PDA

View Full Version : Killdrive Stop with the WR screen play



sheepdip
10-29-2012, 08:56 AM
I dont care if it is Brown, Nicks or whoever it yields nothing or is incomplete or we loose yards. Scrap it please, every team that plays us sniffs it out and especially our divisional teams. Pitts on the other hand works this effectively and they run it a few times a game.

Replace it!.

Diamondring
10-29-2012, 08:57 AM
There is a time to call those plays. Most of the time on those plays, the safety gots to be away and you have the eual amount of defenders and wrs on the same side.

NYGFaninILL
10-29-2012, 09:20 AM
I dont care if it is Brown, Nicks or whoever it yields nothing or is incomplete or we loose yards. Scrap it please, every team that plays us sniffs it out and especially our divisional teams. Pitts on the other hand works this effectively and they run it a few times a game.

Replace it!.

First of all, it is only incomplete when the WR drops the ball. Secondly, we only lose yards when somebody misses a block. Every situation has a play, and plays are not designed to go for negitive yards.

Signature NYG
10-29-2012, 09:21 AM
Replace it with a screen. And only run it when nicks is 100% healthy.

Redeyejedi
10-29-2012, 09:22 AM
Giants are a bad screen team have been the whole time with Eli. Doesnt matter what kind of screen it is either

nycisgreat
10-29-2012, 11:02 AM
I dont care if it is Brown, Nicks or whoever it yields nothing or is incomplete or we loose yards. Scrap it please, every team that plays us sniffs it out and especially our divisional teams. Pitts on the other hand works this effectively and they run it a few times a game.

Replace it!.

Replace it with RB screen passes. I think this was the key to Tiki's success. We have no RB screen or run game. I wish we could change that.

Kruunch
10-29-2012, 11:06 AM
Giants are a bad screen team have been the whole time with Eli. Doesnt matter what kind of screen it is either

Not true ... we were the best screen team in the NFL when Tiki was here.

Giantslb66
10-29-2012, 11:29 AM
As long as KG runs that shotgun draw 8 times a game, we're good!!

TheAnalyst
10-29-2012, 11:35 AM
Giants are a bad screen team have been the whole time with Eli. Doesnt matter what kind of screen it is either

ITs KG style of offense. No dink and dunk. Eli, throw it 30 yards deep on 3rd and shorts!

GMenOnDeck
10-29-2012, 11:37 AM
Im still facepalming on the 3rd and 1 shotgun direct HB snap with BRADSHAW

G-MANning4Life
10-29-2012, 11:48 AM
Not true ... we were the best screen team in the NFL when Tiki was here.
You're right. However, majority of Eli's career with the Giants, the screen has been an ineffective play. I cringe every time I see it coming, because it usually results in a loss of yardage or we break even, getting right back to the line of scrimmage or maybe a yard or two. Yes, it is usually a missed block that messes up the play, but sometimes to opposing team is well prepared for it and overloads us with defenders to where we cannot block them all.

Toadofsteel
10-29-2012, 12:05 PM
Im still facepalming on the 3rd and 1 shotgun direct HB snap with BRADSHAW

Part of me is wondering if that was a designed play (since I've NEVER seen killdrive call a direct HB snap) or if Baas whiffed a snap and it just happened to go into Bradshaw's hands...

gmen0820
10-29-2012, 12:10 PM
Part of me is wondering if that was a designed play (since I've NEVER seen killdrive call a direct HB snap) or if Baas whiffed a snap and it just happened to go into Bradshaw's hands...We've ran that play several times. In 2008, it was very effective for us.

sheepdip
10-29-2012, 01:05 PM
First of all, it is only incomplete when the WR drops the ball. Secondly, we only lose yards when somebody misses a block. Every situation has a play, and plays are not designed to go for negitive yards.

Umm I have to disagree, It is in- complete yes when our receiver drops the ball but in most cases I am glad he does or it will be a 7 yard loss. Also our Wrs out there blocking cant block 4 people either. Again this play is called way too many times and I challenge anyone on this board to show me proof of when this has actually worked and for say over 5 yards!!! in the last few years. I think this has worked 1 time in the last 6 years or so. Yet we have run it maybe 40 times.

sheepdip
10-29-2012, 01:08 PM
Just to clarify this is the WR/Smoke screen as they call it. Sometimes we use a wr and other times we use a rb. So if you see Brown or Bradhsaw or whoever split out wide you can bet it is coming. I am not talking about the regular screen play to the rb.

NYGFaninILL
10-29-2012, 01:19 PM
Just to clarify this is the WR/Smoke screen as they call it. Sometimes we use a wr and other times we use a rb. So if you see Brown or Bradhsaw or whoever split out wide you can bet it is coming. I am not talking about the regular screen play to the rb.

My mistake, I thought you were talking about a standard screen. But just remember, Jaws said this today on Mike and Mike, when talking about what plays we ran, we are always blessed with the outcome of plays.

YATittle1962
10-29-2012, 01:35 PM
the problem is not the call
the problem is the execution

they run it out of the exact formation and exact motion every time

also Eli does not sell it well at all

the Steelers run that very same play all the time .......but Ben looks off defenders before going to the screen

Andrew Luck ran it nicely yesterday as well
Romo is another QB who runs it well

if Eli has any faults ......and there are not many.....one is his body language on designed screens

been saying this for years

it takes a split second to look off a LB ....and that split second could be the difference in a 10 yd gain and a 2 yd loss

moosedrool
10-29-2012, 01:38 PM
The Giants are 4th in the NFL in total yards and people still refer to Gilbride as Killdrive. Unbelievable. Oh yeah, the Giants also won two super bowls with Gilbride.

YATittle1962
10-29-2012, 01:43 PM
The Giants are 4th in the NFL in total yards and people still refer to Gilbride as Killdrive. Unbelievable. Oh yeah, the Giants also won two super bowls with Gilbride.

it really is sickening and quite laughable

but it does make it easy to separate those who understand the game and those who have very little clue around here

KG is a great OC

no one is perfect .....but name 3 OC you would rather have running this offense

he runs a complex offense that requires patient intelligent players

this is not a simple west coast dink and dunk offense

alentown pa
10-29-2012, 01:48 PM
Not true ... we were the best screen team in the NFL when Tiki was here.

Agreed and I always thought we were a good screen team with Derrick Ward as well.

alentown pa
10-29-2012, 01:50 PM
it really is sickening and quite laughable

but it does make it easy to separate those who understand the game and those who have very little clue around here

KG is a great OC

no one is perfect .....but name 3 OC you would rather have running this offense

he runs a complex offense that requires patient intelligent players

this is not a simple west coast dink and dunk offense

people on here are going to get a dose of reality when some of these coordinators, coaches, and players are gone...these are great times and Gilbride is one of the best in the league.

YATittle1962
10-29-2012, 01:52 PM
people on here are going to get a dose of reality when some of these coordinators, coaches, and players are gone...these are great times and Gilbride is one of the best in the league.

I cannot imagine what this place will be like after the spoilings of the Coughlin / Manning era are over

Carlos C
10-29-2012, 02:01 PM
Honestly I have a bigger problem with Gilbride's overall play calling and his love for the 3rd down draw play! He freaking loves to call that on 3rd down whether its 3rd and long or short. Last season in the San Francisco game (regular season), he called that on 3rd down (4th QT) and they were expecting it. I remember it cause even my daughter knew it was coming, we were all saying no draw while watching the game and BAM he does it. Gilbride has a few moments of brilliance but they are far and few better. On my blog I wrote last season a post on exactly his conservative, predictable play calling and found instances since 2009 where it hurt us.

Look how he played that 4th quarter with about 4 minutes left. He played it for the FG. Also agree more screens need to be implemented.

moosedrool
10-29-2012, 02:05 PM
I guess people won't be happy until the Giants are 1st in total offense. 4th just isn't good enough, right?

alentown pa
10-29-2012, 02:15 PM
I cannot imagine what this place will be like after the spoilings of the Coughlin / Manning era are over

can you picture what some of these threads would be like if there were message boards in the 70's lol...think about it we won a division game on the road, on a day where both philly, and washington lost, and some of these threads are insane...not this one, no disrespect to the OP, I agree our screen game is pretty weak, last time we ran that play well was with Derrick Ward.

GiantRoc
10-29-2012, 02:19 PM
Gilbride may be a great OC. Then again maybe he is too detailed for his own good. Maybe what this team needs now and then is a little less complication. We have a TON of talent on this team. Small wonder we have a good offense. At times it seems that our offense is so complicated, it comes back to bite us in the butt. When multiple players need to make split second reads on what a number of defenders are doing, it is often going to cause problems. Early on in Eli's career, you saw A LOT of INTs. That was all about the reads. If Eli makes the wrong read? Big trouble. If a receiver makes a wrong read? Big trouble. Now throw in good defensive players and schemes designed to disguise what they are doing, and you have more trouble. There are a lot of good teams out there that dont have such a complicated offense. I think we have as much, if not more talent than most teams in this league. Maybe we just need to go out there and beat the guy across from us, to make the play. Just a thought.

JustinTuckNYG91
10-29-2012, 02:29 PM
Our total offense is more about the talent than the play calling, which is questionable on a weekly basis. Gilbride has his good games but he needs to be more consistent. Why do we have to mount these come backs? He is very conservative at the start of games and only opens up the playbook in 4th quarters when we're behind. Our offense can be so predictable, he falls in love with a play to the point that you know when it is coming.
I think that's what irks a lot of fans about him and or his play calling.

Kruunch
10-29-2012, 02:36 PM
Agreed and I always thought we were a good screen team with Derrick Ward as well.

There are a couple of things that dictate running a screen:

1) You have to have the personnel for it (especially the running back or WR or whoever you're throwing the screen to).

2) You have to be facing the right defense (you want a defense that over pursues and doesn't honor its containment ... especially at the second level).

3) You have to be able to sell it (something we don't do well anymore).

4) A screen is something that can only be run a couple of times a game ... it's SOOOO easy to defend against if it's part of your normal repertoire.

I wouldn't kill KG for attempting the bubble screen here and there. A lot of times those plays are just to keep defenses honest.

Something I haven't seen a lot of lately which we used to run ALL the time ... the wheel route to the FB (affectionately known as the Hedge**** Play (poor Hedge ... even his name is filtered now)). Hynoski does a really great job of turning those routes up field.

P.S. - Anyone killing KG doesn't know football. Period.

alentown pa
10-29-2012, 03:22 PM
There are a couple of things that dictate running a screen:

1) You have to have the personnel for it (especially the running back or WR or whoever you're throwing the screen to).

2) You have to be facing the right defense (you want a defense that over pursues and doesn't honor its containment ... especially at the second level).

3) You have to be able to sell it (something we don't do well anymore).

4) A screen is something that can only be run a couple of times a game ... it's SOOOO easy to defend against if it's part of your normal repertoire.

I wouldn't kill KG for attempting the bubble screen here and there. A lot of times those plays are just to keep defenses honest.

Something I haven't seen a lot of lately which we used to run ALL the time ... the wheel route to the FB (affectionately known as the Hedge**** Play (poor Hedge ... even his name is filtered now)). Hynoski does a really great job of turning those routes up field.

P.S. - Anyone killing KG doesn't know football. Period.

agreed on everything, I like when they would run the wheel play to the FB around the goaline its a hard play to defend when all you need is 2 or 3 yards and I could be wrong but I think I remember them running that in the season finale last year against Dallas with a lot of sucess...to your point about running the screen against the right defense, this would be a good week for that with Pittsburg and their blitzes

sheepdip
10-29-2012, 03:46 PM
So all you Killdrive supporters think that if we brought in Bills OC or Miami's OC we would just become a rank 25 th offense ??? ahahahaha
man seriously and I dont know football.

Why dont you supporters go and look at last years #'s and count how many plays our Wr's made that was a designed 7 yard play or so and took it to the house ??. How many plays did Cruz make for us. he pretty much saved our season but yet Killdrive is the reason ?. Bottom line is we have Talent at WR and Qb and a veteran team and if any OC in the league was coaching this offense they would be in the top 10.
I can live with him as our OC but I would never call him great. His play calling on certain downs and his pass happiness is what frustrates me and I have watched him since SD days and on.

moosedrool
10-29-2012, 03:50 PM
Why dont you supporters go and look at last years #'s


Uh, I did. Super Bowl trophy still not good enough for you?