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CDN_G-FAN
02-09-2012, 09:45 PM
this is slightly misleading because of how cap hits vary year-to-year, but it still provides perspective.

From a cap perspective:

Bradshaw/Jacobs together are a $2.3 million higher cap hit than if our backfield was Adrian Peterson and Danny Ware.

The difference in cap hit between Chris Canty and Justin Smith (49ers) is $545,000.

We could save $2.85 million against our cap if we were starting Troy Polamalu instead of Antrelle Rolle.

If we could scratch up an extra $840,000 of cap space we could start Nick Mangold for the same cap hit as David Baas.

i know, i know, cap hits change , JPP is way below what he's worth on the field, yadda, yadda, yadda.

i'm pointing this out in a desperate attempt to have fans temper their expectations of what we can do with our roster next year.

In Reese i Trust.

NJGIANTinNC
02-09-2012, 09:54 PM
D. - all of the above.

Drez
02-09-2012, 10:08 PM
Also, all those contracts were written at a time when the projected cap for these upcoming years would have been $20m+ higher under the old CBA.</P>


JR is going to be busy restructuring a lot of contracts and/or cutting players this offseason.</P>


And CDN, you should know better than to think that more the a few people around here will react rationally about our cap situation come FA. Everyone will be pissed we didn't sign [insert marquee FA here] when FA rolls around. </P>


Much like this past offseason.......................</P>

CDN_G-FAN
02-09-2012, 10:38 PM
Also, all those contracts were written at a time when the projected cap for these upcoming years would have been $20m+ higher under the old CBA.</P>


JR is going to be busy restructuring a lot of contracts and/or cutting players this offseason.</P>


And CDN, you should know better than to think that more the a few people around here will react rationally about our cap situation come FA. Everyone will be pissed we didn't sign [insert marquee FA here] when FA rolls around. </P>


Much like this past offseason.......................</P>

i hate free agents.

free agents are most of our biggest cap numbers this year.

raintheory
02-09-2012, 10:39 PM
so your telling me cause of the cap were going to lose alot of playmakers that helped us get here to begin with?

i highly doubt reese allows this too happen his job is on the line. if the eagles can do what they did in free agency last year we can find a way to retain atleast 95% of the original roster.

we dont need bass / or deihl i love deihl alot but beatty will be back and i think give boothe an offseason to learn center he can do the job and petrus can step in and be a good LG

flimflam
02-09-2012, 11:14 PM
Canadian, why does it appear that JR is kind of a nob when it comes to finagling with the cap.

I mean year in and out does it not seem like the Eagles, Redskins, and Cowboys GMs play with the cap better?

Granted, you cannot argue with JR's success, and this even goes back to Accorsi' days, but wouldn't it be nice to have the ability to sign someone if we wanted to fill a hole?

We pick our spots with free agents, and do ok - you can't been exclusive in either way of building, ie draft or FAs only - but this year, for example, it would be fantastic to sign a left tackle and tight end for example, and draft hella defense to fill our needs.

Why does it seem like other GMs can sign somebody on a whim to a big contract even when they are over the cap, and we seem to always be operating jumping on one leg with a hand tied behind our back in a street fight?

ELIteManning
02-09-2012, 11:21 PM
i highly doubt reese allows this too happen his job is on the line.

You seriously think Reese's job is on the line right now ?!? I think the eagles went into last season with like 45+ million of cap room. They had a ton of huge contracts off the books. That is the only reason they were able to sign people the way they did.

zigwontdieNYG
02-10-2012, 02:47 PM
LETS GET PEYTON HILLIS

bansaw
02-10-2012, 02:53 PM
haha my Ihop nice


JR plays the cap, he worked us room a couple years back with Expected to Achieve bonuses that were never able to achieve

CDN_G-FAN
02-10-2012, 02:57 PM
Canadian, why does it appear that JR is kind of a nob when it comes to finagling with the cap. I mean year in and out does it not seem like the Eagles, Redskins, and Cowboys GMs play with the cap better? Granted, you cannot argue with JR's success, and this even goes back to Accorsi' days, but wouldn't it be nice to have the ability to sign someone if we wanted to fill a hole? We pick our spots with free agents, and do ok - you can't been exclusive in either way of building, ie draft or FAs only - but this year, for example, it would be fantastic to sign a left tackle and tight end for example, and draft hella defense to fill our needs. Why does it seem like other GMs can sign somebody on a whim to a big contract even when they are over the cap, and we seem to always be operating jumping on one leg with a hand tied behind our back in a street fight?</P>


i think he takes some FA shots in spots (DT, safety) and then drafts replacements so when he gets to the higher cap years of the contracts, he has the option of asking for money back or he can cut they guys with young talanet available to fill in.</P>


Joeseph and Austin are great examples of the kind of insurance he was hoping for when he got to Canty's higher cap years.</P>


same thing with Chad Jones and Antrelle Rolle.</P>


due to injury some of these things haven't worked out for us, but i think that was his mindset.</P>


in terms of the other teams in our division, the only one that seems to have better cap management is the Eagles.</P>


i guess you could make a case for the Redskins, but they don't have as much talent in the skill positions as we do, which means they have alot more money available.</P>


the Cowboys are no better with the cap than us. i remember Jerry in the offseason in a interview with the NFL network, and he said they were going to have some 'challenges' with the cap this year, and they certainly do.</P>


</P>


I absolutely can't argue with Reese's roster success.I'm interested to seehow he sustains our current level of talentwith our cap challenges.</P>


bottom line,given some of the skillplayers we have (Eli, Snee, CWeb, JPP, Tuck) most fans will have to accept that alot ofour improvement each year is going to have to come fromdrafting insteadof FA.</P>

G-Man67
02-10-2012, 02:59 PM
i realize the -$1MM, but i don't think we are in that bad of shape and i'm a big believer in continuing to try to build the team thru the draft and even thru undrafted FAs



and let's face it, when you win the Super Bowl, you basically hit the reset button, because there is no way you can fault any decisions that led to winning the Super Bowl ... it's really only decisions going forward now that anyone can complain about



i whined about Canty's contract, but there is no way in heck now that i would use my time machine and change that move, so it is all about what we do going forward now

Itlan
02-10-2012, 03:10 PM
KMac's contract being up, Jacobs getting cut or restructured, Canty and Rolle and hopefully Baas getting restructured, and dealing Osi would free up a ton of space.

MattMeyerBud
02-10-2012, 03:19 PM
so your telling me cause of the cap were going to lose alot of playmakers that helped us get here to begin with?

i highly doubt reese allows this too happen his job is on the line. if the eagles can do what they did in free agency last year we can find a way to retain atleast 95% of the original roster.

we dont need bass / or deihl i love deihl alot but beatty will be back and i think give boothe an offseason to learn center he can do the job and petrus can step in and be a good LG


that happens no matter what

Why would Reese's job be on th eline? He grabbed two superbowls in 5 years.

Your always going to have player movement, especially with team success. Thats why the draft is so important.

Baas had a great superbowl and the jury is out on him. Cutting him now would be a waste of money for no reason. It wouldn't even give us barely any cap break.

Why would you want to model our team after the eagles? They have no safteys, no LBs, and half of their DLine is garbage. ALL of their oline is garbage

Diehl isn't goign anywhere. When he moved to LT the line got SIGNIFICANTLY better

MattMeyerBud
02-10-2012, 03:19 PM
KMac's contract being up, Jacobs getting cut or restructured, Canty and Rolle and hopefully Baas getting restructured, and dealing Osi would free up a ton of space.

good luck getting superbowl champions to take less money

JMFP2
02-10-2012, 03:20 PM
LETS GET PEYTON HILLIS</P>


</P>


Dude, your sig is hilarious!</P>

MattMeyerBud
02-10-2012, 03:24 PM
Canadian, why does it appear that JR is kind of a nob when it comes to finagling with the cap. I mean year in and out does it not seem like the Eagles, Redskins, and Cowboys GMs play with the cap better? Granted, you cannot argue with JR's success, and this even goes back to Accorsi' days, but wouldn't it be nice to have the ability to sign someone if we wanted to fill a hole? We pick our spots with free agents, and do ok - you can't been exclusive in either way of building, ie draft or FAs only - but this year, for example, it would be fantastic to sign a left tackle and tight end for example, and draft hella defense to fill our needs. Why does it seem like other GMs can sign somebody on a whim to a big contract even when they are over the cap, and we seem to always be operating jumping on one leg with a hand tied behind our back in a street fight?</p>


i think he takes some FA shots in spots (DT, safety) and then drafts replacements so when he gets to the higher cap years of the contracts, he has the option of asking for money back or he can cut they guys with young talanet available to fill in.</p>


Joeseph and Austin are great examples of the kind of insurance he was hoping for when he got to Canty's higher cap years.</p>


same thing with Chad Jones and Antrelle Rolle.</p>


due to injury some of these things haven't worked out for us, but i think that was his mindset.</p>


in terms of the other teams in our division, the only one that seems to have better cap management is the Eagles.</p>


i guess you could make a case for the Redskins, but they don't have as much talent in the skill positions as we do, which means they have alot more money available.</p>


the Cowboys are no better with the cap than us. i remember Jerry in the offseason in a interview with the NFL network, and he said they were going to have some 'challenges' with the cap this year, and they certainly do.</p>



I absolutely can't argue with Reese's roster success.I'm interested to seehow he sustains our current level of talentwith our cap challenges.</p>


bottom line,given some of the skillplayers we have (Eli, Snee, CWeb, JPP, Tuck) most fans will have to accept that alot ofour improvement each year is going to have to come fromdrafting insteadof FA.</p>

Actually I couldn't disagree more.

Joseph was drafted because Cofield had been mediocre at that point.

I think Austin was a value pick that was brought here because we did lose Cofield after he blew up and Joseph hadn't shown much. I think Canty was always going to be the rock at DT for us.

I think Chad Jones was drafted more to replace KP (sorry). KP's injury prob scared reese. Plus we use 3 saftey sets. I mean I doubt Reese drafted Jones, to replace Antrell Rolle who he had just signed 3 weeks earlier at that point.

Absolutely, our draft over the next 2 years will be instrumental due to the cap restrictions

G-Man67
02-10-2012, 03:29 PM
so your telling me cause of the cap were going to lose alot of playmakers that helped us get here to begin with?

i highly doubt reese allows this too happen his job is on the line. if the eagles can do what they did in free agency last year we can find a way to retain atleast 95% of the original roster.

we dont need bass / or deihl i love deihl alot but beatty will be back and i think give boothe an offseason to learn center he can do the job and petrus can step in and be a good LG


that happens no matter what

Why would Reese's job be on th eline? He grabbed two superbowls in 5 years.

Your always going to have player movement, especially with team success.* Thats why the draft is so important.

Baas had a great superbowl and the jury is out on him.* Cutting him now would be a waste of money for no reason. It wouldn't even give us barely any cap break.*

Why would you want to model our team after the eagles? They have no safteys, no LBs, and half of their DLine is garbage. ALL of their oline is garbage

Diehl isn't goign anywhere.* When he moved to LT the line got SIGNIFICANTLY better


Diehl also played with a broken hand, so it's hard to totally say he can no longer play Guard ... it could have been his hand and a lack of line chemistry after losing O'Hara and Seubert to injury

MattMeyerBud
02-10-2012, 03:29 PM
Canadian, why does it appear that JR is kind of a nob when it comes to finagling with the cap.

I mean year in and out does it not seem like the Eagles, Redskins, and Cowboys GMs play with the cap better?

Granted, you cannot argue with JR's success, and this even goes back to Accorsi' days, but wouldn't it be nice to have the ability to sign someone if we wanted to fill a hole?

We pick our spots with free agents, and do ok - you can't been exclusive in either way of building, ie draft or FAs only - but this year, for example, it would be fantastic to sign a left tackle and tight end for example, and draft hella defense to fill our needs.

Why does it seem like other GMs can sign somebody on a whim to a big contract even when they are over the cap, and we seem to always be operating jumping on one leg with a hand tied behind our back in a street fight?

the guy put together two superbowl teams

how can u say hes been a noobie wtih it?

Hes really only added 4 big free agent contracts wtih Canty, Boley, Bernard, and Baas.

Canty and Boley have paid off...

Bernard was a bad deal (it happens) but once we resigned him this year i think we actually got a value on him. So I guess u can consider that a push

And we had the lockout this year and lost two lineman - we needed a center. We made the best move we can. And while Baas looked bad all year, he stepped up in the superbowl. Too early to decide whether it was a bad move or not

MattMeyerBud
02-10-2012, 03:31 PM
so your telling me cause of the cap were going to lose alot of playmakers that helped us get here to begin with?

i highly doubt reese allows this too happen his job is on the line. if the eagles can do what they did in free agency last year we can find a way to retain atleast 95% of the original roster.

we dont need bass / or deihl i love deihl alot but beatty will be back and i think give boothe an offseason to learn center he can do the job and petrus can step in and be a good LG


that happens no matter what

Why would Reese's job be on th eline? He grabbed two superbowls in 5 years.

Your always going to have player movement, especially with team success. Thats why the draft is so important.

Baas had a great superbowl and the jury is out on him. Cutting him now would be a waste of money for no reason. It wouldn't even give us barely any cap break.

Why would you want to model our team after the eagles? They have no safteys, no LBs, and half of their DLine is garbage. ALL of their oline is garbage

Diehl isn't goign anywhere. When he moved to LT the line got SIGNIFICANTLY better


Diehl also played with a broken hand, so it's hard to totally say he can no longer play Guard ... it could have been his hand and a lack of line chemistry after losing O'Hara and Seubert to injury

true good point

some people just have to realize that sometimes having a tight cap is actually a sign that you've been doing something right with the draft.

pica01
02-10-2012, 04:15 PM
To me,Reese,like Coughlin,is now untouchable.My only concern is his cap management and I don't pretend to be an expert.Somehow the Eagles were 25 million under the cap last year and we were capped out and lost Boss and Smith and couldn't make Osi happy. We're up against the cap again this offseason and have some tough decisions to make.Manningham,like Boss,is probably gonna get an offer we can't match and we'll probably lose him.Steve Smith is much cheaper and seems like a perfect fit.He'll be looking for a one yr deal where he can produce and reestablish his value looking towards getting a multiyear offer for 2014 on.Before he got hurt he was our #1 and got doubled alot.As our #3 and healthy he should thrive.And he was Eli's security blanket on third down.Move Cruz outside and Smith could be very Welkerlike from the slot.A 3rd down nightmare to single cover. We need a RB so even If jacobs restructures I don't see any chance he returns.Bradshaw's back regardless, I would think.I expect we'll pick a rb in the 1st 3 rounds.And I'll never question Reese again whenever he takes a DE. Osi,however, is a problem again next year.At 4 million he's a no brainer.But at 30,can we really expect Osi to play another yr without a new deal.And we might not have the cap space to give it to him,even it we wanted to.As a free agent many teams would look at him as a Charles Haley type.A pass rushing specialist.He would get some nice cash.I would only trade him if someone gave us a 2nd round,3rd at least pick for him.Maybe,someone like Eli or Tuck will step up and offer to restructure next years dollars to a later year to reward Osi and keep him.I could see Eli doing that.In fact,I'm gonna start a new thread on that subject.

nygsb42champs
02-10-2012, 04:17 PM
JR has his work cut out for him again this off season.

pica01
02-10-2012, 04:18 PM
By the way,I spaced and used separate paragraphs and when I posted it came up like this.

MattMeyerBud
02-10-2012, 04:30 PM
To me,Reese,like Coughlin,is now untouchable.My only concern is his cap management and I don't pretend to be an expert.Somehow the Eagles were 25 million under the cap last year and we were capped out and lost Boss and Smith and couldn't make Osi happy. We're up against the cap again this offseason and have some tough decisions to make.Manningham,like Boss,is probably gonna get an offer we can't match and we'll probably lose him.Steve Smith is much cheaper and seems like a perfect fit.He'll be looking for a one yr deal where he can produce and reestablish his value looking towards getting a multiyear offer for 2014 on.Before he got hurt he was our #1 and got doubled alot.As our #3 and healthy he should thrive.And he was Eli's security blanket on third down.Move Cruz outside and Smith could be very Welkerlike from the slot.A 3rd down nightmare to single cover. We need a RB so even If jacobs restructures I don't see any chance he returns.Bradshaw's back regardless, I would think.I expect we'll pick a rb in the 1st 3 rounds.And I'll never question Reese again whenever he takes a DE. Osi,however, is a problem again next year.At 4 million he's a no brainer.But at 30,can we really expect Osi to play another yr without a new deal.And we might not have the cap space to give it to him,even it we wanted to.As a free agent many teams would look at him as a Charles Haley type.A pass rushing specialist.He would get some nice cash.I would only trade him if someone gave us a 2nd round,3rd at least pick for him.Maybe,someone like Eli or Tuck will step up and offer to restructure next years dollars to a later year to reward Osi and keep him.I could see Eli doing that.In fact,I'm gonna start a new thread on that subject.

They were under the cap with MAJOR holes on their team. Not only were we a more rounded team, but we had depth.

Thats also the reason we were capped out. Then the great drafting class he had rom 07, we're coming off their rookie contracts and heavily outproduced what they were making. This is a testament to his drafting skills, not a knock on his cap skills.

Plus the cap dropping wit hthe CBA didn't help at all either.

Manningham is as good as gone.

I wouldn't mind Smith back if healthy either.

Slight chance Jacobs is gone, but i still say he stays for the final year of his deal. He'll prob take less and more guaranteed and cut his cap number down. Reese carried 4 RBs for most of this year, they love the guys we got - i doubt we draft a high RB. Infact barring an unbelievable value that we can't pass up - i say the earliest we draft a RB is in the 5th (if we draft one).

Osi is a question mark. If we can't come to terms wtih him (and he needs to be more realistic) then he needs to be traded and then I want to draft another DE. I never thought i'd say that for at least a few more years

2nd or bust - somebody will give it

Tuck isn't making a big number in comparison to his performance as well, so i wouldn't expect that to happen. Eli could do it, but hes already done it once. Just not sure its a realistic thing to ask after they won a ring.

G-Man67
02-10-2012, 04:33 PM
To me,Reese,like Coughlin,is now untouchable.My only concern is his cap management and I don't pretend to be an expert.Somehow the Eagles were 25 million under the cap last year and we were capped out and lost Boss and Smith and couldn't make Osi happy. We're up against the cap again this offseason and have some tough decisions to make.Manningham,like Boss,is probably gonna get an offer we can't match and we'll probably lose him.Steve Smith is much cheaper and seems like a perfect fit.He'll be looking for a one yr deal where he can produce and reestablish his value looking towards getting a multiyear offer for 2014 on.Before he got hurt he was our #1 and got doubled alot.As our #3 and healthy he should thrive.And he was Eli's security blanket on third down.Move Cruz outside and Smith could be very Welkerlike from the slot.A 3rd down nightmare to single cover. We need a RB so even If jacobs restructures I don't see any chance he returns.Bradshaw's back regardless, I would think.I expect we'll pick a rb in the 1st 3 rounds.And I'll never question Reese again whenever he takes a DE. Osi,however, is a problem again next year.At 4 million he's a no brainer.But at 30,can we really expect Osi to play another yr without a new deal.And we might not have the cap space to give it to him,even it we wanted to.As a free agent many teams would look at him as a Charles Haley type.A pass rushing specialist.He would get some nice cash.I would only trade him if someone gave us a 2nd round,3rd at least pick for him.Maybe,someone like Eli or Tuck will step up and offer to restructure next years dollars to a later year to reward Osi and keep him.I could see Eli doing that.In fact,I'm gonna start a new thread on that subject.

use less than signPgreater than sign html new paragraph babies when you take a breath, no worries though, all good ... sorry couldn't type it ... it kept doing it's thang even in quotes :)

Itlan
02-10-2012, 04:42 PM
KMac's contract being up, Jacobs getting cut or restructured, Canty and Rolle and hopefully Baas getting restructured, and dealing Osi would free up a ton of space.

good luck getting superbowl champions to take less money
I agree, but Canty and Rolle are not worth their pay. Jacobs is nowhere near his pay, and Baas should rename himself Bust.

Need to sign Cruz and Nicks, and Tuck is coming up as well.

MattMeyerBud
02-10-2012, 04:46 PM
KMac's contract being up, Jacobs getting cut or restructured, Canty and Rolle and hopefully Baas getting restructured, and dealing Osi would free up a ton of space.

good luck getting superbowl champions to take less money
I agree, but Canty and Rolle are not worth their pay. Jacobs is nowhere near his pay, and Baas should rename himself Bust.

Need to sign Cruz and Nicks, and Tuck is coming up as well.

Canty for the past two years has absolutely earned his pay

Rolle has ABSOLUTELY earned his pay

and Jacobs is def over paid at this point, but way too early to decide anything about Baas. He played great this past week

JesseJames
02-10-2012, 04:46 PM
something to ponder, we don't draft for need but take the BPA but we do go out and pay fortunes in FA based on need???

MattMeyerBud
02-10-2012, 05:00 PM
something to ponder, we don't draft for need but take the BPA but we do go out and pay fortunes in FA based on need???

what should i be pondering?

bansaw
02-10-2012, 05:01 PM
something to ponder, we don't draft for need but take the BPA but we do go out and pay fortunes in FA based on need???

what should i be pondering?
just ponder dammit

MattMeyerBud
02-10-2012, 05:05 PM
something to ponder, we don't draft for need but take the BPA but we do go out and pay fortunes in FA based on need???

what should i be pondering?
just ponder dammit



http://adriancrowe.files.wordpress.com/2011/12/guy-thinking-of-sex.jpg

TroyArcher
02-10-2012, 05:05 PM
Canadian, why does it appear that JR is kind of a nob when it comes to finagling with the cap. I mean year in and out does it not seem like the Eagles, Redskins, and Cowboys GMs play with the cap better? Granted, you cannot argue with JR's success, and this even goes back to Accorsi' days, but wouldn't it be nice to have the ability to sign someone if we wanted to fill a hole? We pick our spots with free agents, and do ok - you can't been exclusive in either way of building, ie draft or FAs only - but this year, for example, it would be fantastic to sign a left tackle and tight end for example, and draft hella defense to fill our needs. Why does it seem like other GMs can sign somebody on a whim to a big contract even when they are over the cap, and we seem to always be operating jumping on one leg with a hand tied behind our back in a street fight?</P>


</P>


His methodolgy has been to keep the FA's on the Giants that they feel help mesh as a team. Can't argue with his success.</P>

PRFan
02-10-2012, 07:01 PM
You know why the Eagles had all that cap space right? Because they let all of their FA walk last year. That's why they didn't have any LB.

flimflam
02-11-2012, 02:53 AM
Canadian, why does it appear that JR is kind of a nob when it comes to finagling with the cap. I mean year in and out does it not seem like the Eagles, Redskins, and Cowboys GMs play with the cap better? Granted, you cannot argue with JR's success, and this even goes back to Accorsi' days, but wouldn't it be nice to have the ability to sign someone if we wanted to fill a hole? We pick our spots with free agents, and do ok - you can't been exclusive in either way of building, ie draft or FAs only - but this year, for example, it would be fantastic to sign a left tackle and tight end for example, and draft hella defense to fill our needs. Why does it seem like other GMs can sign somebody on a whim to a big contract even when they are over the cap, and we seem to always be operating jumping on one leg with a hand tied behind our back in a street fight?</P>


i think he takes some FA shots in spots (DT, safety) and then drafts replacements so when he gets to the higher cap years of the contracts, he has the option of asking for money back or he can cut they guys with young talanet available to fill in.</P>


Joeseph and Austin are great examples of the kind of insurance he was hoping for when he got to Canty's higher cap years.</P>


same thing with Chad Jones and Antrelle Rolle.</P>


due to injury some of these things haven't worked out for us, but i think that was his mindset.</P>


in terms of the other teams in our division, the only one that seems to have better cap management is the Eagles.</P>


i guess you could make a case for the Redskins, but they don't have as much talent in the skill positions as we do, which means they have alot more money available.</P>


the Cowboys are no better with the cap than us.* i remember Jerry in the offseason in a interview with the NFL network, and he said they were going to have some 'challenges' with the cap this year, and they certainly do.</P>


*</P>


I absolutely can't argue with Reese's roster success.**I'm interested to see*how he sustains our current level of talent*with our cap challenges.</P>


bottom line,*given some of the skill*players we have (Eli, Snee, CWeb, JPP, Tuck) most fans will have to accept that alot of*our improvement each year is going to have to come from*drafting instead*of FA.*</P>

Thanks for the reply and insight. Definitely a different angle than I was thinking. If you are close to his mindset, then I think JR's philosophy is pretty damn good. I mean we see all the success, and we have all experienced the joy of his drafts, which have all been quite excellent. What we do not know is his true background thinking and motives, but you are probably close in your assessment.

While our FA pickups like Canty, BErnard, Boley, etc have been solid, sometimes I think our timinig is off. That is, Reese has the money to spend during week FA years. Again, Canty has been solid, but he threw large amounts at him when say he could have had a Cullen Jenkins instead. Not that I am unhappy, but when JR does open the wallet, I do hope he gets more for his money.

Rocky Bernard money could have been much better spent elsewhere. But hey, JR's batting average is pretty damn good, and I am glad to have him.






Canadian, why does it appear that JR is kind of a nob when it comes to finagling with the cap. I mean year in and out does it not seem like the Eagles, Redskins, and Cowboys GMs play with the cap better? Granted, you cannot argue with JR's success, and this even goes back to Accorsi' days, but wouldn't it be nice to have the ability to sign someone if we wanted to fill a hole? We pick our spots with free agents, and do ok - you can't been exclusive in either way of building, ie draft or FAs only - but this year, for example, it would be fantastic to sign a left tackle and tight end for example, and draft hella defense to fill our needs. Why does it seem like other GMs can sign somebody on a whim to a big contract even when they are over the cap, and we seem to always be operating jumping on one leg with a hand tied behind our back in a street fight?</p>


i think he takes some FA shots in spots (DT, safety) and then drafts replacements so when he gets to the higher cap years of the contracts, he has the option of asking for money back or he can cut they guys with young talanet available to fill in.</p>


Joeseph and Austin are great examples of the kind of insurance he was hoping for when he got to Canty's higher cap years.</p>


same thing with Chad Jones and Antrelle Rolle.</p>


due to injury some of these things haven't worked out for us, but i think that was his mindset.</p>


in terms of the other teams in our division, the only one that seems to have better cap management is the Eagles.</p>


i guess you could make a case for the Redskins, but they don't have as much talent in the skill positions as we do, which means they have alot more money available.</p>


the Cowboys are no better with the cap than us.* i remember Jerry in the offseason in a interview with the NFL network, and he said they were going to have some 'challenges' with the cap this year, and they certainly do.</p>



I absolutely can't argue with Reese's roster success.**I'm interested to see*how he sustains our current level of talent*with our cap challenges.</p>


bottom line,*given some of the skill*players we have (Eli, Snee, CWeb, JPP, Tuck) most fans will have to accept that alot of*our improvement each year is going to have to come from*drafting instead*of FA.*</p>

Actually I couldn't disagree more.

Joseph was drafted because Cofield had been mediocre at that point.

I think Austin was a value pick that was brought here because we did lose Cofield after he blew up and Joseph hadn't shown much. I think Canty was always going to be the rock at DT for us.

I think Chad Jones was drafted more to replace KP (sorry). KP's injury prob scared reese. Plus we use 3 saftey sets.* I mean I doubt Reese drafted Jones, to replace Antrell Rolle who he had just signed 3 weeks earlier at that point.

Absolutely, our draft over the next 2 years will be instrumental due to the cap restrictions


Interesting counter point Matt, and I think there is truth to both your and canadian's view points.

As an aside, it sucks Marvin AUstin did not get to play this year and get that year of experience and also be a part of his championship team on the field instead of on the sidelines. With Canty and BErnard aging and possible cuts in the near future, Austin is going to be a VERY important piece on our D-line for the future. In two years, it could very well be Linval Joseph and Marvin Austin as the interior starters. Austin, if the poor kid can get some experience and develop, could be a force for us. I think he is going to be one the better pass rushing tackles that we have had, not since Keith "The Hammer" Hamilton. I have high hopes for this kid.

Also, in regard to Chad Jones. Many scouts had him ranked third, and rightfully so, behind Earl Thomas and Eric Berry. However, with Jones being so raw, many felt that he had the physical tools to develop into a safety closer to their level of play and polish, and maybe even surpass them with his overall ceiling so high. It is a shame we did not get to see what Chad Lones could do. Man, a 6'3" 220 lb safety with speed is a sight to see.



Canadian, why does it appear that JR is kind of a nob when it comes to finagling with the cap.

I mean year in and out does it not seem like the Eagles, Redskins, and Cowboys GMs play with the cap better?

Granted, you cannot argue with JR's success, and this even goes back to Accorsi' days, but wouldn't it be nice to have the ability to sign someone if we wanted to fill a hole?

We pick our spots with free agents, and do ok - you can't been exclusive in either way of building, ie draft or FAs only - but this year, for example, it would be fantastic to sign a left tackle and tight end for example, and draft hella defense to fill our needs.

Why does it seem like other GMs can sign somebody on a whim to a big contract even when they are over the cap, and we seem to always be operating jumping on one leg with a hand tied behind our back in a street fight?

the guy put together two superbowl teams

how can u say hes been a noobie wtih it?

Hes really only added 4 big free agent contracts wtih Canty, Boley, Bernard, and Baas.

Canty and Boley have paid off...

Bernard was a bad deal (it happens) but once we resigned him this year i think we actually got a value on him. So I guess u can consider that a push

And we had the lockout this year and lost two lineman - we needed a center.* We made the best move we can. And while Baas looked bad all year, he stepped up in the superbowl. Too early to decide whether it was a bad move or not


Matt, I was only questioning JR's cap space maneuvering prowess, that is it. I cannot really argue with many of his other moves. We have a great GM. I do think that he can learn to fiddle with it, and even circumvent it a bit more to our advantage. That is all I am saying.

redbeardxxv
02-11-2012, 04:31 AM
Also, all those contracts were written at a time when the projected cap for these upcoming years would have been $20m+ higher under the old CBA.</P>


JR is going to be busy restructuring a lot of contracts and/or cutting players this offseason.</P>


And CDN, you should know better than to think that more the a few people around here will react rationally about our cap situation come FA. Everyone will be pissed we didn't sign [insert marquee FA here] when FA rolls around. </P>


Much like this past offseason.......................</P>
The NY GIANTS have rarely made a splash in FA. We have always built from the draft up. I have a hard time naming FA's that have had a huge impact in NY. Really in recent memory, who have we brought in that made an impact? Antonio Pierce and Rolle? Look at what the Eagles did.... what did it get them? I'm happy with the way we work. I'd always prefer a team built from the ground up-it lets players mature together, creates camaraderie, and lessens the sense of entitlement among players. A few missing pieces here and there are fine, but we build teams, we don't buy them.

JesseJames
02-11-2012, 10:19 AM
something to ponder, we don't draft for need but take the BPA but we do go out and pay fortunes in FA based on need???

what should i be pondering?
just ponder dammit



http://adriancrowe.files.wordpress.com/2011/12/guy-thinking-of-sex.jpg


I appreciate the vaudeville humor, I really do but my point was why does going for need work for one and not the other because it all comes down to money .

brad
02-11-2012, 10:38 AM
so your telling me cause of the cap were going to lose alot of playmakers that helped us get here to begin with?

i highly doubt reese allows this too happen his job is on the line. if the eagles can do what they did in free agency last year we can find a way to retain atleast 95% of the original roster.

we dont need bass / or deihl i love deihl alot but beatty will be back and i think give boothe an offseason to learn center he can do the job and petrus can step in and be a good LG


JR's job is no where near being "on the line".... and not signing big name free agents certainly isn't going to be the deciding factor. Good cap management is knowing when to let go of players and when to keep them. We as fans may like and want to keep certain key players, but a good GM has to be more objective. Steve Smith is a great example.. few fans wanted to see him leave, yet the Giants were better when he did. No one wanted to see Boss leave, and yet without him they won a SB. No, they didn't have a TE that was better, but they had guys that were good enough in that spot.

It will be hard if we have to see players like Osi, MM and Jacobs leave, but I believe that JR will have a plan in place that ensures that this team will continue to be competitive.

It's not about making a big splash in the off-season, it's about making a big splash in the post-season.

RagTime Blue
02-11-2012, 10:45 AM
In the past, you used to see drafted players getting cut before week 1. Now you don't see that, because only drafted players are cap-friendly.

I think once players cycle through their contracts, and everyone is under the new CBA (I guess in like 3-5 years), Reese will prove to be the best GM is the biz. This will be due to his ability to draft BPA'a worth keeping and being selective on taking young-veteran FA's who might not be stars, but are proven NFL talent.

jomo
02-11-2012, 10:48 AM
Also, all those contracts were written at a time when the projected cap for these upcoming years would have been $20m+ higher under the old CBA.</P>


JR is going to be busy restructuring a lot of contracts and/or cutting players this offseason.</P>


And CDN, you should know better than to think that more the a few people around here will react rationally about our cap situation come FA. Everyone will be pissed we didn't sign [insert marquee FA here] when FA rolls around. </P>


Much like this past offseason.......................</P>


i hate free agents. free agents are most of our biggest cap numbers this year.Most teams have cap problems every year like us and it is hard to do an analysis by "cherry picking" the most extreme examples. No reason to believe that JR will get dumb all of a sudden. This team never looked like it was build to win today at the expense of the future so I expect us to be just fine. Remember, we have a huge advantage over almost every team in that we have Eli.</P>


The great equalizer against the overpaid veterans is always the underpaid youngsters. We hit gold with Bradshaw in his rookie year, we got Cruz for a song etc. JR will get it done, no worries!</P>

Brandon jacobs
02-11-2012, 11:25 AM
Also, all those contracts were written at a time when the projected cap for these upcoming years would have been $20m+ higher under the old CBA.</P>


JR is going to be busy restructuring a lot of contracts and/or cutting players this offseason.</P>


And CDN, you should know better than to think that more the a few people around here will react rationally about our cap situation come FA. Everyone will be pissed we didn't sign [insert marquee FA here] when FA rolls around. </P>


Much like this past offseason.......................</P>

i hate free agents.

free agents are most of our biggest cap numbers this year.

nothing we can do.Even Reese stated in an article a couple or few days ago that, our team will have a new look, with new faces.

We shall see. but I'm REALLY j***ed about our past season because, NO matter what happens next season, No matter what.. we have beaten the same team twice and nothing can be done to change or undo that. PERIOD!

JimC
02-11-2012, 02:32 PM
Canadian, why does it appear that JR is kind of a nob when it comes to finagling with the cap.

I mean year in and out does it not seem like the Eagles, Redskins, and Cowboys GMs play with the cap better?

Granted, you cannot argue with JR's success, and this even goes back to Accorsi' days, but wouldn't it be nice to have the ability to sign someone if we wanted to fill a hole?

We pick our spots with free agents, and do ok - you can't been exclusive in either way of building, ie draft or FAs only - but this year, for example, it would be fantastic to sign a left tackle and tight end for example, and draft hella defense to fill our needs.

Why does it seem like other GMs can sign somebody on a whim to a big contract even when they are over the cap, and we seem to always be operating jumping on one leg with a hand tied behind our back in a street fight?

You are talking about a Super Bowl winning team here! JR made it work with the right combination of FA and drafted players. You just can't ignore the fact that the system was successful. Case in point, everyone thought we needed a TE last year and we found Ballard. He's not a Gronk but we have wide receivers that are very very good and very young. We have youngsters that can play when given the chance. I say continue to develop through the draft and give those rookies from last year a chance to earn a starting spot and don't get hung up with FA's or lack of FA signings. The one disappointment in my view was Baas. I believe you may see him move to the guard spot. The other young OL guys we have on the roster are going to push for playing time.