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View Full Version : Kurt Warner: Eli is not a HOFer!



davmac2BB
02-08-2012, 11:43 AM
Kurt Warner's assessment of Eli chances of being a Hall of Famer.

NY Post Article (http://www.nypost.com/p/sports/giants/whiny_warner_eli_not_hall_that_worthy_9695qksEVyuF bjasNScfQO)

Reading it I kind of got the feeling that this was more about Eli's 2-0 SB record looking better than his 1-2 SB record.

bLuereverie
02-08-2012, 11:45 AM
Maybe Eli believes he himself is not a HoF candidate right now. It'll push him to win 2 or 3 more.

VBGiantsFan
02-08-2012, 11:47 AM
Kurt Warner's assessment of Eli chances of being a Hall of Famer.

NY Post Article (http://http://www.nypost.com/p/sports/giants/whiny_warner_eli_not_hall_that_worthy_9695qksEVyuF bjasNScfQO)

Reading it I kind of got the feeling that this was more about Eli's 2-0 SB record looking better than his 1-2 SB record.


Who cares what Warner has to say. Kurt Warner is not a hall of famer now, and never will be. Eli has a better chance than he does and still have 6 or 7 more years to get another Superbowl and improve his stats.

Move along Kurt Warner.

It's ironic that the only former players that support Eli outside of Michael Strahan are Michael Irving and Dieon Sanders, two hated Cowboys.

NYGinIN
02-08-2012, 11:49 AM
Didn't Warner eventually lose his job to Eli......? I have always sensed a degree of resentment in Warner.

CDN_G-FAN
02-08-2012, 11:50 AM
He's probably not. Not at this point in his career.</P>


Give it a few more years though and there won't be a question.</P>

Kruunch
02-08-2012, 11:54 AM
Kurt Warner's assessment of Eli chances of being a Hall of Famer.

NY Post Article (http://www.nypost.com/p/sports/giants/whiny_warner_eli_not_hall_that_worthy_9695qksEVyuF bjasNScfQO)

Reading it I kind of got the feeling that this was more about Eli's 2-0 SB record looking better than his 1-2 SB record.


I agree with Warner ... if Eli tetired today, he's not a HoF QB.

If he plays another 4-5 years with an average sampling of what he's done up until now (even without another SB) then he is.

In my opinion of course.

lttaylor56
02-08-2012, 12:00 PM
Interesting statement by Kurt. I thought that Eli's record, # of SB;s victories, sb mvp's at this point is better than Kurt's. Except for maybe completion %.

Which leads me to my next point.

Kurt was asked if he considered himself eligible for the HOF and he said yes.

Kruunch
02-08-2012, 12:13 PM
Interesting statement by Kurt. I thought that Eli's record, # of SB;s victories, sb mvp's at this point is better than Kurt's. Except for maybe completion %.

Which leads me to my next point.

Kurt was asked if he considered himself eligible for the HOF and he said yes.

Eli to date: 58.4 (completion %), 27579 yards, 185 TDs, 129 Ints

Warner: 65.5 comp. %, 32344 yards, 208 TDs, 128 Ints.

Based on stats and accomplishment, Kurt Warner is definite HoF. 3 SB appearances, 1 SB MVP, 2 NFL MVPs (which is huge), 4 pro bowls, x2 all-pro, a great story and part of the "Greatest Show on Turf".

Except for career completion percentage, Eli is just about at Warners stats now ... Eli will easily eclipse Warner's stats barring injury which will be enough with 2 SB MVPs to put Eli in the HoF at the least.

But as of today ... Kurt IS a HoF candidate and Eli isn't (imo).

yoeddy
02-08-2012, 12:41 PM
Didn't Warner eventually lose his job to Eli......? I have always sensed a degree of resentment in Warner.

Kurt Warner has had this very squeaky clean image and reputation over the years, but in recent months he definitely seems to have a liitle bit of resentment (or something) towards Eli....strange...

burier
02-08-2012, 12:41 PM
Once again we've confused the Hall Of FAME with the Hall of STATS.

Kurt Warner may get in but not any time soon and he won't get in before Eli so....if he was a smart man he'd be rooting for Eli to get in.

Eli I believe gets in because of the fashion in which he delivered two superbowl championships to one of, if not the most storied franchises in History.

Joe Namath is in based purely on the facts that he conducted himself like a celebrity in New York and he guaranteed a Victory over a team no one thought he could beat.

Eli doesn't have all the Rah Rah but He's delivered a championship on the most improbable run in the history of the sport culminating the in the biggest upset in the history of the sport (Possibly any sport) with the greatest play in Superbowl history (Possibly greatest play in any sport period)

And then he did it again.

If you think Eli Manning isn't going in on the first ballot you are seriously kidding yourself.

(Jesus Christ Curtis Martin is going in and he didn't do anything of note beside finnishing top 5 in rushing yards)

Please be reminded it is the Hall Of Fame and not the hall of stats.

Kurt Warner has some sort of problem with Eli Manning and its painfully obvious. \

Leading up to the Superbowl he went out of his way to say when Eli took over for him that Eli offered "Some of the worst quarterback play" He had ever saw.

Now we all know that Eli stunk the joint up pretty bad his rookie year but Kurt Warner seemed pretty desperate to get that off his chest and he didn't present that opinion in a "Look how far he's come" sorta way.

His bias disqualifies his opinion.

yoeddy
02-08-2012, 12:43 PM
Interesting statement by Kurt. I thought that Eli's record, # of SB;s victories, sb mvp's at this point is better than Kurt's. Except for maybe completion %.

Which leads me to my next point.

Kurt was asked if he considered himself eligible for the HOF and he said yes.

Eli to date: 58.4 (completion %), 27579 yards, 185 TDs, 129 Ints

Warner: 65.5 comp. %, 32344 yards, 208 TDs, 128 Ints.

Based on stats and accomplishment, Kurt Warner is definite HoF. 3 SB appearances, 1 SB MVP, 2 NFL MVPs (which is huge), 4 pro bowls, x2 all-pro, a great story and part of the "Greatest Show on Turf".

Except for career completion percentage, Eli is just about at Warners stats now ... Eli will easily eclipse Warner's stats barring injury which will be enough with 2 SB MVPs to put Eli in the HoF at the least.

But as of today ... Kurt IS a HoF candidate and Eli isn't (imo).

If the HoF is about stats, then this is right. But if the HoF is about players who stand out, Manning is deserving...his 4th quarter performances, his 2 SuperBowl MVPs, his durability, etc...these are noteworthy things that make him stand out.

Brandon jacobs
02-08-2012, 12:44 PM
Kurt Warner is a homer. I think we shall see all the jealous homers coming out now...

Toadofsteel
02-08-2012, 12:44 PM
Didn't Warner eventually lose his job to Eli......? I have always sensed a degree of resentment in Warner.

Kurt Warner has had this very squeaky clean image and reputation over the years, but in recent months he definitely seems to have a liitle bit of resentment (or something) towards Eli....strange...

Warner went to the giants because he thought he could win a ring with them. But then he lost his starter job to Eli, and even though Eli went 1-5 in the first 6 games of his career, the giants stuck with him. Then Warner skipped town and went to Arizona, and the rest is history.

Kruunch
02-08-2012, 12:51 PM
Interesting statement by Kurt. I thought that Eli's record, # of SB;s victories, sb mvp's at this point is better than Kurt's. Except for maybe completion %.

Which leads me to my next point.

Kurt was asked if he considered himself eligible for the HOF and he said yes.

Eli to date: 58.4 (completion %), 27579 yards, 185 TDs, 129 Ints

Warner: 65.5 comp. %, 32344 yards, 208 TDs, 128 Ints.

Based on stats and accomplishment, Kurt Warner is definite HoF. 3 SB appearances, 1 SB MVP, 2 NFL MVPs (which is huge), 4 pro bowls, x2 all-pro, a great story and part of the "Greatest Show on Turf".

Except for career completion percentage, Eli is just about at Warners stats now ... Eli will easily eclipse Warner's stats barring injury which will be enough with 2 SB MVPs to put Eli in the HoF at the least.

But as of today ... Kurt IS a HoF candidate and Eli isn't (imo).

If the HoF is about stats, then this is right. But if the HoF is about players who stand out, Manning is deserving...his 4th quarter performances, his 2 SuperBowl MVPs, his durability, etc...these are noteworthy things that make him stand out.

The HoF is about both and more (which is why I mentioned Warner's backstory).

But if this were Eli's last game, the first knock on him being in the HoF is having a short career.

Then it's lack of stats.

Finally it would be lack of Pro Bowls and All Pros and league MVPs.

The ONLY areas Eli's legacy has right now are his Super Bowl appearances and MVPs and a couple of Pro Bowls. The fact of him being clutch is also in the mix. But as of this second ... I don't think it would be enough.

However there is no doubt in my mind that Eli plays another 5 years (at least) and even if he just compiles mediocre stats during that time, he will have built up enough to easily warrant eventual inclusion in the HoF.

If he puts up another SB win, a 3rd SB MVP and 2 or 3 more Pro Bowls ... he'd be a first ballot guy.

And again, this is obviously all supposition ... just my feelings based on how the HoF has worked up until now.

P.S. - While I believe Kurt Warner is HoF worthy, I do not believe he is first ballot worthy.

Bing Crosby
02-08-2012, 12:56 PM
If the HoF is about stats, then this is right. But if the HoF is about players who stand out, Manning is deserving...his 4th quarter performances, his 2 SuperBowl MVPs, his durability, etc...these are noteworthy things that make him stand out.

I think that's the thing. I'm not sure exactly what it means to be in the HOF. Is it best stats alone? Do you get in with a combination of stats and your "story arc" as a player? I mean look at Broadway Joe. Is he in because of his stats, or because of his story?

I think it's safe to say that the HOF at least today, is a combination of stats and your "story arc". Eli has good stats, and a good story arc. Should the HOF be like that? IDK, but it certainly seems to be that way at least to me.

He's the man who lead the offense that stopped the unbeatable Pat's with the most famous scoring drive in SB history. He's the forth quarter assassin. In the year that his fellow NFL players insulted him by not putting him on the top 100 list, he showed just how hard of a worker he is and how much he had changed. When a DJ asked him if he was Elite, he said yes and turned the laughs of some people into cheers to the point where now some people who only a few months ago were laughing at him are saying he is an elite amongst the QB's of today.

It's a great story and if he decided to retire, I think it would sell, and in the end that's all he really needs to do. Sell his story to the voters and he is in. With that said though I don't think he is going to put his pen down yet, he has a lot of story left to write.

Delicreep
02-08-2012, 12:58 PM
He's probably not.* Not at this point in his career.</P>


Give it a few more years though and there won't be a question.</P>

I agree with Warner, although he would have been better served if he had just said it's too soon to make that kind of judgement about anyone in the class of 2004.

Bing Crosby
02-08-2012, 01:11 PM
I agree with Warner, although he would have been better served if he had just said it's too soon to make that kind of judgement about anyone in the class of 2004.

See if the question is time I think Warner is completely wrong, because let's be honest the only way the Eli doesn't play a few more years is because of injury or something even more shocking such as something that is life threatening, such as (God Forbid) a car wreck. If that happens the storyline isn't going to be "Eli didn't play long enough", it's going to be "Eli was robbed of his best playing years! Look at how he was just coming around and that was stolen from him in the prime of his life."

IMO Eli's biggest threat of not getting into the HOF is if he reverts to old form. That's really the only thing the slows him down. If he gets hurt or suffers a great tragedy I think he's in, because then he has the "What if" factor on his side.

davmac2BB
02-08-2012, 02:14 PM
I'm going to preface this comment by saying I never wanted Kurt Warner on the team in 2004 and I was very critical of when he arrived. And this article starts my basic argument about why I thought he was a bad fit for the Giants in 2004. Kurt Warner comes off sounding very bitter that he was the 'bridge' between the Fassel/Collins era and the Coughlin/Manning era in NY. When he was first signed, I stated that I thought Warner was wrong for the job because he didn't see himself as a stopgap to Manning's eventual assent to the QB position and the thought he should be the starter no matter what. The problem is that Warner is not looking back at the 2004 season realistically. That 2004 team was not built to win, and that 5-2 start was more of a product of beating some really bad teams than it was the Giants being a playoff contender. I mean for Christ Sakes Warner tossed an int in the red zone and lost to the Lions! Warner needs to realize that Tom Coughlin had the good sense to know that fighting to a 9-7 record and a near playoff miss (which I would probably say would have been what Warner could have accomplished if he finished the team) paled in comparison to starting the Eli Manning era when he did. If you looked at the Games, Warner's play in 2004 was average at best (his best game that season was against the Browns). The bottom line is that Warner is needs to realize that for all of his success in St Louis and Arizona, he was NOT a good QB in 2004. If he had been there wouldn't have been anyway the Giants would have been able to sign him a few weeks before Training Camp.

As for Eli's HOF status. I think he's on the road. String together a few more seasons like 2011 and I think he's a lock, because I always think that what makes a player HOF worthy is if over your career you were consistently thought about as one of the top players at your position in your era of play (and yes I realize that all eras will overlapp to some point), but when we look back upon this decade of play, if we can say that Eli belonged in that group of elite QBs, then I will say he's a lock for sure. B

But again, I think he's on the road.

Kruunch
02-08-2012, 02:17 PM
He's probably not.* Not at this point in his career.</P>


Give it a few more years though and there won't be a question.</P>

I agree with Warner, although he would have been better served if he had just said it's too soon to make that kind of judgement about anyone in the class of 2004.

+1

ebick
02-08-2012, 02:40 PM
I agree that Eli is not a lock for the Hall right now. When I think about Brady, I think about the years that he's been QB and how many of those times they did not make the play-offs. </P>


On the other hand, and I have said this before, I believe that this season is the beginning of the fruit bearing years from a maturation process that is now complete. </P>


I do believe that when all is said and done, the hall will be calling....</P>

SackingMyths
02-08-2012, 02:53 PM
He's not a HOFer...yet.

I don't think Warner said anything inflammatory or had a secret resentment towards Eli. Nothing about the guy suggests anything but that of an honest, genuine guy.

Just because (most) analysts don't line up and bow to the Giants, doesn't mean they hate the Giants or have it in for us.

Espn...very different story, and it took me a while to figure their act out. They'd rather create controversy because it creates a buzz, and as Howard Stern proved- if you hate something, you'll get better ratings.

wrek537emc
02-08-2012, 03:24 PM
Eli is a lock for the HOF.

Everyone is saying "he lead the league in interceptions last year!"....

Well.... a lot of those were tipped balls, and the other factor was our defense last year couldnt stop anyone. If teams are leading us by 2-3 TDS in the 4th QTR.. .Eli is GOING to HAVE to throw the BALL.

A lot of those balls shouldn't have been thrown, but he had to do it to attempt to keep the TEAM in the game.

That's why Eli is a HOF'er, he puts team first.. not his numbers. If he cared about the HOF and his numbers.... he would be like "well my D can't stop anyone, so i'm just gonna call a running play and wait for next week."

Tony Bruno
02-08-2012, 03:26 PM
No he isnt yet!!! ;-)