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View Full Version : In retrospect (developing Eli)



ErnieReese
01-23-2012, 08:18 PM
Would the Giants have been more successful if they had not thrown so much at Manning during his younger years?

I ask this not to criticize Coughlin or Eli, but because I've read the two books on Eli and have heard from a few analysts and media heads that when Eli came in, they treated him like Peyton in terms of responsibilities.

What if they had Eli take on the same amt of responsibilities as the young Qbs of today took on?

I think he'd probably have like 15-20 or so tds and 5-10 ints and probably like 3000-3200 yards. He might also have had like a 80-90 Qb rating.

Just curious. They say stats don't mean everything, but being coddled and having an 80-90 qb rating throughout his first few years would have changed people's opinion of him. It's a shallow look, but that's the only reason why Alex Smith was being mentioned in the same breathe as Eli before the NFC Championship game.

CDN_G-FAN
01-23-2012, 08:24 PM
would the giants have been more successful with Rivers or Rothlesberger.

Would the giants have been more successful if we would have brought in 'competition' at QB like we heard for YEARS.

Would the giants have been more successful drafting another QB in the first 3 rounds as an option at QB?

all of these threads are completely non-existent compared to 3 years ago where you could shake a stick and hit every one of those threads every single day.

the answer is, the way that coughlin and mara have handled Eli is absolutely perfect.

people want success NOW, and when they don't get it, they assume that changes need to be made.

this season shows that sometimes sticking with what you've got and waiting for everyone to get on the same page and get it right is a completely legit option.

takes some guts to have a team that's losing or near .500 and say "this team is good enough, we're going to keep things the way they are until they get it right".....

NY_Eli
01-23-2012, 08:31 PM
He won a super bowl mvp in his 3rd full year as a starter. What's the issue?

ErnieReese
01-23-2012, 08:33 PM
Not my issue. But apparently a great issue to the "realists" on this board and to the loads of analysts that don't seem like they watch Giants games but still analyze Eli.

Eric Allen, for example.

bflo23
01-23-2012, 08:35 PM
Are you a 49er fan? Nobody in their right mind is putting Alex Smith in the same breath as Eli.

They are nothing alike and that is an insult. I don't understand your point but it sounds like your are just whining/trolling with complaining about him not having 80-90 QB rating in his first couple years.

In his 4th year, he won a super bowl in epic fashion. You think people care what his QB rating was in 2007?

ErnieReese
01-23-2012, 08:40 PM
Are you a 49er fan? Nobody in their right mind is putting Alex Smith in the same breath as Eli.

They are nothing alike and that is an insult. I don't understand your point but it sounds like your are just whining/trolling with complaining about him not having 80-90 QB rating in his first couple years.

In his 4th year, he won a super bowl in epic fashion. You think people care what his QB rating was in 2007?


I really think you have reading comprehension problems.

ErnieReese
01-23-2012, 08:42 PM
Are you a 49er fan? Nobody in their right mind is putting Alex Smith in the same breath as Eli.

They are nothing alike and that is an insult. I don't understand your point but it sounds like your are just whining/trolling with complaining about him not having 80-90 QB rating in his first couple years.

In his 4th year, he won a super bowl in epic fashion. You think people care what his QB rating was in 2007?


Why would I read two books on Manning if I were a troll? Also... they were calling Alex Smith Joe Montana. You don't think they mentioned him in the same breathe as Eli before the game?

Delicreep
01-23-2012, 08:48 PM
Here's my take: neither the Steelers, Chargers or Giants threw more at their respective QB's then they were certain that they could handle.

Different from each other, and in no small way influenced by team strengths, but designed for success.

And not to put to fine a point on it, but Eli and Ben play for well run organizations that know how to win it all.

bflo23
01-23-2012, 08:51 PM
You said enough.... Alex Smith and Joe Montana now? Guy throws for 197 yards per game with 17 TDs and you think it is ok to compare him to Eli and Montana.

Beyond ridiculous. Even 49er fans would be laughing.

rick5292
01-23-2012, 08:51 PM
Are you a 49er fan? Nobody in their right mind is putting Alex Smith in the same breath as Eli.

They are nothing alike and that is an insult. I don't understand your point but it sounds like your are just whining/trolling with complaining about him not having 80-90 QB rating in his first couple years.

In his 4th year, he won a super bowl in epic fashion. You think people care what his QB rating was in 2007?


I really think you have reading comprehension problems.

LOL Don't mind some of the folks on here. They are a little touchy sometimes. However, I think that we need not worry about others criticizing Eli. We know what he is and what he's done.

ErnieReese
01-23-2012, 08:54 PM
Here's my take: neither the Steelers, Chargers or Giants threw more at their respective QB's then they were certain that they could handle.

Different from each other, and in no small way influenced by team strengths, but designed for success.

And not to put to fine a point on it, but Eli and Ben play for well run organizations that know how to win it all.

In the book, they said Ken Whisenhunt gave Ben Roethlisberger the most simple offensive game plan.

Just bringing something into people's consciousness. Makes me a little annoyed that "analysts" and "realists" don't consider all the factors. I don't understand why Ben is nearly always considered better than Eli.

Also, it makes no sense that Eric Allen would say Eli is "not even close" to Brady. I understand he's not as good, but to say he's not even close-- that would also mean Ben, Rivers, and 99% other Qbs aren't even close. And I don't think that's a good analysis at all.

zimonami
01-23-2012, 08:58 PM
Are you a 49er fan? Nobody in their right mind is putting Alex Smith in the same breath as Eli.

They are nothing alike and that is an insult. I don't understand your point but it sounds like your are just whining/trolling with complaining about him not having 80-90 QB rating in his first couple years.

In his 4th year, he won a super bowl in epic fashion. You think people care what his QB rating was in 2007?


Why would I read two books on Manning if I were a troll? Also... they were calling Alex Smith Joe Montana. You don't think they mentioned him in the same breathe as Eli before the game?
Yes, some tried to elevate Smith to Eli's level... for a while. Fame can be fleeting.
TC doesn't like to play rookies much... old school. Yet, he benched a SB winning vet for Eli. Remember, Eli was raised to read defenses. In his rookie year, our last game against Dallas... we're losing by 3 late in the game. 3rd and goal from the 3 yd line and a pass play is sent in. Eli audibles to a draw to Tiki, and we score and win. It showed his knowledge. Very few rooks could do that. TC had confidence in Eli and his maturity to handle the job. No. I don't think TC thought he was throwing too much at Eli

giantsfan420
01-23-2012, 09:15 PM
would the giants have been more successful with Rivers or Rothlesberger.

Would the giants have been more successful if we would have brought in 'competition' at QB like we heard for YEARS.

Would the giants have been more successful drafting another QB in the first 3 rounds as an option at QB?

all of these threads are completely non-existent compared to 3 years ago where you could shake a stick and hit every one of those threads every single day.

the answer is, the way that coughlin and mara have handled Eli is absolutely perfect.

people want success NOW, and when they don't get it, they assume that changes need to be made.

this season shows that sometimes sticking with what you've got and waiting for everyone to get on the same page and get it right is a completely legit option.

takes some guts to have a team that's losing or near .500 and say "this team is good enough, we're going to keep things the way they are until they get it right".....

i say this respectfully, but wtf r u talking about. we were 11-5 elis first year as a starter. the worst year he's had was 8-8 and that happened only twice. we've been a 10 win team every season except for the 8-8 seasons and this year at 9-7. the people calling for a qb were full out haters and had no reason to do so.

people were expecting peyton manning without realizing he played for the colts. eli manning since being a starter has been every bit as worthy as the 1rst overall pick as peyton was. this team has never been a losing team and only twice in 7 years were we .500. not surprisingly, those two years our DC was tim lewis and sherridan.

not to mention, eli is one of 5 players all time to go his first 6 now 7 years with 3000 yards and 20 plus touchdowns. u are right, people want instant gratification especially in ny