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  • Nelson vs Hernandez vs Wynn

    We have ALL been gushing over Quenton Nelson and how awesome he is (myself included), but ne is going top 5, maybe top 10. Is he worth it over someone like Will Hernandez or Isiah Wynn?

    All 3 of those guys are beasts and i would LOVE to have any of them on the team, but i dont know if i want to spend a top 5 pick on a guard when i can get someone comparable in the 2nd

    .....If we get Nelson, i wont be upset at all, just speculating
    Come check the G-Fambulance and The Scarf Soldiers every home game in Lot L6, and like us on facebook and instagam 'NYG Scarf Soldiers'


  • #2
    I think he is that much better than the other two. To be clear I am all aboard the Hernandez, Wynn, Price train and I would not take Nelson #2 but would take him if we trade back to #5 and got extra picks. Nelson is absolutely that much better though. Hernandez might be the best of the other 3 but he still has some technique issues to fix, especially how he shoots his hands. It is more of a hugging motion than a shooting up the middle motion, I think will lead to holding penalties if he doesn't fix it. I would take any of those guys on this team though. I think they are all awesome at when it comes to finding flaws they are minor.

    I always pose this question. Which is better? Barkley/Hernandez (or Wynn or Price) vs Nelson/Guice (or Chubb or other 2nd round RB). I would take either combo but I would take Barkley at #2 over Nelson and would prefer Hernandez over Guice in round 2. I won't be upset with any of these interior guys though, even if we trade down a few spots, get an extra round 2 pick and take two OGs in the first two rounds.
    LT (132.5) -> Strahan (141.5) -> Osi (65) -> Tuck (60.5) -> JPP (50) -> ???
    "Next man up"

    "I am a nasty football player, I get after people. That is something that I am very proud of. I am out there and I am physical every play, making sure that the guy across from me wants to quit." - Adam Bisnowaty

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    • #3
      Barkley/Hernandez or Nelson/Guice..... Id be ecsatic either way, LOL.

      .....Now if we could only figure our our tackles
      Come check the G-Fambulance and The Scarf Soldiers every home game in Lot L6, and like us on facebook and instagam 'NYG Scarf Soldiers'

      Comment


      • #4
        Originally posted by IrishMike357 View Post
        I think he is that much better than the other two. To be clear I am all aboard the Hernandez, Wynn, Price train and I would not take Nelson #2 but would take him if we trade back to #5 and got extra picks. Nelson is absolutely that much better though. Hernandez might be the best of the other 3 but he still has some technique issues to fix, especially how he shoots his hands. It is more of a hugging motion than a shooting up the middle motion, I think will lead to holding penalties if he doesn't fix it. I would take any of those guys on this team though. I think they are all awesome at when it comes to finding flaws they are minor.

        I always pose this question. Which is better? Barkley/Hernandez (or Wynn or Price) vs Nelson/Guice (or Chubb or other 2nd round RB). I would take either combo but I would take Barkley at #2 over Nelson and would prefer Hernandez over Guice in round 2. I won't be upset with any of these interior guys though, even if we trade down a few spots, get an extra round 2 pick and take two OGs in the first two rounds.
        Yep. Went back to look at Nelson’s tape yesterday just to see how big I thought the drop off was between the OG and Nelson is a plug and play all-pro. Guy does it all. Hernandez and Wynn are more your “pick your flavor” type of guys. Hernandez is the absolute mauler road grader (I think best fits as a RG) and Wynn is your athletic pull and lead blocker with exceptional pass protection skills (ideal LG).

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        • #5
          I’d be fine with Nelson at #2. If we get a solid offer from #5 or #6, i’d take it and hope he’s still available. If not, we can go defense or QB.

          We should be able to change our oline with this draft + free agency. I like Nelson in the first. It looks like Connor Williams and Orlando Brown are dropping and one or both of them might be available in the 2nd. I also like Wynn, Hernandez, and Price there. And then possible in the 3rd, we’ve got a freak in Braden Smith, Frank Ragnow, some other OG/Cs and then some tackles who might be labeled as projects.

          Looking at Gettleman’s track record, the thing that stands out is his ability to find solid offensive lineman in the draft. He drafted 3 offensive lineman with the panthers and 2 other then (Turner in 3rd, Williams in 4th), are high-quality starters and the other (Moton in 2nd) was just a rookie this year and should start next year. He also found Norwell as an UDFA and brought in a journeyman in Mike Remmers who got a $30 million contract from Minnesota this past free agency. Im glad he’s the guy with the responsibility of changing this OL.

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          • #6
            Originally posted by Kase-1 View Post
            We have ALL been gushing over Quenton Nelson and how awesome he is (myself included), but ne is going top 5, maybe top 10. Is he worth it over someone like Will Hernandez or Isiah Wynn?

            All 3 of those guys are beasts and i would LOVE to have any of them on the team, but i dont know if i want to spend a top 5 pick on a guard when i can get someone comparable in the 2nd

            .....If we get Nelson, i wont be upset at all, just speculating
            A top 5 pick for a G is ridiculous to me, especially when the strength of this draft is interior O-LINEMEN. Hernandez or Wynn will be there at 34. If we trade back, I prefer we get a LT in the first round and Hernandez or Wynn or even Price in the second round. Move Flowers to RT and re-sign Fluker to play RG and leave Jones at C.

            Comment


            • #7
              what about frank raginow? he can play guard or center.

              braden smith
              desmond harrison &/or alex cappa moving to guard or even cole madison or austin corbett
              other(s)


              in my mind there are so many guards in the draft that are potentially great prospects.

              tackle OTOH, not so much

              how much does supply and demand weigh into the decision? how much SHOULD supply/demand weigh into it?

              Comment


              • #8
                Originally posted by Cruzan 26 View Post

                A top 5 pick for a G is ridiculous to me, especially when the strength of this draft is interior O-LINEMEN. Hernandez or Wynn will be there at 34. If we trade back, I prefer we get a LT in the first round and Hernandez or Wynn or even Price in the second round. Move Flowers to RT and re-sign Fluker to play RG and leave Jones at C.
                Day this scenario.

                Denver signs Cousins. trades their 1st (5) 2nd (40) and a 2019 (1st) for our 1st (2) to select Saquon Barkley.

                Giants go

                1(5). Quenton Nelson LG
                2(34). Will Hernandez RG
                2(40). Tyrell Crosby LT
                3(66). Darius Leonard LB
                4. DeShon Elliot S
                5. Josh Adams RB

                starting OL

                Crosby-Nelson-Jones($)-Hernandez-Flowers

                Combo of Gallman and Adams at RB. Slash and Bash.


                Comment


                • #9
                  Originally posted by GoDeep13 View Post

                  Day this scenario.

                  Denver signs Cousins. trades their 1st (5) 2nd (40) and a 2019 (1st) for our 1st (2) to select Saquon Barkley.

                  Giants go

                  1(5). Quenton Nelson LG
                  2(34). Will Hernandez RG
                  2(40). Tyrell Crosby LT
                  3(66). Darius Leonard LB
                  4. DeShon Elliot S
                  5. Josh Adams RB

                  starting OL

                  Crosby-Nelson-Jones($)-Hernandez-Flowers

                  Combo of Gallman and Adams at RB. Slash and Bash.

                  That seems like a lot to give up to move up only three spots. Why would Denver agree to that? Selecting a G in the top 5 just doesn't sit well with me.

                  Comment


                  • #10
                    Originally posted by Cruzan 26 View Post

                    That seems like a lot to give up to move up only three spots. Why would Denver agree to that? Selecting a G in the top 5 just doesn't sit well with me.
                    No that’s about exactly what they would have to give up.

                    2nd ovr= 2,600 pts

                    5th ovr= 1,700 pts (-900pt dif)

                    40th ovr = 500 pts (now -400 pts dif)

                    lowest valued 1st is 590 (since 2019 draft isn’t ordered yet I’d have to assume lowest value). Now a +190 dif.

                    We we could offer them a swap of 3rds to smooth out the deal.

                    Denver really just needs a QB and a RB to be legit contenders. I’m sure they’d happily take Saquon and wait till the 3rd to have their next pick. As to that their 1st next season wouldn’t look to be that high with those improvements.

                    Dude. With that OL we draft we could go from near the bottom to near the top in rushing. That alone fixes (or atl east reduces) a lot of our flaws on O.

                    Comment


                    • #11
                      Originally posted by GoDeep13 View Post

                      No that’s about exactly what they would have to give up.

                      2nd ovr= 2,600 pts

                      5th ovr= 1,700 pts (-900pt dif)

                      40th ovr = 500 pts (now -400 pts dif)

                      lowest valued 1st is 590 (since 2019 draft isn’t ordered yet I’d have to assume lowest value). Now a +190 dif.

                      We we could offer them a swap of 3rds to smooth out the deal.

                      Denver really just needs a QB and a RB to be legit contenders. I’m sure they’d happily take Saquon and wait till the 3rd to have their next pick. As to that their 1st next season wouldn’t look to be that high with those improvements.

                      Dude. With that OL we draft we could go from near the bottom to near the top in rushing. That alone fixes (or atl east reduces) a lot of our flaws on O.
                      Would you be happy with Giants management if they give up a 1st and a high second round pick to move up three spots? I would be ****. And Denver have a good RB already.

                      Comment


                      • #12
                        Originally posted by bigpoppy View Post
                        how much does supply and demand weigh into the decision? how much SHOULD supply/demand weigh into it?
                        It should not matter at all honestly. You can't say, well there might be this prospect later so we won't take a guy now. These teams have no clue who will be there later. If there is a guy, at what ever position, that they love in the 1st round they should take him. Also we need the help anyway on the OL, so even if we got Nelson and then Hernandez or Wynn or Price fall to us in round 2 and we took them it would be ok. Our OL is in such chaos we could use 3-4 picks on the OL this year lol.


                        Originally posted by Cruzan 26 View Post
                        If we trade back, I prefer we get a LT in the first round
                        The problem is there is no LT in the draft, certainly not a 1st round LT prospect.
                        LT (132.5) -> Strahan (141.5) -> Osi (65) -> Tuck (60.5) -> JPP (50) -> ???
                        "Next man up"

                        "I am a nasty football player, I get after people. That is something that I am very proud of. I am out there and I am physical every play, making sure that the guy across from me wants to quit." - Adam Bisnowaty

                        Comment


                        • #13
                          Originally posted by IrishMike357 View Post
                          It should not matter at all honestly. You can't say, well there might be this prospect later so we won't take a guy now. These teams have no clue who will be there later. If there is a guy, at what ever position, that they love in the 1st round they should take him. Also we need the help anyway on the OL, so even if we got Nelson and then Hernandez or Wynn or Price fall to us in round 2 and we took them it would be ok. Our OL is in such chaos we could use 3-4 picks on the OL this year lol.



                          The problem is there is no LT in the draft, certainly not a 1st round LT prospect.
                          You have Brown, Williams, Okorafor, McGGlinchey. Trade back and get one of these guys.

                          Comment


                          • #14
                            Originally posted by IrishMike357 View Post
                            It should not matter at all honestly. You can't say, well there might be this prospect later so we won't take a guy now. These teams have no clue who will be there later. If there is a guy, at what ever position, that they love in the 1st round they should take him. Also we need the help anyway on the OL, so even if we got Nelson and then Hernandez or Wynn or Price fall to us in round 2 and we took them it would be ok. Our OL is in such chaos we could use 3-4 picks on the OL this year lol.



                            The problem is there is no LT in the draft, certainly not a 1st round LT prospect.
                            I like orlando Brown at LT in round 1 or 2.

                            Every year there is a run on a position. So, although perhaps it shouldn't matter, it does always appear to work out that way.

                            Gettlemen talked about how he is changing to set up the draft board the way carolina does it. i'm guessing but...

                            setting up a draft board, you would setup up headings across the top of your spreadsheet the position groups from left to right, from most important/most valuable to least valuable. Value is determined by supply demand, Money paid by NFL teams to the position, & current Needs of your team.Tthen your players are ranked by grade from top to bottom.

                            That way you get a visual on best players talent wise and most valuable to your team in terms of the Positions value and team needs at the same time.

                            Doing it that way, the player highest and most to the left will be the most valuable player to your team in the draft, while the players lowest and to the right are the least desirable draft picks.

                            That is what i guess/expect Gettlemen is doing.

                            I guess/expect that QB, OT, are the 2 most valuable positions.

                            That is why nelson or barkley could have less of a chance to be the pick.

                            we shall see

                            QB OT ? ? ? ? ? ?
                            QB, Pass Rusher, OT, ? ? ? ? GUARD, RB

                            Barkley
                            Nelson,
                            Chubb,
                            Fitzpatrick
                            Darnold



                            https://www.foxsports.com/nfl/galler...-player-053117

                            guard is 11th on the list, but due to needs may get pushed further to the left, but how much further?


                            see what i'm saying?

                            its really an intelligent way to set up a draft board because you get a diagonal ranking of sorts.

                            see above tos tart to get the idea of the visual...... if it were a perfect system you could draw a diagonal line and simply choose the player closes to the line but we all know its not perfect but it can give you a better idea or at least gentlemen must think so.
                            Last edited by bigpoppy; 02-03-2018, 04:45 PM.

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                            • #15
                              Originally posted by Cruzan 26 View Post

                              You have Brown, Williams, Okorafor, McGGlinchey. Trade back and get one of these guys.
                              Not a single one is likely to be a LT though. IrishMike McGlinchey or Williams would be fine IMO, but will be RTs.
                              LT (132.5) -> Strahan (141.5) -> Osi (65) -> Tuck (60.5) -> JPP (50) -> ???
                              "Next man up"

                              "I am a nasty football player, I get after people. That is something that I am very proud of. I am out there and I am physical every play, making sure that the guy across from me wants to quit." - Adam Bisnowaty

                              Comment

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