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View Full Version : ppl forget eli's 500 yard game with healthy offense



erivera
12-18-2012, 03:38 PM
when the giants played tampa earlier this season eli had 500 yards, and the giants scored 25 4th quarter points. if you look at the box score of the game. nicks had 10 for 199, cruz was 11 for 179, and bennett was 5 for 72. all three also had td's. andre brown also had 13 carries for 71 yards and avg. 5.5 yards a carry. that game was the high point for the offense. it was also the game where nicks was stepped on after making a catch, and he hasn't been the same since.

i just wanted to point out how reliant this offense is on guys like nicks and a solid running game which brown helped deliver. also in my opinion, the giants didn't really look explosive in those packers and saints game. they were just very effective with what they did.

http://espn.go.com/nfl/boxscore?gameId=320916019

RoanokeFan
12-18-2012, 03:41 PM
Very few are saying this is "Eli's fault." It's the team's fault but ELi, being the captain of the ship, gets too much praise when it sails smooth, and too much blame when approaching the icebergs.

stormblue
12-18-2012, 03:57 PM
he has had 3 or 4 good games ...there is no denying that ....
its the other 10 that are being scrutinized.

this offense is centered around him.
if someone else on the offense is having a bad game
Eli can either work around him...or bring someone else into the game.

if Eli is stinking it up ..there is absolutely nothing anyone can do about it.

Rudyy
12-18-2012, 03:58 PM
he has had 3 or 4 good games ...there is no denying that ....its the other 10 that are being scrutinized.this offense is centered around him.if someone else on the offense is having a bad gameEli can either work around him...or bring someone else into the game.if Eli is stinking it up ..there is absolutely nothing anyone can do about it.How does one "work around" something?

Rusty192
12-18-2012, 04:01 PM
Very few are saying this is "Eli's fault." It's the team's fault but ELi, being the captain of the ship, gets too much praise when it sails smooth, and too much blame when approaching the icebergs.Perhaps people should temper some of the praise when pining over other QB's as well.

Hall of Fame
12-18-2012, 04:02 PM
Very few are saying this is "Eli's fault." It's the team's fault but ELi, being the captain of the ship, gets too much praise when it sails smooth, and too much blame when approaching the icebergs.
RF this is exactly right, but it has to be that way. When he scores 0 points in a game where he looked horrible, we have to point the finger at him. Yeah the team stunk it up, but to come away with 0 points is on Eli. The fact that Atlanta scored over 30 is on the defense.

Rudyy
12-18-2012, 04:03 PM
RF this is exactly right, but it has to be that way. When he scores 0 points in a game where he looked horrible, we have to point the finger at him. Yeah the team stunk it up, but to come away with 0 points is on Eli.No it's not.

Hall of Fame
12-18-2012, 04:05 PM
No it's not.

Enlighten us how its not :)

GameTime
12-18-2012, 04:05 PM
as said in other threads...
the Giants offense has no plan B...if Eli stinks then the whole thing usually sucks
like the Defense...if there is no pass rush it all suffers and usually to the tune of a loss....

of course most teams center their O on the QB....but it seems the Giants cant generate anything if Eli is off....

Rudyy
12-18-2012, 04:06 PM
Enlighten us how its not :)Let me rephrase. It's not all on Eli. Some of it, not all.

Hall of Fame
12-18-2012, 04:07 PM
RF even has another thread about Eli is the root of Giants woes.
Eli Manning's Inconsistency At Root Of Giants' Woes (http://boards.giants.com/showthread.php?25406-Eli-Manning-s-Inconsistency-At-Root-Of-Giants-Woes)

GameTime
12-18-2012, 04:07 PM
Enlighten us how its not :)
Tynes missed a close FG.
They went for two 4th downs instead of trying to kick FGs...

Eli deserves blame but he cant get all the blame for 0 points

Hall of Fame
12-18-2012, 04:08 PM
Let me rephrase. It's not all on Eli. Some of it, not all.

0 points.

RoanokeFan
12-18-2012, 04:08 PM
RF this is exactly right, but it has to be that way. When he scores 0 points in a game where he looked horrible, we have to point the finger at him. Yeah the team stunk it up, but to come away with 0 points is on Eli. The fact that Atlanta scored over 30 is on the defense.

In this last game, it was very much Eli being "off." But we don't have the running game, yet, to take up the "move the chains" slack when Air Eli is down for maintenance. The defense was an issue all of its own and Tynes, uncharacteristically shanked another one.

Rudyy
12-18-2012, 04:09 PM
as said in other threads...the Giants offense has no plan B...if Eli stinks then the whole thing usually suckslike the Defense...if there is no pass rush it all suffers and usually to the tune of a loss....of course most teams center their O on the QB....but it seems the Giants cant generate anything if Eli is off....That is the biggest problem. When plan A folds, everyone folds unless Eli carries the team. If he cannot, game over. There needs to be a backup plan in place. Just because you've practiced your game plan 700 times, it doesnt mean other teams will not try to exploit it. Once they have your plan figured out, it's time for plan B. We never have a plan B. Either our plan works or we fold.

RoanokeFan
12-18-2012, 04:09 PM
RF even has another thread about Eli is the root of Giants woes.
Eli Manning's Inconsistency At Root Of Giants' Woes (http://boards.giants.com/showthread.php?25406-Eli-Manning-s-Inconsistency-At-Root-Of-Giants-Woes)

Don't shoot the messenger, those are news articles.

GameTime
12-18-2012, 04:10 PM
Tynes missed a close FG.
They went for two 4th downs instead of trying to kick FGs...

Eli deserves blame but he cant get all the blame for 0 points


0 points.
Tynes missed a close FG.
They went for two 4th downs instead of trying to kick FGs...

Eli deserves blame but he cant get all the blame for 0 points

Rudyy
12-18-2012, 04:10 PM
0 points.Does he get credit for all 52 points against the Saints?

Hall of Fame
12-18-2012, 04:11 PM
Tynes missed a close FG.
They went for two 4th downs instead of trying to kick FGs...

Eli deserves blame but he cant get all the blame for 0 points
I'm not putting total blame on him, its just that he's the QB, we automatically look at him and his inconsistency when we score 0 points.

GameTime
12-18-2012, 04:11 PM
I'm not putting total blame on him, its just that he's the QB, we automatically look at him and his inconsistency when we score 0 points.
sure...but you put it all on him......and you asked for a reason not to.
So I gave you a few thats all....

Hall of Fame
12-18-2012, 04:12 PM
Don't shoot the messenger, those are news articles.
LMAO thats funny.

Rudyy
12-18-2012, 04:13 PM
I'm not putting total blame on him, its just that he's the QB, we automatically look at him and his inconsistency when we score 0 points.Don't generalize. I didnt automatically look at him. Eli deserves SOME blame, but to say he's the sole reason why we didnt score any points is asinine. You know better.

Hall of Fame
12-18-2012, 04:16 PM
http://boards.giants.com/images/misc/quote_icon.png Originally Posted by RoanokeFan http://boards.giants.com/images/buttons/viewpost-right.png (http://boards.giants.com/showthread.php?p=626758#post626758)
Very few are saying this is "Eli's fault." It's the team's fault but ELi, being the captain of the ship, gets too much praise when it sails smooth, and too much blame when approaching the icebergs.



"RF this is exactly right, but it has to be that way. When he scores 0 points in a game where he looked horrible, we have to point the finger at him. Yeah the team stunk it up, but to come away with 0 points is on Eli. The fact that Atlanta scored over 30 is on the defense."

He took on that role when he decided to be an NFL QB. When we come away with 0 points, he has to be the one to face the music, he's the leader of the offense. Nobody else. Yes everyone else does their part to contribute to the win or loss, but it rides on him, good or bad.

stormblue
12-18-2012, 04:20 PM
How does one "work around" something?

if a WR is not having a good game ...he can throw it to a different receiver...
if DD is having a bad day he can call TE protections to help out.
he can call left -centric plays if the strong side is getting rag-dolled,
he can call different types of plays to avoid poor match-ups..
whomever and whatever is off out there or performing poorly , Eli has the ability and responsibility to adjust for it.

and i can't believe you baited me into answering that stupid question...that you already know the answer to..
considering i type with one finger and takes me 10 minutes per post.

shame on you for picking on an old man Rudyy....
but in all fairness i'm the dumb-asp that fell for it...ha-ha

Rudyy
12-18-2012, 04:20 PM
http://boards.giants.com/images/misc/quote_icon.png Originally Posted by RoanokeFan http://boards.giants.com/images/buttons/viewpost-right.png (http://boards.giants.com/showthread.php?p=626758#post626758)Very few are saying this is "Eli's fault." It's the team's fault but ELi, being the captain of the ship, gets too much praise when it sails smooth, and too much blame when approaching the icebergs."RF this is exactly right, but it has to be that way. When he scores 0 points in a game where he looked horrible, we have to point the finger at him. Yeah the team stunk it up, but to come away with 0 points is on Eli. The fact that Atlanta scored over 30 is on the defense."He took on that role when he decided to be an NFL QB. When we come away with 0 points, he has to be the one to face the music, he's the leader of the offense. Nobody else. Yes everyone else does their part to contribute to the win or loss, but it rides on him, good or bad.You didnt answer my other question. Is he the reason we put up 52 against the Saints?

Rudyy
12-18-2012, 04:22 PM
if a WR is not having a good game ...he can throw it to a different receiver...if DD is having a bad day he can call TE protections to help out.he can call left -centric plays if the strong side is getting rag-dolled,he can call different types of plays to avoid poor match-ups..whomever and whatever is off out there or performing poorly , Eli has the ability and responsibility to adjust for it.and i can't believe you baited me into answering that stupid question...that you already know the answer to..considering i type with one finger and takes me 10 minutes per post.shame on you for picking on an old man Rudyy....but in all fairness i'm the dumb-asp that fell for it...ha-haI guess you are the dumbass since you didn't have to answer such a stupid question...

Buddy333
12-18-2012, 04:23 PM
Who is the most important guy on this team? How has he been playing?

Rudyy
12-18-2012, 04:26 PM
Who is the most important guy on this team? How has he been playing?Nobody is debating that. I think anybody with a brain knows that Eli hasnt been playing well and he did contribute to that blowout. The issue is whether or not he is the sole cause for the 0 points. If you say he is the sole cause for us having 0 points, then you have to say he's the sole reason we had 52 against the Saints, which is stupid.

G-MENBK
12-18-2012, 04:27 PM
This is really getting redundant and mundane.

This team has 6 losses. 6 losses with different suspects to blame for them, with the exception of the 2nd Redskins game: I still think the officiating in that game was horse****.

stormblue
12-18-2012, 04:29 PM
I guess you are the dumbass since you didn't have to answer such a stupid question...

i know ....i know .....touche'

Buddy333
12-18-2012, 04:29 PM
Nobody is debating that. I think anybody with a brain knows that Eli hasnt been playing well and he did contribute to that blowout. The issue is whether or not he is the sole cause for the 0 points. If you say he is the sole cause for us having 0 points, then you have to say he's the sole reason we had 52 against the Saints, which is stupid.Of course. Really the entire offensive unit is off right now.

Hall of Fame
12-18-2012, 04:29 PM
You didnt answer my other question. Is he the reason we put up 52 against the Saints?

Let me give you an example, to kind've answer it in an indirect way. In 07 Super Bowl Eli won MVP, did he deserve it? Most would say no, because it was a good defensive game. However, since he led the team down the field during the go-ahead touchdown, and threw a miracle hail mary up, and its the PC thing to do, he got the MVP because he's the leader of the team. He led us to victory. When we lose as bad as we did Sunday, all eyes are still glaring at him. It's just automatic, especially since we came away with 0 points. For anyone to expect anything other than him getting most of the blame, is crazy. IMO

stormblue
12-18-2012, 04:33 PM
Let me give you an example, to kind've answer it in an indirect way. In 07 Super Bowl Eli won MVP, did he deserve it? Most would say no, because it was a good defensive game. However, since he led the team down the field during the go-ahead touchdown, and threw a miracle hail mary up, and its the PC thing to do, he got the MVP because he's the leader of the team. He led us to victory. When we lose as bad as we did Sunday, all eyes are still glaring at him. It's just automatic, especially since we came away with 0 points. For anyone to expect anything other than him getting most of the blame, is crazy. IMO

word.....no IMO necessary.

Rudyy
12-18-2012, 04:33 PM
Let me give you an example, to kind've answer it in an indirect way. In 07 Super Bowl Eli won MVP, did he deserve it? Most would say no, because it was a good defensive game. However, since he led the team down the field during the go-ahead touchdown, and threw a miracle hail mary up, and its the PC thing to do, he got the MVP because he's the leader of the team. He led us to victory. When we lose as bad as we did Sunday, all eyes are still glaring at him. It's just automatic, especially since we came away with 0 points. For anyone to expect anything other than him getting most of the blame, is crazy. IMOI'm not going to go into the offensive line and the receivers injuries and what not. It's one thing to criticize him, and then there's being ridiculous. I respect your opinion and I'll leave it at that.

Hall of Fame
12-18-2012, 04:36 PM
word.....no IMO necessary.

Thank you, You have to put that IMO disclaimer so you don't get the pile on effect.

stormblue
12-18-2012, 05:00 PM
Thank you, You have to put that IMO disclaimer so you don't get the pile on effect.

yup i know it all too well.

but what the Cultist Eli Homers don't understand is that there aren't any haters here.
there are a lot of realists that argue against all the Elite and HOF crap and are outspoken when
Eli lays a turd......but almost everybody here actually likes Eli as our QB and give him props when he has it coming.

but the cultists won't let us rebuke him when Eli stinks it up.....they treat us like HATERS.....
when we are just being real about it.

you can be a fan ,,,,and still honestly critique your ownership , coaches and players.

HOMERS don't understand that......it's gotta be RAH..RAH..RAH.....
or else they perceive you as an "idiot" with no "credibility".

it's freakin' hilarious.

Hall of Fame
12-18-2012, 05:08 PM
yup i know it all too well.

but what the Cultist Eli Homers don't understand is that there aren't any haters here.
there are a lot of realists that argue against all the Elite and HOF crap and are outspoken when
Eli lays a turd......but almost everybody here actually likes Eli as our QB and give him props when he has it coming.

but the cultists won't let us rebuke him when Eli stinks it up.....they treat us like HATERS.....
when we are just being real about it.

you can be a fan ,,,,and still honestly critique your ownership , coaches and players.

HOMERS don't understand that......it's gotta be RAH..RAH..RAH.....
or else they perceive you as an "idiot" with no "credibility".

it's freakin' hilarious.
That my friend is spot on, u should put that whole thing as your sig. Lol

erivera
12-18-2012, 05:11 PM
yup i know it all too well.

but what the Cultist Eli Homers don't understand is that there aren't any haters here.
there are a lot of realists that argue against all the Elite and HOF crap and are outspoken when
Eli lays a turd......but almost everybody here actually likes Eli as our QB and give him props when he has it coming.

but the cultists won't let us rebuke him when Eli stinks it up.....they treat us like HATERS.....
when we are just being real about it.

you can be a fan ,,,,and still honestly critique your ownership , coaches and players.

HOMERS don't understand that......it's gotta be RAH..RAH..RAH.....
or else they perceive you as an "idiot" with no "credibility".

it's freakin' hilarious.

eli has had some bad games but people make it seem like if he makes a throw here or there everything will be ok. sometimes a throw here or there won't change the fact that the receivers are not getting free and the play calling is brutal. can eli check out of certain plays? of course, but if the plays suck to begin with what does it matter. you can't say the playcalling sucks or nicks is hurt, and then act like eli can magically make those things disappear.

Rudyy
12-18-2012, 05:16 PM
eli has had some bad games but people make it seem like if he makes a throw here or there everything will be ok. sometimes a throw here or there won't change the fact that the receivers are not getting free and the play calling is brutal. can eli check out of certain plays? of course, but if the plays suck to begin with what does it matter. you can't say the playcalling sucks or nicks is hurt, and then act like eli can magically make those things disappear.Just give up. He won't read your post and label you an Eli homer.

erivera
12-18-2012, 05:21 PM
Just give up. He won't read your post and label you an Eli homer.

i think i will give up.

BuffyBlueII
12-18-2012, 05:27 PM
he has had 3 or 4 good games ...there is no denying that ....its the other 10 that are being scrutinized.this offense is centered around him.if someone else on the offense is having a bad gameEli can either work around him...or bring someone else into the game.if Eli is stinking it up ..there is absolutely nothing anyone can do about it.The offense is also completely geared away from his strengths.

stormblue
12-18-2012, 05:51 PM
The offense is also completely geared away from his strengths.

i don't understand what you mean by that.

i thought this offense of read and react was predicated
on Eli's strengths.......the ability to pre-read defenses and alter the play
or re-direct the protection as needed .
that coupled with his strong arm and the ability to be accurate throughout
the entire passing tree.....especially long range warfare.

even the running game is protection oriented as opposed to production oriented.

this entire offense is specifically Eli-centric , so i really don't get what you meant by that.

barran21
12-18-2012, 06:01 PM
I am sure this was said, but remember he threw 3 INTs one returned for a TD, Last year Eli played out of his mind this season he playing like 2010 Eli..

brad
12-18-2012, 06:11 PM
when the giants played tampa earlier this season eli had 500 yards, and the giants scored 25 4th quarter points. if you look at the box score of the game. nicks had 10 for 199, cruz was 11 for 179, and bennett was 5 for 72. all three also had td's. andre brown also had 13 carries for 71 yards and avg. 5.5 yards a carry. that game was the high point for the offense. it was also the game where nicks was stepped on after making a catch, and he hasn't been the same since.

i just wanted to point out how reliant this offense is on guys like nicks and a solid running game which brown helped deliver. also in my opinion, the giants didn't really look explosive in those packers and saints game. they were just very effective with what they did.

http://espn.go.com/nfl/boxscore?gameId=320916019

I haven't seen too many saying it was all Eli's fault, but I have seen quite a few posts trying to absolve him of any blame. In two games (Cincy and ATL) the offense as a whole was horrendous, and while that is not ALL of Eli's fault, he certainly has to take some of the criticism... especially if he receives all of the credit when things go well. How many "I told you Eli was elite" threads did we see after the NO game? After posts like that... you have to expect the "I told you Eli isn't elite" after games like ATL.

brad
12-18-2012, 06:14 PM
i don't understand what you mean by that.

i thought this offense of read and react was predicated
on Eli's strengths.......the ability to pre-read defenses and alter the play
or re-direct the protection as needed .
that coupled with his strong arm and the ability to be accurate throughout
the entire passing tree.....especially long range warfare.

even the running game is protection oriented as opposed to production oriented.

this entire offense is specifically Eli-centric , so i really don't get what you meant by that.

Actually, I would say his strength is the up-tempo 2 minute drill with simplified receiver routes where he is taking 3-4 step drops and getting rid of the ball. This offense is most certainly not geared around that!