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  • For 2017

    QB is good for at least another season. We are screwed without Eli no matter who is #2 so Johnson is good enough to hold the clipboard.

    RB only Perkins is solid and Vereen has a role; this team needs another player to pair with Perkins. If Cook or Fournette make it to their pick you have to seriously consider it. But even spend a later pick on a compliment to Perkins or a young vet would work in FA. I'd prefer the draft route.

    WR Needs a solid outside WR. Everybody on the roster is worth bringing back, even Cruz on a paycut; but none of them should be the outside WR with OBJ and Sheppard in the base 11 personel. FA could find that guy, but I wouldn't object to a high pick at the position if the right player is there.

    TE Adams has promise and Tye has a role; but they need a solid 2 way TE for 2017. If Adams can impprove, that would be ideal. Need to consider spending a high pick here as well, it could also take pressue off the other WR previously mentioned.

    OL I really think they are one player away, had they drafted Conklin, I think this OL would have been worlds better. Flowers has not improved his technique at all since being drafted. This is a problem and I question his willingness to accept coaching based on comments from him and the Giants and the evidense on the field. If I am right on Flowers, then I amend this to we need 2 more OL. I don't think the draft is the way to go, but there could be a couple of good inside guys available in rounds 2 and 3. I'd look to FA for OL.

    DT Really want them to hang onto Hankins, but I wouldn't break the bank for him. Those two made a huge difference together really plugging up the middle running lanes. I think this more than anything improved the defense overall this past season. I was sick of watching the Giants get gashed on runs up the middle. Though it came at a price and you saw it yesterday, neither could provide much pressure. They can push the middle of the pocket though which helps. If they can get a DT to team with them that can really pressure the QB on passing downs or get a guy who can do it all if they let Hankins walk, it can make a huge impact. If they can get that type of DT in the first round this year, I'd pull the trigger there. Though at 23, getting a force against the run that can rush the passer from DT will be tough. There are not a lot of those.

    DE I think the Giants are in a position that they have to sign JPP, or another FA that can pressure the pocket. They are not likely to get a top tier rookie pass rusher in the tail end of the draft. Both OV and JPP are really good DE, but neither is a dynamic pass rusher, they need that. Depth is solid, but none of them look like more than solid depth going forward. Like the OL, I'd look for FA for this spot. IDK who will be out there, but if a dynamic DE is free, you may be better off letting JPP walk and spending more on a better player.

    LB I like how this position has come around. I would like to get one stud at that level though, they are solid. If there is a LBer that can be a stud in the middle or WILL when their pick rolls around, I think this would be a solid grab in this draft. I heard there is a kid from Vandy that might still be there and could be what they need. Sorry, I don't know the players names that well yet.

    CB Seems to be in great shape health provided. Somebody better than Wade at 4 would be nice. I have been a big fan of Desmond King from Iowa, so I wouldn't balk if they pulled the trigger on him and went 4 deep. We saw what happens when they lose just one player from the top 3 against good passing offenses. In lieu of that though, getting another vet with fresher legs than Hall and more skill than Sensabaugh would be a good FA acquisition.

    S Collins is great. Don't know what else they have. Behre has a role as a 3rd S, but is a concussion waiting to happen. The Thompson twins both look skilled enough to man the other safety spot, but can they stay healthy. Adams would be better served as the 3rd or 4th safety.

    K Gould did well, but I would look to get better there if there is a vet available. I'd love to get a young kicker that we can park there for a decade, but the rent a vet seems more reliable for this position.

    P Crappy play-off game not withstanding, Wing is a good punter.

    LS DeOssie has at least one more year in the tank I think.

    KR/PR Harris was a really good signing and not just for his return ability. I think they are in good shape here. If a RB, DB or WR they draft has return ability, it would be a nice addition so we don't have the need to use OBJ there. Harris would still have strong value on specials without being the #1 KR and PR.
    Last edited by jmike; 01-09-2017, 03:54 PM.

    Comment


    • Originally posted by dezzzR View Post
      Yea, Was Wing hurt last night? Hes been good all year...
      I think he just struggled with the cold. Must have felt like kicking a cinderblock.
      Last edited by jmike; 01-09-2017, 04:30 PM.

      Comment


      • Originally posted by jmike View Post
        For 2017

        QB is good for at least another season. We are screwed without Eli no matter who is #2 so Johnson is good enough to hold the clipboard.

        RB only Perkins is solid and Vereen has a role; this team needs another player to pair with Perkins. If Cook or Fournette make it to their pick you have to seriously consider it. But even spend a later pick on a compliment to Perkins or a young vet would work in FA. I'd prefer the draft route.

        WR Needs a solid outside WR. Everybody on the roster is worth bringing back, even Cruz on a paycut; but none of them should be the outside WR with OBJ and Sheppard in the base 11 personel. FA could find that guy, but I wouldn't object to a high pick at the position if the right player is there.

        TE Adams has promise and Tye has a role; but they need a solid 2 way TE for 2017. If Adams can impprove, that would be ideal. Need to consider spending a high pick here as well, it could also take pressue off the other WR previously mentioned.

        OL I really think they are one player away, had they drafted Conklin, I think this OL would have been worlds better. Flowers has not improved his technique at all since being drafted. This is a problem and I question his willingness to accept coaching based on comments from him and the Giants and the evidense on the field. If I am right on Flowers, then I amend this to we need 2 more OL. I don't think the draft is the way to go, but there could be a couple of good inside guys available in rounds 2 and 3. I'd look to FA for OL.

        DT Really want them to hang onto Hankins, but I wouldn't break the bank for him. Those two mand a huge difference together really plugging up the middle running lanes. I think this more than anything improved the defense overall this past season. I was sick of watching the Giants get gashed on runs up the middle. Though it came at a price and you saw it yesterday, neither could provide much pressure. They can push the middle of the pocket though which helps. If they can get a DT to team with them that can really pressure the QB on passing downs or get a guy who can do it all if they let Hankins walk, it can make a huge impact. If they can get that type of DT in the first round this year, I'd pull the trigger there. Though at 23, getting a force against the run that can rush the passer from DT will be tough. There are not a lot of those.

        DE I think the Giants are in a position that they have to sign JPP, or another FA that can pressure the pocket. They are not likely to get a top tier rookie pass rusher in the tail end of the draft. Both OV and JPP are really good DE, but neither is a dynamic pass rusher, they need that. Depth is solid, but none of them look like more than solid depth going forward. Like the OL, I'd look for FA for this spot. IDK who will be out there, but if a dynamic DE is free, you may be better off letting JPP walk and spending more on a better player.

        LB I like how this position has come around. I would like to get one stud at that level though, they are solid. If there is a LBer that can be a stud in the middle or WILL when their pick rolls around, I think this would be a solid grab in this draft. I heard there is a kid from Vandy that might still be there and could be what they need. Sorry, I don't know the players names that well yet.

        CB Seems to be in great shape health provided. Somebody better than Wade at 4 would be nice. I have been a big fan of Desmond King from Iowa, so I wouldn't balk if they pulled the trigger on him and went 4 deep. We saw what happens when they lose just one player from the top 3 against good passing offenses. In lieu of that though, getting another vet with fresher legs than Hall and more skill than Sensabaugh would be a good FA acquisition.

        S Collins is great. Don't know what else they have. Behre has a role as a 3rd S, but is a concussion waiting to happen. The Thompson twins both look skilled enough to man the other safety spot, but can they stay healthy. Adams would be better served as the 3rd or 4th safety.

        K Gould did well, but I would look to get better there if there is a vet available. I'd love to get a young kicker that we can park there for a decade, but the rent a vet seems more reliable for this position.

        P Crappy play-off game not withstanding, Wing is a good punter.

        LS DeOssie has at least one more year in the tank I think.

        KR/PR Harris was a really good signing and not just for his return ability. I think they are in good shape here. If a RB, DB or WR they draft has return ability, it would be a nice addition so we don't have the need to use OBJ there. Harris would still have strong value on specials without being the #1 KR and PR.
        QB- Eli has another 2-3 years

        RB- Agreed

        WR- Agreed minus having Cruz back. Theres no point. He had one td in the first game. Best to look toward the future.

        TE- I think Tye can be solid. Needs to work on blocking. Adams is more of a receiver.

        OL- The Giants achilles heal. Not sure what the FA looks like. I think Reese will go hard, he has to or else hell be drafting ANOTHER lineman in the first. Id like to see Pugh moved to RT, Flowers to guard and pray we can find a LT. Keep Hart as depth and get rid of Newhouse and Jerry. I see us keeping Jerry.

        DT- Would love if we could keep Hank the tank. Not really worried if we dont because Reese has a good eye for DTs, imo.

        DE- I dont want to break the bank on JPP. Vernons contract is crazy and neither are worth it. Jpp also has a problem staying healthy so that can save us a ffew bucks.

        LB- Keep Robinson, Casilla did well, as did Kennard. I was pleased with them this year.

        CB- Not really sold on Apple yet. Would like a solid 4th guy but we are already spoiled with our corners. Probably our strongest position.

        S-Hopefully Thompson can come back healthy, he made a few plays before he went down.

        KR/PR Mehh Harris wasnt too good this year.

        Comment


        • Originally posted by jmike View Post
          I think he just struggled with the could. Must have felt like kicking a cinderblock.
          I'm not going to bother wasting space by posting your analysis in entirety. No need to because I agree damned near 99.8%. Very nice job, jm>
          I agree on a stud LB... I've been crying for one for years.
          I also agree we need a stud OT, and Flowers is not it. We need a definitive LT.
          Plus I agree on TE.
          In order, I think we need the OT, LB, and then TE... if it were all on the draft. Free agents will cost dearly, but the draft is never a sure thing... just look at Flowers for that.
          Nice job, Jenn.

          Comment


          • Originally posted by dezzzR View Post
            QB- Eli has another 2-3 years

            RB- Agreed

            WR- Agreed minus having Cruz back. Theres no point. He had one td in the first game. Best to look toward the future.

            TE- I think Tye can be solid. Needs to work on blocking. Adams is more of a receiver.

            OL- The Giants achilles heal. Not sure what the FA looks like. I think Reese will go hard, he has to or else hell be drafting ANOTHER lineman in the first. Id like to see Pugh moved to RT, Flowers to guard and pray we can find a LT. Keep Hart as depth and get rid of Newhouse and Jerry. I see us keeping Jerry.

            DT- Would love if we could keep Hank the tank. Not really worried if we dont because Reese has a good eye for DTs, imo.

            DE- I dont want to break the bank on JPP. Vernons contract is crazy and neither are worth it. Jpp also has a problem staying healthy so that can save us a ffew bucks.

            LB- Keep Robinson, Casilla did well, as did Kennard. I was pleased with them this year.

            CB- Not really sold on Apple yet. Would like a solid 4th guy but we are already spoiled with our corners. Probably our strongest position.

            S-Hopefully Thompson can come back healthy, he made a few plays before he went down.

            KR/PR Mehh Harris wasnt too good this year.
            Cruz could be a valuable vet as a 4th or 5th WR. But I would pay him as a vet 4th or 5th WR. I wouldn't hesitate to let him go if the younger players out perform him in camp though.

            I think Tye is what he is, a decent possesion guy.

            Harris is a valuable player back there on punts even if he isn't very dynamic. He made a lot of important plays simply by knowing what to do.

            Comment


            • Originally posted by jmike View Post
              Cruz could be a valuable vet as a 4th or 5th WR. But I would pay him as a vet 4th or 5th WR. I wouldn't hesitate to let him go if the younger players out perform him in camp though.

              I think Tye is what he is, a decent possesion guy.

              Harris is a valuable player back there on punts even if he isn't very dynamic. He made a lot of important plays simply by knowing what to do.
              No he cant because he doesnt play ST.

              Comment


              • Originally posted by dezzzR View Post
                No he cant because he doesnt play ST.
                Bingo.

                His career may be over.
                3rd and 4th WR's need to play ST's to have any value.
                You never know though. Maybe another year of healing will get him closer to his former self. I tend to doubt that though.
                Admit nothing. Deny everything. Make counter accusations.

                Comment


                • Originally posted by Morehead State View Post
                  Bingo.

                  His career may be over.
                  3rd and 4th WR's need to play ST's to have any value.
                  You never know though. Maybe another year of healing will get him closer to his former self. I tend to doubt that though.
                  I was going to say the same... he came back from his micro problem way faster than usual, if they return at all. I'm curious to see what another year of hard work will do for him... or, if you're right and he's as good as it gets. He is a slot receiver, not a WR. He'll never be a valuable ST guy. A shame, because he is a very hard worker and a beloved Giant
                  Wishing him good luck.

                  Comment


                  • Originally posted by dezzzR View Post
                    No he cant because he doesnt play ST.
                    I really don't see the problem with giving him a vet min contract and give him a chance in pre-season? If other players prove more valuable, then cut him. But to say there is no way he could offer value based on his first season back after two off with injury. If he declines, or signs elsewhere than fine. What is the downside of a vet min contract and a chance to earn a spot?

                    Comment


                    • Originally posted by jmike View Post
                      I really don't see the problem with giving him a vet min contract and give him a chance in pre-season? If other players prove more valuable, then cut him. But to say there is no way he could offer value based on his first season back after two off with injury. If he declines, or signs elsewhere than fine. What is the downside of a vet min contract and a chance to earn a spot?
                      He's under contract so they would have to cut him first or he would have to volunteer to take a huge pay cut.

                      It's hard to see how Cruz stays but I suck at predicting the future.
                      Admit nothing. Deny everything. Make counter accusations.

                      Comment


                      • Originally posted by Morehead State View Post
                        He's under contract so they would have to cut him first or he would have to volunteer to take a huge pay cut.

                        It's hard to see how Cruz stays but I suck at predicting the future.
                        Obviously he would have to agree to the huge paycut. But if they cut him and that is all he expects on the open market, he might. Make him no guarantees, just say you have a chance to compete for a spot if you take vet min for the year or you can be a free agent. Becomes his choice and little risk for the Giants.

                        Comment


                        • Originally posted by jmike View Post
                          Obviously he would have to agree to the huge paycut. But if they cut him and that is all he expects on the open market, he might. Make him no guarantees, just say you have a chance to compete for a spot if you take vet min for the year or you can be a free agent. Becomes his choice and little risk for the Giants.
                          Its a big risk for the Giants if theyre hoping he can return to form. Its time wasted when they could have been looking at other prospects. How much longer are they going to wait for him to be "100%!"

                          These are Elis last years. Giants need to get Eli the best they can afford.
                          If I were Reese my top priorities would be LT, another WR, and TE. This is year 3 of the Cruz experiment hoping he will return to his former self. It aint gonna happen.

                          Comment


                          • Originally posted by dezzzR View Post
                            Its a big risk for the Giants if theyre hoping he can return to form. Its time wasted when they could have been looking at other prospects. How much longer are they going to wait for him to be "100%!"

                            These are Elis last years. Giants need to get Eli the best they can afford.
                            If I were Reese my top priorities would be LT, another WR, and TE. This is year 3 of the Cruz experiment hoping he will return to his former self. It aint gonna happen.
                            With the amount of crap that you find on the training camp roster do you think this one spot is going to make a big difference. I would say the odds of Cruz returning to be a valuable WR in 2017 are greater than the rookie FA from Div 3 B Poughdunk College for Boys will make an impact in the regular season for even a single play. How would having Cruz reduce his contract to vet minimum adversly impact the Giants signing another FA? Please provide an argument that makes sense.

                            Comment


                            • Originally posted by jmike View Post
                              For 2017

                              QB is good for at least another season. We are screwed without Eli no matter who is #2 so Johnson is good enough to hold the clipboard.

                              RB only Perkins is solid and Vereen has a role; this team needs another player to pair with Perkins. If Cook or Fournette make it to their pick you have to seriously consider it. But even spend a later pick on a compliment to Perkins or a young vet would work in FA. I'd prefer the draft route.

                              WR Needs a solid outside WR. Everybody on the roster is worth bringing back, even Cruz on a paycut; but none of them should be the outside WR with OBJ and Sheppard in the base 11 personel. FA could find that guy, but I wouldn't object to a high pick at the position if the right player is there.

                              TE Adams has promise and Tye has a role; but they need a solid 2 way TE for 2017. If Adams can impprove, that would be ideal. Need to consider spending a high pick here as well, it could also take pressue off the other WR previously mentioned.

                              OL I really think they are one player away, had they drafted Conklin, I think this OL would have been worlds better. Flowers has not improved his technique at all since being drafted. This is a problem and I question his willingness to accept coaching based on comments from him and the Giants and the evidense on the field. If I am right on Flowers, then I amend this to we need 2 more OL. I don't think the draft is the way to go, but there could be a couple of good inside guys available in rounds 2 and 3. I'd look to FA for OL.

                              DT Really want them to hang onto Hankins, but I wouldn't break the bank for him. Those two made a huge difference together really plugging up the middle running lanes. I think this more than anything improved the defense overall this past season. I was sick of watching the Giants get gashed on runs up the middle. Though it came at a price and you saw it yesterday, neither could provide much pressure. They can push the middle of the pocket though which helps. If they can get a DT to team with them that can really pressure the QB on passing downs or get a guy who can do it all if they let Hankins walk, it can make a huge impact. If they can get that type of DT in the first round this year, I'd pull the trigger there. Though at 23, getting a force against the run that can rush the passer from DT will be tough. There are not a lot of those.

                              DE I think the Giants are in a position that they have to sign JPP, or another FA that can pressure the pocket. They are not likely to get a top tier rookie pass rusher in the tail end of the draft. Both OV and JPP are really good DE, but neither is a dynamic pass rusher, they need that. Depth is solid, but none of them look like more than solid depth going forward. Like the OL, I'd look for FA for this spot. IDK who will be out there, but if a dynamic DE is free, you may be better off letting JPP walk and spending more on a better player.

                              LB I like how this position has come around. I would like to get one stud at that level though, they are solid. If there is a LBer that can be a stud in the middle or WILL when their pick rolls around, I think this would be a solid grab in this draft. I heard there is a kid from Vandy that might still be there and could be what they need. Sorry, I don't know the players names that well yet.

                              CB Seems to be in great shape health provided. Somebody better than Wade at 4 would be nice. I have been a big fan of Desmond King from Iowa, so I wouldn't balk if they pulled the trigger on him and went 4 deep. We saw what happens when they lose just one player from the top 3 against good passing offenses. In lieu of that though, getting another vet with fresher legs than Hall and more skill than Sensabaugh would be a good FA acquisition.

                              S Collins is great. Don't know what else they have. Behre has a role as a 3rd S, but is a concussion waiting to happen. The Thompson twins both look skilled enough to man the other safety spot, but can they stay healthy. Adams would be better served as the 3rd or 4th safety.

                              K Gould did well, but I would look to get better there if there is a vet available. I'd love to get a young kicker that we can park there for a decade, but the rent a vet seems more reliable for this position.

                              P Crappy play-off game not withstanding, Wing is a good punter.

                              LS DeOssie has at least one more year in the tank I think.

                              KR/PR Harris was a really good signing and not just for his return ability. I think they are in good shape here. If a RB, DB or WR they draft has return ability, it would be a nice addition so we don't have the need to use OBJ there. Harris would still have strong value on specials without being the #1 KR and PR.

                              Nice write up, jmike.

                              Comment


                              • Originally posted by jmike View Post
                                For 2017

                                QB is good for at least another season. We are screwed without Eli no matter who is #2 so Johnson is good enough to hold the clipboard.

                                RB only Perkins is solid and Vereen has a role; this team needs another player to pair with Perkins. If Cook or Fournette make it to their pick you have to seriously consider it. But even spend a later pick on a compliment to Perkins or a young vet would work in FA. I'd prefer the draft route.

                                WR Needs a solid outside WR. Everybody on the roster is worth bringing back, even Cruz on a paycut; but none of them should be the outside WR with OBJ and Sheppard in the base 11 personel. FA could find that guy, but I wouldn't object to a high pick at the position if the right player is there.

                                TE Adams has promise and Tye has a role; but they need a solid 2 way TE for 2017. If Adams can impprove, that would be ideal. Need to consider spending a high pick here as well, it could also take pressue off the other WR previously mentioned.

                                OL I really think they are one player away, had they drafted Conklin, I think this OL would have been worlds better. Flowers has not improved his technique at all since being drafted. This is a problem and I question his willingness to accept coaching based on comments from him and the Giants and the evidense on the field. If I am right on Flowers, then I amend this to we need 2 more OL. I don't think the draft is the way to go, but there could be a couple of good inside guys available in rounds 2 and 3. I'd look to FA for OL.

                                DT Really want them to hang onto Hankins, but I wouldn't break the bank for him. Those two made a huge difference together really plugging up the middle running lanes. I think this more than anything improved the defense overall this past season. I was sick of watching the Giants get gashed on runs up the middle. Though it came at a price and you saw it yesterday, neither could provide much pressure. They can push the middle of the pocket though which helps. If they can get a DT to team with them that can really pressure the QB on passing downs or get a guy who can do it all if they let Hankins walk, it can make a huge impact. If they can get that type of DT in the first round this year, I'd pull the trigger there. Though at 23, getting a force against the run that can rush the passer from DT will be tough. There are not a lot of those.

                                DE I think the Giants are in a position that they have to sign JPP, or another FA that can pressure the pocket. They are not likely to get a top tier rookie pass rusher in the tail end of the draft. Both OV and JPP are really good DE, but neither is a dynamic pass rusher, they need that. Depth is solid, but none of them look like more than solid depth going forward. Like the OL, I'd look for FA for this spot. IDK who will be out there, but if a dynamic DE is free, you may be better off letting JPP walk and spending more on a better player.

                                LB I like how this position has come around. I would like to get one stud at that level though, they are solid. If there is a LBer that can be a stud in the middle or WILL when their pick rolls around, I think this would be a solid grab in this draft. I heard there is a kid from Vandy that might still be there and could be what they need. Sorry, I don't know the players names that well yet.

                                CB Seems to be in great shape health provided. Somebody better than Wade at 4 would be nice. I have been a big fan of Desmond King from Iowa, so I wouldn't balk if they pulled the trigger on him and went 4 deep. We saw what happens when they lose just one player from the top 3 against good passing offenses. In lieu of that though, getting another vet with fresher legs than Hall and more skill than Sensabaugh would be a good FA acquisition.

                                S Collins is great. Don't know what else they have. Behre has a role as a 3rd S, but is a concussion waiting to happen. The Thompson twins both look skilled enough to man the other safety spot, but can they stay healthy. Adams would be better served as the 3rd or 4th safety.

                                K Gould did well, but I would look to get better there if there is a vet available. I'd love to get a young kicker that we can park there for a decade, but the rent a vet seems more reliable for this position.

                                P Crappy play-off game not withstanding, Wing is a good punter.

                                LS DeOssie has at least one more year in the tank I think.

                                KR/PR Harris was a really good signing and not just for his return ability. I think they are in good shape here. If a RB, DB or WR they draft has return ability, it would be a nice addition so we don't have the need to use OBJ there. Harris would still have strong value on specials without being the #1 KR and PR.
                                complement*
                                My body was sculpted to the proportions of Michelangelo's David.

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