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View Full Version : How do you earn playing time if Tom Coughlin is your head coach?



Marvelousmik
12-25-2012, 03:06 PM
In spite of how this season is turning out, Tom Coughlin in my opinion is one of the best coaches when it comes to getting guys prepared for a game. That being said, he is a big reason why we've been so successful since he has been here, and i respect him. But from a players prospective What do you have to do in order to earn playing time? Here are some examples of why i ask this question.

1. Cruz had a break out year in training camp and was one of the biggest preseason sensations The NFL as ever seen by an undrafted free agent, but still wasn't able to make his way onto the staring line up. They even forced him onto injury reserve (like they do with everyone they want to keep) when he didn't have a season ending injury. The next year Hixon had to go down in order for cruz to finally get his chance. and Even so, Tom even tried playing Bradon Stokley before giving cruz a real shot.

2. Ojomo is another example. he lead the team in sacks during the preseason and showed to be a dominant force. However, he hasnt even been activated once this season, and he isnt even on the injury report. i dont think anyone is asking for him to be a full time starter, but the guy isnt even getting playing time. even Adrian Tracy is a head of him on the depth chart.

3. Ryan Perrilloux. This one actually bothered me the most because he took advantage of all his opportunities during the preseason. (8/9 passes completed, for X yards and 2 touchdowns). The guy basically made good throws and didnt turn the ball over during his limited chances. David carr played garbage and struggled to even complete passes. When it became time for the 3rd and 4th string guys to play in the final preseason game, in spite of how garbage Carr looked, TC kept Ryan on the sidelines and didnt even give him and opportunity to go out there and audition. No chance to earn anything. He made him suit up for nothing. ive never seen a coach do this before.

4. David wilson. The whole blocking excuse goes out the window now. Bradshaw came in hurt last week and whiffed on every block and what did Tom decide to do? He let Hynoski take his place on blocking situations (shotgun) and gave Bradshaw the ball when they lined up in the eye. You couldn't do that with Wilson earlier on in the season? Wilson touched the ball 3 times for 17 yards and a td. In those 3 touches he averaged 5.7 yards a carry. He has been our best special teams player and he has shown us all what he is capable of. But nope. He still hasn't earned playing time. Tom would rather give the ball to an injured player, or a guy that was recently signed and doesn't know the playbook than to further help the development of a healthy first round pick who has proven that he is dangerous with the ball in his hands.

5. Sean Locklear comes in and outperforms David Diehl by a mile showing the coaches that he deserves to be a starter. The coaches even admit that Locklear played good and did everything right, however he still wasn't able to earn the starting right tackle job ( One of the most important positions in the NFL.)

I could keep going down the list and name guys like david Douglas who played better than Jennigan or mention Jpp who is another guy who didnt get much playing time as a rookie (mostly played on special teams). But i dont want this post to be too long.

On this team it seems as though you only get opportunities when players get injured and not based on how you play. What are your thoughts?

penguinfarmer
12-25-2012, 03:20 PM
I don't think the player preference is exclusive to Coughlin. Every fan base has had a preference [and one that may be justified] for one player over the other. But the "Coughlin doesn't like rookies" argument has long been debated for reasons I don't understand. No matter how polished the prospect is, there is ALWAYS a transition to the NFL that takes some time. Why people want to rush a player and compromise the offense for a few "flashes" is beyond me. You should find it fortuante that the Giants aren't in a roster position where they HAVE TO start a rookie over a current stocked roster.

And if that doesn't absorb, there are plenty of rookies that have already played their share with first teams during Coughlin's tenure as a Giant HC which undermines the rookie theory by iteslf/

CowboysSuck
12-25-2012, 03:25 PM
Wilson is the main example I'll agree with you on. I suppose Ojomo is another one, but we have plenty of healthy ends (just none of them produced this year). Side note: Tuck is a straight bum and if he is our starter next year I might lose my mind.

Wilson needs to be featured, Coughlin needs to seriously address these second half collapses and Reese/the F.O. have some serious work cut out for them this offseason.

I tried warning some of you over a month ago that we were collapsing again. I was met with serious criticism and labeled a negative nancy. Yeah, now what?

We can't put all the blame on just one aspect of the team. Its not only the coaches, not only the players, not only the Front Office. Its all three phases. We aren't that good of a team the last 8 games of a season. Simple as that. Something needs to change, and it starts with letting a lot of coaches and players walk.

CowboysSuck
12-25-2012, 03:27 PM
Aside from Wilson, "not letting rookies play" is absolutely not the issue. Lack of preparation, lack of heart, and this mind-set that Coughlin has embraced that we can just flip the switch and get hot once our back is against the wall and win the superbowl no problem is complete crap and frankly I'm a bit fed up with it.

Buddy333
12-25-2012, 05:14 PM
The first Super Bowl they won they used how many draft picks? Wilson is not Super Man. He will not take it to the house every carry and he is a liability protecting a non mobile QB like Eli. Does TC really not want to use Wilson? Then why did the 2nd and 3rd round pick get more playing time than him this year?

M00KIE
12-25-2012, 05:39 PM
Ryan Perrilloux? Really? This is a concern for you?

Marvelousmik
12-25-2012, 05:57 PM
The first Super Bowl they won they used how many draft picks? Wilson is not Super Man. He will not take it to the house every carry and he is a liability protecting a non mobile QB like Eli. Does TC really not want to use Wilson? Then why did the 2nd and 3rd round pick get more playing time than him this year?

what about ojomo never being activated. not even playing special teams

TheShouldersOf
12-25-2012, 05:58 PM
how many times did Bradshaw get Eli sacked? and you are worried about Wilson getting him killed? at least he got in front of the guy in the Atlanta game, maybe he got blown up, but he impeded his progress, what did Bradshaw do?

tell me,

if you were the Coach, would you have kept Bradshaw in?

Buddy333
12-25-2012, 06:26 PM
what about ojomo never being activated. not even playing special teamsTwo thoughts on that. They have not been technically knocked out of the post season yet. Maybe they where hoping to ave Tuck and Osi get back to last seasons form when they needed it most at the end. The other, maybe he s not as good as we though by seeing him against second and third string offenses in the pre season. Whatever the reason, they have proven many of times the are not afraid to use rookies.

Marvelousmik
12-25-2012, 06:28 PM
Two thoughts on that. They have not been technically knocked out of the post season yet. Maybe they where hoping to ave Tuck and Osi get back to last seasons form when they needed it most at the end. The other, maybe he s not as good as we though by seeing him against second and third string offenses in the pre season. Whatever the reason, they have proven many of times the are not afraid to use rookies.

im not saying they are afraid to use rookies. my question is how do you earn playing time?

Buddy333
12-25-2012, 06:28 PM
Bradshaw is one of the bet blocking RB's in the NFL. Seeing Wilson get blown up like that should have had DC's planning on blitzing the second they see him in the game.

Buddy333
12-25-2012, 06:30 PM
im not saying they are afraid to use rookies. my question is how do you earn playing time?Be very good or have lots of injuries in front of you. You don't automatically play because of your draft position if you are not ready.

Cloud57
12-25-2012, 06:38 PM
Bradshaw is one of the bet blocking RB's in the NFL. Seeing Wilson get blown up like that should have had DC's planning on blitzing the second they see him in the game.He was a good blocking RB and that's only when he's healthy. but in terms of his running ability this guy is currently the worse RB, if he was cut today no team would sign him. I'm not hating on Bradshaw and I know that he's tough and playing through injuries but still when you look at the RBs on other teams they all look better than Bradshaw. The lack of a run game is one reason why this offense is struggling, I know the Oline isn't great but the only time when our run game actually looked good this season is when Brown or Wilson was getting a lot of carries.

Marvelousmik
12-25-2012, 06:50 PM
Be very good or have lots of injuries in front of you. You don't automatically play because of your draft position if you are not ready.

then how do you explain adrian tracy being a head of ojomo when ojomo played better than him in the preseason? its not like tracy has been a stud in the regular season or on special teams. what about david douglas getting cut for jennigan, or diehl starting a head of locklear? my point has nothing to do with draft position.

Tony Bruno
12-25-2012, 07:42 PM
Ha now there is a question that no one has the answer to!!!

penguinfarmer
12-25-2012, 08:06 PM
You think preseason is the end all, especially when Ojomo has been playing third stringers? Maybe, just maybe the coaches see just a little bit more than what's viewed on tv.

Coaches put the guys on the field who they feel best give them the opportunity to win. That's who earns playing time. Rarely is that a rookie. There is no major bias. Wilson got a carry well before Brown or Scott.

Buddy333
12-25-2012, 08:07 PM
He was a good blocking RB and that's only when he's healthy. but in terms of his running ability this guy is currently the worse RB, if he was cut today no team would sign him. I'm not hating on Bradshaw and I know that he's tough and playing through injuries but still when you look at the RBs on other teams they all look better than Bradshaw. The lack of a run game is one reason why this offense is struggling, I know the Oline isn't great but the only time when our run game actually looked good this season is when Brown or Wilson was getting a lot of carries.He is actually having a good season. Not his fault the OL is so bad. Even with his speed Wilson was getting stopped.

Buddy333
12-25-2012, 08:12 PM
then how do you explain adrian tracy being a head of ojomo when ojomo played better than him in the preseason? its not like tracy has been a stud in the regular season or on special teams. what about david douglas getting cut for jennigan, or diehl starting a head of locklear? my point has nothing to do with draft position.As far as Tracey he has been on the team for a while and maybe he knows where to be better than Ojomo. He also has been pretty good on special teams. As for JJ they won't get rid of their 3rd round pick from last year that soon. It's not his fault Cruz turned out to be one f the best slot receivers in the game. The Diehl thing is a head scratcher.

Marvelousmik
12-25-2012, 08:22 PM
As far as Tracey goes i dont have a good explanation. As for JJ they won't get rid of their 3rd round pick from last year that soon.. . The Diehl thing is a head scratcher.

shorten and fixed it for you.

you basically couldnt think of a reason for ojomo. it doesnt matter how Douglas played because jennigan is a 3rd round pick. and you think the diehl decision is a head scratcher.

and i agree. this is my whole point. how do you earn playing time? its obviously not solely based on performance.

Buddy333
12-25-2012, 08:26 PM
No, it was worded right. He has time here and maybe the coaches see something that we don't. Like maybe he is in the right place at he right time.

Marvelousmik
12-25-2012, 08:34 PM
No, it was worded right. He has time here and maybe the coaches see something that we don't. Like maybe he is in the right place at he right time.

Okay, so you dont know what the reason is. We get this.

I'm just curious as to how you earn playing time. obviously real game action doesn't have much of a factor.

Buddy333
12-25-2012, 08:37 PM
What real game action are you referring to? Pre season against 3rd stringers?

Marvelousmik
12-25-2012, 08:44 PM
What real game action are you referring to? Pre season against 3rd stringers?

Then how do you earn playing time? At least ojomo is able to look good and make plays some where on the field. I cant say the same for tracy.


real action preseason game > practicing against your teammates half speed without pads. If you cant earn playing time from not only playing good in the preseason, but looking dominant, then whats the point of preseason?

Buddy333
12-25-2012, 09:44 PM
Tracey looked bad in pre season?

Marvelousmik
12-25-2012, 09:46 PM
Tracey looked bad in pre season?

who played better?

Buddy333
12-25-2012, 09:50 PM
They both looked good but wen also don't see the practice sessions.

Marvelousmik
12-25-2012, 09:54 PM
They both looked good but wen also don't see the practice sessions.

ojomo looked way better

TheShouldersOf
12-25-2012, 10:51 PM
Bradshaw is one of the bet blocking RB's in the NFL. Seeing Wilson get blown up like that should have had DC's planning on blitzing the second they see him in the game.

And Watching Bradshaw miss every block and get Eli sacked numerous times was what?

TheShouldersOf
12-25-2012, 10:52 PM
He is actually having a good season. Not his fault the OL is so bad. Even with his speed Wilson was getting stopped.

you mean he is having an average season, which he normally has, he is an average back with better blocking abilities than running, and those have even suffered this year, has blocks were not as good as years prior, and last week should have been benched in the first quarter

Dorothy
12-25-2012, 11:00 PM
In spite of how this season is turning out, Tom Coughlin in my opinion is one of the best coaches when it comes to getting guys prepared for a game. That being said, he is a big reason why we've been so successful since he has been here, and i respect him. But from a players prospective What do you have to do in order to earn playing time? Here are some examples of why i ask this question.

1. Cruz had a break out year in training camp and was one of the biggest preseason sensations The NFL as ever seen by an undrafted free agent, but still wasn't able to make his way onto the staring line up. They even forced him onto injury reserve (like they do with everyone they want to keep) when he didn't have a season ending injury. The next year Hixon had to go down in order for cruz to finally get his chance. and Even so, Tom even tried playing Bradon Stokley before giving cruz a real shot.

2. Ojomo is another example. he lead the team in sacks during the preseason and showed to be a dominant force. However, he hasnt even been activated once this season, and he isnt even on the injury report. i dont think anyone is asking for him to be a full time starter, but the guy isnt even getting playing time. even Adrian Tracy is a head of him on the depth chart.

3. Ryan Perrilloux. This one actually bothered me the most because he took advantage of all his opportunities during the preseason. (8/9 passes completed, for X yards and 2 touchdowns). The guy basically made good throws and didnt turn the ball over during his limited chances. David carr played garbage and struggled to even complete passes. When it became time for the 3rd and 4th string guys to play in the final preseason game, in spite of how garbage Carr looked, TC kept Ryan on the sidelines and didnt even give him and opportunity to go out there and audition. No chance to earn anything. He made him suit up for nothing. ive never seen a coach do this before.

4. David wilson. The whole blocking excuse goes out the window now. Bradshaw came in hurt last week and whiffed on every block and what did Tom decide to do? He let Hynoski take his place on blocking situations (shotgun) and gave Bradshaw the ball when they lined up in the eye. You couldn't do that with Wilson earlier on in the season? Wilson touched the ball 3 times for 17 yards and a td. In those 3 touches he averaged 5.7 yards a carry. He has been our best special teams player and he has shown us all what he is capable of. But nope. He still hasn't earned playing time. Tom would rather give the ball to an injured player, or a guy that was recently signed and doesn't know the playbook than to further help the development of a healthy first round pick who has proven that he is dangerous with the ball in his hands.

5. Sean Locklear comes in and outperforms David Diehl by a mile showing the coaches that he deserves to be a starter. The coaches even admit that Locklear played good and did everything right, however he still wasn't able to earn the starting right tackle job ( One of the most important positions in the NFL.)

I could keep going down the list and name guys like david Douglas who played better than Jennigan or mention Jpp who is another guy who didnt get much playing time as a rookie (mostly played on special teams). But i dont want this post to be too long.

On this team it seems as though you only get opportunities when players get injured and not based on how you play. What are your thoughts?

I so agree with you. Just had this discussion with my guest today. It is the one thing about TC that drives me nutty.

TextureDj
12-25-2012, 11:20 PM
In spite of how this season is turning out, Tom Coughlin in my opinion is one of the best coaches when it comes to getting guys prepared for a game. That being said, he is a big reason why we've been so successful since he has been here, and i respect him. But from a players prospective What do you have to do in order to earn playing time? Here are some examples of why i ask this question.

1. Cruz had a break out year in training camp and was one of the biggest preseason sensations The NFL as ever seen by an undrafted free agent, but still wasn't able to make his way onto the staring line up. They even forced him onto injury reserve (like they do with everyone they want to keep) when he didn't have a season ending injury. The next year Hixon had to go down in order for cruz to finally get his chance. and Even so, Tom even tried playing Bradon Stokley before giving cruz a real shot.

2. Ojomo is another example. he lead the team in sacks during the preseason and showed to be a dominant force. However, he hasnt even been activated once this season, and he isnt even on the injury report. i dont think anyone is asking for him to be a full time starter, but the guy isnt even getting playing time. even Adrian Tracy is a head of him on the depth chart.

3. Ryan Perrilloux. This one actually bothered me the most because he took advantage of all his opportunities during the preseason. (8/9 passes completed, for X yards and 2 touchdowns). The guy basically made good throws and didnt turn the ball over during his limited chances. David carr played garbage and struggled to even complete passes. When it became time for the 3rd and 4th string guys to play in the final preseason game, in spite of how garbage Carr looked, TC kept Ryan on the sidelines and didnt even give him and opportunity to go out there and audition. No chance to earn anything. He made him suit up for nothing. ive never seen a coach do this before.

4. David wilson. The whole blocking excuse goes out the window now. Bradshaw came in hurt last week and whiffed on every block and what did Tom decide to do? He let Hynoski take his place on blocking situations (shotgun) and gave Bradshaw the ball when they lined up in the eye. You couldn't do that with Wilson earlier on in the season? Wilson touched the ball 3 times for 17 yards and a td. In those 3 touches he averaged 5.7 yards a carry. He has been our best special teams player and he has shown us all what he is capable of. But nope. He still hasn't earned playing time. Tom would rather give the ball to an injured player, or a guy that was recently signed and doesn't know the playbook than to further help the development of a healthy first round pick who has proven that he is dangerous with the ball in his hands.

5. Sean Locklear comes in and outperforms David Diehl by a mile showing the coaches that he deserves to be a starter. The coaches even admit that Locklear played good and did everything right, however he still wasn't able to earn the starting right tackle job ( One of the most important positions in the NFL.)

I could keep going down the list and name guys like david Douglas who played better than Jennigan or mention Jpp who is another guy who didnt get much playing time as a rookie (mostly played on special teams). But i dont want this post to be too long.

On this team it seems as though you only get opportunities when players get injured and not based on how you play. What are your thoughts?

I think part of it, especially with the rooks is trying to keep their eligibility for the practicesquad intact. If they activate a guy like Ojomo as a "trial" for too many games dont hey ruin his PS eligibility for next year if they need to stash him?

mike kennedy
12-25-2012, 11:46 PM
You marry into the family and bring the mashed potatoes to the holiday dinners.