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RoanokeFan
04-27-2013, 10:46 AM
http://espn.go.com/blog/new-york/giants/post/_/id/24977/report-card-giants-pick-pugh



Excerpt: "Justin Pugh, OT, Syracuse

Round 1, 19th pick
http://espn.go.com/i/nfl/grades/grade_bplus.jpg


Analysis: A lot of the players the Giants were eyeing had been picked. Alabama tackle D.J. Fluker (http://insider.espn.go.com/nfl/draft/player/_/id/30232/dj-fluker), Texas safety Kenny Vaccaro (http://insider.espn.go.com/nfl/draft/player/_/id/29251/kenny-vaccaro) and LSU safety Eric Reid (http://insider.espn.go.com/nfl/draft/player/_/id/29202/eric-reid) were all gone. In fact, the Niners traded with the Cowboys to take Reid right before the Giants picked. So the Giants opted to fill a big need with an offensive lineman they feel can play tackle, guard or center.

Jerry Reese said he could not pass on Pugh's versatility. While they did pass on a potential top-10 talent in DT Sharrif Floyd (http://insider.espn.go.com/nfl/draft/player/_/id/29257/sharrif-floyd), the Giants got a guy who could potentially enter the mix to start at right tackle this season. At the very least, Pugh offers immediate and much-needed depth on the line that Reese knows isn't getting any younger. Pugh could be a starter in 2014 when Kevin Boothe (http://espn.go.com/nfl/player/_/id/9762/kevin-boothe) and David Diehl (http://espn.go.com/nfl/player/_/id/4618/david-diehl) are expected to be free agents." Read more...

Carter.525
04-27-2013, 10:48 AM
haha.. That picture isn't even Damontre Moore

tonyt830
04-27-2013, 11:13 AM
I give the Giants a C- or maybe a C so far. The selection of Moore in the 3rd rd was of great value and pushed that draft grade up some. Moore was a potential 1st rd grade on many mocks.

I have no problem with the O-line being addressed and adding youth. I just think 19 was a reach for Pugh. I just cant see passing on Floyd, Rhodes, Trufant when they were sitting there at 19. The same goes for the 2nd rd---Jamar Taylor and Arthur Brown were sitting there when the Giants selected, but decided to go with a 2 down player that may have some weight and conditioning issues. If the Giants wanted to go DT they could have gotten a top 10 talent in Floyd at 19 and possibly Pugh in the 2nd rd to address the O-line. Its not like Pugh is going to start this coming season, unless there are a rash of injuries at RT or G. Coughlin is known to not start his 1st rd picks from day 1. Thats why Rhodes, Trufant, Taylor, Brown or Floyd would have made more sense in Rds 1 or 2. At least they could get into a rotation or play ST.

I sure hope that the Giants can find some value/quality at CB and/or LB the next few rounds. Im not confident with Webster and Ross at CB, and Hosley is a nickel back for the most part.

I'm sure some of the homer fans will jump on me for my opinion, but I honestly think that this draft ranks near the bottom(rds 1 and 2 anyway) in the Jerry Reese era. But he does have a chance to redeem himself with solid selections today. I still stick with my C to C- draft grade so far though. I like the Damontre Moore pick though!

Flip Empty
04-27-2013, 11:16 AM
Grades mean zip at this moment.

DaFrenchy
04-27-2013, 11:19 AM
haha.. That picture isn't even Damontre Moore

Yeah this is Jernigan ... :rolleyes:

nycsportzfan
04-27-2013, 11:20 AM
He gave pugh a B+??lol The guy was a mid 2nd rd prospect that went at pick 19.. Hes versatile yes, but theres plenty of versatile lineman out there.. Hes got some potential, and its a upgrade to our oline which is huge, but no way u can give Pugh a B+ grade, right below a A.. Thats crazy..

Overall, we've had a solid draft, and the pick of Damontre Moore has really solidified it for me, and as much as Hankins endurance worries me, he could be valuable if were to lose Linval down the rd, so its grown on me a bit more, and i do think Pugh will be a solid Guard for us, but the value was terrible..

FBomb
04-27-2013, 11:20 AM
So...anyone who doesn't agree with your brilliant opinion is automattically a homer? lol.....classic BS post. You could have easliy just given your grade without all the huff and puff, and chest thumping. I love that people label themselves as "realist" by bashing our GM's picks simply because it wasn't the pick you wanted.

Reese has already said that Pugh was his pick all along. People (including myself) have complained about our o-line and how bad our run game has been because of it. Reese addresses it with what will probably be our starting RT next season and now fans have changed his name to "Reach". It's laughable.

MustWarnOthers
04-27-2013, 11:30 AM
I thought there were reports that at least two other teams were looking at Pugh for the first round? How does that make him a second round prospect, besides the jabber of media hype? The real prospect value is what good GM's place on players and nothing more. Pugh has a high ceiling. The kid pulled a finance degree in 3.5 years while playing football. He's sharp and intelligent and moves well laterally. Mark my words, by mid season 2013/early 2014 people are going to be loving this kid.

BigBlueAllDay
04-27-2013, 11:31 AM
The Giants being able to get Pugh in the second round is an assumption at best. Sorry to all the fans expecting big name picks. At least they didn't trade their 2nd,3rd,4th, and 7th and basically giving up on the rest of the draft for 1 WR, Cordarelle Patterson, lol.

NorwoodBlue
04-27-2013, 11:37 AM
I think this is a good draft so far. Pugh has the potential to be an all-pro guard. I've heard people say he would have gone very high if his arms weren't "short". Probably he's actually Snee's replacement. Hank is huge and the endurance issues seem to come from people looking at him after 65-70 snaps in college, he never came out of a game. He won't have to do that in a four man rotation. And he's young, all of them are, all juniors. Moore is only 20 years old. Most college players don't even get on the field until they're 20, this guy's got three solid seasons behind him. Moore's potential has not even begun to be realized, they just have to make sure he stays focused.

If they can find some good quality special teamers, and maybe uncover a diamond in the next few rounds, I'll be very happy. After round three it's all about speed and athleticism to me. Players you get in those rounds shouldn't be pegged to fill a need, they should be people with upside who could blossom into surprise starters some day, and play special teams well right now. The RB from Stony Brook fits that profile to me, he seems to have a lot of potential.

CowboysSuck
04-27-2013, 11:40 AM
I dont understand people. Like FBomb said, we had all complained about how bad our O-Line was....and how TERRIBLE our starting RT David Diehl was...remember guys?? So Reese goes out and drafts an OT in the first round and people still complain? I mean c'mon man, at least shut up until you see the guy play for a season. Draft grades are complete nonsense IMO until the end of the following year.

FBomb
04-27-2013, 11:44 AM
I dont understand people. Like FBomb said, we had all complained about how bad our O-Line was....and how TERRIBLE our starting RT David Diehl was...remember guys?? So Reese goes out and drafts an OT in the first round and people still complain? I mean c'mon man, at least shut up until you see the guy play for a season. Draft grades are complete nonsense IMO until the end of the following year.

If people would just wait until I give MY opinion and then simply agree with it, this world would be a better place!!!:cool:

CowboysSuck
04-27-2013, 11:48 AM
If people would just wait until I give MY opinion and then simply agree with it, this world would be a better place!!!:cool:

Wellll, Im not so sure about that one

but the dreamers really come out in full force after the draft it seems...

GiantRoc
04-27-2013, 11:49 AM
Reese is terrible. Why did he wait until #19 to make a pick??? All the real good guys were already gone. Just awful. If you disagree you are a total homer.

BigBlueAllDay
04-27-2013, 11:59 AM
Reese is terrible. Why did he wait until #19 to make a pick??? All the real good guys were already gone. Just awful. If you disagree you are a total homer.

Reese did say in an interview that they did consider moving up/down, but basically he didn't like what other teams were giving him in return in a trade offer AKA not getting ripped off like the Vikings.

NorwoodBlue
04-27-2013, 12:12 PM
Reese is terrible. Why did he wait until #19 to make a pick??? All the real good guys were already gone. Just awful. If you disagree you are a total homer.

LOL

giantscolombia
04-27-2013, 12:17 PM
He gave pugh a B+??lol The guy was a mid 2nd rd prospect that went at pick 19..

what would a good grade be?

C or C+?

GiantRoc
04-27-2013, 01:05 PM
Reese did say in an interview that they did consider moving up/down, but basically he didn't like what other teams were giving him in return in a trade offer AKA not getting ripped off like the Vikings.

Nothing kills a joke faster than facts and reality... lol

BigBlue1971
04-27-2013, 01:10 PM
the article mentions that "at the very least, Pugh offers immediate and much-needed depth".

if that's on target the draft grade for him alone is at least B+.

the article also mentions positives on Hankins and Moore as well!

Reese is doing a great job imo. B rated draft so far!

GreenZone
04-27-2013, 01:24 PM
Reese did say in an interview that they did consider moving up/down, but basically he didn't like what other teams were giving him in return in a trade offer AKA not getting ripped off like the Vikings.

It would have been intriguing to see the Giants move down a few notches, still pick Pugh, and get additional draft choices too. While fans would likely then be raving about the Giants' draft, it also indicates to me how badly the Giants want this one player, not to risk losing him.

derekunion28
04-27-2013, 01:34 PM
If people would just wait until I give MY opinion and then simply agree with it, this world would be a better place!!!:cool:...lmao

NorwoodBlue
04-27-2013, 01:38 PM
It would have been intriguing to see the Giants move down a few notches, still pick Pugh, and get additional draft choices too. While fans would likely then be raving about the Giants' draft, it also indicates to me how badly the Giants want this one player, not to risk losing him.

19 is essentially no man's land in the draft. Nobody really wants to trade up to that area when there's a lot of talent left on the boards, as there was Thursday. I don't think anyone would have offered much of real value to trade up to 19, so I don't think it was bad to stay put and take the guy they wanted. And San Fran had just traded up to get Reid, so it kind of punctuated the thought that someone could trade up and take your guy. If you know who you want, and doubt they'll be there in round two, pull the trigger.

Also, there are a lot of guys saying Pugh would have been there in the second round. That's not a good assumption when you're at the 17th pick of round two. I think the Giants did what they had to to insure they got their guy, no complaints here at all.

I Bleed Blue 56
04-27-2013, 01:44 PM
I give it a C we needed a linebacker in the second. I like the Pugh pick because of the aging line. I domt like the second round pick at all. We should have gotten Brown and of course will watch another rookie linebacker flourish in the nfl. While our second round pick rotates and contributes some.

tonyt830
04-27-2013, 03:29 PM
So...anyone who doesn't agree with your brilliant opinion is automattically a homer? lol.....classic BS post. You could have easliy just given your grade without all the huff and puff, and chest thumping. I love that people label themselves as "realist" by bashing our GM's picks simply because it wasn't the pick you wanted.

Reese has already said that Pugh was his pick all along. People (including myself) have complained about our o-line and how bad our run game has been because of it. Reese addresses it with what will probably be our starting RT next season and now fans have changed his name to "Reach". It's laughable.are you referring to my post? If you read it completely, I did say that I was all for addressing the O-line, but I think Pugh was a reach at 19. You speak about huff and puff, chest thumping. That was not my intention, but if thats the way you took it, oh well. Its a message board, peoples opinions will vary. And there are fans that think Reese is the best thing since sliced bread, and if anyone disagrees with that they are told to go root for another team or are a chicken little.

But this year, I think Reese has had a subpar draft, plain and simple. He is the GM, and thats what Mara pays him to do. That does not mean that I have to like every move that Reese makes. But you seem to like to stir the pot some, and thats ok. Each of us our entitled to our opinions, and thats what message boards are for. I have agreed with some of your posts/points in the past, and there have been other times where I did not. Neither my opinion nor yours is the only one. People react differently, and I have seen other posters who are not happy with Reese and the draft this year. But he has also made some good moves over the past few years---it balances out I guess.

AntB
04-27-2013, 06:26 PM
Very nice draft. They already have the talent to win and this draft seems like solid replacements for on or two years down the line. They probably hope Pugh can make it at center pretty quick; if not, Snee might only have one or two solid years left at guard. They know from our recent Super Bowl teams that the D Line is the key to making the rest of the defense better than it is.

darrin99
04-27-2013, 07:15 PM
Solid "B". Filled the trenches the first 3 rounds. Got a potential 1st or 2nd round QB in round 4. Got a guy in round 5 who at the least will solidify special teams. Bottom line, the team is better going into week 1 this year than it was at week 16 last year.

uther99
04-27-2013, 07:17 PM
Thought I read that the Bears were gonna take Pugh at 20, so Giants couldn't really trade down and get him

darrin99
04-27-2013, 07:19 PM
Thought I read that the Bears were gonna take Pugh at 20, so Giants couldn't really trade down and get him

This is true, and the Cowboys wanted him at the bottom of the round too.

Eli TO Shockey
04-27-2013, 07:40 PM
I thought there were reports that at least two other teams were looking at Pugh for the first round? How does that make him a second round prospect, besides the jabber of media hype? The real prospect value is what good GM's place on players and nothing more. Pugh has a high ceiling. The kid pulled a finance degree in 3.5 years while playing football. He's sharp and intelligent and moves well laterally. Mark my words, by mid season 2013/early 2014 people are going to be loving this kid.

this! ^^^^

Its been rumored the bears were going to draft pugh at 20

Eli TO Shockey
04-27-2013, 07:51 PM
http://espn.go.com/blog/nfcnorth/post/_/id/55486/bbao-bears-plans-for-justin-pugh

thegreatone
04-27-2013, 07:57 PM
I give it a c-. Addressed oline, added a great potential De, but ignored lb and cb. I don't like Webster and cringe at the thought of him getting burned again this year. Xavier Rhodes IMO was the bpa(mixed with need,floyd was pure bpa)as he wouldn't only help out in the pass game but the pass rush as well BUT I am content with pugh(for now). 2nd round I don't get at all even if the coaches think Marvin is done there are still plenty of good dts on our roster. 3rd was a steal and what we come to expect from Reese and company. 4th ruined the draft for me,don't get it don't like it? 5th was a reach IMO but an intriguing prospect, sash was too for that matter so take it for what it's worth. 6th was a dynamic rb from Clemson that is a huge steal IMO,unfortunately he went to ariz in the nassib trade. 7th we get a big guard,we shall see since Reese's late round lineman seem to always work out? Then we have 1 more and at this point I'm expecting very little. Like another poster said I'm looking forward to the UDfa's

BlueBlooded1979
04-27-2013, 10:13 PM
Pugh - C+ He will play but was overvalued.
Hankins - B Current depth at DT will limit his snaps but LJ is an FA next year.
Moore - B+ can't argue with his sack production. TC not afraid to cut or bench him if he doesn't fly right.
Nassib - D Good QB but this team has holes that could have been filled. If Eli was 35 it would be a B+
Herman - B- Looks like an upgrade over Petrus
Cox - D Would have been avail as an FA

Depending on the weight of the pick this is a C+ draft. Factor in that they need corners for the future in the worst way and passed on them drags it down to a C-. Trading up for Nassib makes it a D.

Roswell777
04-27-2013, 10:26 PM
I dont know anything about the draft so im not going to complain about certain guys, but i do understand the Giants and their apparent needs. Someone is going to have to explain to me why we didnt draft a linebacker? If we sign Dansby its all good, but we are trading up to draft a player (Nassib) we hope never plays when we have real needs? Someone explain this to me please.

BlueBlooded1979
04-27-2013, 10:33 PM
I dont know anything about the draft so im not going to complain about certain guys, but i do understand the Giants and their apparent needs. Someone is going to have to explain to me why we didnt draft a linebacker? If we sign Dansby its all good, but we are trading up to draft a player (Nassib) we hope never plays when we have real needs? Someone explain this to me please.

The current PR tag line for Nassib is "too valuable to pass up". It is along the lines of "best player available" lie. To me they are missing the boat on value since value and need are always correlated. We have a Top 5 QB in his prime and a backup they like, that should drive the value of any QB in the draft to almost zero.

nhpgiantsfan
04-27-2013, 10:47 PM
I don't follow college football that closely so I won't try and grade the picks. If JR and TC are happy with them, that's good enough for me. But one thing I find slightly annoying about Reese is that he always talks like every guy he picks was the one they wanted all along or that he had so and so rated much higher. I mean how many times are we gonna here that he had guys slated at first round talent. Randle last year, Austin, the 3rd round DE this year. Just tell us why you like the player. We don't need to hear how you think you got a steal about every player you pick.

joemorrisforprez
04-27-2013, 10:59 PM
I give it a c-. Addressed oline, added a great potential De, but ignored lb and cb. I don't like Webster and cringe at the thought of him getting burned again this year. Xavier Rhodes IMO was the bpa(mixed with need,floyd was pure bpa)as he wouldn't only help out in the pass game but the pass rush as well BUT I am content with pugh(for now). 2nd round I don't get at all even if the coaches think Marvin is done there are still plenty of good dts on our roster. 3rd was a steal and what we come to expect from Reese and company. 4th ruined the draft for me,don't get it don't like it? 5th was a reach IMO but an intriguing prospect, sash was too for that matter so take it for what it's worth. 6th was a dynamic rb from Clemson that is a huge steal IMO,unfortunately he went to ariz in the nassib trade. 7th we get a big guard,we shall see since Reese's late round lineman seem to always work out? Then we have 1 more and at this point I'm expecting very little. Like another poster said I'm looking forward to the UDfa'sGreat post.....I agree 100%. I like our 1st and 3rd rounds, 2nd round got us another huge situational defensive tackle....we now have 5000 pounds of defensive tackle on this team to go along with a backup QB in the 4th roundThis draft was a "C" at best

B&RWarrior
04-27-2013, 11:14 PM
I give this draft an A, though I'd like to point out that meaningful draft grades can't be given out until at least 3 years after the draft. I sincerely LOVE this draft. The more I look at it and analyze it, the more I love it.

Rd 1 Analysis: Folks, DD is in decline and we have hole at RT, and Brewer is no proven replacement. In addition to this, Snee won't play for much longer. JP can come in right now and be a starter. He can play several positions, but flexibility is no reason to draft a player at 19. At that spot you are looking for above average potential. I think JP can be a really good guard. We only have a one year deal with Boothe. The experts all say his game tape is awesome. We needed Oline help, and have needed help for the past few years. We don't have another 3 years to wait for a project pick to develop.

speedman
04-27-2013, 11:15 PM
Impossible to grade a draft without seeing these kids play against nfl talent. If four of them make a team like the giants then it's a good draft. If three of them become starters after the first year then it's a real good draft considering where their picking(not picking in the top ten).

B&RWarrior
04-27-2013, 11:31 PM
Rd 2 Analysis: Why in the world does anyone bring up Kuhn and Austin as a reason not to draft a DT? Neither proved they were great at anything, though Kuhn showed off limited potential. Hankins is more powerful than either one, by far. He was the second best run defending tackle after Lotulelie (sp) in the draft. We were soft up the middle last year and this may address that issue for the long term. 30 year old Mike Patterson nor 35 year old Rogers are long term solutions, and did not factor into any draft decisions.

I have been BEGGING for a run stuffing DT for years now and we finally drafted one. A guy built to play 1 tech at the 3 tech. Best pick of the draft if he comes to play. Yes, Kuhn and/or Austin are now expendable. This kid has the potential to dominate at the point of attack like Robbins and the Hammer, freeing up our LBs to make plays. I don't see how you could have watched last year's run defense and feel Joseph alone is all we need. I love this pick. Hankings is our new run stopping gangster!

JJC7301
04-28-2013, 01:25 AM
I'll give the draft a B-. I thought that we should have taken Okafor in the 3rd and Greene in the 4th. Nothing against Nassib because I understand the value, but I would rather have had Greene.

PRGiant
04-28-2013, 05:06 AM
He gave pugh a B+??lol The guy was a mid 2nd rd prospect that went at pick 19.. Hes versatile yes, but theres plenty of versatile lineman out there.. Hes got some potential, and its a upgrade to our oline which is huge, but no way u can give Pugh a B+ grade, right below a A.. Thats crazy..

Overall, we've had a solid draft, and the pick of Damontre Moore has really solidified it for me, and as much as Hankins endurance worries me, he could be valuable if were to lose Linval down the rd, so its grown on me a bit more, and i do think Pugh will be a solid Guard for us, but the value was terrible..
No way Pugh makes it to the second round...He jumped charts after the senior game.

myles2424
04-28-2013, 05:56 AM
Overall I'd have to give this draft a C.....

Pugh,although he may be a great player & some swear we didn't reach for him....Here's my beef,there's a better chance we have to move him around than him being able to play RT.....and we passed on much higher talent (nobody can argue that) that alone makes that pick a C....Crap teams pick for need while good teams get great BPAs that everyone else passes on, Pugh is a need pick....

Hankins, yes I know he's a great run stuffer, but he's still a one demensional player as of now....I believe he was picked exactly where he deserved,no value there.....The pick itself is B, once again passing on much better talent makes it a C+ IMO......I'm sorry but you don't pass on a CB that couldve cracked the starting lineup & the best non pass rushing Lb in the draft that could've easily started week 1, just to pick up a run stuffer......I like the player,dislike the pick....

Moore, everyone has a different opinion on him....but value wise it's a A+ pick....he's not a blazing monster off the edge, but he's obviously doing something right...& people claim his sacks are mostly coverage sacks.......my response to that is, then why the hell aren't all DEs putting up 21 tackles for loss & 12.5 sacks worth of coverage sacks then!?? Come on now!!! there's red flags off the field & when I heard "the program doesn't really endorse him" it scared the hell out of me......but upside of that is, he's only 20 years old & has some growing up to do....perhaps being picked in 3rd round can serve as a reality check & being a rookie on a NFL with alot of talent ahead of him can be a wake up call that it's not going to come easy....

The rest of the picks, no comment....I'm not a fan either way....I hope they're all future hall of farmers,but I'm not a fan of passing up on BPAs that also fill needs......this has been a trend for years now, rounds 4-7 you can count on no name players that are far out projects....I'm sorry but I'm going with the bigger names from the bigger programs, Marcus lattimore,Jonathan Franklin,devin Taylor,Quittin Patton,kasheem Greene,terry hawthorne,Micah Hyde,Cornelius Washington,Baccari Rambo,Jordan poyer,Nick kasa,Sanders Cummings,Shamarko Thomas,Gerald hodges,B.w Webb,etc....I'm sorry but these are the guys that are worth taking chances on in the end of the draft instead of a safety/guard/RB that would've never been draft......I can't understand at all out of the guys I listed, we come up with some crazy picks that wouldn't even had been drafted.....

Cooper Taylor, yea I know he's big & fast....but bad value in the 5th as far as other players that were still around....C
Eric Herman, looks promising, but still the guy wasn't going to be drafted....B-
Michael cox, why?? & who??? The guy impressed nobody in college,production sucked....ray Graham went Undrafted,end of story... D

JesseJames
04-28-2013, 11:22 AM
I'm thinking that we may have drafted our LBer and don't know it yet with the Cooper pick....

B&RWarrior
04-28-2013, 11:34 AM
I'm thinking that we may have drafted our LBer and don't know it yet with the Cooper pick....

Yes, the guy is 10 lbs away from 240. This is my 3rd favorite pick. I love this pick. We need a safety because no way will we throw away more money on Rolle. If he can put on weight then we have a smoking fast LB.

Redeyejedi
04-28-2013, 11:36 AM
So...anyone who doesn't agree with your brilliant opinion is automattically a homer? lol.....classic BS post. You could have easliy just given your grade without all the huff and puff, and chest thumping. I love that people label themselves as "realist" by bashing our GM's picks simply because it wasn't the pick you wanted.

Reese has already said that Pugh was his pick all along. People (including myself) have complained about our o-line and how bad our run game has been because of it. Reese addresses it with what will probably be our starting RT next season and now fans have changed his name to "Reach". It's laughable.
Yes the Oline was bad thats why I wanted for them to take Cordy Glenn a better prospect then Pugh last year. Now I will get the obligatory u think u know more then the Giants Scouts post which I dont believe at all. This is a message board and if I wasnt posting my opinion then what would be the point of posting on here at all. My opinion is this is the worst draft the Giants have had under Reese.That being said I also think this is the worst talented draft pool in that span so it does make some sense this would be the worst.I do however think there were opportunities to get better players at places of need.
I did not care for the Pugh pick at first but after seeing the 2nd and 3rd rd picks it didnt bother me as much.Still Comparing the physical talent of Pugh to recent Lineman picked at that spot he doesnt match up.

BlueSanta
04-28-2013, 11:38 AM
The thing about Pugh, and why this particular pick didn't bother me so much, is the guy absolutely will play in the NFL. With his technical ability and footwork, there is very little chance of him busting completely. That cannot be said about a lot of prospects from the 1st round this year. There are a number of players who could very easily be complete busts.

People like to think that the best drafting teams are the ones that find the most studs in the draft. That really isn't true at all. It is the team with the fewest airballs in the draft.

Was Pugh my favorite choice? No. But, the pick doesn't bother me a ton. At least, not as much as many here in these forums.

BlueSanta
04-28-2013, 11:39 AM
Yes the Oline was bad thats why I wanted for them to take Cordy Glenn a better prospect then Pugh last year


This is the part of the Pugh pick that I have a hard time understanding. When I back away and look at the long term strategy it seems odd that we would pass on Cordy last year then take Pugh this year.

B&RWarrior
04-28-2013, 11:39 AM
Yes the Oline was bad thats why I wanted for them to take Cordy Glenn a better prospect then Pugh last year

I remember Cordy Glenn being there, but as I watched Wilson on the field the memory fades away. I think we got the BPA, and I think behind a good run blocking line Wilson will do better than Martin.

B&RWarrior
04-28-2013, 11:40 AM
This is the part of the Pugh pick that I have a hard time understanding. When I back away and look at the long term strategy it seems odd that we would pass on Cordy last year then take Pugh this year.

There is no David Wilson in this draft.

BlueSanta
04-28-2013, 11:50 AM
There is no David Wilson in this draft.

Hey I was a huge Wilson fan and I was the guy asking for us to draft him prior to the draft last year.

But, That's not what I am saying.

The Pugh pick is safe. He has a small chance of being a bust. That's ok, as I said the best drafting teams often aren't the teams that have the most home runs , but the fewest strike outs.

But, there is very little doubt that the Pugh pick was a need pick. Far more need than value, which is unlike Reese and this front office who is normally very good at avoiding having to pick a guy because we need him sooner rather than later. That is why the passing on Glenn now seems peculiar. I love David Wilson, I loved him at VT. But, I do not like being in a situation in the draft where we HAVE to pick a position NOW because the need is so dire, which is the position our front office found thsmelves in this year in part because they overlooked Glenn last year.

thegreatone
04-28-2013, 11:51 AM
Overall I'd have to give this draft a C.....

Pugh,although he may be a great player & some swear we didn't reach for him....Here's my beef,there's a better chance we have to move him around than him being able to play RT.....and we passed on much higher talent (nobody can argue that) that alone makes that pick a C....Crap teams pick for need while good teams get great BPAs that everyone else passes on, Pugh is a need pick....

Hankins, yes I know he's a great run stuffer, but he's still a one demensional player as of now....I believe he was picked exactly where he deserved,no value there.....The pick itself is B, once again passing on much better talent makes it a C+ IMO......I'm sorry but you don't pass on a CB that couldve cracked the starting lineup & the best non pass rushing Lb in the draft that could've easily started week 1, just to pick up a run stuffer......I like the player,dislike the pick....

Moore, everyone has a different opinion on him....but value wise it's a A+ pick....he's not a blazing monster off the edge, but he's obviously doing something right...& people claim his sacks are mostly coverage sacks.......my response to that is, then why the hell aren't all DEs putting up 21 tackles for loss & 12.5 sacks worth of coverage sacks then!?? Come on now!!! there's red flags off the field & when I heard "the program doesn't really endorse him" it scared the hell out of me......but upside of that is, he's only 20 years old & has some growing up to do....perhaps being picked in 3rd round can serve as a reality check & being a rookie on a NFL with alot of talent ahead of him can be a wake up call that it's not going to come easy....

The rest of the picks, no comment....I'm not a fan either way....I hope they're all future hall of farmers,but I'm not a fan of passing up on BPAs that also fill needs......this has been a trend for years now, rounds 4-7 you can count on no name players that are far out projects....I'm sorry but I'm going with the bigger names from the bigger programs, Marcus lattimore,Jonathan Franklin,devin Taylor,Quittin Patton,kasheem Greene,terry hawthorne,Micah Hyde,Cornelius Washington,Baccari Rambo,Jordan poyer,Nick kasa,Sanders Cummings,Shamarko Thomas,Gerald hodges,B.w Webb,etc....I'm sorry but these are the guys that are worth taking chances on in the end of the draft instead of a safety/guard/RB that would've never been draft......I can't understand at all out of the guys I listed, we come up with some crazy picks that wouldn't even had been drafted.....

Cooper Taylor, yea I know he's big & fast....but bad value in the 5th as far as other players that were still around....C
Eric Herman, looks promising, but still the guy wasn't going to be drafted....B-
Michael cox, why?? & who??? The guy impressed nobody in college,production sucked....ray Graham went Undrafted,end of story... DGreat post and agree 100%. The talent we passed on is mind boggling for high risk projects. I mean we pass n Floyd then take a 2 down dt in the 2nd?? I just didn't understand this draft

B&RWarrior
04-28-2013, 11:59 AM
Great post and agree 100%. The talent we passed on is mind boggling for high risk projects. I mean we pass n Floyd then take a 2 down dt in the 2nd?? I just didn't understand this draft

Floyd doesn't stuff the run and has off the field issues. Run defense is our biggest problem on defense. We got the second best run defending DT in the draft. He will take on double teams and make our LBs more effective. Besides, can you name the last player we drafted with off the field issues in the first round.

We didn't want the athletic speed tackle, we wanted a clogger, we needed a clogger. We got a BEAST!!! Love the Hankins pick.

Redeyejedi
04-28-2013, 12:05 PM
Hey I was a huge Wilson fan and I was the guy asking for us to draft him prior to the draft last year.

But, That's not what I am saying.

The Pugh pick is safe. He has a small chance of being a bust. That's ok, as I said the best drafting teams often aren't the teams that have the most home runs , but the fewest strike outs.

But, there is very little doubt that the Pugh pick was a need pick. Far more need than value, which is unlike Reese and this front office who is normally very good at avoiding having to pick a guy because we need him sooner rather than later. That is why the passing on Glenn now seems peculiar. I love David Wilson, I loved him at VT. But, I do not like being in a situation in the draft where we HAVE to pick a position NOW because the need is so dire, which is the position our front office found thsmelves in this year in part because they overlooked Glenn last year.On twitter last year all the Giant beat writers were convinced they were taking Glenn. Ralph V said that he was their highest graded player. Glenn tested through the roof and had the same versatility Pugh supposedly has having played multiple spots. He had good tape from the SEC at Guard and Tackle. Who was the best lineman Pugh lined up against? In 2011 Bruce Irvin "Trying to get that game" but this year Trevardo Williams. Glenn had tape against Clowney,Melvin Ingram,Courtny Upshaw, and Barkevious Mingo isnt that worth more.

BlueSanta
04-28-2013, 12:12 PM
On twitter last year all the Giant beat writers were convinced they were taking Glenn. Ralph V said that he was their highest graded player. Glenn tested through the roof and had the same versatility Pugh supposedly has having played multiple spots. He had good tape from the SEC at Guard and Tackle. Who was the best lineman Pugh lined up against? In 2011 Bruce Irvin "Trying to get that game" but this year Trevardo Williams. Glenn had tape against Clowney,Melvin Ingram,Courtny Upshaw, and Barkevious Mingo isnt that worth more.

Well I was Wilson's biggest fan in college, you know that. I was happy when we got him.

That said, at the time when our pick came about last year. In the minutes and seconds leading up to our pick, I would have bet money we were taking Glenn.

TheEnigma
04-28-2013, 12:14 PM
On twitter last year all the Giant beat writers were convinced they were taking Glenn. Ralph V said that he was their highest graded player. Glenn tested through the roof and had the same versatility Pugh supposedly has having played multiple spots. He had good tape from the SEC at Guard and Tackle. Who was the best lineman Pugh lined up against? In 2011 Bruce Irvin "Trying to get that game" but this year Trevardo Williams. Glenn had tape against Clowney,Melvin Ingram,Courtny Upshaw, and Barkevious Mingo isnt that worth more.

Dare I even consider the thought and I'll probably get flamed for even suggesting it but Reese might have a weakness in regards to becoming prone to certain positions getting a "run on" during the draft. He mentioned how he took Wilson last year because he suspected a run on RBs and now he did the same for Pugh because all of the "bigs" were coming off the board. Passes on Glenn at the end of the 1st but he gladly takes Pugh in the middle of a 1st round. From a pure value standpoint, this doesn't even make sense honestly.

giantsfam04
04-28-2013, 12:56 PM
He gave pugh a B+??lol The guy was a mid 2nd rd prospect that went at pick 19.. Hes versatile yes, but theres plenty of versatile lineman out there.. Hes got some potential, and its a upgrade to our oline which is huge, but no way u can give Pugh a B+ grade, right below a A.. Thats crazy..

Overall, we've had a solid draft, and the pick of Damontre Moore has really solidified it for me, and as much as Hankins endurance worries me, he could be valuable if were to lose Linval down the rd, so its grown on me a bit more, and i do think Pugh will be a solid Guard for us, but the value was terrible..

Why do you say pugh was mid 2nd round prospect? He was rising up draft boards no way in hell he makes into the second. the bears would have jumped all over him right after us. IMO he was taken exactly where he should have been, the fact that he can play multiple line positions adds extra value to the pick. We drafted our RT day one and if need be a guy who can play guard and center. I don't see you logic in giving him a c- at all.

B&RWarrior
04-28-2013, 01:03 PM
Hey I was a huge Wilson fan and I was the guy asking for us to draft him prior to the draft last year.

But, That's not what I am saying.

The Pugh pick is safe. He has a small chance of being a bust. That's ok, as I said the best drafting teams often aren't the teams that have the most home runs , but the fewest strike outs.


But, there is very little doubt that the Pugh pick was a need pick. Far more need than value, which is unlike Reese and this front office who is normally very good at avoiding having to pick a guy because we need him sooner rather than later. That is why the passing on Glenn now seems peculiar. I love David Wilson, I loved him at VT. But, I do not like being in a situation in the draft where we HAVE to pick a position NOW because the need is so dire, which is the position our front office found thsmelves in this year in part because they overlooked Glenn last year.

Had we drafted Glenn, then this year we would have AB and Ware as our top 2 Rbs, these 2 guys have a very checkered injury history. So, RB would be a dire need this year. Looking at this year's RB class, I think we made the right call.

wideright91
04-28-2013, 01:13 PM
I give it a C we needed a linebacker in the second. I like the Pugh pick because of the aging line. I domt like the second round pick at all. We should have gotten Brown and of course will watch another rookie linebacker flourish in the nfl. While our second round pick rotates and contributes some.

I don't think the fact we went OL in the 1st is why some folks are upset. I think some people are upset because of WHO we took in the 1st. Not saying we should've sold the farm for Lane Johnson or one of the guards - I just think it was a reach pick for a 2nd tier player.

wideright91
04-28-2013, 01:17 PM
Dare I even consider the thought and I'll probably get flamed for even suggesting it but Reese might have a weakness in regards to becoming prone to certain positions getting a "run on" during the draft. He mentioned how he took Wilson last year because he suspected a run on RBs and now he did the same for Pugh because all of the "bigs" were coming off the board. Passes on Glenn at the end of the 1st but he gladly takes Pugh in the middle of a 1st round. From a pure value standpoint, this doesn't even make sense honestly.

I think you raise a valid point. I'd say, though, one should consider the level of talent in last year's draft (remarkably high) than this year's (remarkably low). Think if Glenn - or Wilson, for that matter - are 2013 prospects, they're off the board mid-1st.

B&RWarrior
04-28-2013, 04:21 PM
On twitter last year all the Giant beat writers were convinced they were taking Glenn. Ralph V said that he was their highest graded player. Glenn tested through the roof and had the same versatility Pugh supposedly has having played multiple spots. He had good tape from the SEC at Guard and Tackle. Who was the best lineman Pugh lined up against? In 2011 Bruce Irvin "Trying to get that game" but this year Trevardo Williams. Glenn had tape against Clowney,Melvin Ingram,Courtny Upshaw, and Barkevious Mingo isnt that worth more.

That is just not true. Glenn has better physicals. Definitely does not lack core strength as is the knock on Pugh and has adequate arm length. Glenn had awful mechanics and very sloppy footwork on tape. It wasn't all roses with Glenn as some people like to make it seem.

Redeyejedi
04-28-2013, 05:31 PM
Dare I even consider the thought and I'll probably get flamed for even suggesting it but Reese might have a weakness in regards to becoming prone to certain positions getting a "run on" during the draft. He mentioned how he took Wilson last year because he suspected a run on RBs and now he did the same for Pugh because all of the "bigs" were coming off the board. Passes on Glenn at the end of the 1st but he gladly takes Pugh in the middle of a 1st round. From a pure value standpoint, this doesn't even make sense honestly.Thats why I had thought the whole draft process that they werent going to take a tackle in the 1st. Logically it didnt make sense to me. I guess factoring in the strength of this draft wasnt factored enough into my equation.

Redeyejedi
04-28-2013, 05:38 PM
That is just not true. Glenn has better physicals. Definitely does not lack core strength as is the knock on Pugh and has adequate arm length. Glenn had awful mechanics and very sloppy footwork on tape. It wasn't all roses with Glenn as some people like to make it seem.Glenn was light years more physically talented then Pugh.Glenns problems are a lot easier to fix I believe. Pugh doesnt even have tape against top competition. Who knows how high he gets drafted in the SEC if he was facing bigger stronger lineman week in week out. Glenn was going against Clowney,Mingo,Upshaw,Ingram,Fletcher Cox every week during his college career. When I put games on of Glenn I saw him at Guard and a LT handling all types of lineman and situations. Everyone is just assuming Pugh translates to guard. Im not sure Pugh is strong and physical enough to play Guard or RT. He can mirror edge rushers great but against bull rushers I see weaknesses and against 320 DT's inside I dont know if he can play there