his rookie year. DeOssie was a long snapper (still is). Koets played on STs and was a backup, never developed into more than that. Boss was a solid player for a couple seasons. Michael Johnson was a decent player on STs, awful safety. Bradshaw was a steal as a 7th rounder.

I dont see how you could look back at the 07 draft and say it was a great draft. The players filled some roles for a couple years. Really only got one long term starter out of it (bradshaw) who is constantly injured himself. And DeOssie is a snapper.

Brewer was solid at OT during the preseason???? The guy is a disaster . . . a ****ing turnstile.

If he gets in a game at all this year, we are in SERIOUS trouble.

BlueSanta
09-08-2012, 09:06 PM
Brewer was solid at OT during the preseason???? The guy is a disaster . . . a ****ing turnstile.

If he gets in a game at all this year, we are in SERIOUS trouble.

I can agree with that for sure. Brewer has not looked good at all this preseason. Reports from practices were not good either.

YATittle1962
09-08-2012, 09:07 PM
it is just silly to have this discussion until at least another 2 to 3 years

not everyone pops onto the scene with a big splash

mankind is getting more and more obsessed with instant gratification in every aspect of life than ever before .......and professional athletes do not escape this

joemorrisforprez
09-08-2012, 09:14 PM
Since everyone is giving the OP ****, I'll say a few words here.

First of all, lets be realistic: If you are injured and can't get on the field you are worthless. Simple. You are the opposite of an asset.
That right there includes (SO FAR) Marvin Austin, James Brewer, and to an extent, Prince Amukamara. All three have essentialy done nothing in the NFL with the exception of Prince late last year.

Moving on... We run into Jernigan, Sash, and Scott. No major injury problems here but also nothing spectacular..or even something to get excited about. Scott and Jernigan have speed. Ok, i can accept that. But so dont 250 other NFL players. Sash can go with the group above for all I care. He played last year but didn't have an impact really (with exception of ST), and now hes suspended for 6 weeks.

We then run into Greg Jones. He got cut, need I say more?

Finally we have Jacquain Williams. He is by far the best pick of this draft SO FAR. He has contributed the most and made the most of his opportunity. And he was our 6th ROUND PICK. Remember that fumble he cause Kyle Williams that sent us to the SB? Yeah, no arguing here that hes been the best of the bunch.


So, review the list. Think of the contributions of each player. SO FAR, has this really been a good draft? Even a decent draft? I would say its sub-par at best until Prince and Austin take the field. But hey, you can't argue with the facts.

1st: Prince Amukamara (CB) Nebraska
2nd: Marvin Austin (DT) UNC
3rd: Jerrel Jernigan (WR) Troy
4th: James Brewer (OT) Indiana
6th: Greg Jones (ILB) Mich St
6th: Tyler Sash (S) Iowa
6th: Jacquian Williams (LB) S Florida
7th: Da'Rel Scott (RB) Maryland

This is exactly what I'm talking about.

As for some other posters' comments about the 2007 Draft Class. At this point, there is no comparison...... Aaron Ross played a major role in 2 SB wins and is still in the league..... Steve Smith was a complete stud for us while he was a Giant....Boss was a SB hero.....Bradshaw is our starting running back.....Johnson has been a solid player.....of all the players, the only one who didn't pan out was Koets, and that was injury related if I'm not mistaken.

Honestly, at this point, there is simply no comparing the 2007 Draft Class v. the 2011 Draft Class.....the 2007 class jumped right in as rookies and were a big reason the Giants won the Super Bowl.

The 2011 class had one guy - Williams - that had a major role in the last Super Bowl. And like I said in my initial post, he's the ONLY guy that has really stepped up so far.

There's still time.....if Prince and Austin can get healthy, I'd love for them to turn it on. But, so far, they are getting paid for potential.

Buddy333
09-08-2012, 09:17 PM
Well the title does have the word "horrible" in it which may be a bit extreme, but it starts by saying "so far". When Prince gets back he will start and he did show flashes last year. I have supported Austin but all the time off does have me worried. I'm hoping they can use him with limited reps this year to get his body back in football shape and have him fresh at the end of the season. JJ is not playing because of all the talent in front of him. Then with the guys picked after the 5th round, well there is no guarantee of them making any team. Lots of late round guys get cut.

joemorrisforprez
09-08-2012, 09:21 PM
Well the title does have the word "horrible" in it which may be a bit extreme, but it starts by saying "so far". When Prince gets back he will start and he did show flashes last year. I have supported Austin but all the time off does have me worried. I'm hoping they can use him with limited reps this year to get his body back in football shape and have him fresh at the end of the season. JJ is not playing because of all the talent in front of him. Then with the guys picked after the 5th round, well there is no guarantee of them making any team. Lots of late round guys get cut.

Fair point..... substitute "poor" for "horrible". But I'd say poor is even too mild a term.

So far...... one draft year has produced a good backup linebacker and an average punt returner. Maybe not "horrible", but pretty close to it.

BurnerNYG
09-08-2012, 09:24 PM
I like a good discussion like this, it's harmless if you ask me and the fact that the OP said "so far" gives it merit. What else do you guys wanna discuss...Eli's wife?

slipknottin
09-08-2012, 09:24 PM
Brewer was solid at OT during the preseason???? The guy is a disaster . . . a ****ing turnstile.

If he gets in a game at all this year, we are in SERIOUS trouble.

I thought he looked pretty good at RT. Coughlin agreed.

slipknottin
09-08-2012, 09:26 PM
Fair point..... substitute "poor" for "horrible". But I'd say poor is even too mild a term.

So far...... one draft year has produced a good backup linebacker and an average punt returner. Maybe not "horrible", but pretty close to it.

and a starting CB, and a rotational DT, and a backup OT, and a backup S, and the best ST player on the roster. And two undrafted LBs who are key players on STs.

joemorrisforprez
09-08-2012, 09:34 PM
and a starting CB, and a rotational DT, and a backup OT, and a backup S, and the best ST player on the roster. And two undrafted LBs who are key players on STs.

We have a really good backup linebacker with Williams right now.

Also.....an injured CB.....an injured backup DT.....a backup OT who can't crack a mediocre unit.....and some special teamers.

That's what we've got, so far.

slipknottin
09-08-2012, 09:42 PM
We have a really good backup linebacker with Williams right now.

Also.....an injured CB.....an injured backup DT.....a backup OT who can't crack a mediocre unit.....and some special teamers.

That's what we've got, so far.

All of which are on the team, and many of them are currently challenging for starting spots or at least rotation spots.

This is why you dont review drafts after 1 year.

As I said, you gave the 07 draft class an A, yet out of that draft, only two of those players are still on the team, only one of them is a starter.

Captain Chaos
09-08-2012, 11:09 PM
We draft players to develop their potential. One season does not give them enough time.

Definitely have to agree....

YATittle1962
09-08-2012, 11:25 PM
I like a good discussion like this, it's harmless if you ask me and the fact that the OP said "so far" gives it merit. What else do you guys wanna discuss...Eli's wife?

so what teams whole '11 draft class looks great?

especially after an almost nonexistent offseason

only one of them did not make the current roster

Redeyejedi
09-08-2012, 11:34 PM
I cant blame them for the Jernigan pick they needed a slot receiver. No way they expected Victor cruz to have a 1500 yard season. Jernigan probably wont ever contribute much because of Cruz

GMENAGAIN
09-08-2012, 11:42 PM
I thought he looked pretty good at RT. Coughlin agreed.
You need to go back and watch the tape. The guy is not an NFL player. I'll be shocked if he's on the roster next year.

BurnerNYG
09-09-2012, 12:17 AM
so what teams whole '11 draft class looks great?

especially after an almost nonexistent offseason

only one of them did not make the current rosterI don't think no team whole draft class ever looks great but a few teams like Cincinnati did luck up and drafted a few gems. The draft is a crap shoot, I understand that but I think all the OP is trying to say Is...as it stands the '11 draft class is looking a bit suspect. I don't think he carved it in stone yet...just waiting and probably growing tired of the injuries that's plaguing Prince and Austin. 2nd year and we're starting the season just like we did last year...without em in the lineup.

Hessian
09-09-2012, 12:21 AM
All I have to offer to this thread is a quality beer from squatters... hops rising a fine double IPA. Which any fan who questions his club could quaff and come to his/her senses.

joemorrisforprez
09-09-2012, 12:48 AM
I don't think no team whole draft class ever looks great but a few teams like Cincinnati did luck up and drafted a few gems. The draft is a crap shoot, I understand that but I think all the OP is trying to say Is...as it stands the '11 draft class is looking a bit suspect. I don't think he carved it in stone yet...just waiting and probably growing tired of the injuries that's plaguing Prince and Austin. 2nd year and we're starting the season just like we did last year...without em in the lineup.

Exactly.

I think some people understand the purpose of qualifiers such as "thus far".....and some don't.

I can only go on what I've seen.....and "thus far" it's been a big disappointment.

And again, as for 2007....there's no contest. That was a great draft class, out of the gate.

People want to talk about how some players are no longer on the team.....that's because they were so solid the Giants were raided in free agency.....the cap situation didn't allow the Giants to retain Smith, Boss, and Ross.

Bradshaw is the starting RB, with 2 rings, DeOssie has 2 rings and is a solid long snapper.

Alford was a promising rookie that blew out his knee...... but when he had his shot on the big stage, he made it count. Koets was a backup when the starting offensive line was actually good....but he got injured and that was that.

Johnson was a good safety...he started 35 games for the Giants, and then Reese broke the bank for Rolle, and Johnson was expendable.

Again....the 2007 Draft Class jumped in and immediately contributed: Ross, Boss, Bradshaw, Johnson, and Smith all had major parts in SB42.

As for needing more time to judge a draft class.....that might be true. But I'd argue the longer you need to wait, the less likely it's a good class.

It was pretty self-evident to everyone following football that the 2007 Giants Draft Class had stepped up in a big way, as rookies.....see the link below for an example.

http://sports.espn.go.com/nfl/playoffs07/columns/story?columnist=chadiha_jeff&id=3221900