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TheAnalyst
11-01-2012, 12:48 PM
So here we sit again, half way through another season, with great expectations. 6-2 at the mid point has many of us thinking REPEAT, or at least giving us a shot.

I created a chart that breaks down the Tom Coughlin Era Giants into seasons by half. 8 games on one side, 8 games on another. I wanted to really see how our schedule affects our W/L results.

http://a4.ec-images.myspacecdn.com/images02/55/bfee5c4245b54397b4a50d3fcb178645/l.jpg


On the left is a break down of the Giants seasonal W/L record. The first 8 games on the left and the last 8 games on the right. As you can see, we always have started great under TC. Our best first half was in 2008 at 7-1 (in Blue) while our worst was 2004 5-3 (Kurt Warner) (in red) and 2009 at 5-3.

As you can see, every single season for the past 8 years, we had a better W/L record in the first half of the year as opposed to the 2nd half. Our best second halves were in 2005 and 2008 at 5-3, while our worst was 1-7 in 2004, the rookie years for both TC and Eli.

I then wanted to break down he Strength of Schedule to see if that was playing a major role in our second half collapses. The answer was a pretty bold absolutely.

On the right side of the chart, I broke down the opponents W/L record and % into halves to match up with our half seasons. The first halves ranged from opponent winning % from .391 in 2008 to .484 in 2006. We never had a first half season under TC that our opponents were combined to be above .500 for the FULL SEASON.

Then I looked at the 2nd half of the opponents seasons. The winning % for that ranged from .484 as the low in 2010, to a ridiculous .625 in 2008. Only ONE 2nd half season we played a schedule where the opponents were held UNDER a .500 record for the full season.

So, according to this, our schedule has consistently/ always been much tougher in the second half of the seasons with TC. EVERY SINGLE SEASON! And it's not just by a little, it's by a wide margin. For example, our closest first half to second half gap was in 2005 and 2010, by .062 % or an 8 game difference. Largest was a .234 margin, or 30 games in 2008.

Our best record of 12-4 in 2008 was propelled by the worst win % by opponents (.391) of TC's era here in the first half, followed by the hardest (.625) in the second. For the year the opponents had a Win % of .516 and a record of 130-126.

In 2012, it looks to be the same. We are 6-2, with an opponents win % at .397 for the seasons UP TO THIS POINT. The second half of our season based on the opponents we are playing, the win % jumps up to .552 for the year. So we are on pace this season once again to continue the trend. Signs all point to another second half let down when compared to the first half.

I don't have time to analyze all the NFL teams but I'm pretty sure this is not the norm.

So when we are more beat up toward the end of the year, we play our toughest opponents, every year under TC. And people wonder why we struggle in the second half of seasons and have to "sneak" into the playoffs.

I do, however think this is slightly beneficial to us as it really tests us up to the playoffs and prepares our teams.

Obviously there are some other variables out there that contribute, but I thought this was pretty crazy how our schedule, year after year, is so much more difficult going from the first half to the second half.

What do you guys think?

BParcells777
11-01-2012, 12:55 PM
I think you have too much time on your hands, Stats are for losers and in every 2nd half loss we improved our opponents win % by one game LOL

Why is then when we ge to the post season where we play the undisputed best teams in the NFL we maul them and win SB's?????????

I blame the 2nd half collapses on Coughlins inability to motivate, innovate, make changes and stubborn insistence on not playing rookies and bench players unless forced to.

Once in the playoffs motivation becomes more self guided

But nice job on the stats and helping me to understand what I already knew.......not the strength of schedule part, the mopey un-inspired 2nd half play on the part of our players, and coaches

TheAnalyst
11-01-2012, 01:15 PM
Really? You don't think it has anything to do with us having the Bucs, Panthers, Browns in the first half this year and the Packers, Saints, Steelers, Ravens, Falcons in the second half?

And yes, I have too much time on my hands. I enjoy it though and like breaking down numbers, what can I say.

rEaS
11-01-2012, 01:44 PM
I think you have too much time on your hands, Stats are for losers and in every 2nd half loss we improved our opponents win % by one game LOL

Why is then when we ge to the post season where we play the undisputed best teams in the NFL we maul them and win SB's?????????

I blame the 2nd half collapses on Coughlins inability to motivate, innovate, make changes and stubborn insistence on not playing rookies and bench players unless forced to.

Once in the playoffs motivation becomes more self guided

But nice job on the stats and helping me to understand what I already knew.......not the strength of schedule part, the mopey un-inspired 2nd half play on the part of our players, and coaches

geesh.. take a chill pill..

it's actually a good breakdown.. some years it's been very easy to spot from the beginning of the season that the last few games are going to be a lot harder.. this season is no exception.. we got some 'freebies' in the first half but the second half is all divisional games and tough opponents.. we probably will not have a 6-2 record in the second half.. but i would be more than content with a 5-3 or even a 4-4 if that gets us into the playoffs..

Giants5699
11-01-2012, 01:46 PM
I don't care what happens, as long as we win a championship

BParcells777
11-01-2012, 01:52 PM
Packers, Saints, Steelers, Ravens, Falcons
ALL 2ND RATE PUNK TEAMS

We will destroy the toothless Steelers, the Saints are one of the leagues worst teams
The Ravens are a JOKE- another Harbaugh ground into the turf

FALCONS FALCONS............is that the same team we pummeled 26-2, and dragged them up and down their own home field embarassing them in front of their families????????? (DITTO for poor PACKERS)? GIVE ME A FRIGGEN BREAK..........they will wish they only lost 26-2 this time around........we eat Harbaughs for breakfast

This is not your fathers Giants team.........this 2nd half will be 8-0 Giants (14-2) SWEEP through the playoffs to the magical 5th Lombardi to complete the Chevron.........you heard it here 1st

BParcells777
11-01-2012, 01:56 PM
you forgot one thing........all these poor teams must face the WORLD CHAMPIONS, and we have added 40% more power this year with the two Browns and others

we just had our mid-season funk and we still won

TheAnalyst
11-01-2012, 02:20 PM
Hey, BP777, put down the coffee or pipe or whatever it is you got there. It's all good man.

SweetZombieJesus
11-01-2012, 02:40 PM
I still think there's more to the failures than statistics (although this certainly is a component), but thank you for laying it out in such detail.

Complete the trilogy and do the stats for each playoff run... I'm sure the numbers in 2007 and 2011 are going to be bonkers.

BParcells777
11-01-2012, 03:42 PM
Hey, BP777, put down the coffee or pipe or whatever it is you got there. It's all good man.

you realy think any of these teams stand a chance against us????

we only struggle with NFC East teams..........all others are cattle fodder

DemandedAce
11-01-2012, 04:23 PM
There is a reason for this. Most of the time divisional games are later in the season and we have a tough division and we beat up on the lesser teams in the first half generally

GreenZone
11-01-2012, 04:31 PM
First, analyst, thanks for the work. Second, how about sharing it on a free Live.com account and Skydrive, using the excel format? It's hard to read when turning a wide format spreadsheet into an image file with a narrow column to work with.

Third, it is incredibly demoralizing for someone to come on the site and right away slam someone who actually puts some work and thought into their post and trash it with a "too much time" comment.

If you add up all the time that some posters spend trashing or with inane useless or worse comments, it can easily far surpass the time to do a thoughtful post.

In any event, I for one am anxious to study these further.

BParcells777
11-01-2012, 04:35 PM
Hey, BP777, put down the coffee or pipe or whatever it is you got there. It's all good man.

I'm not smoking anything........how do you think opponets feel who constanty get the losing end of the stick. The Giants are a team to be feared.

Truth be known we have not even gotten it into gear yet......our best effort was against SFO and even then we were still kicking a lot of Field Goals.....it was turnovers that buried San Fran.....6 I believe it was

We lost to Philly by bad end of game coaching, and we just were not ready for the season the 1st go round with Dallas..........We will gain MO as the season progresses not lose it.

This team has a lot more firepower than the 2011 ediition, or really any of Coughlins prior squads. the trend the OP has picked up upon was already well known.....as with all trends this one will end.

The sad thing is even if we win out there will be doubters on here pummeling Blackburn etc

To achieve this dream though we really really would make things easier by inserting Andre Brown in the starting line-up and use Bradshaw as a relief runner to close out games

TheAnalyst
11-01-2012, 04:40 PM
This team has a lot more firepower than the 2011 ediition, or really any of Coughlins prior squads. the trend the OP has picked up upon was already well known.....as with all trends this one will end.



Would you rather I do an in depth presentation on an Eli vs Ben thread? I don't think that has been discussed enough yet.

BParcells777
11-01-2012, 04:40 PM
First, analyst, thanks for the work. Second, how about sharing it on a free Live.com account and Skydrive, using the excel format? It's hard to read when turning a wide format spreadsheet into an image file with a narrow column to work with.

Third, it is incredibly demoralizing for someone to come on the site and right away slam someone who actually puts some work and thought into their post and trash it with a "too much time" comment.

If you add up all the time that some posters spend trashing or with inane useless or worse comments, it can easily far surpass the time to do a thoughtful post.

In any event, I for one am anxious to study these further.

Im not slamming anything.....its an interesting hypothisis but we ARE the NFL's best team and we do not seem to care how well rated our opponents are......we struggle mentally with poor teams not good ones, so frankly what is the point of pointing out the strength of schedule. If you are #1 it does not matter.

With the Giants I'd be more worried if we were facing the 8 worst teams in the league, all home games.

IT is home games not sterling opponents we have trouble with........I think Coughlin is only plus 2 for all home games over 9 years as HC.

rtr1105
11-01-2012, 04:43 PM
Packers, Saints, Steelers, Ravens, Falcons
ALL 2ND RATE PUNK TEAMS

We will destroy the toothless Steelers, the Saints are one of the leagues worst teams
The Ravens are a JOKE- another Harbaugh ground into the turf

FALCONS FALCONS............is that the same team we pummeled 26-2, and dragged them up and down their own home field embarassing them in front of their families????????? (DITTO for poor PACKERS)? GIVE ME A FRIGGEN BREAK..........they will wish they only lost 26-2 this time around........we eat Harbaughs for breakfast

This is not your fathers Giants team.........this 2nd half will be 8-0 Giants (14-2) SWEEP through the playoffs to the magical 5th Lombardi to complete the Chevron.........you heard it here 1st

We beat the Falcons at our stadium.

TheAnalyst
11-01-2012, 04:46 PM
Im not slamming anything.....its an interesting hypothisis but we ARE the NFL's best team and we do not seem to care how well rated our opponents are......we sruggle mentally with poor teams not good ones, so frankly what is the point of pointing out the strength of schedule. If you are #1 it does not matter.

With the Giants I'd be more worried if we were facing the 8 worst teams in the league.

Yes all trends end, but this has been going on since 2004, not for just 3 or 4 years. For 8 going on 9. I'm pretty confident we all knew we had a tough schedule on the back half, but I'm also pretty confident most people don't know how much the way I put it out there, or that it has been Coughlins entire tenure here.
Ease up bud.

If you don't like my analysis, move along and don't respond. I'm sure some people will enjoy it.

BParcells777
11-01-2012, 05:12 PM
I like your analysis .......this team struggles with the weak teams not the strong ones.........its a mental flaw
Thanks for pointing out the rest of the year should be a boat ride but for the Philly and Skins games.......I appreciate it

I feel much more at ease now.........this should be Coughlins best season

BParcells777
11-01-2012, 05:14 PM
We beat the Falcons at our stadium.

And we would beat them at the Roman Colliseum, or Wembly Stadium...........We have their number

TextureDj
11-01-2012, 07:12 PM
So here we sit again, half way through another season, with great expectations. 6-2 at the mid point has many of us thinking REPEAT, or at least giving us a shot.

*snip*


What do you guys think?Dude, I totally thought Analyst meant something else. Totally relieved, if I ever meet you in person I dont have to feel all weird.

Interesting take on the numbers and what i think it shows more than anything is, at least for the giants, success basically rests on how strong of opponents you face overall. Seems pretty simple but sometimes it takes extraordinary means to point out simple things, like good teams are the ones that win the games they should win, and also win the close ones.

When we do that we succeed.

And again, stoked about the name, wish you would have Analyzed something sooner, errrm, wait. Nevermind.

Rudyy
11-01-2012, 07:22 PM
Dude, I totally thought Analyst meant something else. Totally relieved, if I ever meet you in person I dont have to feel all weird.

Interesting take on the numbers and what i think it shows more than anything is, at least for the giants, success basically rests on how strong of opponents you face overall. Seems pretty simple but sometimes it takes extraordinary means to point out simple things, like good teams are the ones that win the games they should win, and also win the close ones.

When we do that we succeed.

And again, stoked about the name, wish you would have Analyzed something sooner, errrm, wait. Nevermind.I get it. Cause his name has the word anal in it.


lolz.

TheAnalyst
11-01-2012, 08:52 PM
First, analyst, thanks for the work. Second, how about sharing it on a free Live.com account and Skydrive, using the excel format? It's hard to read when turning a wide format spreadsheet into an image file with a narrow column to work with.

Third, it is incredibly demoralizing for someone to come on the site and right away slam someone who actually puts some work and thought into their post and trash it with a "too much time" comment.

If you add up all the time that some posters spend trashing or with inane useless or worse comments, it can easily far surpass the time to do a thoughtful post.

In any event, I for one am anxious to study these further.

thanks you. Appreciate it! I have no idea how to share an excel file though.

Moke
11-01-2012, 08:53 PM
6-2 in the past 3 years? Damn, we amazing.

BParcells777
11-01-2012, 09:12 PM
I hope we dont lose any more games this year.......its quite depressing really

why lose when its so much more fun to win

jomo
11-01-2012, 09:28 PM
So here we sit again, half way through another season, with great expectations. 6-2 at the mid point has many of us thinking REPEAT, or at least giving us a shot.

I created a chart that breaks down the Tom Coughlin Era Giants into seasons by half. 8 games on one side, 8 games on another. I wanted to really see how our schedule affects our W/L results.

http://a4.ec-images.myspacecdn.com/images02/55/bfee5c4245b54397b4a50d3fcb178645/l.jpg


On the left is a break down of the Giants seasonal W/L record. The first 8 games on the left and the last 8 games on the right. As you can see, we always have started great under TC. Our best first half was in 2008 at 7-1 (in Blue) while our worst was 2004 5-3 (Kurt Warner) (in red) and 2009 at 5-3.

As you can see, every single season for the past 8 years, we had a better W/L record in the first half of the year as opposed to the 2nd half. Our best second halves were in 2005 and 2008 at 5-3, while our worst was 1-7 in 2004, the rookie years for both TC and Eli.

I then wanted to break down he Strength of Schedule to see if that was playing a major role in our second half collapses. The answer was a pretty bold absolutely.

On the right side of the chart, I broke down the opponents W/L record and % into halves to match up with our half seasons. The first halves ranged from opponent winning % from .391 in 2008 to .484 in 2006. We never had a first half season under TC that our opponents were combined to be above .500 for the FULL SEASON.

Then I looked at the 2nd half of the opponents seasons. The winning % for that ranged from .484 as the low in 2010, to a ridiculous .625 in 2008. Only ONE 2nd half season we played a schedule where the opponents were held UNDER a .500 record for the full season.

So, according to this, our schedule has consistently/ always been much tougher in the second half of the seasons with TC. EVERY SINGLE SEASON! And it's not just by a little, it's by a wide margin. For example, our closest first half to second half gap was in 2005 and 2010, by .062 % or an 8 game difference. Largest was a .234 margin, or 30 games in 2008.

Our best record of 12-4 in 2008 was propelled by the worst win % by opponents (.391) of TC's era here in the first half, followed by the hardest (.625) in the second. For the year the opponents had a Win % of .516 and a record of 130-126.

In 2012, it looks to be the same. We are 6-2, with an opponents win % at .397 for the seasons UP TO THIS POINT. The second half of our season based on the opponents we are playing, the win % jumps up to .552 for the year. So we are on pace this season once again to continue the trend. Signs all point to another second half let down when compared to the first half.

I don't have time to analyze all the NFL teams but I'm pretty sure this is not the norm.

So when we are more beat up toward the end of the year, we play our toughest opponents, every year under TC. And people wonder why we struggle in the second half of seasons and have to "sneak" into the playoffs.

I do, however think this is slightly beneficial to us as it really tests us up to the playoffs and prepares our teams.

Obviously there are some other variables out there that contribute, but I thought this was pretty crazy how our schedule, year after year, is so much more difficult going from the first half to the second half.

What do you guys think?I believe the league loads the back end of our schedule because we are a good bet for high ratings on national games late in the year. The league also has a policy of backloading division foes late in the season for the same reason. Since our division is one of the strongest, it also contributes to your conclusion.

JJC7301
11-01-2012, 09:44 PM
So here we sit again, half way through another season, with great expectations. 6-2 at the mid point has many of us thinking REPEAT, or at least giving us a shot.

I created a chart that breaks down the Tom Coughlin Era Giants into seasons by half. 8 games on one side, 8 games on another. I wanted to really see how our schedule affects our W/L results.

http://a4.ec-images.myspacecdn.com/images02/55/bfee5c4245b54397b4a50d3fcb178645/l.jpg


On the left is a break down of the Giants seasonal W/L record. The first 8 games on the left and the last 8 games on the right. As you can see, we always have started great under TC. Our best first half was in 2008 at 7-1 (in Blue) while our worst was 2004 5-3 (Kurt Warner) (in red) and 2009 at 5-3.

As you can see, every single season for the past 8 years, we had a better W/L record in the first half of the year as opposed to the 2nd half. Our best second halves were in 2005 and 2008 at 5-3, while our worst was 1-7 in 2004, the rookie years for both TC and Eli.

I then wanted to break down he Strength of Schedule to see if that was playing a major role in our second half collapses. The answer was a pretty bold absolutely.

On the right side of the chart, I broke down the opponents W/L record and % into halves to match up with our half seasons. The first halves ranged from opponent winning % from .391 in 2008 to .484 in 2006. We never had a first half season under TC that our opponents were combined to be above .500 for the FULL SEASON.

Then I looked at the 2nd half of the opponents seasons. The winning % for that ranged from .484 as the low in 2010, to a ridiculous .625 in 2008. Only ONE 2nd half season we played a schedule where the opponents were held UNDER a .500 record for the full season.

So, according to this, our schedule has consistently/ always been much tougher in the second half of the seasons with TC. EVERY SINGLE SEASON! And it's not just by a little, it's by a wide margin. For example, our closest first half to second half gap was in 2005 and 2010, by .062 % or an 8 game difference. Largest was a .234 margin, or 30 games in 2008.

Our best record of 12-4 in 2008 was propelled by the worst win % by opponents (.391) of TC's era here in the first half, followed by the hardest (.625) in the second. For the year the opponents had a Win % of .516 and a record of 130-126.

In 2012, it looks to be the same. We are 6-2, with an opponents win % at .397 for the seasons UP TO THIS POINT. The second half of our season based on the opponents we are playing, the win % jumps up to .552 for the year. So we are on pace this season once again to continue the trend. Signs all point to another second half let down when compared to the first half.

I don't have time to analyze all the NFL teams but I'm pretty sure this is not the norm.

So when we are more beat up toward the end of the year, we play our toughest opponents, every year under TC. And people wonder why we struggle in the second half of seasons and have to "sneak" into the playoffs.

I do, however think this is slightly beneficial to us as it really tests us up to the playoffs and prepares our teams.

Obviously there are some other variables out there that contribute, but I thought this was pretty crazy how our schedule, year after year, is so much more difficult going from the first half to the second half.

What do you guys think?
Nice analysis and thanks for taking the time to compile it. Without the analysis, yeah, come to think of it it does seem like our schedule gets harder as time goes on. It's not like they have a history of blowing "easy" games in the 2nd season. It's usually loses to tough teams.

We also have our strangest games, and biggest let downs, in the 2nd half as well (i.e. the Eagles comeback in 2010).

I like the tough opponents. It hardens the team for the playoff run, but they've got to make the playoffs for it to count.

miked1958
11-01-2012, 09:47 PM
Bottom line is its a conspiracy by the NFL to stack our second half schedule to set us up to fail. (Red) All kidding aside. Compare GB, Pittsburgh, Dallas, SF, NE schedules over same time period. They may have had tough schedules but I bet the NFL didn't stick all the tough teams on one side of the schedule crammed into 8 games

miked1958
11-01-2012, 10:06 PM
Last year they gave us NE as our 8th game then in succession to start 2nd half SF, Philly, NO, GB, Dallas. Then skins, jets and Dallas. But it seems they always do this to us. Even in 08. They set is up with a murderous 5/6 game stretch that even the best of the best would have a hard time with

cva14
11-01-2012, 10:41 PM
I think you are on to something, but I suggest that you divide the season into quarters. Except for the two SB years it looks to me that somehow the Giants get worn down by the fourth quarter of the season. This has been attributed to a defensive collapse. But it appears to me that the Giants lost the time of possession battles in the fourth quarter of the season and the defense was on the field too long. Said another way I think its been the OL which has gotten worn down and subsequently the running game failed to move the ball and retain possession. (These were the "fire Coughlin" seasons) The OL IMHO has been on the small side and was a finesse line. If you look at Parcell's lines they were relative to the opposing defenses very big. He has generally carried that concept from team to team although the execution has sometimes been lacking because he never stayed long enough at any other place to demand and receive the necessary execution. Nevertheless I don't think that late in the non-SB seasons that the OL could line up and knock the DL off the line of scrimmage. More recently our passing game has come on and the line pass blocks very well but they really don't have the ability to move the other guys back in short yardage situations. Out of necesiity we have really become a passing team. Thanx for your thoughts.

Parademon
11-01-2012, 10:43 PM
Good! Let the Falcons have a soft schedule & finish with the #1 seed. I'd rather we go thru a gauntlet of tough teams & be battle tested for the playoffs.

NE had a soft schedule last yr & finished 13-3 & they should have lost to the much tougher Ravens in the AFCCG.

A soft schedule just sets you up for failure in the playoffs when you then have to face teams much tougher & better than those you faced in the regular season.

TheAnalyst
11-05-2012, 10:28 AM
Ahem....

0-1

TC is now 1-8 in the 9th game of the year for the Giants, which is the first 2nd half game.

Is it really a shock we lost this game? No. Maybe it is HOW we lost the game though.

Eli? Can't he just pretend this is the playoffs? It's like he does't give a crap all of a sudden. His passes have been terrible. Very very inacurate. And is it Eli or Gilbride that has control over throwing the ball up for grabs over and over agian hoping the WR makes a play? It's pathetic. 3rd and 1, and we throw a 20 yard pass to Randle? And there was about 6-7 throws Eli threw the ball 40 yards deep. It's the definition of chuck and duck. This offense is quite simply embarrassing for the level of talent this team has. Gilbride's job security has to be up in the air, just like his style of offense. We need to find a way to get backl to ground and pound. And by the way, Doug Martin was snatched from us by the Bucs. Tell me he isn't exactly what we need, not that Gilbride would run him anyway.

Bottom line is, 6-2 start, 0-1 second half so far. Don't expect it to get much better either. Teams have figured Gilbrides offense out and how to stop it, and he is too stubborn to change his ways.

WE NEED TO RUN THE BALL MORE

TheAnalyst
11-12-2012, 10:44 AM
Ahem....

0-1

TC is now 1-8 in the 9th game of the year for the Giants, which is the first 2nd half game.

Is it really a shock we lost this game? No. Maybe it is HOW we lost the game though.

Eli? Can't he just pretend this is the playoffs? It's like he does't give a crap all of a sudden. His passes have been terrible. Very very inacurate. And is it Eli or Gilbride that has control over throwing the ball up for grabs over and over agian hoping the WR makes a play? It's pathetic. 3rd and 1, and we throw a 20 yard pass to Randle? And there was about 6-7 throws Eli threw the ball 40 yards deep. It's the definition of chuck and duck. This offense is quite simply embarrassing for the level of talent this team has. Gilbride's job security has to be up in the air, just like his style of offense. We need to find a way to get backl to ground and pound. And by the way, Doug Martin was snatched from us by the Bucs. Tell me he isn't exactly what we need, not that Gilbride would run him anyway.

Bottom line is, 6-2 start, 0-1 second half so far. Don't expect it to get much better either. Teams have figured Gilbrides offense out and how to stop it, and he is too stubborn to change his ways.

WE NEED TO RUN THE BALL MORE

0-2 and blown out by a pathetic Bengals team. See what I said last week for analysis and add in Perry Fewells defense sucks.

TheAnalyst
12-06-2012, 09:43 AM
1-3

The trend continues. We just suck in the second half of seasons. Doesn't matter who we play.

miked1958
12-06-2012, 10:34 AM
1-3

The trend continues. We just suck in the second half of seasons. Doesn't matter who we play.yep and if we dont watch out we drop the next two to match last season collapse of losing 5 of 6 games to drop to 7-7. Difference this time around is i dont think we will still have control of our own destiny like we did last season. All we had to do last year was win our final two games vs jets and dallas and we were in. This year with Skins and Dallas both breathing down our necks and us losing all tie breaking senarios to them i think we would be in a world of trouble if we dont win the next 2. We would have to win the final 2 and hope we get help to get into playoffs this season if the losing trend continues this week vs NO.

miked1958
12-06-2012, 10:36 AM
I also know that Brees has stunk the last 2 weeks vs SF and Falcons throwing 7 picks with two going back to the house. However this team just seems to have our number for whatever reason. I hope i am wrong but i see a shootout... I think we will need our secondary to pick him off 2 or 3 times to win this game

Mercury
12-06-2012, 01:47 PM
I think the whole thing is more of a team/organizational mentality. Do enough to get into the playoffs, and then bring your A game. This team does not play at its best unless they have to. That's why they bring their best games vs. playoff competition and play down to level of less competative teams.

ShakeandBake
12-06-2012, 01:59 PM
Hey, BP777, put down the coffee or pipe or whatever it is you got there. It's all good man.

he's gone off his meds again, pay no mind

joemorrisforprez
12-06-2012, 02:10 PM
So here we sit again, half way through another season, with great expectations. 6-2 at the mid point has many of us thinking REPEAT, or at least giving us a shot.

I created a chart that breaks down the Tom Coughlin Era Giants into seasons by half. 8 games on one side, 8 games on another. I wanted to really see how our schedule affects our W/L results.

http://a4.ec-images.myspacecdn.com/images02/55/bfee5c4245b54397b4a50d3fcb178645/l.jpg


On the left is a break down of the Giants seasonal W/L record. The first 8 games on the left and the last 8 games on the right. As you can see, we always have started great under TC. Our best first half was in 2008 at 7-1 (in Blue) while our worst was 2004 5-3 (Kurt Warner) (in red) and 2009 at 5-3.

As you can see, every single season for the past 8 years, we had a better W/L record in the first half of the year as opposed to the 2nd half. Our best second halves were in 2005 and 2008 at 5-3, while our worst was 1-7 in 2004, the rookie years for both TC and Eli.

I then wanted to break down he Strength of Schedule to see if that was playing a major role in our second half collapses. The answer was a pretty bold absolutely.

On the right side of the chart, I broke down the opponents W/L record and % into halves to match up with our half seasons. The first halves ranged from opponent winning % from .391 in 2008 to .484 in 2006. We never had a first half season under TC that our opponents were combined to be above .500 for the FULL SEASON.

Then I looked at the 2nd half of the opponents seasons. The winning % for that ranged from .484 as the low in 2010, to a ridiculous .625 in 2008. Only ONE 2nd half season we played a schedule where the opponents were held UNDER a .500 record for the full season.

So, according to this, our schedule has consistently/ always been much tougher in the second half of the seasons with TC. EVERY SINGLE SEASON! And it's not just by a little, it's by a wide margin. For example, our closest first half to second half gap was in 2005 and 2010, by .062 % or an 8 game difference. Largest was a .234 margin, or 30 games in 2008.

Our best record of 12-4 in 2008 was propelled by the worst win % by opponents (.391) of TC's era here in the first half, followed by the hardest (.625) in the second. For the year the opponents had a Win % of .516 and a record of 130-126.

In 2012, it looks to be the same. We are 6-2, with an opponents win % at .397 for the seasons UP TO THIS POINT. The second half of our season based on the opponents we are playing, the win % jumps up to .552 for the year. So we are on pace this season once again to continue the trend. Signs all point to another second half let down when compared to the first half.

I don't have time to analyze all the NFL teams but I'm pretty sure this is not the norm.

So when we are more beat up toward the end of the year, we play our toughest opponents, every year under TC. And people wonder why we struggle in the second half of seasons and have to "sneak" into the playoffs.

I do, however think this is slightly beneficial to us as it really tests us up to the playoffs and prepares our teams.

Obviously there are some other variables out there that contribute, but I thought this was pretty crazy how our schedule, year after year, is so much more difficult going from the first half to the second half.

What do you guys think?

Great analysis....I agree that our 2nd half performance is affected by the strength of schedule.

The Giants start off reasonably healthy, against weaker teams....and then in the 2nd half, they have to run a gauntlet, and usually have some key guys who are injured or else not 100%.

GameTime
12-06-2012, 02:16 PM
Really? You don't think it has anything to do with us having the Bucs, Panthers, Browns in the first half this year and the Packers, Saints, Steelers, Ravens, Falcons in the second half?

And yes, I have too much time on my hands. I enjoy it though and like breaking down numbers, what can I say.

wow.....that took some time...nice job...

results are 2 SB wins in 5 years. IMO....and not discounting your informaiton and hard work, I dont care when they win or lose so much as to if they get in the playoffs and win a championship. Not saying I dont care when they lose but if the end of the season results in a Lombardi then thats the goal

TheAnalyst
12-06-2012, 04:10 PM
wow.....that took some time...nice job...

results are 2 SB wins in 5 years. IMO....and not discounting your informaiton and hard work, I dont care when they win or lose so much as to if they get in the playoffs and win a championship. Not saying I dont care when they lose but if the end of the season results in a Lombardi then thats the goal

Very true. that is all that matters. BUT, it would be alot easier for this team if they didn't collapse every year in the second half.

By the way, I see us going 2-2 in the next 4.

GameTime
12-06-2012, 04:13 PM
Very true. that is all that matters. BUT, it would be alot easier for this team if they didn't collapse every year in the second half.

By the way, I see us going 2-2 in the next 4.
me too.....and 9-7 sucks IMO considering thegames the lost and should have won. Whether that gets them in or not is moot....9-7 still blows.

TheAnalyst
12-06-2012, 04:14 PM
me too.....and 9-7 sucks IMO considering thegames the lost and should have won. Whether that gets them in or not is moot....9-7 still blows.

Funny thing is, we probably lose to the Saints and Eagles and beat the Falcons and Ravens.

miked1958
12-06-2012, 07:03 PM
Funny thing is, we probably lose to the Saints and Eagles and beat the Falcons and Ravens.knowing the giants that's just what they'll do, lol

Parademon
12-06-2012, 11:01 PM
Going 2-2 will cost us the playoffs as a tie with the Skins at 9-7 will give em the division if 2 of their Ws are vs Dallas/Philly. 3-1 will most likely win us the NFCE as the best I see the Skins going is 3-1 while Dallas goes 2-2 at best.

The chart provided by Analyst is very accurate & makes me wonder of the NFL does this on purpose to the Giants. Puts the creampuff teams in the 1st half & the contenders/division games in the 2nd half.

Maybe if the D can stop salivating over the other teams best players, and the O can score 6s in the RZ, we can actually win the division.

TheAnalyst
12-07-2012, 10:11 AM
Ok, we NEED to win this Saints game. NEED TO. It is officially in must win mode.

But this has me scared to death:

Saints @ Giants (-4.5)
http://i.imgur.com/laYB2.png (http://i.imgur.com/laYB2.png)

TheAnalyst
12-17-2012, 12:17 PM
2-4

Something has to be done about these lat season collapses. It obviously starts up top because we have almost a completely new team from the 2005-2008 seasons. Same results. The only constant is Eli Gilbride and Coughlin, in being completely inconsistant.

Honestly, we are doing the exact same thing we did last year, but this year we don't have control of our own destiny.

Basically to win the divison, we need to win our 2 games and have at least the Skins or Cowboys lose next weekend. Skins play the Eagles and the Cowboys play the Saints, so that does not look good. Then we need the team that won in week 16 to lose when the Boys play the Skins in week 17. For us to win the wildcard, we need to win both and have the Seahawks, Bears, Vikings losing.
There is still a ray of hope, just like last year at week 16. So, we arent done yet.

From 6-2 and a 3 game lead, to 2-4 and a 1/2 game out to 2 teams.

Toadofsteel
12-17-2012, 12:21 PM
2-4

Something has to be done about these lat season collapses. It obviously starts up top because we have almost a completely new team from the 2005-2008 seasons. Same results. The only constant is Eli Gilbride and Coughlin, in being completely inconsistant.

Honestly, we are doing the exact same thing we did last year, but this year we don't have control of our own destiny.

Basically to win the divison, we need to win our 2 games and have at least the Skins or Cowboys lose next weekend. Skins play the Eagles and the Cowboys play the Saints, so that does not look good. Then we need the team that won in week 16 to lose when the Boys play the Skins in week 17. For us to win the wildcard, we need to win both and have the Seahawks, Bears, Vikings losing.
There is still a ray of hope, just like last year at week 16. So, we arent done yet.

From 6-2 and a 3 game lead, to 2-4 and a 1/2 game out to 2 teams.

If we win out we're guaranteed a wild card seed, but that's far from a given if the jekyll team shows up again...

TheAnalyst
12-17-2012, 12:24 PM
If we win out we're guaranteed a wild card seed, but that's far from a given if the jekyll team shows up again...

I stand corected then. Lets roll out another 6 game win streak then. Remember how bad we were all feeling after our week 15 loss to the Redskins last year that put us at 7-7? Same thing. Time to buckle the seatbelts and let it all out.

TheAnalyst
12-24-2012, 01:50 AM
And...

6-2 start, to 2-5 finish.

Someone explain.

Last 2 games looked like in 2009 when Sheridan was running the ship.

Parademon
12-24-2012, 02:01 AM
No heart. This team should be ashamed to have gone from 6-2 & 2.5 games up to where they are now! Look at what the Colts have been able to do this yr with a rookie QB & really no big names on the roster. 10-5 & the playoffs, while we are 8-7 & on life support. Pathetic 2nd half showing..again!

TheAnalyst
12-24-2012, 03:53 PM
Pathetic.

Honestly, I wouldn't mind a staff change. Yeah, we won 2 SBs, but it was still a 9-7 team last year with the 32nd ranked run game and bottom 5 defense. We just got hot at the right time and rode it.

Obviously Mara wont fire Reese who won't fire coughlin, but TC needs to seriously reconsider his coordinating options. How can you not see how bad we are struggling the simple things? 12 men on the field on a kneel down? Eli still snapping the ball with 1 second left on the play clock or buring time outs? Never having a screen as an option when the oline breaks down? No quick slants?

I think the new era may be closer then we think.

Guys like Webster, Boley, Tuck, Osi, Diehl, Snee, Baas, Nicks, Bradshaw may all be gone very soon.

TheAnalyst
01-02-2013, 12:10 PM
From 6-2 to 3-5.

Look for another split like this next year if we keep the staff together.

TheAnalyst
08-16-2013, 01:56 PM
Pathetic.

Honestly, I wouldn't mind a staff change. Yeah, we won 2 SBs, but it was still a 9-7 team last year with the 32nd ranked run game and bottom 5 defense. We just got hot at the right time and rode it.

Obviously Mara wont fire Reese who won't fire coughlin, but TC needs to seriously reconsider his coordinating options. How can you not see how bad we are struggling the simple things? 12 men on the field on a kneel down? Eli still snapping the ball with 1 second left on the play clock or buring time outs? Never having a screen as an option when the oline breaks down? No quick slants?

I think the new era may be closer then we think.

Guys like Webster, Boley, Tuck, Osi, Diehl, Snee, Baas, Nicks, Bradshaw may all be gone very soon.

Well, almost there....

Bump for nhpgiantsfan (http://boards.giants.com/member.php?26140-nhpgiantsfan)

DragonSoul
08-16-2013, 03:49 PM
Nicely done. I have been saying it for years that our schedule has been consistently the toughest (top 3-5) over the years. Usually in our division we have always had the toughest or 2nd toughest schedule in recent years.... This years schedule seems to be a bit easier from a quick glance. Hopefully we can take advantage of that.

I agree with you that it does make us battle tested, but thats if we can make it into the big dance. The other issues are, injuries and the horrible refs...


So here we sit again, half way through another season, with great expectations. 6-2 at the mid point has many of us thinking REPEAT, or at least giving us a shot.

I created a chart that breaks down the Tom Coughlin Era Giants into seasons by half. 8 games on one side, 8 games on another. I wanted to really see how our schedule affects our W/L results.

http://a4.ec-images.myspacecdn.com/images02/55/bfee5c4245b54397b4a50d3fcb178645/l.jpg


On the left is a break down of the Giants seasonal W/L record. The first 8 games on the left and the last 8 games on the right. As you can see, we always have started great under TC. Our best first half was in 2008 at 7-1 (in Blue) while our worst was 2004 5-3 (Kurt Warner) (in red) and 2009 at 5-3.

As you can see, every single season for the past 8 years, we had a better W/L record in the first half of the year as opposed to the 2nd half. Our best second halves were in 2005 and 2008 at 5-3, while our worst was 1-7 in 2004, the rookie years for both TC and Eli.

I then wanted to break down he Strength of Schedule to see if that was playing a major role in our second half collapses. The answer was a pretty bold absolutely.

On the right side of the chart, I broke down the opponents W/L record and % into halves to match up with our half seasons. The first halves ranged from opponent winning % from .391 in 2008 to .484 in 2006. We never had a first half season under TC that our opponents were combined to be above .500 for the FULL SEASON.

Then I looked at the 2nd half of the opponents seasons. The winning % for that ranged from .484 as the low in 2010, to a ridiculous .625 in 2008. Only ONE 2nd half season we played a schedule where the opponents were held UNDER a .500 record for the full season.

So, according to this, our schedule has consistently/ always been much tougher in the second half of the seasons with TC. EVERY SINGLE SEASON! And it's not just by a little, it's by a wide margin. For example, our closest first half to second half gap was in 2005 and 2010, by .062 % or an 8 game difference. Largest was a .234 margin, or 30 games in 2008.

Our best record of 12-4 in 2008 was propelled by the worst win % by opponents (.391) of TC's era here in the first half, followed by the hardest (.625) in the second. For the year the opponents had a Win % of .516 and a record of 130-126.

In 2012, it looks to be the same. We are 6-2, with an opponents win % at .397 for the seasons UP TO THIS POINT. The second half of our season based on the opponents we are playing, the win % jumps up to .552 for the year. So we are on pace this season once again to continue the trend. Signs all point to another second half let down when compared to the first half.

I don't have time to analyze all the NFL teams but I'm pretty sure this is not the norm.

So when we are more beat up toward the end of the year, we play our toughest opponents, every year under TC. And people wonder why we struggle in the second half of seasons and have to "sneak" into the playoffs.

I do, however think this is slightly beneficial to us as it really tests us up to the playoffs and prepares our teams.

Obviously there are some other variables out there that contribute, but I thought this was pretty crazy how our schedule, year after year, is so much more difficult going from the first half to the second half.

What do you guys think?