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View Full Version : Alarming Cap Hits for 2013 ,may change the team as we know it.



Harooni
12-20-2012, 02:02 PM
2013 cap hits

Eli - 20,800,000

webster - 9,900,000

Rolle- 9,250,000

Diehl- 7,450,000

tuck - 5,600,000

canty- 8,200,000

baas- 6,700,000

Boley- 5,900,000

Reese will restructure some, but he really needs to trim the fat here ,look at the production and worth.

seems like we always are tight in cap space, how about making room so we can have a future.

we have a few FA's we need to pay also

quan the don
12-20-2012, 02:04 PM
Webster can take a pay cut or leave, Diehl should be cut, Rolle should probably take a pay cut too, basically Eli is the only one I wouldn't consider moving on from.

BlueJayC
12-20-2012, 02:06 PM
Diehl gone......Webster restructure......beyond that I have no idea.

primetime
12-20-2012, 02:07 PM
I could see Boley, Webster, Diehl all let go this off-season.

barran21
12-20-2012, 02:12 PM
Webster, Rolle, Diehl, Tuck, Canty are gone IMO, i wanted to make a thread that said this was our last year to win it all because our cap situation is horrible...

Harooni
12-20-2012, 02:12 PM
Id cut at least 5 of them, even if its hard sometimes you have to do it. we should have done it last off season with some of those and took the cap hits for the furture. i mean damn we cant afford good LB's

Jahh
12-20-2012, 02:15 PM
Jeez thats brutal. Most of those guys have been mediocre this year.

Edit: How do we know which players can be cut with no cap hit?

freeoscar
12-20-2012, 02:22 PM
are those the cap hits if they stay on the roster? or if they are cut?

Harooni
12-20-2012, 02:27 PM
are those the cap hits if they stay on the roster? or if they are cut? thats their number that goes against the salary cap if they stay , the cap hit if cut is different, basically its the bonus and guaranteed money accelerated .

WiIdcat
12-20-2012, 02:37 PM
Baas, Canty, Tuck, Diehl, and Webster. Goodbye

rainierjef
12-20-2012, 02:41 PM
Baas really does not need to be making that type of money.

ALLnygIN
12-20-2012, 02:41 PM
Eli and Rolle backed up their pay, the rest have no business getting that type of money.

rainierjef
12-20-2012, 02:42 PM
Eli and Rolle backed up their pay, the rest have no business getting that type of money. Boley as well.

BlueReign
12-20-2012, 02:46 PM
2013 cap hits

Eli - 20,800,000

webster - 9,900,000

Rolle- 9,250,000

Diehl- 7,450,000

tuck - 5,600,000

canty- 8,200,000

baas- 6,700,000

Boley- 5,900,000

Reese will restructure some, but he really needs to trim the fat here ,look at the production and worth.

seems like we always are tight in cap space, how about making room so we can have a future.

we have a few FA's we need to pay also

Webster-cut/restructure
Rolle-keep
Baas-cut/restructure
Tuck-restructure
Boley-keep
Canty-keep

freeoscar
12-20-2012, 02:47 PM
thats their number that goes against the salary cap if they stay , the cap hit if cut is different, basically its the bonus and guaranteed money accelerated .

its the latter number I am more interested in for Diehl and Tuck. Webster/Rolle will restructure. The problem w/restructuring guys like Baas and Canty is that you are just delaying the hit, and I don't see those guys being viable much longer. Webster has had a terrible year, but I am willing to give him the benefit of the doubt given his history. And Rolle has been very good imo. Diehl is well past done, and Tuck is done too.
We just have to free up space for Cruz and then next year for Nicks, and I believe the year after for JPP. all of our other needs are best addressed through the draft b/c you can't get 'good deals' in FA for the DL.

Jahh
12-20-2012, 02:47 PM
Boley as well.

I don't see that

paulj
12-20-2012, 02:47 PM
Webster-cut/restructure
Rolle-keep
Baas-cut/restructure
Tuck-restructure
Boley-keep
Canty-keep

Agree but Canty Restructure too

BlueReign
12-20-2012, 02:49 PM
Agree but Canty Restructure too
Yeah I agree that's what I would want. I just wrote what I expected though.

Buddy333
12-20-2012, 02:53 PM
There will be cuts and restructuring with those guys.

RoanokeFan
12-20-2012, 02:53 PM
2013 cap hits

Eli - 20,800,000

webster - 9,900,000

Rolle- 9,250,000

Diehl- 7,450,000

tuck - 5,600,000

canty- 8,200,000

baas- 6,700,000

Boley- 5,900,000

Reese will restructure some, but he really needs to trim the fat here ,look at the production and worth.

seems like we always are tight in cap space, how about making room so we can have a future.

we have a few FA's we need to pay also

Ditch Eli, sign Tebow for less than half, problem solved

Harooni
12-20-2012, 02:54 PM
its the latter number I am more interested in for Diehl and Tuck. Webster/Rolle will restructure. The problem w/restructuring guys like Baas and Canty is that you are just delaying the hit, and I don't see those guys being viable much longer. Webster has had a terrible year, but I am willing to give him the benefit of the doubt given his history. And Rolle has been very good imo. Diehl is well past done, and Tuck is done too.
We just have to free up space for Cruz and then next year for Nicks, and I believe the year after for JPP. all of our other needs are best addressed through the draft b/c you can't get 'good deals' in FA for the DL. the good news is that cap hit if cut or traded is not so bad almost all of them are in their last 2 years of contract.

Rudyy
12-20-2012, 02:56 PM
Agree but Canty Restructure tooTuck needs to go.

Harooni
12-20-2012, 02:57 PM
Ditch Eli, sign Tebow for less than half, problem solved lmao i say cut them all. Restructuring only defers the problem longer. these guys take up around 70 percent of the cap space. thats a huge chunk. (except Eli, let him live out his contract and see what he brings to the table next season)

RoanokeFan
12-20-2012, 02:59 PM
lmao i say cut them all. Restructuring only defers the problem longer. these guys take up around 70 percent of the cap space. thats a huge chunk. (except Eli, let him live out his contract and see what he brings to the table next season)

How many think Eli was worth that amount this season I wonder?

ShakeandBake
12-20-2012, 03:03 PM
Every single guy on that list should take a pay cut except for Eli and possibly Boley(not that Eli has played well this season, his contract has been restructured too many times.)

RoanokeFan
12-20-2012, 03:13 PM
Every single guy on that list should take a pay cut except for Eli and possibly Boley(not that Eli has played well this season, his contract has been restructured too many times.)

I wonder how play/pay might change if players' actual performance was factored in?

Buddy333
12-20-2012, 03:16 PM
How many think Eli was worth that amount this season I wonder?Two years ago he was not worth his contract. Last year he was worth more. This year has not been a good one for him. He still has a chance.

RoanokeFan
12-20-2012, 03:20 PM
Two years ago he was not worth his contract. Last year he was worth more. This year has not been a good one for him. He still has a chance.

The season's not over and, in fairness, you have to look at the whole body of work. I'll reserve comment.

Buddy333
12-20-2012, 03:22 PM
The season's not over and, in fairness, you have to look at the whole body of work. I'll reserve comment.In the beginning of the season he was playing like an MVP. Maybe he can turn it on again.

Flip Empty
12-20-2012, 03:33 PM
Reese will restructure some, but he really needs to trim the fat here ,look at the production and worth.

seems like we always are tight in cap space, how about making room so we can have a future.

we have a few FA's we need to pay also
Constant restructuring is the reason many of those contracts are the way they are. Though they may not deserve it, those players are entitled to that money. Not one should have to take a pay cut.

rebelfan1966
12-20-2012, 03:33 PM
I don't know who stays, who restructures, who is cut.... I just hope we can for once stay reasonably healthy at key positions throughout a season.

Harooni
12-20-2012, 03:45 PM
Constant restructuring is the reason many of those contracts are the way they are. Though they may not deserve it, those players are entitled to that money. Not one should have to take a pay cut.

thats all well and good , so let them get their guaranteed portion and they already got their signing bonus's and find more money elsewhere. I agree that we mortgaged our future on this one and further restructuring just delays things another year and it then all catches up with you. we need serious upgrades like LB's and oline.

freeoscar
12-20-2012, 03:46 PM
$20mm/yr is the going rate for a top tier QB, and Eli absolutely is that. I can't think of a player who is more valuable to his team than Eli is to the Giants, other than guys like Rodgers, Brees, Brady, and the other Manning who make similar amounts. Romo is up for a new deal this year, and I would be shocked if he doesn't land something in that range.

Harooni
12-20-2012, 03:49 PM
$20mm/yr is the going rate for a top tier QB, and Eli absolutely is that. I can't think of a player who is more valuable to his team than Eli is to the Giants, other than guys like Rodgers, Brees, Brady, and the other Manning who make similar amounts. Romo is up for a new deal this year, and I would be shocked if he doesn't land something in that range. IMO no one is worth that much cap space because you then have to surround them with talent.

bigbluetribe
12-20-2012, 04:02 PM
IMO only Eli and Rolle are worth keeping at that money. Most of those other guys should be let go and I dont say that under the pretense they are worse than what we can get or what we have in back up but they are not worth that much money. I know Boley has been our best LB but that doesnt really say anything on this team

Flip Empty
12-20-2012, 04:04 PM
thats all well and good , so let them get their guaranteed portion and they already got their signing bonus's and find more money elsewhere. I agree that we mortgaged our future on this one and further restructuring just delays things another year and it then all catches up with you. we need serious upgrades like LB's and oline.
Cutting Baas would result in a $9 million hit next season. It's a similar story for many players. Cutting players is easier said than done.

bigbluetribe
12-20-2012, 04:06 PM
Cutting Baas would result in a $9 million hit next season. It's a similar story for many players. Cutting players is easier said than done.
Damn yea it would figure as much that we have a lot of guaranteed money and bonuses in these guys, makes it near impossible to cut them even if thats what should be done. Poor deal making on Reese's part giving money like this to guys that dont deserve it. We cut them and we can barely get enough players with the cap hits

ALLnygIN
12-20-2012, 04:06 PM
Boley as well.

I've been dissapointed with boley this season. I don't know, I don't think his play has been worth that type of money just my opinion though.

freeoscar
12-20-2012, 04:07 PM
IMO no one is worth that much cap space because you then have to surround them with talent.

well, another one who is a $20mm hit next year is Roethlisberger. Now, besides the cap hit, what else do Roethlisberger, Eli, Payton, Brees, Brady, and Rodgers have in common? Clearly, they are worth the hit.

VBGiantsFan
12-20-2012, 04:08 PM
2013 cap hits

Eli - 20,800,000

webster - 9,900,000

Rolle- 9,250,000

Diehl- 7,450,000

tuck - 5,600,000

canty- 8,200,000

baas- 6,700,000

Boley- 5,900,000

Reese will restructure some, but he really needs to trim the fat here ,look at the production and worth.

seems like we always are tight in cap space, how about making room so we can have a future.

we have a few FA's we need to pay also

Restructure Eli again - He just gets his money as a bonus instead of a monthly pay out
Cut Webster if possible
Restrucure Rolle - He just gets his money as a bonus
Cut Diehl - and hope the Redskins sign him to protect RGIII
Cut Tuck - the Redskins will definitely sign him as RGIII's masseur, nake yoga instructor, and happy endings provider
Restructure Canty - He just gets his money as a bonus
Cut Baas - (Will this cost too much?)
Keep Boley - Heart and soul of the defense

Jahh
12-20-2012, 04:24 PM
Restructure Eli again - He just gets his money as a bonus instead of a monthly pay out
Cut Webster if possible
Restrucure Rolle - He just gets his money as a bonus
Cut Diehl - and hope the Redskins sign him to protect RGIII
Cut Tuck - the Redskins will definitely sign him as RGIII's masseur, nake yoga instructor, and happy endings provider
Restructure Canty - He just gets his money as a bonus
Cut Baas - (Will this cost too much?)
Keep Boley - Heart and soul of the defense

Yeah but the amount will be split out even over the remaining years of the deal. It's not like the hit just disappears.

ShakeandBake
12-20-2012, 04:25 PM
I wonder how play/pay might change if players' actual performance was factored in?

It would definitely give us more cap space, but even still some of those players should just be let go period.

Harooni
12-20-2012, 04:34 PM
Restructure Eli again - He just gets his money as a bonus instead of a monthly pay out
Cut Webster if possible
Restrucure Rolle - He just gets his money as a bonus
Cut Diehl - and hope the Redskins sign him to protect RGIII
Cut Tuck - the Redskins will definitely sign him as RGIII's masseur, nake yoga instructor, and happy endings provider
Restructure Canty - He just gets his money as a bonus
Cut Baas - (Will this cost too much?)
Keep Boley - Heart and soul of the defense


lol nice post

Harooni
12-20-2012, 04:36 PM
It would definitely give us more cap space, but even still some of those players should just be let go period. sometimes you got to take the hit and let them go and then the next season you are in a great cap situation. this should have been done this last offseason your fresh off a sb win, tkae the hits and still feild a decent team and now 2013-2015 your sitting pretty with no big inflated contracts.

joemorrisforprez
12-20-2012, 04:48 PM
Every guy Harooni mentioned is expendable except Eli.......with the possible exception of Rolle, because of his versatility and his leadership skills.

I like Canty, but he is overpaid.

Tuck should retire, because physically and emotionally, he's just not there anymore. Dude used to be unblockable without a double team....now he can't get there on a single.

We might need to bite the bullet and keep overpaying Baas, because he's not the worst lineman.

Diehl is finished.....which I don't like saying, because I like Diehl alot. But he'll need to take a cut or be cut.....he shouldn't be starting.

Webster could be like Baas....he's had an off season, but given how badly our secondary gets injured, I'd be very hesitant to get rid of one of the few guys who plays every week. Might need to keep overpaying him, too.

joemorrisforprez
12-20-2012, 04:50 PM
Restructure Eli again - He just gets his money as a bonus instead of a monthly pay out
Cut Webster if possible
Restrucure Rolle - He just gets his money as a bonus
Cut Diehl - and hope the Redskins sign him to protect RGIII
Cut Tuck - the Redskins will definitely sign him as RGIII's masseur, nake yoga instructor, and happy endings provider
Restructure Canty - He just gets his money as a bonus
Cut Baas - (Will this cost too much?)
Keep Boley - Heart and soul of the defense


LMAO about Tuck.

joemorrisforprez
12-20-2012, 04:55 PM
PS.......The Giants need to make room for Cruz, and that's going to be huge money......can't let dead wood get in the way of resigning him.

Harooni
12-20-2012, 05:17 PM
PS.......The Giants need to make room for Cruz, and that's going to be huge money......can't let dead wood get in the way of resigning him. also kenny phillips and stevie brown. we have 21 guys set to be FA's.

joemorrisforprez
12-20-2012, 05:19 PM
also kenny phillips and stevie brown. we have 21 guys set to be FA's.

This is going to be the end of the road for some of the guys remaining from the 2007 run.

Harooni
12-20-2012, 05:23 PM
This is going to be the end of the road for some of the guys remaining from the 2007 run. lets just hope Reese doesnt try and hang on to guys not producing much anymore and doesnt continue to overpay them.

slipknottin
12-20-2012, 05:26 PM
Problem with restructuring is it pushes the money into the next season. So for instance, rolle has two years left, if you took next years and rolled it over to his last year, his cap hit would be enormous, like 25 million. Just cant be done.

Most of the guys listed have their contracts expire next year or the year after, thats why the cap hits are so large.

Harooni
12-20-2012, 05:30 PM
Problem with restructuring is it pushes the money into the next season. So for instance, rolle has two years left, if you took next years and rolled it over to his last year, his cap hit would be enormous, like 25 million. Just cant be done.

Most of the guys listed have their contracts expire next year or the year after, thats why the cap hits are so large. correct except non expire next year from the ones i listed.

joemorrisforprez
12-20-2012, 05:31 PM
lets just hope Reese doesnt try and hang on to guys not producing much anymore and doesnt continue to overpay them.

Fortunately, Reese doesn't have Coughlin's sentimentality.

slipknottin
12-20-2012, 05:32 PM
correct except non expire next year from the ones i listed.

I meant at the end of next year.

Harooni
12-20-2012, 05:34 PM
I meant at the end of next year. ooops gotcha

myles2424
12-20-2012, 05:38 PM
2013 cap hits

Eli - 20,800,000

webster - 9,900,000

Rolle- 9,250,000

Diehl- 7,450,000

tuck - 5,600,000

canty- 8,200,000

baas- 6,700,000

Boley- 5,900,000

Reese will restructure some, but he really needs to trim the fat here ,look at the production and worth.

seems like we always are tight in cap space, how about making room so we can have a future.

we have a few FA's we need to pay also

theres alot of fat to be cut there....

Giant stuck in Texas
12-20-2012, 06:04 PM
Cutting Baas would result in a $9 million hit next season. It's a similar story for many players. Cutting players is easier said than done.

That and the fact that Reese is gonna want to keep most of the oline intact for the purpose of continuity and experience. Baas isnt going anywhere. In fact, with the exception of DD, I'm willing to bet this oline will be exactly the same next year.

However, restructure Webby,, or bye bye. I'm comfortable with Prince and Hosley has got the skill sets.

Isn't KP due for a new contract as well? With the emergence of Brown, I wonder how that pans out.

JesseJames
12-20-2012, 06:29 PM
How many think Eli was worth that amount this season I wonder? absolutely not but he was the only game in town for us because Carr isn't much to count on. I wonder how the front office feels about a QB who is going to be paid about 20 mil and has just had the season Eli has had..

Giggles2013
12-20-2012, 06:33 PM
Reese needs to spend the next three to five years rebuilding this team into a a playoff contender. Getting rid of guys like Diehl, Webster, Tuck, etc. might not be a bad thing since they are dead weight. We need to get younger, healthier, and more talented.

myles2424
12-20-2012, 06:41 PM
That and the fact that Reese is gonna want to keep most of the oline intact for the purpose of continuity and experience. Baas isnt going anywhere. In fact, with the exception of DD, I'm willing to bet this oline will be exactly the same next year.

However, restructure Webby,, or bye bye. I'm comfortable with Prince and Hosley has got the skill sets.

Isn't KP due for a new contract as well? With the emergence of Brown, I wonder how that pans out.

Id think Rolle could be a casualty, KP is younger & wont make nearly as much as Rolles big cap hit....

Giant stuck in Texas
12-20-2012, 06:55 PM
Id think Rolle could be a casualty, KP is younger & wont make nearly as much as Rolles big cap hit....

Yeah, but Rolle is made out of iron and never hurt.(except for the occasional cameraman) KP? Not so much....

myles2424
12-20-2012, 07:00 PM
Yeah, but Rolle is made out of iron and never hurt.(except for the occasional cameraman) KP? Not so much....

True, but unless he takes a paycut, I cant possibly see paying him 9mil for what he brings to the table,same with webster/canty/etc...

DaKraken
12-20-2012, 07:09 PM
Diehl gone......Webster restructure......beyond that I have no idea.

^^ This ^^

And I have no doubt Eli would restructure for the sake of he franchise if need be.

Webster and Baas might be strong armed

Tmurda1984
12-20-2012, 07:09 PM
I kept telling people that we will be in a mess in 2013. There is going to be alot of changes because of Reese's inability to manage our cap. Reese will continue to restructure terrible contracts (that he shouldnt have given out in the first place) and causing a problem down the road. Restructing only puts a band-aid on a big wound. Reese does not have a clue how to manage this cap...and this is my number #1 gripe against him. But alot of people fail to realize this and flame me.

Giant stuck in Texas
12-20-2012, 07:16 PM
True, but unless he takes a paycut, I cant possibly see paying him 9mil for what he brings to the table,same with webster/canty/etc...

I respectively have to disagree on Rolle. He's an above average safety with a big mouth. The Giants need him on D.http://www.freesmileys.org/smileys/smiley-cool02.gif (http://www.freesmileys.org/smileys.php)

Drez
12-20-2012, 07:32 PM
2013 cap hits

Eli - 20,800,000

webster - 9,900,000

Rolle- 9,250,000

Diehl- 7,450,000

tuck - 5,600,000

canty- 8,200,000

baas- 6,700,000

Boley- 5,900,000

Reese will restructure some, but he really needs to trim the fat here ,look at the production and worth.

seems like we always are tight in cap space, how about making room so we can have a future.

we have a few FA's we need to pay also
Diehl's may not be that high. He has escalators in his contract for playing LT. If he's not at LT he's not making as much.

Drez
12-20-2012, 07:36 PM
True, but unless he takes a paycut, I cant possibly see paying him 9mil for what he brings to the table,same with webster/canty/etc...

The reason why Rolle's cap hit is so high is that he's already restructured his contract (after '10 I believe).

slipknottin
12-20-2012, 08:01 PM
Its actually fairly interesting around the league, which of the very highly paid QBs have good defenses?

If you exclude Peyton, because he just signed with a team this season, you have what, Brees with the worst defense, brady with a horrible defense, Rogers defense has been bad two years in a row, who else? Even the steelers defense is starting to fall apart

And if you look at the great defenses, all of them have either young QBs on rookie deals, or very average QBs.

Drez
12-20-2012, 08:03 PM
Its actually fairly interesting around the league, which of the very highly paid QBs have good defenses?

If you exclude Peyton, because he just signed with a team this season, you have what, Brees with the worst defense, brady with a horrible defense, Rogers defense has been bad two years in a row, who else? Even the steelers defense is starting to fall apart

And if you look at the great defenses, all of them have either young QBs on rookie deals, or very average QBs.

Yup. It's a trade off you have to make, it seems.

However, we're paying a lot of our defense like it's a top defense, too, lol.

Tmurda1984
12-20-2012, 08:08 PM
Its actually fairly interesting around the league, which of the very highly paid QBs have good defenses?

If you exclude Peyton, because he just signed with a team this season, you have what, Brees with the worst defense, brady with a horrible defense, Rogers defense has been bad two years in a row, who else? Even the steelers defense is starting to fall apart

And if you look at the great defenses, all of them have either young QBs on rookie deals, or very average QBs.

Brady's defense is not too bad...The Patriots made a huge youth movement to revamp their defense after 2007 because the 2007 defense and previous defenses was very good for the Patriots and Tom Brady has been elite since at least 2005. The Patriots have a solid defense right now after having another cap room to sign Aqib Talib. The Patriots GM knows when to start the youth movement, manage their cap to sign high priced free agents, and even took a chance on free agent acquisitions like Randy Moss and Chad Ochocinco (which did not work out, but they were in dire need of a receiver).

XBIGBLUE5000X
12-20-2012, 08:12 PM
Man !!! that's brutal. Webster,Diehl , Bass and Boley bye bye. I would like to see the Giants moving up in the draft in order to get instant impact guys at OL LB and DB. or take a look in free agency for a solid player who can help with experience and leadership.

brad
12-20-2012, 08:13 PM
2013 cap hits
Eli - 20,800,000
webster - 9,900,000
Rolle- 9,250,000
Diehl- 7,450,000
tuck - 5,600,000
canty- 8,200,000
baas- 6,700,000
Boley- 5,900,000


There isn't one player on here worth the money they are about to get paid... including Eli. Nothing against Eli, but 20,800,000 is more than I would pay him!

slipknottin
12-20-2012, 08:13 PM
Brady's defense is not too bad...The Patriots made a huge youth movement to revamp their defense after 2007 because the 2007 defense and previous defenses was very good for the Patriots and Tom Brady has been elite since at least 2005. The Patriots have a solid defense right now after having another cap room to sign Aqib Talib. The Patriots GM knows when to start the youth movement, manage their cap to sign high priced free agents, and even took a chance on free agent acquisitions like Randy Moss and Chad Ochocinco (which did not work out, but they were in dire need of a receiver).

What high priced FAs have the patriots brought in? Moss and Ocho when they got them were getting scraps. And they have the 27th ranked defense by yards.

As for Talib, hes making 2 mil this season and is a FA next season.

Toadofsteel
12-20-2012, 08:19 PM
Eli - 20,800,000 Not going anywhere, for obvious reasons

webster - 9,900,000 Should take a pay cut or get cut, although Hosley still needs to prove himself before I'd be comfortable even releasing Webby...

Rolle- 9,250,000 Should take a pay cut, and with the emergence of Stevie and Hill, his job is in even more danger.

Diehl- 7,450,000 I would have dropped this guy in a heartbeat. Then Locklear went down for the season...

tuck - 5,600,000 Can we get him to take a pay cut? Or at least strip him of his captain title and give it to Blackburn or something...

canty- 8,200,000 A little high, but we DO need him. If he's willing to restructure great, but I don't really want to see him gone...

baas- 6,700,000 I'd just flat out cut the guy. Cordle is most likely just as good, and even if Baas would be slightly better, Cordle has a much smaller cap hit.

Boley- 5,900,000This one largely depends on whether we'd use Kiwi more on the line (which would result in Tuck getting restructured), or as a LB. Also, the status of Jacquian Williams. If both Kiwi and Williams are starting-level linebackers in 2013, we could probably get away with cutting this guy (if he's not owed too much guaranteed anyway)

Who are the 2013 FA's? Obviously there's Osi who we'd most likely just let walk unless he starts getting 5 sacks a game from here on out, as well as guys like Bennett and Rivers that we'd probably want to re-sign, but who else?

Giant stuck in Texas
12-20-2012, 08:31 PM
Rolle- 9,250,000
Should take a pay cut, and with the emergence of Stevie and Hill, his job is in even more danger.


Rolle already restructured once which is why he's scheduled to make that much. You can't knock him for that.

Besides, Rolle and Blackburn are the TRUE captains of this defense, which increases their value IMO.

slipknottin
12-20-2012, 08:35 PM
Who are the 2013 FA's? Obviously there's Osi who we'd most likely just let walk unless he starts getting 5 sacks a game from here on out, as well as guys like Bennett and Rivers that we'd probably want to re-sign, but who else?

lets see

Carr, Andre Brown(EFRA), Barden, Cruz (RFA), Beckum, Bennett, Tynes, Beatty, Boothe, Sean Rogers, Osi, Blackburn, KP, Rivers, and probably more.

Beatty, Bennett, Boothe are probably must signs, Cruz could be tagged, but its risky.

hungrrrry
12-20-2012, 08:52 PM
2013 cap hits

Eli - 20,800,000

webster - 9,900,000

Rolle- 9,250,000

Diehl- 7,450,000

tuck - 5,600,000

canty- 8,200,000

baas- 6,700,000

Boley- 5,900,000

Reese will restructure some, but he really needs to trim the fat here ,look at the production and worth.

seems like we always are tight in cap space, how about making room so we can have a future.

we have a few FA's we need to pay also
Eli - Restructure and trim 4 mil for 2013
Webster - cut
Rolle - Restructure and trim 2.5 - 3 mil for 2013
Diehl - cut
Tuck - cut
Canty - Restructure and trim 2.5 mil for 2013
Baas - Restructure and trim 3.5 mil for 2013
Boley - Restructure and trim 1.5 - 2 mil for 2013
======================= $14 - 15 mil + another $23 mil just from restructure and cuts from this list = $37-38 mil to put into FA and signing actual contributors on this team...Hell, I'd force Bradshaw to restructure as well. Cut Carr/not re-sign him for 2013...Maybe even restructure Snee as his production has diminished.

I think these are healthy moves for this team, giving us an opportunity to make key moves in FA that we usually don't make. We need LB's, DT's; CB's; OL; RB as well as depth players.

appodictic
12-21-2012, 12:23 AM
Our with the old and in with the new, many of these guys got a chance to 2 peat and are not showing up.

Tuck Gone
Canty Gone
Restructure CWeb
Boley can go
Dehil can go.

Leave money for cruz + bennet + brown.

Buddy333
12-21-2012, 12:28 AM
Brady's defense is not too bad...The Patriots made a huge youth movement to revamp their defense after 2007 because the 2007 defense and previous defenses was very good for the Patriots and Tom Brady has been elite since at least 2005. The Patriots have a solid defense right now after having another cap room to sign Aqib Talib. The Patriots GM knows when to start the youth movement, manage their cap to sign high priced free agents, and even took a chance on free agent acquisitions like Randy Moss and Chad Ochocinco (which did not work out, but they were in dire need of a receiver).The Patriots defense is bad and has been for years now.

stormblue
12-21-2012, 01:27 AM
restructuring is like maxing out all of your 25 % credit cards .....then getting a 2nd mortgage to pay them off...
all the while knowing that your budget could not afford what you bought in the first place.

stupid.....

Flip Empty
12-21-2012, 01:58 AM
It's all well and good saying "cut this guy" and "cut that guy", but who's going to replace these players?

Ditching Rolle would mean the team takes a hit of around $5 million. Keeping him will result in a $7 million hit. Are you really going to find an adequate replacement for around $2 million?


Some guys can be released fairly easily, others can't.
Hete are the approximate hits the team would take for releasing the following players:

Baas - $8.2 million
Rolle - $4.5 million
Canty - $2 million
Webster - $3 million
Diehl - $4 million
Boley - $1.6 million
Tuck - $1.6 million

(Correct me if I'm doing the math wrong)

bearbryant
12-21-2012, 02:16 AM
Wow, I had no idea that we're this deep into cap space with some of these guys. That's what you get when you take a 3-4 DE and make him a 4-3 DT: a 8.2MM DT who needs to bulk up!, A 10MM CB who can't defend passes! A 9.3MM safety who n eeds totake the proper angle to aWR. This deosn't bode well for the Jints but explains where the money went and why we do not have LB's and O Linemen.

stormblue
12-21-2012, 02:17 AM
we need to stop restructuring......and stop overpaying.
you have to start somewhere.....if we miss the playoffs......dump these guys....take the cap hit for the year .....next man up.

at 9-7 or 8-8 , and over the cap ....you are obviously overpaying ...you gotta stop and bite the bullet at some point start to rebuild with younger cheaper.

UK-Giantsfan
12-21-2012, 05:48 AM
We have to keep Rolle surely.

Eli, Webster , Canty will be almost certainley be restructured IMO

Tuck - please retire before it gets embarrasing

Diehl , Bass ......Gone

I'm seriously worried about how we keep both Cruz and Nicks ( although i think Cruz has a sensible head and would not push it )

jomo
12-21-2012, 07:36 AM
Diehl gone......Webster restructure......beyond that I have no idea.Canty is overpaid for what we get out of him, so restructure there as well.

Flip Empty
12-21-2012, 08:05 AM
Releasing Diehl would cost the same as keeping him.

slipknottin
12-21-2012, 09:50 AM
Canty is overpaid for what we get out of him, so restructure there as well.

Restructuring would just make the situation worse the following year

Harooni
12-21-2012, 10:42 AM
It's all well and good saying "cut this guy" and "cut that guy", but who's going to replace these players?

Ditching Rolle would mean the team takes a hit of around $5 million. Keeping him will result in a $7 million hit. Are you really going to find an adequate replacement for around $2 million?


Some guys can be released fairly easily, others can't.
Hete are the approximate hits the team would take for releasing the following players:

Baas - $8.2 million
Rolle - $4.5 million
Canty - $2 million
Webster - $3 million
Diehl - $4 million
Boley - $1.6 million
Tuck - $1.6 million

(Correct me if I'm doing the math wrong) keeping rolle will cost over 9mil he has already restructured that is why. And yes you are going to take cap hits but why prolong it when you can dump the salarys start young guys and then the next season you are sitting pretty. and lets face it these younger guys seem to be producing more.

Harooni
12-21-2012, 10:44 AM
Canty is overpaid for what we get out of him, so restructure there as well. Reese is like my uncle,

makes the min payment on his credit cards and then the next month owes more.

slipknottin
12-21-2012, 11:13 AM
Reese is like my uncle,

makes the min payment on his credit cards and then the next month owes more.

Every team does the same thing. Plus almost all contracts are backloaded.

Redeyejedi
12-21-2012, 11:29 AM
Giants are better off biting the bullet be bad for 1 season and rebuild, resign the young players and give Eli 1 more 3 year window to win until he retires

Redeyejedi
12-21-2012, 11:33 AM
keeping rolle will cost over 9mil he has already restructured that is why. And yes you are going to take cap hits but why prolong it when you can dump the salarys start young guys and then the next season you are sitting pretty. and lets face it these younger guys seem to be producing more.That Baas Contract was awful i knew the second he was signed it was terrible. Webster is worth cutting it saves about 7 million. Tuck wont get cut. Boley might. I like Williams and Paysinger. Rolle may be worth cutting as well. I think they could get similar production from Will Hill

Redeyejedi
12-21-2012, 11:39 AM
This team is in serious trouble basically all that money saved is spoken for with JPP Nicks, and Cruz .Eli better consider how much he likes Nicks and Cruz. Tom Brady took less money to win, Peyton didnt and thats why his team was terrible when he went down

JesseJames
12-21-2012, 11:50 AM
I kept telling people that we will be in a mess in 2013. There is going to be alot of changes because of Reese's inability to manage our cap. Reese will continue to restructure terrible contracts (that he shouldnt have given out in the first place) and causing a problem down the road. Restructing only puts a band-aid on a big wound. Reese does not have a clue how to manage this cap...and this is my number #1 gripe against him. But alot of people fail to realize this and flame me.

someone said on this board that the Giants need to hire a Jewish Lawyer to manage the cap and I have to agree because Reese is not doing a good job at it because we are in cap hell every year...

Redeyejedi
12-21-2012, 11:52 AM
A big part of this as Reese and Ross havent drafted well the last 2 drafts. 2011 Draft is meh Amukamara is a solid starter but Austin is a bust, Jernigan ive seen enough he isnt going to develop, James Brewer? was a project but if he cant beat out Diehl thats a problem, Greg Jones is gone,Sash a special team guy, Scott probably wont make team next season, Jacquain Williams was better value then where he was drafted.

2012 Draft David Wilson a shared time RB. Thats a luxury pick with a team that has a foundation crumbling, Randle a player I like but hasnt seen the field much, 3rd round Hosley I like Hosley but he cant play outside and has been abused, 4th round a TE that was a huge reach in Robinson another luxury pick,Mccants was cut , Kuhn hurt but looks like he could be a depth guy

Flip Empty
12-21-2012, 11:54 AM
someone said on this board that the Giants need to hire a Jewish Lawyer to manage the cap and I have to agree because Reese is not doing a good job at it because we are in cap hell every year...
They play this game to win titles, not balance the books. You can't fault this approach when it's been working.

slipknottin
12-21-2012, 11:57 AM
Giants are fortunate to have been pretty good with UDFAs and low priced or "scrub" FAs. Cruz, Will Hill, Stevie Brown, Hynoski, Locklear, Andre Brown (yes I know he was the giants 4th round pick originally). I'm sure there are a few I'm forgetting. But that list of guys pretty much bailed this team out

Guys like Bennett have got only one year deals but have been huge too

JesseJames
12-21-2012, 12:01 PM
They play this game to win titles, not balance the books. You can't fault this approach when it's been working. I wonder if you'll feel the same way when the Giants have to play with these same guys next year because they couldn't upgrade because of the cap.

slipknottin
12-21-2012, 12:04 PM
I wonder if you'll feel the same way when the Giants have to play with these same guys next year because they could upgrade because of the cap.

Should always be tight against the cap. That's smart management. Especially when you are winning championships.

Redeyejedi
12-21-2012, 12:46 PM
Giants are fortunate to have been pretty good with UDFAs and low priced or "scrub" FAs. Cruz, Will Hill, Stevie Brown, Hynoski, Locklear, Andre Brown (yes I know he was the giants 4th round pick originally). I'm sure there are a few I'm forgetting. But that list of guys pretty much bailed this team out

Guys like Bennett have got only one year deals but have been huge tooYeah the UDFA have covered up some of the misses in the draft.

Redeyejedi
12-21-2012, 12:47 PM
Should always be tight against the cap. That's smart management. Especially when you are winning championships.Arent u supposed to use 95% of the cap each year from the new collective bargaining agreement

Harooni
12-21-2012, 02:51 PM
Should always be tight against the cap. That's smart management. Especially when you are winning championships.

thats fine and i agree, However better to use the space for a few good players than on one declining player. sometimes you just have to let them go. Philly is real good at that but the Giants seen to stick with guys way too long.

GMENAGAIN
12-21-2012, 03:01 PM
thats fine and i agree, However better to use the space for a few good players than on one declining player. sometimes you just have to let them go. Philly is real good at that but the Giants seen to stick with guys way too long.

. . . . and when was the last time that Philly won anything?

Harooni
12-21-2012, 03:03 PM
. . . . and when was the last time that Philly won anything? lol i knew that was coming, but as far as salaries they manage things well.

ryan12
12-21-2012, 03:25 PM
Webster, Rolle, Diehl, Tuck, Canty are gone IMO, i wanted to make a thread that said this was our last year to win it all because our cap situation is horrible...

agreed

gumby74
12-21-2012, 03:41 PM
Its actually fairly interesting around the league, which of the very highly paid QBs have good defenses?

If you exclude Peyton, because he just signed with a team this season, you have what, Brees with the worst defense, brady with a horrible defense, Rogers defense has been bad two years in a row, who else? Even the steelers defense is starting to fall apart

And if you look at the great defenses, all of them have either young QBs on rookie deals, or very average QBs. it's pretty simple actually. Great QBs cost money - leaving no money to spread around. When you have a great QB, you'so going to be offense-centric.

gumby74
12-21-2012, 03:42 PM
Arent u supposed to use 95% of the cap each year from the new collective bargaining agreement something like that. I read that's why deangello williams got such a big deal.

slipknottin
12-21-2012, 04:03 PM
it's pretty simple actually. Great QBs cost money - leaving no money to spread around. When you have a great QB, you'so going to be offense-centric.

Yes it's simple. But I don't believe most fans understand that. They expect a team with a very highly paid QB to also field a great defense. Which from a cap perspective is nearly impossible. Have to be extremely lucky when it comes to guys on rookie contracts and any low priced FAs

Harooni
12-21-2012, 04:35 PM
lucky or you dont spend 7- 9mil on decent players just to keep them around. you cut that crap out and suffer one year of hits and then you can use those $$$ to get some younger FA help.

gumby74
12-21-2012, 05:19 PM
Yes it's simple. But I don't believe most fans understand that. They expect a team with a very highly paid QB to also field a great defense. Which from a cap perspective is nearly impossible. Have to be extremely lucky when it comes to guys on rookie contracts and any low priced FAs Yup. These day's it's all about who can find the best value stop gaps to go along with your small handful of corner stone players. And in general the draft is where you usually find value.

imo, if you have a great qb, you just need a defense that is good enough to win with. it doesn't have to be great, good even. Right now, our defense blows but we're only allowing 20 points a game. With our offense, we SHOULD be able to win with that.

slipknottin
12-21-2012, 05:44 PM
lucky or you dont spend 7- 9mil on decent players just to keep them around. you cut that crap out and suffer one year of hits and then you can use those $$$ to get some younger FA help.

Well, the strange thing is, hitting on players in the draft isnt always a positive, because sooner or later you have to pay those guys if you want to keep them. Sometimes you are better off finding a bunch of good players, instead of a few stars.

Or the ultimate would be to keep drafting studs with every draft pick, and replace great players with younger cheaper great players. But that idea is just not sustainable for any length of time.

Harooni
12-21-2012, 05:48 PM
When i take a look at most of those guys on the list , i feel we could get similar production at half the cap space. Giants need to stop trying to hang on like that bad moss trade, and move on.

slipknottin
12-21-2012, 05:50 PM
When i take a look at most of those guys on the list , i feel we could get similar production at half the cap space. Giants need to stop trying to hang on like that bad moss trade, and move on.

Problem is they need to find a way to rid them of the player without the cap hit. Perhaps try trading some of them away, but who wants those players for that kind of a cap hit?

I really would like to see one of the beat reporters look at those guys on the list and tell us who could be released and how much of a cap hit it would be next season.

giantsfan420
12-21-2012, 05:50 PM
Yes it's simple. But I don't believe most fans understand that. They expect a team with a very highly paid QB to also field a great defense. Which from a cap perspective is nearly impossible. Have to be extremely lucky when it comes to guys on rookie contracts and any low priced FAsthe broncos pay peyton over 20the mil per yr and they have a stacked defense and run game to go with peyton...but i think ur point is valid bc i cant think of another team in the position

slipknottin
12-21-2012, 05:55 PM
the broncos pay peyton over 20the mil per yr and they have a stacked defense and run game to go with peyton...but i think ur point is valid bc i cant think of another team in the position


Peyton is also in the first year of his contract, and almost every player on the denver defense is on their rookie contract, as is most of the offense. Its just not sustainable long term.

When they have to pay Von Miller, and Demaryius Thomas, and Ryan Clady, all of a sudden they have to start letting guys go.

The colts have roughly a 3 year window before they start finding themselves in cap trouble. Which is probably as long as manning will end up playing, so manning leaving alleviates most of the cap problem.

JesseJames
12-21-2012, 06:05 PM
I agree, Philly always seems to know when its time to pull the plug on a player.

bigbluetribe
12-21-2012, 06:08 PM
I think philly structures contracts that help them when players get hurt but when a player is good they cant really give them money. What i mean is philly gives a lot of money overall but not guaranteed so when it doesnt work out they cut a player with no fault and are able to attract more guys because of the seemingly higher payday. However, once they need to sign a guy they usually cant commit all that money. In the end, it still the eagles, and they havent done anything well ever

Sarcasman
12-21-2012, 06:40 PM
How many think Eli was worth that amount this season I wonder?


What was his cap number this year? He sure wasn't worth a $20MM cap hit in 2012.........

Sarcasman
12-21-2012, 06:44 PM
The season's not over and, in fairness, you have to look at the whole body of work. I'll reserve comment.


Yeah, I view it differently. I view contracts as one complete event, not an annual series of events and look at the performance in relative terms to the market. I think Eli has pretty much earned his contract, particularly when viewed within the context of what franchise QBs make.

That said, if one were to view only one year at a time it's looking like it might be tough to be satisfied with this year's performance.

Sarcasman
12-21-2012, 06:46 PM
Reese needs to spend the next three to five years rebuilding this team into a a playoff contender. Getting rid of guys like Diehl, Webster, Tuck, etc. might not be a bad thing since they are dead weight. We need to get younger, healthier, and more talented.

The team is playoff contending now.

Sarcasman
12-21-2012, 06:53 PM
Should always be tight against the cap. That's smart management. Especially when you are winning championships.


I agree. The idea that this team (or any good team) is going to be well under the cap, living well below its means and competing for titles is fantasy. YOu don't get extra points in this league for operating at a healthy % under the cap.

Sarcasman
12-21-2012, 06:55 PM
thats fine and i agree, However better to use the space for a few good players than on one declining player. sometimes you just have to let them go. Philly is real good at that but the Giants seen to stick with guys way too long.


Philly is real good with it and it has paid off handsomely for them hasn't it?

Assuming we're rooting for efficient fiscal management as opposed to winning.

Sarcasman
12-21-2012, 06:55 PM
. . . . and when was the last time that Philly won anything?

Crap.

GentleGiant
12-21-2012, 07:08 PM
Keep eli.

Keep the recieving corp.

keep the running back corp.

Definitely keep the safety corp.

Keep half the secondary(webster is webster)

Keep the linebacking corp including boley but restructure them(boley and blackburn are the leaders of the D).

Keep half the d line. Keep JPP, Canty,joseph(I know canty isn't JPP but the D line is just so much worse without him).


Tuck I feel should retire. I'd say we should cut him but the guy is the leader of the d line and I'm just worried what would happen without him.

Just look at the Ravens. Ray lewis is an average linebacker but when he's not there the whole D falls apart. I just feel Tuck brings something else to the team along with playing.


Osi? If we knew how to use him I'd restructure him. Just rotate him with Tuck when it's run or pass. Tuck can't pass rush but osi can at least but osi sucks against the run so there you go.

slipknottin
12-21-2012, 07:28 PM
Keep eli.

Keep the recieving corp.

keep the running back corp.

Definitely keep the safety corp.

Keep half the secondary(webster is webster)

Keep the linebacking corp including boley but restructure them(boley and blackburn are the leaders of the D).

Keep half the d line. Keep JPP, Canty,joseph(I know canty isn't JPP but the D line is just so much worse without him).


Tuck I feel should retire. I'd say we should cut him but the guy is the leader of the d line and I'm just worried what would happen without him.

Just look at the Ravens. Ray lewis is an average linebacker but when he's not there the whole D falls apart. I just feel Tuck brings something else to the team along with playing.


Osi? If we knew how to use him I'd restructure him. Just rotate him with Tuck when it's run or pass. Tuck can't pass rush but osi can at least but osi sucks against the run so there you go.

So you want to keep everyone expect webster and resign Osi? And hope Tuck retires?

jomo
12-21-2012, 07:45 PM
I view all of this as an opportunity rather than a problem. We get to right size ourselves on some guys who are paid way beyond their level of contribution. That gives JR the cash to reload.

GentleGiant
12-21-2012, 08:57 PM
So you want to keep everyone expect webster and resign Osi? And hope Tuck retires?

I'm talking about the starters. And no I said half the secondary. Hosley and other backups don't do their job. There's also a few recievers. But I'm mainly talking about the 1st and 2nd string.

If we're gonna use Osi against the run then just cut him. Problem is the guy is very good when you know they're gonna pass. If they rotate Osi based on whether it's pass or run then I'd restructure. If not? Get him out of there.

GMENAGAIN
12-21-2012, 10:06 PM
I'm talking about the starters. And no I said half the secondary. Hosley and other backups don't do their job. There's also a few recievers. But I'm mainly talking about the 1st and 2nd string.

If we're gonna use Osi against the run then just cut him. Problem is the guy is very good when you know they're gonna pass. If they rotate Osi based on whether it's pass or run then I'd restructure. If not? Get him out of there.

Restructure Osi? He's in the last year of his deal. He will never be resigned here.

Hosley is a rookie. He will never be let go.

Flip Empty
12-21-2012, 10:21 PM
Why do people think that a restructure is a pay cut?

stormblue
12-21-2012, 10:39 PM
Why do people think that a restructure is a pay cut?

because it usually turns out to be one.
they settle for less now , but when the year comes around to get their big money back ...
their skills are in decline and can wind up being cut without ever getting their payday.
that's why when you cut a player with a contract you still get the cap hit.....that rule is there
to help protect the player.

the cut player never sees the money......but it still counts against the cap (as a deterrent) .

at least that's my general understanding

Flip Empty
12-21-2012, 10:41 PM
Restructuring usually gives the player more guaranteed money.

GentleGiant
12-22-2012, 12:10 AM
Restructure Osi? He's in the last year of his deal. He will never be resigned here.

Hosley is a rookie. He will never be let go.

Well he's a bust of a rookie.

As for osi? What are we gonna replace him with? Tuck?

JJC7301
12-22-2012, 01:12 AM
Osi will be gone, but Tuck and Canty need to go, too.

This team needs some rebuilding or restructuring anyway. Too many stale players at key positions.

slipknottin
12-22-2012, 02:45 AM
because it usually turns out to be one.
they settle for less now

Restructure converts remaining money into a signing bonus, meaning the player gets all that money up front. That's why players never say no.

slipknottin
12-22-2012, 02:47 AM
Well he's a bust of a rookie.

As for osi? What are we gonna replace him with? Tuck?

Hosley is a 3rd round slot CB who has shown a lot of potential, and he's paid pennies. He will never be cut

They need to draft Osi's replacement. Or hope Tracy and Ojomo can step up.

Drez
12-22-2012, 02:49 AM
Well he's a bust of a rookie.

As for osi? What are we gonna replace him with? Tuck?
Yeah, cause 3rd rd draft picks should immediately play like All Pros

Rat_bastich
12-22-2012, 03:09 AM
Well he's a bust of a rookie.

As for osi? What are we gonna replace him with? Tuck?

You can't call a rookie a bust. Remember how many people were saying the same about Prince last year?

As for Osi there are quite a few good pass rushing defensive ends that will fall to the late first round of the draft this year, plus you have a couple of guys that still have a shot to show what they can do.

drewz
12-22-2012, 10:39 AM
Rolle should take a pay cut, or be let go. He's a liability in pass coverage in an already weak defensive backfield. Kenny Phillips can be had cheaper, and Stevie Brown/Will Hill are on the come up.

Flip Empty
12-22-2012, 10:51 AM
Rolle should take a pay cut, or be let go. He's a liability in pass coverage in an already weak defensive backfield. Kenny Phillips can be had cheaper, and Stevie Brown/Will Hill are on the come up.
I don't know about KP coming cheap... Talent-wise he's one of the better safeties in the league. He will certainly attract interest on the open market.

Rolle's contract is the way it is because it's the final year of his backloaded, resructured FA contract. Every big time FA contract is like this.

slipknottin
12-22-2012, 10:53 AM
I don't know about KP coming cheap... Talent-wise he's one of the better safeties in the league. He will certainly attract interest on the open market.

He will be unquestionably cheaper than Rolle is. KP being injured for a lot of this season will reduce the contract size he gets too

jomo
12-22-2012, 10:59 AM
He will be unquestionably cheaper than Rolle is. KP being injured for a lot of this season will reduce the contract size he gets too..........injured for alot of his career as well Slip. I agree totally though, he is very good when healthy and should be a much better value for us than Rolle.

Flip Empty
12-22-2012, 11:03 AM
He will be unquestionably cheaper than Rolle is. KP being injured for a lot of this season will reduce the contract size he gets too
Well that's promising. I'd rather not see him leave.

Cruz/Phillips, then Nicks, then JPP. This team has a lot of cap juggling to do over these next few years.

I Bleed Blue 56
12-22-2012, 11:09 AM
Bass was the worst pick up Rolle might be a cut but doubt it. Webster will be forced to take a pay cut or be cut. Yoi cant hide his horrible play this year. I have a feeling Tuck will retire he seems emotionally done. His shoulder stays hurting him walk away on top it happens to some good players. Hes a NYG for life he knows it we got Tracy and Ojomo waiting in thr wing who should have played.

Flip Empty
12-22-2012, 11:10 AM
Man, is Kenny Phillips the Giants' very own Bob Sanders? It seemed like that guy only got paid to undergo rehab.

Tmurda1984
12-22-2012, 11:37 AM
Man, is Kenny Phillips the Giants' very own Bob Sanders? It seemed like that guy only got paid to undergo rehab.

Give that title to Terrell Thomas. Why did Reese even waste money giving this guy a contract. He was injured throughout USC and as a Giant. This guy is clearly hobbled.

At least Phillips does play...Phillips will be ok...he might not have a long career, but most football players do not. Phillips is also playing on a rookie contract its Thomas who is getting paid to undergo rehab and physical therapy. I dont understand how you draft a guy who was clearly injured all the time in college as well. Bout as dumb as the Marvin Austin pick.

GentleGiant
12-22-2012, 12:17 PM
Yeah, cause 3rd rd draft picks should immediately play like All Pros

You haven't been watching the rookies this year have you?

Harooni
12-31-2012, 07:38 PM
Rolle should take a pay cut, or be let go. He's a liability in pass coverage in an already weak defensive backfield. Kenny Phillips can be had cheaper, and Stevie Brown/Will Hill are on the come up. Reese needs to really rethink keeping a lot of these guys and just makeing our cap worse for the following years. he needs to take some cap hits and play younger more hungry and healthier guys.

giants8493
12-31-2012, 07:58 PM
2013 cap hits

Eli - 20,800,000

webster - 9,900,000

Rolle- 9,250,000

Diehl- 7,450,000

tuck - 5,600,000

canty- 8,200,000

baas- 6,700,000

Boley- 5,900,000

Reese will restructure some, but he really needs to trim the fat here ,look at the production and worth.

seems like we always are tight in cap space, how about making room so we can have a future.

we have a few FA's we need to pay alsoGiven that information I would cut webster Dhiel and boley and give the money we save to ELI

Harooni
12-31-2012, 08:10 PM
Given that information I would cut webster Dhiel and boley and give the money we save to ELI huh??? you would give the extra cap space to Eli??? in case you didnt realize he needs a great cast around him and solid defense. we would take cap hits for cutting some and still need to replace them.

bigbluetribe
12-31-2012, 08:16 PM
could not agree more with playing guys that have something to prove. Honest question now does anyone think if given a chance Tracy or Ojomo dont play their hearts out and at least play as well as Tuck did for 6 times the money. Our entire right side of our oline lives off of past success. We need to get younger, faster. Stop giving money to player we dont need and ones that we can replace for significantly less money. For anyone that says Tracy has been given a chance this year should also note that they moved him back to DE this year but only time he got some playing time they had him at lb.

Harooni
12-31-2012, 08:28 PM
could not agree more with playing guys that have something to prove. Honest question now does anyone think if given a chance Tracy or Ojomo dont play their hearts out and at least play as well as Tuck did for 6 times the money. Our entire right side of our oline lives off of past success. We need to get younger, faster. Stop giving money to player we dont need and ones that we can replace for significantly less money. For anyone that says Tracy has been given a chance this year should also note that they moved him back to DE this year but only time he got some playing time they had him at lb.

bingo younger faster healthier and cheaper !!!!!

we need to stop this

http://i.minus.com/ipOT8wCfqAolt.gif

bigblue58
12-31-2012, 08:35 PM
hate to pile on the bad news but this most likely also means that they can't afford to keep both Nicks AND Cruz!

jomo
12-31-2012, 08:36 PM
Don't count on it. Unless you know intimately who we can cut and who we can restructure don't go too far out on that linb.

Harooni
12-31-2012, 09:02 PM
hate to pile on the bad news but this most likely also means that they can't afford to keep both Nicks AND Cruz! im more worried we will again have no first string linebackers

jomo
12-31-2012, 09:02 PM
im more worried we will again have no first string linebackersDid you have to drop that on us so soon? lol

Harooni
12-31-2012, 09:04 PM
Did you have to drop that on us so soon? lol it sucks but we have no room in the budget , tight on cap room again.

bigbluetribe
12-31-2012, 09:23 PM
yea I think lb would make everything look better on defense. You cant tell me boley is worth it. He might be good but not worthy of being the best lb on our team let alone in a position at weak side where I would argue is least important lb. Cut that fat and find people. Blackburn isnt it either. Only Williams has real potential here and he is too injured for his own good. Lets get young and fast. It cant be any worse than what we have

bigbluetribe
12-31-2012, 09:24 PM
bingo younger faster healthier and cheaper !!!!!

we need to stop this

http://i.minus.com/ipOT8wCfqAolt.gif
You can say that again, speed is the name of the game here and our 5 second 40s on defense arent helping us. Just give me speed, we can work with the rest

bigblue58
12-31-2012, 11:13 PM
im more worried we will again have no first string linebackers

totally agree!