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View Full Version : NFL.com: What Is JPP's Rank As Edge Rusher?



RoanokeFan
06-24-2013, 12:45 PM
http://www.giants.com/news-and-blogs/article-1/NFLcom-What-is-JPPs-rank-as-edge-rusher/18bc8471-9d4b-4161-ae5e-5466159ecb90


Although Jason Pierre-Paul’s numbers dipped in 2012, in part due to a bothersome back, the defensive end still may have the highest ceiling out of his NFL counterparts.

NFL.com ranked the league’s top 25 edge rushers as they stand heading into 2013, and Pierre-Paul, who earlier this month underwent a successful procedure to repair a herniated disc in his lower back, came in at No. 7 among the “best of the best.” The list did not include interior rushers, leaving out 4-3 defensive tackles like Geno Atkins and 3-4 defensive ends like J.J. Watt.

“JPP might have the highest ceiling of the whole group if he recovers well from back surgery and learns more veteran guile,” Gregg Rosenthal wrote about the Giants’ 2010 first-round draft pick.

The top 25 were divided into three categories: The Best of the Best, Next Level, and Knocking on the Door.


The Best of the Best

1. Von Miller
2. Clay Matthews
3. Cameron Wake
4. Terrell Suggs
5. DeMarcus Ware
6. Aldon Smith
7. Jason Pierre-Paul" Read more...

GameTime
06-24-2013, 01:38 PM
inside the top 10 is always good....

hope he gets healthy and keeps on improving....
he needs to stay hungry.

RolleN N CruzN
06-24-2013, 01:43 PM
Too early to tell. The most accurate comment was:

“JPP might have the highest ceiling of the whole group if he recovers well from back surgery and learns more veteran guile,” Gregg Rosenthal wrote about the Giants’ 2010 first-round draft pick.

JPP has the potential to be a Strahan type. His ceiling is incredibly high and he most likely is the franchise player on the defense.

thomsoad
06-24-2013, 04:10 PM
I couldnt help but notice Tuck aint even on the list.

Eliscruzzz
06-24-2013, 04:18 PM
Cameron Wake?? Aldon Smith?? Terrell Suggs?? I don't know I think JPP is better then all three...

TheEnigma
06-24-2013, 04:21 PM
Cameron Wake?? Aldon Smith?? Terrell Suggs?? I don't know I think JPP is better then all three...

I have no problem with Wake being ranked higher as a better edge rusher (he generates crazy pressure) and edge rushing is all Aldon Smith really has but JPP is still more valuable than the other two because of what he brings in terms of run defense. Personally, Clay Matthews is too high on that list for me and Ware is too low.

Eliscruzzz
06-24-2013, 04:22 PM
I think Aldon Smith gets to much credit. When Justin Smith went out A.Smith wasn't nearly as effective.

giantsfan420
06-24-2013, 04:22 PM
aldon smith could be #1 on that list based on what hes done so far. he's every bit the threat off the edge JPP is if not more (JPP is better in virtually every other aspect tho).

GameTime
06-24-2013, 04:22 PM
Cameron Wake?? Aldon Smith?? Terrell Suggs?? I don't know I think JPP is better then all three...
he "can" be better but he isnt as of this time in his career.

GameTime
06-24-2013, 04:23 PM
I think Aldon Smith gets to much credit. When Justin Smith went out A.Smith wasn't nearly as effective.
kinda like Tuck getting lame and it effecting JPP.....

Eliscruzzz
06-24-2013, 04:24 PM
I have no problem with Wake being ranked higher as a better edge rusher (he generates crazy pressure) and edge rushing is all Aldon Smith really has but JPP is still more valuable than the other two because of what he brings in terms of run defense. Personally, Clay Matthews is too high on that list for me and Ware is too low.I agree with Ware. I think he should be number 1, dude's a beast. I guess in pass rushing ability maybe some of these guys are ahead of JPP. I guess, I was just taking into account all aspects of a pass rusher. I don't know about Clay, his defense isn't exactly great and still puts up huge sack numbers.

Eliscruzzz
06-24-2013, 04:25 PM
kinda like Tuck getting lame and it effecting JPP.....Tuck isn't even close to Justin Smith.

TheEnigma
06-24-2013, 04:25 PM
kinda like Tuck getting lame and it effecting JPP.....

It's not really the same since the SF defense schemes specifically for Justin Smith to eat up the blockers in front of Aldon. Now Aldon can still generate good pressure without Justin but he hasn't discovered how to turn that into sack production.

GameTime
06-24-2013, 04:28 PM
Tuck isn't even close to Justin Smith.
not saying he is but when Tuck gets singled it leaves more blockers for JPP to have to deal with....

GameTime
06-24-2013, 04:29 PM
It's not really the same since the SF defense schemes specifically for Justin Smith to eat up the blockers in front of Aldon. Now Aldon can still generate good pressure without Justin but he hasn't discovered how to turn that into sack production.

scheme's aside the NYG DL still relies on the other players doing their jobs. if that doesnt happene then, in theis, case JPP's production will drop off ....

TheEnigma
06-24-2013, 04:29 PM
I agree with Ware. I think he should be number 1, dude's a beast. I guess in pass rushing ability maybe some of these guys are ahead of JPP. I guess, I was just taking into account all aspects of a pass rusher. I don't know about Clay, his defense isn't exactly great and still puts up huge sack numbers.

In terms of turning around the corner (going outside of an LT's left shoulder) and having an explosive first step, I have to give it to Von Miller as #1 but Ware is my choice at #2. JPP seems better going to the inside of a LT instead but that could be because he had weight issues last season.

Eliscruzzz
06-24-2013, 04:31 PM
not saying he is but when Tuck gets singled it leaves more blockers for JPP to have to deal with....Yeah true but Tuck wasn't all that great in '11 either and JPP had a great year. Justin Smith is a demon getting pressure up the middle and teams will always double him before A.Smith. When you play the Giants everyone knows you have to stop number 90, by any means necessary.

GameTime
06-24-2013, 04:33 PM
Yeah true but Tuck wasn't all that great in '11 either and JPP had a great year. Justin Smith is a demon getting pressure up the middle and teams will always double him before A.Smith. When you play the Giants everyone knows you have to stop number 90, by any means necessary.
JPP...wasnt a know factor as much in 2011....but I hear you.
Also the DL as a whole wasnt too bad in 2011....the interior was pretty good.

Eliscruzzz
06-24-2013, 04:34 PM
In terms of turning around the corner (going outside of an LT's left shoulder) and having an explosive first step, I have to give it to Von Miller as #1 but Ware is my choice at #2. JPP seems better going to the inside of a LT instead but that could be because he had weight issues last season.True, I forgot about Miller. He is a beast too. I guess I just see more of Ware when we play them. Dude has made Eli's life a living hell. I'm just curious. Why are you not that high on Clay?

Ntegrase96
06-24-2013, 04:35 PM
aldon smith could be #1 on that list based on what hes done so far. he's every bit the threat off the edge JPP is if not more (JPP is better in virtually every other aspect tho).

I love disagreeing with you, especially when I take the side of a Giants player.

I'd take JPP over Aldon. Aldon isn't that great... don't get me wrong he's a top pass rusher, but a lot of times people act like he's on the same level as Von or Watt, or in this case JPP.

Aldon is good, but if you break down his film, he largely benefits from the other pro bowlers around him.

Eliscruzzz
06-24-2013, 04:36 PM
JPP...wasnt a know factor as much in 2011....but I hear you.
Also the DL as a whole wasnt too bad in 2011....the interior was pretty good.True, I guess it's all speculation. Hopefully JPP gets healthy and he proves this year that he belongs on the top. It's probably just my 49er hate showing...lol.

GameTime
06-24-2013, 04:37 PM
True, I guess it's all speculation. Hopefully JPP gets healthy and he proves this year that he belongs on the top. It's probably just my 49er hate showing...lol.

yes....I hope JPP stays hungry and wants to be the best.

Ntegrase96
06-24-2013, 04:37 PM
http://www.giants.com/news-and-blogs/article-1/NFLcom-What-is-JPPs-rank-as-edge-rusher/18bc8471-9d4b-4161-ae5e-5466159ecb90


Although Jason Pierre-Paul’s numbers dipped in 2012, in part due to a bothersome back, the defensive end still may have the highest ceiling out of his NFL counterparts.

NFL.com ranked the league’s top 25 edge rushers as they stand heading into 2013, and Pierre-Paul, who earlier this month underwent a successful procedure to repair a herniated disc in his lower back, came in at No. 7 among the “best of the best.” The list did not include interior rushers, leaving out 4-3 defensive tackles like Geno Atkins and 3-4 defensive ends like J.J. Watt.

“JPP might have the highest ceiling of the whole group if he recovers well from back surgery and learns more veteran guile,” Gregg Rosenthal wrote about the Giants’ 2010 first-round draft pick.

The top 25 were divided into three categories: The Best of the Best, Next Level, and Knocking on the Door.


The Best of the Best

1. Von Miller
2. Clay Matthews
3. Cameron Wake
4. Terrell Suggs
5. DeMarcus Ware
6. Aldon Smith
7. Jason Pierre-Paul" Read more...

Ranking these guys is pretty difficult with legacies to consider and what not, but the overall best pass rusher in the league at this is Von Miller or JJ Watt.

TheEnigma
06-24-2013, 04:40 PM
True, I forgot about Miller. He is a beast too. I guess I just see more f Ware when we play them. Dude has made Eli's life a living hell. I'm just curious. Why are you not that high on Clay?

I like Clay Matthews but just not that high on this list. I'd take Ware, Wake, Aldon Smith (he still has more ceiling to reach), and JPP over him any day. Cameron Wake has never really been on a top defense and I can only imagine what he would be like if he was on one.

Eliscruzzz
06-24-2013, 04:40 PM
Ranking these guys is pretty difficult with legacies to consider and what not, but the overall best pass rusher in the league at this is Von Miller or JJ Watt.Wow... I didn't even notice JJ Watt was ranked behind all these guys, good choice.I still would take Ware over both of them though.

TheEnigma
06-24-2013, 04:41 PM
Ranking these guys is pretty difficult with legacies to consider and what not, but the overall best pass rusher in the league at this is Von Miller or JJ Watt.

Watt is easily the 1st choice I'd go with to build a defense but he isn't technically an edge rusher.

Edit: Reread it. Never mind lol

Ntegrase96
06-24-2013, 04:45 PM
Watt is easily the 1st choice I'd go with to build a defense but he isn't technically an edge rusher.

It's hard to say who I would take. Watt is a monster that plays a position where he can have a lot of impact (even though the position traditionally isn't traditionally viewed that way unless your Bruce Smith). But Miller is a versatile monster. Both are elite players.

Ntegrase96
06-24-2013, 04:46 PM
Wow... I didn't even notice JJ Watt was ranked behind all these guys, good choice.I still would take Ware over both of them though.

The only reason I may consider Ware better is because of his legacy thus far. He's still pretty good, but Von Miller is doing things that Ware used to do and Watt is doing stuff that no one has ever done at the position. Exciting time for defense lovers if you ask me.

giantsfan420
06-24-2013, 04:50 PM
I love disagreeing with you, especially when I take the side of a Giants player.

I'd take JPP over Aldon. Aldon isn't that great... don't get me wrong he's a top pass rusher, but a lot of times people act like he's on the same level as Von or Watt, or in this case JPP.

Aldon is good, but if you break down his film, he largely benefits from the other pro bowlers around him.ur missing the parameters of the discussion. its not DE or complete package, its strictly "EDGE RUSHER (rushing off the edge)." JPP is dangerous off the edge, but not as much as Aldon Smith. But thats ok, JPP is superior in every other aspect (as my original post pointed out.)if u wanna disagree with that, thats fine. ur just gonna be wrong...as usual :)

TheEnigma
06-24-2013, 04:52 PM
It's hard to say who I would take. Watt is a monster that plays a position where he can have a lot of impact (even though the position traditionally isn't traditionally viewed that way unless your Bruce Smith). But Miller is a versatile monster. Both are elite players.

Miller's explosion is just ridiculous. I don't recall the PFF article but he easily led the league in pressure generated in under 2 seconds from the snap.


The only reason I may consider Ware better is because of his legacy thus far. He's still pretty good, but Von Miller is doing things that Ware used to do and Watt is doing stuff that no one has ever done at the position. Exciting time for defense lovers if you ask me.

Kuechly at LB and Stephon Gilmore at CB (who I think is highly underrated for a 2nd year player heading into this season) are some emerging players in the backfield too.

giantsfan420
06-24-2013, 04:53 PM
Ranking these guys is pretty difficult with legacies to consider and what not, but the overall best pass rusher in the league at this is Von Miller or JJ Watt.again, it isnt "pass rushers", its "rushers off the edge" as in who threatens the edge the most, at least thats how I took it. JPP beats ALdon Smith in virtually every other aspect of pass rushing tho imo and esp as a complete player.

if the list was "complete pass rusher" i'd prob put JPP top 3 (he'd be 1rst but had a so so sack # 2012 which does weight) and A.SMith prob wouldnt even be my top 10. but thats a diff parameter.

Ntegrase96
06-24-2013, 04:56 PM
Miller's explosion is just ridiculous. I don't recall the PFF article but he easily led the league in pressure generated in under 2 seconds from the snap.



Kuechly at LB and Stephon Gilmore at CB (who I think is highly underrated for a 2nd year player heading into this season) are some emerging players in the backfield too.

Yeah Gilmore struggled early but he was down right dominant once he got comfortable. But he plays for the Bills, so I guess I understand the lack of hype. It will come though.

Ntegrase96
06-24-2013, 05:04 PM
again, it isnt "pass rushers", its "rushers off the edge" as in who threatens the edge the most, at least thats how I took it. JPP beats ALdon Smith in virtually every other aspect of pass rushing tho imo and esp as a complete player.

if the list was "complete pass rusher" i'd prob put JPP top 3 (he'd be 1rst but had a so so sack # 2012 which does weight) and A.SMith prob wouldnt even be my top 10. but thats a diff parameter.

That's fair. I'm just replying to this one instead of both, but that's fair for eliminating Watt.

jomo
06-24-2013, 05:45 PM
That's fair. I'm just replying to this one instead of both, but that's fair for eliminating Watt.Why don't you just renounce the Cowboys and hang out here more often. Our MB game would be stronger as a result!

Much......lol.

giantsfan420
06-24-2013, 07:17 PM
That's fair. I'm just replying to this one instead of both, but that's fair for eliminating Watt.well to be honest I dont know why Watt still wouldnt be on the list? he is a 3-4 down lineman, but he isn't like, restricted to one spot on the DL. He's used in a variety of ways, and he can threaten the edge as good as some of those other guys on the list. I guess its bc predominantly he's working on the inside of the OT, but he def. isn't a scrub challenging the edge.

Gmen2005
06-24-2013, 07:21 PM
I just hope he can stay explosive and make a full recover after back surgery. I'm incredibly worried about him.

giantsfan420
06-24-2013, 07:30 PM
me 2 gmen2005. back surgery aint something to take lightly.

i have confidence in the organization tho to ensure a player of JPPs magnitude is given the absolute best shot at a full recovery. remember, kiwi had a serious neck surgery too, that was prob a bigger deal than the injury JPP had. and Kiwi has played like he didnt miss a beat which actually surprised me some in a good way.

my thing is, i dunno if we should rush him back just so we can play him week 1. not having him would be a huge blow but if we had to miss any time with him, id rather it be week 1 when we have the offseason to prepare...

BlueBlooded1979
06-24-2013, 07:47 PM
well to be honest I dont know why Watt still wouldnt be on the list? he is a 3-4 down lineman, but he isn't like, restricted to one spot on the DL. He's used in a variety of ways, and he can threaten the edge as good as some of those other guys on the list. I guess its bc predominantly he's working on the inside of the OT, but he def. isn't a scrub challenging the edge.

3-4 DEs are considered interior rushers most of the time but I hear you. If I am building a 4-3 defense I am still taking him and unleashing him at LDE. Forget about running over there or working the flat as he will bat it down. He would still grab 10-14 sacks as power rush guy.