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G-Men Surg.
02-04-2013, 02:16 AM
Its crystal clear guys. There's no new secret to unveil. The controversy about the mobile QB being the next generation of QB in the league comes every year and in every generation. To this date and until we see the " hybrid " QB win and in a consistent fashion the QB equation will remain the same. To build a championship team the foundation remains the same, you built it inside out and for that matter the O-line is the most improtant intricate part. Lets not kid ourselves, we can have issues and many holes to fill at D but until the O-line isn't fix and taken care of we are not going back to the big dance again.

giantsforce
02-04-2013, 02:22 AM
Its crystal clear guys. There's no new secret to unveil. The controversy about the mobile QB being the next generation of QB in the league comes every year and in every generation. To this date and until we see the " hybrid " QB win and in a consistent fashion the QB equation will remain the same. To build a championship team the foundation remains the same, you built it inside out and for that matter the O-line is the most improtant intricate part. Lets not kid ourselves, we can have issues and many holes to fill at D but until the O-line isn't fix and taken care of we are not going back to the big dance again.O-Line? It seems that Coughlin is happy to have turnstiles like DD. Do not get your hopes up because even if they draft O-line, Coughlin will make sure that they are sitting on the bench until they are "NFL ready".

TheBookOfEli
02-04-2013, 02:29 AM
If Womack falls to us at 19, it'll be a great day for the Giants organization. Yes, to build a team you build them through the trenches. We are not that far off to retooling our O and Dline's.

G-Men Surg.
02-04-2013, 02:40 AM
O-Line? It seems that Coughlin is happy to have turnstiles like DD. Do not get your hopes up because even if they draft O-line, Coughlin will make sure that they are sitting on the bench until they are "NFL ready".


Its a no-brainer. Go back the years you wish and the constant in every championship team is a solid O-line, heck you can win with QBs like Dilfer and Brad Johnson at the helm but behind a solid O-line. I'm not stating something outrageous or nothing new bro just a fact. The Giants have a lot of work to do not having our LT under contract as well as the LG. We have an aging RG going under the knife this offseason, our RT is in his last year of contract and playing with little left in the tank . And there's Baas, could he anchor the line, maybe but he is not the dominant player we need or the answer for the future. I see a lot of question marks all thru out the O-line and I don't like it one bit.

G-Men Surg.
02-04-2013, 02:45 AM
If Womack falls to us at 19, it'll be a great day for the Giants organization. Yes, to build a team you build them through the trenches. We are not that far off to retooling our O and Dline's.

Plain and simple, that's the first line and foundation of a team, the spinal cord, the lines. We are in cap hell this year and it doesn't get any easier in years come, it seems like the safer way to go is to rebuilt our lines thru the draft specially our O-line.

Captain Chaos
02-04-2013, 06:56 AM
I agree we need to work on the O Line; however, I don't think we are in as dire straights as some may think. Resign Beatty maybe a little help from FA and the draft and we will be in pretty good shape. Diehl was really the issue last year.

Flip Empty
02-04-2013, 09:25 AM
The Giants won XLVI with a bad o-line. It can be done.

Mercury
02-04-2013, 11:02 AM
The Oline was actually playing very well when the Giants won XLVI. And I whole-heartedly agree that Oline is the biggest problem that needs to be addressed this offseason.

CDN_G-FAN
02-04-2013, 11:59 AM
The Giants won XLVI with a bad o-line. It can be done.

as Chris Rock once said:

"you can drive your car with your feet if you want to, it doesn't make it a good f'ing idea"...........

giantsforce
02-04-2013, 12:14 PM
Its a no-brainer. Go back the years you wish and the constant in every championship team is a solid O-line, heck you can win with QBs like Dilfer and Brad Johnson at the helm but behind a solid O-line. I'm not stating something outrageous or nothing new bro just a fact. The Giants have a lot of work to do not having our LT under contract as well as the LG. We have an aging RG going under the knife this offseason, our RT is in his last year of contract and playing with little left in the tank . And there's Baas, could he anchor the line, maybe but he is not the dominant player we need or the answer for the future. I see a lot of question marks all thru out the O-line and I don't like it one bit.Don't get me wrong. I agree with you that we need an O-line. But if you expect it to happen through the draft, and have those players make an impact is not going to happen because of the head stooge's attitude towards rookies.

CDN_G-FAN
02-04-2013, 12:55 PM
Don't get me wrong. I agree with you that we need an O-line. But if you expect it to happen through the draft, and have those players make an impact is not going to happen because of the head stooge's attitude towards rookies.

under a different coach its not going to make that much of an immediate impact either.

what's that cliche about the difference between a bad line and a good line? Playing 2,000 snaps together.

this idea that we draft a guy and and we've addressed a need for the next 16 games is unrealistic, and its not because of our head coach.

yo-ho
02-04-2013, 12:55 PM
We need to be able to pick up 3rd and short reliably with a running play. This is something we failed miserably at for the past few years. It's not the backs either. This has to be addressed. We need fourth year or so veterans that are still hungry. I hope there are some to be had in free agency. When we got Sean O'hara from Buffalo, that was a great move. We need some more moves like that.

Moke
02-04-2013, 01:09 PM
With a QB like Eli Manning, you can't expect winning a championship over and over again unless we have a good offensive-line. Let's face it - Eli Manning isn't that outside of the pocket styled QB. You need an offensive line to allow him time to hit an open target.

Carter.525
02-04-2013, 01:12 PM
Lane Johnson.. please

Kase-1
02-04-2013, 02:50 PM
There are a few OL that I would love to pick up in the 1st few rounds. Diehl is only good coming off the bench, we all know he's past his prime, Boothe was decent but I wouldn't mind one of the beastly OGs in the draft. As long as we sign Beatty then we are in decent shape, but if we drafted Lane Johnson for the right side then we would be in WONDERFUL shape.

Championship teams are built in the trenches

G-Men Surg.
02-04-2013, 04:10 PM
The Oline was actually playing very well when the Giants won XLVI. And I whole-heartedly agree that Oline is the biggest problem that needs to be addressed this offseason.
Playing good bro but Big Mac was playing with the last he had in th tank, Boothe is still a FA as well as Beatty, Snee will go under the knife and Baas is not the dominant player we all want him to be. Do we need a complete u-haul ? I don't think so but we need help, resign guys and depth. O-line is top priority this offseason as you also mention.

G-Men Surg.
02-04-2013, 04:15 PM
There are a few OL that I would love to pick up in the 1st few rounds. Diehl is only good coming off the bench, we all know he's past his prime, Boothe was decent but I wouldn't mind one of the beastly OGs in the draft. As long as we sign Beatty then we are in decent shape, but if we drafted Lane Johnson for the right side then we would be in WONDERFUL shape.

Championship teams are built in the trenches
As of this moment we don't have a starting RT, LG and LT are FA.
Lets turn the clock 7-8 years back and take a good look at our O-line. Strong, great mean streak, dominant. We need a " bada&& " o-line again to drive us into the future.

jomo
02-04-2013, 04:55 PM
Its crystal clear guys. There's no new secret to unveil. The controversy about the mobile QB being the next generation of QB in the league comes every year and in every generation. To this date and until we see the " hybrid " QB win and in a consistent fashion the QB equation will remain the same. To build a championship team the foundation remains the same, you built it inside out and for that matter the O-line is the most improtant intricate part. Lets not kid ourselves, we can have issues and many holes to fill at D but until the O-line isn't fix and taken care of we are not going back to the big dance again.That is the crystal clear truth.

BlueBlooded1979
02-04-2013, 06:00 PM
I don't think Baltimore's line played that great. Flacco was under heavy pressure the entire second half and had to get outside the pocket more than ever. What I saw as the winner of the this game was the Baltimore's defense played unafraid. They were less talented than SF but they played the role of the agressor. SF played their typical Cover 2, Cover 4 and Flacco took advantage. Baltimore played Zero Man for the last three plays.

If you are going to learn anything from this games it is that a mature pocket passer with options at WR and TE will win most match-ups. As far as defense goes you are better off being the hammer vs the nail.

TCHOF
02-04-2013, 06:17 PM
There are a few OL that I would love to pick up in the 1st few rounds. Diehl is only good coming off the bench, we all know he's past his prime, Boothe was decent but I wouldn't mind one of the beastly OGs in the draft. As long as we sign Beatty then we are in decent shape, but if we drafted Lane Johnson for the right side then we would be in WONDERFUL shape.

Championship teams are built in the trenches

That's exactly what I want done . . . .sign Beatty and draft Lane Johnson to be the RT.

Flip Empty
02-04-2013, 06:54 PM
as Chris Rock once said:

"you can drive your car with your feet if you want to, it doesn't make it a good f'ing idea"...........
Winning a Super Bowl is a bad idea? The OP suggests you must have a good o-line to get to the final, the Giants proved that incorrect last season.
There is no optimum personnel configuration - only a preferred one. Neither can guarantee a title.

G-Men Surg.
02-04-2013, 06:59 PM
I don't think Baltimore's line played that great. Flacco was under heavy pressure the entire second half and had to get outside the pocket more than ever. What I saw as the winner of the this game was the Baltimore's defense played unafraid. They were less talented than SF but they played the role of the agressor. SF played their typical Cover 2, Cover 4 and Flacco took advantage. Baltimore played Zero Man for the last three plays.

If you are going to learn anything from this games it is that a mature pocket passer with options at WR and TE will win most match-ups. As far as defense goes you are better off being the hammer vs the nail.

I respectfully disagree. I think Flacco got fairly good protection all game long taking in count the rival they had In front. And for that matter you have to review the whole body of work ( a season or a whole tenure ) to make a righteous judgment. The Ravens have a balance team right now in all tree phases but they have continuity and solid players in the O-line, as well as the 49 rs. No secret here bro, just take a look the past 10 or 15 SB winner or more if you like and a constant more often than not is a great O-line.

giantsfan420
02-04-2013, 07:07 PM
i think that watching kapernick try to figure out what to do in tenths of a second when balt brought zero blitzes on do or die plays showed everyone the importance of having a capable pocket passing qb who relishes blitzes bc it means favorable matchup...i didnt like how the 9ers ran that last series. T.O. on 3rd, then on 4th with 1 left, everything was rushed and like fluttered or skiddish. harbough shoulda burned the last T.O. and talked it over with his QB and WR's but instead just let em run the play all confused...and u saw the result...


in terms of the OP, if we had the protection Balt afforded Flacco for the season, we're in the playoffs at least...that 4th and 29 play balt converted vs sd somehow got even bigger

bearbryant
02-04-2013, 07:30 PM
as Chris Rock once said:

"you can drive your car with your feet if you want to, it doesn't make it a good f'ing idea"...........

LOL. Nice! Exactly! When you need to punch it thru the D line, a powerful O Line pays dividends. Honestly, I don't what the h*** TC will do this year given the cap situation. Regardless of what gets done in the draft we're talking maybe 1 ready to go player on the line. What about the other 3 spots... If you resign Beatty? I just don't envy the Jints next season, but I'm hopeful! Go Giants!

G-Men Surg.
02-04-2013, 10:45 PM
LOL. Nice! Exactly! When you need to punch it thru the D line, a powerful O Line pays dividends. Honestly, I don't what the h*** TC will do this year given the cap situation. Regardless of what gets done in the draft we're talking maybe 1 ready to go player on the line. What about the other 3 spots... If you resign Beatty? I just don't envy the Jints next season, but I'm hopeful! Go Giants!

My thoughts exactly.

Buddy333
02-04-2013, 10:58 PM
The OL actually played better this year than last. They need to resign Beatty and get a RT through the draft or FA. They don't have to draft high or over pay to build a solid OL.

Flip Empty
02-04-2013, 11:16 PM
The OL actually played better this year than last. They need to resign Beatty and get a RT through the draft or FA. They don't have to draft high or over pay to build a solid OL.
Pass blocking wasn't much better, but run blocking improved dramatically. Quite strange.

G-Men Surg.
02-04-2013, 11:16 PM
The OL actually played better this year than last. They need to resign Beatty and get a RT through the draft or FA. They don't have to draft high or over pay to build a solid OL.
They will spend to resign Beatty, make no mistake. RT through the drat will likely be a high draft if you want him to be " NFL ready ", we already have to many projects like Brewer and McCants on the team. If one of those guys more likely Brewer could be ready to step up at RT then you have RG to worry about because Boothe is a FA and could command a big contract if the market dictates it. Again its not easy and all seems to end on the Giants spending big bucks in FA unless they make the right move, the correct one thru the draft.

Buddy333
02-04-2013, 11:21 PM
Well they don't have big money to spend in FA so that's not even a consideration. As far as drafting one, maybe they do draft one high, but hat doesn't mean he will be better than a letter round pick or even a veteran FA that will come cheap.

G-Men Surg.
02-04-2013, 11:42 PM
Well they don't have big money to spend in FA so that's not even a consideration. As far as drafting one, maybe they do draft one high, but hat doesn't mean he will be better than a letter round pick or even a veteran FA that will come cheap.

You could be right but that's exactly the point of the thread, its time to get younger, more physical and nastier. Not to mention that this last 2 or 3 years we have gone via quick fixes. Even when Big Mac was still at RT it looked like the O-line needed to be retooled but FO opted for the quick fix and done it quite well I may add but theres just no more space to wiggle around, no more space for error and the O-line has to be taken care of. The draft will bring stability to our O-line for years to come, important years when the Giants window still is very wide open. Picks at OL are never sexy but at the end they pay huge dividens and results.

JB456
02-05-2013, 11:35 AM
The Giants won XLVI with a bad o-line. It can be done.

This is very true.

What is also true is that this bad O-line is two years older....Ewwwwww

RagTime Blue
02-05-2013, 11:49 AM
We don't have the money to sign FA's at the OLine. We're lucky if we can get Beatty back. It's a strategy that's worked in the past, but now JR is paying the piper with overpaid mediocrity.

Forget about drafting a Center, because Baas is eating up way too much cap-space to cut (or even sit).
Snee is overall an average player at this point, and is in the same boat as Baas.

Forget about drafting a Tackle if we resign Beatty. He's in for a payday.

I could see TC starting a first year Guard if he's better than. . .ummm. . .whoever we have.

Redeyejedi
02-05-2013, 01:00 PM
Its crystal clear guys. There's no new secret to unveil. The controversy about the mobile QB being the next generation of QB in the league comes every year and in every generation. To this date and until we see the " hybrid " QB win and in a consistent fashion the QB equation will remain the same. To build a championship team the foundation remains the same, you built it inside out and for that matter the O-line is the most improtant intricate part. Lets not kid ourselves, we can have issues and many holes to fill at D but until the O-line isn't fix and taken care of we are not going back to the big dance again. So when the giants won the Super Bowl in 2011 what was that. Wasnt the Oline that cost the Giants this season. It was a gimpy Hakeem Nicks not stretching the field vertically and the Dline not getting home

G-Men Surg.
02-05-2013, 02:35 PM
So when the giants won the Super Bowl in 2011 what was that. Wasnt the Oline that cost the Giants this season. It was a gimpy Hakeem Nicks not stretching the field vertically and the Dline not getting home

In '11 we had Big Mac at RT, he wasn't here last year, at this moment 2/5 of our O-line are FA and we have Diehl as our starting RT Brewer as depth and Snee is going under the knife this offseason. We have issues and they had an impact last year either we like it or not and more important we have major questions going foward with salary cap issues, FA and aging players all around the line. The point I'm trying to make is that the O-line isn't the same it was a few years back, heck its not the same in so many levels comparing has you said with the ' 11 oline. It's not my judgment call or my job for that matter to weight the problems currently in our O-line, that's for Reese to work on but I'm not blind about it. Its obvious the o-line is going to go thru a major flux and the success of the franchise going foward depends in so many ways in the desicions to be made to fix or better said rebuild our O-line.

G-Men Surg.
02-05-2013, 02:37 PM
We don't have the money to sign FA's at the OLine. We're lucky if we can get Beatty back. It's a strategy that's worked in the past, but now JR is paying the piper with overpaid mediocrity.

Forget about drafting a Center, because Baas is eating up way too much cap-space to cut (or even sit).
Snee is overall an average player at this point, and is in the same boat as Baas.

Forget about drafting a Tackle if we resign Beatty. He's in for a payday.

I could see TC starting a first year Guard if he's better than. . .ummm. . .whoever we have.
We can draft a stud G/C . He could go right in at LG and take over the C spot when Baas leaves. There's 2 or 3 guys that could fit the mold in this years draft.

G-Men Surg.
02-05-2013, 02:38 PM
This is very true.

What is also true is that this bad O-line is two years older....Ewwwwww
And banged up.