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Kruunch
10-22-2012, 02:46 PM
... but while we are #24 in total defense, we are #9 in points scored against.

I have absolutely no faith in our defense BUT they do seem to make the stops (most times) when they need to. Like one of those bad action movies where the hero diffuses the bomb with a microsecond left on the timer.

What are your thoughts on our defense and Perry Fewell?

JimC
10-22-2012, 02:53 PM
Certainly something to be concerned about. It needs to improve as well as our running game.

GameTime
10-22-2012, 02:58 PM
I have faith because they seem to come up with big playts at times. 5-2 I cant really complain much. The pics put them in two bad situations yesterday.
They kept the score close and the O was able to win it. They also held Morris quiet in the 2nd half.

Buddy333
10-22-2012, 02:59 PM
I've been defending them but I'm getting tired of doing so. I think they have talent but are not consistent. At least they made adjustments yesterday, started to get pressure on the QB, and force some TO's.

JB456
10-22-2012, 03:12 PM
Certainly something to be concerned about. It needs to improve as well as our running game.

I don't think anything can be gleaned about the running game from Sundays game. There wasn't any real attempt to establish a running game.

Rudyy
10-22-2012, 03:14 PM
They just aren't consistent. At times they look like the number one defense in the league, and then the worst. So I don't know, I hope they show up Sunday.

GMENAGAIN
10-22-2012, 03:15 PM
I give them a pass yesterday because they faced a very unique player for the first time.

No excuses this week though . . . .

Kruunch
10-22-2012, 03:17 PM
I have faith because they seem to come up with big playts at times. 5-2 I cant really complain much. The pics put them in two bad situations yesterday.
They kept the score close and the O was able to win it. They also held Morris quiet in the 2nd half.

I agree, although my "faith" probably looks more like "closing my eyes and crossing my fingers". Unfortunately, Fewell's game plan often seems to consist of the same.

BUT you are right ... they get the job done, one way or the other.

I'd just like to get through some of these games without punting my cat through the window, ya know?

Toadofsteel
10-22-2012, 03:17 PM
This year the defense seems more worried about generating the turnovers when there's open field behind them. It's only at the goal line where they become 100% committed to all out stopping the offense. It's nice enough when the turnovers happen, but if not, then our defense is usually sunk.

I wish we could generate the pass rush we could last year. It was nice to see that again vs the 49ers, but other than that our pass rush has been largely non-existent... seems like PF is starting to truly mold this defense in his image.

giantsfam04
10-22-2012, 03:18 PM
The stats that matter the most when discussing defense are points allowed and 3rd down percentage.

Fee-fi-fo-fum
10-22-2012, 03:19 PM
What are your thoughts on our defense and Perry Fewell?

Bottom line is points scored against, I suppose. Our defense, under Fewell, seems to be "Bend-Don't-Break" with a lot of "Read and React". We always seem to be two steps behind the opposing offense, one step for "reading" and another for "reacting". We always seem to be keeping our defense on the field forever. We cannot, for whatever reason, put an end to drives unless the opposing offense screws up - even on 3rd or 4th and very long. If you are a fan of the defensive game - which I am - then it is very difficult to watch. I like defensive domination, hard hits, and big turnovers. What we have is conservative, almost afraid. We play between the 20's and then tighten up a bit. Never risk surrendering a big play. I'd prefer if the defense dictated the game. When we ****-canned the read and react last year, the defense woke up and began to command the games - all the way through the Superbowl. Seems like this year we start out trying to succeed with what failed us last year. We changed up a lot of stuff against SF, then apparently resorted to the same old BS against the 4Skins - who - if they were really any good - should have beaten us silly with four quarters of running the ball down our throats. We made some personnel adjustments at the half, which is more adjusting than I usually see. I felt we needed to make adjustments during the first drive yesterday. A better team would have beat our defense silly and used the clock up. I think Fewell is pretty good, I don't mind him compared to some others before him, but I think- or so it seems - that he tries too hard for too long to get the player personnel to rise up to his schemes when they really cannot, both in-game and over the course of the season. As we simplify, we allow for more aggressive play and that seems to serve us well. I wouldn't fire PF, just hope he gets to making adjustments sooner rather than later.

Kruunch
10-22-2012, 03:20 PM
The stats that matter the most when discussing defense are points allowed and 3rd down percentage.

I agree about points ... not so sure I agree about 3rd down percentage (especially if you're giving up a lot of yards on first and second down to not even get to a third down).

However the Giants are #6 in 3rd down percentage.

Soooooo ....

slipknottin
10-22-2012, 03:23 PM
Blackburn was AWFUL again. But everyone will talk about how he got the fumble at the end, and ignore that the entire first half he got absolutely whipped by the redskins linemen and Morris.

JB456
10-22-2012, 03:26 PM
Blackburn was AWFUL again. But everyone will talk about how he got the fumble at the end, and ignore that the entire first half he got absolutely whipped by the redskins linemen and Morris.

Blackburn does many things well but tackling fast and agile QBs isn't one of them.

slipknottin
10-22-2012, 03:29 PM
Blackburn does many things well but tackling fast and agile QBs isn't one of them.

Morris isn't agile at all. I think that entire game Blackburn got off a block twice

Mercury
10-22-2012, 03:41 PM
In their defense, the Redskin offense has been very good this year. That was a fired up team we faced, hungry for the victory and to seize first place in the division. But I agree for the most part. I hated seeing the large chunks of yardage given up, especially the yards after contact.

Kruunch
10-22-2012, 03:41 PM
Blackburn was AWFUL again. But everyone will talk about how he got the fumble at the end, and ignore that the entire first half he got absolutely whipped by the redskins linemen and Morris.

6 tackles (tied most), 4 assists (second highest) and 2 forced fumbles (most).

I think your expectations and personal vendetta against Blackburn may be clouding your vision a tad.

Kruunch
10-22-2012, 03:42 PM
Morris isn't agile at all. I think that entire game Blackburn got off a block twice

Zone blocking ... also known as Hold You Where the Refs Can't See Blocking.

Defensive players should grease their shoulder pads.

TheEnigma
10-22-2012, 03:43 PM
6 tackles (tied most), 4 assists (second highest) and 2 forced fumbles (most).

I think your expectations and personal vendetta against Blackburn may be clouding your vision a tad.

Tackles don't tell anything on the surface. Where did he make the tackle? Did he allow a completion in his coverage before said tackle? Did he struggle to get off a block before making a tackle 10 yards deep? etc.

Plus how much credit does he get for the FF? In his interview, he explained that he was going for the hit and felt the ball was loose. Sounds like Moss has a poor handle on the football.

giantsfam04
10-22-2012, 03:44 PM
I agree about points ... not so sure I agree about 3rd down percentage (especially if you're giving up a lot of yards on first and second down to not even get to a third down).

However the Giants are #6 in 3rd down percentage.

Soooooo ....

That's what I was trying to get at, as long as your not giving up points and can get off the field on 3rd down then to me the rest is not as important.

Kruunch
10-22-2012, 03:48 PM
Tackles don't tell anything on the surface. Where did he make the tackle? Did he allow a completion in his coverage before said tackle? Did he struggle to get off a block before making a tackle 10 yards deep? etc.

Plus how much credit does he get for the FF? In his interview, he explained that he was going for the hit and felt the ball was loose. Sounds like Moss has a poor handle on the football.

Did you watch the game? Blackburn had a *good* game. Granted the Redskins ran up and down our throats in the first half, but there were 10 other guys on the field not getting off of blocks either. In the second half we adjusted fairly well and that non-sense stopped by and large.

The flip side of that is when we needed a big time play, Blackburn stepped up, not once, but twice (the second time sealing the game). And that second FF was all Blackburn ... Moss was securing the ball the second he got it and Blackburn still stripped it away from him.

I agree he's not the fastest and or most athletically gifted LBer ... not by a long shot ... but he comes through when we need him too. Like Eli, those kinds of performances don't give you flashy stats, but they do put a check in the WIN column.

JB456
10-22-2012, 03:48 PM
Morris isn't agile at all. I think that entire game Blackburn got off a block twice

Nah, I was talking about RGIII and Newton when he got lose. You are right though, Morris did abuse us and made RGIII even more effective.

Giant stuck in Texas
10-22-2012, 03:51 PM
Eli had them on the field a lot longer then they needed to be yesterday. Even with that in mind, I feel that the secondary as a whole has been doing a ****ty job tackling and getting of blocks.

TheEnigma
10-22-2012, 03:55 PM
Did you watch the game? Blackburn had a *good* game. Granted the Redskins ran up and down our throats in the first half, but there were 10 other guys on the field not getting off of blocks either. In the second half we adjusted fairly well and that non-sense stopped by and large.

The flip side of that is when we needed a big time play, Blackburn stepped up, not once, but twice (the second time sealing the game). And that second FF was all Blackburn ... Moss was securing the ball the second he got it and Blackburn still stripped it away from him.

I agree he's not the fastest and or most athletically gifted LBer ... not by a long shot ... but he comes through when we need him too. Like Eli, those kinds of performances don't give you flashy stats, but they do put a check in the WIN column.

Yes I watched the game. I'd like to know what you saw from him that constituted as a "good" game because what I saw from him was the inability to shed blocks and be a factor against RG3 (slightly excused since it was the D's first time dealing with him). The play of the other members on D has nothing to do with Chase here since we are talking about him. A big play or two does not erase the other 59 minutes of football that the player was involved in. That is the issue I've had with Chase for the longest - He wouldn't have to make these "splash" plays if he had a more sound and consistent performance earlier in the game yet everyone just remembers the one play and calls it a day. Same thing with the Browns game - Everyone will remember his INT in the end zone against a poor read by Weeden but not how much he was abused in stopping the run against Richardson.

Giant stuck in Texas
10-22-2012, 03:56 PM
Blackburn was AWFUL again. But everyone will talk about how he got the fumble at the end, and ignore that the entire first half he got absolutely whipped by the redskins linemen and Morris.Ohhh, get off that bus already, everyone knows your anti Blackburn. The whole entire secondary can't get off blocks.

And for the record it was Hosley who recovered that fumble at the end, not Blackburn.

gumby74
10-22-2012, 04:05 PM
Good analogy by the Aikman and company was a reference to the Saints SB run a few years back. Their defense was absolute crap, but they came up with timely turnovers when push came to shove. I have 0 faith in our defense. Funny thing is I got ripped on shortly after the SB win when I said this.

moosedrool
10-22-2012, 04:14 PM
Funny how the defense held SF to 3 points in Candlestick 8 days ago and now the defense is a problem. The reality is, this defense and coordinator always struggle against mobile QB's like Vick and RG III, but beat Brady and Rodgers in the playoffs. I just hope we don't face Vick or RG III in the playoffs.

Blackburn is awful against the run. He can't get off blocks and misses tackles. But, he is decent in pass coverage and does enough to stay on the field. And with our offense, that is good enough to win.

slipknottin
10-22-2012, 04:23 PM
Blackburn had a *good* game..

You cant be serious. Blackburn got his butt whipped.

slipknottin
10-22-2012, 04:25 PM
Ohhh, get off that bus already, everyone knows your anti Blackburn. The whole entire secondary can't get off blocks.

And for the record it was Hosley who recovered that fumble at the end, not Blackburn.

I meant he forced it, not recovered it.

Yes, I have some personal vendetta, I dont like watching the giants starting MLB get pushed around all game. The redskins absolutely targeted and beat the snot out of him.

I just cant understand why everyone makes excuses for him, he misses like 6 tackles against the browns in the first half, but thats no big deal because he made an interception at the end of the game?

No, its a huge deal, he has to be able to shed and make tackles to be a starting LB in the NFL, its inexcusable to play someone so bad.

thomsoad
10-22-2012, 04:27 PM
... but while we are #24 in total defense, we are #9 in points scored against.

I have absolutely no faith in our defense BUT they do seem to make the stops (most times) when they need to. Like one of those bad action movies where the hero diffuses the bomb with a microsecond left on the timer.

What are your thoughts on our defense and Perry Fewell?

Its been well documented that Fewell runs a "bend but dont break" style of Defense.
So its to be expected total yards to be below average...the upside is suppose to be fewer points and more turnovers.
Bend Dont Break Defenses look lousy on paper but does not necessarily mean a bad Defense.

fansince69
10-22-2012, 04:30 PM
sorry guys ...anyone who is clinging to the stance that Blackburn is good....can not really be watching these games.....1 or 2 good plays does not override incompetence for the rest of the game

TheEnigma
10-22-2012, 04:34 PM
sorry guys ...anyone who is clinging to the stance that Blackburn is good....can not really be watching these games.....1 or 2 good plays does not override incompetence for the rest of the game

I think it comes down to how much people value these big plays versus the rest of the player's body of work. Some will see Eli's game winning TD to Cruz as he had a good day because he won the game at the end but others will put more stock into the 2nd INT that Eli had where the LB snuck into the window and made the INT or the various throws he had that where off target. People are entitled to their opinions.

fansince69
10-22-2012, 04:42 PM
I think it comes down to how much people value these big plays versus the rest of the player's body of work. Some will see Eli's game winning TD to Cruz as he had a good day because he won the game at the end but others will put more stock into the 2nd INT that Eli had where the LB snuck into the window and made the INT or the various throws he had that where off target. People are entitled to their opinions.

Actually good analogies.....except that even though Eli does have some games where hell make stupid plays and come back at the end and make the great play to make us forget( like Blackburn)


he will then string some great games together

the difference is Blackburn does not have have great games...he just makes a few good/great plays

Giant stuck in Texas
10-22-2012, 04:42 PM
I meant he forced it, not recovered it.

Yes, I have some personal vendetta, I dont like watching the giants starting MLB get pushed around all game. The redskins absolutely targeted and beat the snot out of him.

I just cant understand why everyone makes excuses for him, he misses like 6 tackles against the browns in the first half, but thats no big deal because he made an interception at the end of the game?

No, its a huge deal, he has to be able to shed and make tackles to be a starting LB in the NFL, its inexcusable to play someone so bad. LOL. You said it was 8 tackles PER game. I'm still waiting on those stats btw.

slipknottin
10-22-2012, 04:43 PM
LOL. You said it was 8 tackles PER game. I'm still waiting on those stats btw.

You spent 10 pages on that thread not understanding he missed 8 tackles in A game. Lets start that in another thread again!

Buddy333
10-22-2012, 04:45 PM
I like the guy and all but they need speed out there. Notice how they played Rivers more in the second half? They missed Williams yesterday too.

moosedrool
10-22-2012, 04:46 PM
I just checked PFF inside LB ratings. For the 46 ILB's that have played enough snaps to qualify, Blackburn is rated LAST. I didn't think he would rate that bad, but it confirms what my eyes have been seeing. The problem is, I don't think we have anyone better. Herzlich may be better against the run, but I doubt he would be better in pass coverage.

TheEnigma
10-22-2012, 04:48 PM
Actually good analogies.....except that even though Eli does have some games where hell make stupid plays and come back at the end and make the great play to make us forget( like Blackburn)


he will then string some great games together

the difference is Blackburn does not have have great games...he just makes a few good/great plays

Well I'll admit that he did have a pretty good game against the Patriots in the SB. Granted that he benefited tremendously from covering a hurt Gronk on that play but it was still phenomenal that someone with his lack of athleticism still made that deep pass INT. I'll just say that anytime the opposing offense has a physical and athletic beast like an RG3 or Trent Richardson, I don't feel too good about Chase out there.

slipknottin
10-22-2012, 04:50 PM
I just checked PFF inside LB ratings. For the 46 ILB's that have played enough snaps to qualify, Blackburn is rated LAST. I didn't think he would rate that bad, but it confirms what my eyes have been seeing. The problem is, I don't think we have anyone better. Herzlich may be better against the run, but I doubt he would be better in pass coverage.

Thats the thing with Blackburn, he is usually in the right spot. He doesnt often make mental mistakes, at least not significant ones. He just can not shed blocks or make tackles when he has to.

Giant stuck in Texas
10-22-2012, 05:02 PM
You spent 10 pages on that thread not understanding he missed 8 tackles in A game. Lets start that in another thread again!That is NOT what you wrote and Gametime called you out for the same thing but, I abandoned that argument weeks ago.



Lets start that in another thread again!
I would rather go deaf listening to different renditions of the YMCA song http://www.freesmileys.org/smileys/smiley-merv/ymca.gif (http://www.freesmileys.org/smileys.php) then to rehash that gigantic waste of time.

slipknottin
10-22-2012, 05:03 PM
That is NOT what you wrote and Gametime called you out for the same thing but, I abandoned that argument weeks ago.

Only to just bring it up again now? Seems you havent abandoned anything.

Giant stuck in Texas
10-22-2012, 05:40 PM
Only to just bring it up again now? Seems you havent abandoned anything.Consider it more of a reminder.

Drez
10-22-2012, 05:50 PM
I give them a pass yesterday because they faced a very unique player for the first time.

No excuses this week though . . . .
Romo should seem like Bernie Kosar after facing RG3, lol.

giant-4-life
10-22-2012, 05:53 PM
We have capable players, but lackluster coaching

slipknottin
10-22-2012, 06:14 PM
Consider it more of a reminder.

A reminder that I left out a "a" once? Oh noes.

giantsfam04
10-22-2012, 06:24 PM
We are overlooking one important fact, TC and PF trust him. TC even said so during the presser today and addressed Herzlic (sp) say he will be a good mike backer because he is learning from a good mike backer.

egyptian420
10-22-2012, 06:35 PM
I'm pretty sure he's going to remain our MLB until either Herzlich takes the spot from him or we draft another late draft sleeper. I don't see us bringing in a high profile free agent or drafting one in the first round of the draft unless he truly is the BPA.

rtlax
10-22-2012, 06:57 PM
I want to see what happens in the next Skins game before I comment. There is only one team in the league that can do what they did to us yesterday, perhaps after seeing it once our guys can make the necessary adjustments. One thing is for sure though, The G-Men are going to have to draft with RG3 in mind for the next decade.

Giant stuck in Texas
10-22-2012, 06:59 PM
A reminder that I left out a "a" once? Oh noes.Nice try, but some of us know better.

rtr1105
10-22-2012, 07:19 PM
I was happy with D-Line yesterday. JPP was good as usual and Tuck finally came alive. Canty also helped force the Tuck sack. We created turnovers in key situations which is always good. I was impressed with Kuhn as well. He doesn't give up on the play and made some stops after the ball was away from his area. Blackburn and Boley also played well at LB. There were some situations though where the Skins forced us into bad situations, either with RGIII's legs or great blocking by the O-Line. For the most part our secondary played well too. Webster was decent, I noticed some spots where he didn't know what he was doing.

Captain Chaos
10-22-2012, 07:45 PM
We do have some issues!

alentown pa
10-22-2012, 09:16 PM
... but while we are #24 in total defense, we are #9 in points scored against.

I have absolutely no faith in our defense BUT they do seem to make the stops (most times) when they need to. Like one of those bad action movies where the hero diffuses the bomb with a microsecond left on the timer.

What are your thoughts on our defense and Perry Fewell?

never been big on perry, even after the SB win...I like when we play press and let the guys up front do there thing..I saw tuck dropping in coverage yesterday and I know the skins offense was unique but rushing 3 at times frustrates me.

berya
10-22-2012, 10:42 PM
I meant he forced it, not recovered it.

Yes, I have some personal vendetta, I dont like watching the giants starting MLB get pushed around all game. The redskins absolutely targeted and beat the snot out of him.

I just cant understand why everyone makes excuses for him, he misses like 6 tackles against the browns in the first half, but thats no big deal because he made an interception at the end of the game?

No, its a huge deal, he has to be able to shed and make tackles to be a starting LB in the NFL, its inexcusable to play someone so bad.

I have no vendetta with Blackburn lol. And I agree 100% with everything above. He is not a starting LB in the NFL. Never was and never will be. There was a reason he was sitting on the couch last season. Dude is nothing but a special teams player and a backup at best. Thats it. End of story. Yes he hassles his *** off and most of us like him and give him a pass for it (myself included). But the reality of the situation is the guy blows. And like it was said above it's INEXCUSABLE to play someone so bad, especially in the starting MLB position.

SackingMyths
10-22-2012, 11:08 PM
I have no vendetta with Blackburn lol. And I agree 100% with everything above. He is not a starting LB in the NFL. Never was and never will be. There was a reason he was sitting on the couch last season. Dude is nothing but a special teams player and a backup at best. Thats it. End of story. Yes he hassles his *** off and most of us like him and give him a pass for it (myself included). But the reality of the situation is the guy blows. And like it was said above it's INEXCUSABLE to play someone so bad, especially in the starting MLB position.

I agree with all of this ^. I appreciate what Chase brings to the table with his hustle and cerebral play. He definitely gives you everything he's got each play. But he's just not strong enough, or fast enough and he's an obvious liability.

It's funny b/c he has a knack for making a big play at the end of games and washing out the memory of all the big runs he gave up prior to it. But it's plain to see. Would definitely like to see this upgraded in the offseason.

Buddy333
10-22-2012, 11:11 PM
About the rankings, they are based on yards. Not saying they have been playing great every game, but don't be fooled by stats.

FrankAE
10-23-2012, 12:56 AM
They held a team than averages 29ppg to low 20's, I say they did a pretty good job. Big hand to the secondary, no secondary can cover for as long as rg3 scrambles around like that 4th and 10 conversion. The only thing that was truley fustrating yesterday was the first Moss td, how did he run threw 10 defenders and not get touch, because video shows no one gave a great effort. The lb's did pretty good also. Really we just expect to much from the d-line. A couple sacks, fumble and pressure, they did pretty good for the day. Lets face it, Giants face vick and rg3 now for 4 games a year their bound to be tired and have diminshed numbers.

JPPgetsitdone
10-23-2012, 01:13 AM
JPP is an amazing athlete.

giantsfan420
10-23-2012, 01:48 AM
we led the league in takeaways headn into the monday night game. chicago overtook the lead tho with their 4 takeaways...our d has done pretty well imho progressing and improving. we were really injury plagued those first couple weeks...now that we're generally healthy, D has improved week in week out. 3 pts AT san fran????? and if it wasn't for 2 bad throws by eli, washington woulda had 13 pts when they avg 29...
our D is MUCH improved from last yr in the reg season...

dnotch121
10-23-2012, 03:18 AM
i dont see an area that we are good at.....most teams can stop something, we give up everything... you can run and pass on us. Something gotta change we have the saints, falcons and GB. Defense will need to tighten up

BigJ
10-23-2012, 03:24 AM
The problem with most of u on these boards is that ur love for some players on this team over shadows their actual play. Just cause everyone loves Blackburn and he plays for the Giants doesn't mean he's great. People are so offended when someone says somthing bad about a player and slip is right as much as u all hate to hear it. I love the guy but Sorry to tell u Blackburn is at his best an average MLB. He was a backup for 8 years for a reason. The three of u guys trying to get on Slip trying to nit pick at everything he writes because there isn't enough good real reasons in blackburns games to prove ur case and u try to think of any game were he did good but in reality the bad out weighs the good here. I love Blackburn but its time for a change. The D all around is actually not real good. Eli is the biggest reason we win games now compared to years ago.

GMan-67
10-23-2012, 03:58 AM
yards are not a good way to judge O or D, b/c game circumstances determine how wide open the other team has to play vs. you and whether your D is guarding against the big play instead of playing standard or aggressive

the rushing yards we gave up Sunday are obviously too many, but i attribute that to being so focused on RG3 and not wanting him to fake a handoff and carry it himself for a huge play

the other thing is that Bernard is still hurt and while we dressed Canty he clearly was not ready to go ... and not to pick on Osi, but we all concede he is not great vs. the run

sacks, hurries, batted balls, pressures, QB hits, etc. are big

turnovers are really huge ... Chicago gave up some yards 2nite, but they just kept turning Detroit over ...and we have been turning people over as well

and points are the biggest ... we are one of the highest scoring teams in football and we are 9th in points allowed ... usually when you are scoring 30 you end up giving up 20-24 and we are under 20/game

and finally, you have to consider whether the D is likely to get better or worse and much of that is tied to health

Canty is now back, Bernard should be back soon, Phillips soon ... Rivers just got back, Hosley is past his hammy .. Tuck is playing better, Osi is a little better ... JPP seems to be having fun again and as others improve it gets harder and harder for our opponents to pay extra attention

so, here's the deal ... dont expect us to stuff teams like we did vs. the 49ers, but certainly dont expect us to spew rushing yards like we did vs. the Skins ... it's somewhere in between and i still consider our D a top 10 caliber D

BillTheGreek
10-23-2012, 04:23 AM
Not Liking Our Defense ...

OK , This is how I see it..........One week they show up and are Great, the next week they have issues..... if they don't get a handle on it. It will come back to kill us, At this point you need a Very Good Defensive COACH to take control. If I was Running a Billion Dollar Business, I would get the Best Guy or guys around !

GMan-67
10-23-2012, 04:36 AM
Not Liking Our Defense ...

OK , This is how I see it..........One week they show up and are Great, the next week they have issues..... if they don't get a handle on it. It will come back to kill us, At this point you need a Very Good Defensive COACH to take control. If I was Running a Billion Dollar Business, I would get the Best Guy or guys around !

oh right, yes, fire Fewell coming off a Super Bowl victory and a 5-2 start ... you've figured it out ... can people even see what they type? ... it can't possibly make sense to them

and i guess you'd be stuck with Juan Castillo, cause i think everyone, everyone else without a Super Bowl winning D is busy right now

oh and i havent seen Perry miss one tackle this season

BillTheGreek
10-23-2012, 05:41 AM
oh right, yes, fire Fewell coming off a Super Bowl victory and a 5-2 start ... you've figured it out ... can people even see what they type? ... it can't possibly make sense to them

and i guess you'd be stuck with Juan Castillo, cause i think everyone, everyone else without a Super Bowl winning D is busy right now

oh and i havent seen Perry miss one tackle this season
Yes I did say "Very Good Defensive COACH needs to take control " Meanig Fewell needs HELP with a better Assistant Coach or Assistant Coaches .To get the Job done.

Drez
10-23-2012, 06:28 AM
They held a team than averages 29ppg to low 20's, I say they did a pretty good job. Big hand to the secondary, no secondary can cover for as long as rg3 scrambles around like that 4th and 10 conversion. The only thing that was truley fustrating yesterday was the first Moss td, how did he run threw 10 defenders and not get touch, because video shows no one gave a great effort. The lb's did pretty good also. Really we just expect to much from the d-line. A couple sacks, fumble and pressure, they did pretty good for the day. Lets face it, Giants face vick and rg3 now for 4 games a year their bound to be tired and have diminshed numbers.
They blocked that up to perfection. There was a red shirt on every blue shirt out there. Still frustrating, but it wasn't lack of effort on our part so much as it was excellent scheme and effort on theirs.

GMan-67
10-23-2012, 06:32 AM
Yes I did say "Very Good Defensive COACH needs to take control " Meanig Fewell needs HELP with a better Assistant Coach or Assistant Coaches .To get the Job done.

listen it's not you and im not sure why im so ornary this week

but i maintain my position ... Fewell was a Super Bowl winning coach ... you bring in this nameless expert and what is that going to do to our coaching staff??? ... Perry would be calling his agent and not focused ... and if this nameless expert was even half as good as Fewell he would be employed already in the NFL

so these arguments mean nothing .... it's like a temper tantrum b/c a rookie RB ran for too many yards on Sunday

now if you wanna talk about which players get more snaps ... well that's something that could realistically happen, but the other stuff is just crazy talk and it's insults TC and JRs intelligence and i'll tell you , they know 20X more than any of us

Kruunch
10-23-2012, 07:22 AM
You cant be serious. Blackburn got his butt whipped.

Dude you see only what you want to see.

Kruunch
10-23-2012, 07:27 AM
I have no vendetta with Blackburn lol. And I agree 100% with everything above. He is not a starting LB in the NFL. Never was and never will be. There was a reason he was sitting on the couch last season. Dude is nothing but a special teams player and a backup at best. Thats it. End of story. Yes he hassles his *** off and most of us like him and give him a pass for it (myself included). But the reality of the situation is the guy blows. And like it was said above it's INEXCUSABLE to play someone so bad, especially in the starting MLB position.

Correction: he's the starting LB on the 5-2 defending Super Bowl champs. You people, I swear.

fansince69
10-23-2012, 07:34 AM
Correction: he's the starting LB on the 5-2 defending Super Bowl champs. You people, I swear.
Elvis patterson(toast )was a starting corner back for a super bowl champ in 86.....I am not sure I am following your post..........even good teams have weak links......that makes the team good .....NOT HIM

Kruunch
10-23-2012, 07:43 AM
Elvis patterson(toast )was a starting corner back for a super bowl champ in 86.....I am not sure I am following your post..........even good teams have weak links......that makes the team good .....NOT HIM

10 tackles and 2 forced fumbles isn't good enough for you?

What did you want him to do, score on a Statue of Liberty play?

BillTheGreek
10-23-2012, 08:06 AM
listen it's not you and im not sure why im so ornary this week

but i maintain my position ... Fewell was a Super Bowl winning coach ... you bring in this nameless expert and what is that going to do to our coaching staff??? ... Perry would be calling his agent and not focused ... and if this nameless expert was even half as good as Fewell he would be employed already in the NFL

so these arguments mean nothing .... it's like a temper tantrum b/c a rookie RB ran for too many yards on Sunday

now if you wanna talk about which players get more snaps ... well that's something that could realistically happen, but the other stuff is just crazy talk and it's insults TC and JRs intelligence and i'll tell you , they know 20X more than any of us

I am not debating if Fewell was a Super Bowl winning coach ! ... All I am saying is with ALL the Money the Giants have they should get him some more HELP.
Do you think he needs MORE help ?

fansince69
10-23-2012, 08:24 AM
10 tackles and 2 forced fumbles isn't good enough for you?

What did you want him to do, score on a Statue of Liberty play?

you do realize that when he meets the back in the hole and gets dragged for 4-5 yards it still counts as a tackle right?...If you are honestly watching the games and still think Blackburn is a quality MLB then we really don't have any thing to discuss


btw if he did score on a statue of liberty play it would give all you people that think he's so great because he makes a play here and there something else to marvel at

slipknottin
10-23-2012, 08:28 AM
Dude you see only what you want to see.

Me and everyone else who can watch objectively.

The chase homers are finally dwindling as more and more people see him struggle week to week

GMan-67
10-23-2012, 08:38 AM
I am not debating if Fewell was a Super Bowl winning coach ! ... All I am saying is with ALL the Money the Giants have they should get him some more HELP.
Do you think he needs MORE help ?

help with what?

he's got a DB coach, a LB coach a Dline coach

TCs background is on D

who is this mystery expert and unless the guy is going to go on the field and tackle people ... how would it help?

and finally, when you have a high scoring aggressive offense that puts up 30 and your only giving up 19, well that seems to be a formula for success to me

would i prefer giving up 17, well sure, but im not going to blow up the whole defensive staff over 2 points / game

gumby74
10-23-2012, 08:39 AM
oh right, yes, fire Fewell coming off a Super Bowl victory and a 5-2 start ... you've figured it out ... can people even see what they type? ... it can't possibly make sense to them

and i guess you'd be stuck with Juan Castillo, cause i think everyone, everyone else without a Super Bowl winning D is busy right now

oh and i havent seen Perry miss one tackle this season

Castillo was a scape goat plain and simple. His defense was playing pretty solid ball. Especially, considering their offense would turn the ball over 3 times a game and only score 20 points a game.

fansince69
10-23-2012, 08:47 AM
help with what?

he's got a DB coach, a LB coach a Dline coach

TCs background is on D

who is this mystery expert and unless the guy is going to go on the field and tackle people ... how would it help?

and finally, when you have a high scoring aggressive offense that puts up 30 and your only giving up 19, well that seems to be a formula for success to me

would i prefer giving up 17, well sure, but im not going to blow up the whole defensive staff over 2 points / game

do you know something I don't know?
TC was a wide receiver coach under parcells in late 80's...how is that defense?

BillTheGreek
10-23-2012, 08:48 AM
help with what?

he's got a DB coach, a LB coach a Dline coach

TCs background is on D

who is this mystery expert and unless the guy is going to go on the field and tackle people ... how would it help?

and finally, when you have a high scoring aggressive offense that puts up 30 and your only giving up 19, well that seems to be a formula for success to me

would i prefer giving up 17, well sure, but im not going to blow up the whole defensive staff over 2 points / game

The Defense is not the OLD Giant Defense / The Skins went for a first down on 4th down, 4 Times and got them ! One on the 50 Yard Line. Oh That's Great Defense... BTW The Topic is "Not Liking Our Defense"
You must Like the way our Defense is Playing ....YES or NO ?

GMan-67
10-23-2012, 09:23 AM
The Defense is not the OLD Giant Defense / The Skins went for a first down on 4th down, 4 Times and got them ! One on the 50 Yard Line. Oh That's Great Defense... BTW The Topic is "Not Liking Our Defense"
You must Like the way our Defense is Playing ....YES or NO ?

i love the way they played in SF ... people were picking SF to win the Super Bowl and some still are

we avg. giving up 13 points over the past 2 games

we are 9th in the league in points allowed

we are turning teams over

we got our sacks going again

it's about the big picture

our D shut out Atlanta in the post season

held SF under 20

held GB to 20

and held Tom Brady and the Pats to 17 points !!

and all you can see is rushing yards playing vs. a college style offense in what was a unique challenge with 2 of our DTs hurting ... one out and another on a pitch count of 20 snaps

big picture dude, so to ask you a question, how many rushing yards are you expecting us to give up vs. Dallas????

BillTheGreek
10-23-2012, 09:31 AM
i love the way they played in SF ... people were picking SF to win the Super Bowl and some still are

we avg. giving up 13 points over the past 2 games

we are 9th in the league in points allowed

we are turning teams over

we got our sacks going again

it's about the big picture

our D shut out Atlanta in the post season

held SF under 20

held GB to 20

and held Tom Brady and the Pats to 17 points !!

and all you can see is rushing yards playing vs. a college style offense in what was a unique challenge with 2 of our DTs hurting ... one out and another on a pitch count of 20 snaps

big picture dude, so to ask you a question, how many rushing yards are you expecting us to give up vs. Dallas????



Is that a YES ?

GameTime
10-23-2012, 09:32 AM
Me and everyone else who can watch objectively.

The chase homers are finally dwindling as more and more people see him struggle week to week

Chase is a back up and plays like one. Same arguemnt I had about Tollefson last year. Some fans ripping him. Its a backup thrust into a starting role and they do what they can. Chase is a pedestrian player that has a knack for making some key plays. He has the smarts and the motor. Whats not to like about a backup like that. If you expect him to play like starter just because he is starting then you are the one who is delusional.

GMan-67
10-23-2012, 09:39 AM
Is that a YES ?

yes, im more than fine with our Super Bowl winning defense that is 9th in points allowed... our goal right now is to make it back to the tourney and i am not seeing any reason why we wont do that i bet 20+ teams in the league would want our D ... the 49ers are one of the best rushing teams in the NFL and we totally stuffed them ... im not going to go crazy over giving up some yards to a college style offense ... it's the exception

now Houston gave up 6 TD passes to GB ... and we hear they have a top 5 D ... how do you explain that? ... that DC should be fired 5 times over by your standards ... is Perry Fewell's brother coaching their D maybe

or is this the NFL? ... where parity rules and no team is completely lights out every play, every week

giantsfan420
10-23-2012, 09:45 AM
i dont see an area that we are good at.....most teams can stop something, we give up everything... you can run and pass on us. Something gotta change we have the saints, falcons and GB. Defense will need to tighten up
do u understand that we led the nfl in takeaways before chicago got 4 last night? now we're 2nd in takeaways...thats a great thing to succeed at

GMan-67
10-23-2012, 09:52 AM
do u understand that we led the nfl in takeaways before chicago got 4 last night? now we're 2nd in takeaways...thats a great thing to succeed at

i bet the fairweather Chicago fans are doing the same stoopid stuff on their boards ... but they drove the ball and they were close to scoring and if they didnt give us the ball we mighta lost

but, at least, a Chicago fairweather would have the excuse of saying ... well we havent won in forever, so im not happy b/c i know something bad will happen soon

Kruunch
10-23-2012, 10:24 AM
you do realize that when he meets the back in the hole and gets dragged for 4-5 yards it still counts as a tackle right?...If you are honestly watching the games and still think Blackburn is a quality MLB then we really don't have any thing to discuss


btw if he did score on a statue of liberty play it would give all you people that think he's so great because he makes a play here and there something else to marvel at

So the other 5 people Alfred Morris was dragging along on any given play weren't culpable? It was all Chase Blackburn's fault?

Chris Canty must absolutely suck then, because I saw him get blown up repeatedly on those run plays. If you don't like seeing your MLB getting blown up, then how do you feel about your 6'7 300lb DT?

Kruunch
10-23-2012, 10:30 AM
Me and everyone else who can watch objectively.

The chase homers are finally dwindling as more and more people see him struggle week to week

That's rich coming from you ... the guy who said Urlacher was over rated.

Seriously dude, you don't know how to be critical of a player in one instance, without including his whole career.

Chase Blackburn has probably the least athletic talent of any LBer we have, I would agree with. In a vacuum, you would not think someone like him would crack the starting lineup, I agree.

However, he does make plays and overall adds to the value of the defense. This is where we disagree. You also happen to be disagreeing with the Giants' personnel department, coaching staff, ownership and a total body of work that merits some praise.

I like your analysis generally speaking, but you do have a problem admitting when you're wrong. He had a good game against the Redskins. Yes he missed some tackles. So did the rest of the defense. Yes he got dragged for a few yards (and yes, more than you'd like to see your MLB getting dragged for). So did the rest of the defense. He also made some crucial plays. And ultimately we won the game, in part, due to his performance.

That's an objective analysis. My personal opinion; I'd take that performance (and him) if you could guarantee me that output for the rest of his career.

fansince69
10-23-2012, 10:30 AM
So the other 5 people Alfred Morris was dragging along on any given play weren't culpable? It was all Chase Blackburn's fault?

I never said that..it was just one example...Blackburn completely misses as many tackles as he makes...I really am sorry you are to blind to see it....its your opinion...I have mine....but I will ask you this...if blackburn is so good why was he sitting at home last season ?At this point in time he is a guy with a lot of heart and gives 100%+ effort that does make a espn type play now and then that just is not very skilled.....Don't get me wrong I like blackburn and I do realize that right now he is our only option....but to try to tell me he is a quality MLB in the NFL is just being blind to facts

Kruunch
10-23-2012, 10:38 AM
I never said that..it was just one example...Blackburn completely misses as many tackles as he makes...I really am sorry you are to blind to see it....its your opinion...I have mine....but I will ask you this...if blackburn is so good why was he sitting at home last season ?At this point in time he is a guy with a lot of heart and gives 100%+ effort that does make a espn type play now and then that just is not very skilled.....Don't get me wrong I like blackburn and I do realize that right now he is our only option....but to try to tell me he is a quality MLB in the NFL is just being blind to facts

Let me flip that question to you then ... why is he starting this year for the Giants? You're telling me he's the only MLB option we have? Are you kidding? Was there an outbreak of the Hanta Virus that only effects MLBs recently?

Why wasn't Victor Cruz drafted (or even asked to the Combine)? The draft and personnel process in the NFL isn't 100% complete nor is it static. Players develop, players get discovered, players adapt. I would say Blackburn is the epitome of that.

And that's not just my opinion, but the opinion of the Giants' personnel department and coaching staff, who are a ton more qualified to identify him as a starting MLB then you or I.

If you don't like him, that's fine. But the *fact* is that he IS a starting MLB. Whether you think he should be or not.

fansince69
10-23-2012, 10:53 AM
Let me flip that question to you then ... why is he starting this year for the Giants? You're telling me he's the only MLB option we have? Are you kidding? Was there an outbreak of the Hanta Virus that only effects MLBs recently?

Why wasn't Victor Cruz drafted (or even asked to the Combine)? The draft and personnel process in the NFL isn't 100% complete nor is it static. Players develop, players get discovered, players adapt. I would say Blackburn is the epitome of that.

And that's not just my opinion, but the opinion of the Giants' personnel department and coaching staff, who are a ton more qualified to identify him as a starting MLB then you or I.

If you don't like him, that's fine. But the *fact* is that he IS a starting MLB. Whether you think he should be or not.
He is starting because RIGHT now he is the only option...just because he is starting is not a statement of how good he is...just a statement of how poor the other choices are....Im sorry you like him you are entitled to that....he knows the defense which does give him an advantage

have a great day and hopefully we will agree on another topic some day

GameTime
10-23-2012, 10:56 AM
I never said that..it was just one example...Blackburn completely misses as many tackles as he makes...I really am sorry you are to blind to see it....its your opinion...I have mine....but I will ask you this...if blackburn is so good why was he sitting at home last season ?At this point in time he is a guy with a lot of heart and gives 100%+ effort that does make a espn type play now and then that just is not very skilled.....Don't get me wrong I like blackburn and I do realize that right now he is our only option....but to try to tell me he is a quality MLB in the NFL is just being blind to facts
Chase is a back up and plays like one. Same arguemnt I had about Tollefson last year. Some fans ripping him. Its a backup thrust into a starting role and they do what they can. Chase is a pedestrian player that has a knack for making some key plays. He has the smarts and the motor. Whats not to like about a backup like that. If you expect him to play like starter just because he is starting then you("you" in general. Not you personally) are the one who is delusional.

fansince69
10-23-2012, 10:57 AM
Chase is a back up and plays like one. Same arguemnt I had about Tollefson last year. Some fans ripping him. Its a backup thrust into a starting role and they do what they can. Chase is a pedestrian player that has a knack for making some key plays. He has the smarts and the motor. Whats not to like about a backup like that. If you expect him to play like starter just because he is starting then you are the one who is delusional.


your saying the exact same thing I am saying

slipknottin
10-23-2012, 11:02 AM
Urlacher was and still is overrated. There was a time when people were putting him in the ray Lewis in his prime category. He was never close. Even now. He's a good player, but not one of the best

GameTime
10-23-2012, 11:20 AM
your saying the exact same thing I am saying
thats why I quoted your post.....not to rebutt but to concur...

he is a backup and plays like one. bBt has a knack for big plays.

Buddy333
10-23-2012, 11:22 AM
Well I think most would have to agree that with RG3 in the division the Giants need fast players. I think having Williams the next time will help out a lot.

fansince69
10-23-2012, 11:24 AM
Well I think most would have to agree that with RG3 in the division the Giants need fast players. I think having Williams the next time will help out a lot.

I am sure with Williams available we will have a better chance of winning...lol

fansince69
10-23-2012, 11:26 AM
thats why I quoted your post.....not to rebutt but to concur...

he is a backup and plays like one. bBt has a knack for big plays.


guess im getting paranoid....most in here only quote if they are telling you that your wrong....

still no cowboys...your turning into a real slacker

GameTime
10-23-2012, 11:26 AM
I am sure with Williams available we will have a better chance of winning...lol

Chase will only get half the snaps so I guess he will only miss half the tackles he usually does. To go along with his forced fumbles, pick, pressures that cause interceptions...etc......LOL.....

Oh yeah....he has been lining up as DT now too here and there. Damn guy....just keeps doing whats needed....:)

GameTime
10-23-2012, 11:27 AM
guess im getting paranoid....most in here only quote if they are telling you that your wrong....

still no cowboys...your turning into a real slacker

answered you already in the other thread. Back off already...LOL

I hear you.....the quotes are usually to argue and not to side with....

fansince69
10-23-2012, 11:28 AM
Chase will only get half the snaps so I guess he will only miss half the tackles he usually does. To go along with his forced fumbles, pick, pressures that cause interceptions...etc......LOL.....

Oh yeah....he has been lining up as DT now too here and there. Damn guy....just keeps doing whats needed....:)


Maybe his uniform should have big "S" on the chest

GameTime
10-23-2012, 11:29 AM
Maybe his uniform should have big "S" on the chest

I hear he does chill with Cam Newton....

fansince69
10-23-2012, 11:29 AM
answered you already in the other thread. Back off already...LOL

I hear you.....the quotes are usually to argue and not to side with....

I know I read it after I wrote this one....so now you back off....someone here has to keep you focused and I have nothing better to do lol

GameTime
10-23-2012, 11:30 AM
Maybe his uniform should have big "S" on the chest

well maybe not an "S".....maybe a little "s"........

GameTime
10-23-2012, 11:30 AM
I know I read it after I wrote this one....so now you back off....someone here has to keep you focused and I have nothing better to do lol
tool.....

:rolleyes:

fansince69
10-23-2012, 11:32 AM
tool.....

:rolleyes:

good to know we can have some fun on here once in a while

juice33s
10-23-2012, 11:32 AM
Anybody claiming Blackburn played horrible against the Skins should probably go back to the tape. I just rewatched the game (Through the 3rd quarter) and saw no missed tackles and maybe only 1 or 2 times where he couldn't get off a block to surrender a big run. Blackburn was for the most part very active getting in on alot of plays and had perhaps the biggest hit on RGIII when he SHED a block before blasting him in the head.

Everyone claiming that he is the reason for our defense struggles is clearly forgetting that his arrival coincided with the defensive resurgence last season. And why only blame for chase? Why not the other LB or the defensive line? Perhaps the biggest example of LB's not getting off blocks was the Moss screen play TD where Boley and Rivers both got blasted out of the hole....It was one of the very few plays Chase was on the bench for, perhaps fpr good reason?

slipknottin
10-23-2012, 11:39 AM
Umm. Watch just the first series and Blackburn got owned like 5 times.

fansince69
10-23-2012, 11:41 AM
Umm. Watch just the first series and Blackburn got owned like 5 times.

damn there goes his bid for all pro

GameTime
10-23-2012, 11:41 AM
good to know we can have some fun on here once in a while

oh yeah. Big fun....

happy now.....

fansince69
10-23-2012, 11:43 AM
oh yeah. Big fun....

happy now.....


lmao...told you I get things done

juice33s
10-23-2012, 11:52 AM
Umm. Watch just the first series and Blackburn got owned like 5 times.
Lol, as usual u exagerrate/ make things up to try and prove your point. I think he made at least 3 tackles at or near the l;ine of scrimmage on that drive alone. Geez, for having such a problem tackling guys Chase some how has managed to the lead the team in that category and convince the coaching staff to play him for 97% of the snaps last week

fansince69
10-23-2012, 11:55 AM
Lol, as usual u exagerrate/ make things up to try and prove your point. I think he made at least 3 tackles at or near the l;ine of scrimmage on that drive alone. Geez, for having such a problem tackling guys Chase some how has managed to the lead the team in that category and convince the coaching staff to play him for 97% of the snaps last week

as I tried to explain earlier when you hit the back in the hole and then get dragged for 4-5 yards...it still counts as a tackle...that wasn't just chase but he is part of it

slipknottin
10-23-2012, 11:59 AM
Lol, as usual u exagerrate/ make things up to try and prove your point. I think he made at least 3 tackles at or near the l;ine of scrimmage on that drive alone. Geez, for having such a problem tackling guys Chase some how has managed to the lead the team in that category and convince the coaching staff to play him for 97% of the snaps last week

Watch how often the guards of the skins get to him and take him completely out of the play

Dwinsballgames
10-23-2012, 12:00 PM
guess im getting paranoid....most in here only quote if they are telling you that your wrong....

still no cowboys...your turning into a real slacker

You should be parinoid, not anly did you disagree with that poster, but then you crossed the line by wishing him a good day. I wish the mods would get off their butts and put a stop to this type of internet bullying.


On a related note, I always liked Elvis Patterson..

juice33s
10-23-2012, 12:01 PM
Watch how often the guards of the skins get to him and take him completely out of the play
I wacthed the entire game, there was nothing alarming about that tape at all. Chase was one of our best defenders on Sunday, if not the best

JimC
10-23-2012, 12:02 PM
On a related note, I always liked Elvis Patterson..


#34 TOAST!!!!

fansince69
10-23-2012, 12:05 PM
You should be parinoid, not anly did you disagree with that poster, but then you crossed the line by wishing him a good day. I wish the mods would get off their butts and put a stop to this type of internet bullying.


On a related note, I always liked Elvis Patterson..


I can't say I liked him but didn't dislike him till I heard a rumor that he was at a game in less than 100% condition(either drunk or hung over). First game after 86 Superbowl...Monday night against the bears....he got fried over and over....heard LT really laid into him...yeah I know ironic that LT would say something

slipknottin
10-23-2012, 12:05 PM
I wacthed the entire game, there was nothing alarming about that tape at all. Chase was one of our best defenders on Sunday, if not the best

Then you must have never seen a good MLB play.
I watched the tape too. And he got blown out of the hole nearly every play.

juice33s
10-23-2012, 12:07 PM
Then you must have never seen a good MLB play.
I watched the tape too. And he got blown out of the hole nearly every play.
Right and obviously neither have Coughlin or Perry Fewell or jerry Reese. Somebody sign Slip to the Giants staff so we can load our roster with first round talents like Taylor Mays, Martez Wilson and Marvin Austin

GameTime
10-23-2012, 12:09 PM
Watch how often the guards of the skins get to him and take him completely out of the play


I wacthed the entire game, there was nothing alarming about that tape at all. Chase was one of our best defenders on Sunday, if not the best

so which was it. We have two totally different opinions.

slipknottin
10-23-2012, 12:09 PM
Right and obviously neither have Coughlin or Perry Fewell

Explains why they cut him last year. Doesn't it.

Only brought him back after Goff, Jones, Herzlich, and Dillard didn't work out.

Giant stuck in Texas
10-23-2012, 12:10 PM
Lol, as usual u exagerrate/ make things up to try and prove your point. I think he made at least 3 tackles at or near the l;ine of scrimmage on that drive alone. Geez, for having such a problem tackling guys Chase some how has managed to the lead the team in that category and convince the coaching staff to play him for 97% of the snaps last weekLol, you have no idea.
Like 5 times, like 8 times, like 10 times, like, like, like, like......it's an uphill battle, so don't invest too much of your time.

slipknottin
10-23-2012, 12:10 PM
so which was it. We have two totally different opinions.

Well PFF pointe out how many times Blackburn was taken out of the play too. But they must be biased about Blackburn too.

fansince69
10-23-2012, 12:12 PM
Explains why they cut him last year. Doesn't it.

Only brought him back after Goff, Jones, Herzlich, and Dillard didn't work out.

you can see why they cut him with all those top quality players in front of him....honestly I though Goff was looking promising before he got hurt

GameTime
10-23-2012, 12:13 PM
Well PFF pointe out how many times Blackburn was taken out of the play too. But they must be biased about Blackburn too.
dont kill the messenger I am just asking....

juice33s
10-23-2012, 12:13 PM
Explains why they cut him last year. Doesn't it.

Only brought him back after Goff, Jones, Herzlich, and Dillard didn't work out.
And then brought him back and started him in the Superbowl and made no effort to bring anyone in the offseason to compete with him

slipknottin
10-23-2012, 12:15 PM
And then brought him back and started him in the Superbowl and made no effort to bring anyone in the offseason to compete with him

They did. They brought in Rivers. Unfortunately they haven't had rivers, Boley, and J Will healthy together yet

fansince69
10-23-2012, 12:15 PM
And then brought him back and started him in the Superbowl and made no effort to bring anyone in the offseason to compete with him

the funny part you are serious

fansince69
10-23-2012, 12:16 PM
dont kill the messenger I am just asking....

I like that one better than the helmet....you have my approval
im sure youll sleep better

GameTime
10-23-2012, 12:16 PM
They did. They brought in Rivers. Unfortunately they haven't had rivers, Boley, and J Will healthy together yet

and yet he still plays the game and makes some big plays. Damn back ups!!! How dare he fill in while the "good" guys get healthy.

GameTime
10-23-2012, 12:17 PM
I like that one better than the helmet....you have my approval
im sure youll sleep better

I am very flattered you noticed......:p

Hate me some JJ....

slipknottin
10-23-2012, 12:17 PM
dont kill the messenger I am just asking....

Not. I just find it strange that juice can watch film and think Blackburn played well. I have no clue what he is watching

juice33s
10-23-2012, 12:18 PM
Explains why they cut him last year. Doesn't it.

Only brought him back after Goff, Jones, Herzlich, and Dillard didn't work out.
Lol, funny you mention Dillard. That's yet again another scrub you were hyping on these boards......god you suck and evaluating talent

slipknottin
10-23-2012, 12:19 PM
and yet he still plays the game and makes some big plays. Damn back ups!!! How dare he fill in while the "good" guys get healthy.

I'm not arguing that Blackburn should be on the bench. I know he is their best option with other guys hurt. But the ridiculous amount of "Blackburn had a good game" posts are insane.

fansince69
10-23-2012, 12:19 PM
Not. I just find it strange that juice can watch film and think Blackburn played well. I have no clue what he is watching

watching morris drag him 4-5 yards was like watching a bride and groom drive off dragging tin cans behind them

slipknottin
10-23-2012, 12:19 PM
Lol, funny you mention Dillard. That;s yet again another sxrub you were hyping on these boards......god you suck and evaluating talent

I never hyped up Dillard. Ever.

fansince69
10-23-2012, 12:19 PM
I'm not arguing that Blackburn should be on the bench. I know he is their best option with other guys hurt. But the ridiculous amount of "Blackburn had a good game" posts are insane.

exactly

JayMas9
10-23-2012, 12:19 PM
And then brought him back and started him in the Superbowl and made no effort to bring anyone in the offseason to compete with himThey only brought him back because Herzlich got hurt...

Giant stuck in Texas
10-23-2012, 12:24 PM
watching morris drag him 4-5 yards was like watching a bride and groom drive off dragging tin cans behind themMorris was dragging virtually everyone he came into contact with and to single out one defensive player whether it be Chase or whoever is ridiculous.

fansince69
10-23-2012, 12:27 PM
Morris was dragging virtually everyone he came into contact with and to single out one defensive player whether it be Chase or whoever is ridiculous.

But if chase is as great you and a couple others make him out to be he wouldn't(as the star mlb) let this happen....that is his job first and foremost...stop the run up the middle...yes it happened to others...but this is about chase

Kruunch
10-23-2012, 12:31 PM
Urlacher was and still is overrated. There was a time when people were putting him in the ray Lewis in his prime category. He was never close. Even now. He's a good player, but not one of the best

And I rest my case.

Down-lifer
10-23-2012, 12:35 PM
... but while we are #24 in total defense, we are #9 in points scored against.

I have absolutely no faith in our defense BUT they do seem to make the stops (most times) when they need to. Like one of those bad action movies where the hero diffuses the bomb with a microsecond left on the timer.

What are your thoughts on our defense and Perry Fewell?maybe this was said already, but I don't feel reading through 12 pages of replies. I like the fact that we have created 7 turnovers in the last two games against two teams that "don't turn the ball over".

slipknottin
10-23-2012, 12:36 PM
And I rest my case.

Except you haven't made a point. There are at least 6 other MLBs better than Urlacher.

Lets see,
Sean Lee, Willis, Bowman, D Johnson, D Washington, Cushing (injured now), and you could make cases for more, like Timmons, David Harris, etc.

RoanokeFan
10-23-2012, 12:37 PM
... but while we are #24 in total defense, we are #9 in points scored against.

I have absolutely no faith in our defense BUT they do seem to make the stops (most times) when they need to. Like one of those bad action movies where the hero diffuses the bomb with a microsecond left on the timer.

What are your thoughts on our defense and Perry Fewell?

I agree, marginally. In the Redskins game, had the defense broken, the Redskins would have scored at least 15 more points by scoring touchdowns instead of field goals. There is work to be done but I think the biggest improvement is getting Canty and Bernard back into the starting lineup.

Giant stuck in Texas
10-23-2012, 12:39 PM
But if chase is as great you and a couple others make him out to be he wouldn't(as the star mlb) let this happen....that is his job first and foremost...stop the run up the middle...yes it happened to others...but this is about chasePoint out where I said he was great, in fact point out where anyone said he was great and I'll give you a high five. Furthermore, Morris was dragging 300lb DT's, did you really expect better results from our LB core?

Kruunch
10-23-2012, 12:46 PM
Except you haven't made a point. There are at least 6 other MLBs better than Urlacher.

Lets see,
Sean Lee, Willis, Bowman, D Johnson, D Washington, Cushing (injured now), and you could make cases for more, like Timmons, David Harris, etc.

That IS my point ... you illustrate instances of (in this case, at this one point in time) and then make a broad generalization (like Urlacher is over rated). Not to mention that NONE of the guys you mentioned could call a defense, while Urlacher currently calls one of the best defenses in football.

Here's a clue for you, at any given point in time, there's someone ALWAYS better then the next guy. However over the course of Urlacher's career, he is absolutely in the same tier as Ray Lewis. In fact, those two are WIDELY considered the two best linebackers of the past decade plus.

Ok enough of that garbage ... as this relates to Blackburn: as I stated, he played well in the Redskins game. If you believe he didn't, then you must believe that no one did (since he forced the most turnovers and had the most tackles). We'll have to agree to disagree there. As for his career ... since it's still going, I can't comment, but to this point, whenever he's given the chance, he seems to show up all the other players (that includes being able to stay on the field). Hence why he's currently starting.

Anyways at this point we can just agree to disagree. I say tomato ... you say tomato can. Shrug.

slipknottin
10-23-2012, 12:47 PM
Um. Every one of the guys I listed apart from Bowman calls the defense.

Blackburn did not play well. Forcing a turnover at the end of the game does not mean he didn play badly the rest of the game.

fansince69
10-23-2012, 12:47 PM
Point out where I said he was great, in fact point out where anyone said he was great and I'll give you a high five. Furthermore, Morris was dragging 300lb DT's, did you really expect better results from our LB core?

If you and several others haven't used the word great...then what is your adjective.....because all any of us( slip myself and couple others)have claimed is he is starting by default...he is a good backup who has heart and gives his all but has very little talent...but he is there because there is no other option at the moment

all you guys want to do is argue that we're wrong....what are you saying then if hes not great...because that's how it comes across

stormblue
10-23-2012, 12:55 PM
i'll cut to the chase....we give up 6.4 yards per play.

that's 31st in the league.

the only team worse is new orleans.

our opponents only punt 3.3 times per game.......DEAD LAST in the league

we stop no-one.

we either get a lucky turnover, penalty ,or they shoot themselves in the foot , or they score.

we absolutely suck defensively because

the linebackers are (and have been) our achiles heel .

way to slow , and can't cover or get off blocks.

we must outscore them.....cuz we ain't gonna stop nobody.

giantsfan420
10-23-2012, 12:56 PM
watching morris drag him 4-5 yards was like watching a bride and groom drive off dragging tin cans behind them
u do realize morris is dragging every defender...if getting dragged by morris equates to having bad games/being a backup, some one forgot to tell the other 6 teams they've faced...

i dunno how reliable it is to judge a player based on how he defended washingtons offense...the lb's were almost always a step out of position bc of that bs spread option gimmick...i can remember maybe 1 time where a guy on our defense was able to wrap up and bring morris down by himself at the LOS and that was tuck and apparently he sucks too based on these boards...

giantsfan420
10-23-2012, 12:58 PM
If you and several others haven't used the word great...then what is your adjective.....because all any of us( slip myself and couple others)have claimed is he is starting by default...he is a good backup who has heart and gives his all but has very little talent...but he is there because there is no other option at the moment

all you guys want to do is argue that we're wrong....what are you saying then if hes not great...because that's how it comes across

lmfao is that what u think u and slip have been saying??? i musta missed those bc all i see are "blackburn played horribly and he's a terrible lb" from u and slip...

Kruunch
10-23-2012, 01:02 PM
If you and several others haven't used the word great...then what is your adjective.....because all any of us( slip myself and couple others)have claimed is he is starting by default...he is a good backup who has heart and gives his all but has very little talent...but he is there because there is no other option at the moment

all you guys want to do is argue that we're wrong....what are you saying then if hes not great...because that's how it comes across

Except it's just you and Slip saying CB had a bad game.

You and Slip != "all any of us"

And as GiantStuckInTexas pointed out, none of us called CB "great". In fact, I believe everyone was quite clear in saying that he is capable and had a good game against the Redskins (besides you and Slip) but physically limited.

To be clear. There's enough hyperbole on these boards without adding to it.

slipknottin
10-23-2012, 01:03 PM
lmfao is that what u think u and slip have been saying??? i musta missed those bc all i see are "blackburn played horribly and he's a terrible lb" from u and slip...

He did play horrible and he is a backup LB at best.

Giant stuck in Texas
10-23-2012, 01:08 PM
If you and several others haven't used the word great...then what is your adjective.....because all any of us( slip myself and couple others)have claimed is he is starting by default...he is a good backup who has heart and gives his all but has very little talent...but he is there because there is no other option at the moment

all you guys want to do is argue that we're wrong....what are you saying then if hes not great...because that's how it comes across
I've been crystal clear on my adjectives in this thread and others, which have been... Chase is a descent MLB, Slip spews bull**** stats to further his opinions and my new one would be your possible lack of reading comprehension.

stormblue
10-23-2012, 01:09 PM
He did play horrible and he is a backup LB at best.

not on this team slip , on this team he's aces.

that's the problem , if blackburn is your best , then.......

we have fallen so far from carson and pepper and reasons and LT and the rest.

slipknottin
10-23-2012, 01:10 PM
I've been crystal clear on my adjectives in this thread and others, which have been... Chase is a descent MLB, Slip spews bull**** stats to further his opinions and my new one would be your possible lack of reading comprehension.
Try watching the game. I know I'm not the only one who saw him get blocked out of the play at the 2nd level all game. Even PFF noted it

GameTime
10-23-2012, 01:15 PM
Giants stuck in Texas brings up a great point. Blackburn is doing ok on THIS defense. That in itself is sad that we are arguing about the level of play of a back up MLB.....

Lets get these other ****ing LBs healthy so they can shut some of us up then. I guess Chase doesnt get hurt as much because he is not making contact...lol

JayMas9
10-23-2012, 01:19 PM
There is no way anyone who actually watched that game thought blackburn played well, at least I hope not. He consistently bit hard on play fakes, which made his zone drops way too shallow, and I think contributed to the middle of the field being a bit of a hole. He was also getting dominated at the 2nd level as has been said, and I doubt that has anything to do with his football smarts, he doesn't strike me as a guy who is mentally out of position a lot. He's not a great athlete, and it shows every game. Nothing wrong with having him as depth, since it's great to be able to bring a guy off the bench that is smart and knows the defense. As a starter, he is an absolute liability. I would either like Herzlich to show the coaches what he did last year to get that starting job back (since he is 3 times the athlete and instinctual player Chase is) or Rivers get completely healthy and hold it down. Clearly our coaches don't think either of those things have happened yet.

Giant stuck in Texas
10-23-2012, 01:26 PM
Try watching the game. I know I'm not the only one who saw him get blocked out of the play at the 2nd level all game. Even PFF noted itI don't have all day to read stats and watch game tape over an over, I actually have a job and family to support.

slipknottin
10-23-2012, 01:45 PM
I don't have all day to read stats and watch game tape over an over, I actually have a job and family to support.

So your opinion is based on absolutely nothing. Cool. Thanks for sharing

rtahsin
10-23-2012, 01:52 PM
Due to injuries this team is playing with the whole "bend but don't break" mindset. It's been serving us ok so far and probably will sustain us for a few more games but we have to do something about it soon because that just won't cut it.

Imgrate
10-23-2012, 03:07 PM
Blackburn is probably the worst starter on the team

Kruunch
10-23-2012, 03:10 PM
So your opinion is based on absolutely nothing. Cool. Thanks for sharing

We've all seen the game.

You're not a unique snowflake.

Giant stuck in Texas
10-23-2012, 03:10 PM
So your opinion is based on absolutely nothing. Cool. Thanks for sharingNo, it's based on watching the one game, which is enough for me and most people to draw their own opinions.

As much time as you spend in mommy's basement DVRing **** and read PFF stats like its the bible, one would think you would actually share correct stats on here as opposed to making **** up. Weird..

slipknottin
10-23-2012, 03:13 PM
No, it's based on watching the one game, which is enough for me and most people to draw their own opinions.

As much time as you spend in mommy's basement DVRing **** and read PFF stats like its the bible, one would think you would actually share correct stats on here as opposed to making **** up. Weird..

What "correct stats"? Considering you've provided absolutely nothing.

Blackburn got taken out of the play by guards at the second level constantly all game

GameTime
10-23-2012, 03:14 PM
So, don't kid yourself. The Giants understand what they have -- and don't have -- with Blackburn quarterbacking the defense.
Right now, they obviously believe all of the intangible things outweigh any physical limitations.
Considering how much success they have enjoyed since Blackburn got up off his couch and put on the No. 93 jersey that is hard to argue with.

Above is from an article posted by Ro about CB....

sums it up and PFF they dont have stats for an MLB who gets the other 10 players in the right set up and position which is a huge part of a good MLBs job..

Giant stuck in Texas
10-23-2012, 03:16 PM
What "correct stats"?

Exactly..

TheEnigma
10-23-2012, 03:18 PM
So, don't kid yourself. The Giants understand what they have -- and don't have -- with Blackburn quarterbacking the defense.
Right now, they obviously believe all of the intangible things outweigh any physical limitations.
Considering how much success they have enjoyed since Blackburn got up off his couch and put on the No. 93 jersey that is hard to argue with.

Above is from an article posted by Ro about CB....

sums it up and PFF they dont have stats for an MLB who gets the other 10 players in the right set up and position which is a huge part of a good MLBs job..

Every team has a player that does what Chase does for the NYG and a lot of them give better individual performances as well. I've learned to accept that we need him in there to help us with the mental preparation but I can't help it that I desire better play from Blackburn himself.

GameTime
10-23-2012, 03:20 PM
Every team has a player that does what Chase does for the NYG and a lot of them give better individual performances as well. I've learned to accept that we need him in there to help us with the mental preparation but I can't help it that I desire better play from Blackburn himself.

except the Giants obvioulsy. Thats why he is still in. I would love to have a MLB that was the whole package and in other threads about this I am clear on saying Chase is a back up so dont expect him to play like a starter. The Giants dont have a better option right now if the did he would be on the bench.

Drez
10-23-2012, 03:27 PM
help with what?

he's got a DB coach, a LB coach a Dline coach

TCs background is on D

who is this mystery expert and unless the guy is going to go on the field and tackle people ... how would it help?

and finally, when you have a high scoring aggressive offense that puts up 30 and your only giving up 19, well that seems to be a formula for success to me

would i prefer giving up 17, well sure, but im not going to blow up the whole defensive staff over 2 points / game
Don't know if this has been mentioned, and I apologize if it has, but TC's background is offense not defense.

Kruunch
10-23-2012, 03:30 PM
Don't know if this has been mentioned, and I apologize if it has, but TC's background is offense not defense.

TC also relies heavily on his coordinators. He doesn't call Xs and Os.

GameTime
10-23-2012, 03:34 PM
TC also relies heavily on his coordinators. He doesn't call Xs and Os.

Funny....I never notice him talking to his coordinators during the game. Like to change the game plan if its not working or whatever.

Kruunch
10-23-2012, 03:37 PM
Funny....I never notice him talking to his coordinators during the game. Like to change the game plan if its not working or whatever.

You also never see him with a play card.

He's a technique and discipline guy ... the actual game plan and game time strategies / adjustments are coordinator driven.

Which made Bradshaw yelling at him kind of funny ... sort of like yelling at Grandpa because the baby-sitter makes you play Monopoly instead of Chutes and Ladders.

GameTime
10-23-2012, 03:42 PM
You also never see him with a play card.

He's a technique and discipline guy ... the actual game plan and game time strategies / adjustments are coordinator driven.

Which made Bradshaw yelling at him kind of funny ... sort of like yelling at Grandpa because the baby-sitter makes you play Monopoly instead of Chutes and Ladders.

yeah...you're right.

Bradsahw was prob like..."Will tell those jerks to get back to the run game".
TC said:...."what? Not me man not my job. Now get the **** back out on the field"...

TrueBlue@NYC
10-23-2012, 03:47 PM
You also never see him with a play card.

He's a technique and discipline guy ... the actual game plan and game time strategies / adjustments are coordinator driven.

Which made Bradshaw yelling at him kind of funny ... sort of like yelling at Grandpa because the baby-sitter makes you play Monopoly instead of Chutes and Ladders.

While I doubt TC picks out specific plays at any given time he's constantly in communication with his coordinators about the direction he wants things to go ont he field. Telling the OC to reign it in is exactly his job and I'm sure he tells KG that stuff all the time.

He probably also tells PF similar things in terms of how aggressive he wants the defense to play. It's not specific X's and O's but it's general tone.