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Redeyejedi
11-09-2010, 05:14 PM
He hadnt struggled with Jones before. Before this game Jones had 10 targets , 3 catches. Yea, but now they are both juniors and are probably coming out this year. You have to count how they are playing now far more than how they played as freshmen or sophmores. And for a guy like Peterson with his speed slants should be easy for him to take away with proper technique. I dont think he moves to FS, not with his speed and hips. Hes too valuable at CB.It wont matter much anyway doubt Peterson ends up being a Giant, Maybe a Cowboy though. I think the Boys will go D-line

slipknottin
11-09-2010, 08:33 PM
It wont matter much anyway doubt Peterson ends up being a Giant, Maybe a Cowboy though. I think the Boys will go D-line

I wouldnt be surprised if they took Peterson at all. They need DBs badly. Im just not sure if they are willing to take a 3-4 DE that high in the draft, its not really a flashy pick like Jerry usually likes to make.

ibbill
11-09-2010, 08:38 PM
The Giants struggled running the ball in 2009 and were reportedly high on CJ Spiller. I am a big advocate of the Giants getting an elite pass catching* back* if he brings home run speed even better. Depending on what happens with Jacobs and Bradshaw will determine how high the Giants take a guy. If Brown or Ware doesnt emerge as a legitimate receiver the Giants could still take a guy that could catch the ball. I dont think the Giants will spend a first rounder so I will exclude the likes of Mark Ingram but if somebody wants 2 add him feel free. These guys are just some early favorites and guys I will be watching for early in the year</P>


*</P>


http://walterfootball.com/college/Oklahoma_logo.gifDemarco Murray 6-1* 215 -* I was high on Murray coming into the 2010 draft and he decided to return to school. Murray has been banged up and was projected as a 4th rounder so he wisely returned. Murray has a similar running style and build to that of Adrian Peterson and like Peterson has shown the tendency to get nicked up. Murray has a knack at getting open and finding space in the passing game and had 41 receptions in 2009. Some people have Murray projected as a first rounder but I dont believe he will go that high. His history of being nicked up makes him 2-3 round prospect. (2-3)</P>


http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=yfgrU7mTBeM</P>


http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=WtmtSS0vD34&feature=related</P>


http://walterfootball.com/college/WestVirginia_logo.gifNoel Devine 5-8* 175-I was shocked when Devine decided to return to school at first but seeing how Spiller was a projected 2nd rounder in 2008 returned and went in the top 10 im thinking Devine may be banking on the same thing. I dont think Devine will go in the top 10 but its quite possible he could go in the range that Chris Johnson did. With Mccluster*going at 36*Devine will mostly go at the end of round 1. So if the Giants return to the playoffs he may be right in there draft range. I*like Devine and think his break away speed*and play making ability*would make a huge impact on the Giants offense.Like Mccluster*Devine has proven to be durable and productive. Devine has had over 200 carries the last 2 years and managed a YPC over 6.0*.* The only difference is Devine comes with the *elite speed Mccluster doesnt.* (1-2)</P>


http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Jp9MuxAszEM</P>


http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=7OtxamhvOGE&feature=related</P>


*</P>


http://walterfootball.com/college/OregonState_logo.gifJacquiz*Rodgers* 5-7* 191-* Every year theres specific players I try to watch when I dont know a lot about them Rodgers will be one of them this year. Rodgers had an other worldly 78 receptions in 2009 to go along with his 273 carries. For a college player that is carrying the load on a whole other scale .Rodgers carry totals make me think he will be coming out in the 2011 draft that is just a lot of miles on his legs before he goes to the NFL. Rodgers*doesnt appear to have elite speed for that size so I will be looking to see just how shifty he is season but I am certainly intrigued by his pass catching (2-3)</P>


http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=H5XwHwe0QNI</P>


http://walterfootball.com/college/OhioState_logo.gif*Brandon Saine 6-1 217- Mildly productive in his first year without Wells around. Saine possess a nice* Speed size combo and good skill set. I have a feeling Saine is going to be a better pro then he was in college. Splitting the carries with Herron will limit his productivity but someone will end up getting a good player at a discounted price. (4)</P>


http://walterfootball.com/college/TexasTech_logo.gifBarron Batch 5-11 205- Batch caught my eye in the Alamo bowl last year as he racked up* 185 yards from scrimmage. Batch* has good speed and has proven to be a good receiver in TT's screwed up offense.* (5)</P>

Running back is my choice also.

lawl
11-09-2010, 11:48 PM
Best player in the nation right now is....?(not the best heisman candidate, theres a difference lol)</P>

nycsportzfan
11-10-2010, 06:23 AM
He hadnt struggled with Jones before. Before this game Jones had 10 targets , 3 catches. Yea, but now they are both juniors and are probably coming out this year. You have to count how they are playing now far more than how they played as freshmen or sophmores. And for a guy like Peterson with his speed slants should be easy for him to take away with proper technique. I dont think he moves to FS, not with his speed and hips. Hes too valuable at CB.It wont matter much anyway doubt Peterson ends up being a Giant, Maybe a Cowboy though. I think the Boys will go D-linei have a feeling Peterson ends up a COwboy.. The yr mike jenkins is having is beyond sorry.. Newmans also getting up there in age, and u got a 3rd CB at best in Scandrick after that.. CB is a must for Dallas.. I woulden't be surprised to see them drop down and try and secure a Guy like Prince Amukamura, Janoris Jenkins, B.Harris, Ras Dowling and also snag a Oline member or DE with there next pick..

heavyhitter
11-10-2010, 06:35 AM
Best player in the nation right now is....?(not the best heisman candidate, theres a difference lol)</p><table class="infobox vevent" cellspacing="5"><tbody><tr>
<td style="text-align: center;" colspan="2"><a class="image" href="/wiki/File:HeismanTrophyLogo.png">
</a></td></tr>
<tr>
<th style="text-align: left;" scope="row">
</th>
<td><font size="3">Just a wild guess but I'm assuming your talking about Cam Newton. It seems like every day more and more dirt is being thrown out on him. If these allegations are true, it's a damn shame because he is the best player in the nation this year. I wish the best for him but things really aren't looking too good at this point. Last I heard, the NCAA has the FEDS in on the investigation.
<font size="4"><span style="visibility: visible;" id="main"><span style="visibility: visible;" id="search"><span class="tl">FBI Gets Involved in Cam Newton "Agent" Investigation (http://www.google.com/url?sa=t&amp;source=web&amp;cd=1&amp;sqi=2&amp;ved=0CBcQqQIwAA&amp;url =http%3A%2F%2Fbleacherreport.com%2Farticles%2F5136 66-fbi-gets-involved-in-cam-newton-agent-investigation&amp;rct=j&amp;q=feds%20involved%20in%20cam%2 0&amp;ei=5XzaTJSkNMH38Aach7WCCg&amp;usg=AFQjCNHw5noZ9KpsM0 9LcXXbR0lBmBTVjA&amp;cad=rja)</span></span></span></font></font>
</td></tr></tbody></table>

thegreatone
11-10-2010, 08:38 AM
He hadnt struggled with Jones before. Before this game Jones had 10 targets , 3 catches. Yea, but now they are both juniors and are probably coming out this year. You have to count how they are playing now far more than how they played as freshmen or sophmores. And for a guy like Peterson with his speed slants should be easy for him to take away with proper technique. I dont think he moves to FS, not with his speed and hips. Hes too valuable at CB.It wont matter much anyway doubt Peterson ends up being a Giant, Maybe a Cowboy though. I think the Boys will go D-linei have a feeling Peterson ends up a COwboy.. The yr mike jenkins is having is beyond sorry.. Newmans also getting up there in age, and u got a 3rd CB at best in Scandrick after that.. CB is a must for Dallas.. I woulden't be surprised to see them drop down and try and secure a Guy like Prince Amukamura, Janoris Jenkins, B.Harris, Ras Dowling and also snag a Oline member or DE with there next pick..
yeah i agree he is going to be a cowboy. i think you could also be right in them dropping down too but i dont think they'll have many people trying to jump up. i just hope he decides to not pick up peterson and continues his theme of crappy drafts cause i really dont want to face that kid twice a year.

heavyhitter
11-10-2010, 09:19 AM
Best player in the nation right now is....?(not the best heisman candidate, theres a difference lol)</p>http://i189.photobucket.com/albums/z46/kcochran777/LJ4Heisman.jpg

heavyhitter
11-13-2010, 05:52 AM
<table class="tablehead" cellpadding="3" cellspacing="1"><tbody><tr class="stathead">
<td colspan="3">No. 20 Virginia Tech at North Carolina</td></tr>
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<td align="middle">AWAY</td>
<td align="middle">LOCATION</td>
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<td align="middle">http://a.espncdn.com/i/teamlogos/ncaa/med/259.gif (http://espn.go.com/college-football/team/_/id/259/virginia-tech-hokies)</td>
<td align="middle">


CHAPEL HILL, NC
Nov. 13, 3:30 PM ET
http://a.espncdn.com/i/scoreboard/networkLogo_abc.gif (http://espn.go.com/abcsports/)</p>


Game Preview (/ncf/preview?gameId=303170153)<a href="http://insider.espn.go.com/ncf/pickcenter?gameid=303170153">
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<td align="middle">http://a.espncdn.com/i/teamlogos/ncaa/med/153.gif (http://espn.go.com/college-football/team/_/id/153/north-carolina-tar-heels)</td></tr></tbody></table><table class="tablehead" cellpadding="3" cellspacing="1"><tbody><tr class="stathead">
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No. 2 Auburn vs Georgia</td></tr><tr class="colhead"><td align="middle">HOME</td><td align="middle">LOCATION</td><td align="middle">AWAY</td></tr><tr class="oddrow preview"><td align="middle">http://a.espncdn.com/i/teamlogos/ncaa/med/2.gif (http://espn.go.com/college-football/team/_/id/2/auburn-tigers)</td><td align="middle">


AUBURN, AL
Nov. 13, 3:30 PM ET
CBS</p>


Game Preview (../ncf/preview?gameId=303170002)<a href="http://insider.espn.go.com/ncf/pickcenter?gameid=303170002">

</a></p></td><td align="middle">http://a.espncdn.com/i/teamlogos/ncaa/med/61.gif (http://espn.go.com/college-football/team/_/id/61/georgia-bulldogs)

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<td colspan="3">No. 22 Florida vs No. 23 South Carolina</td></tr>
<tr class="colhead">
<td align="middle">HOME</td>
<td align="middle">LOCATION</td>
<td align="middle">AWAY</td></tr>
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<td align="middle">http://a.espncdn.com/i/teamlogos/ncaa/med/57.gif (http://espn.go.com/college-football/team/_/id/57/florida-gators)</td>
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GAINESVILLE, FL
Nov. 13, 7:15 PM ET
http://a.espncdn.com/i/scoreboard/networkLogo_espn.gif (http://sports.espn.go.com/sports/tvlistings/index)http://a.espncdn.com/i/scoreboard/espn_360_logo_55x14.gif (http://espn.go.com/espn3/index?id=303170057)</p>


Game Preview (/ncf/preview?gameId=303170057)<a href="http://insider.espn.go.com/ncf/pickcenter?gameid=303170057">
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<td align="middle">http://a.espncdn.com/i/teamlogos/ncaa/med/2579.gif (http://espn.go.com/college-football/team/_/id/2579/south-carolina-game****s)</td></tr></tbody></table>
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<tr class="evenrow team-23-213 team-23-194">
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<td colspan="3">No. 12 Alabama vs No. 19 Mississippi State</td></tr>
<tr class="colhead">
<td align="middle">HOME</td>
<td align="middle">LOCATION</td>
<td align="middle">AWAY</td></tr>
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<td align="middle">http://a.espncdn.com/i/teamlogos/ncaa/med/333.gif (http://espn.go.com/college-football/team/_/id/333/alabama-crimson-tide)</td>
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TUSCALOOSA, AL
Nov. 13, 7:15 PM ET
http://a.espncdn.com/i/scoreboard/networkLogo_espn2.gif (http://sports.espn.go.com/sports/tvlistings/index)http://a.espncdn.com/i/scoreboard/espn_360_logo_55x14.gif (http://espn.go.com/espn3/index?id=303170333)</p>


Game Preview (/ncf/preview?gameId=303170333)<a href="http://insider.espn.go.com/ncf/pickcenter?gameid=303170333">
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nycsportzfan
11-13-2010, 04:27 PM
A SS i'm excited about and spoke about once or twice as a somewhat mid rd type is Joe Lefeged.. This guy can do it all and return kicks... Very exciting player who hits hard and has a knack for being around the ball...

nycsportzfan
11-13-2010, 04:29 PM
OMG! What a play by Br.Carter chasing down Ty Taylor and getting him 1yrd shy of a 1st down on 3rd and 8.. There was no one in the picture when taylor was about 4yrds away, and carter closed the gap in no time..

Neverend
11-13-2010, 05:12 PM
Prince Amukamara is just as good as peterson. Doesn't get a lot of attention but I think he can even be better than peterson. Peterson's the better athlete and probably the best natural athlete in the draft, but Prince is slightly more polished and more disciplined than peterson who I've found to be somewhat overaggressive at times</P>


Peterson reminds me of suh. Amazing athlete but doesn't have too worry much about technique because he can dominate players with his amazing athleticism. I think peterson will struggle in the NFL, a bit. Especially against receivers that are quick, percise, and polished in their route running.</P>

heavyhitter
11-13-2010, 05:28 PM
Prince Amukamara is just as good as peterson. Doesn't get a lot of attention but I think he can even be better than peterson. <font size="4">Peterson's the better athlete and probably the best natural athlete in the draft</font>, but Prince is slightly more polished and more disciplined than peterson who I've found to be somewhat overaggressive at times</p>


Peterson reminds me of suh. Amazing athlete but doesn't have too worry much about technique because he can dominate players with his amazing athleticism. I think peterson will struggle in the NFL, a bit. Especially against receivers that are quick, percise, and polished in their route running.</p>
http://i189.photobucket.com/albums/z46/kcochran777/peterson_heisman_2.gif

Redeyejedi
11-13-2010, 05:49 PM
Nice Auburn, The Cowboys almost got us on that one. That seems to be the best way to kick an onsides kick</P>

Redeyejedi
11-13-2010, 05:53 PM
Prince Amukamara is just as good as peterson. Doesn't get a lot of attention but I think he can even be better than peterson. <FONT size=4>Peterson's the better athlete and probably the best natural athlete in the draft</FONT>, but Prince is slightly more polished and more disciplined than peterson who I've found to be somewhat overaggressive at times</P>


Peterson reminds me of suh. Amazing athlete but doesn't have too worry much about technique because he can dominate players with his amazing athleticism. I think peterson will struggle in the NFL, a bit. Especially against receivers that are quick, percise, and polished in their route running.</P>
http://i189.photobucket.com/albums/z46/kcochran777/peterson_heisman_2.gif
The guy has 1 bad game and now off the bandwagon. Ive seen Amukamara get beat up by lesser receivers in a couple games this year. Did U see the OSU game a few weeks ago

Redeyejedi
11-13-2010, 06:11 PM
Oh my is Nick Fairly a beast. I wonder what team he ends up playing for. Im interested in seeing if they make him a 3-4 end. I think he could be in consideration for the Cowboys

Redeyejedi
11-13-2010, 06:18 PM
Man AJ Green looks really light to me. I wonder if he will be able to be as effective in the NFL.

Redeyejedi
11-13-2010, 06:27 PM
LOL that was a dirty play be Fairly there

heavyhitter
11-13-2010, 06:35 PM
Prince Amukamara is just as good as peterson. Doesn't get a lot of attention but I think he can even be better than peterson. <font size="4">Peterson's the better athlete and probably the best natural athlete in the draft</font>, but Prince is slightly more polished and more disciplined than peterson who I've found to be somewhat overaggressive at times</p>


Peterson reminds me of suh. Amazing athlete but doesn't have too worry much about technique because he can dominate players with his amazing athleticism. I think peterson will struggle in the NFL, a bit. Especially against receivers that are quick, percise, and polished in their route running.</p>
http://i189.photobucket.com/albums/z46/kcochran777/peterson_heisman_2.gif
<font size="4">The guy has 1 bad game and now off the bandwagon.</font> Ive seen Amukamara get beat up by lesser receivers in a couple games this year. Did U see the OSU game a few weeks ago<font size="3">What does that sentence supposed to mean, I'm confused? The poster named "Neverend thought Amukamara was just as good as PP. So I posted a PP GIF supporting Pat Peterson. Maybe you can explain the sentence to me??</font>

heavyhitter
11-13-2010, 06:58 PM
Prince Amukamara is just as good as peterson. Doesn't get a lot of attention but I think he can even be better than peterson. <font size="4">Peterson's the better athlete and probably the best natural athlete in the draft</font>, but Prince is slightly more polished and more disciplined than peterson who I've found to be somewhat overaggressive at times</p>


Peterson reminds me of suh. Amazing athlete but doesn't have too worry much about technique because he can dominate players with his amazing athleticism. I think peterson will struggle in the NFL, a bit. Especially against receivers that are quick, percise, and polished in their route running.</p>
http://i189.photobucket.com/albums/z46/kcochran777/peterson_heisman_2.gif
Did U see the OSU game a few weeks ago<font size="3">Did I see the game? I saw the game and WR Blackmon torched Amukamara and I even made a post about it under the "General Sports" section weeks ago(page 32). I'll go over there and bump it for you. I've made it clear plenty of times I personally think Patrick Peterson is the better cornerback. Not to say Prince is a bad corner, I just think PP has the edge and will be drafted higher. <font size="4">Please do me a favor and stop looking for an argument that is not there.</font></font>

Redeyejedi
11-13-2010, 07:06 PM
Prince Amukamara is just as good as peterson. Doesn't get a lot of attention but I think he can even be better than peterson. <FONT size=4>Peterson's the better athlete and probably the best natural athlete in the draft</FONT>, but Prince is slightly more polished and more disciplined than peterson who I've found to be somewhat overaggressive at times</P>


Peterson reminds me of suh. Amazing athlete but doesn't have too worry much about technique because he can dominate players with his amazing athleticism. I think peterson will struggle in the NFL, a bit. Especially against receivers that are quick, percise, and polished in their route running.</P>



http://i189.photobucket.com/albums/z46/kcochran777/peterson_heisman_2.gif
Did U see the OSU game a few weeks ago<FONT size=3>Did I see the game? I saw the game and WR Blackmon torched Amukamara and I even made a post about it under the "General Sports" section weeks ago(page 32). I'll go over there and bump it for you. I've made it clear plenty of times I personally think Patrick Peterson is the better cornerback. Not to say Prince is a bad corner, I just think PP has the edge and will be drafted higher. <FONT size=4>Please do me a favor and stop looking for an argument that is not there.</FONT></FONT>
</P>


Dude is something wrong with U whats with the attitude. I was reading the postdid not know the gif was a seperate post. I think it would be pretty obvious the comment wasnt directed at U.Serious issues</P>

heavyhitter
11-13-2010, 07:14 PM
Prince Amukamara is just as good as peterson. Doesn't get a lot of attention but I think he can even be better than peterson. <font size="4">Peterson's the better athlete and probably the best natural athlete in the draft</font>, but Prince is slightly more polished and more disciplined than peterson who I've found to be somewhat overaggressive at times</p>


Peterson reminds me of suh. Amazing athlete but doesn't have too worry much about technique because he can dominate players with his amazing athleticism. I think peterson will struggle in the NFL, a bit. Especially against receivers that are quick, percise, and polished in their route running.</p>



http://i189.photobucket.com/albums/z46/kcochran777/peterson_heisman_2.gif
Did U see the OSU game a few weeks ago<font size="3">Did I see the game? I saw the game and WR Blackmon torched Amukamara and I even made a post about it under the "General Sports" section weeks ago(page 32). I'll go over there and bump it for you. I've made it clear plenty of times I personally think Patrick Peterson is the better cornerback. Not to say Prince is a bad corner, I just think PP has the edge and will be drafted higher. <font size="4">Please do me a favor and stop looking for an argument that is not there.</font></font>
</p>


<font size="3">Dude is something wrong with U whats with the attitude.<font size="4"> I was reading the postdid not know the gif was a seperate post.</font>
</font></p><font size="5">Lol- You need to fill out one of these forms CORKY:</font>

http://i189.photobucket.com/albums/z46/kcochran777/butthurt_report_form.jpg

Redeyejedi
11-13-2010, 07:29 PM
Prince Amukamara is just as good as peterson. Doesn't get a lot of attention but I think he can even be better than peterson. <FONT size=4>Peterson's the better athlete and probably the best natural athlete in the draft</FONT>, but Prince is slightly more polished and more disciplined than peterson who I've found to be somewhat overaggressive at times</P>


Peterson reminds me of suh. Amazing athlete but doesn't have too worry much about technique because he can dominate players with his amazing athleticism. I think peterson will struggle in the NFL, a bit. Especially against receivers that are quick, percise, and polished in their route running.</P>



http://i189.photobucket.com/albums/z46/kcochran777/peterson_heisman_2.gif
Did U see the OSU game a few weeks ago<FONT size=3>Did I see the game? I saw the game and WR Blackmon torched Amukamara and I even made a post about it under the "General Sports" section weeks ago(page 32). I'll go over there and bump it for you. I've made it clear plenty of times I personally think Patrick Peterson is the better cornerback. Not to say Prince is a bad corner, I just think PP has the edge and will be drafted higher. <FONT size=4>Please do me a favor and stop looking for an argument that is not there.</FONT></FONT>
</P>


<FONT size=3>Dude is something wrong with U whats with the attitude.<FONT size=4> I was reading the postdid not know the gif was a seperate post.</FONT>
</FONT></P>


<FONT size=5>Lol- You need to fill out one of these forms CORKY:</FONT>

http://i189.photobucket.com/albums/z46/kcochran777/butthurt_report_form.jpg
</P>


Whatever guy Im not going to continue arguing with or even responding to your posts anymore. U seriously have problems or just a complete **** or both either waywhy dont Upost on your own draft thread and take a walk away from this one</P>

heavyhitter
11-13-2010, 07:33 PM
<font size="3">Update on the Clemson vs Florida State game at 8:00 pm. Christian Ponder is out due to injury and Sophomore QB E.J. Manuel will be starting in his place. I like Manuel's mobility but Ponder is a much better passer. E.J's young though and has plenty of time to develop. I just hope FSU can pull out a win tonight. Here's some highlights on EJ Manuel from last year (Freshman year): </font><font size="4"><font size="3"></font><font color="#555555">E.J. Manuel 2009 Highlights</font> (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_zmtSBRqBHk)</font>

heavyhitter
11-13-2010, 07:36 PM
Prince Amukamara is just as good as peterson. Doesn't get a lot of attention but I think he can even be better than peterson. <font size="4">Peterson's the better athlete and probably the best natural athlete in the draft</font>, but Prince is slightly more polished and more disciplined than peterson who I've found to be somewhat overaggressive at times</p>


Peterson reminds me of suh. Amazing athlete but doesn't have too worry much about technique because he can dominate players with his amazing athleticism. I think peterson will struggle in the NFL, a bit. Especially against receivers that are quick, percise, and polished in their route running.</p>



http://i189.photobucket.com/albums/z46/kcochran777/peterson_heisman_2.gif
Did U see the OSU game a few weeks ago<font size="3">Did I see the game? I saw the game and WR Blackmon torched Amukamara and I even made a post about it under the "General Sports" section weeks ago(page 32). I'll go over there and bump it for you. I've made it clear plenty of times I personally think Patrick Peterson is the better cornerback. Not to say Prince is a bad corner, I just think PP has the edge and will be drafted higher. <font size="4">Please do me a favor and stop looking for an argument that is not there.</font></font>
</p>


<font size="3">Dude is something wrong with U whats with the attitude.<font size="4"> I was reading the postdid not know the gif was a seperate post.</font>
</font></p>


<font size="5">Lol- You need to fill out one of these forms CORKY:</font>

http://i189.photobucket.com/albums/z46/kcochran777/butthurt_report_form.jpg
</p>


Whatever guy Im not going to continue arguing with or even responding to your posts anymore. U seriously have problems or just a complete **** or both either waywhy dont Upost on your own draft thread and take a walk away from this one</p>http://i189.photobucket.com/albums/z46/kcochran777/text-6ac0ec1212e521b3e4dd42d1112d31.jpg

heavyhitter
11-13-2010, 07:38 PM
<font size="3">Update on the Clemson vs Florida State game at 8:00 pm. Christian Ponder is out due to injury and Sophomore QB E.J. Manuel will be starting in his place. I like Manuel's mobility but Ponder is a much better passer. E.J's young though and has plenty of time to develop. I just hope FSU can pull out a win tonight. Here's some highlights on EJ Manuel from last year (Freshman year): </font><font size="4"><font size="3"></font><font color="#555555">E.J. Manuel 2009 Highlights</font> (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_zmtSBRqBHk)</font>

slipknottin
11-18-2010, 06:55 PM
I have to agree with nevermind, scouts will tell you the same thing. Amakamura is the best cover CB in the draft this year. Peterson has better upside, and is a complete freak physically, but he is not a pure cover guy due to his discipline and technique.

However, discipline and technique can be taught, petersons skill set can not.

And I disagree on Suh not having technique, he had a complete game.

I expect both Peterson and Amakamua both to be top 5 picks.

Redeyejedi
11-18-2010, 07:00 PM
I have to agree with nevermind, scouts will tell you the same thing. Amakamura is the best cover CB in the draft this year. Peterson has better upside, and is a complete freak physically, but he is not a pure cover guy due to his discipline and technique. However, discipline and technique can be taught, petersons skill set can not. And I disagree on Suh not having technique, he had a complete game. I expect both Peterson and Amakamua both to be top 5 picks.Yeah Im curious to see what kind of combine Amakamura has. Me I would rather have Patrick Peterson theres more to work with

slipknottin
11-18-2010, 07:05 PM
Me I would rather have Patrick Peterson theres more to work with

I would think most teams feel that way. However, I expect Peterson to have somewhat of a rough start in the NFL. I think it may take him a season or 2 to really get down the proper technique to be a big time player.

Amukamara I think is more NFL ready, but just doesnt have the upside. Though thats not to say Amukamara doesnt have the physical skills to be a top 10 CB in the NFL.
6' 200 pounds, strong build, and probably will run around a 4.4 flat.

go tuck
11-18-2010, 07:10 PM
hey slipknottin: what is your level of involvement in football? Your analysis sounds like you could almost give Gruden a run for his money

slipknottin
11-18-2010, 07:13 PM
hey slipknottin: what is your level of involvement in football? Your analysis sounds like you could almost give Gruden a run for his money

thats more because Gruden is a moron. Lol.

I have no involvement, just going to school for journalism. Id love to get into some type of scouting, but odds are pretty slim.

Redeyejedi
11-18-2010, 07:14 PM
Me I would rather have Patrick Peterson theres more to work with I would think most teams feel that way. However, I expect Peterson to have somewhat of a rough start in the NFL. I think it may take him a season or 2 to really get down the proper technique to be a big time player. Amukamara I think is more NFL ready, but just doesnt have the upside. Though thats not to say Amukamara doesnt have the physical skills to be a top 10 CB in the NFL. 6' 200 pounds, strong build, and probably will run around a 4.4 flat.Your right Amukamara " I never know if Im spelling that right" is no slouch physically as well. Peterson has just insane physcial ability

go tuck
11-18-2010, 07:18 PM
"No Homo" ... dude love your posts.. do you know what our O-line is gonna look like sunday

slipknottin
11-18-2010, 07:26 PM
Your right Amukamara " I never know if Im spelling that right" is no slouch physically as well. Peterson has just insane physcial ability

I just looked it up, lol. I know how to say it, spelling it is another issue. Though half the time I still screw up typing Umenyiora. Hah.

Yea, Peterson is probably the most physically gifted player in the draft (bruce carter isnt far behind, he will light it up at the combine too).

The real issue is... how often is it the physically gifted player who becomes the best NFL player? Especially at the CB position.

Revis is pretty average physically, 5'11 200 pounds, ran a 4.4 flat He just has incredible technique. Brandon Flowers is another guy, 5'9 195, ran a 4.55. Right now he's arguably the best CB in the league. Neither guy has the physical tools close to what Peterson has.

I still think Peterson is the most like Ike Taylor of the steelers, both 6'2, but run sub 4.3, both play physical. But neither has outstanding discipline or technique. Can Peterson be coached up to be an elite guy? Thats the real question that needs to be asked, he can get away with just being a freak athlete in college, hes bigger and faster than everyone he lines up against, and he is so much better than the CB opposite him that he rarely gets tested, wont work that way in the NFL.

slipknottin
11-18-2010, 07:27 PM
"No Homo" ... dude love your posts.. do you know what our O-line is gonna look like sunday

Honestly, I dont think even Coughlin knows at this point, they seem very hesitant to say much about Andrews.

Redeyejedi
11-18-2010, 10:02 PM
Your right Amukamara " I never know if Im spelling that right" is no slouch physically as well. Peterson has just insane physcial ability I just looked it up, lol. I know how to say it, spelling it is another issue. Though half the time I still screw up typing Umenyiora. Hah. Yea, Peterson is probably the most physically gifted player in the draft (bruce carter isnt far behind, he will light it up at the combine too). The real issue is... how often is it the physically gifted player who becomes the best NFL player? Especially at the CB position. Revis is pretty average physically, 5'11 200 pounds, ran a 4.4 flat He just has incredible technique. Brandon Flowers is another guy, 5'9 195, ran a 4.55. Right now he's arguably the best CB in the league. Neither guy has the physical tools close to what Peterson has. I still think Peterson is the most like Ike Taylor of the steelers, both 6'2, but run sub 4.3, both play physical. But neither has outstanding discipline or technique. Can Peterson be coached up to be an elite guy? Thats the real question that needs to be asked, he can get away with just being a freak athlete in college, hes bigger and faster than everyone he lines up against, and he is so much better than the CB opposite him that he rarely gets tested, wont work that way in the NFL. All fair points .Things have probably come fairly easy for Peterson being that he is athletically superior then almost everyone he goes up against. </P>


U have any opinions on Miamis Brandon Harris its possible the Giants could be looking corner do U think he would even be considered</P>

slipknottin
11-19-2010, 12:40 AM
U have any opinions on Miamis Brandon Harris its possible the Giants could be looking corner do U think he would even be considered</P>

I think it depends on what he measures in at the combine. If he does measure 5'11 I would say they consider him. But I have a feeling he measures in at 5'10 or shorter, and if thats the case, then no, probably not.

nycsportzfan
11-19-2010, 02:16 AM
Your right Amukamara " I never know if Im spelling that right" is no slouch physically as well. Peterson has just insane physcial ability I just looked it up, lol. I know how to say it, spelling it is another issue. Though half the time I still screw up typing Umenyiora. Hah. Yea, Peterson is probably the most physically gifted player in the draft (bruce carter isnt far behind, he will light it up at the combine too). The real issue is... how often is it the physically gifted player who becomes the best NFL player? Especially at the CB position. Revis is pretty average physically, 5'11 200 pounds, ran a 4.4 flat He just has incredible technique. Brandon Flowers is another guy, 5'9 195, ran a 4.55. Right now he's arguably the best CB in the league. Neither guy has the physical tools close to what Peterson has. I still think Peterson is the most like Ike Taylor of the steelers, both 6'2, but run sub 4.3, both play physical. But neither has outstanding discipline or technique. Can Peterson be coached up to be an elite guy? Thats the real question that needs to be asked, he can get away with just being a freak athlete in college, hes bigger and faster than everyone he lines up against, and he is so much better than the CB opposite him that he rarely gets tested, wont work that way in the NFL. All fair points .Things have probably come fairly easy for Peterson being that he is athletically superior then almost everyone he goes up against. </p>


U have any opinions on Miamis Brandon Harris its possible the Giants could be looking corner do U think he would even be considered</p> Looking forward to seeing Harris on jarrett boykin this weekend.. That matchup is one u could see on Sundays down the line, and boykin has explosion and size, and it'll be interesting to watch harris on him.. I sure would think the giants would jump all over him if he were on board and Reese and the Gmen Scouts liked how he played, as i really don't think a inch or 2 is gonna change there minds... I woulden't put to much into the Size of Webster and Thomas, there both players that reese liked, and i have a feeling alot more then Size went into it.... To me, Janoris Jenkins is the flat out best of the best outside the top 2, and i doubt Reese would pass him up because hes closer to Aaron Ross's size then he is Corey Webster's... Watch Jenkins play, and tell me hes not super physical and can't stick anyone and leap with the best of em.. I'm going on a limb and saying Jenkins has the best Vertical at the combine as far as CB's go, unless Peterson beats him out, hes the only one i think has a chance...All this said, Jimmy Smith is a Guy i could see the Giants taking, because he does have the Size and Speed, but only if Jenkins is off the board.. I think the giants will go with overall future projections over size with jenkins if hes on the board still, over any other CB, but if hes gone, i could definetly see him going Size/Speed with Jimmy Smith, i think J.Smith will run a sub 4.50 and is faster then the other real big strong CB in Ras I Dowling...

My Top 5 CB's outside of Prince and Peterson
1. Janoris Jenkins(flat out beast, should be impossibly to pass up if on board still, doubtful thoug)
2. Jimmy Smith(big,strong,fast.. Need i say more?)
3.Johnny Patrick(sleeper alert! Sleeper Alert! If u haven't seen em yet, SEE HIM!!!!!!!)
4.Brandon Harris
5. Tough, guys like Carmichael and Davon house come to mind...


I freaking love Johnny Patick..The guy makes plays all over, and has nice size, alot of expierence and is just a solid pick.. If your just looking for a solid CB who can play immedietly and is almost a sure thing of at least being a Decent NFL corner, u go get this guy, not in rd 1, but i don't think RD 2 is to crazy... Hes gonna FLY up boards by draft time, once scouts go back and look at the tape...

nycsportzfan
11-19-2010, 02:22 AM
Oh ya, by the way, notice that The Increidbly Stong physical beastly Alshon Jeffery had his Worst Game Yards wise and had zero Long Catches against Jenkins.. I think that tells u all u need to about Jenkins.. I watched that game, and if not for Jeffery just being a INsanely Good WR, He'd of had 2or 3 catches for 30yrds.. I mean, Jenkins was aweomse against him for the most part... I love Jenkins! To be honest, he may be this yrs Kenny Britt and Earl Thomas, as a guy i'm just praying the Giants get, all though i may not go that far, because i really don't think the Giants have much a chance at him...

nycsportzfan
11-19-2010, 02:27 AM
hey slipknottin: what is your level of involvement in football? Your analysis sounds like you could almost give Gruden a run for his money

thats more because Gruden is a moron. Lol.

I have no involvement, just going to school for journalism. Id love to get into some type of scouting, but odds are pretty slim. Slip, what do u think of the 2nd tier of CB's... Guys outside of Janoris Jenkins and Peterson and Amukamara? For instance, outta this group, who excites u the most..


Brandon Harris, Brandon Burton, Johnny Patrick(love em!), jimmy smith(love em!), Davon House, Rashad Carmicahel, Aaronn Williams...

Obviously, i put Jenkins in Peterson and Amukamaras class as at least the clear cut 3rd best CB that could possbily be in this draft class, u may feel diffrent, if so include Jenkins in the group listed above... Redeye, feel free to answer how u feel about the group above as well..All though, i think u see Harris as i see Jenkins..

nycsportzfan
11-19-2010, 02:40 AM
also, i must point out that Julio Jones and Aj Green were pretty much non existint against Janoris Jenkins as well.. Thats 3 Sure Fire 1st RD WR's with Size to boot that Jenkins pretty much gave nothing 2.. I was chating to a bunch of Florida Fans and they were telling me, that if not for Jenkins they'd of lost the Georgia Game, and his work on AJ was strickly the reason they didn't.. I was looking at a site that ripped Jenkins for his work on Tolliver, and it made me cringe! I mean, did he not see any of the other games the guy played? Tolliver was due to have a breakout game, and i will give him that, he did a number on Jenkins that game, but jenkins has prooved that to be a bad game and nothing more with his work against Green and Jeffery from that point forward..

Redeyejedi
11-19-2010, 05:37 AM
U have any opinions on Miamis Brandon Harris its possible the Giants could be looking corner do U think he would even be considered


</P> I think it depends on what he measures in at the combine. If he does measure 5'11 I would say they consider him. But I have a feeling he measures in at 5'10 or shorter, and if thats the case, then no, probably not.Those are my thoughts as well. I like Harris unfortunatly I know he isnt 5' 11"

Redeyejedi
11-19-2010, 05:41 AM
hey slipknottin: what is your level of involvement in football? Your analysis sounds like you could almost give Gruden a run for his money thats more because Gruden is a moron. Lol. I have no involvement, just going to school for journalism. Id love to get into some type of scouting, but odds are pretty slim. Slip, what do u think of the 2nd tier of CB's... Guys outside of Janoris Jenkins and Peterson and Amukamara? For instance, outta this group, who excites u the most..


Brandon Harris, Brandon Burton, Johnny Patrick(love em!), jimmy smith(love em!), Davon House, Rashad Carmicahel, Aaronn Williams...

Obviously, i put Jenkins in Peterson and Amukamaras class as at least the clear cut 3rd best CB that could possbily be in this draft class, u may feel diffrent, if so include Jenkins in the group listed above... Redeye, feel free to answer how u feel about the group above as well..All though, i think u see Harris as i see Jenkins..
I like Jenkins Im just thinking in terms of the Giants really. I dont see them taking him. it goes against everything they have done in recent years with there secondary. I was impressed on how well he played Green though

nycsportzfan
11-19-2010, 07:23 AM
hey slipknottin: what is your level of involvement in football? Your analysis sounds like you could almost give Gruden a run for his money thats more because Gruden is a moron. Lol. I have no involvement, just going to school for journalism. Id love to get into some type of scouting, but odds are pretty slim. Slip, what do u think of the 2nd tier of CB's... Guys outside of Janoris Jenkins and Peterson and Amukamara? For instance, outta this group, who excites u the most..


Brandon Harris, Brandon Burton, Johnny Patrick(love em!), jimmy smith(love em!), Davon House, Rashad Carmicahel, Aaronn Williams...

Obviously, i put Jenkins in Peterson and Amukamaras class as at least the clear cut 3rd best CB that could possbily be in this draft class, u may feel diffrent, if so include Jenkins in the group listed above... Redeye, feel free to answer how u feel about the group above as well..All though, i think u see Harris as i see Jenkins..
I like Jenkins Im just thinking in terms of the Giants really. I dont see them taking him. it goes against everything they have done in recent years with there secondary. I was impressed on how well he played Green though Green, Jeffery and J.jones... He played them all fantastically.. None of em had a big play, yardage wise...

Also, as far as the Giants taking These big Corners, lets not forget Aaronn Ross was just the last guy who realistaclly had any chance of going where we picked in that 2007 draft.. The next CB to go went 20plus picks later with Chris Houston... I think that he was the best available player at the positon, a positon we clearly needed... Also, he had that speed and what not, i think there was alot more then he happened to fit a certain SIZE PERAMITER... I mean they did give Bruce Johnson a chance.. U would think they woulden't let the guy have a chance, if they didn't believe in his size, same for Kevin Dockery...

U go look at the Draft Terrell Thomas was taken, and u look at the next 7 CB"s taken, and all of em are big(chevis jackson, Antwaun Molden, Charles Godfrey, Reggie Smith, Tyvon Branch)..etc I mean, some of those guys are so big they are now safties.. Not to mention, looking at that list, i'd rather have Terrell Thomas over all those guys, so maybe it just so happened, Terrell Thomas and Aaron Ross were just the 2most Talented Players at the CB positon left on the board, and definetly CB's, not teetering on Saftey.... There were no better option at the CB positon then Ross and Thomas when we picked them...

Redeyejedi
11-21-2010, 09:06 AM
hey slipknottin: what is your level of involvement in football? Your analysis sounds like you could almost give Gruden a run for his money thats more because Gruden is a moron. Lol. I have no involvement, just going to school for journalism. Id love to get into some type of scouting, but odds are pretty slim. Slip, what do u think of the 2nd tier of CB's... Guys outside of Janoris Jenkins and Peterson and Amukamara? For instance, outta this group, who excites u the most..


Brandon Harris, Brandon Burton, Johnny Patrick(love em!), jimmy smith(love em!), Davon House, Rashad Carmicahel, Aaronn Williams...

Obviously, i put Jenkins in Peterson and Amukamaras class as at least the clear cut 3rd best CB that could possbily be in this draft class, u may feel diffrent, if so include Jenkins in the group listed above... Redeye, feel free to answer how u feel about the group above as well..All though, i think u see Harris as i see Jenkins..
I like Jenkins Im just thinking in terms of the Giants really. I dont see them taking him. it goes against everything they have done in recent years with there secondary. I was impressed on how well he played Green though Green, Jeffery and J.jones... He played them all fantastically.. None of em had a big play, yardage wise...

Also, as far as the Giants taking These big Corners, lets not forget Aaronn Ross was just the last guy who realistaclly had any chance of going where we picked in that 2007 draft.. The next CB to go went 20plus picks later with Chris Houston... I think that he was the best available player at the positon, a positon we clearly needed... Also, he had that speed and what not, i think there was alot more then he happened to fit a certain SIZE PERAMITER... I mean they did give Bruce Johnson a chance.. U would think they woulden't let the guy have a chance, if they didn't believe in his size, same for Kevin Dockery...

U go look at the Draft Terrell Thomas was taken, and u look at the next 7 CB"s taken, and all of em are big(chevis jackson, Antwaun Molden, Charles Godfrey, Reggie Smith, Tyvon Branch)..etc I mean, some of those guys are so big they are now safties.. Not to mention, looking at that list, i'd rather have Terrell Thomas over all those guys, so maybe it just so happened, Terrell Thomas and Aaron Ross were just the 2most Talented Players at the CB positon left on the board, and definetly CB's, not teetering on Saftey.... There were no better option at the CB positon then Ross and Thomas when we picked them...
I dont believe its anaccident the Giants have the largest secondary from top to bottom in the NFL . Theres team that value it more then others. I believe Marc Ross and Jerry Reese have made an effort in obtaining these guys as a philosphy. I personally like it. It tells me they have a plan and direction on how they want the team molded. As U know some players fit better then others in certain systems. If U dont draft towards guys that fit a philosphy U get a jumbled mess that doesnt work.I do admit in Fewells defense it doesnt seem like size is as much of an issue then in Spags.I have been impressed by Janoris Jenkins this year. He has played well against all the big time players in the SEC and if he comes in at 5-11 at the combine he will be in the mix. I do think Ahmad Black is completly out of the question though</P>


Not sure if U saw the Nebraska game but safety Eric Hagg was in 1 on 1 coverage a lot and played reasonably well. Hagg is used as the Nickel player in Nebraskas defense where he lines up as a Corner,linebacker and safety. He is 6-2 207 and a guy that I think could be a good option in the middle rounds as Chad Jones/Deon Grant insurance.</P>

Redeyejedi
11-22-2010, 09:17 AM
1.Bruce Carter OLB NC- A do everything 3 down LB that can give a defense a ton of flexibility. His all around skill set to blitz and cover WR's in the slot can give a DC just way to many options to ignore.His outstanding ability on special teams is another huge plus as well.</P>


2. Brandon Burton CB Utah 6-0 185 - The Giants need a corner that much is obvious.. Brandon Burton is a little different then what we have seen the last few years from the Giants in the type of corner they covet. In Perry Fewells defense however a different type of corner may be a better idea. Burton excels in zone has a nice beck pedal and good recovery speed. I like Burton a lot in Fewells defense if he isnt the DC I would probably go with another corner in this spot. He is also a junior so he may opt to return especially if the CBA is not sorted out.</P>


3. Marvin Austin DT NC- Maybe Im crazy but I think he is going to fall do tocharacter concerns and a motor that doesnt always run. I think he is worththe risk here</P>


4. Jake Kirkpatrick C TCU- The best center in this class in my opion</P>


6. Eric Hagg S Nebraska / Jermaile Hines S Ohio State- I wanted to go safety higher but I couldnt find one with the skill set besides Mark Barron. Hagg plays as the Nickel defender in Nebraskas defense where they use him at linebacker,Safety, and CB. Another guy who I think is only an option if Fewell is the DC. Hines was used in a Deon Grant type role last year at Ohio State Hines comes with great size "6-2 210"that fits the tweener Linebacker/safety role to perfection.</P>


7. Barron Batch RB Texas Tech- Batch could go higher then this and probably will but he fits a need in my opinion. Batch reminds me some of Mike Goodson of the Panthers. Batch to me could make a very good 3rd down back in the NFL something I think the Giants surely lack. He also can help out on special teams and has 4.4 speed</P>


</P>


6-7 Schylur Oordt Northern Iowa- This tight end class is awful but Oordt has gret physical skills to me that cant be ignored a guy to watch in the Senior Bowl.</P>

nycsportzfan
11-23-2010, 08:41 AM
1.Bruce Carter OLB NC- A do everything 3 down LB that can give a defense a ton of flexibility. His all around skill set to blitz and cover WR's in the slot can give a DC just way to many options to ignore.His outstanding ability on special teams is another huge plus as well.</p>


2. Brandon Burton CB Utah 6-0 185 - The Giants need a corner that much is obvious.. Brandon Burton is a little different then what we have seen the last few years from the Giants in the type of corner they covet. In Perry Fewells defense however a different type of corner may be a better idea. Burton excels in zone has a nice beck pedal and good recovery speed. I like Burton a lot in Fewells defense if he isnt the DC I would probably go with another corner in this spot. He is also a junior so he may opt to return especially if the CBA is not sorted out.</p>


3. Marvin Austin DT NC- Maybe Im crazy but I think he is going to fall do tocharacter concerns and a motor that doesnt always run. I think he is worththe risk here</p>


4. Jake Kirkpatrick C TCU- The best center in this class in my opion</p>


6. Eric Hagg S Nebraska / Jermaile Hines S Ohio State- I wanted to go safety higher but I couldnt find one with the skill set besides Mark Barron. Hagg plays as the Nickel defender in Nebraskas defense where they use him at linebacker,Safety, and CB. Another guy who I think is only an option if Fewell is the DC. Hines was used in a Deon Grant type role last year at Ohio State Hines comes with great size "6-2 210"that fits the tweener Linebacker/safety role to perfection.</p>


7. Barron Batch RB Texas Tech- Batch could go higher then this and probably will but he fits a need in my opinion. Batch reminds me some of Mike Goodson of the Panthers. Batch to me could make a very good 3rd down back in the NFL something I think the Giants surely lack. He also can help out on special teams and has 4.4 speed</p>


</p>


6-7 Schylur Oordt Northern Iowa- This tight end class is awful but Oordt has gret physical skills to me that cant be ignored a guy to watch in the Senior Bowl.</p> not bad.. I don't think theres a chance that Austin falls that far.. I think u look at Carlos Dunlap and guys like Andre Smith and Anthony Davis and Dez Bryant and what not, and they all didn't drop to RD 3... I realize none of those guys missed a Whole Season, but your still talking about a Projected Talent for his respective positon that matches the names listed above and there respective positons.. I honestly think someone at the end of RD 1 could try and steal a Top 15 talent in Austin, hoping they are getting just that and figuring its worth it... But if they don't, i almost gurantee someone does within the next half to slightly above half rd...

As u said, i don't think Batch goes in RD 7, thinking more on 4 through extremely early 6th... But i would enjoy the pick!

I really have fallen for kirkpatrick after hering u speak about him and i also like burton..

Overall, pretty solid, but i think its because u have a guy going mid to end rd 3 that won't be there... Just my opinion..

thegreatone
11-23-2010, 09:03 AM
1.Bruce Carter OLB NC- A do everything 3 down LB that can give a defense a ton of flexibility. His all around skill set to blitz and cover WR's in the slot can give a DC just way to many options to ignore.His outstanding ability on special teams is another huge plus as well.</p>


2. Brandon Burton CB Utah 6-0 185 - The Giants need a corner that much is obvious.. Brandon Burton is a little different then what we have seen the last few years from the Giants in the type of corner they covet. In Perry Fewells defense however a different type of corner may be a better idea. Burton excels in zone has a nice beck pedal and good recovery speed. I like Burton a lot in Fewells defense if he isnt the DC I would probably go with another corner in this spot. He is also a junior so he may opt to return especially if the CBA is not sorted out.</p>


3. Marvin Austin DT NC- Maybe Im crazy but I think he is going to fall do tocharacter concerns and a motor that doesnt always run. I think he is worththe risk here</p>


4. Jake Kirkpatrick C TCU- The best center in this class in my opion</p>


6. Eric Hagg S Nebraska / Jermaile Hines S Ohio State- I wanted to go safety higher but I couldnt find one with the skill set besides Mark Barron. Hagg plays as the Nickel defender in Nebraskas defense where they use him at linebacker,Safety, and CB. Another guy who I think is only an option if Fewell is the DC. Hines was used in a Deon Grant type role last year at Ohio State Hines comes with great size "6-2 210"that fits the tweener Linebacker/safety role to perfection.</p>


7. Barron Batch RB Texas Tech- Batch could go higher then this and probably will but he fits a need in my opinion. Batch reminds me some of Mike Goodson of the Panthers. Batch to me could make a very good 3rd down back in the NFL something I think the Giants surely lack. He also can help out on special teams and has 4.4 speed</p>


</p>


6-7 Schylur Oordt Northern Iowa- This tight end class is awful but Oordt has gret physical skills to me that cant be ignored a guy to watch in the Senior Bowl.</p>
if we get bruce carter the draft is already a WIN! ill settle for jones as well if carter is gone. i almost want to switch to a 3-4 just so i can say moch but i know that aint happening:P

thegreatone
11-23-2010, 09:12 AM
also depending on wether or not we can get it together and end up picking in the final 5-10 i could see wisniewski or dowling a strong possibility

nycsportzfan
11-23-2010, 09:16 AM
First wk in awhile i'm dropping the giants in my projected WEEKLY mock that i try and adjust to the most recent WK... I didn't do one last wk, or would of dropped em a pick or 2 then, as well.. I'm saying(guess) about pick 22 right now....


1. Akeem Ayers LB UCLA- Love em and his versatility.. Always good to have a SLB that isn't just a guy that can get to the QB but also hold his own in coverege and has a knack for making plays and has shown good hands and athletic ability..

2. Jason Pinkston OT PITT- This guy can play. Hes a 3yr starter on the left side and pitts run game has always been huge with him as the starting LT.. Good Footwork and Mobility and a talented player.. Not to impressed overall with Beatty Yet, and i'm not sold on Andrews staying healthy and of course we have other injury concerns plus age on our Oline..

3. Johnny Patrick CB LOUISVILLE- A very expierenced CB, whos not the attention getter of a Janoris Jenkins or Peterson, but gets it done, and does a heck of a job as the key cog of his defense.. Hes got decent size and speed and i think his stock is finally rising as it should of long ago, and don't be surprised if hes off the board by the time we pick here, but for now, hes my 3rd rd pick for us... We need another CB..

4. Weslye Saunders TE S.Carolina- Before off field issues, Saunders was touted as a Top TE in the country going forward and is a dual threat as a big strong blocker with solid hands.. It would of been fun to see his progress this yr, and the giants possibly needing a big blocking TE with at leaest Solid hands, take a gamble on Saunders here in RD 4, trying to get a steal, and for the TE positon and the giants needing a Starter for boss, its well worth the risk...

6. Kevin Kowalski C TOLEDO- This is a loaded C Class, and Kowalski has gained recogniton over the wk's and is a fundamentally sound, good sized C that could very easily sneak into the 5th rd, but with such a deep class of C's, i chose to wait untill RD 6, as C is a wierd positon and its odd to see so many taken in the first 5 rd's, so i'm banking someone good slips, and in my scenario, its kowalski.. Also watch small school standout brandon fusco's name, as it continues to gain recogniton(i know nothing about him though)....

7. Davonte Shannon SS BUFFALO- I'm almost banking on this kid getting drafted.. He's a tackling machine that also makes plays and has great size and good speed.. I've actually had alot of expierence with Buffalo on TV over the past couple yrs when they were good and got to see Shannon a few times before this season, and its no surprise hes putting together a Amazing yr in the MAC.. I think hes the type of player that makes a team and ends up being a stellar late rd pick for someone... He also would be good groomed to take over D.Grant's spot..

Redeyejedi
11-23-2010, 09:20 AM
1.Bruce Carter OLB NC- A do everything 3 down LB that can give a defense a ton of flexibility. His all around skill set to blitz and cover WR's in the slot can give a DC just way to many options to ignore.His outstanding ability on special teams is another huge plus as well.</P>


2. Brandon Burton CB Utah 6-0 185 - The Giants need a corner that much is obvious.. Brandon Burton is a little different then what we have seen the last few years from the Giants in the type of corner they covet. In Perry Fewells defense however a different type of corner may be a better idea. Burton excels in zone has a nice beck pedal and good recovery speed. I like Burton a lot in Fewells defense if he isnt the DC I would probably go with another corner in this spot. He is also a junior so he may opt to return especially if the CBA is not sorted out.</P>


3. Marvin Austin DT NC- Maybe Im crazy but I think he is going to fall do tocharacter concerns and a motor that doesnt always run. I think he is worththe risk here</P>


4. Jake Kirkpatrick C TCU- The best center in this class in my opinion</P>


6. Eric Hagg S Nebraska / Jermaile Hines S Ohio State- I wanted to go safety higher but I couldnt find one with the skill set besides Mark Barron. Hagg plays as the Nickel defender in Nebraskas defense where they use him at linebacker,Safety, and CB. Another guy who I think is only an option if Fewell is the DC. Hines was used in a Deon Grant type role last year at Ohio State Hines comes with great size "6-2 210"that fits the tweener Linebacker/safety role to perfection.</P>


7. Barron Batch RB Texas Tech- Batch could go higher then this and probably will but he fits a need in my opinion. Batch reminds me some of Mike Goodson of the Panthers. Batch to me could make a very good 3rd down back in the NFL something I think the Giants surely lack. He also can help out on special teams and has 4.4 speed</P>


</P>


6-7 Schylur Oordt Northern Iowa- This tight end class is awful but Oordt has gret physical skills to me that cant be ignored a guy to watch in the Senior Bowl.</P> not bad.. I don't think theres a chance that Austin falls that far.. I think u look at Carlos Dunlap and guys like Andre Smith and Anthony Davis and Dez Bryant and what not, and they all didn't drop to RD 3... I realize none of those guys missed a Whole Season, but your still talking about a Projected Talent for his respective positon that matches the names listed above and there respective positons.. I honestly think someone at the end of RD 1 could try and steal a Top 15 talent in Austin, hoping they are getting just that and figuring its worth it... But if they don't, i almost gurantee someone does within the next half to slightly above half rd...

As u said, i don't think Batch goes in RD 7, thinking more on 4 through extremely early 6th... But i would enjoy the pick!

I really have fallen for kirkpatrick after hering u speak about him and i also like burton..

Overall, pretty solid, but i think its because u have a guy going mid to end rd 3 that won't be there... Just my opinion..
Your right about Austin Im just having a hard time finding somebody to go in that spot. If Coefield is brought back DT isnt a need though. I wanted to put in the 3rd round a safety,pass rush specialist DE, a 3rd down back or a TE but I couldnt really fit any of those spots there. I thought about possibly Noel Devine but I think he will go in the 2nd round. The TE class is god awful so theres no go there. Mark Barron? I like him and would fill the tweener LB/safety role wellbut he is a junior and I think he will return or go in the 2nd round. A pass rush specialist at DE if we lose Kiwi . I thought Jeremy Beal would of been option here in September but he has been great so I doubt he will be available. Maybe an OT like Carimi or Love

heavyhitter
11-23-2010, 04:17 PM
<font size="3">Kind of off topic, but it's got to do w/ a draft prospect so here it is. Christian Ponders girlfriend is fine as f**. </font>http://i189.photobucket.com/albums/z46/kcochran777/untitled-1.jpg
http://i189.photobucket.com/albums/z46/kcochran777/149113_1701728111075_1474110036_31804635_4688596_n .jpg

slipknottin
11-23-2010, 04:24 PM
There are a couple underclassmen safetys who may be 3rd rounders.

Kenny Tate and Robert Sands

heavyhitter
11-23-2010, 04:33 PM
There are a couple underclassmen safetys who may be 3rd rounders.

Kenny Tate and Robert Sands<font size="3">Watched Kenny Tate last week vs FSU. Kid has got potential- I just don't see Sands as a 3rd rounder, I'm much higher on Tate. I see Sands as maybe a 5th or 6th rounder. Just my opinion-</font>

heavyhitter
11-23-2010, 04:43 PM
<font size="3">Kind of off topic, but it's got to do w/ a draft prospect so here it is. Christian Ponders girlfriend is fine as f**. </font>http://i189.photobucket.com/albums/z46/kcochran777/untitled-1.jpg
http://i189.photobucket.com/albums/z46/kcochran777/149113_1701728111075_1474110036_31804635_4688596_n .jpg
<font size="3">Another pic of Ponders chick. She goes to school at Nova.
http://i189.photobucket.com/albums/z46/kcochran777/untitled.jpg
</font>

heavyhitter
11-23-2010, 05:04 PM
<font size="4">S Kenny Tate, Maryland 6"4/ 220 lbs - </font>
<h3 dir="ltr"><a id="video-long-title-CyM7E31Csac" href="http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=CyM7E31Csac" title="(HD) Kenny Tate (Maryland) lights up Taiwan Easterling (FSU)" rel="nofollow">(HD) Kenny Tate (Maryland) lights up Taiwan Easterling (FSU)
</a></h3>

nycsportzfan
11-24-2010, 06:33 AM
1.Bruce Carter OLB NC- A do everything 3 down LB that can give a defense a ton of flexibility. His all around skill set to blitz and cover WR's in the slot can give a DC just way to many options to ignore.His outstanding ability on special teams is another huge plus as well.</p>


2. Brandon Burton CB Utah 6-0 185 - The Giants need a corner that much is obvious.. Brandon Burton is a little different then what we have seen the last few years from the Giants in the type of corner they covet. In Perry Fewells defense however a different type of corner may be a better idea. Burton excels in zone has a nice beck pedal and good recovery speed. I like Burton a lot in Fewells defense if he isnt the DC I would probably go with another corner in this spot. He is also a junior so he may opt to return especially if the CBA is not sorted out.</p>


3. Marvin Austin DT NC- Maybe Im crazy but I think he is going to fall do tocharacter concerns and a motor that doesnt always run. I think he is worththe risk here</p>


4. Jake Kirkpatrick C TCU- The best center in this class in my opinion</p>


6. Eric Hagg S Nebraska / Jermaile Hines S Ohio State- I wanted to go safety higher but I couldnt find one with the skill set besides Mark Barron. Hagg plays as the Nickel defender in Nebraskas defense where they use him at linebacker,Safety, and CB. Another guy who I think is only an option if Fewell is the DC. Hines was used in a Deon Grant type role last year at Ohio State Hines comes with great size "6-2 210"that fits the tweener Linebacker/safety role to perfection.</p>


7. Barron Batch RB Texas Tech- Batch could go higher then this and probably will but he fits a need in my opinion. Batch reminds me some of Mike Goodson of the Panthers. Batch to me could make a very good 3rd down back in the NFL something I think the Giants surely lack. He also can help out on special teams and has 4.4 speed</p>


</p>


6-7 Schylur Oordt Northern Iowa- This tight end class is awful but Oordt has gret physical skills to me that cant be ignored a guy to watch in the Senior Bowl.</p> not bad.. I don't think theres a chance that Austin falls that far.. I think u look at Carlos Dunlap and guys like Andre Smith and Anthony Davis and Dez Bryant and what not, and they all didn't drop to RD 3... I realize none of those guys missed a Whole Season, but your still talking about a Projected Talent for his respective positon that matches the names listed above and there respective positons.. I honestly think someone at the end of RD 1 could try and steal a Top 15 talent in Austin, hoping they are getting just that and figuring its worth it... But if they don't, i almost gurantee someone does within the next half to slightly above half rd...

As u said, i don't think Batch goes in RD 7, thinking more on 4 through extremely early 6th... But i would enjoy the pick!

I really have fallen for kirkpatrick after hering u speak about him and i also like burton..

Overall, pretty solid, but i think its because u have a guy going mid to end rd 3 that won't be there... Just my opinion..
Your right about Austin Im just having a hard time finding somebody to go in that spot. If Coefield is brought back DT isnt a need though. I wanted to put in the 3rd round a safety,pass rush specialist DE, a 3rd down back or a TE but I couldnt really fit any of those spots there. I thought about possibly Noel Devine but I think he will go in the 2nd round. The TE class is god awful so theres no go there. Mark Barron? I like him and would fill the tweener LB/safety role wellbut he is a junior and I think he will return or go in the 2nd round. A pass rush specialist at DE if we lose Kiwi . I thought Jeremy Beal would of been option here in September but he has been great so I doubt he will be available. Maybe an OT like Carimi or Love A SS that i think would be sensational to draft toward the end of rd 3, because he may not make it to the end of RD 4, is Joe Lefeged of Rutgers.. I've watched a ton of Rutgers this yr, and the guy is a thumper whos got solid instincts and can return kicks not to mention be a beast on special teams, blocking punts and what not, as he did twice in one game against FIU... Those are the type of players we need, verstatile.. And those are the players we like as well.. I just don't know if Joe's quite a 3rd rd prospect, but i think he'd be a steal, because i think hes got a pro career, and a good one in front of him

Redeyejedi
11-24-2010, 09:51 AM
First wk in awhile i'm dropping the giants in my projected WEEKLY mock that i try and adjust to the most recent WK... I didn't do one last wk, or would of dropped em a pick or 2 then, as well.. I'm saying(guess) about pick 22 right now....


1. Akeem Ayers LB UCLA- Love em and his versatility.. Always good to have a SLB that isn't just a guy that can get to the QB but also hold his own in coverege and has a knack for making plays and has shown good hands and athletic ability..

2. Jason Pinkston OT PITT- This guy can play. Hes a 3yr starter on the left side and pitts run game has always been huge with him as the starting LT.. Good Footwork and Mobility and a talented player.. Not to impressed overall with Beatty Yet, and i'm not sold on Andrews staying healthy and of course we have other injury concerns plus age on our Oline..

3. Johnny Patrick CB LOUISVILLE- A very expierenced CB, whos not the attention getter of a Janoris Jenkins or Peterson, but gets it done, and does a heck of a job as the key cog of his defense.. Hes got decent size and speed and i think his stock is finally rising as it should of long ago, and don't be surprised if hes off the board by the time we pick here, but for now, hes my 3rd rd pick for us... We need another CB..

4. Weslye Saunders TE S.Carolina- Before off field issues, Saunders was touted as a Top TE in the country going forward and is a dual threat as a big strong blocker with solid hands.. It would of been fun to see his progress this yr, and the giants possibly needing a big blocking TE with at leaest Solid hands, take a gamble on Saunders here in RD 4, trying to get a steal, and for the TE positon and the giants needing a Starter for boss, its well worth the risk...

6. Kevin Kowalski C TOLEDO- This is a loaded C Class, and Kowalski has gained recogniton over the wk's and is a fundamentally sound, good sized C that could very easily sneak into the 5th rd, but with such a deep class of C's, i chose to wait untill RD 6, as C is a wierd positon and its odd to see so many taken in the first 5 rd's, so i'm banking someone good slips, and in my scenario, its kowalski.. Also watch small school standout brandon fusco's name, as it continues to gain recogniton(i know nothing about him though)....

7. Davonte Shannon SS BUFFALO- I'm almost banking on this kid getting drafted.. He's a tackling machine that also makes plays and has great size and good speed.. I've actually had alot of expierence with Buffalo on TV over the past couple yrs when they were good and got to see Shannon a few times before this season, and its no surprise hes putting together a Amazing yr in the MAC.. I think hes the type of player that makes a team and ends up being a stellar late rd pick for someone... He also would be good groomed to take over D.Grant's spot..
All good players. I like Ayers as a prospect and if Fewell isnt the DC here I would like him more for the Giants. I think he would of been a very good fit for Spags defense actually. I think with Fewell thougha guy with a little more speed and coverage ability is a better fit. Not that Ayers isnt good with both those things but guys like Carter and Lewis to me seem like a better fit, just my opinion good player though. OT to me is a weird spot I could see the Giants taking one high or not at all. I see 4 guys that havegood ability to play tackle on this team. A lot just depends on Andrews if he locks down the LT spot. If he does U then have Diehl and Beatty as back ups for both tackle spots which is pretty dam good.. Mckenzie play has earned him another year which will give Will Beatty one more year to prove himself as a viable canidate. If he can not, Well the Giants draft one high in 2012. Now if Andrews gets hurt or something happens, Well then U probably need to draft one. As it currently stands Im conflicted on the spot. The cornerback ,Ill take your word on havent watched much Big East football this year. That conference is in the toilet. I dont think they should have an at large BCS bid. Weslye Saunders was a guy I considered as well in my mock. I just really dont like this TE class, Its awful. All the guys are either really undersized, soft, orboth. The lack of them leads me to believe they will be over drafted. Saunders got kicked off his team but has the size and talent to be a good player. In this draft he is about as good as they come . The guy I like Schuylar Oordt from Northern Iowa has a very good size speed combo 6-6 246 pounds 4.65 40. He also beats defenses for big plays. He only has 24 catches but for 400 yards a healthy 16.67 YPC. 6 of his 24 catches have been for over 38 yards. With a team that hasnt thrown the ball to the TE much this year a guy that could just beat the defense down the seam for 35 yards once a game could be a good thing. In this awful class a guy with his athleticism and penchant for big plays cant be ignored. I like Kirkpatrick and I really think he has a good chance of being drafted by the Giants but Kowalski isnt a bad player. Has good size with a frame to bulk up and help out at guard if needed. I would not mind getting him if we dont get Kirkpatrick. Davonte Shannon has insane tackle numbers and seems like a good fit as a SS.

slipknottin
11-24-2010, 12:11 PM
Ayers to me is best at 3-4 strong side backer.

Imagine him across from Clay Matthews. Perfect fit there. As a 4-3 backer, not as good a fit.

thegreatone
11-24-2010, 03:20 PM
Ayers to me is best at 3-4 strong side backer.

Imagine him across from Clay Matthews. Perfect fit there. As a 4-3 backer, not as good a fit.that is a scary image.

nycsportzfan
11-24-2010, 04:35 PM
Ayers to me is best at 3-4 strong side backer.

Imagine him across from Clay Matthews. Perfect fit there. As a 4-3 backer, not as good a fit. i think Ayers fits either system perfectly well, and i think thats why so many mocks have him going to either or(4/3-3/4)... The thing i like about him in a 4/3 is he can cover well for a SLB... I love how he plays off blocks..

Redeyejedi
11-24-2010, 04:53 PM
Ayers to me is best at 3-4 strong side backer. Imagine him across from Clay Matthews. Perfect fit there. As a 4-3 backer, not as good a fit.Kinda might thoughts as well, I think he is a good player not just the best fit with this DC. I think with Spags he could of worked. To me Bruce Carter seems like the best fitfor the Giants skill set wise.If he gets to the size I think he will with that speed he can be a nasty SOLB in Fewells defense. He probably would be a WLBin most defenses though.My linebacker wish list is </P>


1.Bruce Carter NC</P>


2. Travis Lewis Oklahoma</P>


3.Quan Sturdivant NC</P>


4.Nigel Bradham FSU</P>


</P>


My frustration is coming at the future at safety. After watching how Grant was used I can envision what the Giants were thinking with Chad Jones. He would of been unbelievable in that role and it just really sucks for him and for the Giants.All of the players that seem ripe for that role are all juniors. I just dont know if many juniors are going to come out with an impending lockout. Those fringe 2nd 3rd rounders will probably just stay.</P>


Does anyone watch any of Pitt. They have a big kid playing SS Dom Deccico.Havent watched a lot of Big East this year if anyones got the skinny on him Im interested.</P>


As I mentioned before Jeremiline Hines and Eric Hagg have been used in similar ways at Ohio State and Nebraska. </P>

slipknottin
11-24-2010, 04:56 PM
i think Ayers fits either system perfectly well, and i think thats why so many mocks have him going to either or(4/3-3/4)...* The thing i like about him in a 4/3 is he can cover well for a SLB... I love how he plays off blocks..


Every scouting report/mock draft Ive seen done by professionals show him being best fit as a 3-4 OLB on the strongside, similar to Woodley. Those guys have more coverage and run stopping responsibility than the 3-4 weakside backer who is primarily the rush backer.

His skill set could translate to a 4-3, but he has far more value as a 3-4 OLB.

nycsportzfan
11-24-2010, 06:49 PM
i think Ayers fits either system perfectly well, and i think thats why so many mocks have him going to either or(4/3-3/4)... The thing i like about him in a 4/3 is he can cover well for a SLB... I love how he plays off blocks..


Every scouting report/mock draft Ive seen done by professionals show him being best fit as a 3-4 OLB on the strongside, similar to Woodley. Those guys have more coverage and run stopping responsibility than the 3-4 weakside backer who is primarily the rush backer.

His skill set could translate to a 4-3, but he has far more value as a 3-4 OLB. Professionals???lol Anyhow.. I do agree, he could fit a 3/4 great, but because of his abilty to do so much more then just rush the passer, i could see him being a asset to either the 4/3 or 3/4... The giants seem to like big strong SLB's, hence Kiwi, Sintim and Adrian Tracy, so why not get one that is more versatile and can do more then the others? That said, it woulden't surprise me to see him go to either formation, and i've watched a ton of him, and was writing about him on here, way before he was a shoe in for the 1st rd, so i'm basing this on what i've seen from him with my own eyes...

nycsportzfan
11-24-2010, 06:52 PM
First wk in awhile i'm dropping the giants in my projected WEEKLY mock that i try and adjust to the most recent WK... I didn't do one last wk, or would of dropped em a pick or 2 then, as well.. I'm saying(guess) about pick 22 right now....


1. Akeem Ayers LB UCLA- Love em and his versatility.. Always good to have a SLB that isn't just a guy that can get to the QB but also hold his own in coverege and has a knack for making plays and has shown good hands and athletic ability..

2. Jason Pinkston OT PITT- This guy can play. Hes a 3yr starter on the left side and pitts run game has always been huge with him as the starting LT.. Good Footwork and Mobility and a talented player.. Not to impressed overall with Beatty Yet, and i'm not sold on Andrews staying healthy and of course we have other injury concerns plus age on our Oline..

3. Johnny Patrick CB LOUISVILLE- A very expierenced CB, whos not the attention getter of a Janoris Jenkins or Peterson, but gets it done, and does a heck of a job as the key cog of his defense.. Hes got decent size and speed and i think his stock is finally rising as it should of long ago, and don't be surprised if hes off the board by the time we pick here, but for now, hes my 3rd rd pick for us... We need another CB..

4. Weslye Saunders TE S.Carolina- Before off field issues, Saunders was touted as a Top TE in the country going forward and is a dual threat as a big strong blocker with solid hands.. It would of been fun to see his progress this yr, and the giants possibly needing a big blocking TE with at leaest Solid hands, take a gamble on Saunders here in RD 4, trying to get a steal, and for the TE positon and the giants needing a Starter for boss, its well worth the risk...

6. Kevin Kowalski C TOLEDO- This is a loaded C Class, and Kowalski has gained recogniton over the wk's and is a fundamentally sound, good sized C that could very easily sneak into the 5th rd, but with such a deep class of C's, i chose to wait untill RD 6, as C is a wierd positon and its odd to see so many taken in the first 5 rd's, so i'm banking someone good slips, and in my scenario, its kowalski.. Also watch small school standout brandon fusco's name, as it continues to gain recogniton(i know nothing about him though)....

7. Davonte Shannon SS BUFFALO- I'm almost banking on this kid getting drafted.. He's a tackling machine that also makes plays and has great size and good speed.. I've actually had alot of expierence with Buffalo on TV over the past couple yrs when they were good and got to see Shannon a few times before this season, and its no surprise hes putting together a Amazing yr in the MAC.. I think hes the type of player that makes a team and ends up being a stellar late rd pick for someone... He also would be good groomed to take over D.Grant's spot..
All good players. I like Ayers as a prospect and if Fewell isnt the DC here I would like him more for the Giants. I think he would of been a very good fit for Spags defense actually. I think with Fewell thougha guy with a little more speed and coverage ability is a better fit. Not that Ayers isnt good with both those things but guys like Carter and Lewis to me seem like a better fit, just my opinion good player though. OT to me is a weird spot I could see the Giants taking one high or not at all. I see 4 guys that havegood ability to play tackle on this team. A lot just depends on Andrews if he locks down the LT spot. If he does U then have Diehl and Beatty as back ups for both tackle spots which is pretty dam good.. Mckenzie play has earned him another year which will give Will Beatty one more year to prove himself as a viable canidate. If he can not, Well the Giants draft one high in 2012. Now if Andrews gets hurt or something happens, Well then U probably need to draft one. As it currently stands Im conflicted on the spot. The cornerback ,Ill take your word on havent watched much Big East football this year. That conference is in the toilet. I dont think they should have an at large BCS bid. Weslye Saunders was a guy I considered as well in my mock. I just really dont like this TE class, Its awful. All the guys are either really undersized, soft, orboth. The lack of them leads me to believe they will be over drafted. Saunders got kicked off his team but has the size and talent to be a good player. In this draft he is about as good as they come . The guy I like Schuylar Oordt from Northern Iowa has a very good size speed combo 6-6 246 pounds 4.65 40. He also beats defenses for big plays. He only has 24 catches but for 400 yards a healthy 16.67 YPC. 6 of his 24 catches have been for over 38 yards. With a team that hasnt thrown the ball to the TE much this year a guy that could just beat the defense down the seam for 35 yards once a game could be a good thing. In this awful class a guy with his athleticism and penchant for big plays cant be ignored. I like Kirkpatrick and I really think he has a good chance of being drafted by the Giants but Kowalski isnt a bad player. Has good size with a frame to bulk up and help out at guard if needed. I would not mind getting him if we dont get Kirkpatrick. Davonte Shannon has insane tackle numbers and seems like a good fit as a SS. Ya, with saunders, i figure in such a weak class, why not try and steal a TE that has dropped for off field reasons, but has big potential and can at least block well, and his hands were ever improving... In such a weak TE class, i figure its worth the gamble trying to get a TE with big potential that dropped for off field issue's

slipknottin
11-24-2010, 06:52 PM
Professionals???lol Anyhow..

yes... paid scouts.

nycsportzfan
11-24-2010, 07:00 PM
Professionals???lol Anyhow..

yes... paid scouts. who? And what paid scouts are doing mock drafts? Thats ridiculous.. Why would they be mocking teams there scouting for? I could see scouting reports, but mock drafts? They have to much time on there hands...


Anyway, i really could care less about any of that, because they are wrong a ridiculous amount of time, and it gets old thinking those sites or any for that matter, know whats going on, then draft day comes, and its completly diffrent, and full of surprises usually starting within the first 5picks...

U watch this tape, and tell me, why This guy woulden't fit a 4/3 absoulutley perfectly.. This is around when i started really following Ayers, as i bet this game and fell in love with Ayers... Notice, almost every play, UCLA is playing with 4down lineman as any 4/3 usually does, and hes lining up in coverege and standing up to rush and inside even.... He can do it all, absoulutley no problem for him...

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bdpaoo
11-24-2010, 08:13 PM
<span id="result_box" class="short_text" lang="en"><span style="" title="">I wish you the door to good luck.. (http://www.myedhardyclothing.com/sinful-clothing-327.html)
</span></span>

slipknottin
11-25-2010, 01:43 AM
As I said, he could fit in a 4-3 defense, but the value is much much higher for a 3-4 OLB than there is for a strongside 4-3 backer.

From all the tape Ive seen of him, he looks more like a 34 strongside backer, he reminds me a ton of Lamarr Woodley

nycsportzfan
11-25-2010, 02:49 AM
As I said, he could fit in a 4-3 defense, but the value is much much higher for a 3-4 OLB than there is for a strongside 4-3 backer.

From all the tape Ive seen of him, he looks more like a 34 strongside backer, he reminds me a ton of Lamarr Woodley he was almost never in a 3/4 in that tape.. but to each his own... I dissagree, and think he 100pct fits equally as a strong or weak side lb in either formation.. I love his Athletic, not to big but sleek frame, that is good for batting pass's on pass rush's and getting his hands on a pass last second in coverege... He reminds me of the type of SLB i think the giants would love to have, as they looked through Kiwi, Sintim and A.tracy to find... A guy whos more athletic, and also is a dual threat, not just one sided.. Fewell could do alot of things with someone that versatile... But your opinion is one i know will not be changed and even if there was a sign that said, "ayers is just as adequete in 3/4 as 4/3", u would find someway to argue it......lol I love the guy, have coming into the yr, and will continue to hope he's a possiblity for the giants.. I do have other players i obviously like as well for the gmen...


What do u think about jimmy smith and Demarcus Love? There just a couple more guys i really like along with j.jenkins..

slipknottin
11-25-2010, 02:53 AM
he was almost never in a 3/4 in that tape..

Its not about where he lines up, its about how he plays, and what his skill set best fits.

As for OTs, I dont pay much attention to offensive linemen, they are too boring to scout.

Redeyejedi
11-25-2010, 08:03 AM
As I said, he could fit in a 4-3 defense, but the value is much much higher for a 3-4 OLB than there is for a strongside 4-3 backer. From all the tape Ive seen of him, he looks more like a 34 strongside backer, he reminds me a ton of Lamarr Woodley he was almost never in a 3/4 in that tape.. but to each his own... I dissagree, and think he 100pct fits equally as a strong or weak side lb in either formation.. I love his Athletic, not to big but sleek frame, that is good for batting pass's on pass rush's and getting his hands on a pass last second in coverege... He reminds me of the type of SLB i think the giants would love to have, as they looked through Kiwi, Sintim and A.tracy to find... A guy whos more athletic, <FONT size=5>and also is a dual threat, not just one sided</FONT>.. Fewell could do alot of things with someone that versatile... But your opinion is one i know will not be changed and even if there was a sign that said, "ayers is just as adequete in 3/4 as 4/3", u would find someway to argue it......lol I love the guy, have coming into the yr, and will continue to hope he's a possiblity for the giants.. I do have other players i obviously like as well for the gmen...


What do u think about jimmy smith and Demarcus Love? There just a couple more guys i really like along with j.jenkins..
</P>


Dual threat - He does a lot of things well but nothing great.He seems like a guy that needs to be shuffled around to get maxium prudction out of him. Who drafts this guy is going to make a huge differance in how his career unfolds, Way more then the average NFL player. Thats whyI agree with Slip he is better off in a 3-4. U can utilize him to a greater capacity In that defense I believe</P>


some videos on him , Technique wise its kind of bad but that can be fixed. Its sucks that the 2 games I watched where I saw a lot of snaps where widely regarded as his worst 2 games. .He is a little raw still and may benefit playing another year in college. Plays a little high for my liking especially for a guy thats 6-4. Sportzfans probably going to get crazy but I dont think he is 255 like he is listed. He has tools to work with though thats for sure may be a bit of a tweener though.</P>


http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=q14Px6MLRfk&amp;feature=related</P>


http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=l5OeiwZVjzI</P>


</P>


Demarcus Love is a guy I wouldnt mind drafting. I like Derreck Sherrod still the best followed by Joesph Barksdale.</P>


Im still not convinced thats a need though it depends a lot on Andrews</P>

nycsportzfan
11-25-2010, 11:09 AM
he was almost never in a 3/4 in that tape..

Its not about where he lines up, its about how he plays, and what his skill set best fits.

As for OTs, I dont pay much attention to offensive linemen, they are too boring to scout. exactly.. He drops in coverege and rush's the passer...lol he plays off blocks well, and does all the things that a SLB should do... The bottom line is the giants like big SLB"s, like Kiwi, A.Tracy and Sintim, and getting one that has some coverege ability is the perfect scenario...

nycsportzfan
11-25-2010, 11:16 AM
As I said, he could fit in a 4-3 defense, but the value is much much higher for a 3-4 OLB than there is for a strongside 4-3 backer. From all the tape Ive seen of him, he looks more like a 34 strongside backer, he reminds me a ton of Lamarr Woodley he was almost never in a 3/4 in that tape.. but to each his own... I dissagree, and think he 100pct fits equally as a strong or weak side lb in either formation.. I love his Athletic, not to big but sleek frame, that is good for batting pass's on pass rush's and getting his hands on a pass last second in coverege... He reminds me of the type of SLB i think the giants would love to have, as they looked through Kiwi, Sintim and A.tracy to find... A guy whos more athletic, <font size="5">and also is a dual threat, not just one sided</font>.. Fewell could do alot of things with someone that versatile... But your opinion is one i know will not be changed and even if there was a sign that said, "ayers is just as adequete in 3/4 as 4/3", u would find someway to argue it......lol I love the guy, have coming into the yr, and will continue to hope he's a possiblity for the giants.. I do have other players i obviously like as well for the gmen...


What do u think about jimmy smith and Demarcus Love? There just a couple more guys i really like along with j.jenkins..
</p>


Dual threat - He does a lot of things well but nothing great.He seems like a guy that needs to be shuffled around to get maxium prudction out of him. Who drafts this guy is going to make a huge differance in how his career unfolds, Way more then the average NFL player. Thats whyI agree with Slip he is better off in a 3-4. U can utilize him to a greater capacity In that defense I believe</p>


some videos on him , Technique wise its kind of bad but that can be fixed. Its sucks that the 2 games I watched where I saw a lot of snaps where widely regarded as his worst 2 games. .He is a little raw still and may benefit playing another year in college. Plays a little high for my liking especially for a guy thats 6-4. Sportzfans probably going to get crazy but I dont think he is 255 like he is listed. He has tools to work with though thats for sure may be a bit of a tweener though.</p>


http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=q14Px6MLRfk&amp;feature=related</p>


http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=l5OeiwZVjzI</p>


</p>


Demarcus Love is a guy I wouldnt mind drafting. I like Derreck Sherrod still the best followed by Joesph Barksdale.</p>


Im still not convinced thats a need though it depends a lot on Andrews</p> man, i've watched Ayers about 6times, i don't even need those video's... Remember i was talking about him as a 1st rder and half the people didn't even know who i was talking about? Same for Derek Sherrod.. I was talking about Sherrod as the best OT in the country when all u heard about was Costanzo Carimi and SOlder... I'm not saying Ayers is champ bailey, but for a team who like a Bigger SLB who can get to the passer, then why would u not like a guy who can play off his blocks and get that RB that is trying to bounce it outside and can also fake the blitz and drop into a zone or maybe take on a TE or something.. I mean, the more u can do, the more teams want u.. Ayers has extremely good hands and is a player i think will fit easily into any scheme.. Just as most were saying Sintim would go to a 3/4, i didn't buy that, i don't buy this.. IF anyhting, sintim was more suited then ayers, becuase sintim didn't do much of any covering... Also, i bet Ayers weighs closer to 247-250, then 255, because hes slender and Sleek, hes got size that fits either sceme, and the giants are also always looking for players that can get to the QB, and Ayers is a Player outside of just the Dline that can do that... I love him for a 4/3 and i love him for a 3/4....

nycsportzfan
11-25-2010, 11:22 AM
he was almost never in a 3/4 in that tape..

Its not about where he lines up, its about how he plays, and what his skill set best fits.

As for OTs, I dont pay much attention to offensive linemen, they are too boring to scout. ok, and i don't see anything that screams 3/4 watching him.. Sure, its a good fit for him, but no more or no less then a 4/3... With all the 3/4 teams out there, sure he can go to a 3/4 team, but it woulden't surprise me in the least bit if he goes to a 4/3 team either, and the giants are always looking for players that can do multiple things, and with bullock getting old, Sintim not panning out, A.tracy getting hurt and not knowing much of what he'll do, and Ayers having almost identical size as Tracy and SIntim, and having more expierence in covering, then why not? I mean, they drafted both Trace and Sintim the last couple yrs, guys that people said were 3/4..

Redeyejedi
11-25-2010, 12:27 PM
As I said, he could fit in a 4-3 defense, but the value is much much higher for a 3-4 OLB than there is for a strongside 4-3 backer. From all the tape Ive seen of him, he looks more like a 34 strongside backer, he reminds me a ton of Lamarr Woodley he was almost never in a 3/4 in that tape.. but to each his own... I dissagree, and think he 100pct fits equally as a strong or weak side lb in either formation.. I love his Athletic, not to big but sleek frame, that is good for batting pass's on pass rush's and getting his hands on a pass last second in coverege... He reminds me of the type of SLB i think the giants would love to have, as they looked through Kiwi, Sintim and A.tracy to find... A guy whos more athletic, <FONT size=5>and also is a dual threat, not just one sided</FONT>.. Fewell could do alot of things with someone that versatile... But your opinion is one i know will not be changed and even if there was a sign that said, "ayers is just as adequete in 3/4 as 4/3", u would find someway to argue it......lol I love the guy, have coming into the yr, and will continue to hope he's a possiblity for the giants.. I do have other players i obviously like as well for the gmen...


What do u think about jimmy smith and Demarcus Love? There just a couple more guys i really like along with j.jenkins..
</P>


Dual threat - He does a lot of things well but nothing great.He seems like a guy that needs to be shuffled around to get maxium prudction out of him. Who drafts this guy is going to make a huge differance in how his career unfolds, Way more then the average NFL player. Thats whyI agree with Slip he is better off in a 3-4. U can utilize him to a greater capacity In that defense I believe</P>


some videos on him , Technique wise its kind of bad but that can be fixed. Its sucks that the 2 games I watched where I saw a lot of snaps where widely regarded as his worst 2 games. .He is a little raw still and may benefit playing another year in college. Plays a little high for my liking especially for a guy thats 6-4. Sportzfans probably going to get crazy but I dont think he is 255 like he is listed. He has tools to work with though thats for sure may be a bit of a tweener though.</P>


http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=q14Px6MLRfk&amp;feature=related</P>


http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=l5OeiwZVjzI</P>


</P>


Demarcus Love is a guy I wouldnt mind drafting. I like Derreck Sherrod still the best followed by Joesph Barksdale.</P>


Im still not convinced thats a need though it depends a lot on Andrews</P>


man, i've watched Ayers about 6times, i don't even need those video's... Remember i was talking about him as a 1st rder and half the people didn't even know who i was talking about? Same for Derek Sherrod.. I was talking about Sherrod as the best OT in the country when all u heard about was Costanzo Carimi and SOlder... I'm not saying Ayers is champ bailey, but for a team who like a Bigger SLB who can get to the passer, then why would u not like a guy who can play off his blocks and get that RB that is trying to bounce it outside and can also fake the blitz and drop into a zone or maybe take on a TE or something.. I mean, the more u can do, the more teams want u.. Ayers has extremely good hands and is a player i think will fit easily into any scheme.. Just as most were saying Sintim would go to a 3/4, i didn't buy that, i don't buy this.. IF anyhting, sintim was more suited then ayers, becuase sintim didn't do much of any covering... Also, i bet Ayers weighs closer to 247-250, then 255, because hes slender and Sleek, hes got size that fits either sceme, and the giants are also always looking for players that can get to the QB, and Ayers is a Player outside of just the Dline that can do that... I love him for a 4/3 and i love him for a 3/4....
</P>


Some 4-3 teams I do. If Spags was here I would like him more for the Giants. I like him for the Patriots or like slip said the Packers the best. Im not debating he has some upside though.Not sure what to think about Juniors in this class though. With the Labor situation who knows if these guys come out.</P>

slipknottin
11-26-2010, 01:02 PM
exactly.. He drops in coverege and rush's the passer...lol
SLBs in a 4-3 dont do much pass rushing, dont even usually stay on the field on passing downs.... Thats exactly what you want in a 3-4 SLB however. Pass rush ability combined with ability to drop in space.


The bottom line is the giants like big SLB"s, like Kiwi, A.Tracy and Sintim, and getting one that has some coverege ability is the perfect scenario...


Right now the giants starting SLB is 235 pounds.... And before him was a 233 pound Danny Clark.

nycsportzfan
11-26-2010, 01:51 PM
exactly.. He drops in coverege and rush's the passer...lol
SLBs in a 4-3 dont do much pass rushing, dont even usually stay on the field on passing downs.... Thats exactly what you want in a 3-4 SLB however. Pass rush ability combined with ability to drop in space.


The bottom line is the giants like big SLB"s, like Kiwi, A.Tracy and Sintim, and getting one that has some coverege ability is the perfect scenario...


Right now the giants starting SLB is 235 pounds.... And before him was a 233 pound Danny Clark. i guess u forgot about Kiwi... i guess u forgot about sintim.. the only reason we picked up sintim in the draft was to rush the passer from the SLB positon.. And the giants have been trying to get away from the 230lb SLB, obviously.. Hence, Adrian Tracy, kiwi and Sintim.. We had our best success from the SLB when Kiwi was our SLB, for that short time, he was showing all sorts of potential before going back to DE because of injurys to OSI... Kiwi was Sacking the QB, Defending Pass's and really starting to make plays when he was are SLB, sintim has simply been a bust because hes so one dimensional and dosen't even do that well, to this point, and A Tracy got hurt... Ayers would be sensational for our team, but is one of many teams that could get em, so its very unlikley..

nycsportzfan
11-26-2010, 01:54 PM
exactly.. He drops in coverege and rush's the passer...lol
SLBs in a 4-3 dont do much pass rushing, dont even usually stay on the field on passing downs.... Thats exactly what you want in a 3-4 SLB however. Pass rush ability combined with ability to drop in space.


The bottom line is the giants like big SLB"s, like Kiwi, A.Tracy and Sintim, and getting one that has some coverege ability is the perfect scenario...


Right now the giants starting SLB is 235 pounds.... And before him was a 233 pound Danny Clark. ya, well when your 2nd RD SLB has been a bust and A Tracy being injured, and jon goff winning the MLB job, u are left with Bullock at SLB... Its because the plans have not worked out for NYG, and GOFF has been good, that we don't have a 248-255lb slb out there for us..

slipknottin
11-26-2010, 03:23 PM
the only reason we picked up sintim in the draft was to rush the passer from the SLB positon..* And the giants have been trying to get awa

I disagree. Sintim was drafted to play the on the line LB in Sheridan's 4-3 under defense. A position the giants no longer use.

Kiwi at LB was really more of him being a standup DE than an actual LB.

The way Fewell calls his defense, you want pass coverage over pass rushing ability. How often have we seen Bulluck sent after the QB?

Redeyejedi
11-26-2010, 03:31 PM
the only reason we picked up sintim in the draft was to rush the passer from the SLB positon.. And the giants have been trying to get awa I disagree. Sintim was drafted to play the on the line LB in Sheridan's 4-3 under defense. A position the giants no longer use. Kiwi at LB was really more of him being a standup DE than an actual LB. The way Fewell calls his defense, you want pass coverage over pass rushing ability. How often have we seen Bulluck sent after the QB?Yeah Kiwi wasnt really used like a normal LB and when he was put in pass coverage he looked very stiff.

Redeyejedi
11-26-2010, 03:31 PM
Anyonw watching the Iron Bowl Alabama is kicking the snot out of Auburn

Redeyejedi
11-26-2010, 03:39 PM
Marcel Dareus is playing out of his mind so far in this game. Lol a 15 yard punt from Auburn. I dont know whats going on with Auburn but they look like a Div 3 team right now. I mean if this keeps going like this game is going to be 56-0

slipknottin
11-26-2010, 03:42 PM
Marcel Dareus is playing out of his mind so far in this game.

Fairley on Auburn is playing great too.

Nobody on Auburn can cover Julio Jones.

Redeyejedi
11-27-2010, 10:18 AM
Anyone else have some questions on Newtons pro game after watching that first half yesterday</P>

Redeyejedi
11-27-2010, 11:05 AM
Anybody have any thoughts on 3rd down backs. I think its a need personally. Out of all of them I like Demarco Murray the best but I doubt the Giants would draft him. I would really like to get a 3rd down back with elite speed as well . One of my later rounds favorite is Barron Batch anybody got there own favorite</P>

Redeyejedi
11-27-2010, 02:32 PM
Chekawa is having a real good game for Ohio State. He has a well rounded game for a corner

heavyhitter
12-02-2010, 04:12 AM
<span style="font-weight: bold;">Prince Amukamara is just as good as peterson.</span> Doesn't get a lot of attention but I think he can even be better than peterson. Peterson's the better athlete and probably the best natural athlete in the draft, but Prince is slightly more polished and more disciplined than peterson who I've found to be somewhat overaggressive at times</p>


Peterson reminds me of suh. Amazing athlete but doesn't have too worry much about technique because he can dominate players with his amazing athleticism. I think peterson will struggle in the NFL, a bit. Especially against receivers that are quick, percise, and polished in their route running.</p><font size="3">I just can't agree w/ this post. You make some valid points but Peterson is a much better all around cornerback and will be drafted higher and be more productive at the next level. You say Amukamara is just as good as Peterson? Patrick Peterson is a premier, top-flight corner w/ safety size, corner speed, and all the tools to be the next shutdown corner in the NFL. Prince will most likely be a top 10 pick but Peterson will be the first corner off the board and top 5 pick. </font>
http://i189.photobucket.com/albums/z46/kcochran777/patrick_peterson_int_mississippi_state.gif

thegreatone
12-02-2010, 08:39 AM
Anybody have any thoughts on 3rd down backs. I think its a need personally. Out of all of them I like Demarco Murray the best but I doubt the Giants would draft him. I would really like to get a 3rd down back with elite speed as well . One of my later rounds favorite is Barron Batch anybody got there own favorite</p>out of seniors devine or locke outta kentucky.batch is a good one too but am wishing for a little more speed.

Redeyejedi
12-02-2010, 09:08 AM
Anybody have any thoughts on 3rd down backs. I think its a need personally. Out of all of them I like Demarco Murray the best but I doubt the Giants would draft him. I would really like to get a 3rd down back with elite speed as well . One of my later rounds favorite is Barron Batch anybody got there own favorite</P>out of seniors devine or locke outta kentucky.batch is a good one too but am wishing for a little more speed.
Batch is a 4.45 guy but has decent size 5-10 208.I know what U mean thoughU want electric speed which would definitely be a plus. The thing that I like about Batch and something that shouldnt be over looked as far as 3rd down backs is that he can block real well. I am a fan of Locke as well though. He has that quick strike speed the offense is lacking. I think he is going to get drafted higher then a lot of the draftniks are predicting. I have seen him as a 5th or 6th rounder I think he goes higher if not your getting a steal. Im not sure where it is but I had him in my first mock draft for this year along with USC's Allen Bradford.

thegreatone
12-02-2010, 10:57 AM
Anybody have any thoughts on 3rd down backs. I think its a need personally. Out of all of them I like Demarco Murray the best but I doubt the Giants would draft him. I would really like to get a 3rd down back with elite speed as well . One of my later rounds favorite is Barron Batch anybody got there own favorite</p>out of seniors devine or locke outta kentucky.batch is a good one too but am wishing for a little more speed.
Batch is a 4.45 guy but has decent size 5-10 208.I know what U mean thoughU want electric speed which would definitely be a plus. The thing that I like about Batch and something that shouldnt be over looked as far as 3rd down backs is that he can block real well. I am a fan of Locke as well though. He has that quick strike speed the offense is lacking. I think he is going to get drafted higher then a lot of the draftniks are predicting. I have seen him as a 5th or 6th rounder I think he goes higher if not your getting a steal. Im not sure where it is but I had him in my first mock draft for this year along with USC's Allen Bradford.
thought i read somewhere he ran 4.5's though he seemed faster in the game. all depends on juniors coming out and how he does at the bine. id say 4th-5th is very reasonable area for him and ,yes, could be a big steal.

thegreatone
12-02-2010, 10:59 AM
oh yeah another guy i like who i always forget about is vai tuau(sp?) outta nevada. not a blazer, decent speed, runs very tough though and can catch. definite late round producer.

Redeyejedi
12-02-2010, 11:01 AM
Anybody have any thoughts on 3rd down backs. I think its a need personally. Out of all of them I like Demarco Murray the best but I doubt the Giants would draft him. I would really like to get a 3rd down back with elite speed as well . One of my later rounds favorite is Barron Batch anybody got there own favorite</P>out of seniors devine or locke outta kentucky.batch is a good one too but am wishing for a little more speed.
Batch is a 4.45 guy but has decent size 5-10 208.I know what U mean thoughU want electric speed which would definitely be a plus. The thing that I like about Batch and something that shouldnt be over looked as far as 3rd down backs is that he can block real well. I am a fan of Locke as well though. He has that quick strike speed the offense is lacking. I think he is going to get drafted higher then a lot of the draftniks are predicting. I have seen him as a 5th or 6th rounder I think he goes higher if not your getting a steal. Im not sure where it is but I had him in my first mock draft for this year along with USC's Allen Bradford.
thought i read somewhere he ran 4.5's though he seemed faster in the game. all depends on juniors coming out and how he does at the bine. id say 4th-5th is very reasonable area for him and ,yes, could be a big steal.
4.5 U mean Locke or Batch. Locke looks a lot faster then 4.5 while Im watching the games

thegreatone
12-02-2010, 11:05 AM
Anybody have any thoughts on 3rd down backs. I think its a need personally. Out of all of them I like Demarco Murray the best but I doubt the Giants would draft him. I would really like to get a 3rd down back with elite speed as well . One of my later rounds favorite is Barron Batch anybody got there own favorite</p>out of seniors devine or locke outta kentucky.batch is a good one too but am wishing for a little more speed.
Batch is a 4.45 guy but has decent size 5-10 208.I know what U mean thoughU want electric speed which would definitely be a plus. The thing that I like about Batch and something that shouldnt be over looked as far as 3rd down backs is that he can block real well. I am a fan of Locke as well though. He has that quick strike speed the offense is lacking. I think he is going to get drafted higher then a lot of the draftniks are predicting. I have seen him as a 5th or 6th rounder I think he goes higher if not your getting a steal. Im not sure where it is but I had him in my first mock draft for this year along with USC's Allen Bradford.
thought i read somewhere he ran 4.5's though he seemed faster in the game. all depends on juniors coming out and how he does at the bine. id say 4th-5th is very reasonable area for him and ,yes, could be a big steal.
4.5 U mean Locke or Batch. Locke looks a lot faster then 4.5 while Im watching the gamesbatch, yeah locke has some wheels.

slipknottin
12-02-2010, 12:45 PM
I just can't agree w/ this post. You make some valid points but Peterson is a much better all around cornerback and will be drafted higher and be more productive at the next level.

No, Peterson is a much better all around athlete. Technique wise, he is average at best as a CB. NFL WRs will work him until he improves his technique, in college he can get away with being bigger and faster than everyone, he wont be at the next level.

Redeyejedi
12-02-2010, 12:49 PM
Anybody have any thoughts on 3rd down backs. I think its a need personally. Out of all of them I like Demarco Murray the best but I doubt the Giants would draft him. I would really like to get a 3rd down back with elite speed as well . One of my later rounds favorite is Barron Batch anybody got there own favorite</P>out of seniors devine or locke outta kentucky.batch is a good one too but am wishing for a little more speed.
Batch is a 4.45 guy but has decent size 5-10 208.I know what U mean thoughU want electric speed which would definitely be a plus. The thing that I like about Batch and something that shouldnt be over looked as far as 3rd down backs is that he can block real well. I am a fan of Locke as well though. He has that quick strike speed the offense is lacking. I think he is going to get drafted higher then a lot of the draftniks are predicting. I have seen him as a 5th or 6th rounder I think he goes higher if not your getting a steal. Im not sure where it is but I had him in my first mock draft for this year along with USC's Allen Bradford.
thought i read somewhere he ran 4.5's though he seemed faster in the game. all depends on juniors coming out and how he does at the bine. id say 4th-5th is very reasonable area for him and ,yes, could be a big steal.
4.5 U mean Locke or Batch. Locke looks a lot faster then 4.5 while Im watching the gamesbatch, yeah locke has some wheels.
Yeah I could see Batch running a 4.5

Redeyejedi
12-02-2010, 01:01 PM
I just can't agree w/ this post. You make some valid points but Peterson is a much better all around cornerback and will be drafted higher and be more productive at the next level. No, Peterson is a much better all around athlete. Technique wise, he is average at best as a CB. NFL WRs will work him until he improves his technique, in college he can get away with being bigger and faster than everyone, he wont be at the next level.Yeah its kind of hard to argue with that. Technically speaking Prince is the better corner. I like Petersons physical ability an upside more.

heavyhitter
12-02-2010, 03:07 PM
I just can't agree w/ this post. You make some valid points but Peterson is a much better all around cornerback and will be drafted higher and be more productive at the next level.

No, Peterson is a much better all around athlete. Technique wise, he is average at best as a CB. NFL WRs will work him until he improves his technique, in college he can get away with being bigger and faster than everyone, he wont be at the next level.<font size="3">This is coming from a guy who said Kyle Wilson will be taken ahead of Joe Haden right before the draft. Tried telling you different but you weren't hearing it. I agree w/ you on most things, but not the issue of Peterson vs Amukamara. Google any scouting report and it will tell you Peterson is a better all around athlete so that is nothing new and next time you take my post and quote it, take the whole post and not bits and pieces. Did you agree w/<span style="font-weight: bold;"> <font size="4"><span style="color: rgb(0, 0, 0); text-decoration: underline;">the rest of the original post?</span></font></span></font>

heavyhitter
12-02-2010, 03:09 PM
<span style="font-weight: bold;">Prince Amukamara is just as good as peterson.</span> Doesn't get a lot of attention but I think he can even be better than peterson. Peterson's the better athlete and probably the best natural athlete in the draft, but Prince is slightly more polished and more disciplined than peterson who I've found to be somewhat overaggressive at times</p>


Peterson reminds me of suh. Amazing athlete but doesn't have too worry much about technique because he can dominate players with his amazing athleticism. I think peterson will struggle in the NFL, a bit. Especially against receivers that are quick, percise, and polished in their route running.</p><font size="3">I just can't agree w/ this post. You make some valid points but Peterson is a much better all around cornerback and will be drafted higher and be more productive at the next level. You say Amukamara is just as good as Peterson? Patrick Peterson is a premier, top-flight corner w/ safety size, corner speed, and all the tools to be the next shutdown corner in the NFL. Prince will most likely be a top 10 pick but Peterson will be the first corner off the board and top 5 pick. </font>
http://i189.photobucket.com/albums/z46/kcochran777/patrick_peterson_int_mississippi_state.gif

slipknottin
12-02-2010, 03:45 PM
This is coming from a guy who said Kyle Wilson will be taken ahead of Joe Haden right before the draft.
That wasent right before the draft, that was right after the combine, when Haden ran a 4.5 something. Had Haden not ran a 4.4 flat at his proday, I still think Wilson would have gone first.


Google any scouting report and it will tell you Peterson is a better all around athlete

Thats what I said. But technique wise he is not the better corner. He will go higher in the draft based on his physical skill set not because he is the better CB.

heavyhitter
12-02-2010, 04:14 PM
<font size="3">So you do agree w/ me that Peterson will be the first DB taken, correct? BTW, you gotta quit taking bits and pieces of original posts and quoting them and things will make more sense to you. Just sayin-</font>

slipknottin
12-02-2010, 06:26 PM
<font size="3">So you do agree w/ me that Peterson will be the first DB taken, correct? BTW, you gotta quit taking bits and pieces of original posts and quoting them and things will make more sense to you. Just sayin-</font>


I take out parts so I can discuss each part. I said from the beginning that Peterson will be the first DB taken. But its not because he is the best CB, its because he is the best athlete.

nycsportzfan
12-02-2010, 07:29 PM
the only reason we picked up sintim in the draft was to rush the passer from the SLB positon.. And the giants have been trying to get awa

I disagree. Sintim was drafted to play the on the line LB in Sheridan's 4-3 under defense. A position the giants no longer use.

Kiwi at LB was really more of him being a standup DE than an actual LB.

The way Fewell calls his defense, you want pass coverage over pass rushing ability. How often have we seen Bulluck sent after the QB? i disagree, Kiwi was used in coverege and made plays in coverge while out there.. U can't just have a guy do the same things over and over again... Obviously, if your playing LB, u are gonna drop in coverege, more often then a Dline guy would, no matter what system, hence 8pass defended and 2picks in Kiwi's first 2yrs in the league... We obviously need a SLB that can cover somewhat, and thats what Ayers could bring... He dosen't look that big either, as he looks lankey and to be honest, he can become alot better at rushing the passer then he has been, he makes quite a few plays against the Run and in coverege, hes the perfect 4/3 SLB because hes not elite at Rushing the QB, but adequete, and as a 3/4 olb, he'll need to be better at Rushing the QB then he is...

slipknottin
12-02-2010, 07:50 PM
i disagree, Kiwi was used in coverege and made plays in coverge while out there..

Not this year he didnt. He was essentially just a standup roving DE. Completely different than an OLB.

heavyhitter
12-02-2010, 08:22 PM
<font size="3">So you do agree w/ me that Peterson will be the first DB taken, correct? BTW, you gotta quit taking bits and pieces of original posts and quoting them and things will make more sense to you. Just sayin-</font>
Peterson will be the first DB taken. He is the best CB, he is the best athlete.<font size="3">I just rather leave posts as they are, and highlight or enlarge the part you want to discuss. Notice how bits n pieces were left out. Anyhow, I'm glad you enjoy Patrick Peterson and from here on out you will show him the utmost respect (kind of like you did for Taylor Mays). Questions, comments?</font> <font size="3">lol</font>

slipknottin
12-02-2010, 08:25 PM
>I just rather leave posts as they are, and highlight or enlarge the part you want to discuss

I never changed anything you said though. You changed what I said.

And no, Peterson is not the best cover CB in the draft.

heavyhitter
12-02-2010, 08:28 PM
Marcel Dareus is playing out of his mind so far in this game.

Fairley on Auburn is playing great too.<font size="3">I can see both Fairley and Dareus as top 10 overall picks. </font>

slipknottin
12-02-2010, 08:33 PM
I can see both Fairley and Dareus as top 10 overall picks. </font>


I think so too, both can play pretty much anywhere on a DL, tho I think both may end up as 3-4 DEs.

heavyhitter
12-02-2010, 08:34 PM
&gt;I just rather leave posts as they are, and highlight or enlarge the part you want to discuss

I never changed anything you said though. You changed what I said.

And no, Peterson is not the best cover CB in the draft.<font size="3">Do you believe Mark Herzlich is going to be rated as a first rounder and how strong do you see this ILB class??</font>

slipknottin
12-02-2010, 08:38 PM
Do you believe Mark Herzlich is going to be rated as a first rounder and how strong do you see this ILB class??</font>


Talent wise yes. But I get the feeling a lot of teams are going to take him off their draft boards or drop him down a ton for health reasons. That the guy had bone cancer and still has weaker bones from it (hes broken multiple bones this year) is a huge concern.

ILB class is difficult, just because its difficult to project who will end up playing at ILB, and who will be an OLB. But IMO, the 4-3 LB class this year is one of the best Ive ever seen.

heavyhitter
12-02-2010, 08:44 PM
I can see both Fairley and Dareus as top 10 overall picks.


I think so too, both can play pretty much anywhere on a DL, tho I think both may end up as 3-4 DEs.<font size="3">I think the 1st round/early 2nd, you will see a ton of 3-4 DE's get drafted but there seems to be a drop off after that. </font>

Redeyejedi
12-02-2010, 08:45 PM
Do you believe Mark Herzlich is going to be rated as a first rounder and how strong do you see this ILB class??</FONT>
Talent wise yes. But I get the feeling a lot of teams are going to take him off their draft boards or drop him down a ton for health reasons. That the guy had bone cancer and still has weaker bones from it (hes broken multiple bones this year) is a huge concern. ILB class is difficult, just because its difficult to project who will end up playing at ILB, and who will be an OLB. But IMO, the 4-3 LB class this year is one of the best Ive ever seen.It is completely loaded isnt it. The top 3 rounds are filled with players that I see thatcould make an immediate impact. There really is a little bit of everything but what surprises ne is the top quality guys that are athletic enough to play the pass

slipknottin
12-02-2010, 08:45 PM
I think the 1st round/early 2nd, you will see a ton of 3-4 DE's get drafted but there seems to be a drop off after that. </font>


I dont see anyway Dareus and Fairley make it to the end of the 1st. Far too talented.

heavyhitter
12-02-2010, 08:49 PM
I think the 1st round/early 2nd, you will see a ton of 3-4 DE's get drafted but there seems to be a drop off after that.


I dont see anyway Dareus and Fairley make it to the end of the 1st. Far too talented.<font size="3">Neither do I, what are you talking about?? Both of those two guys are top 10 overall picks and I stated that earlier.</font>

heavyhitter
12-02-2010, 08:49 PM
Marcel Dareus is playing out of his mind so far in this game.

Fairley on Auburn is playing great too.<font size="3">I can see both Fairley and Dareus as top 10 overall picks. </font>
THIS

slipknottin
12-02-2010, 08:51 PM
There really is a little bit of everything but what surprises ne is the top quality guys that are athletic enough to play the pass

Yea, those guys that are 6'2 ~230-240 pounds and have sideline to sideline speed. Something that was difficult to find last year in the draft.

Last year you had a ton of 3-4 guys, 245+ pounds that ran 4.6+ 40s.

And the guys who ran the sub 4.6 40s were under 230 pounds.

Weatherspoon was really the only guy in the first couple rounds who fit the bill, but he had a huge mouth, something the giants have stayed away from in the draft.

It depends on how many underclassmen declare, but in the first 3 rounds there should be at least 10 guys who fit into what the giants look for. And with that kind of depth, guys are going to fall. If Sturdivant falls to lets say the 3rd or even 4th round, how could you pass him up?

heavyhitter
12-02-2010, 09:07 PM
Anyone else have some questions on Newtons pro game after watching that first half yesterday</p><font size="3">I actually think if Luck doesn't declare, Newton has got a good chance at being the first QB selected over Ryan Mallett. How Newton will translate into the pro's is another story. I think every QB going into the draft has question marks but Luck is by far the safest pick.</font>

slipknottin
12-02-2010, 09:16 PM
I actually think if Luck doesn't declare, Newton has got a good chance at being the first QB selected over Ryan Mallett.

Possibly, I dont really expect both Mallett and Newton to declare though. But you never know.

I do think Newton has a legitimate shot to go in the top 10. Especially after nonsense like Tebow going in the first.

Redeyejedi
12-02-2010, 09:33 PM
There really is a little bit of everything but what surprises ne is the top quality guys that are athletic enough to play the pass Yea, those guys that are 6'2 ~230-240 pounds and have sideline to sideline speed. Something that was difficult to find last year in the draft. Last year you had a ton of 3-4 guys, 245+ pounds that ran 4.6+ 40s. And the guys who ran the sub 4.6 40s were under 230 pounds. Weatherspoon was really the only guy in the first couple rounds who fit the bill, but he had a huge mouth, something the giants have stayed away from in the draft. It depends on how many underclassmen declare, but in the first 3 rounds there should be at least 10 guys who fit into what the giants look for. And with that kind of depth, guys are going to fall. If Sturdivant falls to lets say the 3rd or even 4th round, how could you pass him up?Yeah I was hoping Sturdivant was going to declare last year and the Giants would snag him.I actually liked him more then Sean Weatherspoon. The character stuff though might drop him

slipknottin
12-02-2010, 09:37 PM
Yeah I was hoping Sturdivant was going to declare last year and the Giants would snag him.I actually liked him more then Sean Weatherspoon. The character stuff though might drop him

Yea, the drug posession and hes been injured most of the year. He was my favorite ILB going into this year. I feel like hes a huge value 3rd round or later.

Redeyejedi
12-02-2010, 09:41 PM
I actually think if Luck doesn't declare, Newton has got a good chance at being the first QB selected over Ryan Mallett. Possibly, I dont really expect both Mallett and Newton to declare though. But you never know. I do think Newton has a legitimate shot to go in the top 10. Especially after nonsense like Tebow going in the first.I believe u were watching the Auburn-Alabama game. That first half that had him completly rattled. While I like Newtons physical skills the offense that Auburn runs is nothing like like a pro style offense.

slipknottin
12-02-2010, 09:44 PM
I believe u were watching the Auburn-Alabama game. That first half that had him completly rattled. While I like Newtons physical skills the offense that Auburn runs is nothing like like a pro style offense.

Yea, but teams are going to fall in love with his size and running ability, and hes made enough really good throws that someone will think he has pro QB potential.

nycsportzfan
12-02-2010, 10:08 PM
i disagree, Kiwi was used in coverege and made plays in coverge while out there..

Not this year he didnt. He was essentially just a standup roving DE. Completely different than an OLB. still dropped in coverege.. Not to mention, hes not a LB anymore.. Akeem Ayers can play the traditonal SLB in a 4/3 which ucla has done, and its on tape to see for everyone, plus he can come to the line and rush the QB outta the standup positon.. So whats the problem?

nycsportzfan
12-02-2010, 10:11 PM
I actually think if Luck doesn't declare, Newton has got a good chance at being the first QB selected over Ryan Mallett.

Possibly, I dont really expect both Mallett and Newton to declare though. But you never know.

I do think Newton has a legitimate shot to go in the top 10. Especially after nonsense like Tebow going in the first. Mallett is taking Arkansas to i believe there 1st BCS game ever, so hes gone.. What more to prove? As far as Luck, i don't know, but why risk a serious injury? We've seen it happen to QB's before, and one yr to the next can change alot of views on a player, he'd be silly to not go pro...

nycsportzfan
12-02-2010, 10:11 PM
I actually think if Luck doesn't declare, Newton has got a good chance at being the first QB selected over Ryan Mallett.

Possibly, I dont really expect both Mallett and Newton to declare though. But you never know.

I do think Newton has a legitimate shot to go in the top 10. Especially after nonsense like Tebow going in the first. Mallett is taking Arkansas to i believe there 1st BCS game ever, so hes gone.. What more to prove? As far as Luck, i don't know, but why risk a serious injury? We've seen it happen to QB's before, and one yr to the next can change alot of views on a player, he'd be silly to not go pro...

slipknottin
12-02-2010, 10:34 PM
he can come to the line and rush the QB outta the standup positon.. So whats the problem?


Which is exactly why he has more value as a 3-4 SLB.

Neverend
12-03-2010, 12:30 PM
Akeem ayers looks nearly perfect. he can rush the passer in so many different ways, very versatile,his technique at shedding blocks is impressive (which is rare nowadays), doesn't miss tackles, gets good depth in zone coverage, and he has shown some playmaking ability with INTs and sacks.</P>


But IMO Ayers looks a little tentative &amp; conservative out there in some situations, he doesn't seem very aggressive. He reads &amp; reacts slowly. He doesn't have much instincts from what I've seen.He rarelysniffs out and diagnose plays before they developand make any instinctual plays compared to other LBs like travis lewis, foster, herzlich, etc. Tho, I could be wrong here. Maybe its the scheme and coaches limiting him to let his instincts take over, I don't know. If he can improve in that area, he is pretty much a nearflawless LB (although his motor and coverage skills aren't flawless, but they're good)</P>


In the end, I'm not completely convinced the giants will take ayers. ayers doesn't have a lot of upside as far as athleticism goes. He's a good technician and pretty much a'what you see is what you get' prospect. the giants love to draft players with high upside &amp;potential and try to develop them from there.</P>

nycsportzfan
12-03-2010, 01:08 PM
he can come to the line and rush the QB outta the standup positon.. So whats the problem?


Which is exactly why he has more value as a 3-4 SLB. probably should quote the whole post if u want it to make sense... As i said, he can play in coverege in a 4/3 which he has done at UCLA, and theres tape on it, if u haven't all ready seen it, and he can rush the passer at a standup positon if asked as well.. So whats the problem? Theres a good chance he goes to a 3/4 team, as theres alot of 3/4 teams out there.. He looks the part of a SLB, period... He plays in many diffrent looks, and could be successful in either...

nycsportzfan
12-03-2010, 01:19 PM
Akeem ayers looks nearly perfect. he can rush the passer in so many different ways, very versatile,his technique at shedding blocks is impressive (which is rare nowadays), doesn't miss tackles, gets good depth in zone coverage, and he has shown some playmaking ability with INTs and sacks.</p>


But IMO Ayers looks a little tentative &amp; conservative out there in some situations, he doesn't seem very aggressive. He reads &amp; reacts slowly. He doesn't have much instincts from what I've seen.He rarelysniffs out and diagnose plays before they developand make any instinctual plays compared to other LBs like travis lewis, foster, herzlich, etc. Tho, I could be wrong here. Maybe its the scheme and coaches limiting him to let his instincts take over, I don't know. If he can improve in that area, he is pretty much a nearflawless LB (although his motor and coverage skills aren't flawless, but they're good)</p>


In the end, I'm not completely convinced the giants will take ayers. ayers doesn't have a lot of upside as far as athleticism goes. He's a good technician and pretty much a'what you see is what you get' prospect. the giants love to draft players with high upside &amp;potential and try to develop them from there.</p> His instincts are what stands out about him... He makes plays! Go look back at his INTS, there is incredible instincts... He had a INT for a TD against Temple last yr, where he was asked to rush, he then slipped fell down, got up right as the QB was gonna pass the ball in the flats, he then jumped up and instead of just batting down the ball, caught it, and ran the few yrds for a td, showing awesome athletiscim and instincts and skill.. He also had a ridiculous play eerily similar against i think ARZ ST or ORG ST(can't remember), where he jumped up and instead of batting the ball down, he simply caught it somehow in the endzone and got both feet down in the back of the endzone(don't ask me how?) for a TD.. A Ridiculous feet of athletic ability and skill... He makes plays against the run and against the pass and behind the line... He is good at not over pursueing plays, and plays the game with a level head.. His instincts are what stick out to me..

Neverend
12-03-2010, 03:34 PM
Akeem ayers looks nearly perfect. he can rush the passer in so many different ways, very versatile,his technique at shedding blocks is impressive (which is rare nowadays), doesn't miss tackles, gets good depth in zone coverage, and he has shown some playmaking ability with INTs and sacks.</P>


But IMO Ayers looks a little tentative &amp; conservative out there in some situations, he doesn't seem very aggressive. He reads &amp; reacts slowly. He doesn't have much instincts from what I've seen.He rarelysniffs out and diagnose plays before they developand make any instinctual plays compared to other LBs like travis lewis, foster, herzlich, etc. Tho, I could be wrong here. Maybe its the scheme and coaches limiting him to let his instincts take over, I don't know. If he can improve in that area, he is pretty much a nearflawless LB (although his motor and coverage skills aren't flawless, but they're good)</P>


In the end, I'm not completely convinced the giants will take ayers. ayers doesn't have a lot of upside as far as athleticism goes. He's a good technician and pretty much a'what you see is what you get' prospect. the giants love to draft players with high upside &amp;potential and try to develop them from there.</P>


His instincts are what stands out about him... He makes plays! Go look back at his INTS, there is incredible instincts... He had a INT for a TD against Temple last yr, where he was asked to rush, he then slipped fell down, got up right as the QB was gonna pass the ball in the flats, he then jumped up and instead of just batting down the ball, caught it, and ran the few yrds for a td, showing awesome athletiscim and instincts and skill.. He also had a ridiculous play eerily similar against i think ARZ ST or ORG ST(can't remember), where he jumped up and instead of batting the ball down, he simply caught it somehow in the endzone and got both feet down in the back of the endzone(don't ask me how?) for a TD.. A Ridiculous feet of athletic ability and skill... He makes plays against the run and against the pass and behind the line... He is good at not over pursueing plays, and plays the game with a level head.. His instincts are what stick out to me..
</P>


Excuse me, i meant his instincts against the run. i know he's a playmaker against the pass with a lot of picks as he has a tremendous nose for the football but its his play against the run that i feel has a lot to be desired. he doesn't over pursue but i think that has something to do with him being very conservative. he doesn't attack blockers and stuff gaps. he playsa little tooconservative. its just a small flaw i notice with ayers. i would like him to diagnose plays faster against the run and trust his instincts instead of reading &amp; reacting tentatively and slowly. For example, I rememeber watching a misdirection that could have potentially been a 5 yard loss in the backfield but turned out to be a nice positive gain because it took too long for ayers to diagnose the play. he wasn't out of positionnor didhe over puruse because if he did that play could've gone for 20+ yds, but he also wasn't aggressive enough which caused a negative/no gain play into a positive play. it could go both ways i guess but i think ayers needs to improve in this area a little bit. im honestly just nit picking here lol</P>


but definitely a stud in all other areas. great instincts and nose for the ball against the pass, good blitzer (thats how he gets most of his TFL's anyway), and pretty solid at everything else. I saw that crazy play against oregon. im not sayin ayers has no atlheticism, im saying the giants may draft a LB that may not be as polished as ayers, but may have more upside and potential and may develop him into a starter compared to ayers who is a what you see is what you get guy. not a guy who is going to improve and become a better player than he was in college because he is already polished and developed.however, ayers is going to bea damn good 'what you see is what you get' player</P>

Redeyejedi
12-03-2010, 03:42 PM
Akeem ayers looks nearly perfect. he can rush the passer in so many different ways, very versatile,his technique at shedding blocks is impressive (which is rare nowadays), doesn't miss tackles, gets good depth in zone coverage, and he has shown some playmaking ability with INTs and sacks.</P>


But IMO Ayers looks a little tentative &amp; conservative out there in some situations, he doesn't seem very aggressive. He reads &amp; reacts slowly. He doesn't have much instincts from what I've seen.He rarelysniffs out and diagnose plays before they developand make any instinctual plays compared to other LBs like travis lewis, foster, herzlich, etc. Tho, I could be wrong here. Maybe its the scheme and coaches limiting him to let his instincts take over, I don't know. If he can improve in that area, he is pretty much a nearflawless LB (although his motor and coverage skills aren't flawless, but they're good)</P>


In the end, I'm not completely convinced the giants will take ayers. ayers doesn't have a lot of upside as far as athleticism goes. He's a good technician and pretty much a'what you see is what you get' prospect. the giants love to draft players with high upside &amp;potential and try to develop them from there.</P>


His instincts are what stands out about him... He makes plays! Go look back at his INTS, there is incredible instincts... He had a INT for a TD against Temple last yr, where he was asked to rush, he then slipped fell down, got up right as the QB was gonna pass the ball in the flats, he then jumped up and instead of just batting down the ball, caught it, and ran the few yrds for a td, showing awesome athletiscim and instincts and skill.. He also had a ridiculous play eerily similar against i think ARZ ST or ORG ST(can't remember), where he jumped up and instead of batting the ball down, he simply caught it somehow in the endzone and got both feet down in the back of the endzone(don't ask me how?) for a TD.. A Ridiculous feet of athletic ability and skill... He makes plays against the run and against the pass and behind the line... He is good at not over pursueing plays, and plays the game with a level head.. His instincts are what stick out to me..
</P>


Excuse me, i meant his instincts against the run. i know he's a playmaker against the pass with a lot of picks as he has a tremendous nose for the football but its his play against the run that i feel has a lot to be desired. he doesn't over pursue but i think that has something to do with him being very conservative. he doesn't attack blockers and stuff gaps. he playsa little tooconservative. its just a small flaw i notice with ayers. i would like him to diagnose plays faster against the run and trust his instincts instead of reading &amp; reacting tentatively and slowly. For example, I rememeber watching a misdirection that could have potentially been a 5 yard loss in the backfield but turned out to be a nice positive gain because it took too long for ayers to diagnose the play. he wasn't out of position and he didn't over puruse because if he didn't that play could've gone for 20+ yds, but he also wasn't aggressive enough which caused a negative/no gain play into a positive play. it could go both ways i guess but i think ayers needs to improve in this area a little bit. im honestly just nit picking here lol</P>


but definitely a stud in all other areas. great instincts and nose for the ball against the pass, good blitzer (thats how he gets most of his TFL's anyway), and pretty solid at everything else. I saw that crazy play against oregon. im not sayin ayers has no atlheticism, im saying the giants may draft a LB that may not be as polished as ayers, but may have more upside and potential and may develop him into a starter compared to ayers who is a what you see is what you get guy. not a guy who is going to improve and become a better player than he was in college because he is already polished and developed.however, ayers is going to bea damn good 'what you see is what you get' player</P>The 2 games where I watched a significant amount of snaps they got completely shellacked so I dont know how much of a fair representation of Ayers I saw. I saw tentativeness in videos from 2009 but the small sample size I saw I didnt see it. I watched enough to know UCLA completely sucks though

nycsportzfan
12-03-2010, 06:50 PM
Akeem ayers looks nearly perfect. he can rush the passer in so many different ways, very versatile,his technique at shedding blocks is impressive (which is rare nowadays), doesn't miss tackles, gets good depth in zone coverage, and he has shown some playmaking ability with INTs and sacks.</p>


But IMO Ayers looks a little tentative &amp; conservative out there in some situations, he doesn't seem very aggressive. He reads &amp; reacts slowly. He doesn't have much instincts from what I've seen.He rarelysniffs out and diagnose plays before they developand make any instinctual plays compared to other LBs like travis lewis, foster, herzlich, etc. Tho, I could be wrong here. Maybe its the scheme and coaches limiting him to let his instincts take over, I don't know. If he can improve in that area, he is pretty much a nearflawless LB (although his motor and coverage skills aren't flawless, but they're good)</p>


In the end, I'm not completely convinced the giants will take ayers. ayers doesn't have a lot of upside as far as athleticism goes. He's a good technician and pretty much a'what you see is what you get' prospect. the giants love to draft players with high upside &amp;potential and try to develop them from there.</p>


His instincts are what stands out about him... He makes plays! Go look back at his INTS, there is incredible instincts... He had a INT for a TD against Temple last yr, where he was asked to rush, he then slipped fell down, got up right as the QB was gonna pass the ball in the flats, he then jumped up and instead of just batting down the ball, caught it, and ran the few yrds for a td, showing awesome athletiscim and instincts and skill.. He also had a ridiculous play eerily similar against i think ARZ ST or ORG ST(can't remember), where he jumped up and instead of batting the ball down, he simply caught it somehow in the endzone and got both feet down in the back of the endzone(don't ask me how?) for a TD.. A Ridiculous feet of athletic ability and skill... He makes plays against the run and against the pass and behind the line... He is good at not over pursueing plays, and plays the game with a level head.. His instincts are what stick out to me..
</p>


Excuse me, i meant his instincts against the run. i know he's a playmaker against the pass with a lot of picks as he has a tremendous nose for the football but its his play against the run that i feel has a lot to be desired. he doesn't over pursue but i think that has something to do with him being very conservative. he doesn't attack blockers and stuff gaps. he playsa little tooconservative. its just a small flaw i notice with ayers. i would like him to diagnose plays faster against the run and trust his instincts instead of reading &amp; reacting tentatively and slowly. For example, I rememeber watching a misdirection that could have potentially been a 5 yard loss in the backfield but turned out to be a nice positive gain because it took too long for ayers to diagnose the play. he wasn't out of positionnor didhe over puruse because if he did that play could've gone for 20+ yds, but he also wasn't aggressive enough which caused a negative/no gain play into a positive play. it could go both ways i guess but i think ayers needs to improve in this area a little bit. im honestly just nit picking here lol</p>


but definitely a stud in all other areas. great instincts and nose for the ball against the pass, good blitzer (thats how he gets most of his TFL's anyway), and pretty solid at everything else. I saw that crazy play against oregon. im not sayin ayers has no atlheticism, im saying the giants may draft a LB that may not be as polished as ayers, but may have more upside and potential and may develop him into a starter compared to ayers who is a what you see is what you get guy. not a guy who is going to improve and become a better player than he was in college because he is already polished and developed.however, ayers is going to bea damn good 'what you see is what you get' player</p> yes, i actually do agree with you, that on occasion, it seems Ayers could be alittle less tenative against the run... One thing i disagree about is the fact we know what Ayers will be as a pro.. I never did believe in that, as a player only 20-21 yrs old, can't get better with a whole new crop of coaches teaching him... I mean, u see players have surprise careers and what not all the time, or do better then expected.. I think u gotta draft a guy who first and foremost was productive in college(i hate drafting guys who weren't, ala sinorice moss), and have at least a NFL body and intangiables, and hope u hit...

nycsportzfan
12-03-2010, 06:54 PM
I actually think if Luck doesn't declare, Newton has got a good chance at being the first QB selected over Ryan Mallett. Possibly, I dont really expect both Mallett and Newton to declare though. But you never know. I do think Newton has a legitimate shot to go in the top 10. Especially after nonsense like Tebow going in the first.I believe u were watching the Auburn-Alabama game. That first half that had him completly rattled. While I like Newtons physical skills the offense that Auburn runs is nothing like like a pro style offense.but u seen him drop back and make nfl type throws often.. Sure, maybe he wont be running totally like a cheetah and what not, but its just a added weapon to his rocket arm... The one thing about cam is hes got the extra speed in case your oline breaks down, where he can make a play with his feet and his ht to go along with that speed is a weapon to see over defenses while on the move or in the pocket.. Having his speed with his size and ht is a huge weapon.. Nothing is guranteed, but my god, hes got enough to take a chance on and hope u are right..

thegreatone
12-04-2010, 09:48 AM
I actually think if Luck doesn't declare, Newton has got a good chance at being the first QB selected over Ryan Mallett. Possibly, I dont really expect both Mallett and Newton to declare though. But you never know. I do think Newton has a legitimate shot to go in the top 10. Especially after nonsense like Tebow going in the first.I believe u were watching the Auburn-Alabama game. That first half that had him completly rattled. While I like Newtons physical skills the offense that Auburn runs is nothing like like a pro style offense.but u seen him drop back and make nfl type throws often.. Sure, maybe he wont be running totally like a cheetah and what not, but its just a added weapon to his rocket arm... The one thing about cam is hes got the extra speed in case your oline breaks down, where he can make a play with his feet and his ht to go along with that speed is a weapon to see over defenses while on the move or in the pocket.. Having his speed with his size and ht is a huge weapon.. Nothing is guranteed, but my god, hes got enough to take a chance on and hope u are right..

considering that nfl rookie's salaries will be slotted after this year i think we are going to see A LOT of earlies declare. He'll even if luck does declare i think there is a chance of cam going ahead of him. I wouldnt do it personally but somebody is gonna fall in love with this guy and who can blame them.

thegreatone
12-04-2010, 10:52 AM
draft countdowns new mock has him going 18 to miami after mallet AND locker. i just cant see that happening unless he has a bad pre draft run.

Redeyejedi
12-04-2010, 12:20 PM
I actually think if Luck doesn't declare, Newton has got a good chance at being the first QB selected over Ryan Mallett. Possibly, I dont really expect both Mallett and Newton to declare though. But you never know. I do think Newton has a legitimate shot to go in the top 10. Especially after nonsense like Tebow going in the first.I believe u were watching the Auburn-Alabama game. That first half that had him completly rattled. While I like Newtons physical skills the offense that Auburn runs is nothing like like a pro style offense.but u seen him drop back and make nfl type throws often.. Sure, maybe he wont be running totally like a cheetah and what not, but its just a added weapon to his rocket arm... The one thing about cam is hes got the extra speed in case your oline breaks down, where he can make a play with his feet and his ht to go along with that speed is a weapon to see over defenses while on the move or in the pocket.. Having his speed with his size and ht is a huge weapon.. Nothing is guranteed, but my god, hes got enough to take a chance on and hope u are right..
Oh yeah he can make all the throws and is a horse to bring down. I think best sceniro he may end up being like an early years Steve Mcnair

nycsportzfan
12-06-2010, 12:46 AM
I actually think if Luck doesn't declare, Newton has got a good chance at being the first QB selected over Ryan Mallett. Possibly, I dont really expect both Mallett and Newton to declare though. But you never know. I do think Newton has a legitimate shot to go in the top 10. Especially after nonsense like Tebow going in the first.I believe u were watching the Auburn-Alabama game. That first half that had him completly rattled. While I like Newtons physical skills the offense that Auburn runs is nothing like like a pro style offense.but u seen him drop back and make nfl type throws often.. Sure, maybe he wont be running totally like a cheetah and what not, but its just a added weapon to his rocket arm... The one thing about cam is hes got the extra speed in case your oline breaks down, where he can make a play with his feet and his ht to go along with that speed is a weapon to see over defenses while on the move or in the pocket.. Having his speed with his size and ht is a huge weapon.. Nothing is guranteed, but my god, hes got enough to take a chance on and hope u are right..

considering that nfl rookie's salaries will be slotted after this year i think we are going to see A LOT of earlies declare. He'll even if luck does declare i think there is a chance of cam going ahead of him. I wouldnt do it personally but somebody is gonna fall in love with this guy and who can blame them.
I just hope the Cowboys don't end up with newton.. I don't feel like dealing with that headache 2times a yr.. I'm so glad that the draft will finally be slotted in the near future... Its about time!

thegreatone
12-06-2010, 10:51 AM
I actually think if Luck doesn't declare, Newton has got a good chance at being the first QB selected over Ryan Mallett. Possibly, I dont really expect both Mallett and Newton to declare though. But you never know. I do think Newton has a legitimate shot to go in the top 10. Especially after nonsense like Tebow going in the first.I believe u were watching the Auburn-Alabama game. That first half that had him completly rattled. While I like Newtons physical skills the offense that Auburn runs is nothing like like a pro style offense.but u seen him drop back and make nfl type throws often.. Sure, maybe he wont be running totally like a cheetah and what not, but its just a added weapon to his rocket arm... The one thing about cam is hes got the extra speed in case your oline breaks down, where he can make a play with his feet and his ht to go along with that speed is a weapon to see over defenses while on the move or in the pocket.. Having his speed with his size and ht is a huge weapon.. Nothing is guranteed, but my god, hes got enough to take a chance on and hope u are right..

considering that nfl rookie's salaries will be slotted after this year i think we are going to see A LOT of earlies declare. He'll even if luck does declare i think there is a chance of cam going ahead of him. I wouldnt do it personally but somebody is gonna fall in love with this guy and who can blame them.
I just hope the Cowboys don't end up with newton.. I don't feel like dealing with that headache 2times a yr.. I'm so glad that the draft will finally be slotted in the near future... Its about time!
seriously doubt it with romo's huge contract. bad thing is they are gonna get somone excellent on defense unless they reach for an olineman.

Redeyejedi
12-06-2010, 11:04 AM
I actually think if Luck doesn't declare, Newton has got a good chance at being the first QB selected over Ryan Mallett. Possibly, I dont really expect both Mallett and Newton to declare though. But you never know. I do think Newton has a legitimate shot to go in the top 10. Especially after nonsense like Tebow going in the first.I believe u were watching the Auburn-Alabama game. That first half that had him completly rattled. While I like Newtons physical skills the offense that Auburn runs is nothing like like a pro style offense.but u seen him drop back and make nfl type throws often.. Sure, maybe he wont be running totally like a cheetah and what not, but its just a added weapon to his rocket arm... The one thing about cam is hes got the extra speed in case your oline breaks down, where he can make a play with his feet and his ht to go along with that speed is a weapon to see over defenses while on the move or in the pocket.. Having his speed with his size and ht is a huge weapon.. Nothing is guranteed, but my god, hes got enough to take a chance on and hope u are right..

considering that nfl rookie's salaries will be slotted after this year i think we are going to see A LOT of earlies declare. He'll even if luck does declare i think there is a chance of cam going ahead of him. I wouldnt do it personally but somebody is gonna fall in love with this guy and who can blame them.
I just hope the Cowboys don't end up with newton.. I don't feel like dealing with that headache 2times a yr.. I'm so glad that the draft will finally be slotted in the near future... Its about time!
.Look at the time he gets to make these throws.Look at the throwing lanes he has.Watch how open his WR's get.There open by 5 yards 50% of the time.In the NFL a lot of pass plays are rhythm pass plays,small windows, proper timing, Auburns offense doesnt have these plays.Can Cam Newton take a snap under center do a 3 step drop and hit a receiver on a in route in stride. Can he throw a back shoulder throw on the sideline on 3rd and 8. Im not saying he can't and the physical abilities are fantastic but I just dont know because he doesnt do it. The offense Auburn runs is like the exact opposite of an NFL offense. For his sake I hope he goes to a QB friendly system. I think he would be completely lost under Gilbrides system at least initially

nycsportzfan
12-06-2010, 12:33 PM
I actually think if Luck doesn't declare, Newton has got a good chance at being the first QB selected over Ryan Mallett. Possibly, I dont really expect both Mallett and Newton to declare though. But you never know. I do think Newton has a legitimate shot to go in the top 10. Especially after nonsense like Tebow going in the first.I believe u were watching the Auburn-Alabama game. That first half that had him completly rattled. While I like Newtons physical skills the offense that Auburn runs is nothing like like a pro style offense.but u seen him drop back and make nfl type throws often.. Sure, maybe he wont be running totally like a cheetah and what not, but its just a added weapon to his rocket arm... The one thing about cam is hes got the extra speed in case your oline breaks down, where he can make a play with his feet and his ht to go along with that speed is a weapon to see over defenses while on the move or in the pocket.. Having his speed with his size and ht is a huge weapon.. Nothing is guranteed, but my god, hes got enough to take a chance on and hope u are right..

considering that nfl rookie's salaries will be slotted after this year i think we are going to see A LOT of earlies declare. He'll even if luck does declare i think there is a chance of cam going ahead of him. I wouldnt do it personally but somebody is gonna fall in love with this guy and who can blame them.
I just hope the Cowboys don't end up with newton.. I don't feel like dealing with that headache 2times a yr.. I'm so glad that the draft will finally be slotted in the near future... Its about time!
.Look at the time he gets to make these throws.Look at the throwing lanes he has.Watch how open his WR's get.There open by 5 yards 50% of the time.In the NFL a lot of pass plays are rhythm pass plays,small windows, proper timing, Auburns offense doesnt have these plays.Can Cam Newton take a snap under center do a 3 step drop and hit a receiver on a in route in stride. Can he throw a back shoulder throw on the sideline on 3rd and 8. Im not saying he can't and the physical abilities are fantastic but I just dont know because he doesnt do it. The offense Auburn runs is like the exact opposite of an NFL offense. For his sake I hope he goes to a QB friendly system. I think he would be completely lost under Gilbrides system at least initiallyya, but watching Newton all yr long, i seen some throws under pressure and i seen him pump fake getting his wr open by a step and float the ball inches over the defender and into emory blakes hands for a td, probably one of the better throws i've seen all yr long... I mean, most big plays, WR's are at least open, hence the completion to begin with... Not to mention, hes got those legs when people are covered to make yards, ala what u see with mike vick this yr... The team hes on is supre good, but think about it, its because of him that auburn is this good.. Think about Auburn last yr, there not anything remotley close to this good... I mean, lets also not forget hes doing this against S.E.C foe's... I'm completley sold on Newton, hes passed every test in my opinion.... Going against Players such as Justin Houston, Dre Kirkpatrick, jerrell powe, brandon boykin, pernell McPhee, KJ Wright, Marcel Dareus, Mark Barron, Daquan Bowers, Deandre McDaniel, Marcus Gilchrist, Drake Nevis, Kelvin SHeppard, patrick peterson....etc...etc

I mean, this guys passed all tests! I have a feeling alot of those players i mentioned are gonna be playing on sundays and i'm sure they all will say the same thing about Newton, that hes for real...

Redeyejedi
12-06-2010, 12:55 PM
I actually think if Luck doesn't declare, Newton has got a good chance at being the first QB selected over Ryan Mallett. Possibly, I dont really expect both Mallett and Newton to declare though. But you never know. I do think Newton has a legitimate shot to go in the top 10. Especially after nonsense like Tebow going in the first.I believe u were watching the Auburn-Alabama game. That first half that had him completly rattled. While I like Newtons physical skills the offense that Auburn runs is nothing like like a pro style offense.but u seen him drop back and make nfl type throws often.. Sure, maybe he wont be running totally like a cheetah and what not, but its just a added weapon to his rocket arm... The one thing about cam is hes got the extra speed in case your oline breaks down, where he can make a play with his feet and his ht to go along with that speed is a weapon to see over defenses while on the move or in the pocket.. Having his speed with his size and ht is a huge weapon.. Nothing is guranteed, but my god, hes got enough to take a chance on and hope u are right..

considering that nfl rookie's salaries will be slotted after this year i think we are going to see A LOT of earlies declare. He'll even if luck does declare i think there is a chance of cam going ahead of him. I wouldnt do it personally but somebody is gonna fall in love with this guy and who can blame them.
I just hope the Cowboys don't end up with newton.. I don't feel like dealing with that headache 2times a yr.. I'm so glad that the draft will finally be slotted in the near future... Its about time!
.Look at the time he gets to make these throws.Look at the throwing lanes he has.Watch how open his WR's get.There open by 5 yards 50% of the time.In the NFL a lot of pass plays are rhythm pass plays,small windows, proper timing, Auburns offense doesnt have these plays.Can Cam Newton take a snap under center do a 3 step drop and hit a receiver on a in route in stride. Can he throw a back shoulder throw on the sideline on 3rd and 8. Im not saying he can't and the physical abilities are fantastic but I just dont know because he doesnt do it. The offense Auburn runs is like the exact opposite of an NFL offense. For his sake I hope he goes to a QB friendly system. I think he would be completely lost under Gilbrides system at least initiallyya, but watching Newton all yr long, i seen some throws under pressure and i seen him pump fake getting his wr open by a step and float the ball inches over the defender and into emory blakes hands for a td, probably one of the better throws i've seen all yr long... I mean, most big plays, WR's are at least open, hence the completion to begin with... Not to mention, hes got those legs when people are covered to make yards, ala what u see with mike vick this yr... The team hes on is supre good, but think about it, its because of him that auburn is this good.. Think about Auburn last yr, there not anything remotley close to this good... I mean, lets also not forget hes doing this against S.E.C foe's... I'm completley sold on Newton, hes passed every test in my opinion.... Going against Players such as Justin Houston, Dre Kirkpatrick, jerrell powe, brandon boykin, pernell McPhee, KJ Wright, Marcel Dareus, Mark Barron, Daquan Bowers, Deandre McDaniel, Marcus Gilchrist, Drake Nevis, Kelvin SHeppard, patrick peterson....etc...etc

I mean, this guys passed all tests! I have a feeling alot of those players i mentioned are gonna be playing on sundays and i'm sure they all will say the same thing about Newton, that hes for real...
Yeah I like Newtonand the physical stuff is there buthe in my mind has a ton of questions . He is really going to have to learn how to play QB at the next level. This offense that he is in gives him no help in what he will see in the NFL. It has basically zero NFL reads and very little NFL passing routes and throws. How many times does Newton actually go quickly through his progressions. How many times does Newton get rid of the ball in under 3 seconds. To me ifhis first read isnt open I run or I stand back there for 6 seconds until the guy finally gets open.These type of plays that U see him make down the fieldwith these 5 yard throwing lanes and time will in no way happen in the NFL. It might sound like Imragging onhim but im not.He is doing the right thing and thats there offense so be it.It is quite possible that Cam can do all these things and just hasnt got the opportunity to do so. I just think there is a huge difference in playing QB in Auburns system to the NFL. Its about as gimmicky as there is in CFB. It in no way prepares a QB to play in the NFL.

Redeyejedi
12-06-2010, 01:12 PM
What about Illinois Middle linebacker Martez Wilson as a SOLB in a 4-3. The guy is pretty quick runs a sub 4.6 at 6-4 245. Probably more cut out for a 3-4 but he isnt stiff in the hips like a lot of those guys that size are. Not sure if he would come out but he is a junior</P>

nycsportzfan
12-06-2010, 01:18 PM
I actually think if Luck doesn't declare, Newton has got a good chance at being the first QB selected over Ryan Mallett. Possibly, I dont really expect both Mallett and Newton to declare though. But you never know. I do think Newton has a legitimate shot to go in the top 10. Especially after nonsense like Tebow going in the first.I believe u were watching the Auburn-Alabama game. That first half that had him completly rattled. While I like Newtons physical skills the offense that Auburn runs is nothing like like a pro style offense.but u seen him drop back and make nfl type throws often.. Sure, maybe he wont be running totally like a cheetah and what not, but its just a added weapon to his rocket arm... The one thing about cam is hes got the extra speed in case your oline breaks down, where he can make a play with his feet and his ht to go along with that speed is a weapon to see over defenses while on the move or in the pocket.. Having his speed with his size and ht is a huge weapon.. Nothing is guranteed, but my god, hes got enough to take a chance on and hope u are right..

considering that nfl rookie's salaries will be slotted after this year i think we are going to see A LOT of earlies declare. He'll even if luck does declare i think there is a chance of cam going ahead of him. I wouldnt do it personally but somebody is gonna fall in love with this guy and who can blame them.
I just hope the Cowboys don't end up with newton.. I don't feel like dealing with that headache 2times a yr.. I'm so glad that the draft will finally be slotted in the near future... Its about time!
.Look at the time he gets to make these throws.Look at the throwing lanes he has.Watch how open his WR's get.There open by 5 yards 50% of the time.In the NFL a lot of pass plays are rhythm pass plays,small windows, proper timing, Auburns offense doesnt have these plays.Can Cam Newton take a snap under center do a 3 step drop and hit a receiver on a in route in stride. Can he throw a back shoulder throw on the sideline on 3rd and 8. Im not saying he can't and the physical abilities are fantastic but I just dont know because he doesnt do it. The offense Auburn runs is like the exact opposite of an NFL offense. For his sake I hope he goes to a QB friendly system. I think he would be completely lost under Gilbrides system at least initiallyya, but watching Newton all yr long, i seen some throws under pressure and i seen him pump fake getting his wr open by a step and float the ball inches over the defender and into emory blakes hands for a td, probably one of the better throws i've seen all yr long... I mean, most big plays, WR's are at least open, hence the completion to begin with... Not to mention, hes got those legs when people are covered to make yards, ala what u see with mike vick this yr... The team hes on is supre good, but think about it, its because of him that auburn is this good.. Think about Auburn last yr, there not anything remotley close to this good... I mean, lets also not forget hes doing this against S.E.C foe's... I'm completley sold on Newton, hes passed every test in my opinion.... Going against Players such as Justin Houston, Dre Kirkpatrick, jerrell powe, brandon boykin, pernell McPhee, KJ Wright, Marcel Dareus, Mark Barron, Daquan Bowers, Deandre McDaniel, Marcus Gilchrist, Drake Nevis, Kelvin SHeppard, patrick peterson....etc...etc

I mean, this guys passed all tests! I have a feeling alot of those players i mentioned are gonna be playing on sundays and i'm sure they all will say the same thing about Newton, that hes for real...
Yeah I like Newtonand the physical stuff is there buthe in my mind has a ton of questions . He is really going to have to learn how to play QB at the next level. This offense that he is in gives him no help in what he will see in the NFL. It has basically zero NFL reads and very little NFL passing routes and throws. How many times does Newton actually go quickly through his progressions. How many times does Newton get rid of the ball in under 3 seconds. To me ifhis first read isnt open I run or I stand back there for 6 seconds until the guy finally gets open.These type of plays that U see him make down the fieldwith these 5 yard throwing lanes and time will in no way happen in the NFL. It might sound like Imragging onhim but im not.He is doing the right thing and thats there offense so be it.It is quite possible that Cam can do all these things and just hasnt got the opportunity to do so. I just think there is a huge difference in playing QB in Auburns system to the NFL. Its about as gimmicky as there is in CFB. It in no way prepares a QB to play in the NFL. sure, theres questions, no doubt.. But, who dosen't have questions? I mean, Stanford plays in a wideopen attack, and for all we know, Luck can be the next Trent Edwards, and Arkansas has a crazy offense, of coures theres questions.. I don't think u have seen alot of the throws cams made that are totally fit into the tiniest of spaces, like the TD pass against Ole miss where someone he fit it in the back right(i mean, 1inch back right!) of the endzone to i believe Darvin Adams who was draped and somehow cam put it exactly where only adams could catch it and get 2ft in.. Also, the Td pass against Kentucky where he was scrambling right with a Defender just getting to him he let it go for a perfect bomb pass into the endzone for a TD, while the defender had pretty good coverege... Then the TD pass to emory blake last wk comes to mind as well, as he was covered by 2guys, and he flotaed it over both of em just barley and blake barley had to adjust as it was so perfect of a throw, with pressure just breaking through the line...

Again, theres Questions, of course, but hes made and done enough of everything to take a chance on him.. Hes always gonna have the size and arm strength and wheels, and shown hes very accurate when given time, which alot of QB's have shown there not always accurate on deep throws even when given time, and hes made enough plays throwing on the run and with some pressure and fitting it in tight windows to at least think he can do it consistently, with some more coaching and expierence... I'm with u on questions, but i've seen him do just about everything and make every throw and we shall see if it translates to a more basic offense if thats the way it works out...

slipknottin
12-06-2010, 01:29 PM
Sure Luck could be a bust.

But frankly, hes the best QB prospect to come around in a very very long time. He is the best NFL prospect to come around in a long time, more highly rated than Suh, Calvin Johnson, etc.

nycsportzfan
12-06-2010, 01:37 PM
Sure Luck could be a bust.

But frankly, hes the best QB prospect to come around in a very very long time. He is the best NFL prospect to come around in a long time, more highly rated than Suh, Calvin Johnson, etc. totally diffrent positon then johnson and suh, so i dont buy that for a second.. If Suh ends up being the best DT in the league for yrs to come and Calvin keeps doing what hes doing, then how can he be a better prospect then them? Those 2 are doing exactly what they were drafted to do and if they keep playing stellar ball, its kinda hard to say there not exactly the top prospects they were supposed to be, theres no way at all to compare...

slipknottin
12-06-2010, 02:21 PM
totally diffrent positon then johnson and suh, so i dont buy that for a second..

As I said, Luck is the best NFL prospect, not the best QB prospect, to come out in years.

Redeyejedi
12-06-2010, 02:59 PM
I actually think if Luck doesn't declare, Newton has got a good chance at being the first QB selected over Ryan Mallett. Possibly, I dont really expect both Mallett and Newton to declare though. But you never know. I do think Newton has a legitimate shot to go in the top 10. Especially after nonsense like Tebow going in the first.I believe u were watching the Auburn-Alabama game. That first half that had him completly rattled. While I like Newtons physical skills the offense that Auburn runs is nothing like like a pro style offense.but u seen him drop back and make nfl type throws often.. Sure, maybe he wont be running totally like a cheetah and what not, but its just a added weapon to his rocket arm... The one thing about cam is hes got the extra speed in case your oline breaks down, where he can make a play with his feet and his ht to go along with that speed is a weapon to see over defenses while on the move or in the pocket.. Having his speed with his size and ht is a huge weapon.. Nothing is guranteed, but my god, hes got enough to take a chance on and hope u are right..

considering that nfl rookie's salaries will be slotted after this year i think we are going to see A LOT of earlies declare. He'll even if luck does declare i think there is a chance of cam going ahead of him. I wouldnt do it personally but somebody is gonna fall in love with this guy and who can blame them.
I just hope the Cowboys don't end up with newton.. I don't feel like dealing with that headache 2times a yr.. I'm so glad that the draft will finally be slotted in the near future... Its about time!
.Look at the time he gets to make these throws.Look at the throwing lanes he has.Watch how open his WR's get.There open by 5 yards 50% of the time.In the NFL a lot of pass plays are rhythm pass plays,small windows, proper timing, Auburns offense doesnt have these plays.Can Cam Newton take a snap under center do a 3 step drop and hit a receiver on a in route in stride. Can he throw a back shoulder throw on the sideline on 3rd and 8. Im not saying he can't and the physical abilities are fantastic but I just dont know because he doesnt do it. The offense Auburn runs is like the exact opposite of an NFL offense. For his sake I hope he goes to a QB friendly system. I think he would be completely lost under Gilbrides system at least initiallyya, but watching Newton all yr long, i seen some throws under pressure and i seen him pump fake getting his wr open by a step and float the ball inches over the defender and into emory blakes hands for a td, probably one of the better throws i've seen all yr long... I mean, most big plays, WR's are at least open, hence the completion to begin with... Not to mention, hes got those legs when people are covered to make yards, ala what u see with mike vick this yr... The team hes on is supre good, but think about it, its because of him that auburn is this good.. Think about Auburn last yr, there not anything remotley close to this good... I mean, lets also not forget hes doing this against S.E.C foe's... I'm completley sold on Newton, hes passed every test in my opinion.... Going against Players such as Justin Houston, Dre Kirkpatrick, jerrell powe, brandon boykin, pernell McPhee, KJ Wright, Marcel Dareus, Mark Barron, Daquan Bowers, Deandre McDaniel, Marcus Gilchrist, Drake Nevis, Kelvin SHeppard, patrick peterson....etc...etc

I mean, this guys passed all tests! I have a feeling alot of those players i mentioned are gonna be playing on sundays and i'm sure they all will say the same thing about Newton, that hes for real...
Yeah I like Newtonand the physical stuff is there buthe in my mind has a ton of questions . He is really going to have to learn how to play QB at the next level. This offense that he is in gives him no help in what he will see in the NFL. It has basically zero NFL reads and very little NFL passing routes and throws. How many times does Newton actually go quickly through his progressions. How many times does Newton get rid of the ball in under 3 seconds. To me ifhis first read isnt open I run or I stand back there for 6 seconds until the guy finally gets open.These type of plays that U see him make down the fieldwith these 5 yard throwing lanes and time will in no way happen in the NFL. It might sound like Imragging onhim but im not.He is doing the right thing and thats there offense so be it.It is quite possible that Cam can do all these things and just hasnt got the opportunity to do so. I just think there is a huge difference in playing QB in Auburns system to the NFL. Its about as gimmicky as there is in CFB. It in no way prepares a QB to play in the NFL. sure, theres questions, no doubt.. But, who dosen't have questions? I mean, Stanford plays in a wideopen attack, and for all we know, Luck can be the next Trent Edwards, and Arkansas has a crazy offense, of coures theres questions.. I don't think u have seen alot of the throws cams made that are totally fit into the tiniest of spaces, like the TD pass against Ole miss where someone he fit it in the back right(i mean, 1inch back right!) of the endzone to i believe Darvin Adams who was draped and somehow cam put it exactly where only adams could catch it and get 2ft in.. Also, the Td pass against Kentucky where he was scrambling right with a Defender just getting to him he let it go for a perfect bomb pass into the endzone for a TD, while the defender had pretty good coverege... Then the TD pass to emory blake last wk comes to mind as well, as he was covered by 2guys, and he flotaed it over both of em just barley and blake barley had to adjust as it was so perfect of a throw, with pressure just breaking through the line...

Again, theres Questions, of course, but hes made and done enough of everything to take a chance on him.. Hes always gonna have the size and arm strength and wheels, and shown hes very accurate when given time, which alot of QB's have shown there not always accurate on deep throws even when given time, and hes made enough plays throwing on the run and with some pressure and fitting it in tight windows to at least think he can do it consistently, with some more coaching and expierence... I'm with u on questions, but i've seen him do just about everything and make every throw and we shall see if it translates to a more basic offense if thats the way it works out...
Im talking about mostly the timing type routes they dont run those plays. Everything Auburn does is vertical down the field passing

Neverend
12-06-2010, 06:50 PM
Newton is a project IMO. Needs some development. He reminds me of michael vick/vince young. He has amazing arm strength but his accuracy isn't his strong point. His mechanics and footwork needs a lot of refinement. Too many times I've seen his receivers have to slow down or adjust to his passes and he's not really a pocket QB. Also (imo) a project's success is determined on the team that drafts him (a good organization with a respectable coaching staff) and that players' intangibles. He does have some red flags because of what his father did.</P>


Newton has tremendous athleticism, arm strength, and size but still pretty raw. He will not start in the NFL immediately. Definitely has amazing upside tho</P>

nycsportzfan
12-06-2010, 06:55 PM
Newton is a project IMO. Needs some development. He reminds me of michael vick/vince young. He has amazing arm strength but his accuracy isn't his strong point. His mechanics and footwork needs a lot of refinement. Too many times I've seen his receivers have to slow down or adjust to his passes and he's not really a pocket QB. Also (imo) a project's success is determined on the team that drafts him (a good organization with a respectable coaching staff) and that players' intangibles. He does have some red flags because of what his father did.</p>


Newton has tremendous athleticism, arm strength, and size but still pretty raw. He will not start in the NFL immediately. Definitely has amazing upside tho</p> Hes completing almost 70pct of his pass's... Thats pretty darn accurate..

Redeyejedi
12-06-2010, 07:13 PM
Newton is a project IMO. Needs some development. He reminds me of michael vick/vince young. He has amazing arm strength but his accuracy isn't his strong point. His mechanics and footwork needs a lot of refinement. Too many times I've seen his receivers have to slow down or adjust to his passes and he's not really a pocket QB. Also (imo) a project's success is determined on the team that drafts him (a good organization with a respectable coaching staff) and that players' intangibles. He does have some red flags because of what his father did.</P>


Newton has tremendous athleticism, arm strength, and size but still pretty raw. He will not start in the NFL immediately. Definitely has amazing upside tho</P> Hes completing almost 70pct of his pass's... Thats pretty darn accurate..
Yeah for the things they ask him to do he is magnificent. My only thing is they dont ask him to do NFL types of reads and his receivers dont run NFL routes. Thats not his fault Im just saying

Neverend
12-06-2010, 07:39 PM
Newton is a project IMO. Needs some development. He reminds me of michael vick/vince young. He has amazing arm strength but his accuracy isn't his strong point. His mechanics and footwork needs a lot of refinement. Too many times I've seen his receivers have to slow down or adjust to his passes and he's not really a pocket QB. Also (imo) a project's success is determined on the team that drafts him (a good organization with a respectable coaching staff) and that players' intangibles. He does have some red flags because of what his father did.</P>


Newton has tremendous athleticism, arm strength, and size but still pretty raw. He will not start in the NFL immediately. Definitely has amazing upside tho</P>


Hes completing almost 70pct of his pass's... Thats pretty darn accurate..
Yeah for the things they ask him to do he is magnificent. My only thing is they dont ask him to do NFL types of reads and his receivers dont run NFL routes. Thats not his fault Im just saying</P>


I haven't seen newton make those NFL throws that requires the qb to fit balls into tight windows. Agreed on the lack of NFL type reads, Newton plays in a one-readpassoffense that doesn't even require newton to look through his progressions. His offenseis full of designed runs more of then not too. He also some bust potential with his character concerns. I love the guy's upside and raw natural ability but it would be a big mistake to start this guy in the NFL right away. He needs to sit behind a veteran and develop from there</P>

lawl
12-07-2010, 02:01 AM
All freshman team CB last year Josh Robinson against AJ Green Liberty Bowl. Hopefully the kid holds up, UCF is known for putting out solid DBs so we'll see if this kid is next in line.</P>


Any of you guys watch UCF ball?</P>

nycsportzfan
12-07-2010, 08:14 AM
Newton is a project IMO. Needs some development. He reminds me of michael vick/vince young. He has amazing arm strength but his accuracy isn't his strong point. His mechanics and footwork needs a lot of refinement. Too many times I've seen his receivers have to slow down or adjust to his passes and he's not really a pocket QB. Also (imo) a project's success is determined on the team that drafts him (a good organization with a respectable coaching staff) and that players' intangibles. He does have some red flags because of what his father did.</p>


Newton has tremendous athleticism, arm strength, and size but still pretty raw. He will not start in the NFL immediately. Definitely has amazing upside tho</p> Hes completing almost 70pct of his pass's... Thats pretty darn accurate..
Yeah for the things they ask him to do he is magnificent. My only thing is they dont ask him to do NFL types of reads and his receivers dont run NFL routes. Thats not his fault Im just saying yes, u have made that point quite clear...lol It dosen't change the fact hes hitting his recievers on the move, with guys coming on him, ala the kentucky td pass that was amazing as a Defender litteraly was just about on him and he threw it while scrambling right on the money.. What QB can make that throw? seriously? And speaking of timing patterns, how about his TD pass in the Clemson game, where he freaking gunned it as hard as i seen a QB gun a pass for a 6yrd td pass to the just inside right hashmark, to the point the REF said the WR was out of bounds(a corner was litteraly on his back by the way) and replay clearly showed the feet in... It was just a shot gun get the ball and a second later gun it to where the WR is supposed to be... I mean, the guys made every play, maybe not as much as some would like, but theres evidence of every type of play and throw made from this kid.. The TD pass against KU and Ole Miss are flat out, ******edly sickening good, and i don't know if any player in this Country can make the same throws... I believe in, if your a Good PLayer, your gonna be good, as its just in your blood and your destiny to be good... Cam Newtons just a good player, who can make all the throws, can improvise, and has extremely awesome measurables and speed, and is 100times more accurate at his age then Mike Vick was at the same time, plus he has the advantage of seeing over most defenders, as mike vick can't do that... Dudes stupid accurate, and i've been writing about this kid since like the 2nd wk of the season and had money on just about every game hes played in, so i've seen just about every play from him, and wk by wk, i just kept wanting to see one more thing, to make me a total believer and every wk i was left satisfied and seeing that one more thing... I am 100pct completely satisfied and i would draft him in a Heart beat if i was a GM looking for a QB.. I'd take him over every QB except Luck...

nycsportzfan
12-07-2010, 08:24 AM
Newton is a project IMO. Needs some development. He reminds me of michael vick/vince young. He has amazing arm strength but his accuracy isn't his strong point. His mechanics and footwork needs a lot of refinement. Too many times I've seen his receivers have to slow down or adjust to his passes and he's not really a pocket QB. Also (imo) a project's success is determined on the team that drafts him (a good organization with a respectable coaching staff) and that players' intangibles. He does have some red flags because of what his father did.</p>


Newton has tremendous athleticism, arm strength, and size but still pretty raw. He will not start in the NFL immediately. Definitely has amazing upside tho</p>


Hes completing almost 70pct of his pass's... Thats pretty darn accurate..
Yeah for the things they ask him to do he is magnificent. My only thing is they dont ask him to do NFL types of reads and his receivers dont run NFL routes. Thats not his fault Im just saying</p>


I haven't seen newton make those NFL throws that requires the qb to fit balls into tight windows. Agreed on the lack of NFL type reads, Newton plays in a one-readpassoffense that doesn't even require newton to look through his progressions. His offenseis full of designed runs more of then not too. He also some bust potential with his character concerns. I love the guy's upside and raw natural ability but it would be a big mistake to start this guy in the NFL right away. He needs to sit behind a veteran and develop from there</p> i don't know how u have watched him and not seen him fit it into small windows.. I mean, sure hes hit a ton of pass's where the WR's are open, but my lord, hes made a ton of incredible throws with players right on the WR"s, ala KU game and Ole Miss game, and Clemson game for starters... I mean, its also a testament to Cam, for making some of these plays look so easy as teams must keep a Spy on him and must always have there attention to him possibly taking off for a huge gain... Sure, hes got some things to learn, but most didn't expect him to do what hes done this yr, either.. But yet, here we are.. I remember back in WK3, people were talking about his arm and could he make this throw and is he accurate enough to make this throw, or is he just a runner...etc...etc And bang, u would see the rockets right on target and the bombs floated right in there, and those questions were answered.. I mean, the guys going in RD 1, thats the bottom line, and chances are, after the combine, he'll be a shoe in for the top 15... The guy dosen't throw picks either, as he's only thrown 6 all season long, hes always making the right decisons.. Thats another thing that goes along way.. Its not often u have a 6ft 6inch QB who can throw and run, its a huge weapon against defenses when the QB can see the whole field and decide if he can run or make the throw, as he see's everyone and over everyone...

I never think anyones a gurantee.. I sat here and debated heavily last yr against Cj Spiller not being a sure thing, as almost everyone raved about him, but i'll straight up say, i would take Newton in a second if i was a GM looking for a QB...

nycsportzfan
12-07-2010, 08:31 AM
Loved what merril hodge had to say today on Mike and Mike.. He was talking about the Pats , and brought up how overrated the Combine and all the stuff we try and decipher to decide if these players are big enough and fast enough, and how they move up because they ran a tenth of a second faster then this guy, and how how guys move up RD's over a bench press...etc...etc He then goes on to say look at Danny Woodhead, Deion Branch, benjarvus green ellis, Wes Welker... He goes on to say, they may not be the biggest, strongst or fastest, but they know how to play football, and there reliable and thats why the pats are so good, they don't drop stupid pass's that any moe thats played a snap of football would catch.. They don't run out of bounds when the first down markers a foot away, they just know how to play football..

How true is that? U see so many Freaks of nature, and see them drop the easiest of catches and make the stupidest of mistakes, and u think, man so what if the guys fast or whatever, hes dumb and not consistent, is all his mistakes and drops and whatever worth a big play, here and there?


Look at how many teams passed over Ahmad Bradshaw(albeit some charechter concerns).. Probably becasue he wasen't the speediest of backs and not speedy and small, supposedly equals, no success in the nfl.. Well, guess what? The guys insane! He knows how to play football, and u don't have to run a 4.40 in this league to succeed.. In fact, if thats all u can do, u will not succeed in the NFL!

nycsportzfan
12-07-2010, 08:31 AM
sorry so many long Posts fellas, i coulden't find a way to shorten them..lol My bad!!

Redeyejedi
12-07-2010, 08:43 AM
Newton is a project IMO. Needs some development. He reminds me of michael vick/vince young. He has amazing arm strength but his accuracy isn't his strong point. His mechanics and footwork needs a lot of refinement. Too many times I've seen his receivers have to slow down or adjust to his passes and he's not really a pocket QB. Also (imo) a project's success is determined on the team that drafts him (a good organization with a respectable coaching staff) and that players' intangibles. He does have some red flags because of what his father did.</P>


Newton has tremendous athleticism, arm strength, and size but still pretty raw. He will not start in the NFL immediately. Definitely has amazing upside tho</P>


Hes completing almost 70pct of his pass's... Thats pretty darn accurate..
Yeah for the things they ask him to do he is magnificent. My only thing is they dont ask him to do NFL types of reads and his receivers dont run NFL routes. Thats not his fault Im just saying yes, u have made that point quite clear...lol It dosen't change the fact hes hitting his recievers on the move, with guys coming on him, ala the kentucky td pass that was amazing as a Defender litteraly was just about on him and he threw it while scrambling right on the money.. What QB can make that throw? seriously? And speaking of timing patterns, how about his TD pass in the Clemson game, where he freaking gunned it as hard as i seen a QB gun a pass for a 6yrd td pass to the just inside right hashmark, to the point the REF said the WR was out of bounds(a corner was litteraly on his back by the way) and replay clearly showed the feet in... It was just a shot gun get the ball and a second later gun it to where the WR is supposed to be... I mean, the guys made every play, maybe not as much as some would like, but theres evidence of every type of play and throw made from this kid.. The TD pass against KU and Ole Miss are flat out, ******edly sickening good, and i don't know if any player in this Country can make the same throws... I believe in, if your a Good PLayer, your gonna be good, as its just in your blood and your destiny to be good... Cam Newtons just a good player, who can make all the throws, can improvise, and has extremely awesome measurables and speed, and is 100times more accurate at his age then Mike Vick was at the same time, plus he has the advantage of seeing over most defenders, as mike vick can't do that... Dudes stupid accurate, and i've been writing about this kid since like the 2nd wk of the season and had money on just about every game hes played in, so i've seen just about every play from him, and wk by wk, i just kept wanting to see one more thing, to make me a total believer and every wk i was left satisfied and seeing that one more thing... I am 100pct completely satisfied and i would draft him in a Heart beat if i was a GM looking for a QB.. I'd take him over every QB except Luck...


</P>


Ive watched him just as much as U and Im well aware of what his accomplishments are. That doesnt change the fact the offense he is in has zero NFL reads and next to no NFL passing routes. He has met every challenge in CFB and its probable he will nail it in the NFL as well.Just to get this straight I like Cam alothe has through the roof upside and I love watching him play. I just know he is going to end up on the Redskins and Im going to have to hate him.</P>

Redeyejedi
12-07-2010, 08:51 AM
Loved what merril hodge had to say today on Mike and Mike.. He was talking about the Pats , and brought up how overrated the Combine and all the stuff we try and decipher to decide if these players are big enough and fast enough, and how they move up because they ran a tenth of a second faster then this guy, and how how guys move up RD's over a bench press...etc...etc He then goes on to say look at Danny Woodhead, Deion Branch, benjarvus green ellis, Wes Welker... He goes on to say, they may not be the biggest, strongst or fastest, but they know how to play football, and there reliable and thats why the pats are so good, they don't drop stupid pass's that any moe thats played a snap of football would catch.. They don't run out of bounds when the first down markers a foot away, they just know how to play football..

How true is that? U see so many Freaks of nature, and see them drop the easiest of catches and make the stupidest of mistakes, and u think, man so what if the guys fast or whatever, hes dumb and not consistent, is all his mistakes and drops and whatever worth a big play, here and there?


Look at how many teams passed over Ahmad Bradshaw(albeit some character concerns).. Probably becasue he wasn't the speediest of backs and not speedy and small, supposedly equals, no success in the nfl.. Well, guess what? The guys insane! He knows how to play football, and u don't have to run a 4.40 in this league to succeed.. In fact, if thats all u can do, u will not succeed in the NFL!
</P>


Yeah I like combine numbers way more on defensive players then offensive players. On defense Ilike having the biggest and fastest players out there. On offense route running and good hands trumps pure speed and height. Vision and how hard U run trumps RB size and speed. QB measurables are meaningless as long as the guy has enough height and dont give me Drew Brees one QB that is elite at that height doesnt make something universally true. </P>

Neverend
12-07-2010, 09:05 AM
Loved what merril hodge had to say today on Mike and Mike.. He was talking about the Pats , and brought up how overrated the Combine and all the stuff we try and decipher to decide if these players are big enough and fast enough, and how they move up because they ran a tenth of a second faster then this guy, and how how guys move up RD's over a bench press...etc...etc He then goes on to say look at Danny Woodhead, Deion Branch, benjarvus green ellis, Wes Welker... He goes on to say, they may not be the biggest, strongst or fastest, but they know how to play football, and there reliable and thats why the pats are so good, they don't drop stupid pass's that any moe thats played a snap of football would catch.. They don't run out of bounds when the first down markers a foot away, they just know how to play football..

How true is that? U see so many Freaks of nature, and see them drop the easiest of catches and make the stupidest of mistakes, and u think, man so what if the guys fast or whatever, hes dumb and not consistent, is all his mistakes and drops and whatever worth a big play, here and there?


Look at how many teams passed over Ahmad Bradshaw(albeit some charechter concerns).. Probably becasue he wasen't the speediest of backs and not speedy and small, supposedly equals, no success in the nfl.. Well, guess what? The guys insane! He knows how to play football, and u don't have to run a 4.40 in this league to succeed.. In fact, if thats all u can do, u will not succeed in the NFL!
</P>


Yeah, I agree. People put too much on natural athleticism and potential from the combine. I'll take a guy who is polished technique-wise, has good intangibles, and has goodwork ethic over some athletic beast that is inconsistent or ****y. Just look at reggie bush, amazing athlete but not a football player. </P>

Neverend
12-07-2010, 09:05 AM
Loved what merril hodge had to say today on Mike and Mike.. He was talking about the Pats , and brought up how overrated the Combine and all the stuff we try and decipher to decide if these players are big enough and fast enough, and how they move up because they ran a tenth of a second faster then this guy, and how how guys move up RD's over a bench press...etc...etc He then goes on to say look at Danny Woodhead, Deion Branch, benjarvus green ellis, Wes Welker... He goes on to say, they may not be the biggest, strongst or fastest, but they know how to play football, and there reliable and thats why the pats are so good, they don't drop stupid pass's that any moe thats played a snap of football would catch.. They don't run out of bounds when the first down markers a foot away, they just know how to play football..

How true is that? U see so many Freaks of nature, and see them drop the easiest of catches and make the stupidest of mistakes, and u think, man so what if the guys fast or whatever, hes dumb and not consistent, is all his mistakes and drops and whatever worth a big play, here and there?


Look at how many teams passed over Ahmad Bradshaw(albeit some charechter concerns).. Probably becasue he wasen't the speediest of backs and not speedy and small, supposedly equals, no success in the nfl.. Well, guess what? The guys insane! He knows how to play football, and u don't have to run a 4.40 in this league to succeed.. In fact, if thats all u can do, u will not succeed in the NFL!
</P>


Yeah, I agree. People put too much on natural athleticism and potential from the combine. I'll take a guy who is polished technique-wise, has good intangibles, and has goodwork ethic over some athletic beast that is inconsistent or ****y. Just look at reggie bush, amazing athlete but not a football player. It </P>

Neverend
12-07-2010, 09:05 AM
Loved what merril hodge had to say today on Mike and Mike.. He was talking about the Pats , and brought up how overrated the Combine and all the stuff we try and decipher to decide if these players are big enough and fast enough, and how they move up because they ran a tenth of a second faster then this guy, and how how guys move up RD's over a bench press...etc...etc He then goes on to say look at Danny Woodhead, Deion Branch, benjarvus green ellis, Wes Welker... He goes on to say, they may not be the biggest, strongst or fastest, but they know how to play football, and there reliable and thats why the pats are so good, they don't drop stupid pass's that any moe thats played a snap of football would catch.. They don't run out of bounds when the first down markers a foot away, they just know how to play football..

How true is that? U see so many Freaks of nature, and see them drop the easiest of catches and make the stupidest of mistakes, and u think, man so what if the guys fast or whatever, hes dumb and not consistent, is all his mistakes and drops and whatever worth a big play, here and there?


Look at how many teams passed over Ahmad Bradshaw(albeit some charechter concerns).. Probably becasue he wasen't the speediest of backs and not speedy and small, supposedly equals, no success in the nfl.. Well, guess what? The guys insane! He knows how to play football, and u don't have to run a 4.40 in this league to succeed.. In fact, if thats all u can do, u will not succeed in the NFL!
</P>


Yeah, I agree. People put too much on natural athleticism and potential from the combine. I'll take a guy who is polished technique-wise, has good intangibles, and has goodwork ethic over some athletic beast that is inconsistent or ****y. Just look at reggie bush, amazing athlete but not a football player. It does </P>

Neverend
12-07-2010, 09:05 AM
Loved what merril hodge had to say today on Mike and Mike.. He was talking about the Pats , and brought up how overrated the Combine and all the stuff we try and decipher to decide if these players are big enough and fast enough, and how they move up because they ran a tenth of a second faster then this guy, and how how guys move up RD's over a bench press...etc...etc He then goes on to say look at Danny Woodhead, Deion Branch, benjarvus green ellis, Wes Welker... He goes on to say, they may not be the biggest, strongst or fastest, but they know how to play football, and there reliable and thats why the pats are so good, they don't drop stupid pass's that any moe thats played a snap of football would catch.. They don't run out of bounds when the first down markers a foot away, they just know how to play football..

How true is that? U see so many Freaks of nature, and see them drop the easiest of catches and make the stupidest of mistakes, and u think, man so what if the guys fast or whatever, hes dumb and not consistent, is all his mistakes and drops and whatever worth a big play, here and there?


Look at how many teams passed over Ahmad Bradshaw(albeit some charechter concerns).. Probably becasue he wasen't the speediest of backs and not speedy and small, supposedly equals, no success in the nfl.. Well, guess what? The guys insane! He knows how to play football, and u don't have to run a 4.40 in this league to succeed.. In fact, if thats all u can do, u will not succeed in the NFL!
</P>


Yeah, I agree. People put too much on natural athleticism and potential from the combine. I'll take a guy who is polished technique-wise, has good intangibles, and has goodwork ethic over some athletic beast that is inconsistent or ****y. Just look at reggie bush, amazing athlete but not a football player. </P>

nycsportzfan
12-07-2010, 09:10 AM
Newton is a project IMO. Needs some development. He reminds me of michael vick/vince young. He has amazing arm strength but his accuracy isn't his strong point. His mechanics and footwork needs a lot of refinement. Too many times I've seen his receivers have to slow down or adjust to his passes and he's not really a pocket QB. Also (imo) a project's success is determined on the team that drafts him (a good organization with a respectable coaching staff) and that players' intangibles. He does have some red flags because of what his father did.</p>


Newton has tremendous athleticism, arm strength, and size but still pretty raw. He will not start in the NFL immediately. Definitely has amazing upside tho</p>


Hes completing almost 70pct of his pass's... Thats pretty darn accurate..
Yeah for the things they ask him to do he is magnificent. My only thing is they dont ask him to do NFL types of reads and his receivers dont run NFL routes. Thats not his fault Im just saying yes, u have made that point quite clear...lol It dosen't change the fact hes hitting his recievers on the move, with guys coming on him, ala the kentucky td pass that was amazing as a Defender litteraly was just about on him and he threw it while scrambling right on the money.. What QB can make that throw? seriously? And speaking of timing patterns, how about his TD pass in the Clemson game, where he freaking gunned it as hard as i seen a QB gun a pass for a 6yrd td pass to the just inside right hashmark, to the point the REF said the WR was out of bounds(a corner was litteraly on his back by the way) and replay clearly showed the feet in... It was just a shot gun get the ball and a second later gun it to where the WR is supposed to be... I mean, the guys made every play, maybe not as much as some would like, but theres evidence of every type of play and throw made from this kid.. The TD pass against KU and Ole Miss are flat out, ******edly sickening good, and i don't know if any player in this Country can make the same throws... I believe in, if your a Good PLayer, your gonna be good, as its just in your blood and your destiny to be good... Cam Newtons just a good player, who can make all the throws, can improvise, and has extremely awesome measurables and speed, and is 100times more accurate at his age then Mike Vick was at the same time, plus he has the advantage of seeing over most defenders, as mike vick can't do that... Dudes stupid accurate, and i've been writing about this kid since like the 2nd wk of the season and had money on just about every game hes played in, so i've seen just about every play from him, and wk by wk, i just kept wanting to see one more thing, to make me a total believer and every wk i was left satisfied and seeing that one more thing... I am 100pct completely satisfied and i would draft him in a Heart beat if i was a GM looking for a QB.. I'd take him over every QB except Luck...


</p>


Ive watched him just as much as U and Im well aware of what his accomplishments are. That doesnt change the fact the offense he is in has zero NFL reads and next to no NFL passing routes. He has met every challenge in CFB and its probable he will nail it in the NFL as well.Just to get this straight I like Cam alothe has through the roof upside and I love watching him play. I just know he is going to end up on the Redskins and Im going to have to hate him.</p> Fair enough... I also hope he don't end up on WASH or DALL... Anywhere else but there! I wonder if a team like Cincy would grab him up.. I know one things for sure, He will be a raider if hes on the board when they pick, and thats 100pct FACT!!!lol So many teams could use him, including the 9ers, the panthers, the dolphins, the texans(??), the vikings, the cards, the jags, the titans, the bills, the skins, the seahawks(whitehurst isn't answer)... Thats alot of teams, and thats off the top of the head...

nycsportzfan
12-07-2010, 09:13 AM
Loved what merril hodge had to say today on Mike and Mike.. He was talking about the Pats , and brought up how overrated the Combine and all the stuff we try and decipher to decide if these players are big enough and fast enough, and how they move up because they ran a tenth of a second faster then this guy, and how how guys move up RD's over a bench press...etc...etc He then goes on to say look at Danny Woodhead, Deion Branch, benjarvus green ellis, Wes Welker... He goes on to say, they may not be the biggest, strongst or fastest, but they know how to play football, and there reliable and thats why the pats are so good, they don't drop stupid pass's that any moe thats played a snap of football would catch.. They don't run out of bounds when the first down markers a foot away, they just know how to play football..

How true is that? U see so many Freaks of nature, and see them drop the easiest of catches and make the stupidest of mistakes, and u think, man so what if the guys fast or whatever, hes dumb and not consistent, is all his mistakes and drops and whatever worth a big play, here and there?


Look at how many teams passed over Ahmad Bradshaw(albeit some charechter concerns).. Probably becasue he wasen't the speediest of backs and not speedy and small, supposedly equals, no success in the nfl.. Well, guess what? The guys insane! He knows how to play football, and u don't have to run a 4.40 in this league to succeed.. In fact, if thats all u can do, u will not succeed in the NFL!
</p>


Yeah, I agree. People put too much on natural athleticism and potential from the combine. I'll take a guy who is polished technique-wise, has good intangibles, and has goodwork ethic over some athletic beast that is inconsistent or ****y. Just look at reggie bush, amazing athlete but not a football player. It </p> its ridiculous... I always put my 2-cents in based on the player, and only use combine stuff and what not, as 1small piece of the puzzle...

slipknottin
12-07-2010, 10:14 AM
Athleticism, toughness, and instincts are the three most important parts.

Mental toughness in both the ability to play through injuries, and the attitude to work hard on and off the field.

Polish and proper technique are overrated.

Every single team would chose the more athletic guy over the less athletic more polished guy assuming all else is equal

Redeyejedi
12-07-2010, 10:19 AM
Athleticism, toughness, and instincts are the three most important parts. Mental toughness in both the ability to play through injuries, and the attitude to work hard on and off the field. Polish and proper technique are overrated. Every single team would chose the more athletic guy over the less athletic more polished guy assuming all else is equalI dont think its over rated I just think coaches believe that they can teach technique. I think teams draft athletes way more on defense then offense though

slipknottin
12-07-2010, 10:22 AM
]I dont think its over rated I just think coaches believe that they can teach technique. I think teams draft athletes way more on defense then offense though

I think they draft athletes on both sides as often as they can. And you're right, they can teach technique. It goes back to the mental toughness and how coachable guys are.

That's why a guy like JPP is a coaches dream, extremely athletic but he is very hard working, and will listen and apply everything he is told.

Neverend
12-07-2010, 10:28 AM
ah crap, sorry for the quad-post.</P>



Athleticism, toughness, and instincts are the three most important parts. Mental toughness in both the ability to play through injuries, and the attitude to work hard on and off the field. Polish and proper technique are overrated. Every single team would chose the more athletic guy over the less athletic more polished guy assuming all else is equal</P>


Eh, I think its more underrated but we all have our opinions I guess. I just personally prefer a guy who is a polished route runner over a speedy,tallathletic beast.But it also depends on the position too, I can live with a pass rusher who is quick, fast, and very strongbut lacking in the technique-area over a cornerbackwho is very fast but is lacking in the technique area becauseplaying corner is very tough. You'reright tho, teams do prefer it the other way.It still can go both ways, you can have a polished guy who never makes a game-changing play or any impactful plays, or you can have an athleticbeast who can't fulfill his potential or has character issues. Both have risks I guess</P>

slipknottin
12-07-2010, 10:35 AM
Personally I would take the guy with the greater athleticism and teach him how to properly run routes.

Really it's not a huge issue, the other factors will be more of the key to a players success, how hard a guy works is probably #1, but something that is so rarely talked about.

Sintim for instance, tons of physical talent, but he doesn't apply himself. Goff is average physically, but he works hard. It's the biggest reason for a guys success and the biggest reason for a guys failure.

How many times has a guy been drafted in the first couple rounds and busted out because he wasent physically talented enough? Besides injuries, almost never.

Neverend
12-07-2010, 12:09 PM
Pulled this from eagles MB: http://boards.philadelphiaeagles.com/index.php?showtopic=590067&amp;st=180</P>



Look, Graham was supposed to be the high motor slam dunk guy. He wasn't the salivating athletic specimen that JPP and Dunlap were. They were supposed to be the raw upside projects who needed years to be refined. Graham expected to be the lower risk, polished, finished product.

Yet Graham is the one that is now reduced to the project/next year label while the two athletic freaks are making plays as rookies.

So if he "just needs a little time up the learning curve," then Graham is already losing value and falling behind guys who went after him, who were more athletic projects that are playing better NOW.

How many of you would honestly not trade Graham straight up for JPP RIGHT NOW. Be honest.</P>


I may have to retract my statement about drafting polished players over athletic monsters. JPP is making me change my entire outlook on draft prospects</P>

nycsportzfan
12-07-2010, 06:08 PM
Athleticism, toughness, and instincts are the three most important parts. Mental toughness in both the ability to play through injuries, and the attitude to work hard on and off the field. Polish and proper technique are overrated. Every single team would chose the more athletic guy over the less athletic more polished guy assuming all else is equalI dont think its over rated I just think coaches believe that they can teach technique. I think teams draft athletes way more on defense then offense though All i know, is the best team in football, has 7th rd draft pick Tom Brady throwing to undrafted Wes Welker and Danny Woodhead, and Ben Jarvus Green-Ellis toating the rock... Also, Deion branch isn't exactly a Physical Specimen...lol A very good player on that defense, Gary Guyton, also i believe undrafted, or at least late late rd... I believe that u first and fore most must be a productive college player, as u don't want those athletic players that "COULD" end up being stellar.. I think the combine is just one step, and when teams use it to much, is when trouble starts.. I love the way the Patriots draft, and the type of players they bring along, its really, the right way, in my opinion...

Redeyejedi
12-07-2010, 08:34 PM
Athleticism, toughness, and instincts are the three most important parts. Mental toughness in both the ability to play through injuries, and the attitude to work hard on and off the field. Polish and proper technique are overrated. Every single team would chose the more athletic guy over the less athletic more polished guy assuming all else is equalI dont think its over rated I just think coaches believe that they can teach technique. I think teams draft athletes way more on defense then offense though All i know, is the best team in football, has 7th rd draft pick Tom Brady throwing to undrafted Wes Welker and Danny Woodhead, and Ben Jarvus Green-Ellis toating the rock... Also, Deion branch isn't exactly a Physical Specimen...lol A very good player on that defense, Gary Guyton, also i believe undrafted, or at least late late rd... I believe that u first and fore most must be a productive college player, as u don't want those athletic players that "COULD" end up being stellar.. I think the combine is just one step, and when teams use it to much, is when trouble starts.. I love the way the Patriots draft, and the type of players they bring along, its really, the right way, in my opinion...
Well not every team is as astute as Bill Belicheck and the NE Patriots. A lot of those playersU mentioned where not drafted or even signed as rookies by the Patriots.These same players were discarded by other teams. The Patriots more thenany other team take what a guy does well and maximizes it. Those same players when they wereother teams werent half the players they arenow.

nycsportzfan
12-08-2010, 08:59 AM
Athleticism, toughness, and instincts are the three most important parts. Mental toughness in both the ability to play through injuries, and the attitude to work hard on and off the field. Polish and proper technique are overrated. Every single team would chose the more athletic guy over the less athletic more polished guy assuming all else is equalI dont think its over rated I just think coaches believe that they can teach technique. I think teams draft athletes way more on defense then offense though All i know, is the best team in football, has 7th rd draft pick Tom Brady throwing to undrafted Wes Welker and Danny Woodhead, and Ben Jarvus Green-Ellis toating the rock... Also, Deion branch isn't exactly a Physical Specimen...lol A very good player on that defense, Gary Guyton, also i believe undrafted, or at least late late rd... I believe that u first and fore most must be a productive college player, as u don't want those athletic players that "COULD" end up being stellar.. I think the combine is just one step, and when teams use it to much, is when trouble starts.. I love the way the Patriots draft, and the type of players they bring along, its really, the right way, in my opinion...
Well not every team is as astute as Bill Belicheck and the NE Patriots. A lot of those playersU mentioned where not drafted or even signed as rookies by the Patriots.These same players were discarded by other teams. The Patriots more thenany other team take what a guy does well and maximizes it. Those same players when they wereother teams werent half the players they arenow. thats not really the point, the point is about the players, and outta 5players named, only 2 played for other teams besides New England... The fact is these players are ball players and no how to play the game the right way and all were very productive in college and weren't given the chance that others are given because they were short on some measurable or something, which happens all the time.. Theres a ton of players that don't ever get the chance because of measurables , that can put up impact numbers... I mean, look at guys like Steve Largent and Wayne Chrebet, there the lucky ones that were at leaste given a shot, and succeeded.. Also, u can't blame Deion branch for not doing well in Seattle, with that bum throwing to him up there, and wes welker showed signs before coming to new england, but needed a Real chance, and got one in New England... Theres a ton of players out there like this, how about Fred Jackson? To slow, not big college...etc...etc Well, hes a heck of a back! So far, all Fred Jackson has done, is easily out played 2first RD top RB's in spiller and Lynch... My point simply is, to many times, guys get overlooked because of measurables and 40times, and because of that, u See the easiest of INT"s or Catches dropped, that make your head spin, and horrible routes and ...etc...etc Now, i understand some live up to the hype, but man, some of these guys who are just smart and play the game the right way and know how to catch and simply put, play football, need to not be overlooked so much...

nycsportzfan
12-08-2010, 09:05 AM
]I dont think its over rated I just think coaches believe that they can teach technique. I think teams draft athletes way more on defense then offense though

I think they draft athletes on both sides as often as they can. And you're right, they can teach technique. It goes back to the mental toughness and how coachable guys are.

That's why a guy like JPP is a coaches dream, extremely athletic but he is very hard working, and will listen and apply everything he is told. Plus, its not like JPP wasen't showing the signs of being a big time player.. He had a pretty darn good yr at S.Florida last yr, in his 1st as a Major College player.. 16.5 TFL, 6sacks, 1int, 2ff's, 3pass breakups.. I mean, he put some monster numbers up.. Its not like this guy came to the pros's, knowing nothing, as some made it out to be.. He'd been playing DE for like 5yrs now, learning and learning... Now, its mostly learning the speed of the Pro Game and diffrent Tendencies of Top of the line Olineman and what not... I had a feeling he'd make a impact as a rookie, and at least show the signs of him being stellar in the future.. some made it out to be, like he was gonna need to learn on the bench for this whole yr, like he never played the positon before, or something...

Redeyejedi
12-08-2010, 01:01 PM
]I dont think its over rated I just think coaches believe that they can teach technique. I think teams draft athletes way more on defense then offense though I think they draft athletes on both sides as often as they can. And you're right, they can teach technique. It goes back to the mental toughness and how coachable guys are. That's why a guy like JPP is a coaches dream, extremely athletic but he is very hard working, and will listen and apply everything he is told. Plus, its not like JPP wasen't showing the signs of being a big time player.. He had a pretty darn good yr at S.Florida last yr, in his 1st as a Major College player.. 16.5 TFL, 6sacks, 1int, 2ff's, 3pass breakups.. I mean, he put some monster numbers up.. Its not like this guy came to the pros's, knowing nothing, as some made it out to be.. He'd been playing DE for like 5yrs now, learning and learning... Now, its mostly learning the speed of the Pro Game and diffrent Tendencies of Top of the line Olineman and what not... I had a feeling he'd make a impact as a rookie, and at least show the signs of him being stellar in the future.. some made it out to be, like he was gonna need to learn on the bench for this whole yr, like he never played the positon before, or something...
I disagree those are monster numbers. There good but there hardly monster. Technique wise he was very very raw at South Florida.His had placement was poor and he hadnext to no pass rush moves.Hejust overwhelmed the opposition with physical strength,speed, and will.He still has his trouble playing the run and that will take some time. Kiwi getting hurt has definitely helped hima lot. It has allowed him to get some more snaps and move his progress forward . He is getting by mostly on physical ability, pure tenacity, and motor.Things that will definitely help U contribute as a pass rusher. Once he gets his technique down he will grow into an all around player. With all the extra playing time he has received this year it should really help him going into next season. Maybe Justin Tuck can give JPP sometime this off season on working on his run game technique

Redeyejedi
12-08-2010, 01:20 PM
Sure Luck could be a bust. But frankly, hes the best QB prospect to come around in a very very long time. He is the best NFL prospect to come around in a long time, more highly rated than Suh, Calvin Johnson, etc. totally diffrent positon then johnson and suh, so i dont buy that for a second.. If Suh ends up being the best DT in the league for yrs to come and Calvin keeps doing what hes doing, then how can he be a better prospect then them? Those 2 are doing exactly what they were drafted to do and if they keep playing stellar ball, its kinda hard to say there not exactly the top prospects they were supposed to be, theres no way at all to compare...
How a guy plays in the NFL has nothing to do with what kind of College prospect they are. Slip is talking about comparing players on what they areand what they are projected to be "There Ceiling"at the time they are drafted no more no less. There NFL success does not factor into the equation.

Redeyejedi
12-08-2010, 01:29 PM
]I dont think its over rated I just think coaches believe that they can teach technique. I think teams draft athletes way more on defense then offense though I think they draft athletes on both sides as often as they can. And you're right, they can teach technique. It goes back to the mental toughness and how coachable guys are. That's why a guy like JPP is a coaches dream, extremely athletic but he is very hard working, and will listen and apply everything he is told.Yeah I prefer the Athletes much more on defense myself. Defense is so much more predicated on emotion and instincts. To me it just seems easier to harness raw ability on defense. Guys with raw technique and motor can simply overwhelm the opposition with brute physical ability. On offense there is a more controlledatmosphere where those kind of abilities arent aseasily exploited

nycsportzfan
12-08-2010, 04:41 PM
]I dont think its over rated I just think coaches believe that they can teach technique. I think teams draft athletes way more on defense then offense though I think they draft athletes on both sides as often as they can. And you're right, they can teach technique. It goes back to the mental toughness and how coachable guys are. That's why a guy like JPP is a coaches dream, extremely athletic but he is very hard working, and will listen and apply everything he is told. Plus, its not like JPP wasen't showing the signs of being a big time player.. He had a pretty darn good yr at S.Florida last yr, in his 1st as a Major College player.. 16.5 TFL, 6sacks, 1int, 2ff's, 3pass breakups.. I mean, he put some monster numbers up.. Its not like this guy came to the pros's, knowing nothing, as some made it out to be.. He'd been playing DE for like 5yrs now, learning and learning... Now, its mostly learning the speed of the Pro Game and diffrent Tendencies of Top of the line Olineman and what not... I had a feeling he'd make a impact as a rookie, and at least show the signs of him being stellar in the future.. some made it out to be, like he was gonna need to learn on the bench for this whole yr, like he never played the positon before, or something...
I disagree those are monster numbers. There good but there hardly monster. Technique wise he was very very raw at South Florida.His had placement was poor and he hadnext to no pass rush moves.Hejust overwhelmed the opposition with physical strength,speed, and will.He still has his trouble playing the run and that will take some time. Kiwi getting hurt has definitely helped hima lot. It has allowed him to get some more snaps and move his progress forward . He is getting by mostly on physical ability, pure tenacity, and motor.Things that will definitely help U contribute as a pass rusher. Once he gets his technique down he will grow into an all around player. With all the extra playing time he has received this year it should really help him going into next season. Maybe Justin Tuck can give JPP sometime this off season on working on his run game technique i dissagree, he had a big time season and lead a pretty good defensive team.. Sometimes i think u guys make this out to be more like Rocket Science then football... What do u think all the coaches have been teaching this guy for the last 5yrs? How ot bullrush???lol U don't think the kids learned about hand placement from the last 4coaches hes had? I think the hardest thing for players to really learn is the playbook, the speed of the game, and yes, some little positional tendencies that come in time, but overall, the guy can play DE.. Just like i heard about Iupati, whos also starting as a rookie, and doing extremely well.. Its really not coincedence that those 2are playing very well, because there not dumb, i'm sure they've learned plenty over the last 5yrs, and mostly everything they here at this point, is just being drilled in there heads, because i'm sure they've heard it before.. Most rooks can't be successful because they at least have some sort of vet in front of em, if even for a yr, but as soon as JPP was in, we seen the potential for him to be a beast... Sure, hes just now getting the sacks and what not, but we've all seen this coming, from the time he stepped on the field, and we seen "jpp's a beast" threads from over a month ago...

nycsportzfan
12-08-2010, 04:41 PM
]I dont think its over rated I just think coaches believe that they can teach technique. I think teams draft athletes way more on defense then offense though I think they draft athletes on both sides as often as they can. And you're right, they can teach technique. It goes back to the mental toughness and how coachable guys are. That's why a guy like JPP is a coaches dream, extremely athletic but he is very hard working, and will listen and apply everything he is told. Plus, its not like JPP wasen't showing the signs of being a big time player.. He had a pretty darn good yr at S.Florida last yr, in his 1st as a Major College player.. 16.5 TFL, 6sacks, 1int, 2ff's, 3pass breakups.. I mean, he put some monster numbers up.. Its not like this guy came to the pros's, knowing nothing, as some made it out to be.. He'd been playing DE for like 5yrs now, learning and learning... Now, its mostly learning the speed of the Pro Game and diffrent Tendencies of Top of the line Olineman and what not... I had a feeling he'd make a impact as a rookie, and at least show the signs of him being stellar in the future.. some made it out to be, like he was gonna need to learn on the bench for this whole yr, like he never played the positon before, or something...
I disagree those are monster numbers. There good but there hardly monster. Technique wise he was very very raw at South Florida.His had placement was poor and he hadnext to no pass rush moves.Hejust overwhelmed the opposition with physical strength,speed, and will.He still has his trouble playing the run and that will take some time. Kiwi getting hurt has definitely helped hima lot. It has allowed him to get some more snaps and move his progress forward . He is getting by mostly on physical ability, pure tenacity, and motor.Things that will definitely help U contribute as a pass rusher. Once he gets his technique down he will grow into an all around player. With all the extra playing time he has received this year it should really help him going into next season. Maybe Justin Tuck can give JPP sometime this off season on working on his run game technique i dissagree, he had a big time season and lead a pretty good defensive team.. Sometimes i think u guys make this out to be more like Rocket Science then football... What do u think all the coaches have been teaching this guy for the last 5yrs? How ot bullrush???lol U don't think the kids learned about hand placement from the last 4coaches hes had? I think the hardest thing for players to really learn is the playbook, the speed of the game, and yes, some little positional tendencies that come in time, but overall, the guy can play DE.. Just like i heard about Iupati, whos also starting as a rookie, and doing extremely well.. Its really not coincedence that those 2are playing very well, because there not dumb, i'm sure they've learned plenty over the last 5yrs, and mostly everything they here at this point, is just being drilled in there heads, because i'm sure they've heard it before.. Most rooks can't be successful because they at least have some sort of vet in front of em, if even for a yr, but as soon as JPP was in, we seen the potential for him to be a beast... Sure, hes just now getting the sacks and what not, but we've all seen this coming, from the time he stepped on the field, and we seen "jpp's a beast" threads from over a month ago...

Redeyejedi
12-08-2010, 04:56 PM
]I dont think its over rated I just think coaches believe that they can teach technique. I think teams draft athletes way more on defense then offense though I think they draft athletes on both sides as often as they can. And you're right, they can teach technique. It goes back to the mental toughness and how coachable guys are. That's why a guy like JPP is a coaches dream, extremely athletic but he is very hard working, and will listen and apply everything he is told. Plus, its not like JPP wasen't showing the signs of being a big time player.. He had a pretty darn good yr at S.Florida last yr, in his 1st as a Major College player.. 16.5 TFL, 6sacks, 1int, 2ff's, 3pass breakups.. I mean, he put some monster numbers up.. Its not like this guy came to the pros's, knowing nothing, as some made it out to be.. He'd been playing DE for like 5yrs now, learning and learning... Now, its mostly learning the speed of the Pro Game and diffrent Tendencies of Top of the line Olineman and what not... I had a feeling he'd make a impact as a rookie, and at least show the signs of him being stellar in the future.. some made it out to be, like he was gonna need to learn on the bench for this whole yr, like he never played the positon before, or something...
I disagree those are monster numbers. There good but there hardly monster. Technique wise he was very very raw at South Florida.His had placement was poor and he hadnext to no pass rush moves.Hejust overwhelmed the opposition with physical strength,speed, and will.He still has his trouble playing the run and that will take some time. Kiwi getting hurt has definitely helped hima lot. It has allowed him to get some more snaps and move his progress forward . He is getting by mostly on physical ability, pure tenacity, and motor.Things that will definitely help U contribute as a pass rusher. Once he gets his technique down he will grow into an all around player. With all the extra playing time he has received this year it should really help him going into next season. Maybe Justin Tuck can give JPP sometime this off season on working on his run game technique i dissagree, he had a big time season and lead a pretty good defensive team.. Sometimes i think u guys make this out to be more like Rocket Science then football... What do u think all the coaches have been teaching this guy for the last 5yrs? How ot bullrush???lol U don't think the kids learned about hand placement from the last 4coaches hes had? I think the hardest thing for players to really learn is the playbook, the speed of the game, and yes, some little positional tendencies that come in time, but overall, the guy can play DE.. Just like i heard about Iupati, whos also starting as a rookie, and doing extremely well.. Its really not coincedence that those 2are playing very well, because there not dumb, i'm sure they've learned plenty over the last 5yrs, and mostly everything they here at this point, is just being drilled in there heads, because i'm sure they've heard it before.. Most rooks can't be successful because they at least have some sort of vet in front of em, if even for a yr, but as soon as JPP was in, we seen the potential for him to be a beast... Sure, hes just now getting the sacks and what not, but we've all seen this coming, from the time he stepped on the field, and we seen "jpp's a beast" threads from over a month ago...
Whatever man if U cant see that he was a raw player in terms of how to properly play the position then theres really know point even discussing it .I can see an improvement in his hands and how he uses leverage since he came to the NFL.If he knew how to do it in college he certainly wasnt doing it.So whatever the Giants have done to get him to listen and take it on the field well thats the point of coaching.I dont know what your talking about up top I never said he would have to sit on the bench. I said he could be used as a situational pass rusher and thats exactly what they have used him as.What Ive hear about Iupati is he has been rather ordinary actually. If your a guard and your picked that high Im looking for an immediateprobowl player and he has been far from that. He has had big time pass protection issues. According to 49er fans still has poor technique so I guess he is uncoachable then if U think they have been learning it for years and he still cant do it right.</P>

slipknottin
12-08-2010, 08:45 PM
What do u think all the coaches have been teaching this guy for the last 5yrs? How ot bullrush???lol U don't think the kids learned about hand placement from the last 4coaches hes had?

First off, college and highschool coaches rarely have time to teach little things. They dont usually even have position coaches, and when they do, lets face it, its not like a college or highschool position coach is going to have the knowledge that an NFL coach does.

Second, you are VASTLY oversimplifying football. There is a ton of stuff for DEs to learn, how to read pass/run, how to combat various blocks, different positions, etc etc.

nycsportzfan
12-09-2010, 01:04 AM
What do u think all the coaches have been teaching this guy for the last 5yrs? How ot bullrush???lol U don't think the kids learned about hand placement from the last 4coaches hes had?

First off, college and highschool coaches rarely have time to teach little things. They dont usually even have position coaches, and when they do, lets face it, its not like a college or highschool position coach is going to have the knowledge that an NFL coach does.

Second, you are VASTLY oversimplifying football. There is a ton of stuff for DEs to learn, how to read pass/run, how to combat various blocks, different positions, etc etc. Ya, i'm sure this guy, has no clue about DE's...lol All american, national champion DE for miami, whos been doing nothing but dedicating his life to teaching Dlineman, and more specific, DE's... I'm sure, JPP learned nothing for a yr under this guy... THeres a Jump in the competiton when going pro and the playbook and scheme, but almost everything that was needed to be learned about the positon, JPP already knows, your fooling yourself if u think some secret was given to him in the pro's about hand placement or technique hasen't already been said to him.. Sure, theres room to learn, what speed to go at, and when to do this or that, but the guy knows how to play the positon, man..
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Kevin Patrick
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Position:
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Assistant Coach - Defensive Tackles
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Alma Mater:
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Miami
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Graduating Year:
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1994
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Experience:
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<td class="CoachBioPosValue">
6 Years
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Phone:
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<span class="skype_pnh_print_container">813-974-9760</span><span dir="ltr" class="skype_pnh_container"><span class="skype_pnh_mark"> begin_of_the_skype_highlighting</span><span dir="ltr" title="Call this phone number in United States of America with Skype: +18139749760" class="skype_pnh_highlighting_inactive_common"><span class="skype_pnh_left_span"></span><span title="Skype actions" class="skype_pnh_dropart_span"><span style="background-position: -4499px 1px ! important;" class="skype_pnh_dropart_flag_span"></span></span><span class="skype_pnh_textarea_span"><span class="skype_pnh_text_span">813-974-9760</span></span><span class="skype_pnh_right_span"></span></span><span class="skype_pnh_mark">end_of_the_skype_highlighting</span></span>
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<span class="articlecopy">
Courtesy: USF

Release: 02/27/2008</span>

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<td colspan="3" bgcolor="#005841" height="20"><span class="style1">NFL Proteges</span></td>
</tr>
<tr height="20">
<td colspan="2" bgcolor="#eeeeee" height="20">Jarriett Buie</td>
<td bgcolor="#eeeeee">Tampa Bay Buccaneers</td>
</tr>
<tr height="20">
<td colspan="2" bgcolor="#eeeeee" height="20">Jason Pierre-Paul</td>
<td bgcolor="#eeeeee">New York Giants</td>
</tr>
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<td colspan="2" bgcolor="#eeeeee" height="20">George Selvie</td>
<td bgcolor="#eeeeee">St. Louis Rams</td>
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<td colspan="3" bgcolor="#005841" height="20"><span class="style1">Coaching Experience - Five Years</span></td>
</tr>
<tr height="20">
<td bgcolor="#eeeeee" width="32" height="20">Year</td>
<td bgcolor="#eeeeee" width="167">School/Team</td>
<td bgcolor="#eeeeee" width="191">Assignment</td>
</tr>
<tr height="20">
<td bgcolor="#eeeeee" height="20">1996</td>
<td bgcolor="#eeeeee">USF</td>
<td bgcolor="#eeeeee">Defensive Ends</td>
</tr>
<tr height="20">
<td bgcolor="#eeeeee" height="20">1997</td>
<td bgcolor="#eeeeee">USF</td>
<td bgcolor="#eeeeee">Defensive Ends</td>
</tr>
<tr height="20">
<td bgcolor="#eeeeee" height="20">1998</td>
<td bgcolor="#eeeeee">USF</td>
<td bgcolor="#eeeeee">Defensive Ends</td>
</tr>
<tr height="20">
<td bgcolor="#eeeeee" height="20">2008</td>
<td bgcolor="#eeeeee">USF</td>
<td bgcolor="#eeeeee">Defensive Ends</td>
</tr>
<tr height="20">
<td bgcolor="#eeeeee" height="20">2009</td>
<td bgcolor="#eeeeee">USF</td>
<td bgcolor="#eeeeee">Defensive Line</td>
</tr>
<tr height="20">
<td bgcolor="#eeeeee" height="20">2010</td>
<td bgcolor="#eeeeee">USF</td>
<td bgcolor="#eeeeee">Defensive Tackles</td>
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<td colspan="3" bgcolor="#005841" height="20"><span class="style1">Playing Experience</span></td>
</tr>
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<td bgcolor="#eeeeee" height="20">1985-89</td>
<td colspan="2" bgcolor="#eeeeee">Four-year letterwinner, defensive line, Forest Hill HS, West Palm Beach, Fla.</td>
</tr>
<tr height="20">
<td bgcolor="#eeeeee" height="20">1988-89</td>
<td colspan="2" bgcolor="#eeeeee">Two-year letterwinner, track and field, Forest Hill HS</td>
</tr>
<tr height="20">
<td bgcolor="#eeeeee" height="20">1989-93</td>
<td colspan="2" bgcolor="#eeeeee">Four-year letterwinner, defensive end, University of Miami</td>
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<td colspan="3" bgcolor="#005841" height="20"><span class="style1">Education</span></td>
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<td bgcolor="#eeeeee" height="20">1994</td>
<td colspan="2" bgcolor="#eeeeee">B.S. in business administration, University of Miami</td>
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<td colspan="3" bgcolor="#005841" height="20"><span class="style1">Personal Data</span></td>
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<tr height="20">
<td bgcolor="#eeeeee" height="20">Full Name</td>
<td colspan="2" bgcolor="#eeeeee">Kevin Patrick</td>
</tr>
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<td bgcolor="#eeeeee" height="20">Age</td>
<td colspan="2" bgcolor="#eeeeee">38</td>
</tr>
<tr height="20">
<td bgcolor="#eeeeee" height="20">Born</td>
<td colspan="2" bgcolor="#eeeeee">July 30, 1971 in Phoenix, Ariz.</td>
</tr>
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<td bgcolor="#eeeeee" height="20">Wife</td>
<td colspan="2" bgcolor="#eeeeee">Rachel</td>
</tr>
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<td bgcolor="#eeeeee" height="20">Children</td>
<td colspan="2" bgcolor="#eeeeee">Grace (06/15/02) and Belle (11/15/05)</td>
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Assistant coachKevin Patrick enters his third season with the
University of South Florida football program for the 2010 season after
being named to the position of assistant coach with responsibility over
the team’s defensive ends on Feb. 25, 2007.

Patrick will oversee
the defensive tackles for the 2010 season after spending 2008 coaching
the defensive ends and 2009 mentoring the entire defensive line.

This
is the second time Patrick has been an assistant with USF. He initially
joined the staff in 1996 when he also oversaw the defensive ends. He
was on the staff through the 1998 season.

In his second season
back with the Bulls, Patrick oversaw the development of junior college
transfer Jason Pierre-Paul, a first-team All-American for the 2009
campaign as named by Pro Football Weekly and was the No. 15 overall pick
in the 2010 NFL Draft by the New York Giants. Pierre-Paul was also
named first-team all-conference by the BIG EAST coaches, ESPN,
Rivals.com and the Sporting News along with second-team honors by Phil
Steele.


Former two-time All-American George Selvie earned All-BIG EAST Second
Team honors by the league coaches and Phil Steele. Under Patrick’s
tutelage the last two seasons, Selvie finished his career as the most
prolific defensive players in USF history, topped off by being selected
in the seventh round by the St. Louis Rams in the 2010 Draft.

USF's
defensive ends posted 21.5 of the Bulls' 25 sacks on the season in
2009, along with 37 tackles for loss. The defensive line anchored a
defensive unit that finished second in the BIG EAST in scoring defense
in 2009 and third in total defense.</p>


Patrick flourished during his first season back with the Bulls. He
helped defensive end George Selvie repeat as a first team All-American
and assisted a defensive unit that ranked No. 10 nationally in total
defense.Patrick also reeled in a pair of national awards on the
recruiting trail. Rivals named him one of the top 25
recruiters in America and the top recruiter in the BIG EAST. The
acclaim came after four-star recruits Ryne Giddens, Jacquain Williams,
Jason Pierre-Paul and Julius Forte inked with USF on National Signing
Day.

During his playing days, Patrick was an All-American
defensive end at the University of Miami from 1989-93. He was a major
contributor on the Hurricane team that claimed two National
Championships withwins over Nebraska in the 1992 Orange Bowl and over
Alabama in the 1990 Sugar Bowl. Patrick also played in the Cotton and
Fiesta Bowls during his career. </p>


He isthe second individual in the USF program to have earned BIG
EAST Defensive Player of the Year honors. Patrick claimed his in 1993,
whiletwo-time All-American George Selvie earned that honor in 2007.</p>


Patrick earned his All-America honors and team MVP accolades in 1993
when he collected 10 sacks. During his career he tallied 174 tackles
and 23 sacks, which ranks fifth in program history.</p></td></tr></tbody></table>

nycsportzfan
12-09-2010, 01:13 AM
]I dont think its over rated I just think coaches believe that they can teach technique. I think teams draft athletes way more on defense then offense though I think they draft athletes on both sides as often as they can. And you're right, they can teach technique. It goes back to the mental toughness and how coachable guys are. That's why a guy like JPP is a coaches dream, extremely athletic but he is very hard working, and will listen and apply everything he is told. Plus, its not like JPP wasen't showing the signs of being a big time player.. He had a pretty darn good yr at S.Florida last yr, in his 1st as a Major College player.. 16.5 TFL, 6sacks, 1int, 2ff's, 3pass breakups.. I mean, he put some monster numbers up.. Its not like this guy came to the pros's, knowing nothing, as some made it out to be.. He'd been playing DE for like 5yrs now, learning and learning... Now, its mostly learning the speed of the Pro Game and diffrent Tendencies of Top of the line Olineman and what not... I had a feeling he'd make a impact as a rookie, and at least show the signs of him being stellar in the future.. some made it out to be, like he was gonna need to learn on the bench for this whole yr, like he never played the positon before, or something...
I disagree those are monster numbers. There good but there hardly monster. Technique wise he was very very raw at South Florida.His had placement was poor and he hadnext to no pass rush moves.Hejust overwhelmed the opposition with physical strength,speed, and will.He still has his trouble playing the run and that will take some time. Kiwi getting hurt has definitely helped hima lot. It has allowed him to get some more snaps and move his progress forward . He is getting by mostly on physical ability, pure tenacity, and motor.Things that will definitely help U contribute as a pass rusher. Once he gets his technique down he will grow into an all around player. With all the extra playing time he has received this year it should really help him going into next season. Maybe Justin Tuck can give JPP sometime this off season on working on his run game technique i dissagree, he had a big time season and lead a pretty good defensive team.. Sometimes i think u guys make this out to be more like Rocket Science then football... What do u think all the coaches have been teaching this guy for the last 5yrs? How ot bullrush???lol U don't think the kids learned about hand placement from the last 4coaches hes had? I think the hardest thing for players to really learn is the playbook, the speed of the game, and yes, some little positional tendencies that come in time, but overall, the guy can play DE.. Just like i heard about Iupati, whos also starting as a rookie, and doing extremely well.. Its really not coincedence that those 2are playing very well, because there not dumb, i'm sure they've learned plenty over the last 5yrs, and mostly everything they here at this point, is just being drilled in there heads, because i'm sure they've heard it before.. Most rooks can't be successful because they at least have some sort of vet in front of em, if even for a yr, but as soon as JPP was in, we seen the potential for him to be a beast... Sure, hes just now getting the sacks and what not, but we've all seen this coming, from the time he stepped on the field, and we seen "jpp's a beast" threads from over a month ago...
Whatever man if U cant see that he was a raw player in terms of how to properly play the position then theres really know point even discussing it .I can see an improvement in his hands and how he uses leverage since he came to the NFL.If he knew how to do it in college he certainly wasnt doing it.So whatever the Giants have done to get him to listen and take it on the field well thats the point of coaching.I dont know what your talking about up top I never said he would have to sit on the bench. I said he could be used as a situational pass rusher and thats exactly what they have used him as.What Ive hear about Iupati is he has been rather ordinary actually. If your a guard and your picked that high Im looking for an immediateprobowl player and he has been far from that. He has had big time pass protection issues. According to 49er fans still has poor technique so I guess he is uncoachable then if U think they have been learning it for years and he still cant do it right.</p> i just don't see how u see this? I mean, what do u do, hit the pause button when and examine these things? I mean, u rarley get to see any player through a whole play, and its certainly not easy to compare a play from the Pros to when he was at S.Florida... I realize hes still learning certain things, but the guy knows how to use his hands and what not.. I mean, what was Kevin Patrick teaching this guy at S.Florida? Hes getting used to the talent jump, and the speed of the game and using certain DE moves and stuff, sure... But to think, hes learning on Hand Usage is crazy, as i'm sure hes perfectly adept at using his hands, and has had that drilled into his head time and time again over the past few yrs... I thought he was gonna be good this yr, just as i did, Mike Iupati..

I guess, u could say hes still learning stuff, but how much is there to learn at DE? I mean, does it take 5yrs to learn how to play the freaking positon? if your good at the positon and have the talent, is the reason you'll produce, not that your learning the positon of DE for yrs and yrs.. The hardest part about any positon going into the NFL, is Scheme change, SPeed of the game, and using what you've all ready learned consistently and knowing when to use that.. Sure, i'm sure theres little tricks and tidbits a coach can give JPP on playing the position, but as far as playing the positon of DE, i'm sure hes heard it all, its just a matter of practicing and continuing to Drill the stuff all ready learned time and time again and learn the rest of the league

nycsportzfan
12-09-2010, 01:20 AM
]I dont think its over rated I just think coaches believe that they can teach technique. I think teams draft athletes way more on defense then offense though I think they draft athletes on both sides as often as they can. And you're right, they can teach technique. It goes back to the mental toughness and how coachable guys are. That's why a guy like JPP is a coaches dream, extremely athletic but he is very hard working, and will listen and apply everything he is told. Plus, its not like JPP wasen't showing the signs of being a big time player.. He had a pretty darn good yr at S.Florida last yr, in his 1st as a Major College player.. 16.5 TFL, 6sacks, 1int, 2ff's, 3pass breakups.. I mean, he put some monster numbers up.. Its not like this guy came to the pros's, knowing nothing, as some made it out to be.. He'd been playing DE for like 5yrs now, learning and learning... Now, its mostly learning the speed of the Pro Game and diffrent Tendencies of Top of the line Olineman and what not... I had a feeling he'd make a impact as a rookie, and at least show the signs of him being stellar in the future.. some made it out to be, like he was gonna need to learn on the bench for this whole yr, like he never played the positon before, or something...
I disagree those are monster numbers. There good but there hardly monster. Technique wise he was very very raw at South Florida.His had placement was poor and he hadnext to no pass rush moves.Hejust overwhelmed the opposition with physical strength,speed, and will.He still has his trouble playing the run and that will take some time. Kiwi getting hurt has definitely helped hima lot. It has allowed him to get some more snaps and move his progress forward . He is getting by mostly on physical ability, pure tenacity, and motor.Things that will definitely help U contribute as a pass rusher. Once he gets his technique down he will grow into an all around player. With all the extra playing time he has received this year it should really help him going into next season. Maybe Justin Tuck can give JPP sometime this off season on working on his run game technique i dissagree, he had a big time season and lead a pretty good defensive team.. Sometimes i think u guys make this out to be more like Rocket Science then football... What do u think all the coaches have been teaching this guy for the last 5yrs? How ot bullrush???lol U don't think the kids learned about hand placement from the last 4coaches hes had? I think the hardest thing for players to really learn is the playbook, the speed of the game, and yes, some little positional tendencies that come in time, but overall, the guy can play DE.. Just like i heard about Iupati, whos also starting as a rookie, and doing extremely well.. Its really not coincedence that those 2are playing very well, because there not dumb, i'm sure they've learned plenty over the last 5yrs, and mostly everything they here at this point, is just being drilled in there heads, because i'm sure they've heard it before.. Most rooks can't be successful because they at least have some sort of vet in front of em, if even for a yr, but as soon as JPP was in, we seen the potential for him to be a beast... Sure, hes just now getting the sacks and what not, but we've all seen this coming, from the time he stepped on the field, and we seen "jpp's a beast" threads from over a month ago...
Whatever man if U cant see that he was a raw player in terms of how to properly play the position then theres really know point even discussing it .I can see an improvement in his hands and how he uses leverage since he came to the NFL.If he knew how to do it in college he certainly wasnt doing it.So whatever the Giants have done to get him to listen and take it on the field well thats the point of coaching.I dont know what your talking about up top I never said he would have to sit on the bench. I said he could be used as a situational pass rusher and thats exactly what they have used him as.What Ive hear about Iupati is he has been rather ordinary actually. If your a guard and your picked that high Im looking for an immediateprobowl player and he has been far from that. He has had big time pass protection issues. According to 49er fans still has poor technique so I guess he is uncoachable then if U think they have been learning it for years and he still cant do it right.</p> and as far as 9er fans, my best freind is a 9er fan, like crazy 9er fan, almost freakishly so, and he loves iupati, and i've seen him highlighted on monday night football for job well done, when they were running like mad men on Arizona, with b.westbrook, mite i add.. I mean, hes been solid, and there run game says so...

Singeltary has said from day 1, that iupati has showed the abilty to step in and start from DAY 1, he was all ready given the starting job in freaking August, before pre season even began, because of what he showed during Training camp... Pretty good, for a guy whos got all this learning on the positon to do... And again, i understand theres a whole new play book and scheme and speed of the game to learn, but the guy knows how to play Guard, its what he freaking does for a living...

Redeyejedi
12-09-2010, 06:57 AM
What do u think all the coaches have been teaching this guy for the last 5yrs? How ot bullrush???lol U don't think the kids learned about hand placement from the last 4coaches hes had? First off, college and highschool coaches rarely have time to teach little things. They dont usually even have position coaches, and when they do, lets face it, its not like a college or highschool position coach is going to have the knowledge that an NFL coach does. Second, you are VASTLY oversimplifying football. There is a ton of stuff for DEs to learn, how to read pass/run, how to combat various blocks, different positions, etc etc.Thank U christ Im just going to give up discussing anything like this. College offenses today are in no shape or form anything like a pro offense. Therefore there is different ways and techniques used to attack those offenses and those blocks.There is a good chance that theres certain things the coaches at SF didnt teach because they didnt go up against it.Also being raw can mean not reading the defense correctly and attacking the wrong way theres a lot that goes into it.There are entirely many more variables more then just a " Bullrush".It was a testament to just how physically dominantPaul was that he was even in aposition to make asmany playsas he did at South Florida.

Redeyejedi
12-09-2010, 07:14 AM
]I dont think its over rated I just think coaches believe that they can teach technique. I think teams draft athletes way more on defense then offense though I think they draft athletes on both sides as often as they can. And you're right, they can teach technique. It goes back to the mental toughness and how coachable guys are. That's why a guy like JPP is a coaches dream, extremely athletic but he is very hard working, and will listen and apply everything he is told. Plus, its not like JPP wasen't showing the signs of being a big time player.. He had a pretty darn good yr at S.Florida last yr, in his 1st as a Major College player.. 16.5 TFL, 6sacks, 1int, 2ff's, 3pass breakups.. I mean, he put some monster numbers up.. Its not like this guy came to the pros's, knowing nothing, as some made it out to be.. He'd been playing DE for like 5yrs now, learning and learning... Now, its mostly learning the speed of the Pro Game and diffrent Tendencies of Top of the line Olineman and what not... I had a feeling he'd make a impact as a rookie, and at least show the signs of him being stellar in the future.. some made it out to be, like he was gonna need to learn on the bench for this whole yr, like he never played the positon before, or something...
I disagree those are monster numbers. There good but there hardly monster. Technique wise he was very very raw at South Florida.His had placement was poor and he hadnext to no pass rush moves.Hejust overwhelmed the opposition with physical strength,speed, and will.He still has his trouble playing the run and that will take some time. Kiwi getting hurt has definitely helped hima lot. It has allowed him to get some more snaps and move his progress forward . He is getting by mostly on physical ability, pure tenacity, and motor.Things that will definitely help U contribute as a pass rusher. Once he gets his technique down he will grow into an all around player. With all the extra playing time he has received this year it should really help him going into next season. Maybe Justin Tuck can give JPP sometime this off season on working on his run game technique i dissagree, he had a big time season and lead a pretty good defensive team.. Sometimes i think u guys make this out to be more like Rocket Science then football... What do u think all the coaches have been teaching this guy for the last 5yrs? How ot bullrush???lol U don't think the kids learned about hand placement from the last 4coaches hes had? I think the hardest thing for players to really learn is the playbook, the speed of the game, and yes, some little positional tendencies that come in time, but overall, the guy can play DE.. Just like i heard about Iupati, whos also starting as a rookie, and doing extremely well.. Its really not coincedence that those 2are playing very well, because there not dumb, i'm sure they've learned plenty over the last 5yrs, and mostly everything they here at this point, is just being drilled in there heads, because i'm sure they've heard it before.. Most rooks can't be successful because they at least have some sort of vet in front of em, if even for a yr, but as soon as JPP was in, we seen the potential for him to be a beast... Sure, hes just now getting the sacks and what not, but we've all seen this coming, from the time he stepped on the field, and we seen "jpp's a beast" threads from over a month ago...
Whatever man if U cant see that he was a raw player in terms of how to properly play the position then theres really know point even discussing it .I can see an improvement in his hands and how he uses leverage since he came to the NFL.If he knew how to do it in college he certainly wasnt doing it.So whatever the Giants have done to get him to listen and take it on the field well thats the point of coaching.I dont know what your talking about up top I never said he would have to sit on the bench. I said he could be used as a situational pass rusher and thats exactly what they have used him as.What Ive hear about Iupati is he has been rather ordinary actually. If your a guard and your picked that high Im looking for an immediateprobowl player and he has been far from that. He has had big time pass protection issues. According to 49er fans still has poor technique so I guess he is uncoachable then if U think they have been learning it for years and he still cant do it right.</P>


i just don't see how u see this? I<FONT size=5> mean, what do u do, hit the pause button when and examine these things?</FONT> I mean, u rarley get to see any player through a whole play, and its certainly not easy to compare a play from the Pros to when he was at S.Florida... I realize hes still learning certain things, but the guy knows how to use his hands and what not.. I mean, what was Kevin Patrick teaching this guy at S.Florida? Hes getting used to the talent jump, and the speed of the game and using certain DE moves and stuff, sure... But to think, hes learning on Hand Usage is crazy, as i'm sure hes perfectly adept at using his hands, and has had that drilled into his head time and time again over the past few yrs... I thought he was gonna be good this yr, just as i did, Mike Iupati..

I guess, u could say hes still learning stuff, but how much is there to learn at DE? I mean, does it take 5yrs to learn how to play the freaking positon? if your good at the positon and have the talent, is the reason you'll produce, not that your learning the positon of DE for yrs and yrs.. The hardest part about any positon going into the NFL, is Scheme change, SPeed of the game, and using what you've all ready learned consistently and knowing when to use that.. Sure, i'm sure theres little tricks and tidbits a coach can give JPP on playing the position, but as far as playing the positon of DE, i'm sure hes heard it all, its just a matter of practicing and continuing to Drill the stuff all ready learned time and time again and learn the rest of the league
</P>


Thats exactly what I do. . I pay much more attention to the defensive players then to offensive on a whole "QB's the exception".I like watching defensive lineman the mostthere my favorite players.Daquan Bowers has become one of my favorite players in this draft.He plays with just so much power.He is an elite run defender and should become an excellent LEwho U kick inside on passing downs in the NFL.Ive watched him a lot and Ive also become a fan of his line mate Jarvis Jenkins as well.If Coefield isnt brought back I think Jenkins would be a good option inside.</P>

Redeyejedi
12-09-2010, 08:27 AM
Athleticism, toughness, and instincts are the three most important parts. Mental toughness in both the ability to play through injuries, and the attitude to work hard on and off the field. Polish and proper technique are overrated. Every single team would chose the more athletic guy over the less athletic more polished guy assuming all else is equalI dont think its over rated I just think coaches believe that they can teach technique. I think teams draft athletes way more on defense then offense though All i know, is the best team in football, has 7th rd draft pick Tom Brady throwing to undrafted Wes Welker and Danny Woodhead, and Ben Jarvus Green-Ellis toating the rock... Also, Deion branch isn't exactly a Physical Specimen...lol A very good player on that defense, Gary Guyton, also i believe undrafted, or at least late late rd... I believe that u first and fore most must be a productive college player, as u don't want those athletic players that "COULD" end up being stellar.. I think the combine is just one step, and when teams use it to much, is when trouble starts.. I love the way the Patriots draft, and the type of players they bring along, its really, the right way, in my opinion...
Well not every team is as astute as Bill Belicheck and the NE Patriots. A lot of those playersU mentioned where not drafted or even signed as rookies by the Patriots.These same players were discarded by other teams. The Patriots more thenany other team take what a guy does well and maximizes it. Those same players when they wereother teams werent half the players they arenow. thats not really the point, the point is about the players, and outta 5players named, only 2 played for other teams besides New England... The fact is these players are ball players and no how to play the game the right way and all were very productive in college and weren't given the chance that others are given because they were short on some measurable or something, which happens all the time.. Theres a ton of players that don't ever get the chance because of measurables , that can put up impact numbers... I mean, look at guys like Steve Largent and Wayne Chrebet, there the lucky ones that were at leaste given a shot, and succeeded.. Also, u can't blame Deion branch for not doing well in Seattle, with that bum throwing to him up there, and wes welker showed signs before coming to new england, but needed a Real chance, and got one in New England... Theres a ton of players out there like this, how about Fred Jackson? To slow, not big college...etc...etc Well, hes a heck of a back! So far, all Fred Jackson has done, is easily out played 2first RD top RB's in spiller and Lynch... My point simply is, to many times, guys get overlooked because of measurables and 40times, and because of that, u See the easiest of INT"s or Catches dropped, that make your head spin, and horrible routes and ...etc...etc Now, i understand some live up to the hype, but man, some of these guys who are just smart and play the game the right way and know how to catch and simply put, play football, need to not be overlooked so much...
</P>


Thats fine but your going to find that when U cherry pick players like that. For instance take a look at the RB position. A place where some believe U can plug in anyone because of success of UDFA and later round draft picks. While at times that may be true most of the top 20 backs in rushing are fromthe top 3 rounds. 15 of the top 20 backs in rushingare top 3 round backs and 8 out of the top 10 are top 3 round backs. Ive beenfollowing this for about 5 years now and every year I find the same thing. When U look closer U find out most of the backs thathave succeess that are late round backs dont duplicate that success very long. There very often a flash in the pan while the higher round backs tend to have longer staying power near the top. So while its true U can find good players in any round there is a much higher success rate in the top picks. What I did find intresting while I have been monitoring this is the infrequency of Middle round backs in the top 20. Its like you are either a top draft pick or UDFA ,7th rounder.</P>


</P>


Top 20</P>


7First Rounders</P>


6 2nd Rounders</P>


2 3rd rounders</P>


27th Rounder</P>


3 UDFA</P>

Neverend
12-09-2010, 09:48 AM
I guess, u could say hes still learning stuff, but how much is there to learn at DE? I mean, does it take 5yrs to learn how to play the freaking positon? if your good at the positon and have the talent, is the reason you'll produce, not that your learning the positon of DE for yrs and yrs.. The hardest part about any positon going into the NFL, is Scheme change, SPeed of the game, and using what you've all ready learned consistently and knowing when to use that.. Sure, i'm sure theres little tricks and tidbits a coach can give JPP on playing the position, but as far as playing the positon of DE, i'm sure hes heard it all, its just a matter of practicing and continuing to Drill the stuff all ready learned time and time again and learn the rest of the league
</P>


In JPP's case, there is a lot more learning curve than just the speed of the game and a new system. Its not that easy playing DE when you have no technique like JPP does. As a defensive lineman you must win at the point of attack, maintain leverage by staying low with a good level, anchor &amp; set the edge, and shed blockers with proper hand technique. JPP wasn't very good at that in college as he had a tendency to be on the ground a lot against the run because he was so raw with all the things I mentioned. He made plays against therun in college (particularly his TFL's)with his quickness&amp; athleticismrather than technique which obviously wouldn't work in the nfl.You can't blame scounts and people being critical with the draft pick because peeps prefered a safer pick who can be an immediate starter as oppose to a raw, boom-or-bust kind of guy like JPP who needed development and was a 15th overall pick no less.</P>


As for the pass, JPP's stance wasn't very polished and his pass rush moves was lacking. All he relied on in college was a speed rush with an occasional bull rush, nothing else. In my opinion you can't fault the people for critizing JPP because he was so raw and the learning curve in the NFL would be tough. Luckily we have a good coaching staff here and JPP is known to have good work ethic. They adjusted his stance at rookie camp and he's shown more pass rushing moves as his sack last week against trent williams was impressive. This guy is progressing a lot. I think its right using him a situational pass rusher as he's still too raw to play against the run and is still probably a couple of years away from being a 3-down player (altho thats not necessary here). I also think justin tuck and other d-lineman are going to help him polish up his technique against the run as justin tuck said 'im teaching JPP everything I know' which is incredibly encouraging to hear. </P>

Redeyejedi
12-09-2010, 10:12 AM
I guess, u could say hes still learning stuff, but how much is there to learn at DE? I mean, does it take 5yrs to learn how to play the freaking positon? if your good at the positon and have the talent, is the reason you'll produce, not that your learning the positon of DE for yrs and yrs.. The hardest part about any positon going into the NFL, is Scheme change, SPeed of the game, and using what you've all ready learned consistently and knowing when to use that.. Sure, i'm sure theres little tricks and tidbits a coach can give JPP on playing the position, but as far as playing the positon of DE, i'm sure hes heard it all, its just a matter of practicing and continuing to Drill the stuff all ready learned time and time again and learn the rest of the league
</P>


In JPP's case, there is a lot more learning curve than just the speed of the game and a new system. Its not that easy playing DE when you have no technique like JPP does. As a defensive lineman you must win at the point of attack, maintain leverage by staying low with a good level, anchor &amp; set the edge, and shed blockers with proper hand technique. JPP wasn't very good at that in college as he had a tendency to be on the ground a lot against the run because he was so raw with all the things I mentioned. He made plays against therun in college (particularly his TFL's)with his quickness&amp; athleticismrather than technique which obviously wouldn't work in the nfl.You can't blame scounts and people being critical with the draft pick because peeps prefered a safer pick who can be an immediate starter as oppose to a raw, boom-or-bust kind of guy like JPP who needed development and was a 15th overall pick no less.</P>


As for the pass, JPP's stance wasn't very polished and his pass rush moves was lacking. All he relied on in college was a speed rush with an occasional bull rush, nothing else. In my opinion you can't fault the people for critizing JPP because he was so raw and the learning curve in the NFL would be tough. Luckily we have a good coaching staff here and JPP is known to have good work ethic. They adjusted his stance at rookie camp and he's shown more pass rushing moves as his sack last week against trent williams was impressive. This guy is progressing a lot. I think its right using him a situational pass rusher as he's still too raw to play against the run and is still probably a couple of years away from being a 3-down player (altho thats not necessary here). I also think justin tuck and other d-lineman are going to help him polish up his technique against the run as justin tuck said 'im teaching JPP everything I know' which is incredibly encouraging to hear. </P> He has come along way technique wise from South Florida U can visibly see the difference in how he plays the game.The extra snaps he has received from the Kiwi injury has been a godsend to him. Focusing on him in the early season games he was really have a tough go at it. He was being swallowed up rather easily. Ever since the Kiwi injury though he has really improved. U can see the difference in his game and its really encouraging. He still has problems against the run but hopefully an off-season of working withthe Giants coachesand Tuck he comes into camp as more then just a situational pass rusher.

Redeyejedi
12-09-2010, 10:42 AM
]I dont think its over rated I just think coaches believe that they can teach technique. I think teams draft athletes way more on defense then offense though I think they draft athletes on both sides as often as they can. And you're right, they can teach technique. It goes back to the mental toughness and how coachable guys are. That's why a guy like JPP is a coaches dream, extremely athletic but he is very hard working, and will listen and apply everything he is told. Plus, its not like JPP wasen't showing the signs of being a big time player.. He had a pretty darn good yr at S.Florida last yr, in his 1st as a Major College player.. 16.5 TFL, 6sacks, 1int, 2ff's, 3pass breakups.. I mean, he put some monster numbers up.. Its not like this guy came to the pros's, knowing nothing, as some made it out to be.. He'd been playing DE for like 5yrs now, learning and learning... Now, its mostly learning the speed of the Pro Game and diffrent Tendencies of Top of the line Olineman and what not... I had a feeling he'd make a impact as a rookie, and at least show the signs of him being stellar in the future.. some made it out to be, like he was gonna need to learn on the bench for this whole yr, like he never played the positon before, or something...
I disagree those are monster numbers. There good but there hardly monster. Technique wise he was very very raw at South Florida.His had placement was poor and he hadnext to no pass rush moves.Hejust overwhelmed the opposition with physical strength,speed, and will.He still has his trouble playing the run and that will take some time. Kiwi getting hurt has definitely helped hima lot. It has allowed him to get some more snaps and move his progress forward . He is getting by mostly on physical ability, pure tenacity, and motor.Things that will definitely help U contribute as a pass rusher. Once he gets his technique down he will grow into an all around player. With all the extra playing time he has received this year it should really help him going into next season. Maybe Justin Tuck can give JPP sometime this off season on working on his run game technique i dissagree, he had a big time season and lead a pretty good defensive team.. Sometimes i think u guys make this out to be more like Rocket Science then football... What do u think all the coaches have been teaching this guy for the last 5yrs? How ot bullrush???lol U don't think the kids learned about hand placement from the last 4coaches hes had? I think the hardest thing for players to really learn is the playbook, the speed of the game, and yes, some little positional tendencies that come in time, but overall, the guy can play DE.. Just like i heard about Iupati, whos also starting as a rookie, and doing extremely well.. Its really not coincedence that those 2are playing very well, because there not dumb, i'm sure they've learned plenty over the last 5yrs, and mostly everything they here at this point, is just being drilled in there heads, because i'm sure they've heard it before.. Most rooks can't be successful because they at least have some sort of vet in front of em, if even for a yr, but as soon as JPP was in, we seen the potential for him to be a beast... Sure, hes just now getting the sacks and what not, but we've all seen this coming, from the time he stepped on the field, and we seen "jpp's a beast" threads from over a month ago...
Whatever man if U cant see that he was a raw player in terms of how to properly play the position then theres really know point even discussing it .I can see an improvement in his hands and how he uses leverage since he came to the NFL.If he knew how to do it in college he certainly wasnt doing it.So whatever the Giants have done to get him to listen and take it on the field well thats the point of coaching.I dont know what your talking about up top I never said he would have to sit on the bench. I said he could be used as a situational pass rusher and thats exactly what they have used him as.What Ive hear about Iupati is he has been rather ordinary actually. If your a guard and your picked that high Im looking for an immediateprobowl player and he has been far from that. He has had big time pass protection issues. According to 49er fans still has poor technique so I guess he is uncoachable then if U think they have been learning it for years and he still cant do it right.</P>


and as far as 9er fans, my best freind is a 9er fan, like crazy 9er fan, almost freakishly so, and he loves iupati, and i've seen him highlighted on monday night football for job well done, when they were running like mad men on Arizona, with b.westbrook, mite i add.. I mean, hes been solid, and there run game says so...

Singeltary has said from day 1, that iupati has showed the abilty to step in and start from DAY 1, he was all ready given the starting job in freaking August, before pre season even began, because of what he showed during Training camp... Pretty good, for a guy whos got all this learning on the positon to do... And again, i understand theres a whole new play book and scheme and speed of the game to learn, but the guy knows how to play Guard, its what he freaking does for a living...
</P>


Your acting like I said the guy was going to bust or something. All I said is that I dont like interior line prospects that high and If I was going to get one I would want one more polished then Iupati. I still said he was the 2nd best interior line prospect in the draft . Im just not crazy about drafting interior lineman and an upside interior lineman at that, that high.</P>

slipknottin
12-09-2010, 11:03 AM
Ya I'm sure your right, a former college DE who clearly knows everything taught JPP everything in a year and a half.

I mean that Tuck spent two seasons in the NFL improving his hand usage shows that guys can learn it within a month with college coaching.

nycsportzfan
12-09-2010, 12:24 PM
Ya I'm sure your right, a former college DE who clearly knows everything taught JPP everything in a year and a half.

I mean that Tuck spent two seasons in the NFL improving his hand usage shows that guys can learn it within a month with college coaching. Ya, u and tuck talked about that over dinner last night, right? Dude, your full of it...

nycsportzfan
12-09-2010, 12:27 PM
]I dont think its over rated I just think coaches believe that they can teach technique. I think teams draft athletes way more on defense then offense though I think they draft athletes on both sides as often as they can. And you're right, they can teach technique. It goes back to the mental toughness and how coachable guys are. That's why a guy like JPP is a coaches dream, extremely athletic but he is very hard working, and will listen and apply everything he is told. Plus, its not like JPP wasen't showing the signs of being a big time player.. He had a pretty darn good yr at S.Florida last yr, in his 1st as a Major College player.. 16.5 TFL, 6sacks, 1int, 2ff's, 3pass breakups.. I mean, he put some monster numbers up.. Its not like this guy came to the pros's, knowing nothing, as some made it out to be.. He'd been playing DE for like 5yrs now, learning and learning... Now, its mostly learning the speed of the Pro Game and diffrent Tendencies of Top of the line Olineman and what not... I had a feeling he'd make a impact as a rookie, and at least show the signs of him being stellar in the future.. some made it out to be, like he was gonna need to learn on the bench for this whole yr, like he never played the positon before, or something...
I disagree those are monster numbers. There good but there hardly monster. Technique wise he was very very raw at South Florida.His had placement was poor and he hadnext to no pass rush moves.Hejust overwhelmed the opposition with physical strength,speed, and will.He still has his trouble playing the run and that will take some time. Kiwi getting hurt has definitely helped hima lot. It has allowed him to get some more snaps and move his progress forward . He is getting by mostly on physical ability, pure tenacity, and motor.Things that will definitely help U contribute as a pass rusher. Once he gets his technique down he will grow into an all around player. With all the extra playing time he has received this year it should really help him going into next season. Maybe Justin Tuck can give JPP sometime this off season on working on his run game technique i dissagree, he had a big time season and lead a pretty good defensive team.. Sometimes i think u guys make this out to be more like Rocket Science then football... What do u think all the coaches have been teaching this guy for the last 5yrs? How ot bullrush???lol U don't think the kids learned about hand placement from the last 4coaches hes had? I think the hardest thing for players to really learn is the playbook, the speed of the game, and yes, some little positional tendencies that come in time, but overall, the guy can play DE.. Just like i heard about Iupati, whos also starting as a rookie, and doing extremely well.. Its really not coincedence that those 2are playing very well, because there not dumb, i'm sure they've learned plenty over the last 5yrs, and mostly everything they here at this point, is just being drilled in there heads, because i'm sure they've heard it before.. Most rooks can't be successful because they at least have some sort of vet in front of em, if even for a yr, but as soon as JPP was in, we seen the potential for him to be a beast... Sure, hes just now getting the sacks and what not, but we've all seen this coming, from the time he stepped on the field, and we seen "jpp's a beast" threads from over a month ago...
Whatever man if U cant see that he was a raw player in terms of how to properly play the position then theres really know point even discussing it .I can see an improvement in his hands and how he uses leverage since he came to the NFL.If he knew how to do it in college he certainly wasnt doing it.So whatever the Giants have done to get him to listen and take it on the field well thats the point of coaching.I dont know what your talking about up top I never said he would have to sit on the bench. I said he could be used as a situational pass rusher and thats exactly what they have used him as.What Ive hear about Iupati is he has been rather ordinary actually. If your a guard and your picked that high Im looking for an immediateprobowl player and he has been far from that. He has had big time pass protection issues. According to 49er fans still has poor technique so I guess he is uncoachable then if U think they have been learning it for years and he still cant do it right.</p>


and as far as 9er fans, my best freind is a 9er fan, like crazy 9er fan, almost freakishly so, and he loves iupati, and i've seen him highlighted on monday night football for job well done, when they were running like mad men on Arizona, with b.westbrook, mite i add.. I mean, hes been solid, and there run game says so...

Singeltary has said from day 1, that iupati has showed the abilty to step in and start from DAY 1, he was all ready given the starting job in freaking August, before pre season even began, because of what he showed during Training camp... Pretty good, for a guy whos got all this learning on the positon to do... And again, i understand theres a whole new play book and scheme and speed of the game to learn, but the guy knows how to play Guard, its what he freaking does for a living...
</p>


Your acting like I said the guy was going to bust or something. All I said is that I dont like interior line prospects that high and If I was going to get one I would want one more polished then Iupati. I still said he was the 2nd best interior line prospect in the draft . Im just not crazy about drafting interior lineman and an upside interior lineman at that, that high.</p> i know, your not calling him a bust, never said that..

nycsportzfan
12-09-2010, 12:34 PM
I guess, u could say hes still learning stuff, but how much is there to learn at DE? I mean, does it take 5yrs to learn how to play the freaking positon? if your good at the positon and have the talent, is the reason you'll produce, not that your learning the positon of DE for yrs and yrs.. The hardest part about any positon going into the NFL, is Scheme change, SPeed of the game, and using what you've all ready learned consistently and knowing when to use that.. Sure, i'm sure theres little tricks and tidbits a coach can give JPP on playing the position, but as far as playing the positon of DE, i'm sure hes heard it all, its just a matter of practicing and continuing to Drill the stuff all ready learned time and time again and learn the rest of the league
</p>


In JPP's case, there is a lot more learning curve than just the speed of the game and a new system. Its not that easy playing DE when you have no technique like JPP does. As a defensive lineman you must win at the point of attack, maintain leverage by staying low with a good level, anchor &amp; set the edge, and shed blockers with proper hand technique. JPP wasn't very good at that in college as he had a tendency to be on the ground a lot against the run because he was so raw with all the things I mentioned. He made plays against therun in college (particularly his TFL's)with his quickness&amp; athleticismrather than technique which obviously wouldn't work in the nfl.You can't blame scounts and people being critical with the draft pick because peeps prefered a safer pick who can be an immediate starter as oppose to a raw, boom-or-bust kind of guy like JPP who needed development and was a 15th overall pick no less.</p>


As for the pass, JPP's stance wasn't very polished and his pass rush moves was lacking. All he relied on in college was a speed rush with an occasional bull rush, nothing else. In my opinion you can't fault the people for critizing JPP because he was so raw and the learning curve in the NFL would be tough. Luckily we have a good coaching staff here and JPP is known to have good work ethic. They adjusted his stance at rookie camp and he's shown more pass rushing moves as his sack last week against trent williams was impressive. This guy is progressing a lot. I think its right using him a situational pass rusher as he's still too raw to play against the run and is still probably a couple of years away from being a 3-down player (altho thats not necessary here). I also think justin tuck and other d-lineman are going to help him polish up his technique against the run as justin tuck said 'im teaching JPP everything I know' which is incredibly encouraging to hear. </p> so, specifically, what is tuck gonna teach the kid "TECHNIQUE" wise that he dosen't all ready know? I mean, seriously, what? All it is at this point, is repititon and drillling, hes not teaching him anything he hasen't heard all ready or learned all ready, maybe hes getting reminders of diffrent things, but hes not learning anything new at this point... I'm sure tuck can tell him tons about diffrent Olinman in the league though... Right now, its just about getting out there more and more and obviously with more playing time, the better your gonna become, getting used to the scheme and the new teammates and speed of the game and what not... Its also not like he hasen't had a whole offseason to learn from our own coaches as well, before the season even began.. To me, its all about repititon, because there is not anything that hasen't been taught to him at this point, as far as technique and hand placement...

nycsportzfan
12-09-2010, 12:41 PM
]I dont think its over rated I just think coaches believe that they can teach technique. I think teams draft athletes way more on defense then offense though I think they draft athletes on both sides as often as they can. And you're right, they can teach technique. It goes back to the mental toughness and how coachable guys are. That's why a guy like JPP is a coaches dream, extremely athletic but he is very hard working, and will listen and apply everything he is told. Plus, its not like JPP wasen't showing the signs of being a big time player.. He had a pretty darn good yr at S.Florida last yr, in his 1st as a Major College player.. 16.5 TFL, 6sacks, 1int, 2ff's, 3pass breakups.. I mean, he put some monster numbers up.. Its not like this guy came to the pros's, knowing nothing, as some made it out to be.. He'd been playing DE for like 5yrs now, learning and learning... Now, its mostly learning the speed of the Pro Game and diffrent Tendencies of Top of the line Olineman and what not... I had a feeling he'd make a impact as a rookie, and at least show the signs of him being stellar in the future.. some made it out to be, like he was gonna need to learn on the bench for this whole yr, like he never played the positon before, or something...
I disagree those are monster numbers. There good but there hardly monster. Technique wise he was very very raw at South Florida.His had placement was poor and he hadnext to no pass rush moves.Hejust overwhelmed the opposition with physical strength,speed, and will.He still has his trouble playing the run and that will take some time. Kiwi getting hurt has definitely helped hima lot. It has allowed him to get some more snaps and move his progress forward . He is getting by mostly on physical ability, pure tenacity, and motor.Things that will definitely help U contribute as a pass rusher. Once he gets his technique down he will grow into an all around player. With all the extra playing time he has received this year it should really help him going into next season. Maybe Justin Tuck can give JPP sometime this off season on working on his run game technique i dissagree, he had a big time season and lead a pretty good defensive team.. Sometimes i think u guys make this out to be more like Rocket Science then football... What do u think all the coaches have been teaching this guy for the last 5yrs? How ot bullrush???lol U don't think the kids learned about hand placement from the last 4coaches hes had? I think the hardest thing for players to really learn is the playbook, the speed of the game, and yes, some little positional tendencies that come in time, but overall, the guy can play DE.. Just like i heard about Iupati, whos also starting as a rookie, and doing extremely well.. Its really not coincedence that those 2are playing very well, because there not dumb, i'm sure they've learned plenty over the last 5yrs, and mostly everything they here at this point, is just being drilled in there heads, because i'm sure they've heard it before.. Most rooks can't be successful because they at least have some sort of vet in front of em, if even for a yr, but as soon as JPP was in, we seen the potential for him to be a beast... Sure, hes just now getting the sacks and what not, but we've all seen this coming, from the time he stepped on the field, and we seen "jpp's a beast" threads from over a month ago...
Whatever man if U cant see that he was a raw player in terms of how to properly play the position then theres really know point even discussing it .I can see an improvement in his hands and how he uses leverage since he came to the NFL.If he knew how to do it in college he certainly wasnt doing it.So whatever the Giants have done to get him to listen and take it on the field well thats the point of coaching.I dont know what your talking about up top I never said he would have to sit on the bench. I said he could be used as a situational pass rusher and thats exactly what they have used him as.What Ive hear about Iupati is he has been rather ordinary actually. If your a guard and your picked that high Im looking for an immediateprobowl player and he has been far from that. He has had big time pass protection issues. According to 49er fans still has poor technique so I guess he is uncoachable then if U think they have been learning it for years and he still cant do it right.</p>


i just don't see how u see this? I<font size="5"> mean, what do u do, hit the pause button when and examine these things?</font> I mean, u rarley get to see any player through a whole play, and its certainly not easy to compare a play from the Pros to when he was at S.Florida... I realize hes still learning certain things, but the guy knows how to use his hands and what not.. I mean, what was Kevin Patrick teaching this guy at S.Florida? Hes getting used to the talent jump, and the speed of the game and using certain DE moves and stuff, sure... But to think, hes learning on Hand Usage is crazy, as i'm sure hes perfectly adept at using his hands, and has had that drilled into his head time and time again over the past few yrs... I thought he was gonna be good this yr, just as i did, Mike Iupati..

I guess, u could say hes still learning stuff, but how much is there to learn at DE? I mean, does it take 5yrs to learn how to play the freaking positon? if your good at the positon and have the talent, is the reason you'll produce, not that your learning the positon of DE for yrs and yrs.. The hardest part about any positon going into the NFL, is Scheme change, SPeed of the game, and using what you've all ready learned consistently and knowing when to use that.. Sure, i'm sure theres little tricks and tidbits a coach can give JPP on playing the position, but as far as playing the positon of DE, i'm sure hes heard it all, its just a matter of practicing and continuing to Drill the stuff all ready learned time and time again and learn the rest of the league
</p>


Thats exactly what I do. . I pay much more attention to the defensive players then to offensive on a whole "QB's the exception".I like watching defensive lineman the mostthere my favorite players.Daquan Bowers has become one of my favorite players in this draft.He plays with just so much power.He is an elite run defender and should become an excellent LEwho U kick inside on passing downs in the NFL.Ive watched him a lot and Ive also become a fan of his line mate Jarvis Jenkins as well.If Coefield isnt brought back I think Jenkins would be a good option inside.</p> Even with pause button, its not entirely easy to see everything u want to, because they flash away so fast, u don't get to see every player, its impossible to see what every defensive player is doing from snap to end of play, just impossible... Believe me, i've tried it thousands of times... Sure, u pause helps, but it still dosen't give u a 100pct accurate assesment into what a players doing all the time, u miss a ton by cameras flashing to where ever the plays going, and not having all the players in the picture...

Neverend
12-09-2010, 05:27 PM
I guess, u could say hes still learning stuff, but how much is there to learn at DE? I mean, does it take 5yrs to learn how to play the freaking positon? if your good at the positon and have the talent, is the reason you'll produce, not that your learning the positon of DE for yrs and yrs.. The hardest part about any positon going into the NFL, is Scheme change, SPeed of the game, and using what you've all ready learned consistently and knowing when to use that.. Sure, i'm sure theres little tricks and tidbits a coach can give JPP on playing the position, but as far as playing the positon of DE, i'm sure hes heard it all, its just a matter of practicing and continuing to Drill the stuff all ready learned time and time again and learn the rest of the league
</P>


In JPP's case, there is a lot more learning curve than just the speed of the game and a new system. Its not that easy playing DE when you have no technique like JPP does. As a defensive lineman you must win at the point of attack, maintain leverage by staying low with a good level, anchor &amp; set the edge, and shed blockers with proper hand technique. JPP wasn't very good at that in college as he had a tendency to be on the ground a lot against the run because he was so raw with all the things I mentioned. He made plays against therun in college (particularly his TFL's)with his quickness&amp; athleticismrather than technique which obviously wouldn't work in the nfl.You can't blame scounts and people being critical with the draft pick because peeps prefered a safer pick who can be an immediate starter as oppose to a raw, boom-or-bust kind of guy like JPP who needed development and was a 15th overall pick no less.</P>


As for the pass, JPP's stance wasn't very polished and his pass rush moves was lacking. All he relied on in college was a speed rush with an occasional bull rush, nothing else. In my opinion you can't fault the people for critizing JPP because he was so raw and the learning curve in the NFL would be tough. Luckily we have a good coaching staff here and JPP is known to have good work ethic. They adjusted his stance at rookie camp and he's shown more pass rushing moves as his sack last week against trent williams was impressive. This guy is progressing a lot. I think its right using him a situational pass rusher as he's still too raw to play against the run and is still probably a couple of years away from being a 3-down player (altho thats not necessary here). I also think justin tuck and other d-lineman are going to help him polish up his technique against the run as justin tuck said 'im teaching JPP everything I know' which is incredibly encouraging to hear. </P>


so, specifically, what is tuck gonna teach the kid "TECHNIQUE" wise that he dosen't all ready know? I mean, seriously, what? All it is at this point, is repititon and drillling, hes not teaching him anything he hasen't heard all ready or learned all ready, maybe hes getting reminders of diffrent things, but hes not learning anything new at this point... I'm sure tuck can tell him tons about diffrent Olinman in the league though... Right now, its just about getting out there more and more and obviously with more playing time, the better your gonna become, getting used to the scheme and the new teammates and speed of the game and what not... Its also not like he hasen't had a whole offseason to learn from our own coaches as well, before the season even began.. To me, its all about repititon, because there is not anything that hasen't been taught to him at this point, as far as technique and hand placement...
</P>


if i wasnt clear:</P>



As a defensive lineman you must win at the point of attack, maintain leverage by staying low with a good level, anchor &amp; set the edge, and shed blockers with proper hand technique. JPP wasn't very good at that in college as he had a tendency to be on the ground a lot against the run because he was so raw with all the things I mentioned. As for the pass, JPP's stance wasn't very polished and his pass rush moves was lacking. All he relied on in college was a speed rush with an occasional bull rush, nothing else.</P>


</P>


Once he improves in all of these areas, he will be one of the most dominant defensive players in the game. Right now he's still learning while making plays with his athleticism and motor.</P>

Redeyejedi
12-11-2010, 08:13 AM
Whats every ones thoughts on NC DE/DT Quinton Coples. The guy has a monster frame to end up at LE in the NFL and kick inside as a pass rusher on passing downs. I think his best bet may be bulking up some more and playing DE in a 3-4 anyone have any thoughts. I look at that roster of NC defense and I see a lot of guys thathave they strength and athleticism of very good NFL football players. They just need to be molded a little better but they are loaded with upside talent

slipknottin
12-11-2010, 03:55 PM
Whats every ones thoughts on NC DE/DT *Quinton Coples. The guy has a monster frame to end up at LE in the NFL and kick inside as a pass rusher on passing downs. I think his best bet may be bulking up some more and playing DE in a 3-4 anyone have any thoughts.

Thats exactly where I would think he goes. 5 tech. He has the frame to bulk up to close to 300 if a team wants him to play inside.

Redeyejedi
12-11-2010, 05:48 PM
Whats every ones thoughts on NC DE/DT Quinton Coples. The guy has a monster frame to end up at LE in the NFL and kick inside as a pass rusher on passing downs. I think his best bet may be bulking up some more and playing DE in a 3-4 anyone have any thoughts. Thats exactly where I would think he goes. 5 tech. He has the frame to bulk up to close to 300 if a team wants him to play inside. U familar with Marylands Kenny Tate I think he may be a good fit to play in that 3rd safety role. He is a junior so he probably wont come out but he has some size he is listed at 6-4 220. If he comes out I think the Giants should really consider grabbing him</P>

heavyhitter
12-12-2010, 05:28 AM
Whats every ones thoughts on NC DE/DT Quinton Coples. The guy has a monster frame to end up at LE in the NFL and kick inside as a pass rusher on passing downs. I think his best bet may be bulking up some more and playing DE in a 3-4 anyone have any thoughts. Thats exactly where I would think he goes. 5 tech. He has the frame to bulk up to close to 300 if a team wants him to play inside. U familar with Marylands Kenny Tate I think he may be a good fit to play in that 3rd safety role. He is a junior so he probably wont come out but he has some size he is listed at 6-4 220. If he comes out I think the Giants should really consider grabbing him</p><font size="3">I really like Kenny Tate. Nothing against Robert Sands but I'd take Tate over Sands anyday even though he rocked my boy Taiwan earlier this year. </font>
<h3 dir="ltr"><a id="video-long-title-CyM7E31Csac" href="http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=CyM7E31Csac" title="(HD) Kenny Tate (Maryland) lights up Taiwan Easterling (FSU)" rel="nofollow">(HD) Kenny Tate (Maryland) lights up Taiwan Easterling (FSU)
</a></h3>

Neverend
12-12-2010, 06:37 AM
My favorite safety in this class is florida'sahmad black. he's 100x better than major wright coming out. he hits hard, hasleadership skills, is aball hawk, hasgood instincts, very physical, very good blitzer, and extremely athletic. The only thing thats probably keeping him from getting more attention is his size (5'9) which utterly sucks.</P>


I also like the sooners' safeties too. Both jonathan nelson and quinton carter. i think carter is more of a playmaker tho. There are some really talented safeties in this draft class</P>

nycsportzfan
12-15-2010, 05:54 AM
My favorite safety in this class is florida'sahmad black. he's 100x better than major wright coming out. he hits hard, hasleadership skills, is aball hawk, hasgood instincts, very physical, very good blitzer, and extremely athletic. The only thing thats probably keeping him from getting more attention is his size (5'9) which utterly sucks.</p>


I also like the sooners' safeties too. Both jonathan nelson and quinton carter. i think carter is more of a playmaker tho. There are some really talented safeties in this draft class</p> i love black, and somewhere in these draft threads, you'll see me rave about him.. I know hes not that big, but hes a huge hitter with good instincts and above solid speed.. As i said with jenkins, i look forward to seeing his vertical, those Florida DB's got serious Up's!

nycsportzfan
12-15-2010, 06:15 AM
Ok, after beating the Vikings down, we now are picking 25th overall, if the season ended today and there was no playoffs... As i have been doing, heres my Weekly mock based on whereever we would be picking as of now..... I have no life....lol


1. Bruce Carter lb UNC- i think travis lewis is gone at this point, and b.carter is big upside..

2.Johnny Patrick CB Louisville- a Reese type pick.. Huge production and all the right measurables and a leader.. This guys gonna be a sound NFL football player, most definetly.. if you haven't gotten a chance to watch him, u better tune into louisvilles bowl game, i believe hes one of the safest bets in this yrs draft outside of RD 1 guys...

3. Jake Kirkpatrick TCU- mauling, good technician from winning program...

4. Joe Lefeged SS RU- this guy will be a beast on ST's, and will certainly fill in the role of D.Grant in time, and hits very hard with exceptional instincts and nose for the football..

6. Weslye Saunders TE S.Car- if hes on the board this late, u don't hesitate.. To much upside here, at a positon where we could use help if KB leaves.. A exceptional blocker with ever improving recieving skills...

7. Terrell McClain DT S.Fla- more of a finese DT, even though hes got solid size, but has some promise, at a positon we could use some help.. Obviously, he knows one person on the team all ready..lol

Redeyejedi
12-17-2010, 02:47 PM
Wade Phillips and Dan Reeves will coach the shrine bowl

myles2424
12-17-2010, 11:39 PM
Ok, after beating the Vikings down, we now are picking 25th overall, if the season ended today and there was no playoffs... As i have been doing, heres my Weekly mock based on whereever we would be picking as of now..... I have no life....lol


1. Bruce Carter lb UNC- i think travis lewis is gone at this point, and b.carter is big upside..

2.Johnny Patrick CB Louisville- a Reese type pick.. Huge production and all the right measurables and a leader.. This guys gonna be a sound NFL football player, most definetly.. if you haven't gotten a chance to watch him, u better tune into louisvilles bowl game, i believe hes one of the safest bets in this yrs draft outside of RD 1 guys...

3. Jake Kirkpatrick TCU- mauling, good technician from winning program...

4. Joe Lefeged SS RU- this guy will be a beast on ST's, and will certainly fill in the role of D.Grant in time, and hits very hard with exceptional instincts and nose for the football..

6. Weslye Saunders TE S.Car- if hes on the board this late, u don't hesitate.. To much upside here, at a positon where we could use help if KB leaves.. A exceptional blocker with ever improving recieving skills...

7. Terrell McClain DT S.Fla- more of a finese DT, even though hes got solid size, but has some promise, at a positon we could use some help.. Obviously, he knows one person on the team all ready..lol
</P>


I think they'll be better CB talent in the 2nd.... And didnt Weslye Saunders get kicked off the team?</P>

CGYgiant
12-18-2010, 02:51 AM
If one of our starting CBs go down, will anyone here feel comfortable?

I was wondering if any of you guys have any opinions as to which CB will be availble picks 23-31....I really think a CB is as valuble if not more valuble then OLB

Neverend
12-18-2010, 09:30 AM
Yeah I like corner too but I don't think we should pick a CB just to pick a CB, they have to be talented. If a great cover guy falls then I'm not hesitating. Tho I'm not a fan of Aaron Williams or Dowling.</P>


I think there is some talent at LB in the later rounds. Casey Matthews is still currently my favorite LB in the draft. Cant wait to watch him against auburn in a few weeks. Mayock and all the scouts are going to rave about this guy during draft time and his stock will rise like crazy. </P>

nycsportzfan
12-18-2010, 01:27 PM
Ok, after beating the Vikings down, we now are picking 25th overall, if the season ended today and there was no playoffs... As i have been doing, heres my Weekly mock based on whereever we would be picking as of now..... I have no life....lol


1. Bruce Carter lb UNC- i think travis lewis is gone at this point, and b.carter is big upside..

2.Johnny Patrick CB Louisville- a Reese type pick.. Huge production and all the right measurables and a leader.. This guys gonna be a sound NFL football player, most definetly.. if you haven't gotten a chance to watch him, u better tune into louisvilles bowl game, i believe hes one of the safest bets in this yrs draft outside of RD 1 guys...

3. Jake Kirkpatrick TCU- mauling, good technician from winning program...

4. Joe Lefeged SS RU- this guy will be a beast on ST's, and will certainly fill in the role of D.Grant in time, and hits very hard with exceptional instincts and nose for the football..

6. Weslye Saunders TE S.Car- if hes on the board this late, u don't hesitate.. To much upside here, at a positon where we could use help if KB leaves.. A exceptional blocker with ever improving recieving skills...

7. Terrell McClain DT S.Fla- more of a finese DT, even though hes got solid size, but has some promise, at a positon we could use some help.. Obviously, he knows one person on the team all ready..lol
</p>


I think they'll be better CB talent in the 2nd.... And didnt Weslye Saunders get kicked off the team?</p> Johnny Patrick is one of the better Corners in the country, thats why your slowly seeing his Draft Grades moving up toward and into 2nd rd... THe guys got good speed, and good size, and has had a really good career, culminating with a 47tckl 5.5TFL 1sack 5INT 11pass broken up SR season... Kids exactly what the giants seem to like in there CB's, and if he runs a Good Solid 40 time at the combine, the Expierenced Corner is going most likely RD 2 in my opinion, no later then first half of RD 3...

As for Saunders, ya he got dismissed from S.CAR, thats why i got em in RD 6, hoping that he drops... If he didn't, the kid would be in the Kyle Rudolph and Dj Williams area of the draft, most likely... WIth it being such a weak crop of TE's this yr, i figure u wait, and take a big upside in Saunders late and hope he pans out... He can block something fierce and his hands were ever improving...

Redeyejedi
12-19-2010, 05:22 PM
EPIC COLLAPSE MOCK</P>


</P>


1. Travis Lewis OLB Oklahoma- Giants miss playoffs but get the 19th pick and nab Lewis</P>


2. Noel Devine RB West Virgina- Im convinced the Giants offense needs more speed they never get an easy score. Noel Devine will change that.</P>


3. Devon House New Mexico State- A little smaller then the usual Giant corner but hey everyone is fired in this scenario so a new philosophy is in place</P>


4. Titus Young WR Boise St- More speed a guy thats shifty in the open field</P>


6. Tyrod Taylor QB VT- Am i putting this here because of what I just saw probably but who cares he run the wildcat and with new coordinators we will see some different looks</P>


7.Jeremile Hines S Ohio State- An Athletic safety to battle MJ for the last safety roster spot</P>

nycsportzfan
12-20-2010, 02:31 PM
EPIC COLLAPSE MOCK</p>


</p>


1. Travis Lewis OLB Oklahoma- Giants miss playoffs but get the 19th pick and nab Lewis</p>


2. Noel Devine RB West Virgina- Im convinced the Giants offense needs more speed they never get an easy score. Noel Devine will change that.</p>


3. Devon House New Mexico State- A little smaller then the usual Giant corner but hey everyone is fired in this scenario so a new philosophy is in place</p>


4. Titus Young WR Boise St- More speed a guy thats shifty in the open field</p>


6. Tyrod Taylor QB VT- Am i putting this here because of what I just saw probably but who cares he run the wildcat and with new coordinators we will see some different looks</p>


7.Jeremile Hines S Ohio State- An Athletic safety to battle MJ for the last safety roster spot</p> nice! Heres my epic fail draft..

1. Travis Lewis LB OU

2. Jerrell Jerrnigan Wr/Kr/Rb Troy- this kids speed! He is a do all weapon with good sized hands for his size, and would be a force in return game...

3. Ahmad Black SS Fla- i know hes smallish, but he hits! hes also somewhat of a ballhawk, and he gives great effort and has solid speed, which we lack in the Secondary.. I think a future trio of KP, Rolle and Black gives us all sorts of strengths in the safety area...

4. KJ Wright SLB Miss st- a football player! Plain and simple, this kids a player that will make it in the NFL, as a solid, do everything the right way, strong, physical LB.. I love this kid...

6. Kevin Kowalski C Toledo- We wait, but still get a Center who can maul and plays with nice Technique and has decent size....

7. Lee Smith TE Marshall- Good Sized TE, that has good hands, but don't score as much as u would like.. But, he can block and could be a Kevin Boss type find late in the draft.. If nothing else, he could help the run game....

Redeyejedi
12-21-2010, 08:42 PM
EPIC COLLAPSE MOCK</P>


</P>


1. Travis Lewis OLB Oklahoma- Giants miss playoffs but get the 19th pick and nab Lewis</P>


2. Noel Devine RB West Virgina- Im convinced the Giants offense needs more speed they never get an easy score. Noel Devine will change that.</P>


3. Devon House New Mexico State- A little smaller then the usual Giant corner but hey everyone is fired in this scenario so a new philosophy is in place</P>


4. Titus Young WR Boise St- More speed a guy thats shifty in the open field</P>


6. Tyrod Taylor QB VT- Am i putting this here because of what I just saw probably but who cares he run the wildcat and with new coordinators we will see some different looks</P>


7.Jeremile Hines S Ohio State- An Athletic safety to battle MJ for the last safety roster spot</P>


nice! Heres my epic fail draft..

1. Travis Lewis LB OU

2. Jerrell Jerrnigan Wr/Kr/Rb Troy- this kids speed! He is a do all weapon with good sized hands for his size, and would be a force in return game...

3. Ahmad Black SS Fla- i know hes smallish, but he hits! hes also somewhat of a ballhawk, and he gives great effort and has solid speed, which we lack in the Secondary.. I think a future trio of KP, Rolle and Black gives us all sorts of strengths in the safety area...

4. KJ Wright SLB Miss st- a football player! Plain and simple, this kids a player that will make it in the NFL, as a solid, do everything the right way, strong, physical LB.. I love this kid...

6. Kevin Kowalski C Toledo- We wait, but still get a Center who can maul and plays with nice Technique and has decent size....

7. Lee Smith TE Marshall- Good Sized TE, that has good hands, but don't score as much as u would like.. But, he can block and could be a Kevin Boss type find late in the draft.. If nothing else, he could help the run game....
</P>


I actually almost put Jerrnigan in mine. I think he is a good idea. 3 birds with one stone</P>

Redeyejedi
12-21-2010, 08:43 PM
Boise St Utah tommorow probably see Brandon Burton locked up on Austin Pettis should be a good game

Redeyejedi
12-21-2010, 11:32 PM
Boise St Utah tommorow probably see Brandon Burton locked up on Austin Pettis should be a good game

nycsportzfan
12-22-2010, 04:16 AM
Boise St Utah tommorow probably see Brandon Burton locked up on Austin Pettis should be a good gameya, i'm looking forward to it! I'm also looking forward to seeing jeron johnson and Ryan Winterswyk and utah brusier Matt Asiata! Asiata is a stud! Hes the type of runner and player teams love to have on there team.. Just plays the game the right way, and has a old school feel to him, and i think he'd pair great with ahmad, but i don't know about his speed though...


Did u notice gartrell Johnson playing for the falcons??lol U hated on him, but hes making it, somewhat, and got another chance after almost making it here, with a good team, no less.. Hes not lighting the world on fire, but hes got a couple grabs and 1big run of 23yrds... Its not all about speed, my friend..lol

Redeyejedi
12-22-2010, 07:03 AM
Boise St Utah tommorow probably see Brandon Burton locked up on Austin Pettis should be a good gameya, i'm looking forward to it! I'm also looking forward to seeing jeron johnson and Ryan Winterswyk and utah brusier Matt Asiata! Asiata is a stud! Hes the type of runner and player teams love to have on there team.. Just plays the game the right way, and has a old school feel to him, and i think he'd pair great with ahmad, but i don't know about his speed though...


Did u notice gartrell Johnson playing for the falcons??lol U hated on him, but hes making it, somewhat, and got another chance after almost making it here, with a good team, no less.. Hes not lighting the world on fire, but hes got a couple grabs and 1big run of 23yrds... Its not all about speed, my friend..lol


I said he would be out of the NFL by thestart of nextseason so we will see. I knew he would be gone from the Giants but I thought when some injuries happened he would be brought back.One more draft of young players he will be flushed out. I mean he has 8 carries this season that is not much of a success in my book

Redeyejedi
12-22-2010, 11:25 AM
Ive been against this kind of stuff in the past but this offense needs some more options. With Bomar going to the Vikings we need a new developmental QB. Why not draft Tyrod Taylor. You can get him in on some wildcat packages, Maybe some WR, Maybe a KR. Use him like the Jets use Brad Smith . Tell me he isnt a better option on 3rd and 3 from the shotgun then Eli Manning. Time to get this offense some wrinkles and some speed.</P>


http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=EAoYbtsQXEU&amp;feature=related</P>


</P>

thegreatone
12-22-2010, 08:19 PM
I wouldn't be opposed to that at all. What do you guys think the odds of kellen Moore declaring are?

nycsportzfan
12-22-2010, 11:34 PM
Ive been against this kind of stuff in the past but this offense needs some more options. With Bomar going to the Vikings we need a new developmental QB. Why not draft Tyrod Taylor. You can get him in on some wildcat packages, Maybe some WR, Maybe a KR. Use him like the Jets use Brad Smith . Tell me he isnt a better option on 3rd and 3 from the shotgun then Eli Manning. Time to get this offense some wrinkles and some speed.</p>


http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=EAoYbtsQXEU&amp;feature=related</p>


</p> he'll probably go earlier then 6th rd, but a guy i have loved for a long time is Colin Kapernick.. Hes got the Athletic ability, and the HT to see over defenses and a solid arm, to make all the throws, and make em on the move, and he can kill ya with his ft.. He may be a good one, if given a shot and some time to learn a basic NFL offense.. Alot to work with, here....

nycsportzfan
12-22-2010, 11:46 PM
anyone got any small school guys there excited about this yr? Obviously Vlad Ducasse was my guy last yr, i was amped about, and then u had Akwasi owusu-ansah and a few others...

THis yr, theres a few guys i have heard about and have done alittle research on, guys like Benjamin Ilajana Olineman from Villanova, and also his teammate WR Matt Szczur, who is a absoulute weapon! He runs the wildcat, can throw the ball, Returns kicks and punts, and is a very good wideout, and hes a very exceptional athlete who was drafted by the CUBS in RD 5, giving him a decison to make... He was invited to the SR BOWL, and i am looking forward to seeing this kid, bigtime!!! Hes a great guy, as you'll see in this article, and may be just the type of versatile weapon our offense needs! Seriously, do some research on this kid, and you'll fall in love with his ability, and hes got good Size, hes a nice thick 205 lber standing 5ft 11inche's.. Very intriuging athlete... Read this article, its a good read


<div class="articleSpanImage">http://graphics8.nytimes.com/images/2010/12/17/sports/YVILLANOVA/YVILLANOVA-articleLarge.jpg
<div class="credit">Matt Rourke/Associated Press</div>
<p class="caption">Matt Szczur has a chance to sign with the Chicago Cubs, but then he’d miss the N.F.L. scouting combine. </p>
</div>
<h6 class="byline">By DAVE CALDWELL (http://topics.nytimes.com/top/reference/timestopics/people/c/dave_caldwell/index.html?inline=nyt-per)</h6>
<h6 class="dateline">Published: December 16, 2010</h6>

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Villanova’s Matt Szczur has had so much to do this year — play football
and baseball, provide bone marrow to a toddler with juvenile leukemia,
keep up with his schoolwork — that he sometimes wishes he had a
duplicate Matt Szczur (http://www.villanova.com/sports/m-basebl/mtt/szczur_matt00.html) to give him a hand. </p>
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Szczur, a wide receiver, likes to do it all, but he will have to make a
hard choice after he plays in the Senior Bowl next month. Szczur is also
a baseball player who was drafted in the fifth round last year by the Chicago Cubs (http://topics.nytimes.com/top/news/sports/baseball/majorleague/chicagocubs/index.html?inline=nyt-org).
If he commits to play only baseball by Feb. 10, in time for spring
training, he will receive a $500,000 bonus. That means he would miss the
N.F.L. (http://topics.nytimes.com/top/reference/timestopics/organizations/n/national_football_league/index.html?inline=nyt-org)’s scouting combine, which begins Feb. 23. </p>


“I’d rather see him play baseball,” his father, Marc, said this week, “but I just want him to be happy.” </p>


For Matt Szczur, whose last name sounds like Caesar, football makes him
happiest right now. And another championship is at stake. Villanova
(9-4), the reigning national champion in the Football Championship Subdivision (http://www.ncaa.com/brackets/2010/ncaa_bracket_FCS_football.html), formerly Division I-AA, will play a semifinal game against Eastern Washington (11-2) on Friday in Cheney, Wash. </p>


The winner will face either Delaware, Villanova’s archrival, or Georgia
Southern in the championship game Jan. 7 in Frisco, Tex. </p>


Szczur said this week that he was focused on Friday’s game more than whether he would choose football or baseball. </p>


“This is my senior year, and there was nothing better than winning the
national championship last year,” he said. “It’s a goal of ours not just
to repeat, but it’s a legacy we’re going for now.” </p>


Szczur, a senior from Erma, N.J., gained attention late in the 2009 season after the National Marrow Donor Program (http://www.marrow.org/) determined that his bone marrow was a match for a 13-month-old girl (http://www.nytimes.com/2009/12/05/sports/ncaafootball/05villanova.html?scp=1&amp;sq=szczur&amp;st=cse) with juvenile leukemia. </p>


Wildcats players have been tested since 1992 at the urging of Coach Andy Talley. </p>


A bone-marrow drive — called the Szczur Swab — is to be held in January
at Lower Cape May High School, Szczur’s alma mater. </p>


Szczur underwent the exhausting procedure to donate his marrow after his
junior football season, but it forced him to miss 10 baseball games in
the spring. He hit a home run in his last at-bat before the procedure
and an inside-the-park home run in his first at-bat after it. </p>


“He’s much prouder of that than anything else,” his father said of Szczur’s being able to help the girl. </p>


Szczur, an outfielder, batted .347 in 25 games for three Cubs minor
league affiliates last summer, but he sounds as if he is leaning toward
pursuing an N.F.L. career. He has been invited to the Senior Bowl on
Jan. 30 in Mobile, Ala. The game, Szczur said, will be a test run.
Talley has said he could be drafted as high as the third round. </p>


Szczur decided to attend Villanova over larger colleges like Vanderbilt, Duke (http://topics.nytimes.com/top/reference/timestopics/organizations/d/duke_university/index.html?inline=nyt-org)
and Rutgers because it offered him a better chance to play two sports.
Even after the Cubs drafted him, he decided he wanted to play his senior
football season at Villanova. He still wants to play both sports.
</p>


“Football is just a shorter window,” he said. “If I decide to play
baseball, I don’t think I would be able to go back to playing football.”
</p>


He was the most outstanding player in last year’s F.C.S. title game,
which Villanova won over Montana, but his senior season, at least until
Saturday, has not been as successful. Szczur missed six games with a
high ankle sprain and Villanova lost three of them. </p>


“There was a great morale lift when he came back,” Talley said. “He was like Superman.” </p>


Szczur, who is listed at 5 feet 11 inches and 205 pounds, does a little
of everything for the Wildcats. He catches a lot of passes, but he also
takes snaps in Villanova’s version of the wildcat offense, running or
throwing the ball, and he has returned punts and kickoffs. </p>


He played only the first half of Villanova’s regular-season finale on
Nov. 20 at Delaware, but he contributed enough to help the Wildcats beat
the Blue Hens, then ranked No. 1 in the country, 28-21 in overtime, to
squeak into the national playoffs. He also re-emerged as a vocal leader.
</p>


“It’s tough for any player who’s not playing much to say anything,” said Chris Whitney, the Villanova quarterback. </p>


In Villanova’s first playoff game, against Stephen F. Austin on Dec. 4,
Szczur rushed for 68 yards and caught 11 passes for 128 yards and a
touchdown in a come-from-behind victory in Nacogdoches, Tex. </p>


The next game was a one-man tour de force. Szczur scored four touchdowns
— three rushing and one receiving — and threw a touchdown pass in a
42-24 victory Saturday against Appalachian State in Boone, N.C.
Appalachian State, which won three straight national title from 2005-7,
was the top seed in the 20-team tournament. </p>


Football fans at Delaware and Villanova — two Colonial Athletic
Association universities that are only 40 miles apart — would be
delighted to see a rematch in the national championship game, but Szczur
will worry about that later. He has never played at Eastern Washington,
whose home field is nicknamed the Inferno because it has red FieldTurf.
</p>


Szczur, a liberal arts major, has also had to take a couple of final
examinations this week. No matter where he ends up in the spring, he
plans to take his last four courses at Villanova through the Internet
and graduate with his class in May. </p>


“This isn’t nearly as hard a decision as it was last year,” Szczur said.
“I was really stressing out about that, because I wanted to play
football. That was more of a stressful decision than this one. I feel I
have better options now.” </p>

thegreatone
12-23-2010, 05:32 PM
anyone got any small school guys there excited about this yr? Obviously Vlad Ducasse was my guy last yr, i was amped about, and then u had Akwasi owusu-ansah and a few others...

THis yr, theres a few guys i have heard about and have done alittle research on, guys like Benjamin Ilajana Olineman from Villanova, and also his teammate WR Matt Szczur, who is a absoulute weapon! He runs the wildcat, can throw the ball, Returns kicks and punts, and is a very good wideout, and hes a very exceptional athlete who was drafted by the CUBS in RD 5, giving him a decison to make... He was invited to the SR BOWL, and i am looking forward to seeing this kid, bigtime!!! Hes a great guy, as you'll see in this article, and may be just the type of versatile weapon our offense needs! Seriously, do some research on this kid, and you'll fall in love with his ability, and hes got good Size, hes a nice thick 205 lber standing 5ft 11inche's.. Very intriuging athlete... Read this article, its a good read


<div class="articleSpanImage">http://graphics8.nytimes.com/images/2010/12/17/sports/YVILLANOVA/YVILLANOVA-articleLarge.jpg
<div class="credit">Matt Rourke/Associated Press</div>
<p class="caption">Matt Szczur has a chance to sign with the Chicago Cubs, but then he’d miss the N.F.L. scouting combine. </p>
</div>
<h6 class="byline">By DAVE CALDWELL (http://topics.nytimes.com/top/reference/timestopics/people/c/dave_caldwell/index.html?inline=nyt-per)</h6>
<h6 class="dateline">Published: December 16, 2010</h6>

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Villanova’s Matt Szczur has had so much to do this year — play football
and baseball, provide bone marrow to a toddler with juvenile leukemia,
keep up with his schoolwork — that he sometimes wishes he had a
duplicate Matt Szczur (http://www.villanova.com/sports/m-basebl/mtt/szczur_matt00.html) to give him a hand. </p>
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Szczur, a wide receiver, likes to do it all, but he will have to make a
hard choice after he plays in the Senior Bowl next month. Szczur is also
a baseball player who was drafted in the fifth round last year by the Chicago Cubs (http://topics.nytimes.com/top/news/sports/baseball/majorleague/chicagocubs/index.html?inline=nyt-org).
If he commits to play only baseball by Feb. 10, in time for spring
training, he will receive a $500,000 bonus. That means he would miss the
N.F.L. (http://topics.nytimes.com/top/reference/timestopics/organizations/n/national_football_league/index.html?inline=nyt-org)’s scouting combine, which begins Feb. 23. </p>


“I’d rather see him play baseball,” his father, Marc, said this week, “but I just want him to be happy.” </p>


For Matt Szczur, whose last name sounds like Caesar, football makes him
happiest right now. And another championship is at stake. Villanova
(9-4), the reigning national champion in the Football Championship Subdivision (http://www.ncaa.com/brackets/2010/ncaa_bracket_FCS_football.html), formerly Division I-AA, will play a semifinal game against Eastern Washington (11-2) on Friday in Cheney, Wash. </p>


The winner will face either Delaware, Villanova’s archrival, or Georgia
Southern in the championship game Jan. 7 in Frisco, Tex. </p>


Szczur said this week that he was focused on Friday’s game more than whether he would choose football or baseball. </p>


“This is my senior year, and there was nothing better than winning the
national championship last year,” he said. “It’s a goal of ours not just
to repeat, but it’s a legacy we’re going for now.” </p>


Szczur, a senior from Erma, N.J., gained attention late in the 2009 season after the National Marrow Donor Program (http://www.marrow.org/) determined that his bone marrow was a match for a 13-month-old girl (http://www.nytimes.com/2009/12/05/sports/ncaafootball/05villanova.html?scp=1&amp;sq=szczur&amp;st=cse) with juvenile leukemia. </p>


Wildcats players have been tested since 1992 at the urging of Coach Andy Talley. </p>


A bone-marrow drive — called the Szczur Swab — is to be held in January
at Lower Cape May High School, Szczur’s alma mater. </p>


Szczur underwent the exhausting procedure to donate his marrow after his
junior football season, but it forced him to miss 10 baseball games in
the spring. He hit a home run in his last at-bat before the procedure
and an inside-the-park home run in his first at-bat after it. </p>


“He’s much prouder of that than anything else,” his father said of Szczur’s being able to help the girl. </p>


Szczur, an outfielder, batted .347 in 25 games for three Cubs minor
league affiliates last summer, but he sounds as if he is leaning toward
pursuing an N.F.L. career. He has been invited to the Senior Bowl on
Jan. 30 in Mobile, Ala. The game, Szczur said, will be a test run.
Talley has said he could be drafted as high as the third round. </p>


Szczur decided to attend Villanova over larger colleges like Vanderbilt, Duke (http://topics.nytimes.com/top/reference/timestopics/organizations/d/duke_university/index.html?inline=nyt-org)
and Rutgers because it offered him a better chance to play two sports.
Even after the Cubs drafted him, he decided he wanted to play his senior
football season at Villanova. He still wants to play both sports.
</p>


“Football is just a shorter window,” he said. “If I decide to play
baseball, I don’t think I would be able to go back to playing football.”
</p>


He was the most outstanding player in last year’s F.C.S. title game,
which Villanova won over Montana, but his senior season, at least until
Saturday, has not been as successful. Szczur missed six games with a
high ankle sprain and Villanova lost three of them. </p>


“There was a great morale lift when he came back,” Talley said. “He was like Superman.” </p>


Szczur, who is listed at 5 feet 11 inches and 205 pounds, does a little
of everything for the Wildcats. He catches a lot of passes, but he also
takes snaps in Villanova’s version of the wildcat offense, running or
throwing the ball, and he has returned punts and kickoffs. </p>


He played only the first half of Villanova’s regular-season finale on
Nov. 20 at Delaware, but he contributed enough to help the Wildcats beat
the Blue Hens, then ranked No. 1 in the country, 28-21 in overtime, to
squeak into the national playoffs. He also re-emerged as a vocal leader.
</p>


“It’s tough for any player who’s not playing much to say anything,” said Chris Whitney, the Villanova quarterback. </p>


In Villanova’s first playoff game, against Stephen F. Austin on Dec. 4,
Szczur rushed for 68 yards and caught 11 passes for 128 yards and a
touchdown in a come-from-behind victory in Nacogdoches, Tex. </p>


The next game was a one-man tour de force. Szczur scored four touchdowns
— three rushing and one receiving — and threw a touchdown pass in a
42-24 victory Saturday against Appalachian State in Boone, N.C.
Appalachian State, which won three straight national title from 2005-7,
was the top seed in the 20-team tournament. </p>


Football fans at Delaware and Villanova — two Colonial Athletic
Association universities that are only 40 miles apart — would be
delighted to see a rematch in the national championship game, but Szczur
will worry about that later. He has never played at Eastern Washington,
whose home field is nicknamed the Inferno because it has red FieldTurf.
</p>


Szczur, a liberal arts major, has also had to take a couple of final
examinations this week. No matter where he ends up in the spring, he
plans to take his last four courses at Villanova through the Internet
and graduate with his class in May. </p>


“This isn’t nearly as hard a decision as it was last year,” Szczur said.
“I was really stressing out about that, because I wanted to play
football. That was more of a stressful decision than this one. I feel I
have better options now.” </p>
i hate you. THIS IS MY GUY. love this kid and his ability to make a play is amazing. hope he plays football will be very ticked if he doesnt. i almost brought him up a few weeks ago but the n saw he had signed with a baseball team so figured he wasnt even thinking of entering the nfl.

Neverend
12-23-2010, 09:54 PM
Speaking of offensive playmakers, i like torrey smith. reminds me of percy harvin, amazing speed, electric burst, great acceleration.. he's going to be a GREAT returner in the NFL. He also had a monster game against north carolina</P>


tho doubt the giants take him. he's a 2nd round pick definitely. he's going to be electric in the nfl</P>

nycsportzfan
12-24-2010, 02:53 AM
ya, i've written his name once or twice on here myself... Hes definetly got "IT", it seems... A multi threat, from almost every skilled positon... Also, i like as i mentioned, that hes not a little teeny guy, hes up there at a respectable 5ft 11inch 205... I think hes got a chance to be a really solid player... Can't wait till the SR BOWL...

Redeyejedi
12-24-2010, 06:57 AM
I wonder with those suspensions for next year if those Ohio State players enter the NFL Draft.The LT Mike Adams is the prototypical NFL LT, guy is a monster. Posey is a 2-3rd round receiver.Pryor im not sure what he is. Im not convinced he can play QB in the NFL.Dan Herron to me is a mid round back.Personally I dont think he is better then his teamate Brandon Saine but Oh well.

thegreatone
12-24-2010, 09:26 AM
ya, i've written his name once or twice on here myself...* Hes definetly got "IT", it seems... A multi threat, from almost every skilled positon... Also, i like as i mentioned, that hes not a little teeny guy, hes up there at a respectable 5ft 11inch 205... I think hes got a chance to be a really solid player... Can't wait till the SR BOWL...
Wait, maybe it was you that brought him to my attention. Can't remember and wouldn't be the first time. Anyways I just really love this kid athletic ability. Reminds me of woodhead as in jack of all trades type guy. Didn't know he hadn't signed yet coulda swore I read he did.

Redeyejedi
12-24-2010, 10:11 AM
ya, i've written his name once or twice on here myself... Hes definetly got "IT", it seems... A multi threat, from almost every skilled positon... Also, i like as i mentioned, that hes not a little teeny guy, hes up there at a respectable 5ft 11inch 205... I think hes got a chance to be a really solid player... Can't wait till the SR BOWL...
Wait, maybe it was you that brought him to my attention. Can't remember and wouldn't be the first time. Anyways I just really love this kid athletic ability. Reminds me of woodhead as in jack of all trades type guy. Didn't know he hadn't signed yet coulda swore I read he did.Yeah he is a nice player but he is a junior. Maryland has a few nice players but there all underclassmen. Its hard to predict whats going to happen in this draft because of the CBA. It could end up being a very weak draft if a lot of these guys stay put. I really like there safety Kenny Tate as well the kid is a monster. He is 6-4 225 and runs the 40 at 4.55. If he comes out he will be right near the top of the safeties I want and maybe the top 1. 84 tackles, 4 sacks , 3 interceptions.

nycsportzfan
12-24-2010, 01:22 PM
SPeaking of small school studs.. lets not forget about this little guy with big play potential... Anthony Gaitor, the CB from FIU....


<font size="+1">•</font> Florida International CB Anthony Gaitor
(5-10, 178, 4.53): Toledo will see plenty of this slight defensive
back's cover skills (11 career INTs) and ability around the line in run
support and blitzes (8.5 TFL, three sacks).

lawl
12-28-2010, 12:33 AM
Really thinka goal this offseasonneeds tobeanincrease in our overall team speed.

myles2424
12-28-2010, 01:17 PM
Really thinka goal this offseasonneeds tobeanincrease in our overall team speed.</P>


Speed sounds nice.....But I want some guys that realy love football &amp; that are leaders....Im Sick of these clowns either giving up &amp; getting pushed around....</P>

CGYgiant
12-28-2010, 06:44 PM
any players to look for in todays bowl games?

Redeyejedi
12-28-2010, 10:00 PM
any players to look for in todays bowl games?
</P>


George Bryan,TE,NC State (JR) </P>


One of the onlygood TE prospects and he isnt a lock to come out. If he does he would probably be number 2 on my prospect list at TE. Has the size to be a very effective well rounded TE.</P>


http://www.opposingviews.com/i/2010-11-nfl-draft-prospect-games-champs-bowl-insight-bowl</P>


. Robert Sands, S, West Virginia (JR)
A much improved player over this season, Sands has moved from a decent in the box safety to a rangy threat against the run and pass. He’s become a more reliable tackler, he’s shown he can defend backs and tight ends man to man, and has made many plays in short and mid-range coverage. He’ll need to show instincts and the ability to stay at home against a nimble quarterback. </P>


Russell Wilson, QB, NC State (JR)
A top baseball prospect who played this past baseball season and likely will try it out again this football off-season, Wilson may want to throw his hat into the NFL and see if he can stick. He moves very well, great accuracy and touch, and can also play in the pocket. His size and arm will hurt as well as sometimes inconsistent play, but he should make it very frustrating for the Mountaineers. </P>


Noel Devine, RB, West Virginia
A lightening quick back who will likely have to be a situational back at the next level, he has shown a very impressive burst out of the hole and the deep speed to score on any play. He can’t carry the full time load in the NFL and has Darren Sproles-type potential, but he should be a handful for this NC State team. </P>


Owen Spencer, WR, NCState
He and Russell Wilson have had great chemistry all season, and Spencer development as a pass catcher as well as his draft stock have gone up significantly throughout the year. Spencer has used great routes and catching the ball at the highest point to out perform his cornerbacks, and I expect another big game from Spencer to cap over his career at NC State. </P>


Nate Irving, ILB, NCState
After a few devastating injuries over the early part of his career, Irving has proved, at least on the field, that he has just about fully recovered and has been a force all season long for this defense. He’s a consistent tackler with great range, and his athletic ability and hips likely make him a fit for most defenses at the next level. </P>


Brandon Hogan, CB, West Virginia
Hogan has dealt with injuries and a suspension for the early part of the year, but he should be ready to go to cap off his senior season at West Virginia as he hopes to regain the draft stock that he lost. Hogan has the hips and ball skills to be a starter at the next level, but he’ll need to show the consistent speed, jumping ability, and tackling ability if he hopes to go in the first three rounds. </P>


Scooter Berry, DT, West Virginia
Another Mountaineer who I’ve seen develop over the past two seasons, better is a perfect fit for a 3-4 defense at the next level. He doesn’t have a huge range of moves, but he moves well for his size, can get in the backfield, and can take up two defenders. He’ll try and set up this pass rush against NC State and has done well all season at helping his linebackers get into the backfield.</P>


Julian Miller, DE, West Virginia (JR)
My personal favorite from the Big East conference as far as surprisingly high prospects go, I scouted him in-depthly myself over the past two seasons, and I believe that he can be a very solid pass rusher at the next level in the right system. He hasn’t been as consistent of a threat as you’d like, but he should be the lead man getting pressure on Russell Wilson in this one.
<SPAN style="TEXT-DECORATION: underline">
Missouri</SPAN><SPAN style="TEXT-DECORATION: underline"> Tigers vs. </SPAN><SPAN style="TEXT-DECORATION: underline">Iowa</SPAN><SPAN style="TEXT-DECORATION: underline"> Hawkeyes – Insight Bowl</SPAN> </P>


Adrian Clayborn, DE, Iowa
At one point early in the draft season, Clayborn was the clear cut top defensive player in the country. But his lack of great production and other players emerging, he’s fallen slightly. Still, his ability to fit in a 3-4 or 4-3 defense at defensive end and his range of pass rush moves still makes him a 1<SUP>st</SUP> rounder and a likely problem for the Missouri Tigers. </P>


Blaine Gabbert, QB, Missouri (JR)
Since he took over for Chase Daniel, Gabbert has been extremely impressive with his arm strength, deep accuracy, and ability to make plays when the offensive line breaks down. He hasn’t been all that consistent over his career, but he has the size, arm, touch, and technique to be a starting quarterback in the NFL. He’ll have a chance to showcase his mobility in this one against a tough Iowa pass rush. </P>


Christian Ballard, DT, Iowa
He’s been overshadowed at times because of the defensive end production, but Ballard has been a force inside for this defense over the past two years. He has a few pass rush moves and engages well by keeping a low base, but he needs to show he can get in the backfield with more consistency and can stay at home against a team that runs quick routes, draws, and screen passes. </P>


Tyler Sash, S, Iowa (JR)
While some have viewed Sash as a possible 1<SUP>st</SUP>-2<SUP>nd</SUP> round safety prospect because of his range, tackling ability, and mid range ball skills, Sash still has to prove, to me at least, that he can defend the deep pass as well as be more consistent in quick man coverage. He’ll have that chance against the pass happy Missouri team. </P>


Tim Barnes, C, Missouri
One of the better senior centers in the country, Barnes has been a leader for this team for the past two seasons and has done a great job in getting to the second level for the inside running game. He’ll have a tough job setting his teammates up on the offensive line against one of the best in the country, and he’ll likely have the most to gain from this game. </P>


Ricky Stanzi, QB, Iowa
Stanzi has not been physically impressive over the season and over his career, but he has the ability to keep his eyes down field and make a good throw in the short and mid-range area from different platforms and arm angles. Stanzi will likely struggle to have a shot at the NFL, but because of his winning ways and his scrappiness as a passer, he could get a look and should be a viable threat for this inconsistent Missouri secondary.</P>

lawl
12-29-2010, 02:04 PM
So if Kiwi walks, and Osi gets dealt. Chances of us drafting a DE in the 1st two rounds are...?

CGYgiant
12-29-2010, 04:38 PM
any players to look for in todays bowl games?
</p>


George Bryan,TE,NC State (JR) </p>


One of the onlygood TE prospects and he isnt a lock to come out. If he does he would probably be number 2 on my prospect list at TE. Has the size to be a very effective well rounded TE.</p>


http://www.opposingviews.com/i/2010-11-nfl-draft-prospect-games-champs-bowl-insight-bowl</p>


. Robert Sands, S, West Virginia (JR)
A much improved player over this season, Sands has moved from a decent in the box safety to a rangy threat against the run and pass. He’s become a more reliable tackler, he’s shown he can defend backs and tight ends man to man, and has made many plays in short and mid-range coverage. He’ll need to show instincts and the ability to stay at home against a nimble quarterback. </p>


Russell Wilson, QB, NC State (JR)
A top baseball prospect who played this past baseball season and likely will try it out again this football off-season, Wilson may want to throw his hat into the NFL and see if he can stick. He moves very well, great accuracy and touch, and can also play in the pocket. His size and arm will hurt as well as sometimes inconsistent play, but he should make it very frustrating for the Mountaineers. </p>


Noel Devine, RB, West Virginia
A lightening quick back who will likely have to be a situational back at the next level, he has shown a very impressive burst out of the hole and the deep speed to score on any play. He can’t carry the full time load in the NFL and has Darren Sproles-type potential, but he should be a handful for this NC State team. </p>


Owen Spencer, WR, NCState
He and Russell Wilson have had great chemistry all season, and Spencer development as a pass catcher as well as his draft stock have gone up significantly throughout the year. Spencer has used great routes and catching the ball at the highest point to out perform his cornerbacks, and I expect another big game from Spencer to cap over his career at NC State. </p>


Nate Irving, ILB, NCState
After a few devastating injuries over the early part of his career, Irving has proved, at least on the field, that he has just about fully recovered and has been a force all season long for this defense. He’s a consistent tackler with great range, and his athletic ability and hips likely make him a fit for most defenses at the next level. </p>


Brandon Hogan, CB, West Virginia
Hogan has dealt with injuries and a suspension for the early part of the year, but he should be ready to go to cap off his senior season at West Virginia as he hopes to regain the draft stock that he lost. Hogan has the hips and ball skills to be a starter at the next level, but he’ll need to show the consistent speed, jumping ability, and tackling ability if he hopes to go in the first three rounds. </p>


Scooter Berry, DT, West Virginia
Another Mountaineer who I’ve seen develop over the past two seasons, better is a perfect fit for a 3-4 defense at the next level. He doesn’t have a huge range of moves, but he moves well for his size, can get in the backfield, and can take up two defenders. He’ll try and set up this pass rush against NC State and has done well all season at helping his linebackers get into the backfield.</p>


Julian Miller, DE, West Virginia (JR)
My personal favorite from the Big East conference as far as surprisingly high prospects go, I scouted him in-depthly myself over the past two seasons, and I believe that he can be a very solid pass rusher at the next level in the right system. He hasn’t been as consistent of a threat as you’d like, but he should be the lead man getting pressure on Russell Wilson in this one.
<span style="text-decoration: underline;">
Missouri</span><span style="text-decoration: underline;"> Tigers vs. </span><span style="text-decoration: underline;">Iowa</span><span style="text-decoration: underline;"> Hawkeyes – Insight Bowl</span> </p>


Adrian Clayborn, DE, Iowa
At one point early in the draft season, Clayborn was the clear cut top defensive player in the country. But his lack of great production and other players emerging, he’s fallen slightly. Still, his ability to fit in a 3-4 or 4-3 defense at defensive end and his range of pass rush moves still makes him a 1<sup>st</sup> rounder and a likely problem for the Missouri Tigers. </p>


Blaine Gabbert, QB, Missouri (JR)
Since he took over for Chase Daniel, Gabbert has been extremely impressive with his arm strength, deep accuracy, and ability to make plays when the offensive line breaks down. He hasn’t been all that consistent over his career, but he has the size, arm, touch, and technique to be a starting quarterback in the NFL. He’ll have a chance to showcase his mobility in this one against a tough Iowa pass rush. </p>


Christian Ballard, DT, Iowa
He’s been overshadowed at times because of the defensive end production, but Ballard has been a force inside for this defense over the past two years. He has a few pass rush moves and engages well by keeping a low base, but he needs to show he can get in the backfield with more consistency and can stay at home against a team that runs quick routes, draws, and screen passes. </p>


Tyler Sash, S, Iowa (JR)
While some have viewed Sash as a possible 1<sup>st</sup>-2<sup>nd</sup> round safety prospect because of his range, tackling ability, and mid range ball skills, Sash still has to prove, to me at least, that he can defend the deep pass as well as be more consistent in quick man coverage. He’ll have that chance against the pass happy Missouri team. </p>


Tim Barnes, C, Missouri
One of the better senior centers in the country, Barnes has been a leader for this team for the past two seasons and has done a great job in getting to the second level for the inside running game. He’ll have a tough job setting his teammates up on the offensive line against one of the best in the country, and he’ll likely have the most to gain from this game. </p>


Ricky Stanzi, QB, Iowa
Stanzi has not been physically impressive over the season and over his career, but he has the ability to keep his eyes down field and make a good throw in the short and mid-range area from different platforms and arm angles. Stanzi will likely struggle to have a shot at the NFL, but because of his winning ways and his scrappiness as a passer, he could get a look and should be a viable threat for this inconsistent Missouri secondary.</p>

thanks dude this actually really helped, being up in Canada, american college football is rarely seen so again thanks. That Devine kid is incredibly fast wow

how about in todays games? I know tommorows games look better (i think) but it would be nice to know which players (games) to look forward too.

SuperMario82
12-29-2010, 04:50 PM
I hope we can snag Dwayne Harris. Hes such a weapon on STs

Redeyejedi
12-29-2010, 09:07 PM
The more I think about the Tackles in this draft the more I think Demarcus Love of Arkansas may be the best pick. He can play both sides and does so often. Arkansas employs a Weakside/ Strongside Tacklewith Love as the weaksidetackle so he rarely has TE help. Love seems like a guy that they could use at Guard and be a very effective one at that. The Giants value this type of versatility out of there lineman. He has very good size and bulk and may have the most upside out of these O-lineman. I have a feeling once the draft approaches Love is going to be a guy that rises. I think he would be a very solid pick.As a second round pick he is a steal but I think as the draft approaches he will be a first rounder

Redeyejedi
12-29-2010, 09:37 PM
A couple things from the Milatary Bowl. Maryland has some very solid players on there roster. The son of former Giant Dave Megget "Davin Megget" is a player I will be watching intentlynext season out of curiosity "I loved his father as a kidto bad he turned out to be a rapist ". Da'rell Scott is a very solid mid round RB prospect. Ive had an eye on him because he has some pop but is a better inside runner then he gets credit for, hell of a game today. Ive spoke a few times of Marylands Kenny Tate a 6-4 220 pound safety who will be the near the top of my board if he decides to come out. Tremendous athleticism and size and is good in coverage despite his height.</P>


Martez Wilson MLB Illinois- Is a guy I would watch intently. </P>


http://www.opposingviews.com/i/2011-nfl-draft-prospects-bowl-previews-military-texas-alamo</P>


Goodjob by by NFL House (http://www.opposingviews.com/users/nfl-house)
</P>


<SPAN style="TEXT-DECORATION: underline">East Carolina</SPAN><SPAN style="TEXT-DECORATION: underline"> Pirates vs. </SPAN><SPAN style="TEXT-DECORATION: underline">Maryland</SPAN><SPAN style="TEXT-DECORATION: underline"> Terrapins – Military Bowl
</SPAN>
Alex Wujciak, ILB, Maryland
One of the top <FONT style="FONT-WEIGHT: 400; COLOR: blue! important; FONT-FAMILY: Arial, Helvetica, clean, sans-serif; POSITION: static" color=blue><SPAN class=kLink style="FONT-WEIGHT: 400; COLOR: blue! important; BORDER-BOTTOM: blue 1px solid; FONT-FAMILY: Arial, Helvetica, clean, sans-serif; POSITION: relative; BACKGROUND-COLOR: transparent">linebackers</SPAN></FONT> (http://www.opposingviews.com/i/2011-nfl-draft-prospects-bowl-previews-military-texas-alamo#) in Maryland history and maybe the top ACC, production-wise, linebacker over the past three years, Wujciak has improved each year with his range, zone coverage ability, and blitzing ability. He’ll need to showcase those improvements with a very versatile, passing offense of ECU.</P>


Da’Rel Scott, RB, Maryland
Scott impressed me last season with his tough running ability to break tackles at the second level and get up field. However, he’s dealt with minor injuries, lack of great second level blocking, and an inability to break off numerous big plays this year. He’ll need to control the ball if coach Ralph Fridgen hopes to end his Maryland career with a win.</P>


Dwayne Harris, WR, East Carolina
Junior quarterback Dominique Davis has really helped Harris’s draft prospects by giving him numerous deep ball plays and really helping him get open with throws. Harris seems much more comfortable in deep and mid range routes, and has become a more reliable ball grabber.</P>


<SPAN style="TEXT-DECORATION: underline">Illinois</SPAN><SPAN style="TEXT-DECORATION: underline"> <FONT style="FONT-WEIGHT: 700; COLOR: blue! important; FONT-FAMILY: Arial, Helvetica, clean, sans-serif; POSITION: static" color=blue><SPAN class=kLink style="FONT-WEIGHT: 700; COLOR: blue! important; FONT-FAMILY: Arial, Helvetica, clean, sans-serif; POSITION: relative">Fighting </SPAN><SPAN class=kLink style="FONT-WEIGHT: 700; COLOR: blue! important; FONT-FAMILY: Arial, Helvetica, clean, sans-serif; POSITION: relative">Illini</SPAN></FONT> (http://www.opposingviews.com/i/2011-nfl-draft-prospects-bowl-previews-military-texas-alamo#) vs. Baylor Bears – </SPAN><SPAN style="TEXT-DECORATION: underline">Texas</SPAN><SPAN style="TEXT-DECORATION: underline"> Bowl</SPAN></P>


Danny Watkins, OT, Baylor
An <FONT style="FONT-WEIGHT: 400; COLOR: blue! important; FONT-FAMILY: Arial, Helvetica, clean, sans-serif; POSITION: static" color=blue><SPAN class=kLink style="FONT-WEIGHT: 400; COLOR: blue! important; FONT-FAMILY: Arial, Helvetica, clean, sans-serif; POSITION: relative">athletic</SPAN></FONT> (http://www.opposingviews.com/i/2011-nfl-draft-prospects-bowl-previews-military-texas-alamo#) tackle that has shown off his movement all season, Watkins has been huge this year in his ability to block on the move and allow quarterback Robert Griffin to both develop as a pocket passer as well as give his run game some extra support. He could play left tackle in the right system in the NFL, and could be a mid round pick because of it.</P>


Phil Taylor, DT, Baylor
Another lineman who has improved over the season, Taylor has shown that he can both absorb two blockers as well as take advantage of one on ones to get in the backfield. He isn’t a dynamic <FONT style="FONT-WEIGHT: 400; COLOR: blue! important; FONT-FAMILY: Arial, Helvetica, clean, sans-serif; POSITION: static" color=blue><SPAN class=kLink style="FONT-WEIGHT: 400; COLOR: blue! important; FONT-FAMILY: Arial, Helvetica, clean, sans-serif; POSITION: relative">athlete</SPAN></FONT> (http://www.opposingviews.com/i/2011-nfl-draft-prospects-bowl-previews-military-texas-alamo#) and will need to improve his moves if he hopes to be a starter at the NFL level.</P>


Martez Wilson, ILB, Illinois (JR)
One of the top prospects coming out of high school, some off the field and injury issues have derailed what could have been a future 1<SUP>st</SUP> round pick dream. Still, Wilson’s athletic ability and movement in space means that if he declares, he could be a mid round pick who could develop in the pros. Most scouts, however, likely hope he stays for another season.

Nate Bussey, OLB, Illinois
Not as athletically gifted or consistent as Wilson has been over his career, Bussey has been a consistent threat on the outside, both with his tackle-to-sideline range and his blitzing off the edge skills improving. He’ll struggle to make the NFL, but he will be crucial in keeping Robert Griffin of Baylor in the pocket.</P>


<SPAN style="TEXT-DECORATION: underline">Oklahoma</SPAN><SPAN style="TEXT-DECORATION: underline"> </SPAN><SPAN style="TEXT-DECORATION: underline">State</SPAN><SPAN style="TEXT-DECORATION: underline"> Cowboys vs. </SPAN><SPAN style="TEXT-DECORATION: underline">Arizona</SPAN><SPAN style="TEXT-DECORATION: underline"> Wildcats – </SPAN><SPAN style="TEXT-DECORATION: underline">Alamo</SPAN><SPAN style="TEXT-DECORATION: underline"> Bowl</SPAN></P>


Justin Blackmon, WR, Oklahoma State (RS SO)
Coming into the season, Blackmon was ready to take over for Dez Bryant as the team’s new feature receiver and a receiver with a bright future. Now, however, after having one of the most productive season’s in <FONT style="FONT-WEIGHT: 400; COLOR: blue! important; FONT-FAMILY: Arial, Helvetica, clean, sans-serif; POSITION: static" color=blue><SPAN class=kLink style="FONT-WEIGHT: 400; COLOR: blue! important; FONT-FAMILY: Arial, Helvetica, clean, sans-serif; POSITION: relative">college </SPAN><SPAN class=kLink style="FONT-WEIGHT: 400; COLOR: blue! important; FONT-FAMILY: Arial, Helvetica, clean, sans-serif; POSITION: relative">football</SPAN></FONT> (http://www.opposingviews.com/i/2011-nfl-draft-prospects-bowl-previews-military-texas-alamo#) history as a receiver and return man, he’s eyeing Dez Bryant as being the higher of the two when it comes to draft area. If he declares, he could be looking at the middle to latter part of the 1<SUP>st</SUP> round.</P>


Nick Foles, QB, Arizona (JR)
While he’s already come out and said it’s very unlikely he’ll declare for the draft, he’d be a solid 2<SUP>nd</SUP> rounder if he did. Foles has become a very solid pocket passer with improved deep touch and confidence in the pocket. He does have trouble moving to his left side as well as making something out of good pass rush, both of which he’ll likely have a shot to prove wrong in this one.</P>


Kendall Hunter, RB, Oklahoma State
Hunter would have been considered to be a mid rounder last year if he declared if it wasn’t for an early season injury that kept him out much of the year, he has shown his NFL speed and quickness that could still make him a mid round pick thanks to a very productive season this year.</P>


Colin Baxter, C, Arizona
One of the better, more consistent centers in the country and over his career, Baxter has been known to be a team leader in the locker room and has contributed to the development of Adam Grant as well as the defensive lineman for this team. He moves well on the move, but his struggles against bigger <FONT style="FONT-WEIGHT: 400; COLOR: blue! important; FONT-FAMILY: Arial, Helvetica, clean, sans-serif; POSITION: static" color=blue><SPAN class=kLink style="FONT-WEIGHT: 400; COLOR: blue! important; FONT-FAMILY: Arial, Helvetica, clean, sans-serif; POSITION: relative">nose </SPAN><SPAN class=kLink style="FONT-WEIGHT: 400; COLOR: blue! important; FONT-FAMILY: Arial, Helvetica, clean, sans-serif; POSITION: relative">tackles</SPAN></FONT> (http://www.opposingviews.com/i/2011-nfl-draft-prospects-bowl-previews-military-texas-alamo#) as well as his inconsistent blocking against blitzers.</P>


Brandon Weeden, QB, Oklahoma State (JR)
Check out our article on Weeden HERE. While based on his play this year and his remaining year of eligibility, he should stay in college, things are unique for Weeden because of his age. Still, if he does declare, he could be a middle to late round pick, and should be able to utilize his weapons on offense enough, as he’s done all year, to lead his team to a victory in what could be the big three’s final game.</P>


Adam Grant, OT, Arizona
A likely right tackle or guard at the next level, he’s very similar to a lesser version of former Arizona tackle Eben Britton, currently in the NFL. He doesn’t have great feet for pass blocking, but he can get the job done, and can run block well with good leverage. He’ll likely have to focus on the pass rush in this game that likely will be a shootout.</P>


Ugo Chinasa, DE, Oklahoma State
Quite a productive defensive end over his career, he’s been the reason over his career why many teams can’t keep up with the Cowboys and their offense. He’s a bit undersized to be a standard NFL defensive end in a 4-3 scheme, but could be a good pass rusher at the next level, and should be a good match-up against Adam Grant in getting to quarterback Nick Foles</P>


</P>

CGYgiant
12-30-2010, 12:39 AM
A couple things from the Milatary Bowl. Maryland has some very solid players on there roster. The son of former Giant Dave Megget "Davin Megget" is a player I will be watching intentlynext season out of curiosity "I loved his father as a kidto bad he turned out to be a rapist ". Da'rell Scott is a very solid mid round RB prospect. Ive had an eye on him because he has some pop but is a better inside runner then he gets credit for, hell of a game today. Ive spoke a few times of Marylands Kenny Tate a 6-4 220 pound safety who will be the near the top of my board if he decides to come out. Tremendous athleticism and size and is good in coverage despite his height.</p>


Martez Wilson MLB Illinois- Is a guy I would watch intently. </p>


http://www.opposingviews.com/i/2011-nfl-draft-prospects-bowl-previews-military-texas-alamo</p>


Goodjob by by NFL House (http://www.opposingviews.com/users/nfl-house)
</p>


<span style="text-decoration: underline;">East Carolina</span><span style="text-decoration: underline;"> Pirates vs. </span><span style="text-decoration: underline;">Maryland</span><span style="text-decoration: underline;"> Terrapins – Military Bowl
</span>
Alex Wujciak, ILB, Maryland
One of the top <font style="font-weight: 400; color: blue ! important; font-family: Arial,Helvetica,clean,sans-serif; position: static;" color="blue"><span class="kLink" style="font-weight: 400; color: blue ! important; border-bottom: 1px solid blue; font-family: Arial,Helvetica,clean,sans-serif; position: relative; background-color: transparent;">linebackers</span></font> (http://www.opposingviews.com/i/2011-nfl-draft-prospects-bowl-previews-military-texas-alamo#) in Maryland history and maybe the top ACC, production-wise, linebacker over the past three years, Wujciak has improved each year with his range, zone coverage ability, and blitzing ability. He’ll need to showcase those improvements with a very versatile, passing offense of ECU.</p>


Da’Rel Scott, RB, Maryland
Scott impressed me last season with his tough running ability to break tackles at the second level and get up field. However, he’s dealt with minor injuries, lack of great second level blocking, and an inability to break off numerous big plays this year. He’ll need to control the ball if coach Ralph Fridgen hopes to end his Maryland career with a win.</p>


Dwayne Harris, WR, East Carolina
Junior quarterback Dominique Davis has really helped Harris’s draft prospects by giving him numerous deep ball plays and really helping him get open with throws. Harris seems much more comfortable in deep and mid range routes, and has become a more reliable ball grabber.</p>


<span style="text-decoration: underline;">Illinois</span><span style="text-decoration: underline;"> <font style="font-weight: 700; color: blue ! important; font-family: Arial,Helvetica,clean,sans-serif; position: static;" color="blue"><span class="kLink" style="font-weight: 700; color: blue ! important; font-family: Arial,Helvetica,clean,sans-serif; position: relative;">Fighting </span><span class="kLink" style="font-weight: 700; color: blue ! important; font-family: Arial,Helvetica,clean,sans-serif; position: relative;">Illini</span></font> (http://www.opposingviews.com/i/2011-nfl-draft-prospects-bowl-previews-military-texas-alamo#) vs. Baylor Bears – </span><span style="text-decoration: underline;">Texas</span><span style="text-decoration: underline;"> Bowl</span></p>


Danny Watkins, OT, Baylor
An <font style="font-weight: 400; color: blue ! important; font-family: Arial,Helvetica,clean,sans-serif; position: static;" color="blue"><span class="kLink" style="font-weight: 400; color: blue ! important; font-family: Arial,Helvetica,clean,sans-serif; position: relative;">athletic</span></font> (http://www.opposingviews.com/i/2011-nfl-draft-prospects-bowl-previews-military-texas-alamo#) tackle that has shown off his movement all season, Watkins has been huge this year in his ability to block on the move and allow quarterback Robert Griffin to both develop as a pocket passer as well as give his run game some extra support. He could play left tackle in the right system in the NFL, and could be a mid round pick because of it.</p>


Phil Taylor, DT, Baylor
Another lineman who has improved over the season, Taylor has shown that he can both absorb two blockers as well as take advantage of one on ones to get in the backfield. He isn’t a dynamic <font style="font-weight: 400; color: blue ! important; font-family: Arial,Helvetica,clean,sans-serif; position: static;" color="blue"><span class="kLink" style="font-weight: 400; color: blue ! important; font-family: Arial,Helvetica,clean,sans-serif; position: relative;">athlete</span></font> (http://www.opposingviews.com/i/2011-nfl-draft-prospects-bowl-previews-military-texas-alamo#) and will need to improve his moves if he hopes to be a starter at the NFL level.</p>


Martez Wilson, ILB, Illinois (JR)
One of the top prospects coming out of high school, some off the field and injury issues have derailed what could have been a future 1<sup>st</sup> round pick dream. Still, Wilson’s athletic ability and movement in space means that if he declares, he could be a mid round pick who could develop in the pros. Most scouts, however, likely hope he stays for another season.

Nate Bussey, OLB, Illinois
Not as athletically gifted or consistent as Wilson has been over his career, Bussey has been a consistent threat on the outside, both with his tackle-to-sideline range and his blitzing off the edge skills improving. He’ll struggle to make the NFL, but he will be crucial in keeping Robert Griffin of Baylor in the pocket.</p>


<span style="text-decoration: underline;">Oklahoma</span><span style="text-decoration: underline;"> </span><span style="text-decoration: underline;">State</span><span style="text-decoration: underline;"> Cowboys vs. </span><span style="text-decoration: underline;">Arizona</span><span style="text-decoration: underline;"> Wildcats – </span><span style="text-decoration: underline;">Alamo</span><span style="text-decoration: underline;"> Bowl</span></p>


Justin Blackmon, WR, Oklahoma State (RS SO)
Coming into the season, Blackmon was ready to take over for Dez Bryant as the team’s new feature receiver and a receiver with a bright future. Now, however, after having one of the most productive season’s in <font style="font-weight: 400; color: blue ! important; font-family: Arial,Helvetica,clean,sans-serif; position: static;" color="blue"><span class="kLink" style="font-weight: 400; color: blue ! important; font-family: Arial,Helvetica,clean,sans-serif; position: relative;">college </span><span class="kLink" style="font-weight: 400; color: blue ! important; font-family: Arial,Helvetica,clean,sans-serif; position: relative;">football</span></font> (http://www.opposingviews.com/i/2011-nfl-draft-prospects-bowl-previews-military-texas-alamo#) history as a receiver and return man, he’s eyeing Dez Bryant as being the higher of the two when it comes to draft area. If he declares, he could be looking at the middle to latter part of the 1<sup>st</sup> round.</p>


Nick Foles, QB, Arizona (JR)
While he’s already come out and said it’s very unlikely he’ll declare for the draft, he’d be a solid 2<sup>nd</sup> rounder if he did. Foles has become a very solid pocket passer with improved deep touch and confidence in the pocket. He does have trouble moving to his left side as well as making something out of good pass rush, both of which he’ll likely have a shot to prove wrong in this one.</p>


Kendall Hunter, RB, Oklahoma State
Hunter would have been considered to be a mid rounder last year if he declared if it wasn’t for an early season injury that kept him out much of the year, he has shown his NFL speed and quickness that could still make him a mid round pick thanks to a very productive season this year.</p>


Colin Baxter, C, Arizona
One of the better, more consistent centers in the country and over his career, Baxter has been known to be a team leader in the locker room and has contributed to the development of Adam Grant as well as the defensive lineman for this team. He moves well on the move, but his struggles against bigger <font style="font-weight: 400; color: blue ! important; font-family: Arial,Helvetica,clean,sans-serif; position: static;" color="blue"><span class="kLink" style="font-weight: 400; color: blue ! important; font-family: Arial,Helvetica,clean,sans-serif; position: relative;">nose </span><span class="kLink" style="font-weight: 400; color: blue ! important; font-family: Arial,Helvetica,clean,sans-serif; position: relative;">tackles</span></font> (http://www.opposingviews.com/i/2011-nfl-draft-prospects-bowl-previews-military-texas-alamo#) as well as his inconsistent blocking against blitzers.</p>


Brandon Weeden, QB, Oklahoma State (JR)
Check out our article on Weeden HERE. While based on his play this year and his remaining year of eligibility, he should stay in college, things are unique for Weeden because of his age. Still, if he does declare, he could be a middle to late round pick, and should be able to utilize his weapons on offense enough, as he’s done all year, to lead his team to a victory in what could be the big three’s final game.</p>


Adam Grant, OT, Arizona
A likely right tackle or guard at the next level, he’s very similar to a lesser version of former Arizona tackle Eben Britton, currently in the NFL. He doesn’t have great feet for pass blocking, but he can get the job done, and can run block well with good leverage. He’ll likely have to focus on the pass rush in this game that likely will be a shootout.</p>


Ugo Chinasa, DE, Oklahoma State
Quite a productive defensive end over his career, he’s been the reason over his career why many teams can’t keep up with the Cowboys and their offense. He’s a bit undersized to be a standard NFL defensive end in a 4-3 scheme, but could be a good pass rusher at the next level, and should be a good match-up against Adam Grant in getting to quarterback Nick Foles</p>


</p>

Justin Blackmon is a beast, why isn't he getting the hype that Dez was?

Redeyejedi
12-30-2010, 01:02 AM
A couple things from the Milatary Bowl. Maryland has some very solid players on there roster. The son of former Giant Dave Megget "Davin Megget" is a player I will be watching intentlynext season out of curiosity "I loved his father as a kidto bad he turned out to be a rapist ". Da'rell Scott is a very solid mid round RB prospect. Ive had an eye on him because he has some pop but is a better inside runner then he gets credit for, hell of a game today. Ive spoke a few times of Marylands Kenny Tate a 6-4 220 pound safety who will be the near the top of my board if he decides to come out. Tremendous athleticism and size and is good in coverage despite his height.</P>


Martez Wilson MLB Illinois- Is a guy I would watch intently. </P>


http://www.opposingviews.com/i/2011-nfl-draft-prospects-bowl-previews-military-texas-alamo</P>


Goodjob by by NFL House (http://www.opposingviews.com/users/nfl-house)
</P>


<SPAN style="TEXT-DECORATION: underline">East Carolina</SPAN><SPAN style="TEXT-DECORATION: underline"> Pirates vs. </SPAN><SPAN style="TEXT-DECORATION: underline">Maryland</SPAN><SPAN style="TEXT-DECORATION: underline"> Terrapins – Military Bowl
</SPAN>
Alex Wujciak, ILB, Maryland
One of the top <FONT style="FONT-WEIGHT: 400; COLOR: blue! important; FONT-FAMILY: Arial,Helvetica,clean,sans-serif; POSITION: static" color=blue><SPAN class=kLink style="FONT-WEIGHT: 400; COLOR: blue! important; BORDER-BOTTOM: blue 1px solid; FONT-FAMILY: Arial,Helvetica,clean,sans-serif; POSITION: relative; BACKGROUND-COLOR: transparent">linebackers</SPAN></FONT> (http://www.opposingviews.com/i/2011-nfl-draft-prospects-bowl-previews-military-texas-alamo#) in Maryland history and maybe the top ACC, production-wise, linebacker over the past three years, Wujciak has improved each year with his range, zone coverage ability, and blitzing ability. He’ll need to showcase those improvements with a very versatile, passing offense of ECU.</P>


Da’Rel Scott, RB, Maryland
Scott impressed me last season with his tough running ability to break tackles at the second level and get up field. However, he’s dealt with minor injuries, lack of great second level blocking, and an inability to break off numerous big plays this year. He’ll need to control the ball if coach Ralph Fridgen hopes to end his Maryland career with a win.</P>


Dwayne Harris, WR, East Carolina
Junior quarterback Dominique Davis has really helped Harris’s draft prospects by giving him numerous deep ball plays and really helping him get open with throws. Harris seems much more comfortable in deep and mid range routes, and has become a more reliable ball grabber.</P>


<SPAN style="TEXT-DECORATION: underline">Illinois</SPAN><SPAN style="TEXT-DECORATION: underline"> <FONT style="FONT-WEIGHT: 700; COLOR: blue! important; FONT-FAMILY: Arial,Helvetica,clean,sans-serif; POSITION: static" color=blue><SPAN class=kLink style="FONT-WEIGHT: 700; COLOR: blue! important; FONT-FAMILY: Arial,Helvetica,clean,sans-serif; POSITION: relative">Fighting </SPAN><SPAN class=kLink style="FONT-WEIGHT: 700; COLOR: blue! important; FONT-FAMILY: Arial,Helvetica,clean,sans-serif; POSITION: relative">Illini</SPAN></FONT> (http://www.opposingviews.com/i/2011-nfl-draft-prospects-bowl-previews-military-texas-alamo#) vs. Baylor Bears – </SPAN><SPAN style="TEXT-DECORATION: underline">Texas</SPAN><SPAN style="TEXT-DECORATION: underline"> Bowl</SPAN></P>


Danny Watkins, OT, Baylor
An <FONT style="FONT-WEIGHT: 400; COLOR: blue! important; FONT-FAMILY: Arial,Helvetica,clean,sans-serif; POSITION: static" color=blue><SPAN class=kLink style="FONT-WEIGHT: 400; COLOR: blue! important; FONT-FAMILY: Arial,Helvetica,clean,sans-serif; POSITION: relative">athletic</SPAN></FONT> (http://www.opposingviews.com/i/2011-nfl-draft-prospects-bowl-previews-military-texas-alamo#) tackle that has shown off his movement all season, Watkins has been huge this year in his ability to block on the move and allow quarterback Robert Griffin to both develop as a pocket passer as well as give his run game some extra support. He could play left tackle in the right system in the NFL, and could be a mid round pick because of it.</P>


Phil Taylor, DT, Baylor
Another lineman who has improved over the season, Taylor has shown that he can both absorb two blockers as well as take advantage of one on ones to get in the backfield. He isn’t a dynamic <FONT style="FONT-WEIGHT: 400; COLOR: blue! important; FONT-FAMILY: Arial,Helvetica,clean,sans-serif; POSITION: static" color=blue><SPAN class=kLink style="FONT-WEIGHT: 400; COLOR: blue! important; FONT-FAMILY: Arial,Helvetica,clean,sans-serif; POSITION: relative">athlete</SPAN></FONT> (http://www.opposingviews.com/i/2011-nfl-draft-prospects-bowl-previews-military-texas-alamo#) and will need to improve his moves if he hopes to be a starter at the NFL level.</P>


Martez Wilson, ILB, Illinois (JR)
One of the top prospects coming out of high school, some off the field and injury issues have derailed what could have been a future 1<SUP>st</SUP> round pick dream. Still, Wilson’s athletic ability and movement in space means that if he declares, he could be a mid round pick who could develop in the pros. Most scouts, however, likely hope he stays for another season.

Nate Bussey, OLB, Illinois
Not as athletically gifted or consistent as Wilson has been over his career, Bussey has been a consistent threat on the outside, both with his tackle-to-sideline range and his blitzing off the edge skills improving. He’ll struggle to make the NFL, but he will be crucial in keeping Robert Griffin of Baylor in the pocket.</P>


<SPAN style="TEXT-DECORATION: underline">Oklahoma</SPAN><SPAN style="TEXT-DECORATION: underline"> </SPAN><SPAN style="TEXT-DECORATION: underline">State</SPAN><SPAN style="TEXT-DECORATION: underline"> Cowboys vs. </SPAN><SPAN style="TEXT-DECORATION: underline">Arizona</SPAN><SPAN style="TEXT-DECORATION: underline"> Wildcats – </SPAN><SPAN style="TEXT-DECORATION: underline">Alamo</SPAN><SPAN style="TEXT-DECORATION: underline"> Bowl</SPAN></P>


Justin Blackmon, WR, Oklahoma State (RS SO)
Coming into the season, Blackmon was ready to take over for Dez Bryant as the team’s new feature receiver and a receiver with a bright future. Now, however, after having one of the most productive season’s in <FONT style="FONT-WEIGHT: 400; COLOR: blue! important; FONT-FAMILY: Arial,Helvetica,clean,sans-serif; POSITION: static" color=blue><SPAN class=kLink style="FONT-WEIGHT: 400; COLOR: blue! important; FONT-FAMILY: Arial,Helvetica,clean,sans-serif; POSITION: relative">college </SPAN><SPAN class=kLink style="FONT-WEIGHT: 400; COLOR: blue! important; FONT-FAMILY: Arial,Helvetica,clean,sans-serif; POSITION: relative">football</SPAN></FONT> (http://www.opposingviews.com/i/2011-nfl-draft-prospects-bowl-previews-military-texas-alamo#) history as a receiver and return man, he’s eyeing Dez Bryant as being the higher of the two when it comes to draft area. If he declares, he could be looking at the middle to latter part of the 1<SUP>st</SUP> round.</P>


Nick Foles, QB, Arizona (JR)
While he’s already come out and said it’s very unlikely he’ll declare for the draft, he’d be a solid 2<SUP>nd</SUP> rounder if he did. Foles has become a very solid pocket passer with improved deep touch and confidence in the pocket. He does have trouble moving to his left side as well as making something out of good pass rush, both of which he’ll likely have a shot to prove wrong in this one.</P>


Kendall Hunter, RB, Oklahoma State
Hunter would have been considered to be a mid rounder last year if he declared if it wasn’t for an early season injury that kept him out much of the year, he has shown his NFL speed and quickness that could still make him a mid round pick thanks to a very productive season this year.</P>


Colin Baxter, C, Arizona
One of the better, more consistent centers in the country and over his career, Baxter has been known to be a team leader in the locker room and has contributed to the development of Adam Grant as well as the defensive lineman for this team. He moves well on the move, but his struggles against bigger <FONT style="FONT-WEIGHT: 400; COLOR: blue! important; FONT-FAMILY: Arial,Helvetica,clean,sans-serif; POSITION: static" color=blue><SPAN class=kLink style="FONT-WEIGHT: 400; COLOR: blue! important; FONT-FAMILY: Arial,Helvetica,clean,sans-serif; POSITION: relative">nose </SPAN><SPAN class=kLink style="FONT-WEIGHT: 400; COLOR: blue! important; FONT-FAMILY: Arial,Helvetica,clean,sans-serif; POSITION: relative">tackles</SPAN></FONT> (http://www.opposingviews.com/i/2011-nfl-draft-prospects-bowl-previews-military-texas-alamo#) as well as his inconsistent blocking against blitzers.</P>


Brandon Weeden, QB, Oklahoma State (JR)
Check out our article on Weeden HERE. While based on his play this year and his remaining year of eligibility, he should stay in college, things are unique for Weeden because of his age. Still, if he does declare, he could be a middle to late round pick, and should be able to utilize his weapons on offense enough, as he’s done all year, to lead his team to a victory in what could be the big three’s final game.</P>


Adam Grant, OT, Arizona
A likely right tackle or guard at the next level, he’s very similar to a lesser version of former Arizona tackle Eben Britton, currently in the NFL. He doesn’t have great feet for pass blocking, but he can get the job done, and can run block well with good leverage. He’ll likely have to focus on the pass rush in this game that likely will be a shootout.</P>


Ugo Chinasa, DE, Oklahoma State
Quite a productive defensive end over his career, he’s been the reason over his career why many teams can’t keep up with the Cowboys and their offense. He’s a bit undersized to be a standard NFL defensive end in a 4-3 scheme, but could be a good pass rusher at the next level, and should be a good match-up against Adam Grant in getting to quarterback Nick Foles</P>


</P>




Justin Blackmon is a beast, why isn't he getting the hype that Dez was?
</P>


Very good crop of Underclassman WR's that can come out in this draft. Dez to me was by far the best receiver in the 10 draft. I had a Top 10 grade on him.</P>

Redeyejedi
12-30-2010, 06:54 PM
SomeCover 2 early from NC with Sturdivant at MLB. Hanging with Luke Stocker down the seam.Quan looking like liquid how fluid his movement is early in the game. Looks like he is back to his old self after being banged up most of the year</P>

Redeyejedi
12-30-2010, 07:01 PM
Kendric Burney with a nice pick under cutting the receiver. Thats how U play off man Terrel Thomas.Next timetry not to fumble the ball Burney.Sturdivant looking very sharp in pass coverage. Getting very good depth in his drops muddling up the throwing lanes

CGYgiant
12-30-2010, 07:03 PM
SomeCover 2 early from NC with Sturdivant at MLB. Hanging with Luke Stocker down the seam.Quan looking like liquid how fluid his movement is early in the game. Looks like he is back to his old self after being banged up most of the year</p>

bruce carter is not playing right?

Redeyejedi
12-30-2010, 07:05 PM
Sturdivant lined up on the 6-5 Freshman WR Justin Hunter .I think some miscommunication by the defense. He handled him well in man coverage though as the ball falls incomplete.

Redeyejedi
12-30-2010, 07:10 PM
SomeCover 2 early from NC with Sturdivant at MLB. Hanging with Luke Stocker down the seam.Quan looking like liquid how fluid his movement is early in the game. Looks like he is back to his old self after being banged up most of the year</P>




bruce carter is not playing right?
Torn ACL, Theres a lot of players still on this NC defense. Quinton Coples DE/DT, Donte Paige Moss DE, Zach Brown LB, Kendric Burney CB, Deunta Williams S, Quan Sturdivant LB, Jerrard Mcadoo all these guys will get looks by NFL teams. Plus U get to watch Jeff Feagles son Punt for NC</P>


Zach Brown Bruce Carters replacement has blazing speed. Rumored to run a sub 4.3 40 at 225 pounds. He will be a sought after LB in the 2012 draft</P>

Redeyejedi
12-30-2010, 07:15 PM
Deunta Williams grabbing hisleg noooo!!!! He is in trouble thats looks like a badleg injury. Poor kid I hopehe is OK. They have a cart on the field. Im going to have to change my sig before Sturdivant gets hurt 2. Maybe I cursed them</P>

CGYgiant
12-30-2010, 07:25 PM
SomeCover 2 early from NC with Sturdivant at MLB. Hanging with Luke Stocker down the seam.Quan looking like liquid how fluid his movement is early in the game. Looks like he is back to his old self after being banged up most of the year</p>




bruce carter is not playing right?
Torn ACL, Theres a lot of players still on this NC defense. Quinton Coples DE/DT, Donte Paige Moss DE, Zach Brown LB, Kendric Burney CB, Deunta Williams S, Quan Sturdivant LB, Jerrard Mcadoo all these guys will get looks by NFL teams. Plus U get to watch Jeff Feagles son Punt for NC</p>


Zach Brown Bruce Carters replacement has blazing speed. Rumored to run a sub 4.3 40 at 225 pounds. He will be a sought after LB in the 2012 draft</p>

Woah Duenta Williams definitely broke his leg there, jesus

Redeyejedi
12-30-2010, 07:39 PM
SomeCover 2 early from NC with Sturdivant at MLB. Hanging with Luke Stocker down the seam.Quan looking like liquid how fluid his movement is early in the game. Looks like he is back to his old self after being banged up most of the year</P>




bruce carter is not playing right?
Torn ACL, Theres a lot of players still on this NC defense. Quinton Coples DE/DT, Donte Paige Moss DE, Zach Brown LB, Kendric Burney CB, Deunta Williams S, Quan Sturdivant LB, Jerrard Mcadoo all these guys will get looks by NFL teams. Plus U get to watch Jeff Feagles son Punt for NC</P>


Zach Brown Bruce Carters replacement has blazing speed. Rumored to run a sub 4.3 40 at 225 pounds. He will be a sought after LB in the 2012 draft</P>




Woah Duenta Williams definitely broke his leg there, jesus
</P>


Yeah it sucks for Williams I changed by Sig.2 guys have gone down since I made that,How about Jeff Feagles son out there</P>

Redeyejedi
12-30-2010, 07:40 PM
Theres Sturdivant in the backfield for a 3yard loss. Tenn is having serious problems blocking Quinton Coples . He is going to be a solid 5 Tech

Redeyejedi
12-30-2010, 07:48 PM
How about Zach Brown. North Carolina is loaded with NFL type athletes. Butch Davis knows what he is doing. Awesome eye for NFL talent

Redeyejedi
12-31-2010, 07:31 AM
Deunta Williams has a fractured Tibia which isnt a serious injury and shouldnt effect his draft status to much. He will no doubt be ready for training camp and could very possibly ready for rookie camp. He should still be a early to mid 2nd round pick. When I saw that injury and how is leg bent I thought it was a much worse injury its good to hear

Redeyejedi
12-31-2010, 07:52 AM
Prince Amakumara isnt very fast Im not sure if he will run under a 4.55. He is awesome in press coverage thoughlet him get up on a receiver and he dominates his man. He doesnt have recovery speed and can be beat by the long ball. </P>


Jake Locker couldnt throw the football against Nebraska again but he wasnt as horrible as his stats would indicate. 2 terrible looking stat lines</P>


5-16 for 56 yards , 13 carries fr 83 yards</P>


4-20 for 71 yards , 11 carries for 59 yards</P>


Locker needs a lot of work at the next level and after watching Clausen this year I wont ever not factor in winning as a major component from a College QB again.</P>


</P>


</P>

thegreatone
12-31-2010, 09:01 AM
Prince Amakumara isnt very fast Im not sure if he will run under a 4.55. He is awesome in press coverage thoughlet him get up on a receiver and he dominates his man. He doesnt have recovery speed and can be beat by the long ball. </p>


Jake Locker couldnt throw the football against Nebraska again but he wasnt as horrible as his stats would indicate. 2 terrible looking stat lines</p>


5-16 for 56 yards , 13 carries fr 83 yards</p>


4-20 for 71 yards , 11 carries for 59 yards</p>


Locker needs a lot of work at the next level and after watching Clausen this year I wont ever not factor in winning as a major component from a College QB again.</p>


</p>


</p>
yeah he didnt look very good but im wondering if that monster hit he took early had something to do with it. I was really impressed with sturdivant and might be leaning more his way than my boy carter (sry bruce!). quan look very smooth in pass D