PDA

View Full Version : Which unit will have to step up this year?



BJacobs aka The Problem
06-27-2013, 09:29 AM
Back once again with another poll because it's going to be a long Thursday waiting for Friday to get here.

My question to everyone is this:

In order to get back to the Superbowl, which unit will have to step up this year?

Will the Defense have to step up and play much better then they did last year to reclaim past glory? Will the offense once again have to put the team on it's shoulders and score tons of points or will it be the special teams unit that will have to make the plays to put both the defensive and offensive units in better positions to win games?

Moke
06-27-2013, 09:30 AM
The offense IMO.

We really need to convert more. I feel like we had way too many punts last year.

Toadofsteel
06-27-2013, 09:44 AM
The two things that need to happen is:

1) We need to have better red zone efficiency. When teams know our only true red zone weapon is Andre Brown, they can sell out vs the run and stop us.
2) We need to stop the run ourselves, at the line. Especially when it comes to those option teams, you have to punish the QB no matter whether he keeps the ball or not, since even if he dumps off the ball to the RB, he is still used as a blocker, and isn't subject to the rules protecting the QB from hits at that point. Constant punishment of the option is the only way to shut it down for good.

Rudyy
06-27-2013, 09:55 AM
Everyone needs to step up. The offense couldn't score touchdowns, and the defense couldn't do anything.

Moke
06-27-2013, 09:55 AM
I just feel like the defensive could be better on paper if the offense didn't stop turning the ball over on downs often.

Gimaniac
06-27-2013, 10:05 AM
Offense looks good at the skills positions. OLine has been improved through the draft.

D has JPP coming off surgery, Tuck/CToast on the decline. Osi gone. Seems like Fewell will play the vets regardless of how bad they play.

I would say defense, but you still have to play the game to find out.

GameTime
06-27-2013, 10:06 AM
Everyone needs to step up. .

this^^^^^

egyptian420
06-27-2013, 10:48 AM
I picked defense in the poll but as many have already suggested, our offense punted too many times and we couldn't score TDs so our offense definitely needs to improve as well.

giantscolombia
06-27-2013, 10:58 AM
The offense IMO.

We really need to convert more. I feel like we had way too many punts last year.

HAHAHAHAH you're sig dude! hahaha

I'm going to have to go with the Defense on this one.

Not too many forced punts...

Moke
06-27-2013, 11:01 AM
HAHAHAHAH you're sig dude! hahaha

I'm going to have to go with the Defense on this one.

Not too many forced punts...

:p

giantsfan420
06-27-2013, 11:08 AM
i said offense too moke. but for diff reasons. i think if we're gonna get to the SB, this yr is gonna be like 2011, where the offense is buying the defense the time to step up their game by the post season. in the playoffs, all phases of the game need to contribute really, but in order for this team to get to the playoffs, i can def. see the offense needing to carry the defense esp if the defense is anything like last yrs.

GameTime
06-27-2013, 11:31 AM
i said offense too moke. but for diff reasons. i think if we're gonna get to the SB, this yr is gonna be like 2011, where the offense is buying the defense the time to step up their game by the post season. in the playoffs, all phases of the game need to contribute really, but in order for this team to get to the playoffs, i can def. see the offense needing to carry the defense esp if the defense is anything like last yrs.
If the defense is anything like last years they aint making the SB....same can be said for the O..
Has to be a collective step all the way around....coaching too

ryan12
06-27-2013, 12:55 PM
i voted for defense if they play with some balls and learn how to tackle and play with some heart the rest will fall into place

Buddy333
06-27-2013, 01:27 PM
Both played inconsistent last year.

Gmen2005
06-27-2013, 02:30 PM
I wish I could vote for health.

BJacobs aka The Problem
06-27-2013, 02:35 PM
Looks like the majority are choosing Defense and I think I'm going to have to agree. I guess it's because I grew up watching a great D that I feel as though if the Giants are going to get back, the D is going to have to be more consistent and play better.

I believe it's the reason the Giants won the SB the last two times they were there. Yeah Eli played lights friggen out, but man the defense shut it down. They manhandled high powered offenses on the road to the championship and shut down one of the most prolific offenses in NFL history.

So if the Giants are going to get back, the D is going to need to rise up to the occasion.

Gimaniac
06-27-2013, 03:14 PM
Both played inconsistent last year. True, but in terms of points scored and points allowed, the offense ranked higher than the defense last year. The offense was actually ranked 6th in points scored. I would sign for that today.

EliDaMANning
06-27-2013, 03:27 PM
Coaching and offensive line need to step up. DD needs to step down.

Buddy333
06-27-2013, 03:50 PM
True, but in terms of points scored and points allowed, the offense ranked higher than the defense last year. The offense was actually ranked 6th in points scored. I would sign for that today.Again, consistency. The offense failed to score more than 20 points 7 times last year and it would have been 8 had it not bed. For the defense in another. The offense is better than the defense, but they where both inconsistent.

FishinTheSalt
06-27-2013, 03:59 PM
Coaching should be added to the poll (and this isn't an attack on any coach). While I don't think it will surpass the defense in the poll, great coaches can elevate the play of the team above individual performances. We've proved you don't need to have the best defense to win the big game, nor do we need to have a game winning drive to win every game. So, to get back to what it takes to get back to the sb? Improvement everywhere and anywhere we can.

slipknottin
06-27-2013, 04:23 PM
Giants were 13th in the league last year at TD conversions in the redzone.

Thats not a significant problem, though you always want to improve there.


12th in scoring defense, 5th in scoring offense.



If you just look at a normal regression due to scoring difference, giants if they play exactly the same as they did last year should win two additional games.


Also, some people were complaining about how the offense starts games slowly, the giants had the 3rd ranked first quarter offense in the league. 3rd in the 2nd quarter as well, and 9th in the 4th. The quarter they struggle most offensively is the 3rd, where they were 17th.

The defense on the other hand starts terribly. 26th in the league in the first quarter. 16th in the 2nd, 24th in the 3rd, and 4th in the 4th.

It seems like the giants defense has trouble understanding what an offense is doing, and take about a full quarter to figure it out, then as the opposing team makes adjustments at halftime, the giants defense struggles again for a full quarter.

JesseJames
06-27-2013, 04:38 PM
we have to stop settling for field goals when we get in the red zone.

Ruttiger711
06-27-2013, 04:50 PM
Giants were 13th in the league last year at TD conversions in the redzone.

Thats not a significant problem, though you always want to improve there.


12th in scoring defense, 5th in scoring offense.



If you just look at a normal regression due to scoring difference, giants if they play exactly the same as they did last year should win two additional games.


Also, some people were complaining about how the offense starts games slowly, the giants had the 3rd ranked first quarter offense in the league. 3rd in the 2nd quarter as well, and 9th in the 4th. The quarter they struggle most offensively is the 3rd, where they were 17th.

The defense on the other hand starts terribly. 26th in the league in the first quarter. 16th in the 2nd, 24th in the 3rd, and 4th in the 4th.

It seems like the giants defense has trouble understanding what an offense is doing, and take about a full quarter to figure it out, then as the opposing team makes adjustments at halftime, the giants defense struggles again for a full quarter.

Interesting info -

I have always held firm that the D is tired at the end of the games not because of 3 and outs by the Offense (not that they help), but primarily because of how they open games. I cant count how many times they would open with letting up 10 - 12+ play drives on the first 2 or so drives.

Gimaniac
06-27-2013, 06:14 PM
Again, consistency. The offense failed to score more than 20 points 7 times last year and it would have been 8 had it not bed. For the defense in another. The offense is better than the defense, but they where both inconsistent.

You could say the same about the Ravens.

No offense is consistent. Peaks and valleys are a part of the game.

Buddy333
06-27-2013, 06:40 PM
Not saying they won't have a bad day but half the season?

speedman
06-27-2013, 07:07 PM
Both played inconsistent last year.The defense was worse.

giantsfan420
06-27-2013, 07:14 PM
The defense was worse.while that may be true, i dunno if it really matters. in a sport where 2nd place is the 1rst loser, i could care less what makes up the reasons for the lack of success. we didnt get it done. while I'd agree, the defense was worse, both units struggled badly at times, and both will need to improve over the long haul if we're actually gonna watch a home SB.

Buddy333
06-27-2013, 07:25 PM
The defense was worse.Eh, maybe. Either way, they where both bad.

jomo
06-27-2013, 07:34 PM
O & D. ST were OK.

I am in minimalist mode.

RolleN N CruzN
06-27-2013, 07:36 PM
When we won our last SB, the offense converted in key 3rd down situations every time. It seemed like Eli was clutch every time on 3rd down. The NFL is all about offense. New England proved that you can make it to the Superbowl without an elite defense. It's about the offense to me.

giantsfan420
06-27-2013, 07:38 PM
When we won our last SB, the offense converted in key 3rd down situations every time. It seemed like Eli was clutch every time on 3rd down. The NFL is all about offense. New England proved that you can make it to the Superbowl without an elite defense. It's about the offense to me.yeah but we proved that it takes more than an offense to win the SB as both SB 42 and 46 are Defense played excellent and was the difference bc as u said, NE had a great offense and we had a great offense. there d couldnt reach the level our D could, and hence, we won.

RolleN N CruzN
06-27-2013, 07:56 PM
yeah but we proved that it takes more than an offense to win the SB as both SB 42 and 46 are Defense played excellent and was the difference bc as u said, NE had a great offense and we had a great offense. there d couldnt reach the level our D could, and hence, we won.

Good point. We also proved this against GB. I'll never forget that brilliant draw to Bradshaw to close the first half. Pure brilliance and total lack of defense.

Gimaniac
06-27-2013, 08:13 PM
Not saying they won't have a bad day but half the season?

The Ravens pulled it off and their offense was just as inconsistent. Their defense stepped it up. Our defense stepped out.

I actually expect the offense to be better this year. Not having Nicks last year really hurt, no one else was capable of filling that void. I think we could return to 2011 form with Nicks back and Randle ready to play the Manningham role.

I have low expectations for our defense this year. JPP is coming off surgery. Osi gone. Tuck/CWeb aging. Herzlich is new MLB. Nobody can cover but Prince who has never stayed healthy. Our defense might actually be worse than last year.

ironfox
06-27-2013, 08:20 PM
It's gotta be the defense. This offense seems poised to be one of the best in the NFL but they cant be expected to put up 30+ points a game to keep us in a game week in and week out

giantsfan420
06-27-2013, 09:46 PM
Good point. We also proved this against GB. I'll never forget that brilliant draw to Bradshaw to close the first half. Pure brilliance and total lack of defense.thanks. but your point is just as valid if not more so, the NFL has shifted towards a passing league. I dont believe the D needs to be AS good as our Offense, but I do feel that they do need to play better than last yr, much better in fact.

Rudyy
06-27-2013, 09:50 PM
It's gotta be the defense. This offense seems poised to be one of the best in the NFL but they cant be expected to put up 30+ points a game to keep us in a game week in and week out+1

Buddy333
06-27-2013, 09:55 PM
The Ravens pulled it off and their offense was just as inconsistent. Their defense stepped it up. Our defense stepped out.I actually expect the offense to be better this year. Not having Nicks last year really hurt, no one else was capable of filling that void. I think we could return to 2011 form with Nicks back and Randle ready to play the Manningham role. I have low expectations for our defense this year. JPP is coming off surgery. Osi gone. Tuck/CWeb aging. Herzlich is new MLB. Nobody can cover but Prince who has never stayed healthy. Our defense might actually be worse than last year.Does it really make it better? The fact is this offense was very inconsistent as as much a problem as the defense. They did have their injury issues and Eli was not as good as the year before. Those things can be corrected though. However, they lost a great blocking RB and TE. Add to that they have some aging OL's coming off injuries. The defense may be very bad this year. They will miss KP. Not sure if Webster is going to have a rebound season at this point in his career.

Buddy333
06-27-2013, 10:01 PM
It's gotta be the defense. This offense seems poised to be one of the best in the NFL but they cant be expected to put up 30+ points a game to keep us in a game week in and week outThe odds are the defense won't be very good this year. The offense failed to score more than 20 points 7 times last year and almost made it 8 if it wasn't for the defense forcing so many TO's. Also, don't buy that we shouldn't expect 30 points a game from an offense that is supposed to be so good. They need to worry about blocking, but if they do, 30 points should not be considered to much.

miked1958
06-27-2013, 11:38 PM
we have to stop settling for field goals when we get in the red zone.yea that was a huge problem.. Which is why I don't know how they didn't insert Barden in those situations and use his height to convert more TDs. He proved in those few game s he started he can catch the ball

miked1958
06-27-2013, 11:39 PM
Based off the poll it seems most feel the defense needs to improve. They allowed way to many yards last season. I think they were second to last on yards allowed per game at around 384 and overall yards allowed which was over 4000 they were like 4th or 5th from bottom. Not good

GiantRoc
06-28-2013, 12:03 AM
:p.

Moke. What does R.I.P. mean? Rot In Prison???

Gimaniac
06-28-2013, 06:59 AM
Does it really make it better? No, I'm just trying to have realistic expectations. 30 point a game would be great, but it ain't gonna happen. The offense runs through Eli, who has never been consistent during the season. It is what it is. However, if we can get into the playoffs, he is capable of outperforming the best of the best.

speedman
06-28-2013, 07:25 AM
Eh, maybe. Either way, they where both bad.The offense didn't play well last year. I think because the coaches kept Nicks on the field when he wasn't healthy. If the defense can get the other team off the field instead of bend but don't break it gives the offense more chances.

Buddy333
06-28-2013, 07:29 AM
The offense failed on their own last year. Their problems are more easily fixed than the defense though.

Buddy333
06-28-2013, 07:31 AM
No, I'm just trying to have realistic expectations. 30 point a game would be great, but it ain't gonna happen. The offense runs through Eli, who has never been consistent during the season. It is what it is. However, if we can get into the playoffs, he is capable of outperforming the best of the best.Eh, the year before he was pretty consistent and they still need the defense in the playoffs.

speedman
06-28-2013, 07:35 AM
The offense failed on their own last year. Their problems are more easily fixed than the defense though.The offense ranked 10th last year defense 31st. A 3 and out with a punt is better than letting them drive the field and then get a turnover. It gives the offense more chances. Tell me what I'm missing.

speedman
06-28-2013, 07:39 AM
Eh, the year before he was pretty consistent and they still need the defense in the playoffs.Doesn't that prove the point that the defense needs to play better?

Imgrate
06-28-2013, 07:45 AM
The offense ranked 10th last year defense 31st. A 3 and out with a punt is better than letting them drive the field and then get a turnover. It gives the offense more chances. Tell me what I'm missing.Not true. Turnovers swing momentum. Additionally, the w-l numbers are staggering with regards to turnover differentials.

Buddy333
06-28-2013, 08:02 AM
Doesn't that prove the point that the defense needs to play better?As does the offense.

EliDaMANning
06-28-2013, 08:10 AM
As does the offense.That's fine but the defense is a weaker link.

Buddy333
06-28-2013, 08:32 AM
Both sides where responsible last year. Not one side bailed the other out. Now this year the defense could be bad so yes the offense does need o be better. Much better.

BJacobs aka The Problem
06-28-2013, 09:11 AM
Based off the poll it seems most feel the defense needs to improve. They allowed way to many yards last season. I think they were second to last on yards allowed per game at around 384 and overall yards allowed which was over 4000 they were like 4th or 5th from bottom. Not good

The biggest issue with the defense last year wasn't just the yards allowed. I don't care if you give up a million yards, if you're not letting the opposition score. The problem was the fact that the defense couldn't get off the field on 3rd down. The Giants were the tied for 2nd worst with a 42% 3rd Down pct. The worst part of that is the fact that they only had 198 3rd down attempts which was the 2nd least in the league.

Their amount of plays they seen and the amount of first downs they gave up were middle of the road. It just seems as though the key is getting off the field on 3rd down.

JesseJames
06-28-2013, 10:32 AM
yea that was a huge problem.. Which is why I don't know how they didn't insert Barden in those situations and use his height to convert more TDs. He proved in those few game s he started he can catch the ball I think Barden would have gotten a lot more playing time but he committed that pass interference against that defender and was benched and never saw much playing time after that..

speedman
06-28-2013, 12:20 PM
That's fine but the defense is a weaker link.You'll never get him to see that. He has some kind of axe to grind against the offense.

miked1958
06-28-2013, 04:58 PM
I think Barden would have gotten a lot more playing time but he committed that pass interference against that defender and was benched and never saw much playing time after that..yea but that was just plain dumb on the coaches part. They put Barden in that position by making Eli throw that deep ball when all they needed was 5/10 yards to win the game. Barden did what he had to to make sipper ball wasnt picked off. Also benching him was stupid especially when they continually struggled in the red zone. Why not put him in game for those close to goal line crucial plays. Put the ball up in the air where only he can get it. Seems like a no brainer. The big knock on Barden was that he couldn't get separation. You don't need to get separation in the back of the endzone. Just out jump the DB

miked1958
06-28-2013, 05:00 PM
The biggest issue with the defense last year wasn't just the yards allowed. I don't care if you give up a million yards, if you're not letting the opposition score. The problem was the fact that the defense couldn't get off the field on 3rd down. The Giants were the tied for 2nd worst with a 42% 3rd Down pct. The worst part of that is the fact that they only had 198 3rd down attempts which was the 2nd least in the league. Their amount of plays they seen and the amount of first downs they gave up were middle of the road. It just seems as though the key is getting off the field on 3rd down.i agree. They were not horrible in points allowed but if you continue to allow teams to convert 3rd downs you eventually wind up losing some games

slipknottin
06-28-2013, 05:12 PM
yea that was a huge problem.. Which is why I don't know how they didn't insert Barden in those situations and use his height to convert more TDs. He proved in those few game s he started he can catch the ball

Because height is completely meaningless if you have no ability to high point the ball and secure it. Barden wins on one route, the slant. Because he can shield defenders with his size.

Barden offers absolutely nothing in the endzone that the other receivers arent better at. Randle and Nicks in particular are much much better red zone receivers with their ability to leap, their physical style, and stronger hands.

miked1958
06-28-2013, 05:39 PM
Because height is completely meaningless if you have no ability to high point the ball and secure it. Barden wins on one route, the slant. Because he can shield defenders with his size. Barden offers absolutely nothing in the endzone that the other receivers arent better at. Randle and Nicks in particular are much much better red zone receivers with their ability to leap, their physical style, and stronger hands.id still get him out there on those type plays if only for a decoy

giantsfan420
06-28-2013, 05:45 PM
The biggest issue with the defense last year wasn't just the yards allowed. I don't care if you give up a million yards, if you're not letting the opposition score. The problem was the fact that the defense couldn't get off the field on 3rd down. The Giants were the tied for 2nd worst with a 42% 3rd Down pct. The worst part of that is the fact that they only had 198 3rd down attempts which was the 2nd least in the league.

Their amount of plays they seen and the amount of first downs they gave up were middle of the road. It just seems as though the key is getting off the field on 3rd down.great post man well said.

i've been talking about this exact point for sometime. you had the actual #s which I thank you for as well.

I should be able to count how many times we gave up 3rd and 15(maybe 20) or more on one hand, with 4 or 5 fingers remaining lol.
We musta given a few up per game. we almost lost the dallas game on that play to dez bc the situation was almost the same mentally as a 3rd and forever. Same thing vs TB. We gave up a couple 3rd and 25s, and like a 3rd and 40 which V.Jackson scored a TD on lmfao...we were absolutely TERRIBLE on 3rd downs...it was either, get a turnover or concede points really.

GameTime
06-28-2013, 06:27 PM
id still get him out there on those type plays if only for a decoy
he'd be no more of a decoy then any other receiver they have in the formation...

I liked Barden but I think by now he just doesnt have what it takes. IMO he doesnt even make it through camp.

giantsfan420
06-28-2013, 08:32 PM
you def may be right gametime. im just holding out hope against the odds something finally clicks. but i think im just like that with basically any giants player that hasnt broken out yet lol...it'd be great if Barden did suddenly become this threat like plax was in his prime.

ShakeandBake
06-28-2013, 08:34 PM
he'd be no more of a decoy then any other receiver they have in the formation...

I liked Barden but I think by now he just doesnt have what it takes. IMO he doesnt even make it through camp.

Agreed. He won't make it to the final 53 unless there are injuries

slipknottin
06-29-2013, 02:01 AM
id still get him out there on those type plays if only for a decoy

Teams are far more worried about good receivers like Nicks or Randle in the end zone than they are worried about a guy like Barden that is only capable of running slants