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JJC7301
07-01-2013, 04:00 PM
It's something that's obvious and sorely lacking. I'm getting pretty tired of hearing about "flicking the switch" every year...

TUCK: [We have] to kind of get away from that and approach the game in a way that those '80s teams did with [Lawrence Taylor] and all those guys. They went out into a game trying to kill an offense and not give them anything, Tuck continued. We have to get back to that on defense. I dont care if our offense puts up 40 points a game. We have to put up six.

IMO, if the D doesn't produce this year, then it's time for at least a new DC and probably a major overhaul of that unit.


http://espn.go.com/blog/nfceast/post/_/id/52518/is-giants-defense-still-capable-of-carrying

Buddy333
07-01-2013, 04:02 PM
This shold be good.

Eliscruzzz
07-01-2013, 04:03 PM
I agree but....I don't think you can play like the 80's anymore cause the passing game is so deadly now.

I do think we need to blitz a little more to give our front four help sometimes.

Eliscruzzz
07-01-2013, 04:04 PM
Last year I don't think we could've done that cause of all the injuries in the secondary.

RoanokeFan
07-01-2013, 04:04 PM
The Giants need to win 12 games in 2013 and the Super Bowl in 2014.

Refer to my sig....

JJC7301
07-01-2013, 04:09 PM
I agree but....I don't think you can play like the 80's anymore cause the passing game is so deadly now.

I do think we need to blitz a little more to give our front four help sometimes.

The D may just not have the talent that we had all thought, or hoped, existed, but there's just something in this unit's language, body language, and stated mentality that just screams "not tough" to me. They just don't carry themselves a certain way. If the D of the '80s lost some of these games and gave up big yardage like this modern unit does, they'd be mad at themselves and clawing to get back onto the field the following week to make someone pay. They wouldn't be talking about resting on the shoulders of the O.

I like Tuck, but they need some players with the "your not going to get anything on us" mental attitude. Tuck talks a good game, but...

RoanokeFan
07-01-2013, 04:10 PM
I agree but....I don't think you can play like the 80's anymore cause the passing game is so deadly now.

I do think we need to blitz a little more to give our front four help sometimes.

I'm guessing he means the intensity of the 80's.

Eliscruzzz
07-01-2013, 04:12 PM
The D may just not have the talent that we had all thought, or hoped, existed, but there's just something in this unit's language, body language, and stated mentality that just screams "not tough" to me. They just don't carry themselves a certain way. If the D of the '80s lost some of these games and gave up big yardage like this modern unit does, they'd be mad at themselves and clawing to get back onto the field the following week to make someone pay. They wouldn't be talking about resting on the shoulders of the O.

I like Tuck, but they need some players with the "your not going to get anything on us" mental attitude. Tuck talks a good game, but...I think most of us feel that way cause these guys either have a sb ring or have 2.

Now it's like they just go through the motions. It's almost like the play like they are to cool. Even in 2011 they were bad until the playoffs started. Every game it seem like the waited till the were losing to turn up their defense. They tried to do the same this year and it bit them in their, you know what.

Eliscruzzz
07-01-2013, 04:18 PM
I'm guessing he means the intensity of the 80's.I don't even think you can play with that intensity now. You can't even touch the quarterbacks.You can make the big hit that sets the tone for a defense. You can't lay a hair on a wr anymore.

It's funny that this is coming from a guy like Tuck to who set the tone last year saying "that it sucks playing RG3 and running quarterbacks" If they want to play with more intensity then they can start by not having the captain praising a rookie quarterback.

RoanokeFan
07-01-2013, 04:19 PM
I don't even think you can play with that intensity now. You can't even touch the quarterbacks.You can make the big hit that sets the tone for a defense. You can't lay a hair on a wr anymore.

It funny that it's coming from a guy like Tuck to who set the tone last year saying "that it sucks playing RG3 and running quarterbacks" If they want to play with more intensity then they can start by not having the captain praising a rookie quarterback.

Playing with heart and determination

giantscolombia
07-01-2013, 04:22 PM
It's something that's obvious and sorely lacking. I'm getting pretty tired of hearing about "flicking the switch" every year...

TUCK: “[We have] to kind of get away from that and approach the game in a way that those '80’s teams did with [Lawrence Taylor] and all those guys. They went out into a game trying to kill an offense and not give them anything,” Tuck continued. “We have to get back to that on defense. I don’t care if our offense puts up 40 points a game. We have to put up six.”

IMO, if the D doesn't produce this year, then it's time for at least a new DC and probably a major overhaul of that unit.


http://espn.go.com/blog/nfceast/post/_/id/52518/is-giants-defense-still-capable-of-carrying

YES!

Eliscruzzz
07-01-2013, 04:23 PM
Playing with heart and determinationyeah your probably right. That's pretty sad if this team has to play with more of both those things.

RoanokeFan
07-01-2013, 04:25 PM
yeah your probably right. That's pretty sad if this team has to play with more of both those things.

It's not sad if they do it :) You can't rely on those two rings and expect that to get you a third or fourth. You have to EARN them by playing every game as though it matters, because every game does matter.

speedman
07-01-2013, 04:26 PM
Playing with heart and determinationI think it's the scheme. They're a bunch of ******* since Fewell became DC.

JJC7301
07-01-2013, 04:33 PM
It's not sad if they do it :) You can't rely on those two rings and expect that to get you a third or fourth. You have to EARN them by playing every game as though it matters, because every game does matter.

+1. I miss having a D in which I can laugh as the opposing O tries and fails to complete 1st downs. :(

RoanokeFan
07-01-2013, 04:33 PM
I think it's the scheme. They're a bunch of ******* since Fewell became DC.

I'm not so sure all the blame falls to Fewell.

Eliscruzzz
07-01-2013, 04:39 PM
I'm not so sure all the blame falls to Fewell.+1

RoanokeFan
07-01-2013, 04:40 PM
+1. I miss having a D in which I can laugh as the opposing O tries and fails to complete 1st downs. :(

Those were the days

speedman
07-01-2013, 04:42 PM
I'm not so sure all the blame falls to Fewell.Most of the time they look like they don't know where they're supposed to be on the field.

RoanokeFan
07-01-2013, 04:45 PM
Most of the time they look like they don't know where they're supposed to be on the field.

Hopefully, they will know this season. By most accounts, we run a very complicated playbook.

KidA
07-01-2013, 06:40 PM
I know the Giants don't like to live in the past, but I wonder if we've had any talks with Spagnuolo since his departure. Those boys on defense loved to play for him and it showed.

Eliscruzzz
07-01-2013, 06:41 PM
I know the Giants don't like to live in the past, but I wonder if we've had any talks with Spagnuolo since his departure. Those boys on defense loved to play for him and it showed.Spags is working with the Ravens now I think...

RoanokeFan
07-01-2013, 06:44 PM
I know the Giants don't like to live in the past, but I wonder if we've had any talks with Spagnuolo since his departure. Those boys on defense loved to play for him and it showed.

I am thinking the players may have made Spags what he was here. He has not been able to duplicate his success since he left.

GameTime
07-01-2013, 07:22 PM
I don't even think you can play with that intensity now. You can't even touch the quarterbacks.You can make the big hit that sets the tone for a defense. You can't lay a hair on a wr anymore.

It's funny that this is coming from a guy like Tuck to who set the tone last year saying "that it sucks playing RG3 and running quarterbacks" If they want to play with more intensity then they can start by not having the captain praising a rookie quarterback.
yet you see huge hit after huge hit on the highlights every week......
Playing with high intensity is a possible now as it was back then...

speedman
07-01-2013, 07:31 PM
I am thinking the players may have made Spags what he was here. He has not been able to duplicate his success since he left. I think they made each other. Spags had an agressive system that the players believed in and it played to their strengths.

giantsacks
07-01-2013, 07:45 PM
Toughness and angry players =aggressive defense

theGateKeeper
07-01-2013, 07:52 PM
"We gotta play like a pack of crazed dogs"...............That was how best to describe the 80's defense.

talbot
07-01-2013, 07:56 PM
They gotta give em the D

BigBlueAllDay
07-01-2013, 07:58 PM
or the mindset of the 2007 defense that he was on with the great pass rush.

Eliscruzzz
07-01-2013, 08:01 PM
yet you see huge hit after huge hit on the highlights every week......
Playing with high intensity is a possible now as it was back then...Usually when you see a hit like in the 80's it followed by a fine..which makes the player play with less intensity. Only play I seen that was a hard hit was the pollard hit on Stephen Ridley.

joemorrisforprez
07-01-2013, 10:59 PM
It's good to see how much respect Tuck has for the 1980's teams.

But if someone on the GMB posted something similar to what Tuck is saying, the resident "experts" would tell him to stop living in the past, the game has changed, those old guys couldn't play anymore in this league, linebackers aren't important, blah, blah, blah, blah.

jomo
07-01-2013, 11:17 PM
JT needs to focus on getting ready an earning his salary and forget about proclamations. Talk is cheap. Play the games.
Who is advising JT these days?
Whoever that is needs to understand that his boy JT was terrible last year and earned only about 40% of his salary. Why would he think that we would all be pumped up about these general statements that have nothing to do with productivity on the field. Get in the weight room JT and then get in the film room and stop talking stuff to reporters. I don't care at all about what you say. I only care about what you do. Maybe it's just me.

giantsfan420
07-02-2013, 12:13 AM
I think they made each other. Spags had an agressive system that the players believed in and it played to their strengths.true. and dont forget, spags defense had its ups n downs that first yr too. the D was on pace to be the worst NYG D of all time by a mile long margin the first 3 games. we were up n down until late in the season when everyone bought in. very similar to the 2011 run. But we did have that 2008 Defensive performance that was top 5 iirc. similar to how PF had a top 10 D his first year here.

i'd like it if we could just have consistency, well consistently good play to be specific. the d has been consistent the past 2 yrs, consistently terrible.

giantsfan420
07-02-2013, 12:16 AM
aand the post about Tucks antics revolving around RGKnee in relation to his comments about intensity was well made imo. Tuck seems like he has multiple personality disorder sometimes, either that or he's bipolar. last yr his heart wasnt in it, he was afraid to play rgknee by his own admission, the football gods were cruel by givin the redskins rgknee yada yada yada...

i think it was remember the titans that made a great point involving team sports; attitude reflects leadership, captain. and the team attitude hasnt been great defensively. a lot of questioning and at times even finger pointing. confusion. lack of heart at times...these are all things tucks play has demonstrated. im not saying i hate tuck or dislike tuck or dont even respect tuck. im saying, talk is cheap and if u want the D to play with intensity, you should bring it play after play and hope ur mentality trickles down to the rest of the team.

GameTime
07-02-2013, 08:01 AM
Usually when you see a hit like in the 80's it followed by a fine..which makes the player play with less intensity. Only play I seen that was a hard hit was the pollard hit on Stephen Ridley.
I dissagree.......players are still kicking each other's asses.

GameTime
07-02-2013, 08:04 AM
JT needs to focus on getting ready an earning his salary and forget about proclamations. Talk is cheap. Play the games.
Who is advising JT these days?
Whoever that is needs to understand that his boy JT was terrible last year and earned only about 40% of his salary. Why would he think that we would all be pumped up about these general statements that have nothing to do with productivity on the field. Get in the weight room JT and then get in the film room and stop talking stuff to reporters. I don't care at all about what you say. I only care about what you do. Maybe it's just me.
not just you but you are over reacting IMO. Most of what Tuck has said has been totally benign and he was at some charity event while being questioned by reproters. Not like he is holding press conferences. And believe me....he knows he played poorly.

nhpgiantsfan
07-02-2013, 08:16 AM
There's one difference between this defense and the '80s defense...... TALENT

egyptian420
07-02-2013, 08:21 AM
JT needs to focus on getting ready an earning his salary and forget about proclamations. Talk is cheap. Play the games.
Who is advising JT these days?
Whoever that is needs to understand that his boy JT was terrible last year and earned only about 40% of his salary. Why would he think that we would all be pumped up about these general statements that have nothing to do with productivity on the field. Get in the weight room JT and then get in the film room and stop talking stuff to reporters. I don't care at all about what you say. I only care about what you do. Maybe it's just me.I don't think Tuck is at all content with how he played last year but like it or not, he is still the leader of this defense and he has to talk like it.

He knows as we all do that if he doesn't play better not only will he lose his duties as the leader but he will also lose his starting job.

giantscolombia
07-02-2013, 08:46 AM
With all this talk Tuck is doing during the offseason he BETTER show up! if not he is going to look down-right foolish!

Mercury
07-02-2013, 09:13 AM
JT needs to focus on getting ready an earning his salary and forget about proclamations. Talk is cheap. Play the games.
Who is advising JT these days?
Whoever that is needs to understand that his boy JT was terrible last year and earned only about 40% of his salary. Why would he think that we would all be pumped up about these general statements that have nothing to do with productivity on the field. Get in the weight room JT and then get in the film room and stop talking stuff to reporters. I don't care at all about what you say. I only care about what you do. Maybe it's just me.

I agree with you to a large degree and somewhat in spirit. However, keep in mind, even more than the other players, as the captain of the defense, Tuck get asked a lot of questions by reporters. He does have an obligation to answer their questions. Tuck is considered one of the faces of this franchise. When he responds to them with any tidbit they can make a story out of, (which doesn't take much), they are the one's writing it up. That largely puts him in no position "to shut up and play the game."

He's in a contract year. He supposedly is training hard (in the weight room) for the upcoming season. And he can't actually play until the preseason/season starts. So, try to be a bit more patient with Tuck.

Eliscruzzz
07-02-2013, 09:18 AM
I dissagree.......players are still kicking each other's asses.If your talking about in the trenches yeah, but wr are not afraid to go over the middle anymore. You only see the quarterback get nailed once in a while and now you have a rule were rb's cannot truck anyone. It does make player hesitant on how much aggression they play with.The closest thing to an 80's player is Suh.

YATittle1962
07-02-2013, 09:19 AM
I love this attitude by Tuck

crazed dogs right?........now stop talking about it and go do it

I've never seen one of these guys yelling from the sideline ..."...you better hope I don't get back in there I'll kick your ****ing *** !!!"......like LT

I sit right behind the Giants bench every sunday and I cannot tell you how angering it can be to see the defense get embarrassed then come to the side line and lightly chat with each other and laugh on the bench not even discussing the game.

this did not happen in the old days....those guys were standing as close to the field as they could get ready to rip someones head off pacing back and forth slapping themselves on the head .......but only after Belichick had them in a huddle while he drew upsidedown on a white board .

I'd love to see that old attitude out of these comfortable millionaires

TheAnalyst
07-02-2013, 09:33 AM
Tuck needs to play with the intensity he had a few years ago if he wants to be the leader and push the kids (JPP, MOORE, OJOMO, TRACY ect.)

B&RWarrior
07-02-2013, 09:40 AM
It's something that's obvious and sorely lacking. I'm getting pretty tired of hearing about "flicking the switch" every year...

TUCK: “[We have] to kind of get away from that and approach the game in a way that those '80’s teams did with [Lawrence Taylor] and all those guys. They went out into a game trying to kill an offense and not give them anything,” Tuck continued. “We have to get back to that on defense. I don’t care if our offense puts up 40 points a game. We have to put up six.”

IMO, if the D doesn't produce this year, then it's time for at least a new DC and probably a major overhaul of that unit.


http://espn.go.com/blog/nfceast/post/_/id/52518/is-giants-defense-still-capable-of-carrying

There is a dearth of talent at LB and only one-JWill- has potential to excel in coverage. The truth be told he has shown good athleticism and ability to cover but is lacking in instinct.

Our secondary because C-Web is a question mark and Hosely is learning, but he looked bad. Stevie Brown made a lot of picks and made a lot of mistakes as well. Prince looks for real.

At Dline even JPP may miss a good portion of the season, which I prefer as long as he heals properly. Kiwi is a downgrade from JPP, but still pretty good in his own right. Tuck is an unknown after the last 2 seasons. The DTs have been overhauled and Joseph should have something to prove after last season.

Moore, Tracy, and Ojomo, Taylor, and Hankins, will experience growing pains having never received any significant time before this year.

My point is that if things go wrong it wouldn't be a shock, but I couldn't put it solely at the feet of the DC. These are the question marks that we know about going in to camp before any injuries occur.

giantsfan420
07-02-2013, 10:37 AM
I love this attitude by Tuck

crazed dogs right?........now stop talking about it and go do it

I've never seen one of these guys yelling from the sideline ..."...you better hope I don't get back in there I'll kick your ****ing *** !!!"......like LT

I sit right behind the Giants bench every sunday and I cannot tell you how angering it can be to see the defense get embarrassed then come to the side line and lightly chat with each other and laugh on the bench not even discussing the game.

this did not happen in the old days....those guys were standing as close to the field as they could get ready to rip someones head off pacing back and forth slapping themselves on the head .......but only after Belichick had them in a huddle while he drew upsidedown on a white board .

I'd love to see that old attitude out of these comfortable millionairesclassic post YA. I'd feel much better about our D if they cut that weak ish on the sidelines as well. they get lit up, out physicaled, and on the sideline it looks like a taping of The View or something. Get angry, get up, and look to beat the **** out of the Offense. Id bet anythin the D improves a couple notches based on that mentality alone

JesseJames
07-02-2013, 10:38 AM
I wonder where Tuck's mindset was for the last 2 years....

JJC7301
07-02-2013, 10:53 AM
I've never seen one of these guys yelling from the sideline ..."...you better hope I don't get back in there I'll kick your ****ing *** !!!"......like LT



+1. Probably my favorite football quote of all time.

JJC7301
07-02-2013, 10:57 AM
There is a dearth of talent at LB and only one-JWill- has potential to excel in coverage. The truth be told he has shown good athleticism and ability to cover but is lacking in instinct.

Our secondary because C-Web is a question mark and Hosely is learning, but he looked bad. Stevie Brown made a lot of picks and made a lot of mistakes as well. Prince looks for real.

At Dline even JPP may miss a good portion of the season, which I prefer as long as he heals properly. Kiwi is a downgrade from JPP, but still pretty good in his own right. Tuck is an unknown after the last 2 seasons. The DTs have been overhauled and Joseph should have something to prove after last season.

Moore, Tracy, and Ojomo, Taylor, and Hankins, will experience growing pains having never received any significant time before this year.

My point is that if things go wrong it wouldn't be a shock, but I couldn't put it solely at the feet of the DC. These are the question marks that we know about going in to camp before any injuries occur.
There may actually be a dearth of talent on this entire D, not just the LB corp, and it may finally be fully exposed this year.

There's also been a mindset on this team going back to at least SB 42 that they can "flip a switch" and everything's going to be okay. And it did happen leading up to SB 46, I grant that. But why should it take a switch? Why can't that desire be there every single week? I think that it says a lot about the character of this D.

Tuck's not the first one to bring this up, so my question is: if you know what the problem is (and it's just mental, apparently), then why is it so hard to cure? It may take new blood (lot's, like a blood transfusion) to get the D to be amped up every game.

B&RWarrior
07-02-2013, 11:16 AM
There may actually be a dearth of talent on this entire D, not just the LB corp, and it may finally be fully exposed this year.

There's also been a mindset on this team going back to at least SB 42 that they can "flip a switch" and everything's going to be okay. And it did happen leading up to SB 46, I grant that. But why should it take a switch? Why can't that desire be there every single week? I think that it says a lot about the character of this D.

Tuck's not the first one to bring this up, so my question is: if you know what the problem is (and it's just mental, apparently), then why is it so hard to cure? It may take new blood (lot's, like a blood transfusion) to get the D to be amped up every game.

I share all of these sentiments. Some people believe the only thing that counts is the postseason, but that is pure malarkey. The reality is that 9 times out of ten you can't just switch it on. You have to play hard every time you go out there.

Kruunch
07-02-2013, 12:01 PM
It's something that's obvious and sorely lacking. I'm getting pretty tired of hearing about "flicking the switch" every year...

TUCK: [We have] to kind of get away from that and approach the game in a way that those '80s teams did with [Lawrence Taylor] and all those guys. They went out into a game trying to kill an offense and not give them anything, Tuck continued. We have to get back to that on defense. I dont care if our offense puts up 40 points a game. We have to put up six.

IMO, if the D doesn't produce this year, then it's time for at least a new DC and probably a major overhaul of that unit.


http://espn.go.com/blog/nfceast/post/_/id/52518/is-giants-defense-still-capable-of-carrying

Note sure Goodell would approve of crack and bounties.

Just a guess.