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View Full Version : a look at the 49ers wins + loss



sheepdip
10-10-2012, 03:31 PM
GB - Ran the ball as a team 14 times and that includes Rogers scrambling 5 times, basically they ran by design 9 times. ???
Lions - Ran the ball 26 times and 2 were with Stafford scrambling, 8 point loss.
minny - ran the ball 30 + times, ball control time of possession nothing deep and WIN.
Jets- ran the ball 17 times and a couple were from Tebow. Blowout loss
Bills - ran 19 times with the QB 2 times. Blow out!!

Run the ball 30 + times seems like the logical thing to do. The running game doesnt have to yield 4 -5 yards a carry to be effective.
Thats what I would do, force our will and be just as physical, send a message. Maybe that will inspire our Defense that seems to be a sleep at times.

I remember years back playing in Pitts and our team came out really physical and we beat them. This to me seems like the same type of game.

njg85m
10-10-2012, 03:36 PM
Run to not only wear them down and control the clock but also to open up some deep balls off of play action.

Buddy333
10-10-2012, 03:39 PM
The defense can not let up huge scoring plays like they have in all but one game so far though. If they get behind they will abandon the running game. The defense has to play better.

burier
10-10-2012, 03:46 PM
Guy...Minni has a better defense than we have so they can play that style. We have to score the ball early and often or we lose unless that defense suddenly shows up which we've all been waiting for all season.

TuckandRolle
10-10-2012, 04:24 PM
We won't be winning or losing this game based on how our offense performs. Its our defense that needs to stop their offense. We are averaging 30.4 points a game right now, I firmly believe our offense can score on any defense in this league. Yes consistent balance is a must I agree, but our defense can not give up big plays. If they do, we lose the game.

njg85m
10-10-2012, 04:34 PM
We won't be winning or losing this game based on how our offense performs.

Tampa game?

slipknottin
10-10-2012, 05:18 PM
Teams run the ball more when they have the lead. Obviously the teams who run the ball the most will have the closest score or the lead

pino
10-10-2012, 05:19 PM
Easier said than done. Minny ran it 30+ times because they have AP, and AP ran it well. We can run it 30+ times, but how successful would that be?

That said, I agree that we have to at least run the ball to keep the defense honest. We shouldn't abandon it just because we are not averaging 4.5 yards a carry. The longer we keep that defense on the field, the better.

Cloud57
10-10-2012, 05:24 PM
The key to winning is defense, our defense has to show up and play well. If our defense allows the 49ers to score a lot of points then it will be hard to catch up against their defense. If it's a low scoring game like it was during the playoffs then we have a good chance of winning. Keep in mind that we are the underdogs so that should help.

SF49erfan
10-10-2012, 05:26 PM
I agree, the way to beat the 49ers is to run at them all game. With that said, it's not an easy thing to do especially with them playing at home. It just doesn't happen. If the Giants want to win this game they're going to have to stop our run game first because the 49ers like to milk the clock which will keep Manning on the sidelines. The 49ers for some reason didn't run as much against the Vikings and it cost them.

slipknottin
10-10-2012, 05:34 PM
I agree, the way to beat the 49ers is to run at them all game. With that said, it's not an easy thing to do especially with them playing at home. It just doesn't happen. If the Giants want to win this game they're going to have to stop our run game first because the 49ers like to milk the clock which will keep Manning on the sidelines. The 49ers for some reason didn't run as much against the Vikings and it cost them.

They didnt run as much because they were playing from behind all game!

When teams get the lead, they sit back and run the ball more, when they are behind they pass more.

People have such trouble with this cause and effect thing.

SF49erfan
10-10-2012, 05:36 PM
They didnt run as much because they were playing from behind all game! This is very simple.

When teams get the lead, they sit back and run the ball more, when they are behind they pass more.

That's not true. They came out throwing and never looked back. They weren't trailing by enough to abandon the run.

slipknottin
10-10-2012, 05:37 PM
That's not true. They came out throwing and never looked back. They weren't trailing by enough to abandon the run.

They came out throwing because they were down 7 nothing early in the game.

All this stuff about teams who run the ball 30+ times win most of the time is nonsense. Teams who are winning the game run the ball more.

SF49erfan
10-10-2012, 05:39 PM
They came out throwing because they were down 7 nothing early in the game.

All this stuff about teams who run the ball 30+ times win most of the time is nonsense. Teams who are winning the game run the ball more.

That's not why they came out thowing. Trailing by seven? C'mon man.

slipknottin
10-10-2012, 05:40 PM
That's not why they came out thowing. Trailing by seven? C'mon man.

How many times have the 49ers been playing from behind this season? Think about it.

They do not know how to play when they are behind, they immediately start going to the pass and try to regain the lead or tie, where they settle back down and start running.

SF49erfan
10-10-2012, 05:43 PM
How many times have the 49ers been playing from behind this season? Think about it.

They do not know how to play when they are behind, they immediately start going to the pass and try to regain the lead or tie, where they settle back down and start running.

I watch every snap of every game. Sometimes I rewatch the games 2-3 times. They run no matter what. Unless it's two minute drill or they are trailing by alot which hasn't happened it two years.

slipknottin
10-10-2012, 05:45 PM
I watch every snap of every game. Sometimes I rewatch the games 2-3 times. They run no matter what. Unless it's two minute drill or they are trailing by alot which hasn't happened it two years.

let me ask again, which games have they been playing from behind this season.

Ill wait.

SF49erfan
10-10-2012, 05:46 PM
Frank Gore 12 carries
Kendall Hunter 4 carries...That's not 49er football....

SF49erfan
10-10-2012, 05:46 PM
let me ask again, which games have they been playing from behind this season.

Ill wait.

They don't trail in games, but what's your point? They're still going to run the ball...

Here you go...Going back to last season they only trailed by 10 or more once and that was vs the Eagles in 2011, week 4..They trailed 21-3...guess what? They still ran the ball!

slipknottin
10-10-2012, 05:47 PM
They don't trail in games, but what's your point? They're still going to run the ball...

That is my point. They run the ball because they dont trail in games.

The one time they were playing all game from behind, they did not run the ball.

Somehow you are saying this exact thing, but dont believe it. Which is odd. Teams run the ball when they feel comfortable, either their defense is playing great and the game is very close, or they are comfortably in the lead. When they are behind, they press and throw the ball more. Can see this with nearly every team every week. Especially with run first teams.

slipknottin
10-10-2012, 05:51 PM
They trailed 21-3...guess what? They still ran the ball!

They ran the ball 25 times. Including an Alex Smith run. They passed the ball 33 times.

TheEnigma
10-10-2012, 05:52 PM
We can't really afford to run the ball as much as the Vikings did since they have a top 5 RB. I understand AP isn't exactly up to 100% health just yet but he's still one of those players who can make any defense look stupid. We need to rely on our strengths in the passing game with Cruz and Nicks (hopefully) and sprinkle in the runs when we can.

SF49erfan
10-10-2012, 05:54 PM
That is my point. They run the ball because they dont trail in games.

The one time they were playing all game from behind, they did not run the ball.

Somehow you are saying this exact thing, but dont believe it. Which is odd. Teams run the ball when they feel comfortable, either their defense is playing great and the game is very close, or they are comfortably in the lead. When they are behind, they press and throw the ball more. Can see this with nearly every team every week. Especially with run first teams.

True, teams that are trailing pass more than run. I know that..But, they do this only in the 4th quarter, Or if the run game isn't working, Or they are trailing by a million points like the Bills were. The 49ers are not like any team in the NFL. They RUN, RUN, RUN...That's how they play football..Trailing 7-0 to the Vikings in the first 5 minutes of the game is not why they abandoned the run.

slipknottin
10-10-2012, 05:55 PM
The 49ers are not like any team in the NFL. They RUN, RUN, RUN...

They run run run because they are the one team who is never trailing. Put them in games where they are playing from behind often, and I bet you they go pass pass pass!

SF49erfan
10-10-2012, 05:56 PM
They ran the ball 25 times. Including an Alex Smith run. They passed the ball 33 times.

Ok, so there you go....34 pass plays(not including the sacks) to 25 running plays..That's almost a 50/50 ratio. Does that sound like a team that was trailing 21-3 at halftime?

SF49erfan
10-10-2012, 05:57 PM
They run run run because they are the one team who is never trailing. Put them in games where they are playing from behind often, and I bet you they go pass pass pass!

I just told you. The Eagles game last year. On the game winning drive it was Frank Gore that carried them down the field for the go ahead TD. Not Alex Smith's arm.

BParcells777
10-10-2012, 05:58 PM
I just told you. The Eagles game last year. On the game winning drive it was Frank Gore that carried them down the field for the go ahead TD. Not Alex Smith's arm. what a shocker

run gore all night.........mr 9 yds per giants game LOL

slipknottin
10-10-2012, 05:58 PM
Ok, so there you go....34 pass plays(not including the sacks) to 25 running plays..That's almost a 50/50 ratio. Does that sound like a team that was trailing 21-3 at halftime?

And they went pass heavy until they were caught up, then proceeded to go run run run! Compare their 3rd quarter where they ran the ball like 4 times, to the 4th, where they ran the ball like 12 times, including 5 times on the final posession when they were killing the clock. They were pass heavy that game by far

SF49erfan
10-10-2012, 05:59 PM
The only two times I remember the 49ers abandoning the run was against the Giants in the NFCCG last year and against the Vikings this year. Guess what? They lost both games. The strength of this team is the running game. They run the ball like no team in the NFL.

slipknottin
10-10-2012, 06:00 PM
I just told you. The Eagles game last year. On the game winning drive it was Frank Gore that carried them down the field for the go ahead TD. Not Alex Smith's arm.

Frank Gore got the ball twice on that drive... Smith twice that...

SF49erfan
10-10-2012, 06:02 PM
And they went pass heavy until they were caught up, then proceeded to go run run run! Compare their 3rd quarter where they ran the ball like 4 times, to the 4th, where they ran the ball like 12 times, including 5 times on the final posession when they were killing the clock. They were pass heavy that game by far

You saw the ratio..
But trailing 21-3 in the third and trailing 7-0 with 10 min in the first quarter are two different things. How could you say they abandoned the run because they were trailing 7-0? You obviously don't watch 49er football.

BParcells777
10-10-2012, 06:03 PM
we would prefer you run all night

SF49erfan
10-10-2012, 06:04 PM
Frank Gore got the ball twice on that drive... Smith twice that...

What about Kendall Hunter?

SF49erfan
10-10-2012, 06:04 PM
we would prefer you run all night

If this happens its not a good sign.

slipknottin
10-10-2012, 06:05 PM
You saw the ratio..
But trailing 21-3 in the third and trailing 7-0 with 10 min in the first quarter are two different things. How could you say they abandoned the run because they were trailing 7-0? You obviously don't watch 49er football.

They were pass heavy that entire game! Not including the final posession where they were icing the clock, they had 33 passes to 19 runs. Thats nowhere near 50/50, or what the 49ers usually do.

Look at this season for comparison, 161 running plays to 95 passing plays.

They are a run heavy team because they can afford to be. If they are playing from behind, which is very rare, they become a pass heavy team. The stats are all there for you to see.

slipknottin
10-10-2012, 06:05 PM
What about Kendall Hunter?

Once.

SF49erfan
10-10-2012, 06:08 PM
They were pass heavy that entire game! Not including the final posession where they were icing the clock, they had 33 passes to 19 runs. Thats nowhere near 50/50, or what the 49ers usually do.

Look at this season for comparison, 161 running plays to 95 passing plays.

They are a run heavy team because they can afford to be. If they are playing from behind, which is very rare, they become a pass heavy team. The stats are all there for you to see.

Lets start over...You said the 49ers went against their usual gameplan because they were trailing the Vikings 7-0, right?

slipknottin
10-10-2012, 06:08 PM
Also vs. the Saints in the post season. Very pass heavy that game despite being ahead early. 42 passes to like 20 runs.

slipknottin
10-10-2012, 06:09 PM
Lets start over...You said the 49ers went against their usual gameplan because they were trailing the Vikings 7-0, right?

every game the 49ers have been behind in they pass far more than they run.

You said they run more than anyone else, and they do, because they are never behind.

SF49erfan
10-10-2012, 06:13 PM
every game the 49ers have been behind in they pass far more than they run.

You said they run more than anyone else, and they do, because they are never behind.

Yes, but trailing 7-0 is not a reason to come out and pass 10 out of 13 plays. That's not 49er football.

slipknottin
10-10-2012, 06:14 PM
Yes, but trailing 7-0 is not a reason to come out and pass 10 out of 13 plays. That's not 49er football.

On the other hand, maybe it is, considering we have only seen them trailing in two games, and both of those were pass heavy.

SF49erfan
10-10-2012, 06:16 PM
On the other hand, maybe it is, considering we have only seen them trailing in two games, and both of those were pass heavy.

They have trailed by 7 points in plenty of games, but trailing by 7+ in the 4th quarter with little time remaining and trailing by 7 after the first drive are two completely different scenarios. The point is, the 49ers had a gameplan against the Vikings and that was to pass heavy from the get go. It didn't work, because Alex Smith can't carry the team all by himself, he needs the running game to be working...With that said, teams don't shut down the 49ers run game, but when they do the 49ers have a hard time. That's how the Giants win this game. Shut down the running game. I'll give them a 10% to do so, which means i'll give the Giants a 10% chance of winning.

crossouttheeyes
10-10-2012, 06:16 PM
The Giants will not run the ball 30+ times this game. That would be playing right into the 49ers hands. They want to get us into a clock control game, because nobody can beat them in a clock control game.

As good as the Giants running game has looked lately, that was against the Browns, not the best defenses in the league. It's important to establish some run game to keep pressure off of Eli, but the only way the Giants will win this game is to score early and often using the passing game. We need to get ahead and force Alex Smith to throw the ball, a lot. Their run game and defense are too good when you get down. They're probably the hardest team in the league to come back on. We need to sling it effectively and make Alex Smith get into a shootout with Eli. That's the only way we win this game. Our best player is named Eli Manning, not Adrien Peterson. We can't play the Vikings game and beat the Niners.

SF49erfan
10-10-2012, 06:25 PM
The Giants will not run the ball 30+ times this game. That would be playing right into the 49ers hands. They want to get us into a clock control game, because nobody can beat them in a clock control game.

As good as the Giants running game has looked lately, that was against the Browns, not the best defenses in the league. It's important to establish some run game to keep pressure off of Eli, but the only way the Giants will win this game is to score early and often using the passing game. We need to get ahead and force Alex Smith to throw the ball, a lot. Their run game and defense are too good when you get down. They're probably the hardest team in the league to come back on. We need to sling it effectively and make Alex Smith get into a shootout with Eli. That's the only way we win this game. Our best player is named Eli Manning, not Adrien Peterson. We can't play the Vikings game and beat the Niners.

I expect Eli to throw the ball 50+ times in this game. The 49ers secondary is much improved this year so we'll see...As long as Eli doesn't throw INTs this should be a close game. I think he will throw a couple so I have the 49ers winning 30-14.

slipknottin
10-10-2012, 06:28 PM
They have trailed by 7 points in plenty of games

except that they havent. They have not been trailing in a game at all this season apart from the Vikings game.

SF49erfan
10-10-2012, 06:29 PM
except that they havent. They have not been trailing in a game at all this season apart from the Vikings game.

It's only five games, so I'm talking about last season too. They trailed the Bills 3-0..Lions too I think.

crossouttheeyes
10-10-2012, 06:34 PM
He's definitely gonna be throwing it 40+ times. I believe Eli and the Giants passing game has improved since our last meeting and I don't expect anything but a close game. The 49ers know how to force turnovers, but I don't see Eli throwing any picks in this game. He knows that any mistake against this 49ers team will probably be fatal (plus Manningham is now on the opposite sideline running the wrong routes :lol:). I expect this one to go to the bitter end. These two teams are in my opinion the class of the NFC, and neither of them will go down lightly.

This is becoming a nice rivalry in the NFC and I have great respect for this 49ers team and their fans. Good luck on Sunday and hopefully we can steal another one from you guys at Candlestick.

SF49erfan
10-10-2012, 06:37 PM
Having Bennett is the reason why the passing game has improved. I can't wait to see how the 49er cover him.

slipknottin
10-10-2012, 06:38 PM
Having Bennett is the reason why the passing game has improved. I can't wait to see how the 49er cover him.

The pass blocking is the difference, Bennett is nice, but has not been a major factor the past couple weeks.

giantsfan420
10-10-2012, 07:14 PM
Having Bennett is the reason why the passing game has improved. I can't wait to see how the 49er cover him.
past 2 weeks we've asked him to do a lot more blocking. he still has made several catches tho. and i was a lil surprised bc i thought bennett may have helped ease the nicks loss but dont really know

giantsfan420
10-10-2012, 07:16 PM
It's only five games, so I'm talking about last season too. They trailed the Bills 3-0..Lions too I think.

lol dont think thats quite what he means when saying trailing and u guys abandon the run game...

crossouttheeyes
10-10-2012, 07:17 PM
The pass blocking is the difference, Bennett is nice, but has not been a major factor the past couple weeks.
This, Nicks and Bennet are both questionable for this game however. If they're out, I think it might be R.I.P. Giants.

giantsfan420
10-10-2012, 07:17 PM
I expect Eli to throw the ball 50+ times in this game. The 49ers secondary is much improved this year so we'll see...As long as Eli doesn't throw INTs this should be a close game. I think he will throw a couple so I have the 49ers winning 30-14.
i have smith with 2 ints and a lost fumble, with us winning 24-17

crossouttheeyes
10-10-2012, 07:18 PM
i have smith with 2 ints and a loss fumble, with us winning 24-17
Not happening. Smith doesn't win many games but he also doesn't make many mistakes.

SF49erfan
10-10-2012, 07:24 PM
Not happening. Smith doesn't win many games but he also doesn't make many mistakes.

This

chuckedafter5yards
10-10-2012, 07:46 PM
Keep in mind the horrible field in SF, it's the worst surface in the whole league.

giantsfan420
10-10-2012, 09:00 PM
Not happening. Smith doesn't win many games but he also doesn't make many mistakes.
really?

i know but football doesn't always go according to script. I beliee our DL is gonna wake up and wreak HAVOC. that will force Smith into making mistakes he normally wouldn't. Plus I also believe we're gonna jump out to a lil lead like 10-0, and it will force SF to take more chances as well.

oddly enough I believe one of the ints will be off a tipped pass by MM...

Parademon
10-10-2012, 11:58 PM
Like in most games, I think the team that wins the battle in the trenches & the turnover battle wins the game.

Hessian
10-11-2012, 12:33 AM
I believe the key to this game is the amount of beer I can consume. If I can out drink SF fan(should be easy) we win this game hands down. :P

Joe Morrison
10-11-2012, 02:50 AM
The 49ers have surprised me so far but reality set in in Minnesota a little, when you lose a game like that you kind of lose the aura that you are unbeatable, and trouncing the Jets was no big deal. Expect to see another rought game, close to the vest for the most part with the better QB coming out on top in the end.

Rat_bastich
10-11-2012, 04:21 AM
The 49ers have surprised me so far but reality set in in Minnesota a little, when you lose a game like that you kind of lose the aura that you are unbeatable, and trouncing the Jets was no big deal. Expect to see another rought game, close to the vest for the most part with the better QB coming out on top in the end.

The one thing the 49ers have over us though is consistency. Every week their defense plays tough and their offense isn't a slouch either. For us, we don't know who is coming. We went from having an abysmal running game to having a ranked one in one game. Our defense is streaky and hasn't gotten much pressure throughout. If the Giants are clicking on all cylinders then this will be a win, but if one facet doesn't show up then it will be a nightmare.

sheepdip
10-15-2012, 08:47 AM
Looks like Sheepdip was right as usual !!!