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tikiandphil
01-29-2012, 07:41 PM
It's great to see all of the opposing NFC helmets of teams that the Giants beat on the way to the Super Bowl. They really look colorful on the new HD television I bought to watch our team play this week. Snap...

Voldamort
01-29-2012, 07:43 PM
FITZ WITH A TD THE GUY IS A BEAST!

jomo
01-29-2012, 07:45 PM
Glad to see some of my favorite players there.....Mangold, Brees, Rodgers......[:D]

giantsfan420
01-29-2012, 07:45 PM
i just turned the tv off. if i wanted to watch grown men fake their profession i'd watch politicians on CSPAN.
you see these *** clowns on the DL and in coverage? the first run play the NFC ran I thought a false start had been flagged bc no one seemed to do much of anything.

a complete joke.

calzonesays
01-29-2012, 07:46 PM
everyone looks so emo to be there.

it's really great being in the SB and seeing eagles/packers/saints/etc battling it out in a meaningless probowl.

giantsfan420
01-29-2012, 07:46 PM
and if rivers made the probowl this year somehow, eli should have been a probowl every year he's been a starter. that guy had one of the worst seasons from a franchise qb ive ever seen. ugh, this probowl is a joke and ruins pro footballs credibility.

Voldamort
01-29-2012, 07:48 PM
THAT'S TWO FOR LARRY HE IS A BEAST

PIERCEnumber58rules
01-29-2012, 07:50 PM
Was the probowl always this big of a joke? I never really watched it as a kid- or adult! But it's not entertaining if the players don't try, OR CARE!

egyptian420
01-29-2012, 07:51 PM
i just turned the tv off. if i wanted to watch grown men fake their profession i'd watch politicians on CSPAN.
you see these *** clowns on the DL and in coverage? the first run play the NFC ran I thought a false start had been flagged bc no one seemed to do much of anything.

a complete joke.
Yea I watched the first two offensive drives for both teams and turned it off....that was pathetic

Football is a game that can't be faked, you're either all in or you just don't play at all. In the NBA you could have an interesting all-star game because it's not physical.

CTLadyBlue
01-29-2012, 07:52 PM
Why is Mike McCarthy coaching the NFC? I thought the coaches of the losing CG coached the Pro Bowl? Don't tell me Baby Jim Harbaugh balked at that?

GmenFan1980
01-29-2012, 07:53 PM
Why is Mike McCarthy coaching the NFC? I thought the coaches of the losing CG coached the Pro Bowl? Don't tell me Baby Jim Harbaugh balked at that?

coach with best record in playoffs

MikeIsaGiant
01-29-2012, 07:53 PM
ROFL, did you just see this? sO DUMB

giantsfan420
01-29-2012, 07:54 PM
wow ben is a bad pocket qb. in a game where theres no pass rush so he cant extend plays and has to throw from the pocket, he throws an int. lol.

and i caved i turned it back on. now its going off for good this is a joke.

GMenNY21
01-29-2012, 07:58 PM
This dline play is comical..

miked1958
01-29-2012, 08:02 PM
Wow! Clay M makes great INT and then pitches it back which was fine. Then it got comical as it got pitched to peppers who tried to throw it over someone and got stuffed. Just horrible

miked1958
01-29-2012, 08:03 PM
It was like something u see at end of a game. I know they are just out ther having fun but that was 7 easy points NFC gave up

MikeIsaGiant
01-29-2012, 08:03 PM
They should take the dline and oline out and just play the game, tat's how this game should be

miked1958
01-29-2012, 08:05 PM
Did the gmen just have Eli and JPP?
I am pretty sure the Pats had like 8 or so guys that would of been there

miked1958
01-29-2012, 08:07 PM
Kinda like when we beat the #1 seed 13-3 Cowboys which had like 12 or so guys and we had hardly any or none. Same few weeks later when we played unbeaten pats.

I like when giants beat all these teams with so many Probowlers

miked1958
01-29-2012, 08:07 PM
Lol now 14-14

krygny
01-29-2012, 08:19 PM
I'm missing a rerun of The Simpsons for this?

See y'all next week.

(click)

bLuereverie
01-29-2012, 08:21 PM
WTF is with Roethlisberger's face? He's pulling a page from Shanahan's book and is matching his team's jersey color.

ghwriter1976
01-29-2012, 08:26 PM
I'm glad I never had the biggest urge to watch the Pro Bowl. Or should I say, my wife is glad I never had the biggest urge to watch it. I've been driving her insane with the past four games, and she's been a real trooper putting up with my many superstitions, so I'm glad to give her a break this week...

gmen0820
01-29-2012, 08:29 PM
The Pro Bowl and the voting for it is a joke.

miked1958
01-29-2012, 08:41 PM
Wow. Did u see who Jared Allen just did. Went to ground and rolled under player and popped up,before ball was snapped

miked1958
01-29-2012, 08:42 PM
This is really becoming a joke

ibbill
01-29-2012, 08:49 PM
i just turned the tv off. if i wanted to watch grown men fake their profession i'd watch politicians on CSPAN.
you see these *** clowns on the DL and in coverage? the first run play the NFC ran I thought a false start had been flagged bc no one seemed to do much of anything.

a complete joke.

I just switched channels what a joke that is.

giantsfan420
01-29-2012, 08:57 PM
The Pro Bowl and the voting for it is a joke.

i disagree with this mentality. the 5 min i did watch, they interviewed gates, rodgers, and another couple players and each one said how much it means to them that they were voted in bc it meant their peers really respect what they've done this year. doug flutie also said that too how it was such a proud moment for him bc it meant that the rest of the league really respected his play that year.

if it was just fan vote or if the fan vote weighed any more than it does i'd agree with that mentality its a joke. but 2/3rds of the vote is strictly players and coaches, people i think have the most knowledge of who deserves it. the fan vote is only 1/3, and even with that, not every fan voting takes it as a joke. i know when i vote i vote for who i really thinks should go. when giants players dont show me they deserve to go i dont even vote. i only voted bc i thought eli, jpp, and cruz deserved it and u couldnt even vote for jpp and cruz. they made it in strictly on their peers votes.

to say its a joke "bc the fans vote" is just flat out wrong. the fan joke doesnt even mean that much in all honesty, its just a way to get them involved. players like for example eli, was 5th in qb voting for the nfc last i checked and coulda even dropped further down. he made it based heavily on a high number of player/coaching votes. i guess i should amend my stance into "yes it is a joke when a player doesnt even play much of the season and still makes it bc he was the #1 fan vote for his position but that happens for like 2 or 3 players out of the entire roster for both sides. the majority of players actually earned it."

tikiandphil
01-29-2012, 09:00 PM
I think I just heard Mayock imply that with our existing running game we are going to win the Super Bowl. Nice.

miked1958
01-29-2012, 09:02 PM
I'm glad I never had the biggest urge to watch the Pro Bowl. Or should I say, my wife is glad I never had the biggest urge to watch it. I've been driving her insane with the past four games, and she's been a real trooper putting up with my many superstitions, so I'm glad to give her a break this week...
Yes me to... And there are MANY superstitions trust me.
P
I can't tell u what they are and u know why. Lol. They are working!!!

Make a thread after we win and I will be glad to list all the crazy things we have been doing for over a month

gmen0820
01-29-2012, 09:11 PM
The Pro Bowl and the voting for it is a joke.

i disagree with this mentality. the 5 min i did watch, they interviewed gates, rodgers, and another couple players and each one said how much it means to them that they were voted in bc it meant their peers really respect what they've done this year. doug flutie also said that too how it was such a proud moment for him bc it meant that the rest of the league really respected his play that year.

if it was just fan vote or if the fan vote weighed any more than it does i'd agree with that mentality its a joke. but 2/3rds of the vote is strictly players and coaches, people i think have the most knowledge of who deserves it. the fan vote is only 1/3, and even with that, not every fan voting takes it as a joke. i know when i vote i vote for who i really thinks should go. when giants players dont show me they deserve to go i dont even vote. i only voted bc i thought eli, jpp, and cruz deserved it and u couldnt even vote for jpp and cruz. they made it in strictly on their peers votes.

to say its a joke "bc the fans vote" is just flat out wrong. the fan joke doesnt even mean that much in all honesty, its just a way to get them involved. players like for example eli, was 5th in qb voting for the nfc last i checked and coulda even dropped further down. he made it based heavily on a high number of player/coaching votes. i guess i should amend my stance into "yes it is a joke when a player doesnt even play much of the season and still makes it bc he was the #1 fan vote for his position but that happens for like 2 or 3 players out of the entire roster for both sides. the majority of players actually earned it."So Rivers deserves to be in there? Even though " that guy had one of the worst seasons from a franchise qb ive ever seen. "

Looks like Rivers peers really disagree with you on that notion.

And how accurate was that 2010 players top 100 list?

NYGRealityCheck
01-29-2012, 09:13 PM
It's the Pro Bowl... Players are out there just to have a fun time and represent their team (Lmao I don't recall seeing a Lions players...)

People especting a fierce competitve game should wait one more week.

Every team should have some representation in the Pro Bowl (at least one player). Having 8,9 players from just one team is a joke and it always will be.

Also, if the trend of the Pro Bowl games is going towards passing (which it has been because of the Pro Bowl rules), they should eliminate the 3rd RB position and add one more spot for the TE/WR position for each team.

NYfanatic
01-29-2012, 09:20 PM
Its embarrassing when Cam Newton is in the pro bowl.

giantsfan420
01-29-2012, 09:20 PM
The Pro Bowl and the voting for it is a joke.

i disagree with this mentality. the 5 min i did watch, they interviewed gates, rodgers, and another couple players and each one said how much it means to them that they were voted in bc it meant their peers really respect what they've done this year. doug flutie also said that too how it was such a proud moment for him bc it meant that the rest of the league really respected his play that year.

if it was just fan vote or if the fan vote weighed any more than it does i'd agree with that mentality its a joke. but 2/3rds of the vote is strictly players and coaches, people i think have the most knowledge of who deserves it. the fan vote is only 1/3, and even with that, not every fan voting takes it as a joke. i know when i vote i vote for who i really thinks should go. when giants players dont show me they deserve to go i dont even vote. i only voted bc i thought eli, jpp, and cruz deserved it and u couldnt even vote for jpp and cruz. they made it in strictly on their peers votes.

to say its a joke "bc the fans vote" is just flat out wrong. the fan joke doesnt even mean that much in all honesty, its just a way to get them involved. players like for example eli, was 5th in qb voting for the nfc last i checked and coulda even dropped further down. he made it based heavily on a high number of player/coaching votes. i guess i should amend my stance into "yes it is a joke when a player doesnt even play much of the season and still makes it bc he was the #1 fan vote for his position but that happens for like 2 or 3 players out of the entire roster for both sides. the majority of players actually earned it."So Rivers deserves to be in there? Even though " that guy had one of the worst seasons from a franchise qb ive ever seen. "

Looks like Rivers peers really disagree with you on that notion.

And how accurate was that 2010 players top 100 list?

like i said, there are a few players every year who dont deserve it but like 97% of the players do. and even so, the afc didnt have good qb play at all really. brady and then theres a serious drop off in talent. rivers was like one of the top qbs in the afc and that speaks more to the lack of quality qbs in the afc. which qbs do u think got shafted from that? and what other players do u think didnt deserve to go?

NYfanatic
01-29-2012, 09:22 PM
Its embarrassing when Cam Newton is in the pro bowl.



I guess Newton only knows how to throw to Steve Smith.
He looked terrible throwing that pick and that other pass that went nowhere.

NYfanatic
01-29-2012, 09:23 PM
Its embarrassing when Cam Newton is in the pro bowl.



I guess Newton only knows how to throw to Steve Smith.
He looked terrible throwing that pick and that other pass that went nowhere.

But yet again Andy Dalton for some reason is in it as well.
Both are not deserving of the probowl.

jjj45
01-29-2012, 09:26 PM
Its embarrassing when Cam Newton is in the pro bowl.


I love how they are slobbering over him and then he throws a pick.

jjj45
01-29-2012, 09:31 PM
Steve Smith: straight up beast!

Jet-Blue
01-29-2012, 09:32 PM
It's a paid vacation for these guys. They are there to have fun and not get hurt. No big deal.

NYfanatic
01-29-2012, 09:33 PM
Its embarrassing when Cam Newton is in the pro bowl.


I love how they are slobbering over him and then he throws a pick.

It seems only Steve Smith can catch Newtons passes.

NYfanatic
01-29-2012, 09:34 PM
Its embarrassing when Cam Newton is in the pro bowl.


I love how they are slobbering over him and then he throws a pick.

It seems only Steve Smith can catch Newtons passes.

Newton is the only one who isnt tucking in his jersey.
CMON MAN.

jjj45
01-29-2012, 09:35 PM
The scenery shots of Hawaii are breathtaking. Wish I was back.....

BurnerNYG
01-29-2012, 09:37 PM
Its embarrassing when Cam Newton is in the pro bowl.


I love how they are slobbering over him and then he throws a pick.

It seems only Steve Smith can catch Newtons passes.
Lol... I wonder who's gonna catch Tebow's passes. Ooops, I forgot he's not there. :-D

gmen0820
01-29-2012, 09:38 PM
The Pro Bowl and the voting for it is a joke.

i disagree with this mentality. the 5 min i did watch, they interviewed gates, rodgers, and another couple players and each one said how much it means to them that they were voted in bc it meant their peers really respect what they've done this year. doug flutie also said that too how it was such a proud moment for him bc it meant that the rest of the league really respected his play that year.

if it was just fan vote or if the fan vote weighed any more than it does i'd agree with that mentality its a joke. but 2/3rds of the vote is strictly players and coaches, people i think have the most knowledge of who deserves it. the fan vote is only 1/3, and even with that, not every fan voting takes it as a joke. i know when i vote i vote for who i really thinks should go. when giants players dont show me they deserve to go i dont even vote. i only voted bc i thought eli, jpp, and cruz deserved it and u couldnt even vote for jpp and cruz. they made it in strictly on their peers votes.

to say its a joke "bc the fans vote" is just flat out wrong. the fan joke doesnt even mean that much in all honesty, its just a way to get them involved. players like for example eli, was 5th in qb voting for the nfc last i checked and coulda even dropped further down. he made it based heavily on a high number of player/coaching votes. i guess i should amend my stance into "yes it is a joke when a player doesnt even play much of the season and still makes it bc he was the #1 fan vote for his position but that happens for like 2 or 3 players out of the entire roster for both sides. the majority of players actually earned it."So Rivers deserves to be in there? Even though " that guy had one of the worst seasons from a franchise qb ive ever seen. "

Looks like Rivers peers really disagree with you on that notion.

And how accurate was that 2010 players top 100 list?

like i said, there are a few players every year who dont deserve it but like 97% of the players do. and even so, the afc didnt have good qb play at all really. brady and then theres a serious drop off in talent. rivers was like one of the top qbs in the afc and that speaks more to the lack of quality qbs in the afc. which qbs do u think got shafted from that? and what other players do u think didnt deserve to go?My point is that the Pro Bowl is a joke, and the voting is too.

You say its not because of the players and coaches vote but you do realize that the QB voting for the AFC was Brady, Ben and Tebow so Rivers got in because of his 2/3rds, his peers who "are credible".

My only purpose is to discredit the players vote, which I think the snubbing of Stafford, Cruz, as well as others and that top 100 players list voted by the players is enough. So how do you figure that 2/3rds (peers) vote Rivers in when you say he had one of the worst seasons from a franchise QB, who is credible in this scenario? You, or the 2/3rds, because his peers surely thought he was worthy.

NYfanatic
01-29-2012, 09:40 PM
Its embarrassing when Cam Newton is in the pro bowl.


I love how they are slobbering over him and then he throws a pick.

It seems only Steve Smith can catch Newtons passes.
Lol... I wonder who's gonna catch Tebow's passes. Ooops, I forgot he's not there. :-D
another pick for newton... You have to agree with me that Stafford was way more deserving of the spot then Newton right?
I wish it was Tebow vs Newton in the pro bowl. The game is a joke anyway mind of well have two polarizing figures throw passes to some elite talent and see what they really got.

BurnerNYG
01-29-2012, 09:43 PM
Its embarrassing when Cam Newton is in the pro bowl.


I love how they are slobbering over him and then he throws a pick.

It seems only Steve Smith can catch Newtons passes.
Lol... I wonder who's gonna catch Tebow's passes. Ooops, I forgot he's not there. :-D
another pick for newton... You have to agree with me that Stafford was way more deserving of the spot then Newton right?
I wish it was Tebow vs Newton in the pro bowl. The game is a joke anyway mind of well have two polarizing figures throw passes to some elite talent and see what they really got.
Yeah I agree, Stafford did deserve to make it over Newton but I thought Stafford deserved to go in over Eli too.

miked1958
01-29-2012, 09:50 PM
The scenery shots of Hawaii are breathtaking. Wish I was back.....

Ugly

NYfanatic
01-29-2012, 09:52 PM
Its embarrassing when Cam Newton is in the pro bowl.


I love how they are slobbering over him and then he throws a pick.

It seems only Steve Smith can catch Newtons passes.
Lol... I wonder who's gonna catch Tebow's passes. Ooops, I forgot he's not there. :-D
another pick for newton... You have to agree with me that Stafford was way more deserving of the spot then Newton right?
I wish it was Tebow vs Newton in the pro bowl. The game is a joke anyway mind of well have two polarizing figures throw passes to some elite talent and see what they really got.
Yeah I agree, Stafford did deserve to make it over Newton but I thought Stafford deserved to go in over Eli too.
Seems like Rich Seymour isnt all too happy with newton.

GmenFan1980
01-29-2012, 09:53 PM
Luckiest TD i have ever seen :P by Dalton

jjj45
01-29-2012, 09:56 PM
The scenery shots of Hawaii are breathtaking. Wish I was back.....

Uglylol you kidding???

jjj45
01-29-2012, 09:59 PM
lol all the defenders hate Cam. They're kicking the crap out of him.

NYfanatic
01-29-2012, 10:01 PM
Its embarrassing when Cam Newton is in the pro bowl.


I love how they are slobbering over him and then he throws a pick.

It seems only Steve Smith can catch Newtons passes.
Lol... I wonder who's gonna catch Tebow's passes. Ooops, I forgot he's not there. :-D
another pick for newton... You have to agree with me that Stafford was way more deserving of the spot then Newton right?
I wish it was Tebow vs Newton in the pro bowl. The game is a joke anyway mind of well have two polarizing figures throw passes to some elite talent and see what they really got.
Yeah I agree, Stafford did deserve to make it over Newton but I thought Stafford deserved to go in over Eli too.
Seems like Rich Seymour isnt all too happy with newton.

neither is Antonio Smith.

GmenFan1980
01-29-2012, 10:01 PM
lol all the defenders hate Cam. They're kicking the crap out of him.


i noticed that :S. when cam came in all the defenders started to play a little harder

miked1958
01-29-2012, 10:07 PM
lol all the defenders hate Cam. They're kicking the crap out of him.


i noticed that :S. when cam came in all the defenders started to play a little harder
Why did Cam play whole 3 rd quarter? Didn't seem like brees or Rodgers got equal time.

miked1958
01-29-2012, 10:08 PM
Unless they both get put back in again

NyGiants062586
01-29-2012, 10:15 PM
Anyone hearing all the boo-birds out for Cam Newton? The kid's not smiling too much anymore...

BurnerNYG
01-29-2012, 10:15 PM
Cam looks horrible today and the crowd is letting him have it.

NYfanatic
01-29-2012, 10:16 PM
Anyone hearing all the boo-birds out for Cam Newton? The kid's not smiling too much anymore...

he hasnt completed a pass in a while.

DVision
01-29-2012, 10:17 PM
The AFC defense quickly knocked that stupid smile off Cam's face!

NYfanatic
01-29-2012, 10:20 PM
So is Marhsall or Fitz the MVP?

Rudyy
01-29-2012, 10:21 PM
So is Marhsall or Fitz the MVP?
Looks like it's going to Marshall.

guardplay320
01-29-2012, 10:21 PM
Marshall is just begging to have a real QB (Peyton?) in Miami at this point. Guy is a ridiculous talent.

NYfanatic
01-29-2012, 10:22 PM
Marshall is just begging to have a real QB (Peyton?) in Miami at this point. Guy is a ridiculous talent.

just needs to get his mind right.

jjj45
01-29-2012, 10:23 PM
Marshall is just begging to have a real QB (Peyton?) in Miami at this point. Guy is a ridiculous talent.
Imagine if we had him? We'd be a dynasty for the next six years. Our offense couldn't be stopped.

gmen0820
01-29-2012, 10:26 PM
Marshall is just begging to have a real QB (Peyton?) in Miami at this point.* Guy is a ridiculous talent.*
Imagine if we had him? We'd be a dynasty for the next six years. Our offense would not stopped.
Depending on what Marshall shows up. He has MPS and it might not be getting blown up in Miami, but it sure would here.

giantsfan420
01-29-2012, 10:31 PM
The Pro Bowl and the voting for it is a joke.

i disagree with this mentality. the 5 min i did watch, they interviewed gates, rodgers, and another couple players and each one said how much it means to them that they were voted in bc it meant their peers really respect what they've done this year. doug flutie also said that too how it was such a proud moment for him bc it meant that the rest of the league really respected his play that year.

if it was just fan vote or if the fan vote weighed any more than it does i'd agree with that mentality its a joke. but 2/3rds of the vote is strictly players and coaches, people i think have the most knowledge of who deserves it. the fan vote is only 1/3, and even with that, not every fan voting takes it as a joke. i know when i vote i vote for who i really thinks should go. when giants players dont show me they deserve to go i dont even vote. i only voted bc i thought eli, jpp, and cruz deserved it and u couldnt even vote for jpp and cruz. they made it in strictly on their peers votes.

to say its a joke "bc the fans vote" is just flat out wrong. the fan joke doesnt even mean that much in all honesty, its just a way to get them involved. players like for example eli, was 5th in qb voting for the nfc last i checked and coulda even dropped further down. he made it based heavily on a high number of player/coaching votes. i guess i should amend my stance into "yes it is a joke when a player doesnt even play much of the season and still makes it bc he was the #1 fan vote for his position but that happens for like 2 or 3 players out of the entire roster for both sides. the majority of players actually earned it."So Rivers deserves to be in there? Even though " that guy had one of the worst seasons from a franchise qb ive ever seen. "

Looks like Rivers peers really disagree with you on that notion.

And how accurate was that 2010 players top 100 list?

like i said, there are a few players every year who dont deserve it but like 97% of the players do. and even so, the afc didnt have good qb play at all really. brady and then theres a serious drop off in talent. rivers was like one of the top qbs in the afc and that speaks more to the lack of quality qbs in the afc. which qbs do u think got shafted from that? and what other players do u think didnt deserve to go?My point is that the Pro Bowl is a joke, and the voting is too.

You say its not because of the players and coaches vote but you do realize that the QB voting for the AFC was Brady, Ben and Tebow so Rivers got in because of his 2/3rds, his peers who "are credible".

My only purpose is to discredit the players vote, which I think the snubbing of Stafford, Cruz, as well as others and that top 100 players list voted by the players is enough. So how do you figure that 2/3rds (peers) vote Rivers in when you say he had one of the worst seasons from a franchise QB, who is credible in this scenario? You, or the 2/3rds, because his peers surely thought he was worthy.

i just want to be clear before i continue on, i didnt mean to disrespect u in any way conversing with u on this and if i did i apologize. i dont like how ur turning this into im not credible thing.

u failed to address what i asked, who should go in over him? and my point about rivers was more about if he made it this year then eli could have made it every year too.

i dont think stafford was snubbed, i think the 4 qbs chosen ahead of him were how it should be. stafford did awesome, but he has one of the best wr's of our generation to throw into triple coverage and he comes down with it. cruz wasnt snubbed, he did make the probowl as a first alternate i gues thats a snub somewhat.

and ur point is to discredit the players vote? to u that makes it a joke? im sorry i cannot follow that line of thought at all.

and we already went over the top 100 players, that whole setup was extremely flawed. dont know if u forgot but it was 20% of the players asked and it wasnt "list ur top 100 players" it was list ur top 5 or 10 players whatever it was, and the order in which players voted for u was then made into a points system to determine 100 thru 1. do u think players were gonna vote in a guy like eli at top 5 players in the league? after a 25 int year? guarantee if the top 100 players was done after this season, eli would be top 20 maybe top 10.

but u feel the probowl voting is a joke bc of the player aspect? how would u organize a probowl team? how would players get in? stats dont tell the whole story so how? i agree that aspects of the probowl voting is a joke and some players get in that shouldnt, but i feel that the strong majority of both teams are players who deserved it. u named rivers, and even then he may have been the 3rd best qb in the afc, the afc has a weak qb class. what other players beside rivers made the team that u think is a joke?

again, no disrespect at all, just very confused by ur stance and i think that most would agree with me on that.

the probowl game itself is a huge joke tho i agree with u on that if that was part of ur point

lawl
01-29-2012, 10:40 PM
Stafford threw for 5000 yards and 40 TDs and didnt make the Pro Bowl. Tons of QBs have had the opportunity to throw the ball to HoF caliber WRs and they didn't come anywhere near this output. </P>


Matt Stafford was absolutely snubbed.</P>

GmenFan1980
01-29-2012, 10:40 PM
Most exciting moment of the game?

Drew brees drop kick extra point attempt lol

GmenFan1980
01-29-2012, 10:43 PM
Stafford threw for 5000 yards and 40 TDs and didnt make the Pro Bowl. Tons of QBs have had the opportunity to throw the ball to HoF caliber WRs and they didn't come anywhere near this output. </P>


Matt Stafford was absolutely snubbed.</P>

oh absolutely, at the very least should have been 1st runner up. but not on the list at all? shame, he should get it next year if he continue this production

gmen0820
01-29-2012, 10:47 PM
The Pro Bowl and the voting for it is a joke.

i disagree with this mentality. the 5 min i did watch, they interviewed gates, rodgers, and another couple players and each one said how much it means to them that they were voted in bc it meant their peers really respect what they've done this year. doug flutie also said that too how it was such a proud moment for him bc it meant that the rest of the league really respected his play that year.

if it was just fan vote or if the fan vote weighed any more than it does i'd agree with that mentality its a joke. but 2/3rds of the vote is strictly players and coaches, people i think have the most knowledge of who deserves it. the fan vote is only 1/3, and even with that, not every fan voting takes it as a joke. i know when i vote i vote for who i really thinks should go. when giants players dont show me they deserve to go i dont even vote. i only voted bc i thought eli, jpp, and cruz deserved it and u couldnt even vote for jpp and cruz. they made it in strictly on their peers votes.

to say its a joke "bc the fans vote" is just flat out wrong. the fan joke doesnt even mean that much in all honesty, its just a way to get them involved. players like for example eli, was 5th in qb voting for the nfc last i checked and coulda even dropped further down. he made it based heavily on a high number of player/coaching votes. i guess i should amend my stance into "yes it is a joke when a player doesnt even play much of the season and still makes it bc he was the #1 fan vote for his position but that happens for like 2 or 3 players out of the entire roster for both sides. the majority of players actually earned it."So Rivers deserves to be in there? Even though " that guy had one of the worst seasons from a franchise qb ive ever seen. "

Looks like Rivers peers really disagree with you on that notion.

And how accurate was that 2010 players top 100 list?

like i said, there are a few players every year who dont deserve it but like 97% of the players do. and even so, the afc didnt have good qb play at all really. brady and then theres a serious drop off in talent. rivers was like one of the top qbs in the afc and that speaks more to the lack of quality qbs in the afc. which qbs do u think got shafted from that? and what other players do u think didnt deserve to go?My point is that the Pro Bowl is a joke, and the voting is too.

You say its not because of the players and coaches vote but you do realize that the QB voting for the AFC was Brady, Ben and Tebow so Rivers got in because of his 2/3rds, his peers who "are credible".

My only purpose is to discredit the players vote, which I think the snubbing of Stafford, Cruz, as well as others and that top 100 players list voted by the players is enough. So how do you figure that 2/3rds (peers) vote Rivers in when you say he had one of the worst seasons from a franchise QB, who is credible in this scenario? You, or the 2/3rds, because his peers surely thought he was worthy.

i just want to be clear before i continue on, i didnt mean to disrespect u in any way conversing with u on this and if i did i apologize. i dont like how ur turning this into im not credible thing.

u failed to address what i asked, who should go in over him? and my point about rivers was more about if he made it this year then eli could have made it every year too.

i dont think stafford was snubbed, i think the 4 qbs chosen ahead of him were how it should be. stafford did awesome, but he has one of the best wr's of our generation to throw into triple coverage and he comes down with it. cruz wasnt snubbed, he did make the probowl as a first alternate i gues thats a snub somewhat.

and ur point is to discredit the players vote? to u that makes it a joke? im sorry i cannot follow that line of thought at all.

and we already went over the top 100 players, that whole setup was extremely flawed. dont know if u forgot but it was 20% of the players asked and it wasnt "list ur top 100 players" it was list ur top 5 or 10 players whatever it was, and the order in which players voted for u was then made into a points system to determine 100 thru 1. do u think players were gonna vote in a guy like eli at top 5 players in the league? after a 25 int year? guarantee if the top 100 players was done after this season, eli would be top 20 maybe top 10.

but u feel the probowl voting is a joke bc of the player aspect? how would u organize a probowl team? how would players get in? stats dont tell the whole story so how? i agree that aspects of the probowl voting is a joke and some players get in that shouldnt, but i feel that the strong majority of both teams are players who deserved it. u named rivers, and even then he may have been the 3rd best qb in the afc, the afc has a weak qb class. what other players beside rivers made the team that u think is a joke?

again, no disrespect at all, just very confused by ur stance and i think that most would agree with me on that.

the probowl game itself is a huge joke tho i agree with u on that if that was part of ur pointMy point is I don't think the players are credible. The top 100 list, no matter what the system was, which was voting of the top 20 players, still does not change the fact that players like Donavan McNabb and Vonta Leach showed up on player lists more frequently than players like Eli Manning and Matt Schaub.

And I'm not saying you're not credible, but if you think that Rivers, who you say had one of the worst seasons for a franchise QB, and the players vote him in, who is right? I mean, Flacco and Sanchez were considered 'franchise QBs' by their coaches (who you do think are credible), do you think they had better years than Rivers? Or did they have "some of the worst years for a franchise QB too"? I really don't get your logic, because if you don't think that, then I guess they should have been voted over Rivers, and if you do think that then you have seen three of the worst franchise QB years ever, this year? That is pretty odd.

And you think because players have a better knowledge of the game, that their vote means something, which alone is a logical fallacy in your argument, because while that may be true, it doesn't mean that they have the ability to make a good pick for the pro bowl, and this is on display with that top 100 list.

NYGRealityCheck
01-29-2012, 10:48 PM
and that's a wrap as the NFC and AFC continue swapping Pro Bowl victories.

Poor Panthers, Cam Newtown was not accurate to say the least. lol

jjj45
01-29-2012, 11:02 PM
and that's a wrap as the NFC and AFC continue swapping Pro Bowl victories.

Poor Panthers, Cam Newtown was not accurate to say the least. lolyeah Cam got his *** kicked. like the only time I haven't seen Cam with a smile continuously plastered on face.

giantsfan420
01-29-2012, 11:10 PM
The Pro Bowl and the voting for it is a joke.

i disagree with this mentality. the 5 min i did watch, they interviewed gates, rodgers, and another couple players and each one said how much it means to them that they were voted in bc it meant their peers really respect what they've done this year. doug flutie also said that too how it was such a proud moment for him bc it meant that the rest of the league really respected his play that year.

if it was just fan vote or if the fan vote weighed any more than it does i'd agree with that mentality its a joke. but 2/3rds of the vote is strictly players and coaches, people i think have the most knowledge of who deserves it. the fan vote is only 1/3, and even with that, not every fan voting takes it as a joke. i know when i vote i vote for who i really thinks should go. when giants players dont show me they deserve to go i dont even vote. i only voted bc i thought eli, jpp, and cruz deserved it and u couldnt even vote for jpp and cruz. they made it in strictly on their peers votes.

to say its a joke "bc the fans vote" is just flat out wrong. the fan joke doesnt even mean that much in all honesty, its just a way to get them involved. players like for example eli, was 5th in qb voting for the nfc last i checked and coulda even dropped further down. he made it based heavily on a high number of player/coaching votes. i guess i should amend my stance into "yes it is a joke when a player doesnt even play much of the season and still makes it bc he was the #1 fan vote for his position but that happens for like 2 or 3 players out of the entire roster for both sides. the majority of players actually earned it."So Rivers deserves to be in there? Even though " that guy had one of the worst seasons from a franchise qb ive ever seen. "

Looks like Rivers peers really disagree with you on that notion.

And how accurate was that 2010 players top 100 list?

like i said, there are a few players every year who dont deserve it but like 97% of the players do. and even so, the afc didnt have good qb play at all really. brady and then theres a serious drop off in talent. rivers was like one of the top qbs in the afc and that speaks more to the lack of quality qbs in the afc. which qbs do u think got shafted from that? and what other players do u think didnt deserve to go?My point is that the Pro Bowl is a joke, and the voting is too.

You say its not because of the players and coaches vote but you do realize that the QB voting for the AFC was Brady, Ben and Tebow so Rivers got in because of his 2/3rds, his peers who "are credible".

My only purpose is to discredit the players vote, which I think the snubbing of Stafford, Cruz, as well as others and that top 100 players list voted by the players is enough. So how do you figure that 2/3rds (peers) vote Rivers in when you say he had one of the worst seasons from a franchise QB, who is credible in this scenario? You, or the 2/3rds, because his peers surely thought he was worthy.

i just want to be clear before i continue on, i didnt mean to disrespect u in any way conversing with u on this and if i did i apologize. i dont like how ur turning this into im not credible thing.

u failed to address what i asked, who should go in over him? and my point about rivers was more about if he made it this year then eli could have made it every year too.

i dont think stafford was snubbed, i think the 4 qbs chosen ahead of him were how it should be. stafford did awesome, but he has one of the best wr's of our generation to throw into triple coverage and he comes down with it. cruz wasnt snubbed, he did make the probowl as a first alternate i gues thats a snub somewhat.

and ur point is to discredit the players vote? to u that makes it a joke? im sorry i cannot follow that line of thought at all.

and we already went over the top 100 players, that whole setup was extremely flawed. dont know if u forgot but it was 20% of the players asked and it wasnt "list ur top 100 players" it was list ur top 5 or 10 players whatever it was, and the order in which players voted for u was then made into a points system to determine 100 thru 1. do u think players were gonna vote in a guy like eli at top 5 players in the league? after a 25 int year? guarantee if the top 100 players was done after this season, eli would be top 20 maybe top 10.

but u feel the probowl voting is a joke bc of the player aspect? how would u organize a probowl team? how would players get in? stats dont tell the whole story so how? i agree that aspects of the probowl voting is a joke and some players get in that shouldnt, but i feel that the strong majority of both teams are players who deserved it. u named rivers, and even then he may have been the 3rd best qb in the afc, the afc has a weak qb class. what other players beside rivers made the team that u think is a joke?

again, no disrespect at all, just very confused by ur stance and i think that most would agree with me on that.

the probowl game itself is a huge joke tho i agree with u on that if that was part of ur pointMy point is I don't think the players are credible. The top 100 list, no matter what the system was, which was voting of the top 20 players, still does not change the fact that players like Donavan McNabb and Vonta Leach showed up on player lists more frequently than players like Eli Manning and Matt Schaub.

And I'm not saying you're not credible, but if you think that Rivers, who you say had one of the worst seasons for a franchise QB, and the players vote him in, who is right? I mean, Flacco and Sanchez were considered 'franchise QBs' by their coaches (who you do think are credible), do you think they had better years than Rivers? Or did they have "some of the worst years for a franchise QB too"? I really don't get your logic, because if you don't think that, then I guess they should have been voted over Rivers, and if you do think that then you have seen three of the worst franchise QB years ever, this year? That is pretty odd.

And you think because players have a better knowledge of the game, that their vote means something, which alone is a logical fallacy in your argument, because while that may be true, it doesn't mean that they have the ability to make a good pick for the pro bowl, and this is on display with that top 100 list.

maybe i was too hard what i said about rivers. maybe i should restate it as one of the worst years a supposed "elite" franchise qb had. and u focusing on the rivers aspect is a fallacy bc ur using the weakest aspect of my stance and applying it to everything im trying to say.

but can u answer my questions? what players besides rivers who still can be argued as the top 3 or 4 qb in the afc made the probowl that didnt warrant it. who in the probowl got there that had absolutely no business being there. remember i acknowledge a few players probably get in each year that dont deserve it, so unless u can name more than 5 or so players, ur line of reasoning just seems off. the strong majority of players in the probowl had years that warranted it.

and no what i've been saying isnt a logical fallacy bc i believe that the players got it right for the most part, like 95% correct. u referring to the top 100 list is a fallacy bc it has nothing to do with this. but lets not get into fallacy semantics, just address my question, who made the probowl that didnt warrant it? list me a bunch of players that dont deserve to be there, otherwise, how could the players vote be wrong if they actually got it right?

gmen0820
01-29-2012, 11:36 PM
The Pro Bowl and the voting for it is a joke.

i disagree with this mentality. the 5 min i did watch, they interviewed gates, rodgers, and another couple players and each one said how much it means to them that they were voted in bc it meant their peers really respect what they've done this year. doug flutie also said that too how it was such a proud moment for him bc it meant that the rest of the league really respected his play that year.

if it was just fan vote or if the fan vote weighed any more than it does i'd agree with that mentality its a joke. but 2/3rds of the vote is strictly players and coaches, people i think have the most knowledge of who deserves it. the fan vote is only 1/3, and even with that, not every fan voting takes it as a joke. i know when i vote i vote for who i really thinks should go. when giants players dont show me they deserve to go i dont even vote. i only voted bc i thought eli, jpp, and cruz deserved it and u couldnt even vote for jpp and cruz. they made it in strictly on their peers votes.

to say its a joke "bc the fans vote" is just flat out wrong. the fan joke doesnt even mean that much in all honesty, its just a way to get them involved. players like for example eli, was 5th in qb voting for the nfc last i checked and coulda even dropped further down. he made it based heavily on a high number of player/coaching votes. i guess i should amend my stance into "yes it is a joke when a player doesnt even play much of the season and still makes it bc he was the #1 fan vote for his position but that happens for like 2 or 3 players out of the entire roster for both sides. the majority of players actually earned it."So Rivers deserves to be in there? Even though " that guy had one of the worst seasons from a franchise qb ive ever seen. "

Looks like Rivers peers really disagree with you on that notion.

And how accurate was that 2010 players top 100 list?

like i said, there are a few players every year who dont deserve it but like 97% of the players do. and even so, the afc didnt have good qb play at all really. brady and then theres a serious drop off in talent. rivers was like one of the top qbs in the afc and that speaks more to the lack of quality qbs in the afc. which qbs do u think got shafted from that? and what other players do u think didnt deserve to go?My point is that the Pro Bowl is a joke, and the voting is too.

You say its not because of the players and coaches vote but you do realize that the QB voting for the AFC was Brady, Ben and Tebow so Rivers got in because of his 2/3rds, his peers who "are credible".

My only purpose is to discredit the players vote, which I think the snubbing of Stafford, Cruz, as well as others and that top 100 players list voted by the players is enough. So how do you figure that 2/3rds (peers) vote Rivers in when you say he had one of the worst seasons from a franchise QB, who is credible in this scenario? You, or the 2/3rds, because his peers surely thought he was worthy.

i just want to be clear before i continue on, i didnt mean to disrespect u in any way conversing with u on this and if i did i apologize. i dont like how ur turning this into im not credible thing.

u failed to address what i asked, who should go in over him? and my point about rivers was more about if he made it this year then eli could have made it every year too.

i dont think stafford was snubbed, i think the 4 qbs chosen ahead of him were how it should be. stafford did awesome, but he has one of the best wr's of our generation to throw into triple coverage and he comes down with it. cruz wasnt snubbed, he did make the probowl as a first alternate i gues thats a snub somewhat.

and ur point is to discredit the players vote? to u that makes it a joke? im sorry i cannot follow that line of thought at all.

and we already went over the top 100 players, that whole setup was extremely flawed. dont know if u forgot but it was 20% of the players asked and it wasnt "list ur top 100 players" it was list ur top 5 or 10 players whatever it was, and the order in which players voted for u was then made into a points system to determine 100 thru 1. do u think players were gonna vote in a guy like eli at top 5 players in the league? after a 25 int year? guarantee if the top 100 players was done after this season, eli would be top 20 maybe top 10.

but u feel the probowl voting is a joke bc of the player aspect? how would u organize a probowl team? how would players get in? stats dont tell the whole story so how? i agree that aspects of the probowl voting is a joke and some players get in that shouldnt, but i feel that the strong majority of both teams are players who deserved it. u named rivers, and even then he may have been the 3rd best qb in the afc, the afc has a weak qb class. what other players beside rivers made the team that u think is a joke?

again, no disrespect at all, just very confused by ur stance and i think that most would agree with me on that.

the probowl game itself is a huge joke tho i agree with u on that if that was part of ur pointMy point is I don't think the players are credible. The top 100 list, no matter what the system was, which was voting of the top 20 players, still does not change the fact that players like Donavan McNabb and Vonta Leach showed up on player lists more frequently than players like Eli Manning and Matt Schaub.

And I'm not saying you're not credible, but if you think that Rivers, who you say had one of the worst seasons for a franchise QB, and the players vote him in, who is right? I mean, Flacco and Sanchez were considered 'franchise QBs' by their coaches (who you do think are credible), do you think they had better years than Rivers? Or did they have "some of the worst years for a franchise QB too"? I really don't get your logic, because if you don't think that, then I guess they should have been voted over Rivers, and if you do think that then you have seen three of the worst franchise QB years ever, this year? That is pretty odd.

And you think because players have a better knowledge of the game, that their vote means something, which alone is a logical fallacy in your argument, because while that may be true, it doesn't mean that they have the ability to make a good pick for the pro bowl, and this is on display with that top 100 list.

maybe i was too hard what i said about rivers. maybe i should restate it as one of the worst years a supposed "elite" franchise qb had. and u focusing on the rivers aspect is a fallacy bc ur using the weakest aspect of my stance and applying it to everything im trying to say.

but can u answer my questions? what players besides rivers who still can be argued as the top 3 or 4 qb in the afc made the probowl that didnt warrant it. who in the probowl got there that had absolutely no business being there. remember i acknowledge a few players probably get in each year that dont deserve it, so unless u can name more than 5 or so players, ur line of reasoning just seems off. the strong majority of players in the probowl had years that warranted it.

and no what i've been saying isnt a logical fallacy bc i believe that the players got it right for the most part, like 95% correct. u referring to the top 100 list is a fallacy bc it has nothing to do with this. but lets not get into fallacy semantics, just address my question, who made the probowl that didnt warrant it? list me a bunch of players that dont deserve to be there, otherwise, how could the players vote be wrong if they actually got it right?So me wanting to discredit the players vote and bringing up an example of players voting gone horribly wrong is a fallacy? Which one?

And me focusing on Rivers isn't a fallacy. It's the focal point of my argument because I don't understand your logic of saying that the players and coaches vote got Eli as a sign of credibility when it did for Rivers too, but he has one of the worst years for a franchise QB that you've ever seen, yet he gets in with the players and coaches vote too. If your argument was water tight, you could plug both variables in and it still makes sense. The thing is, I think Rivers does deserve to be in the Pro Bowl in my opinion but obviously not in yours since he had one of the worst years for a franchise QB you've ever seen.

As for players who don't deserve to be there, that's not the case. Everyone there is a good player but Asomugha should be in over Tillman, Cruz should be in over Jennings, Stafford over Newton, Turner or Peterson, Navorro Bowman should be in.

But you've rephrased your Rivers stance, so you definitely avoid a double standard in your argument, which is a good first step. Now you just have to prove to me that players votes are credible like I've done the opposite with that error laden top 100 list, which had a top 20 players frequented with the likes of Donavan McNabb or Vonta Leach over many more deserved players, not to mention the rankings were pretty sketchy too. And I'm sure you can say something like, I think players would know a good deal about their profession, but of course, that would be a logical fallacy.

giantsfan420
01-29-2012, 11:56 PM
The Pro Bowl and the voting for it is a joke.

i disagree with this mentality. the 5 min i did watch, they interviewed gates, rodgers, and another couple players and each one said how much it means to them that they were voted in bc it meant their peers really respect what they've done this year. doug flutie also said that too how it was such a proud moment for him bc it meant that the rest of the league really respected his play that year.

if it was just fan vote or if the fan vote weighed any more than it does i'd agree with that mentality its a joke. but 2/3rds of the vote is strictly players and coaches, people i think have the most knowledge of who deserves it. the fan vote is only 1/3, and even with that, not every fan voting takes it as a joke. i know when i vote i vote for who i really thinks should go. when giants players dont show me they deserve to go i dont even vote. i only voted bc i thought eli, jpp, and cruz deserved it and u couldnt even vote for jpp and cruz. they made it in strictly on their peers votes.

to say its a joke "bc the fans vote" is just flat out wrong. the fan joke doesnt even mean that much in all honesty, its just a way to get them involved. players like for example eli, was 5th in qb voting for the nfc last i checked and coulda even dropped further down. he made it based heavily on a high number of player/coaching votes. i guess i should amend my stance into "yes it is a joke when a player doesnt even play much of the season and still makes it bc he was the #1 fan vote for his position but that happens for like 2 or 3 players out of the entire roster for both sides. the majority of players actually earned it."So Rivers deserves to be in there? Even though " that guy had one of the worst seasons from a franchise qb ive ever seen. "

Looks like Rivers peers really disagree with you on that notion.

And how accurate was that 2010 players top 100 list?

like i said, there are a few players every year who dont deserve it but like 97% of the players do. and even so, the afc didnt have good qb play at all really. brady and then theres a serious drop off in talent. rivers was like one of the top qbs in the afc and that speaks more to the lack of quality qbs in the afc. which qbs do u think got shafted from that? and what other players do u think didnt deserve to go?My point is that the Pro Bowl is a joke, and the voting is too.

You say its not because of the players and coaches vote but you do realize that the QB voting for the AFC was Brady, Ben and Tebow so Rivers got in because of his 2/3rds, his peers who "are credible".

My only purpose is to discredit the players vote, which I think the snubbing of Stafford, Cruz, as well as others and that top 100 players list voted by the players is enough. So how do you figure that 2/3rds (peers) vote Rivers in when you say he had one of the worst seasons from a franchise QB, who is credible in this scenario? You, or the 2/3rds, because his peers surely thought he was worthy.

i just want to be clear before i continue on, i didnt mean to disrespect u in any way conversing with u on this and if i did i apologize. i dont like how ur turning this into im not credible thing.

u failed to address what i asked, who should go in over him? and my point about rivers was more about if he made it this year then eli could have made it every year too.

i dont think stafford was snubbed, i think the 4 qbs chosen ahead of him were how it should be. stafford did awesome, but he has one of the best wr's of our generation to throw into triple coverage and he comes down with it. cruz wasnt snubbed, he did make the probowl as a first alternate i gues thats a snub somewhat.

and ur point is to discredit the players vote? to u that makes it a joke? im sorry i cannot follow that line of thought at all.

and we already went over the top 100 players, that whole setup was extremely flawed. dont know if u forgot but it was 20% of the players asked and it wasnt "list ur top 100 players" it was list ur top 5 or 10 players whatever it was, and the order in which players voted for u was then made into a points system to determine 100 thru 1. do u think players were gonna vote in a guy like eli at top 5 players in the league? after a 25 int year? guarantee if the top 100 players was done after this season, eli would be top 20 maybe top 10.

but u feel the probowl voting is a joke bc of the player aspect? how would u organize a probowl team? how would players get in? stats dont tell the whole story so how? i agree that aspects of the probowl voting is a joke and some players get in that shouldnt, but i feel that the strong majority of both teams are players who deserved it. u named rivers, and even then he may have been the 3rd best qb in the afc, the afc has a weak qb class. what other players beside rivers made the team that u think is a joke?

again, no disrespect at all, just very confused by ur stance and i think that most would agree with me on that.

the probowl game itself is a huge joke tho i agree with u on that if that was part of ur pointMy point is I don't think the players are credible. The top 100 list, no matter what the system was, which was voting of the top 20 players, still does not change the fact that players like Donavan McNabb and Vonta Leach showed up on player lists more frequently than players like Eli Manning and Matt Schaub.

And I'm not saying you're not credible, but if you think that Rivers, who you say had one of the worst seasons for a franchise QB, and the players vote him in, who is right? I mean, Flacco and Sanchez were considered 'franchise QBs' by their coaches (who you do think are credible), do you think they had better years than Rivers? Or did they have "some of the worst years for a franchise QB too"? I really don't get your logic, because if you don't think that, then I guess they should have been voted over Rivers, and if you do think that then you have seen three of the worst franchise QB years ever, this year? That is pretty odd.

And you think because players have a better knowledge of the game, that their vote means something, which alone is a logical fallacy in your argument, because while that may be true, it doesn't mean that they have the ability to make a good pick for the pro bowl, and this is on display with that top 100 list.

maybe i was too hard what i said about rivers. maybe i should restate it as one of the worst years a supposed "elite" franchise qb had. and u focusing on the rivers aspect is a fallacy bc ur using the weakest aspect of my stance and applying it to everything im trying to say.

but can u answer my questions? what players besides rivers who still can be argued as the top 3 or 4 qb in the afc made the probowl that didnt warrant it. who in the probowl got there that had absolutely no business being there. remember i acknowledge a few players probably get in each year that dont deserve it, so unless u can name more than 5 or so players, ur line of reasoning just seems off. the strong majority of players in the probowl had years that warranted it.

and no what i've been saying isnt a logical fallacy bc i believe that the players got it right for the most part, like 95% correct. u referring to the top 100 list is a fallacy bc it has nothing to do with this. but lets not get into fallacy semantics, just address my question, who made the probowl that didnt warrant it? list me a bunch of players that dont deserve to be there, otherwise, how could the players vote be wrong if they actually got it right?So me wanting to discredit the players vote and bringing up an example of players voting gone horribly wrong is a fallacy? Which one?

And me focusing on Rivers isn't a fallacy. It's the focal point of my argument because I don't understand your logic of saying that the players and coaches vote got Eli as a sign of credibility when it did for Rivers too, but he has one of the worst years for a franchise QB that you've ever seen, yet he gets in with the players and coaches vote too. If your argument was water tight, you could plug both variables in and it still makes sense. The thing is, I think Rivers does deserve to be in the Pro Bowl in my opinion but obviously not in yours since he had one of the worst years for a franchise QB you've ever seen.

As for players who don't deserve to be there, that's not the case. Everyone there is a good player but Asomugha should be in over Tillman, Cruz should be in over Jennings, Stafford over Newton, Turner or Peterson, Navorro Bowman should be in.

But you've rephrased your Rivers stance, so you definitely avoid a double standard in your argument, which is a good first step. Now you just have to prove to me that players votes are credible like I've done the opposite with that error laden top 100 list, which had a top 20 players frequented with the likes of Donavan McNabb or Vonta Leach over many more deserved players, not to mention the rankings were pretty sketchy too. And I'm sure you can say something like, I think players would know a good deal about their profession, but of course, that would be a logical fallacy.

how is a completely different subject and method of playr voting relevant to the probowl? the top 100 list is def a joke and i agree, but the parameters are completely different and thus irrelevant. to go "the top 100 list is a joke therefore the probowl is too" is a logical fallacy.

again tho, lets not get into logical fallacy semantics. im not trying to present a stance in such a manner that i want others to agree. im merely presenting my opinion, and that is:

while there will always be a few players voted in that shouldnt be probowlers, the strong majority of players that made this years probowl was warranted. even rivers, i can admit that my line of thinking and statement was way off, i allowed my personal bias on him to effect my reasoning, however, in the afc the qb play is weak. what qb's could go over him? maybe flacco? maybe? i cant name another qb from the afc that deserved to go over him, therefore i think the players got that right.
and yes certain players may have more basis for getting in over players that did make it, but does that mean the players voting was a joke? its not as if the players voted in someone that completely didnt deserve it. i would argue every single player in the probowl this year at the least played well enough to warrant players voting for them,

again, which players that were voted in do not deserve to be there? and to say that another player had a better season in some areas does not mean the players got it wrong.

i just simply cannot understand how u feel that players voting for players is a joke. what other system would work better? gm's? scouts? but then the argument can be made that those people didnt face off against the players on the field. i like the player vote bc it goes further than just stats, it goes into how the players felt that other players played as competition. the fan vote, i can agree is a joke but ur not saying that the fan vote is ajoke, ur saying the player vote is a joke and that i simply cannot understand. id think that most everyone would agree with my point on that, although that doesnt mean its right, it just means that it isnt a joke and for the most part, its the best way to actually vote players in.

with that said, its not a big deal and i can see where ur coming from, i just cannot agree with it and i think ur verbiage is way too strong. to call player voting the reason why the probowl is a joke is just imo, off base. that doesnt mean im right, but thats why i ask; what other way would be better? what players that made the probowl absolutely did not deserve to be there?

edit- and i actually do not feel namdi deserved to be a probowler. while he had good parts of the year, his overall play was very up and down and he was embarrassed for a lot of the season. whether or not it was bc of coaching is irrelevant.
the pro bowl is not based on talent or potential, but actual play. and namdi had several games where he flat out didnt play like a probowler. a lot of philly fans were actually very upset with his level of play. maybe what hurt namdi is that people expected a certain level of play from him, and elite revis like level of play. he may not have had a bad year, maybe even had a good year. but he certainly didnt reach the level that he had shown before.

gmen0820
01-30-2012, 12:32 AM
"how is a completely different subject and method of playr voting relevant to the probowl? the top 100 list is def a joke and i agree, but the parameters are completely different and thus irrelevant. to go "the top 100 list is a joke therefore the probowl is too" is a logical fallacy."
-It's not different, players voted on player rankings, that's what the pro bowl is. They were both determined by that year, too. That is one example of how players votes are really not that credible, at least in my estimation.

My main rebuttal and argument to your reasoning was the Rivers statement, but with you knowingly revoking that statement because of a personal bias, I'm in no position to just rag on your opinion, however prior to that, there was as you can see a reasoning flaw for me to point out, because that is really all we are arguing here, reasoning for our opinions on the matter. It'd almost be like me saying midway through the argument that it isn't a joke, it just has a small margin for error maybe 10 percents worth to which you might have agreed to as well.

giantsfan420
01-30-2012, 12:51 AM
"how is a completely different subject and method of playr voting relevant to the probowl? the top 100 list is def a joke and i agree, but the parameters are completely different and thus irrelevant. to go "the top 100 list is a joke therefore the probowl is too" is a logical fallacy."
-It's not different, players voted on player rankings, that's what the pro bowl is. They were both determined by that year, too. That is one example of how players votes are really not that credible, at least in my estimation.

My main rebuttal and argument to your reasoning was the Rivers statement, but with you knowingly revoking that statement because of a personal bias, I'm in no position to just rag on your opinion, however prior to that, there was as you can see a reasoning flaw for me to point out, because that is really all we are arguing here, reasoning for our opinions on the matter. It'd almost be like me saying midway through the argument that it isn't a joke, it just has a small margin for error maybe 10 percents worth to which you might have agreed to as well.

yeah i agree but then are u conceding that the player vote isnt a joke? it may be flawed, but i dont think it warrants being called a joke bc for the most part the players got it right. and i dunno how the player probowl vote works out, if it is the same system to how the top 100 players worked then yes i'd agree, but as far as my understanding goes, the players have almost the same exact ballot as the fans do.

and i was trying to explain that the rivers point was pretty much irrelevant bc still rivers even tho i believe he had a bad season, represented the best choice for afc qb bc there really isn't anyone who i feel should go over him.

edit- and i still dont know how the top 100 vote is relevant to the probowl vote. the only similarity is that the players made votes. the entire voting system is completely different. i see how u feel that it could be an example of the players voting being flawed, but i think u'd agree the top 100 list was pretty off base on several players. the probowl however, for the most part, is not.

eh, truth be told its hard for me to not say the probowl is a joke. the play was a joke, the whole deal is a joke. i just think players voting on the probowl is better than the fan vote. i think the fan vote can be a joke, just like the nba all star game. yao ming was one of the top voted players and made the all star game even tho he hadnt even played in the season. some of that happens in the nfl voting im sure, but for the most part, again, the players got it right. therefore i dont think the player vote is a joke.

gmen0820
01-30-2012, 01:10 AM
Players vote>fan vote.

Just not by much. I really have never viewed the pro bowl as an accomplishment. My favorite award is the Assosciated Press award. JPP made first team all pro, that's incredible.

Any other year Eli wins it too, competition was stiff this year with Brady and Brees breaking Marino's record and Stafford and Rodgers playing excellent as well.

And I wouldn't be conceding my stance on the position, it's just when arguing my reasoning to yours, the role that Rivers served in it being a, what I see as a flaw in your reasoning, when you changed your stance on the Rivers comment, it all becomes subjective in a way.

I'd rather see the Assosciated press team play, but either way there is no motivational factor for the game in itself and we can both agree that the game itself is a joke.

miked1958
01-30-2012, 08:54 AM
and that's a wrap as the NFC and AFC continue swapping Pro Bowl victories. Poor Panthers, Cam Newtown was not accurate to say the least. lolyeah Cam got his *** kicked. like the only time I haven't seen Cam with a smile continuously plastered on face.
</P>


Yea i think he completed more passes to the AFC then he did to his own WRs. what did he wind up throwing 4 picks and overthrew a ton of passes or just threw them into the ground because he was being pursued. </P>


Just a horrible showing</P>

jjj45
01-30-2012, 11:55 AM
and that's a wrap as the NFC and AFC continue swapping Pro Bowl victories. Poor Panthers, Cam Newtown was not accurate to say the least. lolyeah Cam got his *** kicked. like the only time I haven't seen Cam with a smile continuously plastered on face.
</p>


Yea i think he completed more passes to the AFC then he did to his own WRs. what did he wind up throwing 4 picks and overthrew a ton of passes or just threw them into the ground because he was being pursued. </p>


Just a horrible showing</p>lol cuz I guess no one likes him. None of the other NFC QB's were getting half the pressure Cam got. (lol try no pressure)

The only guy he can throw the ball to is Steve Smith.