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View Full Version : Giants' Justin Tuck Vows To Return To All Pro Level In 2012



RoanokeFan
01-23-2013, 06:42 AM
http://www.giants101.com/2013/01/23/new-york-giants-justin-tuck-vows-to-return-to-all-pro-level-in-2013/

Excerpt: "New York Giants defensive end Justin Tuck (http://www.giants101.com/tag/justin-tuck/) is not happy with himself. As he continues to breakdown game film from the 2012 season, he sees a player he doesn't recognize; a player he doesn't want to be. And while attending a Garden of Dreams charity event at MSG on Tuesday night, the veteran lineman vowed to be better in 2013.


ďThatís what itís going to be for me, getting back to the Pro Bowl, All-Pro type status that Iím accustomed to playing at,Ē Tuck said. ďIíve been watching film of myself the last couple weeks and itís just frustrating to see that I havenít played to that standard and thatís going to be a definite focus for me.Ē

Tuck played poorly across the board in 2012, and faded down the stretch. Not only was he failing to reach the quarterback, but also began to suffer against the run. He finished the season with only four sacks Ė his lowest total since 2006 Ė and had little impact elsewhere, failing to force or recover a single fumble." Read more...

bill2000
01-23-2013, 06:50 AM
yawn...show me.

SweetZombieJesus
01-23-2013, 07:17 AM
^

Did he watch any film of himself contemplating retirement or slobbering over RG3?

Buddy333
01-23-2013, 07:23 AM
His play was disappointing but so was most of the team. Don't see everyone being nearly as tough on other players that didn't perform. So many are talking about making Rolle the captain and he probably played just as bad if not worse and makes to much money. At least Tuck plays the run well.

Kruunch
01-23-2013, 07:58 AM
I vow to be excited when he does.

Redeyejedi
01-23-2013, 08:27 AM
Is Justin delusional how is this OK. Does that mean he didnt put in the effort to be a great player? If he can just work harder and become a pro Bowl player again then why didnt he put forth the effort the last 2 seasons. Probably will play better isnt it a contract year for him

jomo
01-23-2013, 08:33 AM
Is Justin delusional how is this OK. Does that mean he didnt put in the effort to be a great player? If he can just work harder and become a pro Bowl player again then why didnt he put forth the effort the last 2 seasons. Probably will play better isnt it a contract year for himHe's just trying to hang onto his large paycheck which now exceeds his contribution to the team. I don't begrudge him that but JR has to wring every last bit of production out of the money he can spend under the cap. JR needs to be the adult in the room and right size Tuck's contract or move on. I expect it to be renegotiated with Tuck retiring a Giant.

ryan12
01-23-2013, 08:48 AM
^

Did he watch any film of himself contemplating retirement or slobbering over RG3?

lmfao

Toadofsteel
01-23-2013, 08:53 AM
I vow to be excited when he does.

My thoughts exactly. No hard feelings for the guy, but we need someone that produces on the field...

TheAnalyst
01-23-2013, 09:06 AM
Why are you guys filled with so much hatred towards our star players? Jesus. Tuck could be a 2 time Superbowl MVP for us, as recently as last year, and you guys are completely shredding this guy apart. You guys do the same with Osi. Without those 2, IMO, we dont win superbowls. Lighten up. These are our players. Great players at that. Yeah, they had a down year last year, but who didnt????

I hope Tuck can rebound and think if he truely wants to and can stay healthy, he can. I thought he started playing better towards the end of the year.

Not to mention the man had a seriously emotionally tough off the field year.

RoanokeFan
01-23-2013, 09:36 AM
His play was disappointing but so was most of the team. Don't see everyone being nearly as tough on other players that didn't perform. So many are talking about making Rolle the captain and he probably played just as bad if not worse and makes to much money. At least Tuck plays the run well.

Every player who regressed has been raked over the coals, it's not just about Tuck. As others have said, he needs to play better, not talk better and that goes for ALL of the players.

TCHOF
01-23-2013, 09:42 AM
I disagree with everyone who questions Tuck's heart. Without him, we have zero SB wins in the past 5 years.

I just think that his body can't hold up to be an every down player in the NFL any more. I believe that if we reduce his snaps, we can increase his effectiveness.

nhpgiantsfan
01-23-2013, 09:43 AM
His play was disappointing but so was most of the team. Don't see everyone being nearly as tough on other players that didn't perform. So many are talking about making Rolle the captain and he probably played just as bad if not worse and makes to much money. At least Tuck plays the run well.

Tuck had a horrible year all around. He averaged less than 2 tackles a game. I'm sorry but he did not do well against the run either. I am all for giving him one more year to turn it around but he shouldn't be the captain. He should just focus on his own play.

nhpgiantsfan
01-23-2013, 09:46 AM
I disagree with everyone who questions Tuck's heart. Without him, we have zero SB wins in the past 5 years.

I just think that his body can't hold up to be an every down player in the NFL any more. I believe that if we reduce his snaps, we can increase his effectiveness.

Then if his body can't handle it and he needs to reduce his snaps, then he also needs to reduce the dollars in his paycheck. If you look at his demeanor on the field and how much he was seen sulking this year, it is very understandable why people would question his heart. He is supposed to be a leader out there.

Flip Empty
01-23-2013, 09:48 AM
He's just trying to hang onto his large paycheck which now exceeds his contribution to the team. I don't begrudge him that but JR has to wring every last bit of production out of the money he can spend under the cap. JR needs to be the adult in the room and right size Tuck's contract or move on. I expect it to be renegotiated with Tuck retiring a Giant.
$5 mil isn't that large a paycheck for a DE; Tuck has been underpaid his entire career.

RagTime Blue
01-23-2013, 09:50 AM
Many on here think that injuries have reduced Tuck to a mediocre player. We want better than that, whether it's Tuck improving or someone else.

Rat_bastich
01-23-2013, 09:51 AM
I'm glad he can turn it on and turn it off when he wants to.

Razur
01-23-2013, 09:58 AM
Well, if he is VOWING to be better, maybe he will consider a pay cut? He certainly hasn'tbeen playing at the level he negotiated his deal from, back few years ago, so let's talk business instead of emotion here. Restructure his contract, and keep him to his word. If he doesn't man-up, at least we'll be helping the cap situation. If he only plays at a mediocre level, pay him at a mediocre level.

Flip Empty
01-23-2013, 10:00 AM
Then if his body can't handle it and he needs to reduce his snaps, then he also needs to reduce the dollars in his paycheck.
He's under no obligation to do anything. Yearly salaries aren't performance based.

Well, if he is VOWING to be better, maybe he will consider a pay cut? He certainly hasn'tbeen playing at the level he negotiated his deal from, back few years ago, so let's talk business instead of emotion here. Restructure his contract, and keep him to his word. If he doesn't man-up, at least we'll be helping the cap situation. If he only plays at a mediocre level, pay him at a mediocre level.
A restructure isn't a pay cut.

nhpgiantsfan
01-23-2013, 10:02 AM
He's under no obligation to do anything. Yearly salaries aren't performance based.

Umm, thanks captain obvious..

Buddy333
01-23-2013, 10:08 AM
Every player who regressed has been raked over the coals, it's not just about Tuck. As others have said, he needs to play better, not talk better and that goes for ALL of the players.Not giving him a pass for his poor play, but it seems like more people want him run out of town than any other player and he was not the only underachiever on the team this year. As far as talking, this is not trash talking. The season is over and he just said he wants to return to form. Pretty obvious he needs to be better next year. Nothing wrong with what he said.

RoanokeFan
01-23-2013, 10:14 AM
Not giving him a pass for his poor play, but it seems like more people want him run out of town than any other player and he was not the only underachiever on the team this year. As far as talking, this is not trash talking. The season is over and he just said he wants to return to form. Pretty obvious he needs to be better next year. Nothing wrong with what he said.

In 2011 Tuck had similar issues but was able to get his head straight and we went to the playoffs. When the symptoms resurfaced in 2012, it was more disappointing for most fans. Some think he should have done better in 2012 but he was clearly not the All Pro player we need to have on the field. The downfall was not his fault but he didn't do very much to be a beacon in the dark and that can be said of a lot of our players.

TheAnalyst
01-23-2013, 10:15 AM
I feel Eli had a bad year this year, and he is making 4X more then Tuck.... Eli 20M vs Tuck 5M

Kruunch
01-23-2013, 10:29 AM
I disagree with everyone who questions Tuck's heart. Without him, we have zero SB wins in the past 5 years.

I just think that his body can't hold up to be an every down player in the NFL any more. I believe that if we reduce his snaps, we can increase his effectiveness.

We just overpaid for a situational player this year (Osi) ... and look how that turned out :(

Rudyy
01-23-2013, 10:30 AM
I feel Eli had a bad year this year, and he is making 4X more then Tuck.... Eli 20M vs Tuck 5MOk? Lol

FlyingTruck
01-23-2013, 10:33 AM
Maybe mentally he wants to be there, but physically it won't happen. It's obvious that his body can't keep up anymore.

Buddy333
01-23-2013, 10:33 AM
Ok? LolCare to explain why this funny?

SweetZombieJesus
01-23-2013, 10:35 AM
I disagree with everyone who questions Tuck's heart. Without him, we have zero SB wins in the past 5 years.I just think that his body can't hold up to be an every down player in the NFL any more. I believe that if we reduce his snaps, we can increase his effectiveness. Leaders have to keep their doubts internal. Show no weakness to friend or foe. I'm more concerned with his mental and emotional weakness than his physical decline.

Flip Empty
01-23-2013, 10:36 AM
Umm, thanks captain obvious..
Stupid statement gets a stupid response.

Rat_bastich
01-23-2013, 10:36 AM
Not giving him a pass for his poor play, but it seems like more people want him run out of town than any other player and he was not the only underachiever on the team this year. As far as talking, this is not trash talking. The season is over and he just said he wants to return to form. Pretty obvious he needs to be better next year. Nothing wrong with what he said.

I think the problem people are having with Tuck was the body language. He seemed resigned to the fact that he sucked and couldn't get better and he showed it. The other thing is that he was the leader of the defense. When you have a high profile position like that you are going to get the criticism. As my old First Sergeant used to say "Lead, Follow or get the **** out of the way".

He became more of a detriment and instead of saying..Coach, I can't get it together, try one of these young guys out...or something. He tried to stay in. He wasn't the only problem but sometimes you shake things up by taking out the leader.

Buddy333
01-23-2013, 10:38 AM
Yeah, he didn't look fired up all year, but people need to also get it out of their heads that he is a vocal leader.

Rudyy
01-23-2013, 10:39 AM
Care to explain why this funny?Two different scenarios. We need Eli, we don't NEED Tuck. In addition, Eli doesn't vow every year to play better knowing he maybe injured, but continues to play and be ineffective. Mind you after a bad play, you see Eli on the sidelines with Gilbride looking at the playbook. Not shaking his head with his hands on his hips. I already know what you're gonna say "Eli needs to play better". Of course he does.

bansaw
01-23-2013, 10:42 AM
I feel Eli had a bad year this year, and he is making 4X more then Tuck.... Eli 20M vs Tuck 5M

Eli is making $13 M in 2013 fwiw

Buddy333
01-23-2013, 10:43 AM
Two different scenarios. We need Eli, we don't NEED Tuck. In addition, Eli doesn't vow every year to play better knowing he maybe injured, but continues to play and be ineffective. Mind you after a bad play, you see Eli on the sidelines with Gilbride looking at the playbook. Not shaking his head with his hands on his hips. I already know what you're gonna say "Eli needs to play better". Of course he does.Right so because they need Eli more than Tuck what was said about him playing bad and making so much more does not sound so funny. Oh, and after every throw Eli makes that face, points to something, and bows his head. Not defending Tuck on his sideline attitude.

Rudyy
01-23-2013, 10:49 AM
Right so because they need Eli more than Tuck what was said about him playing bad and making so much more does not sound so funny. Oh, and after every throw Eli makes that face, points to something, and bows his head. Not defending Tuck on his sideline attitude.k.

TCHOF
01-23-2013, 10:51 AM
$5 mil isn't that large a paycheck for a DE; Tuck has been underpaid his entire career.
+100

TCHOF
01-23-2013, 10:52 AM
Well, if he is VOWING to be better, maybe he will consider a pay cut? He certainly hasn'tbeen playing at the level he negotiated his deal from, back few years ago, so let's talk business instead of emotion here. Restructure his contract, and keep him to his word. If he doesn't man-up, at least we'll be helping the cap situation. If he only plays at a mediocre level, pay him at a mediocre level.

Should the Giants pay him more for the years when he outplayed his deal?

TCHOF
01-23-2013, 10:58 AM
Leaders have to keep their doubts internal. Show no weakness to friend or foe. I'm more concerned with his mental and emotional weakness than his physical decline.

I don't buy that he was an integral leader in leading the Giants to two SB's in the last 5 years, but suddenly this year he didn't lead. We really don't know how he leads in the locker room and it seems to me that we are probably judging his leadership based solely upon the outcome of the season (i.e., we did not have a great season so that must mean that Tuck was not a great leader).

giantsfan420
01-23-2013, 11:10 AM
Right so because they need Eli more than Tuck what was said about him playing bad and making so much more does not sound so funny. Oh, and after every throw Eli makes that face, points to something, and bows his head. Not defending Tuck on his sideline attitude.eli didnt have a bad year by any means. he just didnt have a great one...tuck was absolutely putrid sans the last game of the season.

ibbill
01-23-2013, 11:11 AM
^

Did he watch any film of himself contemplating retirement or slobbering over RG3?

lmao nice one.

Tuck its to late you wimp

TCHOF
01-23-2013, 11:16 AM
lmao nice one.

Tuck its to late you wimp

Why don't you drive over to Giants Stadium and call him a wimp to his face?? Internet muscles!!

Joe Morrison
01-23-2013, 11:19 AM
Real Pro Bowl Players are there year after year, they don't take time off and whine, sure he got dinged up but the real ones play through it, think Justin has passed up on his dreams of greatness.

Rudyy
01-23-2013, 11:28 AM
Real Pro Bowl Players are there year after year, they don't take time off and whine, sure he got dinged up but the real ones play through it, think Justin has passed up on his dreams of greatness.+1

TCHOF
01-23-2013, 11:31 AM
Real Pro Bowl Players are there year after year, they don't take time off and whine, sure he got dinged up but the real ones play through it, think Justin has passed up on his dreams of greatness.

You have no idea what his physical issues were, and thus have no idea whether or not he could have "played throught it" any more than he did. This post is just silly. "Justin has passed upo on his dreams of greatness" . . . lol. You can't be serious with this stuff.

BlueReign
01-23-2013, 11:33 AM
You have no idea what his physical issues were, and thus have no idea whether or not he could have "played throught it" any more than he did. This post is just silly.
You must've missed the whole season. Playing through an injury and playing with no will to win are completely different and Tuck played with zero will.

Cloud57
01-23-2013, 11:33 AM
Why don't you drive over to Giants Stadium and call him a wimp to his face?? Internet muscles!!Tuck is soft aint nobody scared of him lol

Rudyy
01-23-2013, 11:42 AM
Nobody can dispute that he's been playing crappy for the past two seasons. He thought about retirement for a reason, he cannot do it anymore. That's not any fault of his own. But what people are tired of hearing are the "I'll get better, I'm gonna bounce back" claims. If you're done, you're done. We have youth on the bench waiting for their opportunity.

TCHOF
01-23-2013, 11:50 AM
You must've missed the whole season. Playing through an injury and playing with no will to win are completely different and Tuck played with zero will.

And you can tell the difference how?

Joe Morrison
01-23-2013, 12:11 PM
And you can tell the difference how?
You have no idea what it is to put it all on the line, if you only have 80% give 80%, Tuck has not played inspired football for two years, got a little excited as they got closer to the Superbowl last year but without that run by the team he might have been in San Francisco too!

WinterIsComing
01-23-2013, 12:35 PM
Tuck might have some all pro athletic talent left, but from what I have heard from him he doesn't have an all pro attitude.

ibbill
01-23-2013, 12:55 PM
You have no idea what his physical issues were, and thus have no idea whether or not he could have "played throught it" any more than he did. This post is just silly. "Justin has passed upo on his dreams of greatness" . . . lol. You can't be serious with this stuff.

yea your right he only made approx. $5,000.00 per snap and I am sure you think he gave us our moneys worth.With his all out supreme effort.

TCHOF
01-23-2013, 01:21 PM
You have no idea what it is to put it all on the line, if you only have 80% give 80%, Tuck has not played inspired football for two years, got a little excited as they got closer to the Superbowl last year but without that run by the team he might have been in San Francisco too!

How do you know what ideas I have or don't have? Have you been in a football locker room and on a field after Pop Warner? I have.

Most of you are judgingTuck's effort strictly based upon his output and that is a flawed premise.

Neither you nor anyone on this MB (including me) have any idea how much effort Tuck put into this season.

Rudyy
01-23-2013, 01:24 PM
How do you know what ideas I have or don't have? Have you been in a football locker room and on a field after Pop Warner? I have.

Most of you are judgingTuck's effort strictl;y based upon his output and that is a flawed premise.

Neither you nor anyone on this MB (including me) have any idea how much effort Tuck put into this season.Well whatever effort he's putting fourth, it's not enough.

TCHOF
01-23-2013, 01:26 PM
Well whatever effort he's putting fourth, it's not enough.

I give up.

Did Hakeem Nicks also not put forth enough effort this season?

Rudyy
01-23-2013, 01:27 PM
I give up.

Did Hakeem Nicks also not put forth enough effort this season?Hakeem Nicks should have sat as well, definitely should have sat.
The freaking doctors came out and said he needed 6-8 weeks to heal. Rueben Randle should have been used in place of Nicks.

Also, Hakeem Nicks isn't thinking about retirement every off season but still promises to do better and doesn't.

JJC7301
01-23-2013, 01:27 PM
I like Tuck, but I'll believe it when I see it.

JJC7301
01-23-2013, 01:29 PM
Hakeem Nicks should have sat as well, definitely should have sat.
The freaking doctors came out and said he needed 6-8 weeks to heal. Rueben Randle should have been used in place of Nicks.

Also, Hakeem Nicks isn't thinking about retirement every off season but still promises to do better and doesn't.
Agreed. I don't like have an injured player out there who's not playing even close to his ability. I'd rather he sit and heel, and give someone else the chance.

Buddy333
01-23-2013, 01:31 PM
Hakeem Nicks should have sat as well, definitely should have sat.The freaking doctors came out and said he needed 6-8 weeks to heal. Rueben Randle should have been used in place of Nicks.Also, Hakeem Nicks isn't thinking about retirement every off season but still promises to do better and doesn't.So he many times did you hear Tuck say he was thinking about retiring?

Joe Morrison
01-23-2013, 01:34 PM
How do you know what ideas I have or don't have? Have you been in a football locker room and on a field after Pop Warner? I have.

Most of you are judgingTuck's effort strictly based upon his output and that is a flawed premise.

Neither you nor anyone on this MB (including me) have any idea how much effort Tuck put into this season.

Not to get into specifics, I was a State Champion in High School and College and know what it means to give it your all, at practice and game time.

Took it the next step and coached Pop Warner, we had our group form 2nd grade right until they entered High School where they went on to be Champions also.

Does this help?

Rudyy
01-23-2013, 01:35 PM
So he many times did you hear Tuck say he was thinking about retiring?He said he was thinking about it in the off season prior to 2011, and also in 2011 before the Super Bowl. Clearly that just tells me he cannot perform at a efficient level throughout an entire season. I love Tuck to death, but he just cannot do it anymore. The past two seasons he has shown that he is not capable of being the player he once was. That is FINE. I understand that, people slow down, but give others a chance to perform. We have Ojomo and Tracey waiting for their opportunity on the bench, and here is Tuck promising to get better. How can you get better if you were thinking about retirement not long ago? If you are thinking about retirement you know you cannot perform. It's not rocket science. Sorry, but I'm just not buying it anymore.

Also, what ever happened to talk is cheap player the game?

Buddy333
01-23-2013, 01:48 PM
He said he was thinking about it in the off season prior to 2011, and also in 2011 before the Super Bowl. Clearly that just tells me he cannot perform at a efficient level throughout an entire season. I love Tuck to death, but he just cannot do it anymore. The past two seasons he has shown that he is not capable of being the player he once was. That is FINE. I understand that, people slow down, but give others a chance to perform. We have Ojomo and Tracey waiting for their opportunity on the bench, and here is Tuck promising to get better. How can you get better if you were thinking about retirement not long ago? If you are thinking about retirement you know you cannot perform. It's not rocket science. Sorry, but I'm just not buying it anymore. Also, what ever happened to talk is cheap player the game?Last year there was a neck injury and some lost loved ones that may have had him considering leaving the game. This year he was bad as where many on this team. As far as talk goes, it's the offseason for him. Nothing really bad about saying you want to play better next year is there?

Rudyy
01-23-2013, 01:55 PM
Last year there was a neck injury and some lost loved ones that may have had him considering leaving the game. This year he was bad as where many on this team. As far as talk goes, it's the offseason for him. Nothing really bad about saying you want to play better next year is there?Tired of hearing it.

TCHOF
01-23-2013, 02:26 PM
Not to get into specifics, I was a State Champion in High School and College and know what it means to give it your all, at practice and game time.

Took it the next step and coached Pop Warner, we had our group form 2nd grade right until they entered High School where they went on to be Champions also.

Does this help?

So you certainly know the difference between (1) a person who gives a 100% effort and for whatever reason (injuries, talent, bad luck, etc.) his performance output does not reflect that level of effort; and (2) a person who does not give 100% effort and his poor performance is directly due to that lack of effort.

None of us knows the kind of work Tuck puts in behind the scenes -- in the weight room, the meeting rooms, in practice, in the offseason workouts, etc. All I am saying is that to say that a great Giants Champion isn't giving his full effort simply because he only had 4 sacks this year doesn't make a lot of sense to me.

The guy has earned the benefit of the doubt. In my opinion, his body is not capable of producing on an every down basis anymore. Nothing to do with a lack of effort.

BuffyBlueII
01-23-2013, 03:06 PM
Not to get into specifics, I was a State Champion in High School and College and know what it means to give it your all, at practice and game time.

Took it the next step and coached Pop Warner, we had our group form 2nd grade right until they entered High School where they went on to be Champions also.

Does this help?

Nice post. Also, Jake Gibbs is NCAA National Champion QB.

BuffyBlueII
01-23-2013, 03:09 PM
I really hope that Justin Tuck does go out and prepare this offseason and give it his when he comes back. It would be great motivation for our young players.

My old 1SG used to state that "you always lead by example, just make sure to set the right one." Lets hope Justin Tuck sets the right one. our team sure could use it.

nhpgiantsfan
01-23-2013, 03:24 PM
So you certainly know the difference between (1) a person who gives a 100% effort and for whatever reason (injuries, talent, bad luck, etc.) his performance output does not reflect that level of effort; and (2) a person who does not give 100% effort and his poor performance is directly due to that lack of effort.

None of us knows the kind of work Tuck puts in behind the scenes -- in the weight room, the meeting rooms, in practice, in the offseason workouts, etc. All I am saying is that to say that a great Giants Champion isn't giving his full effort simply because he only had 4 sacks this year doesn't make a lot of sense to me.

The guy has earned the benefit of the doubt. In my opinion, his body is not capable of producing on an every down basis anymore. Nothing to do with a lack of effort.

You're right nobody knows the effort he puts forth in practice or the weight room. And I'm sure he is trying on the field during the game. He is just not getting the job done for whatever reason. And I don't want to hear about injury considering he wasn't on the injury report all year until the one week that he missed a game.

giantsfan420
01-23-2013, 03:27 PM
tuck has the ability to be an all pro run dfender. he has the ability to be an all pro pass rusher. imo, he no longer has the ability to be both. his body just isnt holding up. JR/TC need to figure how using Tuck helps the team to the best chance of winning; as strictly a 1rst and 2nd down DE to play the run, or strictly as that osi type pass rush specialist...

when he was used like osi had been used the past couple years vs philly week 17, tuck had his best game in 2 yrs, so imo, there actually still is a way we can get tuck back to an all pro level...only it will be in one aspect and not as a complete DE

BlueReign
01-23-2013, 04:10 PM
And you can tell the difference how?
How many times this past season did you see Tuck chase a RB down from behind? Or run across the field and make a tackle? He might've injured his shoulder, but those are two scenarios that he used to do often, which don't involve the shoulder, that he hasn't done the past two seasons.Those are plays you make when you want to be there.

TCHOF
01-23-2013, 04:15 PM
How many times this past season did you see Tuck chase a RB down from behind? Or run across the field and make a tackle? He might've injured his shoulder, but those are two scenarios that he used to do often, which don't involve the shoulder, that he hasn't done the past two seasons.Those are plays you make when you want to be there.

I'm sorry but I must withdraw from this argument in order to preserve my mental health.

BlueReign
01-23-2013, 04:19 PM
I'm sorry but I must withdraw from this argument in order to preserve my mental health.
Agree to disagree I guess. Suggest you go back and watch the games again.

TCHOF
01-23-2013, 04:47 PM
Agree to disagree I guess. Suggest you go back and watch the games again.

Ha ha . . . my entire argument is that you can't judge a guy's effort by simply looking at his performance on tv. Thanks for the laugh!

Rudyy
01-23-2013, 05:04 PM
Ha ha . . . my entire argument is that you can't judge a guy's effort by simply looking at his performance on tv. Thanks for the laugh!Then we can't jude Eli or anybody else by that logic.

myles2424
01-23-2013, 05:38 PM
Real Pro Bowl Players are there year after year, they don't take time off and whine, sure he got dinged up but the real ones play through it, think Justin has passed up on his dreams of greatness.
agreed

joemorrisforprez
01-23-2013, 06:49 PM
I'm not going to disagree with anyone who thinks Tuck had a poor season in 2012.

However, this guy was a huge reason why the Giants won 2 Super Bowls.....so if anyone deserves the benefit of the doubt, he does.

ImElectric2
01-23-2013, 07:34 PM
I'm not going to disagree with anyone who thinks Tuck had a poor season in 2012.However, this guy was a huge reason why the Giants won 2 Super Bowls.....so if anyone deserves the benefit of the doubt, he does.I tend to, and in this case really want to agree, but I don't know that you can discount the fact that he was equally as big a reason we missed the playoffs this year. It took brilliant coaching to motivate him back to par the end of last year which may well indicate that his ability it still there. He also showed flashes here and there this year. If its strictly motivation/drive then I can see him.coming out strong again. If its that PLUS a drop off in talent due to age than I fear our stable is quite thinner than we expected it would be at this point.

BigBlue1971
01-23-2013, 09:30 PM
i like Tuck and all but he might be fooling himself thinking he will get back to pro bowl status!

i mean hes getting older and i doubt he can get up to that level again!

i am rooting for him and hope he makes it!

joemorrisforprez
01-23-2013, 10:03 PM
I tend to, and in this case really want to agree, but I don't know that you can discount the fact that he was equally as big a reason we missed the playoffs this year. It took brilliant coaching to motivate him back to par the end of last year which may well indicate that his ability it still there. He also showed flashes here and there this year. If its strictly motivation/drive then I can see him.coming out strong again. If its that PLUS a drop off in talent due to age than I fear our stable is quite thinner than we expected it would be at this point.

I really can't disagree with you....2012 was just poor. 2011 was similar, until a late season surge.

2013 is really a pivotal year for him.....the team really can't afford another down year from him.

About the only things I can say in this defense are:

2 Time Super Bowl Champ....he has shown up in big games.
We've seen what he can do...when he is at the top of his game, he's among the best in the business.
He's got great character....granted, he can get a little mopey, but he's not a locker room cancer, or an off-field embarrassment.
He recognizes the urgent need to return to form.

Based mainly on the fact that he's performed at a high level in the past, I think he deserves the benefit of the doubt in 2013.....HOWEVER, I want to see guys like Ojomo push Tuck hard in the preseason.....Tuck should have to fight to keep his starting status.

BlueReign
01-24-2013, 01:10 AM
Ha ha . . . my entire argument is that you can't judge a guy's effort by simply looking at his performance on tv. Thanks for the laugh!
Because body language isn't visible.

OX1
01-24-2013, 09:00 AM
i like Tuck and all but he might be fooling himself thinking he will get back to pro bowl status!

i mean hes getting older and i doubt he can get up to that level again!

i am rooting for him and hope he makes it!

He just does not seem like he has the fire to get back to that level.
In fact his moods seem to range from nonchalant to down right mopey.....

TCHOF
01-24-2013, 09:00 AM
Because body language isn't visible.

Please explain what body language you saw from Tuck on TV that confirmed that he wasn't giving 100% effort on the field. Specific examples are welcomed.

Rudyy
01-24-2013, 09:19 AM
Please explain what body language you saw from Tuck on TV that confirmed that he wasn't giving 100% effort on the field. Specific examples are welcomed.Giving up on plays (So obvious), most of the time he was on the sidelines sulking. Shaking his head. In his interviews, came off as careless. Just wasnt emptionally there this year.

Buddy333
01-24-2013, 09:28 AM
Never saw him give up on a play. Now seeing him not make a play, yes.

gumby74
01-24-2013, 09:43 AM
<Insert Charlie Brown Teacher Voice>

TCHOF
01-24-2013, 09:46 AM
Giving up on plays (So obvious), most of the time he was on the sidelines sulking. Shaking his head. In his interviews, came off as careless. Just wasnt emptionally there this year.

Sorry, never saw him once give up on a play all year. Can you provide specific examples? Maybe I just missed it.

Sulking and shaking his head . . . is that really unusual for a guy who feels like he isn't performing up to his usual standards? Would you rather have him smiling and laughing in interviews after he hasn't performed?

Rudyy
01-24-2013, 10:00 AM
Sorry, never saw him once give up on a play all year. Can you provide specific examples? Maybe I just missed it.Sulking and shaking his head . . . is that really unusual for a guy who feels like he isn't performing up to his usual standards? Would you rather have him smiling and laughing in interviews after he hasn't performed?I would rather him 1.) Give someone else a chance to play if he's hurt/Not feeling well 2.) Stop talking about bouncing back and actually get healthy and do so.

TCHOF
01-24-2013, 10:02 AM
I would rather him 1.) Give someone else a chance to play if he's hurt/Not feeling well 2.) Stop talking about bouncing back and actually get healthy and do so.

What if that someone else (I assume that you are referring to Ojomo and/or Tracey) couldn't match even Tuck's depleted production?

Rudyy
01-24-2013, 10:04 AM
What if that someone else (I assume that you are referring to Ojomo and/or Tracey) couldn't match even Tuck's depleted production?How would you know that for sure?

BlueReign
01-24-2013, 10:12 AM
What if that someone else (I assume that you are referring to Ojomo and/or Tracey) couldn't match even Tuck's depleted production?
At least you'll get someone with fire in their belly. Tuck, whether it be to injuries or other factors, just doesn't seem to have that fire he possessed 3-4 years ago. He appears complacent to me and many,many others not including yourself obviously. I am grateful that he helped bring home 2 Lombardi's, and yes, I believe he deserves the benefit of the doubt for that reason alone, I'm just saying what I saw which can be interpreted differently by you and I. He will never say he isn't able to get the job done anymore, no player would, and I'm not asking for him to say that. Just show some life, that's all.

TheEnigma
01-24-2013, 10:13 AM
How would you know that for sure?

Only the coaching staff would really know and common sense would dictate that someone of Tracy's size is just not a good fit for a large amount of snaps on the DL. Ojomo might just be too raw or perhaps he isn't doing the right things at practice to gain play time?

Anyway, this is one of those few times I will use blind faith. Something just tells me Tuck will bounce back for one more good season.

TCHOF
01-24-2013, 10:39 AM
How would you know that for sure?

You or I wouldn't, but I'm presuming that the coaches who watch the players every day in practice would (or should).

Rudyy
01-24-2013, 10:40 AM
Only the coaching staff would really know and common sense would dictate that someone of Tracy's size is just not a good fit for a large amount of snaps on the DL. Ojomo might just be too raw or perhaps he isn't doing the right things at practice to gain play time?Anyway, this is one of those few times I will use blind faith. Something just tells me Tuck will bounce back for one more good season.Perhaps. But still, I just can't see him being the player he once was.

TheEnigma
01-24-2013, 10:49 AM
Perhaps. But still, I just can't see him being the player he once was.

The fact is we don't have a long term answer at the DE position to pair with JPP and that needs to be addressed this offseason. It's time to get someone like Alex Okafor, Tank Carradine, or Datone Jones in the draft.

ibbill
01-24-2013, 10:55 AM
The fact is we don't have a long term answer at the DE position to pair with JPP and that needs to be addressed this offseason. It's time to get someone like Alex Okafor, Tank Carradine, or Datone Jones in the draft.

question is are any of them going to be starters.Do they sit on the practice team for a year.

TheEnigma
01-24-2013, 11:00 AM
question is are any of them going to be starters.Do they sit on the practice team for a year.

Probably situational snaps like rushing the passer on 3rd downs and giving Tuck and JPP occasional breathers but we all know the Giants aren't going to gamble on someone else as the starter unless said player does something amazing in the preseason/training camp on a consistent basis.

BigBlue1971
01-24-2013, 11:13 AM
He just does not seem like he has the fire to get back to that level.
In fact his moods seem to range from nonchalant to down right mopey.....

yea exactly!

he didnt appear hungry for another ring and seems satisfied with the two he has!

TCHOF
01-24-2013, 11:39 AM
question is are any of them going to be starters.Do they sit on the practice team for a year.

If we use a high pick on a pass rusher, he will not be on the practice squad and will definitely be used in the rotation.

Toadofsteel
01-24-2013, 11:55 AM
Probably situational snaps like rushing the passer on 3rd downs and giving Tuck and JPP occasional breathers but we all know the Giants aren't going to gamble on someone else as the starter unless said player does something amazing in the preseason/training camp on a consistent basis.

Even when they do something amazing, they'll probably just be inactive all season even if they make the roster...
http://cbsnewyork.files.wordpress.com/2012/08/adewale-ojomo.jpg?w=300
http://cdn.bleacherreport.net/images_root/slides/photos/002/388/089/144266511_crop_650x440.jpg?1341545084

ibbill
01-24-2013, 12:24 PM
Even when they do something amazing, they'll probably just be inactive all season even if they make the roster...
http://cbsnewyork.files.wordpress.com/2012/08/adewale-ojomo.jpg?w=300
http://cdn.bleacherreport.net/images_root/slides/photos/002/388/089/144266511_crop_650x440.jpg?1341545084

+1

ibbill
01-24-2013, 12:27 PM
If we use a high pick on a pass rusher, he will not be on the practice squad and will definitely be used in the rotation.

okay just like we used Ojomo oops wait no they used Tuck instead. Now I know you know nothing about how TC runs a team

TCHOF
01-24-2013, 12:31 PM
okay just like we used Ojomo oops wait no they used Tuck instead. Now I know you know nothing about how TC runs a team

Ojomo was a high pick? Sorry, I didn't know that. I thought he was some undrafted FA who made the roster by the skin of his teeth. Thanks for the education!

TheEnigma
01-24-2013, 12:50 PM
It's not like Ojomo was beating All-Pro tackles in his rookie preseason like JPP did against Damien Woody (the first T he ever beat). When it comes to pass rushing, this coaching staff has earned the right for us to believe in them on who is worthy for opportunities on game day.

ibbill
01-24-2013, 12:53 PM
Ojomo was a high pick? Sorry, I didn't know that. I thought he was some undrafted FA who made the roster by the skin of his teeth. Thanks for the education!

your welcome