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View Full Version : I think we should drop coughlin straight up



giant-4-life
12-31-2012, 01:49 AM
and pursue Cowher. he's a hell of a lot harder as a coach then coughlin. I might be pulling at straws here or we will be in for a lackluster 2013

gmen0820
12-31-2012, 01:50 AM
AsianGiant for HC

Harooni
12-31-2012, 02:25 AM
they will never fire him .

DemandedAce
12-31-2012, 02:38 AM
Coughlin will never be fired, if it ever got beyond terrible he would be given a chance to retire with dignity.

giantsfan420
12-31-2012, 02:40 AM
keep TC.
hire Tom Moore as OC, otherwise retain KG.
Hire Spags as DC.

Host first ever home SB game...

Drez
12-31-2012, 02:41 AM
and pursue Cowher. he's a hell of a lot harder as a coach then coughlin. I might be pulling at straws here or we will be in for a lackluster 2013
And wait 13 years for a Lombardi?

ashleymarie
12-31-2012, 02:45 AM
AsianGiant for HC

Who is Asian Giant, Don Corleone? Like your avatar.

ashleymarie
12-31-2012, 02:49 AM
Coughlin will never be fired, if it ever got beyond terrible he would be given a chance to retire with dignity.

FO will want him here for the SB next year.

gmen0820
12-31-2012, 02:51 AM
Who is Asian Giant, Don Corleone? Like your avatar.His sig makes mention that he was formerly known as [the poster] Brandon Jacobs.

Brandon Jacobs created this thread (http://boards.giants.com/showthread.php?11-Asian-giant-for-HC&highlight=asiangiant) a few years back, that has managed to stick around years later.

And thanks for the avatar mention, just switched it for the first time in about a year.

ashleymarie
12-31-2012, 02:56 AM
His sig makes mention that he was formerly known as [the poster] Brandon Jacobs.

Brandon Jacobs created this thread (http://boards.giants.com/showthread.php?11-Asian-giant-for-HC&highlight=asiangiant) a few years back, that has managed to stick around years later.

And thanks for the avatar mention, just switched it for the first time in about a year.

Thank you for your info. I wasn't aware of it. Some threads have a life of their own, they grow legs so to speak. :)

gmen0820
12-31-2012, 02:58 AM
Thank you for your info. I wasn't aware of it. Some threads have a life of their own, they grow legs so to speak. :)You're welcome, and yes, it sure appears to be the case with that thread, and a few others in particular.

BurnerNYG
12-31-2012, 03:07 AM
Win a Superbowl in February and then gets fired in December. I sure wouldn't wanna work for you.

G-MENBK
12-31-2012, 03:11 AM
Win a Superbowl in February and then gets fired in December. I sure wouldn't wanna work for you.

He still needs a conversation with the higher-ups. Since Coughlin has taken the helm, this team has been highly inconsistent: strong first half followed by a subpar second half.

This needs to stop. No, I'm not implying they should fire Coughlin but they should give him the impetus to let go players, fire personnel that are a detriment.

ashleymarie
12-31-2012, 03:20 AM
Win a Superbowl in February and then gets fired in December. I sure wouldn't wanna work for you.

Not being testy, honest. Can you name a few things he did this season worthy of retaining his job. I mean all I hear about is PAST laurels and accolades. Is that why he still has a job here, or did he really do some magical things this season and I missed seeing them. No offense meant in any manner.

BurnerNYG
12-31-2012, 03:21 AM
He still needs a conversation with the higher-ups. Since Coughlin has taken the helm, this team has been highly inconsistent: strong first half followed by a subpar second half.

This needs to stop. No, I'm not implying they should fire Coughlin but they should give him the impetus to let go players, fire personnel that are a detriment.We don't have the luxury of playing Buffalo, the Jets and Miami every year... plus our schedule was hard. We won 2 Superbowls in 5 years so therefore this conversation doesn't make a whole lot of sense.

giant-4-life
12-31-2012, 03:25 AM
I've heard it said that as long as TC stays, so does KG. not sure how much water that will hold but if that IS the case, we won't go back to a SB and I say this HOPING I'm wrong...

BurnerNYG
12-31-2012, 03:28 AM
I think TC lucked up last year with Cruz and the 1st Superbowl with Bradshaw and Boss but the fact of the matter is... he won. Do you realize how hard it is to win Championships in the NFL? They can't fire him... we're stuck until he bows out gracefully but they can probably force him to find new coordinators.

ashleymarie
12-31-2012, 03:32 AM
I think TC lucked up last year with Cruz and the 1st Superbowl with Bradshaw and Boss but the fact of the matter is... he won. Do you realize how hard it is to win Championships in the NFL? They can't fire him... we're stuck until he bows out gracefully but they can probably force him to find new coordinators.

I see. I respect your opinion. Thanks.

G-MENBK
12-31-2012, 03:37 AM
We don't have the luxury of playing Buffalo, the Jets and Miami every year... plus our schedule was hard. We won 2 Superbowls in 5 years so therefore this conversation doesn't make a whole lot of sense.

With all due respect, this season, the Giants have shown glimpses of dominating games that were supposed to be highly contested; losing games that they were supposed to win.

At the end of the day, you still have a team that falters once the second half starts.

NYGFaninILL
12-31-2012, 03:53 AM
I bet you were saying that after 09 and 10, too. Oh, wait, I forgot the Giants won two super bowls IN SPITE of our Coaching staff and FO.

Drez
12-31-2012, 03:56 AM
I've heard it said that as long as TC stays, so does KG. not sure how much water that will hold but if that IS the case, we won't go back to a SB and I say this HOPING I'm wrong...
Yeah, because we weren't able to make it to 2 and win 2 SBs with KG.

G-MENBK
12-31-2012, 04:04 AM
I bet you were saying that after 09 and 10, too. Oh, wait, I forgot the Giants won two super bowls IN SPITE of our Coaching staff and FO.

Great. And the Giants will be home next week.

NYGFaninILL
12-31-2012, 04:08 AM
Great. And the Giants will be home next week.

What's your point? Cleaning house because we missed the playoffs?

G-MENBK
12-31-2012, 04:23 AM
What's your point? Cleaning house because we missed the playoffs?

I don't want Coughlin gone but this inconsistency has been around since he's taken the helm. What hurt us a lot this season was that he allowed injured players to play instead of allowing someone else to take their place, and he's a too loyal to veteran players on this team.

For starters, that **** needs to stop.

Redeyejedi
12-31-2012, 08:32 AM
Great. And the Giants will be home next week.Should the Steelers fire everyone?

Flip Empty
12-31-2012, 08:43 AM
They either win spectacularly or bomb out dramatically. Coughlin doesn't do things by halves.

RoanokeFan
12-31-2012, 08:51 AM
and pursue Cowher. he's a hell of a lot harder as a coach then coughlin. I might be pulling at straws here or we will be in for a lackluster 2013

Why would we do that?

Kruunch
12-31-2012, 08:53 AM
and pursue Cowher. he's a hell of a lot harder as a coach then coughlin. I might be pulling at straws here or we will be in for a lackluster 2013

You're the kind of guy who likes Fords over Ferraris aren't you?

Mercury
12-31-2012, 09:15 AM
giant-4-life? What were you born yesterday? Way to support your SB-winning HC.

MikeyMike01
12-31-2012, 09:21 AM
Unfortunately I think we're stuck with this turd of a coaching staff. At least for next season.

giantyankee1976
12-31-2012, 09:31 AM
Thank you for your info. I wasn't aware of it. Some threads have a life of their own, they grow legs so to speak. :)

evolution

tmcd637
12-31-2012, 09:33 AM
Keep TC but the rest of the staff has to go. Kildrive has Eli passing with 2 mins left in the first half leaving time on the clock for the Eagles, Then all season the Defense has been rushing four down linemen instead of mixing things up. Same record as last year with two big blowouts in the mix Players play the game but it's coaching that get them ready!

Die-Hard
12-31-2012, 09:42 AM
Man, another "Fire TC" thread? Come on, people. Aren't there 40 other ones already here that you could have posted your opinions in?

Stop already, or at the very least, do your homework. While I'm far from being a fan of KG's offense, it DOES work, and he's got 2 rings to prove it. Why is that not enough to placate you guys? They aren't going to win it all every year, so accept it and move on.

gumby74
12-31-2012, 09:46 AM
i was never a TC fan, but this is overboard.

giantyankee1976
12-31-2012, 09:46 AM
Man, another "Fire TC" thread? Come on, people. Aren't there 40 other ones already here that you could have posted your opinions in?

Stop already, or at the very least, do your homework. While I'm far from being a fan of KG's offense, it DOES work, and he's got 2 rings to prove it. Why is that not enough to placate you guys? They aren't going to win it all every year, so accept it and move on.

Tommy goes no where, Gilbride stays. If anything Perry Sheridan Lewis should get a hard look...

sc_markt
12-31-2012, 09:50 AM
and pursue Cowher. he's a hell of a lot harder as a coach then coughlin. I might be pulling at straws here or we will be in for a lackluster 2013

Yes, and if I am not mistaken, he got Pittsburgh 1 super bowl in 15 years which is way better than Coughlin's record here...

bELIeve_in_Giants
12-31-2012, 09:52 AM
Spags has had no success since leaving the Giants. Not sure I trust that he's the answer on defense.

Coughlin has earned the right to stay until he retires and goes into the HOF. Nothing has changed on that since February.

Rudyy
12-31-2012, 09:53 AM
Just straight up firing someone doesn't really solve anything.

gumby74
12-31-2012, 10:03 AM
Just straight up firing someone doesn't really solve anything.

There are plenty of cases where coaching changes,especially in the case of a d-co-ordinator, did wonders.

RoanokeFan
12-31-2012, 10:10 AM
Spags has had no success since leaving the Giants. Not sure I trust that he's the answer on defense.

Coughlin has earned the right to stay until he retires and goes into the HOF. Nothing has changed on that since February.

I had this conversation on Spags with my son on the way home from the game. Did Spags make our D great or did the players? He hasn't had any success since leaving here.

RoanokeFan
12-31-2012, 10:12 AM
There are plenty of cases where coaching changes,especially in the case of a d-co-ordinator, did wonders.

Probably so, but those firings were't made by emotional fans.

Rudyy
12-31-2012, 10:12 AM
There are plenty of cases where coaching changes,especially in the case of a d-co-ordinator, did wonders.But it's not just them, it's a combination of things.

JayMas9
12-31-2012, 10:17 AM
I think TC lucked up last year with Cruz and the 1st Superbowl with Bradshaw and Boss but the fact of the matter is... he won. Do you realize how hard it is to win Championships in the NFL? They can't fire him... we're stuck until he bows out gracefully but they can probably force him to find new coordinators.No one forces Coughlin into new coordinators. As a head coach, he is in charge of his staff. I don't know where this bologna came from about front office and making Coughlin hire/fire coordinators, but it has no basis in reality. When we needed a change at OC, he fired Huffnagel. When we needed changes at DC, he made them. He's never showed a stubbornness to improve the coaching staff if he can. If he thinks Perry Fewell or KG would have to go...then he would take care of it, he's proven that.

DandyDon
12-31-2012, 11:06 AM
I think TC lucked up last year with Cruz and the 1st Superbowl with Bradshaw and Boss but the fact of the matter is... he won. Do you realize how hard it is to win Championships in the NFL? They can't fire him... we're stuck until he bows out gracefully but they can probably force him to find new coordinators.

So we won 2 superbowls in spite of Coughlin? He was just lucky to be here? :confused:

r1000
12-31-2012, 11:11 AM
What is the love fest with B Cowher... ugh not me... i don't want him as a the HC!!

Kez Simpson
12-31-2012, 11:21 AM
When will these morons go away? This isn't even up for discussion.

BurnerNYG
12-31-2012, 11:50 AM
So we won 2 superbowls in spite of Coughlin? He was just lucky to be here? :confused:I said he lucked up with some players that probably wouldn't have sniffed the field had a few guys didn't get hurt.

Die-Hard
12-31-2012, 11:53 AM
I had this conversation on Spags with my son on the way home from the game. Did Spags make our D great or did the players? He hasn't had any success since leaving here.

Not even a little bit. He had the perfect cast for his system when he was here, but those guys are either no longer here, or are too old to be effective anymore. Spags is definitely NOT the answer

RoanokeFan
12-31-2012, 11:55 AM
Not even a little bit. He had the perfect cast for his system when he was here, but those guys are either no longer here, or are too old to be effective anymore. Spags is definitely NOT the answer

He at last needs to show some success somewhere else.

gumby74
12-31-2012, 11:55 AM
Not even a little bit. He had the perfect cast for his system when he was here, but those guys are either no longer here, or are too old to be effective anymore. Spags is definitely NOT the answer

I'm no expert, but I'm a firm believer that coaching is more about adaptation and stuff that you can't see than X's and O's. If you compare Spags in 2008 and Fewell his first year here. PF had much more talent than Spags. Yet Spags defense was top 5.

Why is it that a good co-ordinator can come in using the exact same personnel and succeed where as the previous coordinator failed? Sure, it's never that simple, but there are plenty of cases where this is true.

Die-Hard
12-31-2012, 12:00 PM
He at last needs to show some success somewhere else.

Spage was much better at mid game adjustments, but again, he had much more to work with IMO. Yes, some of those guys are still here, but they now have MANY more miles on them, and cant play at that level anymore. PF doesn't adjust anything. He installs the game plan, and sticks to it regardless of whats happening. I agree that they should consider looking elsewhere for a DC, but I do not think Spags should be the guy they look to. He has done nothing since he left the Giants

EDIT: Meant to quote Gumby74, not you RF. My bad!

gumby74
12-31-2012, 12:03 PM
Spage was much better at mid game adjustments, but again, he had much more to work with IMO. Yes, some of those guys are still here, but they now have MANY more miles on them, and cant play at that level anymore. PF doesn't adjust anything. He installs the game plan, and sticks to it regardless of whats happening. I agree that they should consider looking elsewhere for a DC, but I do not think Spags should be the guy they look to. He has done nothing since he left the Giants

Did he? Spags had Butler, Dockery, Johnson, Danny Clark, AP, and god knows who played weak side. I can't even remember. Fewell had KP, Rolle, Boley, Canty (but no Cofield/Robbins) in additionto everyone else.

TroyArcher
12-31-2012, 12:17 PM
TC won 2 SB's in less time it took Cowher to win one. Come on, get serious.

RoanokeFan
12-31-2012, 12:36 PM
Spage was much better at mid game adjustments, but again, he had much more to work with IMO. Yes, some of those guys are still here, but they now have MANY more miles on them, and cant play at that level anymore. PF doesn't adjust anything. He installs the game plan, and sticks to it regardless of whats happening. I agree that they should consider looking elsewhere for a DC, but I do not think Spags should be the guy they look to. He has done nothing since he left the Giants

EDIT: Meant to quote Gumby74, not you RF. My bad!

I figured it out :)

ny06
12-31-2012, 12:41 PM
Dig up Vince Lombardi and give him a two year contract...

gmen0820
12-31-2012, 12:44 PM
Did he? Spags had Butler, Dockery, Johnson, Danny Clark, AP, and god knows who played weak side. I can't even remember. Fewell had KP, Rolle, Boley, Canty (but no Cofield/Robbins) in additionto everyone else.Fewell had Cofield in 2010

Joe Morrison
12-31-2012, 12:46 PM
Spage was much better at mid game adjustments, but again, he had much more to work with IMO. Yes, some of those guys are still here, but they now have MANY more miles on them, and cant play at that level anymore. PF doesn't adjust anything. He installs the game plan, and sticks to it regardless of whats happening. I agree that they should consider looking elsewhere for a DC, but I do not think Spags should be the guy they look to. He has done nothing since he left the Giants

EDIT: Meant to quote Gumby74, not you RF. My bad!

Spags has not done well since he left, this year with the Saints was a disaster for him.

JayMas9
12-31-2012, 12:48 PM
Fewell had Cofield in 2010We also had a statistically solid defense in 10, that collapse was absolutely awful though.

ghostoftommymaddox
12-31-2012, 12:57 PM
Had Nicks been healthy, they would have won the division and we would not be having this discussion. And the entire competitive philosophy of the NFL is built around the idea of parity anyway. That, along with injuries, makes it difficult to pin a team's failures on the coach unless there is obvious incompetence, and I don't see how you put TC in that category.

Check around a bit. Cowher, Gruden, Billick etc. had more than their share of ups and downs -- look it up. Shanahan has two rings but folks in D.C. were screaming for his head until about a month ago (and they'd have it on a platter had he not brought RGIII to town). Jim Schwartz took the Lions from 0-16 to the playoffs and back down the toilet in less than four years. Rex Ryan: two AFC championship games in his first two years, the laughingstock of the league in year four. Ken Whisenhunt took the Cardinals to the Super Bowl not long ago -- he's now in the same boat as Schwartz.

The idea that the Giants are at some kind of coaching disadvantage is simply wrong. TC is not perfect, but neither is anybody else.

And, by the way, only Belichick has a measurably superior track record, and TC has beaten him twice in the Super Bowl.

BlueJayC
12-31-2012, 01:02 PM
and pursue Cowher. he's a hell of a lot harder as a coach then coughlin. I might be pulling at straws here or we will be in for a lackluster 2013


http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=5hfYJsQAhl0

Trevor
12-31-2012, 05:31 PM
For what it's worth, I think it's central to the discussion that basically, this has been the team's MO under Coughlin. Good first half, then adventure/agita in the second. It's kind of Jekyll and Hyde, and at this point, I think the players subconsciously key-in that they can have huge let-downs and still win. Unfortunately, that doesn't always pan out. And with the talent on this team, it has to stop.

Then there are the truly bewildering examples of play calling and strategy. In the first Redskins game, after a fumble, Giants get the ball back on their own 29 with 7 minutes left, but Eli comes out throwing on first down and is immediately picked off. Even the announcers were criticizing throwing at that point. That lead to a Redskins FG, bringing them within 4 points. In the Giant's next series, with 3 and change on the clock, facing a 3rd and 1 (when running the clock down should have been most important), Eli was throwing again. Incomplete pass, stopped clock, punt, and RGIII puts 7 on the board to put Skins ahead with a minute and a half on the clock. And only the Eli to Cruz 77-yarder saved our bacon.

Could go on and on. I'm sure others could, too. Just basic strategy that gets screwed up. And at the end of the day, if Coughlin isn't willing to step in and say some of these plays are really pretty dumb, then what's the point of all his barking? The buck stops with him, doesn't it?

And not for nothing, but geez, the man has never run a real trick play. Other teams don't even have to prepare for that because they know Coughlin wouldn't dream of doing it.

All in all, I think we won two SBs because of Spagnuolo's D plan against the Pats, and Eli's ridiculous season last year. And let's face it, if not for injuries, Cruz would have mostly ridden the bench last year.

Admittedly, I've never been a Coughlin fan. Too much talent on these teams for them to be so flat for so many big games. Maybe it was the Panthers 23-0 stinker in 2006, that set me on this course. I don't know. But this team should not be sitting at home next weekend. Actually, they should have been practicing as they should have earned a first round bye. And like I said, the buck stops with Coughlin.

In the end, let's just say I wouldn't be unhappy with some new blood for this team. I think Coughlin's become stale and it's wearing down the players. Fire him? Don't know if I'd pull that trigger considering the 2 SBs, but change is always good.

G14ntzF4π
12-31-2012, 05:43 PM
I used to want to see tom fired but now I just wish he would retire. He has done the most he can do with the giants and more than most HC's. It's time he hand's over the keys though.

giant-4-life
12-31-2012, 05:47 PM
Win a Superbowl in February and then gets fired in December. I sure wouldn't wanna work for you.

why? because from Feb to December you lost control of the team?

BigBlue1971
12-31-2012, 05:59 PM
TC will never be fired from this team! the guy has directed us to 2 superbowl victories with one of 'em just last year. i just dont think firing him is justified!

Trevor
12-31-2012, 06:28 PM
I used to want to see tom fired but now I just wish he would retire. He has done the most he can do with the giants and more than most HC's. It's time he hand's over the keys though.

I want him to be fired, but don't want to see it happen (if that makes sense). He has too much pride and has devoted himself to the Giants for many a year. So I'm with you, I'd like to see him retire. With a big ceremony, of course. He deserves that and hopefully he'll get it.

SuperNYGiants
12-31-2012, 10:30 PM
It's going to be Coughlin's last year if he doesn't take the team to the playoffs in 2013, no doubt about it.