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View Full Version : Thinker stat: other than Coughlin's first year, the Giants have NEVER been worse than 8-8 under him.



GOBIGBLUE52
12-24-2011, 06:20 PM
I'm not happy with how the offense played today and we'll have to play better against Dallas (D was better though), but you can't deny that's a nice stat to have. Regardless of what happens with first round playoff exits, etc, the Giants have won a lot with him here. If someone told me in 2004 the Giants would have won a super bowl and be in playoff contention almost every year, I would've signed up for that. Look at teams like the browns, the vikings, redskins....they'd kill for that. Hell even the giant fans from the 60s and 70s can probably vouch here.

krygny
12-24-2011, 06:54 PM
... Hell even the giant fans from the 60s and 70s can probably vouch here.
I was there. Wandered in the football wasteland for my first 20 years as a Giants fan. Most of those seasons were on the low side of 8-8 (or 7-7).

But if the Giants win next week, there's no way Coughlin or Gilbride OR Fewell will be fired. Now, how many haters here will be rooting for Dallas?

Sintim97
12-24-2011, 06:58 PM
Honestly? Yes I'm rooting for Dallas to stomp a mud hole in us. Lol @ Fewells job not being in jeproday

giantsforce
12-24-2011, 07:02 PM
... Hell even the giant fans from the 60s and 70s can probably vouch here.
I was there. Wandered in the football wasteland for my first 20 years as a Giants fan. Most of those seasons were on the low side of 8-8 (or 7-7).

But if the Giants win next week, there's no way Coughlin or Gilbride OR Fewell will be fired. Now, how many haters here will be rooting for Dallas?

I guess you are used to accepting mediocrity and if 9-7 is not mediocrity to you then I am sorry that you have such a low standards. Other than 2007 Coughlin's teams have done nothing special, Even when they made the playoffs they got trounced in the first game. So, even if we make this year's playoffs, the chances getting by teams like Detroit or Atlanta are minimal.

krygny
12-24-2011, 07:29 PM
... Hell even the giant fans from the 60s and 70s can probably vouch here.
I was there. Wandered in the football wasteland for my first 20 years as a Giants fan. Most of those seasons were on the low side of 8-8 (or 7-7).

But if the Giants win next week, there's no way Coughlin or Gilbride OR Fewell will be fired. Now, how many haters here will be rooting for Dallas?

I guess you are used to accepting mediocrity and if 9-7 is not mediocrity to you then I am sorry that you have such a low standards. Other than 2007 Coughlin's teams have done nothing special, Even when they made the playoffs they got trounced in the first game. So, even if we make this year's playoffs, the chances getting by teams like Detroit or Atlanta are minimal.
So, when DID you ever root for the Giants? By your logic, you sure as hell didn't root for them in 2007 either.

yoeddy
12-24-2011, 07:31 PM
I'm not happy with how the offense played today and we'll have to play better against Dallas (D was better though), but you can't deny that's a nice stat to have. Regardless of what happens with first round playoff exits, etc, the Giants have won a lot with him here. If someone told me in 2004 the Giants would have won a super bowl and be in playoff contention almost every year, I would've signed up for that. Look at teams like the browns, the vikings, redskins....they'd kill for that. Hell even the giant fans from the 60s and 70s can probably vouch here.


FWIW, no other Giant head coach can make the same claim that other than their first year, they did not have a losing season...

Medisleman
12-24-2011, 07:32 PM
Coughlin is a great coach and great man. Anybody else notice him shoving the doc and everyone aside so he could go coach the team?

JaxMan
12-24-2011, 07:35 PM
(Giantsforce) Your arugment is flawed as well, '07 they only went 10-6,just like they did in '11, and as far as when they havent been mediocre, hows about '05 when they won the division with 11 wins and '08 when they had 12 wins. Also for the op even the fans of mid 90s can appreciate whats happening here.

giantsforce
12-24-2011, 07:40 PM
... Hell even the giant fans from the 60s and 70s can probably vouch here.
I was there. Wandered in the football wasteland for my first 20 years as a Giants fan. Most of those seasons were on the low side of 8-8 (or 7-7).

But if the Giants win next week, there's no way Coughlin or Gilbride OR Fewell will be fired. Now, how many haters here will be rooting for Dallas?

I guess you are used to accepting mediocrity and if 9-7 is not mediocrity to you then I am sorry that you have such a low standards. Other than 2007 Coughlin's teams have done nothing special, Even when they made the playoffs they got trounced in the first game. So, even if we make this year's playoffs, the chances getting by teams like Detroit or Atlanta are minimal.
So, when DID you ever root for the Giants? By your logic, you sure as hell didn't root for them in 2007 either.

What does rooting for the Giants have to do with the fact that we have been a mediocre team under Coughlin? Of course I root for them to win. The problem is I am not willing to accept mediocre efforts. Rooting has nothing to do with telling it like it is?Coughlin's Nov/Dec record: 29-42, Now that's something to root for!

giantsforce
12-24-2011, 07:43 PM
Coughlin is a great coach and great man.** Anybody else notice him shoving the doc and everyone aside so he could go coach the team?
Coach the game? Since when Coughlin coaches the game? He is just a bystander that he likes to watch the game from the sidelines and did not want to miss the action. It is not like he does anything other than having a stupid look on his face when Killdrive or Fewell call a crapy game!

stormblue
12-24-2011, 08:15 PM
winding up with an 8n8 or 9n7 record when you constantly start out 5n1 or 5n2 is crap.
we always do this under this guy.

which leaves us constantly picking in the second half of the draft rounds .

if you don't make the playoffs 2n14 is better than 8n8.

RagTime Blue
12-24-2011, 08:25 PM
No playoffs or SB victory, I want Coughlin gone.

GOBIGBLUE52
12-24-2011, 11:40 PM
... Hell even the giant fans from the 60s and 70s can probably vouch here.
I was there. Wandered in the football wasteland for my first 20 years as a Giants fan. Most of those seasons were on the low side of 8-8 (or 7-7).

But if the Giants win next week, there's no way Coughlin or Gilbride OR Fewell will be fired. Now, how many haters here will be rooting for Dallas?

I guess you are used to accepting mediocrity and if 9-7 is not mediocrity to you then I am sorry that you have such a low standards. Other than 2007 Coughlin's teams have done nothing special, Even when they made the playoffs they got trounced in the first game. So, even if we make this year's playoffs, the chances getting by teams like Detroit or Atlanta are minimal.

So winning records are mediocre? Other than the Patriots, Colts and to a lesser extent Pittsburgh, what teams have been consistently in it the last decade? Well, let's look through every team by division:
Cowboys: No, up and down every year. Eagles: A few heartbreaking losses with some bad years, this being one. Redskins: Enough said.

Jets: Other than the past 2 years, this team has been irrelevant for decades with 1 or 2 isolated good years. Bills/Dolphins: See Redskins. Pats: The exception in today's NFL

Colts: Another exception, this year aside. Titans: Incredibly inconsistent. Jaguars: Horrible, outside of a few first round exits. Texans: made the playoffs for the first time this year!

Steelers: Along with Pats and Colts, another exception, but even before 04 they had a down year. Ravens: Again, very spotty. Mostly good. But not always. Browns: What is, one playoff appearance since they were reinstated? Bengals: a few above average years with Palmer, Dalton's looked good but who knows

Bears: again, spotty. A few playoff appearances. Packers: Best in the league right now, but were awful not too long ago. Vikings: rode Favre for a year, now they're arguably the worst in football. Modest success with culpepper. Lions: Enough said

49ers: No playoff wins since 2003. Seahawks: One bowl berth, followed by a bunch of early exits, now they're maybe on the rise again. Rams: Again, up and down. Cardinals: Rode Kurt to a super bowl, other than that, nothing. Maybe next year.

Chargers: Remember when Eli was taken #1 overall? Worst team in football to some playoff runs to mediocrity again and probably a new coach. Chiefs: Awful, beat up on bad teams last year. Raiders: Bills, Dolphins, etc. Broncos: Some playoff success with Jake, then came McDaniels

Panthers: Made the super bowl, then faded until they were 1-15 last year. Falcons: Inconsistent throughout Vick era, may not make playoffs this year after making it last two years. Bucs: Again, very up and down. Saints: Irrelevant until 2006, had a down year, then won a superbowl

So really, what teams are mediocre now? Because I look at how every team has done, and I only see 2-3 that have been consistently great and better than the giants overall in the last decade.

Tenspro2002
12-24-2011, 11:54 PM
I'm not happy with how the offense played today and we'll have to play better against Dallas (D was better though), but you can't deny that's a nice stat to have. Regardless of what happens with first round playoff exits, etc, the Giants have won a lot with him here. If someone told me in 2004 the Giants would have won a super bowl and be in playoff contention almost every year, I would've signed up for that. Look at teams like the browns, the vikings, redskins....they'd kill for that. Hell even the giant fans from the 60s and 70s can probably vouch here.


We've always been in contention, but have a maddening tendency to fail to show up in certain games (especially at home). That leaves the impression in a lot of fans -- myself included -- that we could have done even better in those seasons under different leadership.

It's still the case that, other than in 2007, we have at best staggered into the playoffs and haven't won a playoff game in any other years.

In 2005 we won the division in a fairly down year for the NFC East and got embarrassed at home in the playoffs.

In 2006 we backed into the playoffs going 2-6 in the second half and predictably lost in a close playoff game to the Eagles.

In 2008 we were the best team in football for 3 months, but lost 4 of 5 down the stretch, including a humiliating home playoff loss to the Eagles.

I don't need to tell you about 2009 or 2010, or about this year.

We may have never had a losing record over those years, but you can't help but feel like we left something on the table.

GOBIGBLUE52
12-25-2011, 12:13 AM
I'm not happy with how the offense played today and we'll have to play better against Dallas (D was better though), but you can't deny that's a nice stat to have. Regardless of what happens with first round playoff exits, etc, the Giants have won a lot with him here. If someone told me in 2004 the Giants would have won a super bowl and be in playoff contention almost every year, I would've signed up for that. Look at teams like the browns, the vikings, redskins....they'd kill for that. Hell even the giant fans from the 60s and 70s can probably vouch here.


We've always been in contention, but have a maddening tendency to fail to show up in certain games (especially at home). That leaves the impression in a lot of fans -- myself included -- that we could have done even better in those seasons under different leadership.

It's still the case that, other than in 2007, we have at best staggered into the playoffs and haven't won a playoff game in any other years.

In 2005 we won the division in a fairly down year for the NFC East and got embarrassed at home in the playoffs.

In 2006 we backed into the playoffs going 2-6 in the second half and predictably lost in a close playoff game to the Eagles.

In 2008 we were the best team in football for 3 months, but lost 4 of 5 down the stretch, including a humiliating home playoff loss to the Eagles.

I don't need to tell you about 2009 or 2010, or about this year.

We may have never had a losing record over those years, but you can't help but feel like we left something on the table.

I don't disagree, but at the same time I feel like a lot of fans can say that about their teams. the Bills losing 4 straight super bowls (you would think eventually they'd win ONE), the Eagles losing in the NFCCG so many consecutive years, the Vikings that one year with Gary Anderson missing that field goal and then a few years ago almost in scoring range with Favre's INT...it's not like the Giants are the only team that experiences those kind of moments.

Hell, you can even say that about previous eras of Giants football. Even Parcells had his moments. The 88 Jet/Giant game with Al Toon effectively knocking them out of the playoffs, Flipper Anderson running into the tunnel a year later in the playoffs (which many Giants of that time said was the best team they ever played on), it's not like those teams didn't have excruciating losses either, because they did.

One other thing: It's so easy to look at year by year results and pin that on the coach. But really, look at it down the line.

05: Reminds me a lot of this year except Eli was much worse. That secondary was just as bad if not worse than it is now.
06: Should not have happened, Barber's distraction probably did not help.
07: No explanation needed, because we won.
08: 11-1. Plax shoots himself. 1-3. We had defeated Arizona in Arizona and Pittsburgh in Pittsburgh. I've said this before, I'll say it again, if Burress doesn't shoot himself that year, WE WOULD HAVE REPEATED. That was the best giant team I'd ever seen.
09: Started out 5-0 yes, but those were all against losing teams. Once we started playing decent opponents we got exposed hard. That defense was never any good.
10: Like 06, this one I can't defend.
11: Like 09, we started out hot by beating up on bad teams like the bills, dolphins, rams, etc. Then we got thrown against the best teams in the league. Can this REALLY be called a collapse?

Tenspro2002
12-25-2011, 12:21 AM
11: Like 09, we started out hot by beating up on bad teams like the bills, dolphins, rams, etc. Then we got thrown against the best teams in the league. Can this REALLY be called a collapse?

If we had merely had a losing record against great teams like NE, SF, NO, and GB, then I'd agree with you. But when that stretch includes head-scratching no-shows at home against the Eagles and Skins, yes I do think you call that a collapse. And one that has its origin in preparedness/motivation, which comes from how the coaches can't get the players to respond.

SweetZombieJesus
12-25-2011, 12:37 AM
But if the Giants win next week, there's no way Coughlin or Gilbride OR Fewell will be fired. Now, how many haters here will be rooting for Dallas?



I still think they have to win a playoff game to save their jobs.

SweetZombieJesus
12-25-2011, 12:39 AM
If someone told me in 2004 the Giants would have won a super bowl and be in playoff contention almost every year, I would've signed up for that.


What if you added in a 30-42 Nov/Dec record, 7 collapses, and never winning a home playoff game?

stormblue
12-25-2011, 12:48 AM
the giants have won despite him , not because of him.

bearbryant
12-25-2011, 02:04 AM
Regardless of what the final outcome is this season, the franchise needs to go in a different direction in many ways in order to make the giants the type of team it used to be.</P>


I hope no one is fooled by the Giants win today. Yes, I feel good about the win but I haven't changed my thinking about what this franchise needs</P>

giantsfan420
12-25-2011, 02:12 AM
Regardless of what the final outcome is this season, the franchise needs to go in a different direction in many ways in order to make the giants the type of team it used to be.</P>


I hope no one is fooled by the Giants win today. Yes, I feel good about the win but I haven't changed my thinking about what this franchise needs</P>

i disagree. coughlin is a great head coach. the new direction needs to be his staff. new OC, DC and ST coaches, but the years not over. the d and ST and run game can still come around.

You guys should read Mara's post game interview...he aint getting rid of Coughlin...not gonna happen imo...maybe if we get destroyed next week but if we make the playoffs, with the injuries and other hurdles we've had to overcome, I dont think the owners would really even think of firing coughlin

krygny
12-25-2011, 04:58 AM
But if the Giants win next week, there's no way Coughlin or Gilbride OR Fewell will be fired. Now, how many haters here will be rooting for Dallas?



I still think they have to win a playoff game to save their jobs.

Nope. The New York Football Giants do not fire a coaching staff that makes the playoffs. First of all, they understand the they could do a lot worse than Tom Coughlin and it's not very likely they can do very much better. They also understand that you bring in a new HC, OC and DC you're staring from scratch with new systems that some veteran players may not embrace right away. It can take the better part of a season for it to gel. For example, not only has Eli become comfortable with what Gilbride and Coughlin want to do but Gilbride and Coughlin have become comfortable with what Eli likes to do.

You blow up a 4-12 team. You don't blow up a 9-7 team.

redbeardxxv
12-25-2011, 06:13 AM
... Hell even the giant fans from the 60s and 70s can probably vouch here.
I was there. Wandered in the football wasteland for my first 20 years as a Giants fan. Most of those seasons were on the low side of 8-8 (or 7-7).

But if the Giants win next week, there's no way Coughlin or Gilbride OR Fewell will be fired. Now, how many haters here will be rooting for Dallas?



I'll NEVER root for Dallas, but, KF and PF both need to be fired. TC might need to go too, but if we can keep TC, and get a decent OC and DC, I'm all for it.