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I don't understand the negativity regarding DJ Fluker

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  • I don't understand the negativity regarding DJ Fluker

    Title pretty much sums this one up. I don't get why anytime someone mentions DJ Fluker it always follows with "unless we trade back/get him in the 2nd round...etc". Considering we basically have no proven RT right now, it seems like Fluker is a near ideal prospect for the Giants at 19th overall.

    He's a bonafide road grader with mean written all over him. Plus, I have my doubts that anyone carries 340 better than this guy does.

    I've watched tape on this guy and I'm not seeing a whole lot to pick at, but I just want to hear some legitimate concerns and not the usual mocking bird routine that is often apparent around here.

  • PRGiant
    replied
    That's a big boy...

    Leave a comment:


  • BlueSabbath
    replied
    DJ Fluker Sports Science

    http://espn.go.com/video/clip?id=9117429

    First thing you'll notice is that he doesn't need to lose ANY weight. And watch this little dude FLY!

    Leave a comment:


  • nycsportzfan
    replied
    Originally posted by wideright91 View Post
    True that Fluker's got some heavy feet (which have apparently improved in the draft process?), but I disagree he moves worse than Watson. While Watson may be faster, but he's got some wacky footwork and often seems out-of-position at the point of attack. At least on the bit of tape that I saw.
    Watson looks the part in my opinoin.. Anyone who can start for FLA St with only 2yrs of football expierence and also play basketball on the collegiete level, and also box and play soccer, has something.. Yes, he had a less then stellar combine, and yes its said he has some heavy feet, but i think its mostly due to not being completely comfortable in his technique and overall ability at football yet.. I personally will take the kid for his upside, charechter(his life has been pretty amazing, as far as his travels and what hes been through), over the big and plodding Fluker...

    I just got a feeling about Watson that i don't have about Fluker... Like i said, i personally woulden't touch either in RD1, as there not rd 1 prospects in my opinion... I woulden't take Fluker in RD 2 either.. I think hes a bust waiting to happen personally.. And even if he plays ok, i see him with a short shelf life, that fades quickly, and isn't a 1st rd pick that has a long succesful NFL career...

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  • slipknottin
    replied
    Originally posted by wideright91 View Post
    but he's got some wacky footwork.
    That stuff is coachable, IMO. Heavy feet is not.


    Maybe if you get Fluker down to 320 or so he moves better, but does that take away from his ability in the run game?

    Either way, how often do you see OTs go in the first (especially mid first) that are really RTs only, and possibly guards?

    If you take an OT in the first, he better be able to play LT.

    Leave a comment:


  • wideright91
    replied
    Originally posted by nycsportzfan View Post
    I agree.. If i had to take a RT, i said i'd take Menelik Watson over Fluker, because Watson moves alot better in my opinion, and still has upside and could in fact, max out as a LT.. But even then, i woulden't take em, but my point is, thats how little i like Fluker..
    True that Fluker's got some heavy feet (which have apparently improved in the draft process?), but I disagree he moves worse than Watson. While Watson may be faster, but he's got some wacky footwork and often seems out-of-position at the point of attack. At least on the bit of tape that I saw.

    Leave a comment:


  • BlueSanta
    replied
    I do think people are being a little harsh on him. I am not saying I would like us to pick him 19th, but he has done well for himself this offseason and I have to give him credit for that. But, I still am not fond of his value at 19.

    Coming into the combine there were rumors that he played overweight while at Bama. I read he weighed as much as 380 lbs at one point during the season. Scouts were expecting him to look sloppy at the weight in. Apparently, he did not despite weighing 355 lbs. Many scouts , including Mayock, were saying he carried the weight well.

    NFL has shown that players who play at high weights like that tend to suffer from durability and stamina issues. Simply put, it is a massive amount to carry around for an entire game, let alone an entire career. He will likely need to get down to 330ish. That doesnt seem all that hard, but you never know. NFL history is riddled with players who failed because of weight management issues.

    To be fair, Fluker has been extremely durable to date. But a 21 yr old guy carrying 355+ lbs for a couple years is 1 thing, doing it into your 30's is another and people like to spend early draft picks on O-linemen who will last.

    These little question marks are enough to lower his value to the point where I wouldnt risk it at 19. I do think he would most certainly help our run game because he is absolutely a mauler in the run game. But, we arent a team uses the oline to "maul" anyways. We typically use very complicated blocking schemes that require more finesse blocks.

    I will never be surprised by Reese, who is brilliant at keeping his intentions under wraps. But I can say I would be more surprised that in recent years if we selected Fluker.

    Leave a comment:


  • BlueSabbath
    replied
    Originally posted by TheEnigma View Post
    Sorry but I didn't see this earlier. It is of the game film posted by Redeye on Youtube with all of Fluker's snaps.
    Gotcha. Must have missed the link but will go check it out. If it's of all of his snaps from his junior year and you found 8 messups, perhaps even I myself have underestimated how good he really is.

    Leave a comment:


  • TheEnigma
    replied
    Originally posted by BlueSabbath View Post
    What are these times? Are they game times? A link to which film you are watching? No qtrs listed so I'm confused.
    Sorry but I didn't see this earlier. It is of the game film posted by Redeye on Youtube with all of Fluker's snaps.

    Leave a comment:


  • TheEnigma
    replied
    Originally posted by BlueSabbath View Post
    Just watch Alabama vs LSU to feel good about your side of the argument. There is a load of NFL talent on that LSU line and Fluker had no problems... even when facing Mingo (a first round speed rusher) on passing situations. I remember at the end of the game Alabama was in obvious passing situations because of the time and being down. If Fluker sucked so bad Mingo would have easily been flying right by him. Didn't happen. He pretty much owned Mingo whenever they faced off.

    I'm not too concerned with the Michigan game. It was the first game of his junior year. I'm more concerned with how he developed.
    Mingo is bad at 4-3 DE if you play him there exclusively. Some of the moves LSU does leaves me baffled and that's one of them. He's obviously more of a space guy and should be rushing the passer standing up outside of a more natural DE's outside shoulder. Being fair though, Fluker had a good game against him. Still don't think people are properly projecting him on how he is going to fare in an offense like this which features more 5 and 7 step dropbacks. The Gilbride offense would leave his weaknesses more exposed.

    Leave a comment:


  • BlueSabbath
    replied
    Originally posted by TheEnigma View Post
    I'll list them for you then and let you judge for yourself

    Michigan

    0:17 - Both on Fluker and the RB. Fluker was just way too slow on the snap here to diagnose the inside move.

    1:13 - Deep pass attempt by the Roll Ride. Good coverage down the field but both Fluker and the TE on the weakside are beat by their man to force McCarron to throw it away. This one is a little debatable but it would still count as a pressure.

    1:56 - The defensive end manages to shed Fluker here and takes the RB down for a loss in the backfield. This is obviously not a pass pressure but just an example that Fluker can be beat in the run game lol. He's not perfect in that regard.

    2:02 - He looked sloppy on his backpedal here and the defensive end had a good amount of room and thus, managed to turn the corner against him. At least this one was technique.

    4:12 - Kouandijo (moreso) and Fluker are both beat around the edge on this deep pass attempt. No coverage pressure here.

    I'll have to rewatch the Miss State game later but that is what stood out to me on Michigan. I like him much better at Guard in the pros personally and even if he does play RT initially, I can't imagine him doing too well at it when he reaches the twilight portion of his career.
    What are these times? Are they game times? A link to which film you are watching? No qtrs listed so I'm confused.

    Leave a comment:


  • BlueSabbath
    replied
    Originally posted by PBTimmons View Post
    I respect Enigma and Slips opinions more than just about anyone on here, but I disagree with the both of you. You're both definitely exaggerating reality here.

    Enigma - Michigan and Miss St. were not bad games for Fluker. I count no more than half those 8 pressures you mentioned. You must be placing blame on pressures that were actually the responsibility of AJ Mccarron, the RB protection, or Anthony Steen (RG). The guy is a force in the running game and doesn't look bad in pass protect.

    I think the point is clear that he would be an upgrade over anyone we've had at RT for the last 3 years.
    Just watch Alabama vs LSU to feel good about your side of the argument. There is a load of NFL talent on that LSU line and Fluker had no problems... even when facing Mingo (a first round speed rusher) on passing situations. I remember at the end of the game Alabama was in obvious passing situations because of the time and being down. If Fluker sucked so bad Mingo would have easily been flying right by him. Didn't happen. He pretty much owned Mingo whenever they faced off.

    I'm not too concerned with the Michigan game. It was the first game of his junior year. I'm more concerned with how he developed.

    Leave a comment:


  • TheEnigma
    replied
    Originally posted by PBTimmons View Post
    I respect Enigma and Slips opinions more than just about anyone on here, but I disagree with the both of you. You're both definitely exaggerating reality here.

    Enigma - Michigan and Miss St. were not bad games for Fluker. I count no more than half those 8 pressures you mentioned. You must be placing blame on pressures that were actually the responsibility of AJ Mccarron, the RB protection, or Anthony Steen (RG). The guy is a force in the running game and doesn't look bad in pass protect.

    I think the point is clear that he would be an upgrade over anyone we've had at RT for the last 3 years.
    I'll list them for you then and let you judge for yourself

    Michigan

    0:17 - Both on Fluker and the RB. Fluker was just way too slow on the snap here to diagnose the inside move.

    1:13 - Deep pass attempt by the Roll Ride. Good coverage down the field but both Fluker and the TE on the weakside are beat by their man to force McCarron to throw it away. This one is a little debatable but it would still count as a pressure.

    1:56 - The defensive end manages to shed Fluker here and takes the RB down for a loss in the backfield. This is obviously not a pass pressure but just an example that Fluker can be beat in the run game lol. He's not perfect in that regard.

    2:02 - He looked sloppy on his backpedal here and the defensive end had a good amount of room and thus, managed to turn the corner against him. At least this one was technique.

    4:12 - Kouandijo (moreso) and Fluker are both beat around the edge on this deep pass attempt. No coverage pressure here.

    I'll have to rewatch the Miss State game later but that is what stood out to me on Michigan. I like him much better at Guard in the pros personally and even if he does play RT initially, I can't imagine him doing too well at it when he reaches the twilight portion of his career.

    Leave a comment:


  • PBTimmons
    replied
    I respect Enigma and Slips opinions more than just about anyone on here, but I disagree with the both of you. You're both definitely exaggerating reality here.

    Enigma - Michigan and Miss St. were not bad games for Fluker. I count no more than half those 8 pressures you mentioned. You must be placing blame on pressures that were actually the responsibility of AJ Mccarron, the RB protection, or Anthony Steen (RG). The guy is a force in the running game and doesn't look bad in pass protect.

    I think the point is clear that he would be an upgrade over anyone we've had at RT for the last 3 years.

    Leave a comment:


  • BlueSabbath
    replied
    The guy is going to get burned every single play because apparently only defensive ends gets better after college... Yet somehow he's projected to be a first rounder??! GMs should read our boards to really learn about players.

    Again, I don't want him at #19 since we're more of a passing offense and I agree it's his weakness right now... but he's not as bad as people are makingh him out to be.
    Last edited by BlueSabbath; 04-02-2013, 11:10 AM.

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