PDA

View Full Version : Why Mark Herlzlich might not have played as bad as it seems.



NYGBandit
11-08-2012, 05:05 AM
I'll set the tone for you.. I'm playing semi-pro football for a scrub team in western mass...

I'm playing CB in a cover 2 defense...

I pressed the WR to the outside and released him about 2-3 yards from the sideline... I drifted underneath him for about 5 yards not committing passed 10 yards from the line of scrimmage... then I saw it entered an all out sprint... the quarterback threw a 20 yard pass to him and I got there just in top to make a stop as he caught the ball at the 5.

I thought to myself... damn I stopped a touchdown, I'm a hero... my teammates on the sideline who didn't know the call was cover 2... are screaming for my head, and that I was jogging underneath and should be benched.

To put it in perspective, I doubt sincerely that Herzlich was supposed to be in some of the positions he was in after watching the game again. Namely in a couple of his pass coverages where he looks flat out beaten, could actually be a great recognition play... There was 4-5 times where he did have to go into coverage where he doesn't look to be struggling covering people.

I'm not saying he's an all star, just saying, some of those plays were bad... but some of them, might not have been as bad as first look.

UK-Giantsfan
11-08-2012, 05:24 AM
an interesting point and intelligently put .......i thought that Herzlich had a mediocre game .......but not an awful game ......considering that our DT's were owned all night long by the Steelers ...our inability to stop the run was not all the fault of our Mlb

Rat_bastich
11-08-2012, 05:54 AM
While I won't condemn Herzlich, one thing I did notice about alot of his plays were that even when he was in position he wasn't the one who initiated contact. He usually swooped in after someone else made the tackle and pretty much "two hand touched" the already downed player. I'm not going to say he is afraid of contact but he looked hesitant. Maybe he had alot going on with leading the defense.

I like the guy. Besides a feel good story, the guy was a top linebacker in college and a Boston College guy that we know TC loves. I think the potential is there but I don't know what is wrong.

BParcells777
11-08-2012, 07:10 AM
Are you kidding me?

Marvelousmik
11-08-2012, 07:30 AM
I'll set the tone for you.. I'm playing semi-pro football for a scrub team in western mass...

I'm playing CB in a cover 2 defense...

I pressed the WR to the outside and released him about 2-3 yards from the sideline... I drifted underneath him for about 5 yards not committing passed 10 yards from the line of scrimmage... then I saw it entered an all out sprint... the quarterback threw a 20 yard pass to him and I got there just in top to make a stop as he caught the ball at the 5.

I thought to myself... damn I stopped a touchdown, I'm a hero... my teammates on the sideline who didn't know the call was cover 2... are screaming for my head, and that I was jogging underneath and should be benched.

To put it in perspective, I doubt sincerely that Herzlich was supposed to be in some of the positions he was in after watching the game again. Namely in a couple of his pass coverages where he looks flat out beaten, could actually be a great recognition play... There was 4-5 times where he did have to go into coverage where he doesn't look to be struggling covering people.

I'm not saying he's an all star, just saying, some of those plays were bad... but some of them, might not have been as bad as first look.

cool story.

herlzlich played bad

UK-Giantsfan
11-08-2012, 07:38 AM
Are you kidding me?

Jack ......yesterday you were advocating that the Giants moved JPP to Middle Linebacker .......................are you kidding me ! ?

bigblue58
11-08-2012, 07:57 AM
I'll set the tone for you.. I'm playing semi-pro football for a scrub team in western mass...

I'm playing CB in a cover 2 defense...

I pressed the WR to the outside and released him about 2-3 yards from the sideline... I drifted underneath him for about 5 yards not committing passed 10 yards from the line of scrimmage... then I saw it entered an all out sprint... the quarterback threw a 20 yard pass to him and I got there just in top to make a stop as he caught the ball at the 5.

I thought to myself... damn I stopped a touchdown, I'm a hero... my teammates on the sideline who didn't know the call was cover 2... are screaming for my head, and that I was jogging underneath and should be benched.

To put it in perspective, I doubt sincerely that Herzlich was supposed to be in some of the positions he was in after watching the game again. Namely in a couple of his pass coverages where he looks flat out beaten, could actually be a great recognition play... There was 4-5 times where he did have to go into coverage where he doesn't look to be struggling covering people.

I'm not saying he's an all star, just saying, some of those plays were bad... but some of them, might not have been as bad as first look.


Lets face it....we haven't had a good run stopping D lineman since Strahan retired!

nycisgreat
11-08-2012, 08:00 AM
cool story.

herlzlich played bad

+199

giantscolombia
11-08-2012, 08:35 AM
cool story.

herlzlich played bad

hahahahahah

Zaggs
11-08-2012, 08:41 AM
Yes, yes it was. His pass coverage was awful. This wasn't about herzlich perhaps having multiple assignments to worry about. It was about how you could see which man he had, and just being late to react to their moves.

JayMas9
11-08-2012, 08:54 AM
He didn't play nearly as bad as some would have you believe. He did not play well though. Like Chase, he was not able to get off a lot of blocks and make stops that were for minimal gains.

TheAnalyst
11-08-2012, 08:58 AM
Nah, Herz just isn't a MLB in the NFL right now. Maybe one day he will get better, but right now, he is a STer. He missed tackles, hasn't found the ball well, and can not cover. Chase is better then him in all 3 of those aspects. CHASE BLACKBURN.

DaKraken
11-08-2012, 09:01 AM
cool story.

herlzlich played bad

+200

BlueSanta
11-08-2012, 09:33 AM
Even if your story did relate to Herzlich's play, which I do not think it does, it still doesnt excuse his absolutely horrendous play vs the run.

I think when most people here criticize him for his play last weekend it is because the Steelers went RIGHT AT him in the run game and they did it will massive success.

ryan12
11-08-2012, 09:39 AM
Are you kidding me?

+1

Ruttiger711
11-08-2012, 09:48 AM
On the Wallace td play, Herzlich wound up right where tuck usually lines up when the pass was actually thrown. Wallace caught this pass uncontested near the middle of the field and a few strides later he was at full speed and no one has a chance then.

Herzlich's fault? I'm not making a statement either way, I dont know. My uneducated guess is that he looked like he ran himself out of position.

BlueReign
11-08-2012, 10:08 AM
He's young. He didn't have a great game against the Steelers, but he will work it out.

ReiRiza
11-08-2012, 10:27 AM
He's young. He didn't have a great game against the Steelers, but he will work it out.
Exactly. Let the man play a few games before we go crazy

GameTime
11-08-2012, 10:43 AM
Are you kidding me?

why???? you say dumb *** stuff all the time....:)

GameTime
11-08-2012, 10:45 AM
he had a rough game. He is not the only one who is supposed to make tackles up the middle though. The whole D fell apart in that regard...

GMENAGAIN
11-08-2012, 10:48 AM
he had a rough game. He is not the only one who is supposed to make tackles up the middle though. The whole D fell apart in that regard...

+1

ryan12
11-08-2012, 10:49 AM
he had a rough game. He is not the only one who is supposed to make tackles up the middle though. The whole D fell apart in that regard...

not the only one true but the middle lb job is protecting the middle and he had a horrible game... maybe he had the jitters or something but i thought he looked soild in preseason and lost last sunday that being said hope the kid figures it out cuz i think he can be a good lb maybe not a middle at this point

TheAnalyst
11-08-2012, 12:54 PM
Exactly. Let the man play a few games before we go crazy

Tough timing to let him test it out a few games to see if it works. We need this Bengals win. Personally,. I thought Greg Jones was a better MLB right now. Is he on our PS?

moosedrool
11-08-2012, 12:55 PM
On the Wallace td play, Herzlich wound up right where tuck usually lines up when the pass was actually thrown. Wallace caught this pass uncontested near the middle of the field and a few strides later he was at full speed and no one has a chance then.

Herzlich's fault? I'm not making a statement either way, I dont know. My uneducated guess is that he looked like he ran himself out of position.

That was Antrel Rolle's fault. He took a bad angle and turned a 7 yard gain into a 51 yard TD.

TheAnalyst
11-08-2012, 12:57 PM
That was Antrel Rolle's fault. He took a bad angle and turned a 7 yard gain into a 51 yard TD.

Prince didn't sit in his zone either. That was his side of the field. He got sucked into the middle of the field if you watch the replay.

Martyr
11-08-2012, 02:33 PM
Tough timing to let him test it out a few games to see if it works. We need this Bengals win. Personally,. I thought Greg Jones was a better MLB right now. Is he on our PS?

He never made it out of training camp

dave56dj
11-08-2012, 02:54 PM
A person who truly knows the game of football - the x's and o's, is always a more informed opinion then those fans who see a player near the ball and blame him for whatever the offense had just done. I played on fridays in high school and sat in college - many many years ago but i still watch with a basic know how of coverages and the different defenses played. That said going back and watching some of Herzlich's play its really tough to argue for him, except to say he is young and it was one game. He got caught up in the wash FAR to many times and then looked like he was on skates being blocked. The MLB has to sniff some of that out better and be faster to react to the guards movement, he really wasn't. Chase is no great coverage guy either but he has a knack for turning his head which is half the battle. Herzlich was in position a couple of times in zone and simply didn't turn his head. Not a good game from the youngster but he will learn and get better.

That said i think most of the giants backers are more speed and finesse then guys who play very big in between guards. There skill is beating the block - not taking it on. Boley - Jwill - Rivers and even Herz to this point all fit that category. We don't have a beast backer who takes on guards and sheds them and part of this is b/c of fewell's plan of attack which utilizes speed and athletecism more. Chase is probably our best thumper but lacks the speed and athleticism of the other guys.

MattMeyerBud
11-08-2012, 06:19 PM
Even if your story did relate to Herzlich's play, which I do not think it does, it still doesnt excuse his absolutely horrendous play vs the run.

I think when most people here criticize him for his play last weekend it is because the Steelers went RIGHT AT him in the run game and they did it will massive success.

absolutely.

Chase makes our run defense exist and has been since hes been back. Herzlich did have a pretty bad game, but you can't write him off yet. As he had those patch of games last year where he started he was progressively getting better, but hes got to put forth a better performance from here on out.