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View Full Version : I wanted to give my 0.02 on what is wrong with this team



TrueBlue07
12-20-2011, 09:39 PM
It's not one thing, it's a bad combination of a lot of things. First, and foremost, on the defensive side of the ball, this roster is just not that good. Combine injuries, with guys playing out of position, and other guys being asked to take on bigger roles too early in their career, it is the perfect storm for this disaster. Think about it, the 17 or so guys that rotate on to the field defensively, are they really THAT good? Our stud players have for the most part been injured, Osi is a malcontent, and I could go on down the line.

I wouldn't pin all of the problems on Fewell and his scheme. I'm sure anyone who has watched every game over the last two years will acknowledge the scheme has changed from last year. I never liked Fewell's reactionary scheme to begin with, and this year it has gotten worse. I think Fewell is trying to do his best with what he has, but even having said that, at full strength I don't like Fewell's philosophy and hope a change is made there in the off season.

LEADERSHIP: It is not a coincidence that under TC we have collapsed every year except for one. Now personally I tend to put that more on the players than the head coach, but it is easier to get rid of 1 guy than 30. TC is a very good coach, but his time is up. The only way I would bring him back would be if we could get Spags back as the DC and HC in waiting. Give Spags 2 years to develop his skills, figure out his mistakes in STL, and how he'd change. If TC would be up for grooming Spags that would be fantastic. I always felt TC's strength was organization, and running the team at a macro level, not as much about X's and O's. Spags would be very lucky to have a guy with TC's pedigree to teach him the ropes a bit.

Now, as for leadership as it relates to the players, clearly there is none on this team. Remember last season when Tuck & Osi rallied the guys at the half vs Jax? Why doesn't that happen more often? I understand it is not n Tuck's nature to be a "rah rah" guy, but you know what? People are looking to you Tuck. If it doesn't come natural to you, I don't care, adapt, adjust, and light a fire under some asses. This defense has a glass jaw, punch them in the mouth and they won't come back at you. They lack that brutal, disgusting, "I want you to catch that 3 yard pass so I can plant you face first in the turf" mentality. I watch the Ravens and Steelers play defense and they are flying around with such passion. I watch them and say to myself "hot damn, those are some bad MFers". We could use some of that here, and you won't get it from a rookie in the draft.

What frustrates me most about this team is after every unexplainable loss, where the team had a let down we hear the same garbage. They can't explain what went wrong, they don't have answers. How the hell are you going to fix the problem if you don't even know what is causing the problem????!! That's why it keeps happening! I truly believe there is a big time locker room problem that we are not hearing about, and probably won't until the off season, IF there are changes made to the coaching staff.

My first choice would be TC for two more years with Spags (and that's strictly for Spags and not TC). If that doesn't happen I'd want Zimmer from Cincy to take over as the HC.


Sorry for the long post. This crap has been bothering me for a while, it was therapeutic to get it out. lol

Coloradokid
12-21-2011, 06:53 PM
Very good observations! I feel that a major portion of the problems exist at the GM / Scout area. I have stated several times that the GM looks at the players from a scouting perspective and not a player perspective. An example is Prince everyone was GA GA when he fell to the Giants. What did he fall? The answer I believe can be found in TC's statement pertaining to his back problem is revealing. To paraphrase the back problem is a nonoccurrence and has been managed in the past. Why did Prince fall in the draft? Opinion, other GM's avoided the problem. The second round pick was away from Football for over a year but the GM was impressed with the first round potential talent. The LB pick have been very bad check the second round picks we passed on. The GM must begin to pick for some need and avoid the Athletic ability trap he has fallen into. Note when some reporters questioned Hanlon on the weekly show he became very defensive and the question session came to an abrupt halt. The reporter specifically blames the GM or lack of depth and lack of quality depth. I think this is a fair observation

JMFP2
12-21-2011, 06:58 PM
It's not one thing, it's a bad combination of a lot of things.* First, and foremost, on the defensive side of the ball, this roster is just not that good.* Combine injuries, with guys playing out of position, and other guys being asked to take on bigger roles too early in their career, it is the perfect storm for this disaster.* Think about it, the 17 or so guys that rotate on to the field defensively, are they really THAT good?* Our stud players have for the most part been injured, Osi is a malcontent, and I could go on down the line. *

I wouldn't pin all of the problems on Fewell and his scheme.* I'm sure anyone who has watched every game over the last two years will acknowledge the scheme has changed from last year.* I never liked Fewell's reactionary scheme to begin with, and this year it has gotten worse.* I think Fewell is trying to do his best with what he has, but even having said that, at full strength I don't like Fewell's philosophy and hope a change is made there in the off season.

LEADERSHIP: It is not a coincidence that under TC we have collapsed every year except for one.* Now personally I tend to put that more on the players than the head coach, but it is easier to get rid of 1 guy than 30.* TC is a very good coach, but his time is up.* The only way I would bring him back would be if we could get Spags back as the DC and HC in waiting.* Give Spags 2 years to develop his skills, figure out his mistakes in STL, and how he'd change.* If TC would be up for grooming Spags that would be fantastic.* I always felt TC's strength was organization, and running the team at a macro level, not as much about X's and O's.* Spags would be very lucky to have a guy with TC's pedigree to teach him the ropes a bit.

Now, as for leadership as it relates to the players, clearly there is none on this team.* Remember last season when Tuck & Osi rallied the guys at the half vs Jax? Why doesn't that happen more often?* I understand it is not n Tuck's nature to be a "rah rah" guy, but you know what? People are looking to you Tuck.* If it doesn't come natural to you, I don't care, adapt, adjust, and light a fire under some asses.* This defense has a glass jaw, punch them in the mouth and they won't come back at you.* They lack that brutal, disgusting, "I want you to catch that 3 yard pass so I can plant you face first in the turf" mentality.* I watch the Ravens and Steelers play defense and* they are flying around with such passion.* I watch them and say to myself "hot damn, those are some bad MFers".* We could use some of that here, and you won't get it from a rookie in the draft.

What frustrates me most about this team is after every unexplainable loss, where the team had a let down we hear the same garbage. They can't explain what went wrong, they don't have answers.* How the hell are you going to fix the problem if you don't even know what is causing the problem????!! That's why it keeps happening!* I truly believe there is a big time locker room problem that we are not hearing about, and probably won't until the off season, IF there are changes made to the coaching staff.

My first choice would be TC for two more years with Spags (and that's strictly for Spags and not TC).* If that doesn't happen I'd want Zimmer from Cincy to take over as the HC.


Sorry for the long post. This crap has been bothering me for a while, it was therapeutic to get it out. lol


Another great post.

I'd really like to get Spags back, but unless Mara/Tisch break tradition and guarantee him the HC spot after Coughlin leaves, I don't see it happening.

Still, I love the idea.

About the only guy out there I'd want other than Coughlin is Gruden or Jeff Fisher.

Fisher spent his entire career making chicken soup out of his GM's chicken feathers.....he'd be a perfect fit fixing all the issues that Reese's misfires have done to the roster and cap room.

Gruden is a smart, young, energetic coach that would fire up his team and the fanbase. Chuckie in the Meadowlands would be a blast.

Any ex-coach out there - Gruden, Cowher, Fisher, etc.....would JUMP at the chance to coach the Giants. The NFL's flagship team, the cultural capital of the nation.....and an ownership that is extremely patient and loyal.

JMFP2
12-21-2011, 07:08 PM
Very good observations! I feel that a major portion of the problems exist at the GM / Scout area. I have stated several times that the GM looks at the players from a scouting perspective and not a player perspective. An example is Prince everyone was GA GA when he fell to the Giants. What did he fall? The answer I believe can be found in TC's statement pertaining to his back problem is revealing. To paraphrase the back problem is a nonoccurrence and has been managed in the past. Why did Prince fall in the draft? Opinion, other GM's avoided the problem. The second round pick was away from Football for over a year but the GM was impressed with the first round potential talent. The LB pick have been very bad check the second round picks we passed on. The GM must begin to pick for some need and avoid the Athletic ability trap he has fallen into. Note when some reporters questioned Hanlon on the weekly show he became very defensive and the question session came to an abrupt halt. The reporter specifically blames the GM or lack of depth and lack of quality depth. I think this is a fair observation

Totally fair observation. The free agency and draft this season was a failure.

I understand that injuries have alot to do with it. But I reject the cap space argument. The GM is responsible for the cap, so if the team didn't have the money, it's because Reese signed guys to fat money who haven't lived up to their contracts.


I'll give Prince and Austin an incomplete due to their injuries.....but Jernigan in the 3rd was a wasted pick. That was where the LB should have been drafted.

TrueBlue07
12-21-2011, 07:43 PM
A H.U.G.E. issue I had with Reese was how underprepared this team was for the offseason. I understand this was a difficult spot for teams/GMs to be in, but that is no excuse. I normally don't like going crazy in FA, maybe 1 big move here or there, but we couldn't even be players in the market if we wanted to. Who ever the team capologist is needs to be the first one to go. Smith was overpaid, so that move didn't really bother me, as was Boss. As we are seeing this year, Eli & this system can get by with an avg TE. We do have many other areas of need though, and so far I can't really see how not spending this year has set us up for the future.

As for the draft, I also would give Prince & Austin Incomplete's as well. To be honest, it is amazing we are where we are considering we did nothing to improve from last year to this year. Even the guys we drafted really aren't providing any support. With the way the NFL works, we better pray Prince & Austin bounce back next year because you cannot afford to just "punt" a whole draft class.

Whether it comes via trade, FA, or the draft, they absolutely need a difference making LBer on this team. If we don't get one soon, the inability of Reese to figure out this area will quickly become one of his biggest legacies he leaves here.

Coloradokid
12-21-2011, 07:51 PM
Very good observations! I feel that a major portion of the problems exist at the GM / Scout area. I have stated several times that the GM looks at the players from a scouting perspective and not a player perspective. An example is Prince everyone was GA GA when he fell to the Giants. What did he fall? The answer I believe can be found in TC's statement pertaining to his back problem is revealing. To paraphrase the back problem is a nonoccurrence and has been managed in the past. Why did Prince fall in the draft? Opinion, other GM's avoided the problem. The second round pick was away from Football for over a year but the GM was impressed with the first round potential talent. The LB pick have been very bad check the second round picks we passed on. The GM must begin to pick for some need and avoid the Athletic ability trap he has fallen into. Note when some reporters questioned Hanlon on the weekly show he became very defensive and the question session came to an abrupt halt. The reporter specifically blames the GM or lack of depth and lack of quality depth. I think this is a fair observation

Coloradokid
12-21-2011, 07:56 PM
Sorry I riposted my original statements. But another looming problem is the honesty and trust the players have in the GM. The Osi perceptions that he was made a promise then the GM dropped the ball is a cancer that will spread. Trust and honesty in the front office is a building lock that this GM may have cracked.

jaxnygmen
12-21-2011, 10:17 PM
Good post. I do agree with Coloradokid on the gm and scouting issue. I have also said our drafts have been below average. Many of our players are average at best. It is clear to me that they do not put 100% effort in on every play and some even lay down. Why are they not benched then!! I too think TC is a decent coach but his loyalty to those around him has hurt. He needed to dump The special teams coach last year and did not. There are lots of things that need to happen, Lots of these players need to go and we need to re-stock the shelves.

bearbryant
12-22-2011, 01:18 AM
Some very worthwhile points in the preceeding replies. To the whole GM issue, one of the things I was always concerned about was making a scout our GM. Great he's worked in evaluatying talent for most of his pro career but theres a lot more to being a GM than the 40 yd dash and the long jump!

StarWarsGiant
12-22-2011, 08:34 AM
Love your post.
This starts with the FO and trickles down. Spags or no Spags TC has to go. His message what ever that is is fallen on deaf ears.

Fewell is a disaster. this is not a read and react zone league. Its a pressure based league on defense. Since you can't play defense anymore then you have to get in the face of the QB quickly and be physical with the WR's on every down.

Offense is just ok. We need a better oline and more explosive players I think at Rb and TE..

TrueBlue07
12-22-2011, 09:32 AM
JR built his foundations in scouting, but every team has a capologist, unless their GM is known for that, then maybe he takes on both roles. I would assume the Giants have a capologist as well, although it doesn't seem like they do. Maybe someone else can confirm whether or not the Giants employe one?

Reese has had some up's and down's, but overall I like him....for now. When ever I want to criticize JR or TC, I look around the league at some of the people hired who last 1-2 years and then get fired. Neither man is perfect, but IMO they're in the top 15 of their job.

This offseason will be very telling. If they don't address some key areas that have been problems for quite some time then I think Reese may start to feel some major heat from ownership

Mercury
12-22-2011, 09:47 AM
This whole thing is a premature ejaculation. Stop being teenage boys and grow a pair! The season is not over and the post-season is still within reach. If the Giants fail, then start pissing and moaning.

SweetZombieJesus
12-22-2011, 09:49 AM
What frustrates me most about this team is after every unexplainable loss, where the team had a let down we hear the same garbage. They can't explain what went wrong, they don't have answers. How the hell are you going to fix the problem if you don't even know what is causing the problem????!! That's why it keeps happening! I truly believe there is a big time locker room problem that we are not hearing about, and probably won't until the off season, IF there are changes made to the coaching staff.

This right here is what frustrates me most -- that the same problem(s) keep happening over and over and nobody can do anything about it. Obviously because they don't even know what the problem is. What, are they just hoping it won't happen? If you had a guy at your job who just didn't know what he was doing, and made the same mistake 7 out of 8 times, wouldn't you fire him? I'm struggling for an example but if a guy is in a job and doesn't know what he's doing either teach him or get him out.

I'm going to borrow a line from Attenborough in Jurassic Park -- I don't blame people for their mistakes, but I do ask them to pay them.

Learn from your mistakes and address them. Sure it may take you 2 or 3 tries to get it right. Not 7. Not learning from your mistakes is something that should light everybody's fuse in the organization.

They just keep failing the same way over and over and apparently can't fix it. We get the same lame excuses over and over. Mea Culpas and I'm sorry's. FIX IT.


Now, on other matters... I'm not going to say Jerry Reese gets off the hook and I will agree there are some drafting & free agency problems -- specifically our drought at line backer frustrates the hell out of me. Worse that we are coming up empty in the draft that we don't cover for it in free agency -- at least bring in one big name stud to anchor the group.

However, I must point out that we have experienced the same big game duds and late season collapses under different circumstances -- with a different GM (Ernie Accorsie), with different players, with players who were leaders (Tiki, Shockey, Strahan, Pierce).

There are multiple problems, but the largest, most over-arching problems are the inability to fix these duds and collapses, and we all know where we have to assign blame here. It's the only piece that hasn't changed.

SweetZombieJesus
12-22-2011, 09:57 AM
This whole thing is a premature ejaculation. Stop being teenage boys and grow a pair! The season is not over and the post-season is still within reach. If the Giants fail, then start pissing and moaning.


You do follow this team, right?

You also realize that if something happens 7 times in 8 years, it is likely to happen again, right?

http://garciamedialife.files.wordpress.com/2010/09/charlie_brown_lucy_football.jpg