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giantsfan420
12-26-2011, 09:04 PM
Was the Pro Bowl roster released today on Monday Night Countdown? I remember it was supposed to be soon and I thought I saw a commercial saying it'd be tonight...any one have any news on that or if the roster was released if any Giants made it?

giantpride84
12-26-2011, 09:44 PM
its tomorrow

VBGiantsFan
12-26-2011, 10:09 PM
Were JPP or Cruz on the ballot? They both belong outright!

G4L
12-26-2011, 10:25 PM
Only starters are put on the fan ballot. The coaches/player/etc ballot is open. Cruz was not a starter therefore not on the fan ballot. Don't think JPP was either, not sure. Their only hope is to overwhelm the other ballot to make up for the 0% on the fan ballot (which counts for 1/3).</P>

C1010
12-26-2011, 10:42 PM
The reveal is tomorrow. As for Cruz and JPP not being on the fan ballot, one can only hope the players and coaches which account for 2/3 of the total vote will vote them in.

TrueBlue07
12-26-2011, 10:45 PM
lets hope no giants can even play in the game because they are at the super bowl!! i havent watched a second of the pro bowl game in prob 10 years

gmen46
12-26-2011, 11:23 PM
lets hope no giants can even play in the game because they are at the super bowl!! i havent watched a second of the pro bowl game in prob 10 years


Of course. But it's the respect and honor coming from their peers and opposing coaches that matters, so it would be good to see Cruz, JPP, and Eli on the final reveal.

As good as Cruz has been--and I do think he legitimately should be a first teamer--it may be a long shot, since he was completely unknown before this year (so it may have taken opposing players and coaches a while to catch up).

But even more pertinent, is that every year there are qualified and deserving WRs left off the list simply because every year there are too many really good receivers and not enough slots for them on the pro bowl.

Remember Plax , as good as he was for us those 4 years--especially his first 3 years with us--never was selected to the pro bowl.

Neither was Toomer in 2002 when he set the franchise record in yards that Cruz just broke on Saturday.

On the other hand, I will be shocked--SHOCKED!-- if JPP doesn't make it. Players throughout the league are aware of him by now.

Don't underestimate Eli's chances this year, either.

CGYgiant
12-27-2011, 12:11 AM
lets hope no giants can even play in the game because they are at the super bowl!! i havent watched a second of the pro bowl game in prob 10 years


Of course. But it's the respect and honor coming from their peers and opposing coaches that matters, so it would be good to see Cruz, JPP, and Eli on the final reveal.

As good as Cruz has been--and I do think he legitimately should be a first teamer--it may be a long shot, since he was completely unknown before this year (so it may have taken opposing players and coaches a while to catch up).

But even more pertinent, is that every year there are qualified and deserving WRs left off the list simply because every year there are too many really good receivers and not enough slots for them on the pro bowl.

Remember Plax , as good as he was for us those 4 years--especially his first 3 years with us--never was selected to the pro bowl.

Neither was Toomer in 2002 when he set the franchise record in yards that Cruz just broke on Saturday.

On the other hand, I will be shocked--SHOCKED!-- if JPP doesn't make it. Players throughout the league are aware of him by now.

Don't underestimate Eli's chances this year, either.

Brees, Rogers, Stafford all deserve to be there more then Manning.

giantsfan420
12-27-2011, 12:17 AM
lets hope no giants can even play in the game because they are at the super bowl!! i havent watched a second of the pro bowl game in prob 10 years


Of course. But it's the respect and honor coming from their peers and opposing coaches that matters, so it would be good to see Cruz, JPP, and Eli on the final reveal.

As good as Cruz has been--and I do think he legitimately should be a first teamer--it may be a long shot, since he was completely unknown before this year (so it may have taken opposing players and coaches a while to catch up).

But even more pertinent, is that every year there are qualified and deserving WRs left off the list simply because every year there are too many really good receivers and not enough slots for them on the pro bowl.

Remember Plax , as good as he was for us those 4 years--especially his first 3 years with us--never was selected to the pro bowl.

Neither was Toomer in 2002 when he set the franchise record in yards that Cruz just broke on Saturday.

On the other hand, I will be shocked--SHOCKED!-- if JPP doesn't make it. Players throughout the league are aware of him by now.

Don't underestimate Eli's chances this year, either.

Brees, Rogers, Stafford all deserve to be there more then Manning.

disagree. those other teams have talent flowing out there bums..while we have a couple talented wr's, those other teams have 4 or 5 legitimate threats.

eli has been our teams mvp w.o a doubt.

Brees and Rogers yea i agree, not Stafford. Calvin Johnson is that teams MVP imo, u take him away, that offense looks a whole lot different.

eli IS our offense, and we got a chance at the playoffs, LITERALLY because of him. Our D, OL and Run game sucks ballsack

CGYgiant
12-27-2011, 12:24 AM
lets hope no giants can even play in the game because they are at the super bowl!! i havent watched a second of the pro bowl game in prob 10 years


Of course. But it's the respect and honor coming from their peers and opposing coaches that matters, so it would be good to see Cruz, JPP, and Eli on the final reveal.

We all know the pro bowl is a numbers game, and without doubt these three guys all have better statistics and also have their teams in the playoffs. Stafford is a great young QB and yes he has Megatron but then who else? Eli has Nicks and Cruz and even Manningham

As good as Cruz has been--and I do think he legitimately should be a first teamer--it may be a long shot, since he was completely unknown before this year (so it may have taken opposing players and coaches a while to catch up).

But even more pertinent, is that every year there are qualified and deserving WRs left off the list simply because every year there are too many really good receivers and not enough slots for them on the pro bowl.

Remember Plax , as good as he was for us those 4 years--especially his first 3 years with us--never was selected to the pro bowl.

Neither was Toomer in 2002 when he set the franchise record in yards that Cruz just broke on Saturday.

On the other hand, I will be shocked--SHOCKED!-- if JPP doesn't make it. Players throughout the league are aware of him by now.

Don't underestimate Eli's chances this year, either.

Brees, Rogers, Stafford all deserve to be there more then Manning.

disagree. those other teams have talent flowing out there bums..while we have a couple talented wr's, those other teams have 4 or 5 legitimate threats.

eli has been our teams mvp w.o a doubt.

Brees and Rogers yea i agree, not Stafford. Calvin Johnson is that teams MVP imo, u take him away, that offense looks a whole lot different.

eli IS our offense, and we got a chance at the playoffs, LITERALLY because of him. Our D, OL and Run game sucks ballsack

Yeah but Calvin is just one guy. Eli has Nicks Cruz and Manningham, who does Stafford have? Pettigrew? I think Stafford is underrated,also, the fact remains that he and Brees and Rogers all have better stats and also find themselves in the playoffs. Not to mention the Lions run game is just as crappy as ours is.

BurnerNYG
12-27-2011, 12:28 AM
I think if Eli would've kept up with the way he was playing and keeping the int's down, he would've definitely deserved to go in over Stafford. Stafford might have 16 picks just like Eli but he has 36 TD's to Eli's 26.

I know every time I mention Newton's name posters get mad but F it... that man, I mean rookie has 34 TD's rushing and passing, he broke Peyton's rookie record and he's gonna go over 4000 next week barring injury. I love this dude... f'n incredible athlete!

Besides Cam, one of these QB's is going to the Superbowl so maybe Eli will creep in there if Newton doesn't take the vote.

TheEnigma
12-27-2011, 12:41 AM
I think if Eli would've kept up with the way he was playing and keeping the int's down, he would've definitely deserved to go in over Stafford. Stafford might have 16 picks just like Eli but he has 36 TD's to Eli's 26.

I know every time I mention Newton's name posters get mad but F it... that man, I mean rookie has 34 TD's rushing and passing, he broke Peyton's rookie record and he's gonna go over 4000 next week barring injury. I love this dude... f'n incredible athlete!

Besides Cam, one of these QB's is going to the Superbowl so maybe Eli will creep in there if Newton doesn't take the vote.Fully agree with your statement.

Zaggs
12-27-2011, 12:43 AM
lets hope no giants can even play in the game because they are at the super bowl!! i havent watched a second of the pro bowl game in prob 10 years


Of course. But it's the respect and honor coming from their peers and opposing coaches that matters, so it would be good to see Cruz, JPP, and Eli on the final reveal.

As good as Cruz has been--and I do think he legitimately should be a first teamer--it may be a long shot, since he was completely unknown before this year (so it may have taken opposing players and coaches a while to catch up).

But even more pertinent, is that every year there are qualified and deserving WRs left off the list simply because every year there are too many really good receivers and not enough slots for them on the pro bowl.

Remember Plax , as good as he was for us those 4 years--especially his first 3 years with us--never was selected to the pro bowl.

Neither was Toomer in 2002 when he set the franchise record in yards that Cruz just broke on Saturday.

On the other hand, I will be shocked--SHOCKED!-- if JPP doesn't make it. Players throughout the league are aware of him by now.

Don't underestimate Eli's chances this year, either.

Brees, Rogers, Stafford all deserve to be there more then Manning.

No. Eli deserves to be ahead of Stafford. No one on the Giants compares to Megatron. Though Stafford will probably go simply because Detroit hasn't done jack in a decade.

BurnerNYG
12-27-2011, 12:44 AM
I think if Eli would've kept up with the way he was playing and keeping the int's down, he would've definitely deserved to go in over Stafford. Stafford might have 16 picks just like Eli but he has 36 TD's to Eli's 26.

I know every time I mention Newton's name posters get mad but F it... that man, I mean rookie has 34 TD's rushing and passing, he broke Peyton's rookie record and he's gonna go over 4000 next week barring injury. I love this dude... f'n incredible athlete!

Besides Cam, one of these QB's is going to the Superbowl so maybe Eli will creep in there if Newton doesn't take the vote.Fully agree with your statement.;-)

BurnerNYG
12-27-2011, 12:47 AM
lets hope no giants can even play in the game because they are at the super bowl!! i havent watched a second of the pro bowl game in prob 10 years


Of course. But it's the respect and honor coming from their peers and opposing coaches that matters, so it would be good to see Cruz, JPP, and Eli on the final reveal.

As good as Cruz has been--and I do think he legitimately should be a first teamer--it may be a long shot, since he was completely unknown before this year (so it may have taken opposing players and coaches a while to catch up).

But even more pertinent, is that every year there are qualified and deserving WRs left off the list simply because every year there are too many really good receivers and not enough slots for them on the pro bowl.

Remember Plax , as good as he was for us those 4 years--especially his first 3 years with us--never was selected to the pro bowl.

Neither was Toomer in 2002 when he set the franchise record in yards that Cruz just broke on Saturday.

On the other hand, I will be shocked--SHOCKED!-- if JPP doesn't make it. Players throughout the league are aware of him by now.

Don't underestimate Eli's chances this year, either.

Brees, Rogers, Stafford all deserve to be there more then Manning.

No.* Eli deserves to be ahead of Stafford.* No one on the Giants compares to Megatron.* Though Stafford will probably go simply because Detroit hasn't done jack in a decade.
You can have Megatron all you want... somebody still gotta get him the ball. Kerry Collins had Moss and still didn't do ****. Everybody thought Moss was done.

Zaggs
12-27-2011, 12:48 AM
lets hope no giants can even play in the game because they are at the super bowl!! i havent watched a second of the pro bowl game in prob 10 years


Of course. But it's the respect and honor coming from their peers and opposing coaches that matters, so it would be good to see Cruz, JPP, and Eli on the final reveal.

We all know the pro bowl is a numbers game, and without doubt these three guys all have better statistics and also have their teams in the playoffs. Stafford is a great young QB and yes he has Megatron but then who else? Eli has Nicks and Cruz and even Manningham

As good as Cruz has been--and I do think he legitimately should be a first teamer--it may be a long shot, since he was completely unknown before this year (so it may have taken opposing players and coaches a while to catch up).

But even more pertinent, is that every year there are qualified and deserving WRs left off the list simply because every year there are too many really good receivers and not enough slots for them on the pro bowl.

Remember Plax , as good as he was for us those 4 years--especially his first 3 years with us--never was selected to the pro bowl.

Neither was Toomer in 2002 when he set the franchise record in yards that Cruz just broke on Saturday.

On the other hand, I will be shocked--SHOCKED!-- if JPP doesn't make it. Players throughout the league are aware of him by now.

Don't underestimate Eli's chances this year, either.

Brees, Rogers, Stafford all deserve to be there more then Manning.

disagree. those other teams have talent flowing out there bums..while we have a couple talented wr's, those other teams have 4 or 5 legitimate threats.

eli has been our teams mvp w.o a doubt.

Brees and Rogers yea i agree, not Stafford. Calvin Johnson is that teams MVP imo, u take him away, that offense looks a whole lot different.

eli IS our offense, and we got a chance at the playoffs, LITERALLY because of him. Our D, OL and Run game sucks ballsack

Yeah but Calvin is just one guy. Eli has Nicks Cruz and Manningham, who does Stafford have? Pettigrew? I think Stafford is underrated,also, the fact remains that he and Brees and Rogers all have better stats and also find themselves in the playoffs. Not to mention the Lions run game is just as crappy as ours is.

Nate Burleson comes to mind. But also Detroit plays a more long ball game than the Giants.
Their run game is just as crappy? Huh? Best averages 4.6 yards, Smith is 5.1. Neither Jacobs nor Bradshaw are above 4.

Zaggs
12-27-2011, 12:50 AM
lets hope no giants can even play in the game because they are at the super bowl!! i havent watched a second of the pro bowl game in prob 10 years


Of course. But it's the respect and honor coming from their peers and opposing coaches that matters, so it would be good to see Cruz, JPP, and Eli on the final reveal.

As good as Cruz has been--and I do think he legitimately should be a first teamer--it may be a long shot, since he was completely unknown before this year (so it may have taken opposing players and coaches a while to catch up).

But even more pertinent, is that every year there are qualified and deserving WRs left off the list simply because every year there are too many really good receivers and not enough slots for them on the pro bowl.

Remember Plax , as good as he was for us those 4 years--especially his first 3 years with us--never was selected to the pro bowl.

Neither was Toomer in 2002 when he set the franchise record in yards that Cruz just broke on Saturday.

On the other hand, I will be shocked--SHOCKED!-- if JPP doesn't make it. Players throughout the league are aware of him by now.

Don't underestimate Eli's chances this year, either.

Brees, Rogers, Stafford all deserve to be there more then Manning.

No. Eli deserves to be ahead of Stafford. No one on the Giants compares to Megatron. Though Stafford will probably go simply because Detroit hasn't done jack in a decade.
You can have Megatron all you want... somebody still gotta get him the ball. Kerry Collins had Moss and still didn't do ****. Everybody thought Moss was done.

Eli's top receivers can't even be relied upon to catch a simple slant route. Stafford can miss read the route and Johnson will simply go and get it. Johnson is all drive. Moss is all flash.

BurnerNYG
12-27-2011, 12:55 AM
lets hope no giants can even play in the game because they are at the super bowl!! i havent watched a second of the pro bowl game in prob 10 years


Of course. But it's the respect and honor coming from their peers and opposing coaches that matters, so it would be good to see Cruz, JPP, and Eli on the final reveal.

As good as Cruz has been--and I do think he legitimately should be a first teamer--it may be a long shot, since he was completely unknown before this year (so it may have taken opposing players and coaches a while to catch up).

But even more pertinent, is that every year there are qualified and deserving WRs left off the list simply because every year there are too many really good receivers and not enough slots for them on the pro bowl.

Remember Plax , as good as he was for us those 4 years--especially his first 3 years with us--never was selected to the pro bowl.

Neither was Toomer in 2002 when he set the franchise record in yards that Cruz just broke on Saturday.

On the other hand, I will be shocked--SHOCKED!-- if JPP doesn't make it. Players throughout the league are aware of him by now.

Don't underestimate Eli's chances this year, either.

Brees, Rogers, Stafford all deserve to be there more then Manning.

No.* Eli deserves to be ahead of Stafford.* No one on the Giants compares to Megatron.* Though Stafford will probably go simply because Detroit hasn't done jack in a decade.
You can have Megatron all you want... somebody still gotta get him the ball. Kerry Collins had Moss and still didn't do ****. Everybody thought Moss was done.

Eli's top receivers can't even be relied upon to catch a simple slant route.* Stafford can miss read the route and Johnson will simply go and get it.* Johnson is all drive.* Moss is all flash.
Eli had Plax, Toomer and Shockey and STILL ain't never put up 36 TD's with a game left. Stafford is a damn good QB.

gmen0820
12-27-2011, 12:57 AM
Eli had Plax, Toomer and Shockey and STILL ain't never put up 36 TD's with a game left. Stafford is a damn good QB.If Eli and Stafford were in reverse (Eli w/ 36 TDs and Megatron), and you tried to make the same argument that Stafford (w/ Eli's year) be rated over Eli, you would be crucified.

CGYgiant
12-27-2011, 12:58 AM
lets hope no giants can even play in the game because they are at the super bowl!! i havent watched a second of the pro bowl game in prob 10 years


Of course. But it's the respect and honor coming from their peers and opposing coaches that matters, so it would be good to see Cruz, JPP, and Eli on the final reveal.

As good as Cruz has been--and I do think he legitimately should be a first teamer--it may be a long shot, since he was completely unknown before this year (so it may have taken opposing players and coaches a while to catch up).

But even more pertinent, is that every year there are qualified and deserving WRs left off the list simply because every year there are too many really good receivers and not enough slots for them on the pro bowl.

Remember Plax , as good as he was for us those 4 years--especially his first 3 years with us--never was selected to the pro bowl.

Neither was Toomer in 2002 when he set the franchise record in yards that Cruz just broke on Saturday.

On the other hand, I will be shocked--SHOCKED!-- if JPP doesn't make it. Players throughout the league are aware of him by now.

Don't underestimate Eli's chances this year, either.

Brees, Rogers, Stafford all deserve to be there more then Manning.

No.* Eli deserves to be ahead of Stafford.* No one on the Giants compares to Megatron.* Though Stafford will probably go simply because Detroit hasn't done jack in a decade.
You can have Megatron all you want... somebody still gotta get him the ball. Kerry Collins had Moss and still didn't do ****. Everybody thought Moss was done.

Eli's top receivers can't even be relied upon to catch a simple slant route.* Stafford can miss read the route and Johnson will simply go and get it.* Johnson is all drive.* Moss is all flash.
Eli had Plax, Toomer and Shockey and STILL ain't never put up 36 TD's with a game left. Stafford is a damn good QB.

Apparently not, this homerism is mind boggling, Stafford is in the playoffs, has 10 more touchdowns thrown, loses his starting RB and still puts up as many yards as Eli..

its a no brainer

TheEnigma
12-27-2011, 12:59 AM
Here's how I simply see it:

Rodgers and Brees are obviously going to be the #1 and #2 respectively.

The last spot is open to either Eli, Stafford, or Cam in no particular order. They each have pros and cons to their game.

Stafford helped bring a team that hasn't seen the playoffs since 99 to January again.

Cam has revitalized the Panthers organization and also Steve Smith's career along with his phenomenal rushing and passing accolades for a rookie.

Eli has lifted this team on his shoulders alone at times and is one of the most clutch 4th qtr QB's of all time.

giantsfan420
12-27-2011, 01:08 AM
no one is saying stafford aint doing awesome this year

i guess its subjective like everything else. imo, eli has done more with less.

stafford has c.johnson, pettigrew, burleson, a solid O-Line and an amazing DL. Detroit is more of a complete team. Stafford does have better stats except yards.

Eli, has a HORRIBLE ol, defense, and run game. I dunno its just my take on it. Eli has what 6 4th quarter game winning drives? Its fine and dandy to throw all over the place when u got a lead and play in a dome like Stafford, its just Eli has done what he's done while being the only way this Giants team has even won 8 games. The D won it for us vs the Jets, but every other game the d shat the bed, and the run game just did enough if that.

It isnt about stats when I think of whose playing at the highest level, its about winning and how those wins came to be. Stafford has done amazing, but how would Stafford do on this team this year? How would Eli play on Detroit? I think Eli would be right around Staffords stats on Detroit, but I just dont see how Stafford would even make it thru the year on the Giants.

again, all subjective. Didnt mean to make it seem like "IM RIGHT YOUR WRONG" when I responded to u originally, this is just my subjective opinion.

Eli's done more with less than almost every other QB in the league. If u compare talent team by team, I could argue Eli has done more with less than every QB in the league. Rodgers, Brees, Stafford, Brady...all these QBs are surrounded by amazing talent all over the place.

we got Eli, Cruz (UDFA) and Nicks who has been sporadic. Thats it. Jacobs and Bradshaw have missed time and havent done much of anything. Name one game the run game took over and won it for us...Our OL has been garbage and interchanged with injuries all year...our Defense has JPP and honorable mention for Phillips and Webster.

Its amazing we're even in the position we are in right now bc of how little talent it seems we have fielded this year week by week, Ballards our starting TE for gods sake, he's a good player but he aint Gronks or Hernadez or Pettigrew not even close.

The ONE constant we have this year, is Eli. He takes 15 hits a game, no run game to bail him out, a moron play caller as OC, and no defense...Eli deserves to go, and if we make the playoffs, deserves some MVP votes. the past two weeks hurt all that, but still...eli has been our MVP BY FAR

Overdrive92
12-27-2011, 01:08 AM
Stafford's gonna' get the last spot. People hate giving Eli the credit he deserves.

$10 also says that Cruz doesn't make the Pro Bowl. Prepare to be disappointed folks. I doubt there will be many Giants on the roster. The Pro Bowl is an embarrassment to the NFL year in & year out.

Zaggs
12-27-2011, 01:10 AM
lets hope no giants can even play in the game because they are at the super bowl!! i havent watched a second of the pro bowl game in prob 10 years


Of course. But it's the respect and honor coming from their peers and opposing coaches that matters, so it would be good to see Cruz, JPP, and Eli on the final reveal.

As good as Cruz has been--and I do think he legitimately should be a first teamer--it may be a long shot, since he was completely unknown before this year (so it may have taken opposing players and coaches a while to catch up).

But even more pertinent, is that every year there are qualified and deserving WRs left off the list simply because every year there are too many really good receivers and not enough slots for them on the pro bowl.

Remember Plax , as good as he was for us those 4 years--especially his first 3 years with us--never was selected to the pro bowl.

Neither was Toomer in 2002 when he set the franchise record in yards that Cruz just broke on Saturday.

On the other hand, I will be shocked--SHOCKED!-- if JPP doesn't make it. Players throughout the league are aware of him by now.

Don't underestimate Eli's chances this year, either.

Brees, Rogers, Stafford all deserve to be there more then Manning.

No. Eli deserves to be ahead of Stafford. No one on the Giants compares to Megatron. Though Stafford will probably go simply because Detroit hasn't done jack in a decade.
You can have Megatron all you want... somebody still gotta get him the ball. Kerry Collins had Moss and still didn't do ****. Everybody thought Moss was done.

Eli's top receivers can't even be relied upon to catch a simple slant route. Stafford can miss read the route and Johnson will simply go and get it. Johnson is all drive. Moss is all flash.
Eli had Plax, Toomer and Shockey and STILL ain't never put up 36 TD's with a game left. Stafford is a damn good QB.

Has stafford played in a run first offense? Exactly. Not saying Stafford isn't good. But Stafford also has 50 more attempts than Eli, yet has a lesser average and has been sacked about 10 more times (means 60 more pass plays for Matthew). That means Stafford, due to their offense, has more than an entire game on Eli as far as pass plays go. Just to throw another bomb in there. Stafford has played the majority (10) of this years games indoors (11 if you count Dallas). So by default Stafford should have bigger numbers, doesn't make him a better QB. How many 4th quarter comebacks does he have this year?

NYGFaninILL
12-27-2011, 01:22 AM
Is it bad not wanting JPP or Cruz in the pro bowl only to avoid the massive pay raises they will ask for?

BurnerNYG
12-27-2011, 02:05 AM
lets hope no giants can even play in the game because they are at the super bowl!! i havent watched a second of the pro bowl game in prob 10 years


Of course. But it's the respect and honor coming from their peers and opposing coaches that matters, so it would be good to see Cruz, JPP, and Eli on the final reveal.

As good as Cruz has been--and I do think he legitimately should be a first teamer--it may be a long shot, since he was completely unknown before this year (so it may have taken opposing players and coaches a while to catch up).

But even more pertinent, is that every year there are qualified and deserving WRs left off the list simply because every year there are too many really good receivers and not enough slots for them on the pro bowl.

Remember Plax , as good as he was for us those 4 years--especially his first 3 years with us--never was selected to the pro bowl.

Neither was Toomer in 2002 when he set the franchise record in yards that Cruz just broke on Saturday.

On the other hand, I will be shocked--SHOCKED!-- if JPP doesn't make it. Players throughout the league are aware of him by now.

Don't underestimate Eli's chances this year, either.

Brees, Rogers, Stafford all deserve to be there more then Manning.

No.* Eli deserves to be ahead of Stafford.* No one on the Giants compares to Megatron.* Though Stafford will probably go simply because Detroit hasn't done jack in a decade.
You can have Megatron all you want... somebody still gotta get him the ball. Kerry Collins had Moss and still didn't do ****. Everybody thought Moss was done.

Eli's top receivers can't even be relied upon to catch a simple slant route.* Stafford can miss read the route and Johnson will simply go and get it.* Johnson is all drive.* Moss is all flash.
Eli had Plax, Toomer and Shockey and STILL ain't never put up 36 TD's with a game left. Stafford is a damn good QB.

Has stafford played in a run first offense?* Exactly.* Not saying Stafford isn't good.* But Stafford also has 50 more attempts than Eli, yet has a lesser average and has been sacked about 10 more times (means 60 more pass plays for Matthew).* That means Stafford, due to their offense, has more than an entire game on Eli as far as pass plays go.* Just to throw another bomb in there.* Stafford has played the majority (10) of this years games indoors (11 if you count Dallas).* So by default Stafford should have bigger numbers, doesn't make him a better QB.* How many 4th quarter comebacks does he have this year?
I'm not a Lions fan but I can remember off the top of my head Stafford coming back to win the game against Dallas, Carolina, Minnesota and Oakland.

gmen0820
12-27-2011, 02:10 AM
Is it bad not wanting JPP or Cruz in the pro bowl only to avoid the massive pay raises they will ask for?I don't think it will have a big say in them getting their inevitable huge deals in the near future.

After they get their deals and they have those incentives, then you can root against their pro bowl status.

BurnerNYG
12-27-2011, 02:32 AM
Eli had Plax, Toomer and Shockey and STILL ain't never put up 36 TD's with a game left. Stafford is a damn good QB.If Eli and Stafford were in reverse (Eli w/ 36 TDs and Megatron), and you tried to make the same argument that Stafford (w/ Eli's year) be rated over Eli, you would be crucified.And laughed at... hysterically!

BurnerNYG
12-27-2011, 09:53 AM
lets hope no giants can even play in the game because they are at the super bowl!! i havent watched a second of the pro bowl game in prob 10 years


Of course. But it's the respect and honor coming from their peers and opposing coaches that matters, so it would be good to see Cruz, JPP, and Eli on the final reveal.

As good as Cruz has been--and I do think he legitimately should be a first teamer--it may be a long shot, since he was completely unknown before this year (so it may have taken opposing players and coaches a while to catch up).

But even more pertinent, is that every year there are qualified and deserving WRs left off the list simply because every year there are too many really good receivers and not enough slots for them on the pro bowl.

Remember Plax , as good as he was for us those 4 years--especially his first 3 years with us--never was selected to the pro bowl.

Neither was Toomer in 2002 when he set the franchise record in yards that Cruz just broke on Saturday.

On the other hand, I will be shocked--SHOCKED!-- if JPP doesn't make it. Players throughout the league are aware of him by now.

Don't underestimate Eli's chances this year, either.

Brees, Rogers, Stafford all deserve to be there more then Manning.

No.* Eli deserves to be ahead of Stafford.* No one on the Giants compares to Megatron.* Though Stafford will probably go simply because Detroit hasn't done jack in a decade.
You can have Megatron all you want... somebody still gotta get him the ball. Kerry Collins had Moss and still didn't do ****. Everybody thought Moss was done.

Eli's top receivers can't even be relied upon to catch a simple slant route.* Stafford can miss read the route and Johnson will simply go and get it.* Johnson is all drive.* Moss is all flash.
Eli had Plax, Toomer and Shockey and STILL ain't never put up 36 TD's with a game left. Stafford is a damn good QB.

Apparently not, this homerism is mind boggling, Stafford is in the playoffs, has 10 more touchdowns thrown, loses his starting RB and still puts up as many yards as Eli..

its a no brainerWhen Eli was playing extremely well earlier on, like I said, I would've defended him myself but to sit here and tell me that he's playing or got better numbers than Stafford right now is asinine. Sometimes you just gotta be fair and level headed and take the homer glasses off for awhile.

BurnerNYG
12-27-2011, 09:54 AM
Here's how I simply see it:

Rodgers and Brees are obviously going to be the #1 and #2 respectively.

The last spot is open to either Eli, Stafford, or Cam in no particular order. They each have pros and cons to their game.

Stafford helped bring a team that hasn't seen the playoffs since 99 to January again.

Cam has revitalized the Panthers organization and also Steve Smith's career along with his phenomenal rushing and passing accolades for a rookie.

Eli has lifted this team on his shoulders alone at times and is one of the most clutch 4th qtr QB's of all time.Agreed.

Redeyejedi
12-27-2011, 09:58 AM
Eli's last 2 weeks will keep him off the original 3 that are picked. However theres a good bet some of these guys might not go to the ProBowl

burier
12-27-2011, 12:59 PM
lets hope no giants can even play in the game because they are at the super bowl!! i havent watched a second of the pro bowl game in prob 10 years


Of course. But it's the respect and honor coming from their peers and opposing coaches that matters, so it would be good to see Cruz, JPP, and Eli on the final reveal.

As good as Cruz has been--and I do think he legitimately should be a first teamer--it may be a long shot, since he was completely unknown before this year (so it may have taken opposing players and coaches a while to catch up).

But even more pertinent, is that every year there are qualified and deserving WRs left off the list simply because every year there are too many really good receivers and not enough slots for them on the pro bowl.

Remember Plax , as good as he was for us those 4 years--especially his first 3 years with us--never was selected to the pro bowl.

Neither was Toomer in 2002 when he set the franchise record in yards that Cruz just broke on Saturday.

On the other hand, I will be shocked--SHOCKED!-- if JPP doesn't make it. Players throughout the league are aware of him by now.

Don't underestimate Eli's chances this year, either.

Brees, Rogers, Stafford all deserve to be there more then Manning.

No.* Eli deserves to be ahead of Stafford.* No one on the Giants compares to Megatron.* Though Stafford will probably go simply because Detroit hasn't done jack in a decade.
You can have Megatron all you want... somebody still gotta get him the ball. Kerry Collins had Moss and still didn't do ****. Everybody thought Moss was done.

Eli's top receivers can't even be relied upon to catch a simple slant route.* Stafford can miss read the route and Johnson will simply go and get it.* Johnson is all drive.* Moss is all flash.
Eli had Plax, Toomer and Shockey and STILL ain't never put up 36 TD's with a game left. Stafford is a damn good QB.

Apparently not, this homerism is mind boggling, Stafford is in the playoffs, has 10 more touchdowns thrown, loses his starting RB and still puts up as many yards as Eli..

its a no brainer

Whoa whoa whoa...are we saying Stafford is better than Eli now???

BurnerNYG
12-27-2011, 01:41 PM
lets hope no giants can even play in the game because they are at the super bowl!! i havent watched a second of the pro bowl game in prob 10 years


Of course. But it's the respect and honor coming from their peers and opposing coaches that matters, so it would be good to see Cruz, JPP, and Eli on the final reveal.

As good as Cruz has been--and I do think he legitimately should be a first teamer--it may be a long shot, since he was completely unknown before this year (so it may have taken opposing players and coaches a while to catch up).

But even more pertinent, is that every year there are qualified and deserving WRs left off the list simply because every year there are too many really good receivers and not enough slots for them on the pro bowl.

Remember Plax , as good as he was for us those 4 years--especially his first 3 years with us--never was selected to the pro bowl.

Neither was Toomer in 2002 when he set the franchise record in yards that Cruz just broke on Saturday.

On the other hand, I will be shocked--SHOCKED!-- if JPP doesn't make it. Players throughout the league are aware of him by now.

Don't underestimate Eli's chances this year, either.

Brees, Rogers, Stafford all deserve to be there more then Manning.

No.* Eli deserves to be ahead of Stafford.* No one on the Giants compares to Megatron.* Though Stafford will probably go simply because Detroit hasn't done jack in a decade.
You can have Megatron all you want... somebody still gotta get him the ball. Kerry Collins had Moss and still didn't do ****. Everybody thought Moss was done.

Eli's top receivers can't even be relied upon to catch a simple slant route.* Stafford can miss read the route and Johnson will simply go and get it.* Johnson is all drive.* Moss is all flash.
Eli had Plax, Toomer and Shockey and STILL ain't never put up 36 TD's with a game left. Stafford is a damn good QB.

Apparently not, this homerism is mind boggling, Stafford is in the playoffs, has 10 more touchdowns thrown, loses his starting RB and still puts up as many yards as Eli..

its a no brainer

Whoa whoa whoa...are we saying Stafford is better than Eli now???Nobody's saying that Stafford is better than Eli, we're just pointing out that he's having a better year. Is he not?

BurnerNYG
12-27-2011, 01:41 PM
lets hope no giants can even play in the game because they are at the super bowl!! i havent watched a second of the pro bowl game in prob 10 years


Of course. But it's the respect and honor coming from their peers and opposing coaches that matters, so it would be good to see Cruz, JPP, and Eli on the final reveal.

As good as Cruz has been--and I do think he legitimately should be a first teamer--it may be a long shot, since he was completely unknown before this year (so it may have taken opposing players and coaches a while to catch up).

But even more pertinent, is that every year there are qualified and deserving WRs left off the list simply because every year there are too many really good receivers and not enough slots for them on the pro bowl.

Remember Plax , as good as he was for us those 4 years--especially his first 3 years with us--never was selected to the pro bowl.

Neither was Toomer in 2002 when he set the franchise record in yards that Cruz just broke on Saturday.

On the other hand, I will be shocked--SHOCKED!-- if JPP doesn't make it. Players throughout the league are aware of him by now.

Don't underestimate Eli's chances this year, either.

Brees, Rogers, Stafford all deserve to be there more then Manning.

No.* Eli deserves to be ahead of Stafford.* No one on the Giants compares to Megatron.* Though Stafford will probably go simply because Detroit hasn't done jack in a decade.
You can have Megatron all you want... somebody still gotta get him the ball. Kerry Collins had Moss and still didn't do ****. Everybody thought Moss was done.

Eli's top receivers can't even be relied upon to catch a simple slant route.* Stafford can miss read the route and Johnson will simply go and get it.* Johnson is all drive.* Moss is all flash.
Eli had Plax, Toomer and Shockey and STILL ain't never put up 36 TD's with a game left. Stafford is a damn good QB.

Apparently not, this homerism is mind boggling, Stafford is in the playoffs, has 10 more touchdowns thrown, loses his starting RB and still puts up as many yards as Eli..

its a no brainer

Whoa whoa whoa...are we saying Stafford is better than Eli now???Nobody's saying that Stafford is better than Eli, we're just pointing out that he's having a better year. Is he not?

burier
12-27-2011, 01:47 PM
lets hope no giants can even play in the game because they are at the super bowl!! i havent watched a second of the pro bowl game in prob 10 years


Of course. But it's the respect and honor coming from their peers and opposing coaches that matters, so it would be good to see Cruz, JPP, and Eli on the final reveal.

As good as Cruz has been--and I do think he legitimately should be a first teamer--it may be a long shot, since he was completely unknown before this year (so it may have taken opposing players and coaches a while to catch up).

But even more pertinent, is that every year there are qualified and deserving WRs left off the list simply because every year there are too many really good receivers and not enough slots for them on the pro bowl.

Remember Plax , as good as he was for us those 4 years--especially his first 3 years with us--never was selected to the pro bowl.

Neither was Toomer in 2002 when he set the franchise record in yards that Cruz just broke on Saturday.

On the other hand, I will be shocked--SHOCKED!-- if JPP doesn't make it. Players throughout the league are aware of him by now.

Don't underestimate Eli's chances this year, either.

Brees, Rogers, Stafford all deserve to be there more then Manning.

No.* Eli deserves to be ahead of Stafford.* No one on the Giants compares to Megatron.* Though Stafford will probably go simply because Detroit hasn't done jack in a decade.
You can have Megatron all you want... somebody still gotta get him the ball. Kerry Collins had Moss and still didn't do ****. Everybody thought Moss was done.

Eli's top receivers can't even be relied upon to catch a simple slant route.* Stafford can miss read the route and Johnson will simply go and get it.* Johnson is all drive.* Moss is all flash.
Eli had Plax, Toomer and Shockey and STILL ain't never put up 36 TD's with a game left. Stafford is a damn good QB.

Apparently not, this homerism is mind boggling, Stafford is in the playoffs, has 10 more touchdowns thrown, loses his starting RB and still puts up as many yards as Eli..

its a no brainer

Whoa whoa whoa...are we saying Stafford is better than Eli now???Nobody's saying that Stafford is better than Eli, we're just pointing out that he's having a better year. Is he not?

He may be having a better statistical year I'm not sure. But he's definately not having a better year for reasons I'm sure have already been expressed in this thread. I'll let you guys debate that point.

I was just making sure the entire board hadn't gone mad.

BurnerNYG
12-27-2011, 01:52 PM
lets hope no giants can even play in the game because they are at the super bowl!! i havent watched a second of the pro bowl game in prob 10 years


Of course. But it's the respect and honor coming from their peers and opposing coaches that matters, so it would be good to see Cruz, JPP, and Eli on the final reveal.

As good as Cruz has been--and I do think he legitimately should be a first teamer--it may be a long shot, since he was completely unknown before this year (so it may have taken opposing players and coaches a while to catch up).

But even more pertinent, is that every year there are qualified and deserving WRs left off the list simply because every year there are too many really good receivers and not enough slots for them on the pro bowl.

Remember Plax , as good as he was for us those 4 years--especially his first 3 years with us--never was selected to the pro bowl.

Neither was Toomer in 2002 when he set the franchise record in yards that Cruz just broke on Saturday.

On the other hand, I will be shocked--SHOCKED!-- if JPP doesn't make it. Players throughout the league are aware of him by now.

Don't underestimate Eli's chances this year, either.

Brees, Rogers, Stafford all deserve to be there more then Manning.

No.* Eli deserves to be ahead of Stafford.* No one on the Giants compares to Megatron.* Though Stafford will probably go simply because Detroit hasn't done jack in a decade.
You can have Megatron all you want... somebody still gotta get him the ball. Kerry Collins had Moss and still didn't do ****. Everybody thought Moss was done.

Eli's top receivers can't even be relied upon to catch a simple slant route.* Stafford can miss read the route and Johnson will simply go and get it.* Johnson is all drive.* Moss is all flash.
Eli had Plax, Toomer and Shockey and STILL ain't never put up 36 TD's with a game left. Stafford is a damn good QB.

Apparently not, this homerism is mind boggling, Stafford is in the playoffs, has 10 more touchdowns thrown, loses his starting RB and still puts up as many yards as Eli..

its a no brainer

Whoa whoa whoa...are we saying Stafford is better than Eli now???Nobody's saying that Stafford is better than Eli, we're just pointing out that he's having a better year. Is he not?

He may be having a better statistical year I'm not sure. But he's definately not having a better year for reasons I'm sure have already been expressed in this thread. I'll let you guys debate that point.

I was just making sure the entire board hadn't gone mad.It's way too early in Stafford's career to say that he's better than Eli. One year wonders happen all the time. One thing for sure though, Eli never threw 36 TD's so if Stafford keeps that up, it'll defintely be a strong debate.

bashful
12-27-2011, 01:53 PM
lets hope no giants can even play in the game because they are at the super bowl!! i havent watched a second of the pro bowl game in prob 10 years


Of course. But it's the respect and honor coming from their peers and opposing coaches that matters, so it would be good to see Cruz, JPP, and Eli on the final reveal.

As good as Cruz has been--and I do think he legitimately should be a first teamer--it may be a long shot, since he was completely unknown before this year (so it may have taken opposing players and coaches a while to catch up).

But even more pertinent, is that every year there are qualified and deserving WRs left off the list simply because every year there are too many really good receivers and not enough slots for them on the pro bowl.

Remember Plax , as good as he was for us those 4 years--especially his first 3 years with us--never was selected to the pro bowl.

Neither was Toomer in 2002 when he set the franchise record in yards that Cruz just broke on Saturday.

On the other hand, I will be shocked--SHOCKED!-- if JPP doesn't make it. Players throughout the league are aware of him by now.

Don't underestimate Eli's chances this year, either.

Brees, Rogers, Stafford all deserve to be there more then Manning.

stafford what the hell are you smoking

BurnerNYG
12-27-2011, 02:04 PM
lets hope no giants can even play in the game because they are at the super bowl!! i havent watched a second of the pro bowl game in prob 10 years


Of course. But it's the respect and honor coming from their peers and opposing coaches that matters, so it would be good to see Cruz, JPP, and Eli on the final reveal.

As good as Cruz has been--and I do think he legitimately should be a first teamer--it may be a long shot, since he was completely unknown before this year (so it may have taken opposing players and coaches a while to catch up).

But even more pertinent, is that every year there are qualified and deserving WRs left off the list simply because every year there are too many really good receivers and not enough slots for them on the pro bowl.

Remember Plax , as good as he was for us those 4 years--especially his first 3 years with us--never was selected to the pro bowl.

Neither was Toomer in 2002 when he set the franchise record in yards that Cruz just broke on Saturday.

On the other hand, I will be shocked--SHOCKED!-- if JPP doesn't make it. Players throughout the league are aware of him by now.

Don't underestimate Eli's chances this year, either.

Brees, Rogers, Stafford all deserve to be there more then Manning.

stafford what the hell are you smokingEli only has 69 more yards than Stafford and I was wrong... Stafford only threw 14 picks. 36/14 vs 26/16... numbers don't lie.

C1010
12-27-2011, 04:07 PM
I honestly think Manning should still get the nod. JPP and Cruz should definitely be in though. Snee and Rolle are likely as well.

gmen46
12-27-2011, 05:14 PM
I raised the possibility of Eli being a strong consideration for the Pro Bowl, and I hold to that.

Stafford may indeed be voted over Eli. Lord knows there are those who vote who retain a dead mans grip on their bias against Eli, but I believe many have reconsidered their opinion based on his 2011 performance.

I think the choice between Stafford and Eli this year is a pickem', frankly, not a "slam dunk" either way, as some here have claimed.

There are equally strong arguments for each one, so I won't be surprised when one or the other is announced.

As someone mentioned, Cam will probably be in the mix, but hopefully some reason will prevail and he should be satisfied with ROY for this year. Let him compete for Pro Bowls from next year forward.

giantsfan420
12-27-2011, 07:25 PM
well looks like the coaches and players respected just how much eli means to this team. they couldnt overlook the fact that bc of his play we have a bonafide shot at the playoffs and he's carried this team in ways that only truly elite qb's can.

well done to JPP too.

our pro bowl players that made it made it the right way, from players and coaches votes. fan votes are popularity contest and speak nothing to how a player really did. but when the players and coaches vote u in w/o the fan vote, that says something to the year you had.

congrats eli and jpp for giving the pro bowl a little bit of credence for being LEGIT pro bowlers

jjj45
12-27-2011, 07:28 PM
Eli's last 2 weeks will keep him off the original 3 that are picked. However theres a good bet some of these guys might not go to the ProBowlApparently the rest of America doesn't feel that way. Maybe they know something about Football too.

Firenugget
12-27-2011, 07:30 PM
lets hope no giants can even play in the game because they are at the super bowl!! i havent watched a second of the pro bowl game in prob 10 years


Of course. But it's the respect and honor coming from their peers and opposing coaches that matters, so it would be good to see Cruz, JPP, and Eli on the final reveal.

As good as Cruz has been--and I do think he legitimately should be a first teamer--it may be a long shot, since he was completely unknown before this year (so it may have taken opposing players and coaches a while to catch up).

But even more pertinent, is that every year there are qualified and deserving WRs left off the list simply because every year there are too many really good receivers and not enough slots for them on the pro bowl.

Remember Plax , as good as he was for us those 4 years--especially his first 3 years with us--never was selected to the pro bowl.

Neither was Toomer in 2002 when he set the franchise record in yards that Cruz just broke on Saturday.

On the other hand, I will be shocked--SHOCKED!-- if JPP doesn't make it. Players throughout the league are aware of him by now.

Don't underestimate Eli's chances this year, either.

Brees, Rogers, Stafford all deserve to be there more then Manning.

stafford what the hell are you smokingEli only has 69 more yards than Stafford and I was wrong... Stafford only threw 14 picks. 36/14 vs 26/16... numbers don't lie.

He also has about 50 more pass attempts. Nearly 2 games worth, so yeah...They don't lie.

gmen0820
12-27-2011, 07:31 PM
well looks like the coaches and players respected just how much eli means to this team. they couldnt overlook the fact that bc of his play we have a bonafide shot at the playoffs and he's carried this team in ways that only truly elite qb's can.

well done to JPP too.

our pro bowl players that made it made it the right way, from players and coaches votes. fan votes are popularity contest and speak nothing to how a player really did. but when the players and coaches vote u in w/o the fan vote, that says something to the year you had.

congrats eli and jpp for giving the pro bowl a little bit of credence for being LEGIT pro bowlersWhere can I see these votes?

giantsfan420
12-27-2011, 07:35 PM
well looks like the coaches and players respected just how much eli means to this team. they couldnt overlook the fact that bc of his play we have a bonafide shot at the playoffs and he's carried this team in ways that only truly elite qb's can.

well done to JPP too.

our pro bowl players that made it made it the right way, from players and coaches votes. fan votes are popularity contest and speak nothing to how a player really did. but when the players and coaches vote u in w/o the fan vote, that says something to the year you had.

congrats eli and jpp for giving the pro bowl a little bit of credence for being LEGIT pro bowlersWhere can I see these votes?

he was 5th in qb voting for the NFC, there were threads with links to nfl.com that showed this. u could prob find it there. or search the forum bc there were certainly threads that showed this.
he was behind the two who made it in ahead of him, romo, newton, and i believe stafford

Sarcasman
12-27-2011, 07:38 PM
well looks like the coaches and players respected just how much eli means to this team. they couldnt overlook the fact that bc of his play we have a bonafide shot at the playoffs and he's carried this team in ways that only truly elite qb's can.

well done to JPP too.

our pro bowl players that made it made it the right way, from players and coaches votes. fan votes are popularity contest and speak nothing to how a player really did. but when the players and coaches vote u in w/o the fan vote, that says something to the year you had.

congrats eli and jpp for giving the pro bowl a little bit of credence for being LEGIT pro bowlers

Nonsense.

The Pro Bowl - like most all star games - is more popularity contest than anything else.

Add to that the fact that almost 2/3rds of the votes come from voters who don't know much and you've got a popularity contest that is going to get it right some of the time.

History should show that many of the players chosen are good choices and some aren't. But the idea that the voters somehow always or usually get it right or that the voting results are in any indicative of the actual quality of the play of those chosen is naive or stupid. Or both.

giantsfan420
12-27-2011, 07:41 PM
well looks like the coaches and players respected just how much eli means to this team. they couldnt overlook the fact that bc of his play we have a bonafide shot at the playoffs and he's carried this team in ways that only truly elite qb's can.

well done to JPP too.

our pro bowl players that made it made it the right way, from players and coaches votes. fan votes are popularity contest and speak nothing to how a player really did. but when the players and coaches vote u in w/o the fan vote, that says something to the year you had.

congrats eli and jpp for giving the pro bowl a little bit of credence for being LEGIT pro bowlers

Nonsense.

The Pro Bowl - like most all star games - is more popularity contest than anything else.

Add to that the fact that almost 2/3rds of the votes come from voters who don't know much and you've got a popularity contest that is going to get it right some of the time.

History should show that many of the players chosen are good choices and some aren't. But the idea that the voters somehow always or usually get it right or that the voting results are in any indicative of the actual quality of the play of those chosen is naive or stupid. Or both.

no, the fan vote is 1/3 of the selection process. players 1/3 and coaches 1/3.

eli was 5th last i checked in fan voting for nfc qb's, he got in bc the coaches and players voted him in. before u go on ur rant u should double check how the process is decided.
i agree the pro bowl is a joke...but when a player or players like eli and jpp make it in despite the typical popularity contest votes, that speaks to the years the players had

giantsfan420
12-27-2011, 07:42 PM
remember, jpp didnt even receive one fan vote, and he still made it. it was bc the players and coaches knew how much he meant to this team and how well he has played...just like eli

almot every player and coach had to have voted for eli and jpp especially jpp bc he missed out on an entire 1/3 of the voting process

jjj45
12-27-2011, 07:44 PM
remember, jpp didnt even receive one fan vote, and he still made it.thats pretty amazing.

Sarcasman
12-27-2011, 07:45 PM
well looks like the coaches and players respected just how much eli means to this team. they couldnt overlook the fact that bc of his play we have a bonafide shot at the playoffs and he's carried this team in ways that only truly elite qb's can.

well done to JPP too.

our pro bowl players that made it made it the right way, from players and coaches votes. fan votes are popularity contest and speak nothing to how a player really did. but when the players and coaches vote u in w/o the fan vote, that says something to the year you had.

congrats eli and jpp for giving the pro bowl a little bit of credence for being LEGIT pro bowlers

Nonsense.

The Pro Bowl - like most all star games - is more popularity contest than anything else.

Add to that the fact that almost 2/3rds of the votes come from voters who don't know much and you've got a popularity contest that is going to get it right some of the time.

History should show that many of the players chosen are good choices and some aren't. But the idea that the voters somehow always or usually get it right or that the voting results are in any indicative of the actual quality of the play of those chosen is naive or stupid. Or both.

no, the fan vote is 1/3 of the selection process. players 1/3 and coaches 1/3.

eli was 5th last i checked in fan voting for nfc qb's, he got in bc the coaches and players voted him in. before u go on ur rant u should double check how the process is decided.
i agree the pro bowl is a joke...but when a player or players like eli and jpp make it in despite the typical popularity contest votes, that speaks to the years the players had


I'm aware but thanks for assuming I don't. That's an endearing quality, assuming that others don't understand pedestrian concepts like pro bowl voting.

DId I say pedestrian? I meant exceedingly difficult, nuanced and complicated.

The fans and the player votes are a popularity contest. That's why I said 2/3rds.

I'll grant that the coaches who care enough to be thoughtful in their choices is a good barometer however I doubt many coaches give enough of a crap to do that. Many of them have more important things on their mind right now.

The majority of the fans and players have no clue.

giantsfan420
12-27-2011, 07:47 PM
well looks like the coaches and players respected just how much eli means to this team. they couldnt overlook the fact that bc of his play we have a bonafide shot at the playoffs and he's carried this team in ways that only truly elite qb's can.

well done to JPP too.

our pro bowl players that made it made it the right way, from players and coaches votes. fan votes are popularity contest and speak nothing to how a player really did. but when the players and coaches vote u in w/o the fan vote, that says something to the year you had.

congrats eli and jpp for giving the pro bowl a little bit of credence for being LEGIT pro bowlers

Nonsense.

The Pro Bowl - like most all star games - is more popularity contest than anything else.

Add to that the fact that almost 2/3rds of the votes come from voters who don't know much and you've got a popularity contest that is going to get it right some of the time.

History should show that many of the players chosen are good choices and some aren't. But the idea that the voters somehow always or usually get it right or that the voting results are in any indicative of the actual quality of the play of those chosen is naive or stupid. Or both.

no, the fan vote is 1/3 of the selection process. players 1/3 and coaches 1/3.

eli was 5th last i checked in fan voting for nfc qb's, he got in bc the coaches and players voted him in. before u go on ur rant u should double check how the process is decided.
i agree the pro bowl is a joke...but when a player or players like eli and jpp make it in despite the typical popularity contest votes, that speaks to the years the players had

I'm aware.

The fans and the player votes are a popularity contest. That's why I said 2/3rds.

I'll grant that the coaches who care enough to be thoughtful in their choices is a good barometer however I doubt many coaches give enough of a crap to do that. Many of them have more important things on their mind right now.

The majority of the fans and players have no clue.

well i agree with the fan votes, but disagree with u on the players voting. these are the guys that face each other, they'd know more than fans certainly about who deserves to go and who doesnt.

but hey i agree the pro bowl is a joke in most cases, but when players make it in WITHOUT the popularity contest votes, theres really no way to detract from the accomplishment

gmen0820
12-27-2011, 07:47 PM
well looks like the coaches and players respected just how much eli means to this team. they couldnt overlook the fact that bc of his play we have a bonafide shot at the playoffs and he's carried this team in ways that only truly elite qb's can.

well done to JPP too.

our pro bowl players that made it made it the right way, from players and coaches votes. fan votes are popularity contest and speak nothing to how a player really did. but when the players and coaches vote u in w/o the fan vote, that says something to the year you had.

congrats eli and jpp for giving the pro bowl a little bit of credence for being LEGIT pro bowlers

Nonsense.

The Pro Bowl - like most all star games - is more popularity contest than anything else.

Add to that the fact that almost 2/3rds of the votes come from voters who don't know much and you've got a popularity contest that is going to get it right some of the time.

History should show that many of the players chosen are good choices and some aren't. But the idea that the voters somehow always or usually get it right or that the voting results are in any indicative of the actual quality of the play of those chosen is naive or stupid. Or both.

no, the fan vote is 1/3 of the selection process. players 1/3 and coaches 1/3.

eli was 5th last i checked in fan voting for nfc qb's, he got in bc the coaches and players voted him in. before u go on ur rant u should double check how the process is decided.
i agree the pro bowl is a joke...but when a player or players like eli and jpp make it in despite the typical popularity contest votes, that speaks to the years the players hadEli finished 5th in popularity vote which certainly helped his cause. I'm sure you have a coaches link to see just how he stacked up vs other players and coaches.

By the way, how credible is all of that players and coaches vote anyway. Wasn't Eli not in the players choice for top 100 last year, and why didn't Cruz make the playoffs. Why did O'Hara make the playoffs last year, and Diehl the year before. You finally found a way to hype Eli up with a Pro Bowl and now you want to spin it a different way and sing another tune.

Props to Sarcasman who I at times haven't seen eye to eye with on this issue actually standing true to a bogus pro bowl.

giantsfan420
12-27-2011, 07:50 PM
ah stuff it. no one cares what u think about this topic. eli made the pro bowl. props to him. made it in on the votes of the players and coaches, they know a lot more than fans.

big time props to jpp who didnt even receive one vote from the fans and made it in. every player and coach musta had him like top ballot for de. way to go jpp!

Sarcasman
12-27-2011, 07:50 PM
well looks like the coaches and players respected just how much eli means to this team. they couldnt overlook the fact that bc of his play we have a bonafide shot at the playoffs and he's carried this team in ways that only truly elite qb's can.

well done to JPP too.

our pro bowl players that made it made it the right way, from players and coaches votes. fan votes are popularity contest and speak nothing to how a player really did. but when the players and coaches vote u in w/o the fan vote, that says something to the year you had.

congrats eli and jpp for giving the pro bowl a little bit of credence for being LEGIT pro bowlers

Nonsense.

The Pro Bowl - like most all star games - is more popularity contest than anything else.

Add to that the fact that almost 2/3rds of the votes come from voters who don't know much and you've got a popularity contest that is going to get it right some of the time.

History should show that many of the players chosen are good choices and some aren't. But the idea that the voters somehow always or usually get it right or that the voting results are in any indicative of the actual quality of the play of those chosen is naive or stupid. Or both.

no, the fan vote is 1/3 of the selection process. players 1/3 and coaches 1/3.

eli was 5th last i checked in fan voting for nfc qb's, he got in bc the coaches and players voted him in. before u go on ur rant u should double check how the process is decided.
i agree the pro bowl is a joke...but when a player or players like eli and jpp make it in despite the typical popularity contest votes, that speaks to the years the players had

I'm aware.

The fans and the player votes are a popularity contest. That's why I said 2/3rds.

I'll grant that the coaches who care enough to be thoughtful in their choices is a good barometer however I doubt many coaches give enough of a crap to do that. Many of them have more important things on their mind right now.

The majority of the fans and players have no clue.

well i agree with the fan votes, but disagree with u on the players voting. these are the guys that face each other, they'd know more than fans certainly about who deserves to go and who doesnt.

but hey i agree the pro bowl is a joke in most cases, but when players make it in WITHOUT the popularity contest votes, theres really no way to detract from the accomplishment

Um, no.

This assumes the average NFL pLayer is spending time thinking about this which I have to disagree with. I think the average NFL player couldn't think himself out of jail cell with bars made out of ice.

It's largely a popularity contest regardless of whether or not you agree with the choices.

gmen0820
12-27-2011, 07:51 PM
well i agree with the fan votes, but disagree with u on the players voting. these are the guys that face each other, they'd know more than fans certainly about who deserves to go and who doesnt.

but hey i agree the pro bowl is a joke in most cases, but when players make it in WITHOUT the popularity contest votes, theres really no way to detract from the accomplishmentSo you agree with Eli not making the players top 100 list, correct.

Double standard...

giantsfan420
12-27-2011, 07:53 PM
sarcasman-agree to disagree. i think the players may not be rocket scientists, but one thing they do know is football. its ok, we can disagree on this.
i actually agree that the pro bowl is a joke, a big one.
but certain times like this, when two players dont get the popularity contest votes like jpp and eli and still make it in, because of the coaches and players votes, i think it gives a lil more credence to it.

if the pro bowl was nothing but coach and player votes, it wouldnt be a joke. would u agree on that? bc thats how jpp and eli made it in.

0820-the vote came after a 25 int year, i never even commented on the top 100 in the fist place....lol u and ur "double standard" insult u love to throw around at me. ok cool we get how u feel, nice.


PROPS TO ELI AND JPP FOR MAKING THE PROBOWL!
hopefully they dont even have to play bc were getting ready for the super bowl.

oh, and technically eli just made the top 80 players of the nfl as voted in by players and coaches.

TheEnigma
12-27-2011, 07:53 PM
Eli is the only reason we won 8 games? I know you like Eli bro but don't exaggerate the facts. This Jets game is a decent example. Cruz made an excellent play off what was only supposed to be a simple 10 yard gain route while AB and BJ had some pretty good runs. The D-Line played pretty well also.

Then you have the Cowboys game where JPP had his career game and blocked that FG to prevent OT and not to mention that safety.

Eli has been good for us this year, his best year I think so far, but let's not act like he's the second coming of Jesus.

gmen0820
12-27-2011, 07:54 PM
It's largely a popularity contest regardless of whether or not you agree with the choices.I'm sure you were also someone who thought that the players top 100 list was bogus.

I'll have to apologize if I used that in an argument against you months ago when discussing Eli thinking you were an offender of a double standard, clearly you stay pretty on point when discussing how a QB be viewed.

giantsfan420
12-27-2011, 07:56 PM
Eli is the only reason we won 8 games? I know you like Eli bro but don't exaggerate the facts. This Jets game is a decent example. Cruz made an excellent play off what was only supposed to be a simple 10 yard gain route while AB and BJ had some pretty good runs. The D-Line played pretty well also.

Then you have the Cowboys game where JPP had his career game and blocked that FG to prevent OT and not to mention that safety.

Eli has been good for us this year, his best year I think so far, but let's not act like he's the second coming of Jesus.

yeah i corrected that in another thread. 7 games eli has been a huge factor for us winning. the jets game was all the defense. my bad, real excited

Sarcasman
12-27-2011, 07:56 PM
agree to disagree. i think the players may not be rocket scientists, but one thing they do know is football. its ok, we can disagree on this.
i actually agree that the pro bowl is a joke, a big one.
but certain times like this, when two players dont get the popularity contest votes like jpp and eli and still make it in, because of the coaches and players votes, i think it gives a lil more credence to it.

if the pro bowl was nothing but coach and player votes, it wouldnt be a joke. would u agree on that? bc thats how jpp and eli made it in.

The players are athletes. The one thing they know is how to perform in their role.

That's not the same thing as understanding the game or even having a more than rudimentary understanding of how the game works.

The same is true for for anything that the players vote for. 100 best players voted by the players? Please.

More nonsense created to entertain mindless jock sniffers. Like the pro bowls and all star games.

giantsfan420
12-27-2011, 07:58 PM
agree to disagree. i think the players may not be rocket scientists, but one thing they do know is football. its ok, we can disagree on this.
i actually agree that the pro bowl is a joke, a big one.
but certain times like this, when two players dont get the popularity contest votes like jpp and eli and still make it in, because of the coaches and players votes, i think it gives a lil more credence to it.

if the pro bowl was nothing but coach and player votes, it wouldnt be a joke. would u agree on that? bc thats how jpp and eli made it in.

The players are athletes. The one thing they know is how to perform in their role.

That's not the same thing as understanding the game or even having a more than rudimentary understanding of how the game works.

The same is true for for anything that the players vote for. 100 best players voted by the players? Please.

More nonsense created to entertain mindless jock sniffers. Like the pro bowls and all star games.

i have no problem agreeing to disagree. im not stating anything more than my personal opinion. i respect yours and largely agree with u. i just feel the players voting equals much moer than the fan vote.

if the pro bowl was strictly player and coaching votes, would u consider it a joke?

gmen0820
12-27-2011, 07:58 PM
sarcasman-agree to disagree. i think the players may not be rocket scientists, but one thing they do know is football. its ok, we can disagree on this.
i actually agree that the pro bowl is a joke, a big one.
but certain times like this, when two players dont get the popularity contest votes like jpp and eli and still make it in, because of the coaches and players votes, i think it gives a lil more credence to it.

if the pro bowl was nothing but coach and player votes, it wouldnt be a joke. would u agree on that? bc thats how jpp and eli made it in.

0820-the vote came after a 25 int year, i never even commented on the top 100 in the fist place....lol u and ur "double standard" insult u love to throw around at me. ok cool we get how u feel, nice.


PROPS TO ELI AND JPP FOR MAKING THE PROBOWL!
hopefully they dont even have to play bc were getting ready for the super bowl.

oh, and technically eli just made the top 80 players of the nfl as voted in by players and coaches.Oh, okay. You didn't comment on that list? Then I'll ask you now: after last year, do you think it would be fair and justified that the PLAYERS (who aren't rocket scientists, but know football, right?) kept Eli off the top 100 for players like Vonta Leach and McNabb etc.?

giantsfan420
12-27-2011, 08:01 PM
sarcasman-agree to disagree. i think the players may not be rocket scientists, but one thing they do know is football. its ok, we can disagree on this.
i actually agree that the pro bowl is a joke, a big one.
but certain times like this, when two players dont get the popularity contest votes like jpp and eli and still make it in, because of the coaches and players votes, i think it gives a lil more credence to it.

if the pro bowl was nothing but coach and player votes, it wouldnt be a joke. would u agree on that? bc thats how jpp and eli made it in.

0820-the vote came after a 25 int year, i never even commented on the top 100 in the fist place....lol u and ur "double standard" insult u love to throw around at me. ok cool we get how u feel, nice.


PROPS TO ELI AND JPP FOR MAKING THE PROBOWL!
hopefully they dont even have to play bc were getting ready for the super bowl.

oh, and technically eli just made the top 80 players of the nfl as voted in by players and coaches.Oh, okay. You didn't comment on that list? Then I'll ask you now: after last year, do you think it would be fair and justified that the PLAYERS (who aren't rocket scientists, but know football, right?) kept Eli off the top 100 for players like Vonta Leach and McNabb etc.?

well since u ask, eli came off a 25 int year. so while i disagree that eli wasnt a top 100 player, i could understand why the players wouldnt vote for him. the entire 100 top players voting system was iffy too if u ask me. they asked like 20% of the players, and didnt ask them to rank 100 players. they were asked to vote for there top 15 i believe. no way would i see players voting eli in that way esp after a 25 int year.
but hey, i dont really care what u think and find it funny u just have to try and "prove me wrong" and to be some "double standard" goon. lol. its all gravy baby, u feel one way i feel the other. next.


way to go eli and jpp well done this year!

gmen0820
12-27-2011, 08:03 PM
sarcasman-agree to disagree. i think the players may not be rocket scientists, but one thing they do know is football. its ok, we can disagree on this.
i actually agree that the pro bowl is a joke, a big one.
but certain times like this, when two players dont get the popularity contest votes like jpp and eli and still make it in, because of the coaches and players votes, i think it gives a lil more credence to it.

if the pro bowl was nothing but coach and player votes, it wouldnt be a joke. would u agree on that? bc thats how jpp and eli made it in.

0820-the vote came after a 25 int year, i never even commented on the top 100 in the fist place....lol u and ur "double standard" insult u love to throw around at me. ok cool we get how u feel, nice.


PROPS TO ELI AND JPP FOR MAKING THE PROBOWL!
hopefully they dont even have to play bc were getting ready for the super bowl.

oh, and technically eli just made the top 80 players of the nfl as voted in by players and coaches.Oh, okay. You didn't comment on that list? Then I'll ask you now: after last year, do you think it would be fair and justified that the PLAYERS (who aren't rocket scientists, but know football, right?) kept Eli off the top 100 for players like Vonta Leach and McNabb etc.?

well since u ask, eli came off a 25 int year. so while i disagree that eli wasnt a top 100 player, i could understand why the players wouldnt vote for him. the entire 100 top players voting system was iffy too if u ask me. they asked like 20% of the players, and didnt ask them to rank 100 players. they were asked to vote for there top 15 i believe. no way would i see players voting eli in that way esp after a 25 int year.
but hey, i dont really care what u think and find it funny u just have to try and "prove me wrong" and to be some "double standard" goon. lol. its all gravy baby, u feel one way i feel the other. next.


way to go eli and jpp well done this year!Do you have a link for the way the system was graded?

giantsfan420
12-27-2011, 08:05 PM
sarcasman-agree to disagree. i think the players may not be rocket scientists, but one thing they do know is football. its ok, we can disagree on this.
i actually agree that the pro bowl is a joke, a big one.
but certain times like this, when two players dont get the popularity contest votes like jpp and eli and still make it in, because of the coaches and players votes, i think it gives a lil more credence to it.

if the pro bowl was nothing but coach and player votes, it wouldnt be a joke. would u agree on that? bc thats how jpp and eli made it in.

0820-the vote came after a 25 int year, i never even commented on the top 100 in the fist place....lol u and ur "double standard" insult u love to throw around at me. ok cool we get how u feel, nice.


PROPS TO ELI AND JPP FOR MAKING THE PROBOWL!
hopefully they dont even have to play bc were getting ready for the super bowl.

oh, and technically eli just made the top 80 players of the nfl as voted in by players and coaches.Oh, okay. You didn't comment on that list? Then I'll ask you now: after last year, do you think it would be fair and justified that the PLAYERS (who aren't rocket scientists, but know football, right?) kept Eli off the top 100 for players like Vonta Leach and McNabb etc.?

well since u ask, eli came off a 25 int year. so while i disagree that eli wasnt a top 100 player, i could understand why the players wouldnt vote for him. the entire 100 top players voting system was iffy too if u ask me. they asked like 20% of the players, and didnt ask them to rank 100 players. they were asked to vote for there top 15 i believe. no way would i see players voting eli in that way esp after a 25 int year.
but hey, i dont really care what u think and find it funny u just have to try and "prove me wrong" and to be some "double standard" goon. lol. its all gravy baby, u feel one way i feel the other. next.


way to go eli and jpp well done this year!Do you have a link for the way the system was graded?
yeah let me look thru my cell phone for still shots i took of the pages, lol what u think im some kind of loser?

do the research urself, i read it and thats how the top 100 players were voted on. lol

TheEnigma
12-27-2011, 08:06 PM
you guys are my favorite forum rivalry lol.

lawl
12-27-2011, 08:08 PM
So much sexual tension in this thread.

gmen0820
12-27-2011, 08:10 PM
yeah let me look thru my cell phone for still shots i took of the pages, lol what u think im some kind of loser?

do the research urself, i read it and thats how the top 100 players were voted on. lolThat's a logical fallacy. Ad hominem. They don't do much for your argument, just thought I'd give you the heads up, because it is a very effective thing to do when in arguments, note the oppositions logical fallacies.

giantsfan420
12-27-2011, 08:12 PM
lol lawl. sorry i may be a little bit overboard with the excitement. i just am stoked jpp and eli made the pro bowl. to think giants fans would try and use weathorfords punting and websters coverage skills to detract from that, lmfao.

ok, the rush has ended. but lets be clear here, this is a giants mb, r people really trying to **** on giants fans parade for eli making the pro bowl?

notice how none of the jpp makes the pro bowl threads has the same type of instigators on it. talk about double standard.

giantsfan420
12-27-2011, 08:13 PM
yeah let me look thru my cell phone for still shots i took of the pages, lol what u think im some kind of loser?

do the research urself, i read it and thats how the top 100 players were voted on. lolThat's a logical fallacy. Ad hominem. They don't do much for your argument, just thought I'd give you the heads up, because it is a very effective thing to do when in arguments, note the oppositions logical fallacies.

um, this isnt even a logical debate. there is an explanation of the way the top 100 players were voted on. i read it, obviously u didnt. why would i engage with some one in a logical debate who is obvioulsy clueless to how it was run??lol. ur just mad cuz of that cell phone picture comment...lol

gmen0820
12-27-2011, 08:17 PM
lol lawl. sorry i may be a little bit overboard with the excitement. i just am stoked jpp and eli made the pro bowl. to think giants fans would try and use weathorfords punting and websters coverage skills to detract from that, lmfao.

ok, the rush has ended. but lets be clear here, this is a giants mb, r people really trying to **** on giants fans parade for eli making the pro bowl?

notice how none of the jpp makes the pro bowl threads has the same type of instigators on it. talk about double standard.Having the same type of instigator is consistency, not a double standard.

TheEnigma
12-27-2011, 08:17 PM
lol lawl. sorry i may be a little bit overboard with the excitement. i just am stoked jpp and eli made the pro bowl. to think giants fans would try and use weathorfords punting and websters coverage skills to detract from that, lmfao.

ok, the rush has ended. but lets be clear here, this is a giants mb, r people really trying to **** on giants fans parade for eli making the pro bowl?

notice how none of the jpp makes the pro bowl threads has the same type of instigators on it. talk about double standard.It's because no one is saying that JPP is the sole reason for this team being 8-7 and acting like he's the hero of our hopes and dreams. Then you have Eli and everyone acting like he's the only one contributing to the wins. It's an insult to the other players on the team who have done well and don't get the recognition they deserve because everyone is too focused on what Eli and to a lesser extent, JPP, has been doing. Both of these guys have made their fair share of mistakes.

As for Weatherford, I think you severely underrate what a good punter does for this team if you're knocking that. Imagine how many more points we could of had scored on us if we still had Dodge and his line-drive punts with little to no hang time.

Eli is great bro but I'm going to call out when people act like he's the ONLY reason we win when it's a blatant lie.

gmen0820
12-27-2011, 08:19 PM
yeah let me look thru my cell phone for still shots i took of the pages, lol what u think im some kind of loser?

do the research urself, i read it and thats how the top 100 players were voted on. lolThat's a logical fallacy. Ad hominem. They don't do much for your argument, just thought I'd give you the heads up, because it is a very effective thing to do when in arguments, note the oppositions logical fallacies.

um, this isnt even a logical debate. there is an explanation of the way the top 100 players were voted on. i read it, obviously u didnt. why would i engage with some one in a logical debate who is obvioulsy clueless to how it was run??lol. ur just mad cuz of that cell phone picture comment...lolWell I asked for you to provide the link where you read how it was condoned. You did paraphrase it for me and needless to say, however it was graded, you head the Vonta Leach's and McNabb's of the list making it and/or showing up on the top 15 or 20 or 25 players list (see this is why I'd like to know how it was condoned).

IF you're just blowing smoke though, I guess I wouldn't be surprised.

giantsfan420
12-27-2011, 08:26 PM
yeah let me look thru my cell phone for still shots i took of the pages, lol what u think im some kind of loser?

do the research urself, i read it and thats how the top 100 players were voted on. lolThat's a logical fallacy. Ad hominem. They don't do much for your argument, just thought I'd give you the heads up, because it is a very effective thing to do when in arguments, note the oppositions logical fallacies.

um, this isnt even a logical debate. there is an explanation of the way the top 100 players were voted on. i read it, obviously u didnt. why would i engage with some one in a logical debate who is obvioulsy clueless to how it was run??lol. ur just mad cuz of that cell phone picture comment...lolWell I asked for you to provide the link where you read how it was condoned. You did paraphrase it for me and needless to say, however it was graded, you head the Vonta Leach's and McNabb's of the list making it and/or showing up on the top 15 or 20 or 25 players list (see this is why I'd like to know how it was condoned).

IF you're just blowing smoke though, I guess I wouldn't be surprised.
"A total of 413 players voted, and each player was asked to list their top 20 current players. Point values (20 for No. 1, 19 for No. 2, etc) were assigned. Total points for each of the players named were added and the cumulative point totals ranked in order to determine the list. NFL Films reached out to players through a variety ways to try to get as many players to participate as possible, and the gathering of votes took place roughly over a five month period, from December to April."

http://www.arrowheadpride.com/2011/6/30/2252811/nfl-network-top-100-players-vote

sorry, u've been wrong again. its all good tho. lets not hijack the thread.

rosters were voted for the probowl.

eli and jpp made it despite not having the "fan popularity vote", congratulations to both for a helluva year!

lawl
12-27-2011, 08:28 PM
You guys get too vicious. I've learned to tame myself(a little)

gmen0820
12-27-2011, 08:30 PM
yeah let me look thru my cell phone for still shots i took of the pages, lol what u think im some kind of loser?

do the research urself, i read it and thats how the top 100 players were voted on. lolThat's a logical fallacy. Ad hominem. They don't do much for your argument, just thought I'd give you the heads up, because it is a very effective thing to do when in arguments, note the oppositions logical fallacies.

um, this isnt even a logical debate. there is an explanation of the way the top 100 players were voted on. i read it, obviously u didnt. why would i engage with some one in a logical debate who is obvioulsy clueless to how it was run??lol. ur just mad cuz of that cell phone picture comment...lolWell I asked for you to provide the link where you read how it was condoned. You did paraphrase it for me and needless to say, however it was graded, you head the Vonta Leach's and McNabb's of the list making it and/or showing up on the top 15 or 20 or 25 players list (see this is why I'd like to know how it was condoned).

IF you're just blowing smoke though, I guess I wouldn't be surprised.
"A total of 413 players voted, and each player was asked to list their top 20 current players. Point values (20 for No. 1, 19 for No. 2, etc) were assigned. Total points for each of the players named were added and the cumulative point totals ranked in order to determine the list. NFL Films reached out to players through a variety ways to try to get as many players to participate as possible, and the gathering of votes took place roughly over a five month period, from December to April."

http://www.arrowheadpride.com/2011/6/30/2252811/nfl-network-top-100-players-vote

sorry, u've been wrong again. its all good tho. lets not hijack the thread.

rosters were voted for the probowl.

eli and jpp made it despite not having the "fan popularity vote", congratulations to both for a helluva year!Lol how was I wrong? I asked to see how it was condoned. IF ANYTHING you were wrong. This was how you said it was condoned:

the entire 100 top players voting system was iffy too if u ask me. they asked like 20% of the players, and didnt ask them to rank 100 players. they were asked to vote for there top 15 i believe.

giantsfan420
12-27-2011, 08:30 PM
You guys get too vicious. I've learned to tame myself(a little)

haha. sorry man. i've been good lately tho. i shoulda known eli getting voted to the pro bowl and me celebrating it justifiably woulda attracted the response a few posters did, but i dont really care.
really stoked for eli and jpp! they deserved it.

BurnerNYG
12-27-2011, 08:32 PM
Eli actually beat out Stafford? Who put in the ballot... Stevie Wonder? Lol...j/k. Big ups to Eli and JPP. How in the world did Cruz get snubbed? That's garbage!

gmen0820
12-27-2011, 08:32 PM
And additional to that, that still doesn't change the fact that Eli Manning failed to show up on that list more than the other 100 players.

Take it like this, that list is a joke and you should stop using player votes like an accomplishment. Pro Bowl is a sham.

lawl
12-27-2011, 08:32 PM
You guys get too vicious. I've learned to tame myself(a little)

haha. sorry man. i've been good lately tho. i shoulda known eli getting voted to the pro bowl and me celebrating it justifiably woulda attracted the response a few posters did, but i dont really care.
really stoked for eli and jpp! they deserved it.

I hope they don't go, if you know what I mean.

jjj45
12-27-2011, 08:33 PM
Eli actually beat out Stafford? Who put in the ballot... Stevie Wonder? Lol...j/k. Big ups to Eli and JPP. How in the world did Cruz get snubbed? That's garbage!And Cam!...... Oh, Cam!

*cries alone in corner*

giantsfan420
12-27-2011, 08:34 PM
You guys get too vicious. I've learned to tame myself(a little)

haha. sorry man. i've been good lately tho. i shoulda known eli getting voted to the pro bowl and me celebrating it justifiably woulda attracted the response a few posters did, but i dont really care.
really stoked for eli and jpp! they deserved it.

I hope they don't go, if you know what I mean.

u and me both buddy. u and me both.

lawl
12-27-2011, 08:35 PM
Eli actually beat out Stafford? Who put in the ballot... Stevie Wonder? Lol...j/k. Big ups to Eli and JPP. How in the world did Cruz get snubbed? That's garbage!
It's Cruz's first year starting, he is widely regarded as the second best WR on his own team, he wasn't on the fan vote, and there are alot of big name WRs. He had alot to overcome. The no fan vote screwed him the most

BurnerNYG
12-27-2011, 08:37 PM
Eli actually beat out Stafford? Who put in the ballot... Stevie Wonder? Lol...j/k. Big ups to Eli and JPP. How in the world did Cruz get snubbed? That's garbage!And Cam!...... Oh, Cam!

*cries alone in corner*
Cam's that dude. Don't believe me? Keep watching football. 34 TD's... almost 800 yds rushing and 4000 yds passing... a beast!

jjj45
12-27-2011, 08:39 PM
Eli actually beat out Stafford? Who put in the ballot... Stevie Wonder? Lol...j/k. Big ups to Eli and JPP. How in the world did Cruz get snubbed? That's garbage!And Cam!...... Oh, Cam!

*cries alone in corner*
Cam's that dude. Don't believe me? Keep watching football. 34 TD's... almost 800 yds rushing and 4000 yds passing... a beast!yo I know dawg. Just busting ya. I know how much you love supercam.

giantsfan420
12-27-2011, 08:40 PM
Eli actually beat out Stafford? Who put in the ballot... Stevie Wonder? Lol...j/k. Big ups to Eli and JPP. How in the world did Cruz get snubbed? That's garbage!And Cam!...... Oh, Cam!

*cries alone in corner*
Cam's that dude. Don't believe me? Keep watching football. 34 TD's... almost 800 yds rushing and 4000 yds passing... a beast!

if cam made it i wouldnt have objected. he really has been something else to watch. like jpp, hes got plenty of room to improve.

Sarcasman
12-27-2011, 08:44 PM
It's largely a popularity contest regardless of whether or not you agree with the choices.I'm sure you were also someone who thought that the players top 100 list was bogus.

I'll have to apologize if I used that in an argument against you months ago when discussing Eli thinking you were an offender of a double standard, clearly you stay pretty on point when discussing how a QB be viewed.

Yeah, I think that list is crap too.

And thanks but no apology is necessary - we don't have to agree all the time on everything. We do agree on being GIant fans so that's cool enough by me.

Sarcasman
12-27-2011, 08:46 PM
agree to disagree. i think the players may not be rocket scientists, but one thing they do know is football. its ok, we can disagree on this.
i actually agree that the pro bowl is a joke, a big one.
but certain times like this, when two players dont get the popularity contest votes like jpp and eli and still make it in, because of the coaches and players votes, i think it gives a lil more credence to it.

if the pro bowl was nothing but coach and player votes, it wouldnt be a joke. would u agree on that? bc thats how jpp and eli made it in.

The players are athletes. The one thing they know is how to perform in their role.

That's not the same thing as understanding the game or even having a more than rudimentary understanding of how the game works.

The same is true for for anything that the players vote for. 100 best players voted by the players? Please.

More nonsense created to entertain mindless jock sniffers. Like the pro bowls and all star games.

i have no problem agreeing to disagree. im not stating anything more than my personal opinion. i respect yours and largely agree with u. i just feel the players voting equals much moer than the fan vote.

if the pro bowl was strictly player and coaching votes, would u consider it a joke?

Yes. Yes, I would.

I might feel differently if it was coaches, GMs and scouts though...

gmen0820
12-27-2011, 08:47 PM
It's largely a popularity contest regardless of whether or not you agree with the choices.I'm sure you were also someone who thought that the players top 100 list was bogus.

I'll have to apologize if I used that in an argument against you months ago when discussing Eli thinking you were an offender of a double standard, clearly you stay pretty on point when discussing how a QB be viewed.

Yeah, I think that list is crap too.

And thanks but no apology is necessary - we don't have to agree all the time on everything. We do agree on being GIant fans so that's cool enough by me.Sounds good. Where's the Simpsons avi btw?

BurnerNYG
12-27-2011, 08:54 PM
Eli actually beat out Stafford? Who put in the ballot... Stevie Wonder? Lol...j/k. Big ups to Eli and JPP. How in the world did Cruz get snubbed? That's garbage!And Cam!...... Oh, Cam!

*cries alone in corner*
Cam's that dude. Don't believe me? Keep watching football. 34 TD's... almost 800 yds rushing and 4000 yds passing... a beast!

if cam made it i wouldnt have objected. he really has been something else to watch. like jpp, hes got plenty of room to improve.I like Cam but that doesn't mean that I'm upset that one of our own made it. I thought the last 2 weeks was gonna set Eli back though. I'm proud of him... him and JPP. Just real disappointed that Giants receivers always have a hard time making it. I was surprised when Smith made it.

BurnerNYG
12-27-2011, 09:01 PM
I meant to say almost 700 rushing yards by the way. At work texting from my phone.

IamGiantsfan
12-27-2011, 09:15 PM
yeah let me look thru my cell phone for still shots i took of the pages, lol what u think im some kind of loser?

do the research urself, i read it and thats how the top 100 players were voted on. lolThat's a logical fallacy. Ad hominem. They don't do much for your argument, just thought I'd give you the heads up, because it is a very effective thing to do when in arguments, note the oppositions logical fallacies.

um, this isnt even a logical debate. there is an explanation of the way the top 100 players were voted on. i read it, obviously u didnt. why would i engage with some one in a logical debate who is obvioulsy clueless to how it was run??lol. ur just mad cuz of that cell phone picture comment...lolWell I asked for you to provide the link where you read how it was condoned. You did paraphrase it for me and needless to say, however it was graded, you head the Vonta Leach's and McNabb's of the list making it and/or showing up on the top 15 or 20 or 25 players list (see this is why I'd like to know how it was condoned).

IF you're just blowing smoke though, I guess I wouldn't be surprised.
"A total of 413 players voted, and each player was asked to list their top 20 current players. Point values (20 for No. 1, 19 for No. 2, etc) were assigned. Total points for each of the players named were added and the cumulative point totals ranked in order to determine the list. NFL Films reached out to players through a variety ways to try to get as many players to participate as possible, and the gathering of votes took place roughly over a five month period, from December to April."

http://www.arrowheadpride.com/2011/6/30/2252811/nfl-network-top-100-players-vote

sorry, u've been wrong again. its all good tho. lets not hijack the thread.

rosters were voted for the probowl.

eli and jpp made it despite not having the "fan popularity vote", congratulations to both for a helluva year!Lol how was I wrong? I asked to see how it was condoned. IF ANYTHING you were wrong. This was how you said it was condoned:

the entire 100 top players voting system was iffy too if u ask me. they asked like 20% of the players, and didnt ask them to rank 100 players. they were asked to vote for there top 15 i believe.
53 x 32 = 1696
413 devided by 1696 = .2435 etc which is about 24 percent
top 15 close to top 20,
how was he wrong?

gmen0820
12-27-2011, 09:20 PM
yeah let me look thru my cell phone for still shots i took of the pages, lol what u think im some kind of loser?

do the research urself, i read it and thats how the top 100 players were voted on. lolThat's a logical fallacy. Ad hominem. They don't do much for your argument, just thought I'd give you the heads up, because it is a very effective thing to do when in arguments, note the oppositions logical fallacies.

um, this isnt even a logical debate. there is an explanation of the way the top 100 players were voted on. i read it, obviously u didnt. why would i engage with some one in a logical debate who is obvioulsy clueless to how it was run??lol. ur just mad cuz of that cell phone picture comment...lolWell I asked for you to provide the link where you read how it was condoned. You did paraphrase it for me and needless to say, however it was graded, you head the Vonta Leach's and McNabb's of the list making it and/or showing up on the top 15 or 20 or 25 players list (see this is why I'd like to know how it was condoned).

IF you're just blowing smoke though, I guess I wouldn't be surprised.
"A total of 413 players voted, and each player was asked to list their top 20 current players. Point values (20 for No. 1, 19 for No. 2, etc) were assigned. Total points for each of the players named were added and the cumulative point totals ranked in order to determine the list. NFL Films reached out to players through a variety ways to try to get as many players to participate as possible, and the gathering of votes took place roughly over a five month period, from December to April."

http://www.arrowheadpride.com/2011/6/30/2252811/nfl-network-top-100-players-vote

sorry, u've been wrong again. its all good tho. lets not hijack the thread.

rosters were voted for the probowl.

eli and jpp made it despite not having the "fan popularity vote", congratulations to both for a helluva year!Lol how was I wrong? I asked to see how it was condoned. IF ANYTHING you were wrong. This was how you said it was condoned:

the entire 100 top players voting system was iffy too if u ask me. they asked like 20% of the players, and didnt ask them to rank 100 players. they were asked to vote for there top 15 i believe.
53 x 32 = 1696
413 devided by 1696 = .2435 etc which is about 24 percent
top 15 close to top 20,
how was he wrong?Notice I said 'if anything' and I even took the time to go back, erase it and put it in caps. And you answered your own question, there was a discrepancy, albeit small.

Better question, how was I wrong? If you read his post above mine he says, "sorry, u've been wrong again".

FIFTY6G-MAN
12-27-2011, 09:46 PM
LOVE THE TITLE.......RELEASE THEM ALL! I am sure we could afford to pick up some of those players LMAO

IamGiantsfan
12-27-2011, 10:17 PM
yeah let me look thru my cell phone for still shots i took of the pages, lol what u think im some kind of loser?

do the research urself, i read it and thats how the top 100 players were voted on. lolThat's a logical fallacy. Ad hominem. They don't do much for your argument, just thought I'd give you the heads up, because it is a very effective thing to do when in arguments, note the oppositions logical fallacies.

um, this isnt even a logical debate. there is an explanation of the way the top 100 players were voted on. i read it, obviously u didnt. why would i engage with some one in a logical debate who is obvioulsy clueless to how it was run??lol. ur just mad cuz of that cell phone picture comment...lolWell I asked for you to provide the link where you read how it was condoned. You did paraphrase it for me and needless to say, however it was graded, you head the Vonta Leach's and McNabb's of the list making it and/or showing up on the top 15 or 20 or 25 players list (see this is why I'd like to know how it was condoned).

IF you're just blowing smoke though, I guess I wouldn't be surprised.
"A total of 413 players voted, and each player was asked to list their top 20 current players. Point values (20 for No. 1, 19 for No. 2, etc) were assigned. Total points for each of the players named were added and the cumulative point totals ranked in order to determine the list. NFL Films reached out to players through a variety ways to try to get as many players to participate as possible, and the gathering of votes took place roughly over a five month period, from December to April."

http://www.arrowheadpride.com/2011/6/30/2252811/nfl-network-top-100-players-vote

sorry, u've been wrong again. its all good tho. lets not hijack the thread.

rosters were voted for the probowl.

eli and jpp made it despite not having the "fan popularity vote", congratulations to both for a helluva year!Lol how was I wrong? I asked to see how it was condoned. IF ANYTHING you were wrong. This was how you said it was condoned:

the entire 100 top players voting system was iffy too if u ask me. they asked like 20% of the players, and didnt ask them to rank 100 players. they were asked to vote for there top 15 i believe.
53 x 32 = 1696
413 devided by 1696 = .2435 etc which is about 24 percent
top 15 close to top 20,
how was he wrong?Notice I said 'if anything' and I even took the time to go back, erase it and put it in caps. And you answered your own question, there was a discrepancy, albeit small.

Better question, how was I wrong? If you read his post above mine he says, "sorry, u've been wrong again".
a small discrepancy doesn't mean he's wrong, doesn't matter though let's just leave it at that.

Sarcasman
12-28-2011, 12:50 AM
It's largely a popularity contest regardless of whether or not you agree with the choices.I'm sure you were also someone who thought that the players top 100 list was bogus.

I'll have to apologize if I used that in an argument against you months ago when discussing Eli thinking you were an offender of a double standard, clearly you stay pretty on point when discussing how a QB be viewed.

Yeah, I think that list is crap too.

And thanks but no apology is necessary - we don't have to agree all the time on everything. We do agree on being GIant fans so that's cool enough by me.Sounds good. Where's the Simpsons avi btw?


I got bored.

I'm looking for something new but nothing yet has struck my fancy.