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Why Saquan Barkley Would Be A HUGE Mistake

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  • Originally posted by Morehead State View Post

    Many teams don't prioritize RB as a high value position. because it's not.
    You can do better than that.
    Engage brain before speaking.

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    • Originally posted by Morehead State View Post

      Many teams don't prioritize RB as a high value position. because it's not.
      http://boards.giants.com/forum/new-y...he-rb-position

      Perhaps that will change your perspective.

      Comment


      • Originally posted by Morehead State View Post

        Sounds like Alvin Kamara.....and he was taken in the third round.
        Fair enough but that same logic can be used against taking a QB or any other position as great players sometimes get taken later in the draft. Furthermore, while it is unlikely Barkley can do better than Kamara's receiving numbers (just too many other targets), I think Barkley will have more of an impact running than Kamara did since Kamara only had 120 rushes.

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        • Originally posted by bringsimmsback View Post

          I didn't comment way back when you originally posted this but have seen it now because someone else commented and moved the thread up the board. I'm not a huge fan of taking Barkley (he was last on my list of picks I would at least understand) but he isn't the type of back you are describing above. Running is his second attribute while his impact in the passing game will be why he is worth the number 2 (if it turns out that way). He is a good enough runner to keep defences honest and to run out the clock when needed but I think we will appreciate those parts of the game where he keeps down and distance manageable as a good check-down option. What will put him over the top as a pick (again, if he pans out) is those plays designed to get 5 to 10 yards with a quick, high percentage throw that he ends up taking 65 yards for a TD. I predict we will have way more consistency (fewer 3 and outs and higher 3rd down) next year with more big plays thrown in.

          I get your point and it is reasonable if you think of Barkley as traditional RB but I think he is a RB reflective of today's emphasis on the pass that can also fulfill the more traditional role as needed.
          Nice.
          I hadn't thought of that..
          I am not as savvy as most here, but I appreciate a well reasoned and articulate post.

          Comment


          • Originally posted by bringsimmsback View Post

            Fair enough but that same logic can be used against taking a QB or any other position as great players sometimes get taken later in the draft. Furthermore, while it is unlikely Barkley can do better than Kamara's receiving numbers (just too many other targets), I think Barkley will have more of an impact running than Kamara did since Kamara only had 120 rushes.
            RB....Pretty easy to find later in the draft.
            QB....Pretty damned hard to find anywhere in the draft
            Deny everything. Admit nothing. Make counter accusations.

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            • I originally wanted NYG to parlay the #2 pick into assets. I was however, open to taking Barkley at 2. Its not just his talent, its the person. The Giants have severely lacked Offensive leaders. I see Barkley as a true CATALYST. He will become a team leader, sooner than later. His persona, work ethic, pursuit of excellence, and will to win will most certainly impact the entire team. Even Stewart and Gallman will be that much better with Barkley on the team. If Odell concentrates on "team" and winning, his numbers will go through the roof.
              As for not taking a QB, Collins, Jenkins, and Shepard have all stated recently they have full confidence in Webb becoming the successor. Collins stated that Webb dropped dimes on him and Jenkins completing passes to well covered WRs. If Lauletta beats out Webb so be it, but with the weapons NYG has assembled I feel it should be the strong armed QB. The Giants are coming around rapidly. DG had a great draft.

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              • Originally posted by Morehead State View Post

                RB....Pretty easy to find later in the draft.
                QB....Pretty damned hard to find anywhere in the draft
                It has been of late, with a few examples to prove your point, but it remains to be seen if RB will prove easier than other positions over time. I'm not interested in arguing that, however, as I already said Barkley was the last option I was ok with. The point of my post was that most of the argument about the position of RB being devalued is based on thinking of RBs as only runners.

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                • Nobody has mentioned Myron Foinbush, the highly touted prospect who never led his team to the Super Bowl. In fact, never played in a game.

                  Everyone had such high hopes for him, especially his mother.

                  Myron, where are you today?
                  Last edited by WayBackFan; 05-11-2018, 06:40 AM.
                  "Don't cry because it's over. Smile because it happened." -- Dr. Seuss

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                  • Originally posted by WayBackFan View Post
                    Nobody has mentioned Myron Foinbush, the highly touted prospect who never led his team to the Super Bowl. In fact, never played in a game.

                    Everyone had such high hopes for him, especially his mother.

                    Myron, where are you today?
                    I think he's having lunch with Jonas Seawright

                    Comment


                    • Originally posted by Morehead State View Post

                      He was NOT a secret find....which is my point. It doesn't require "secret finds" to have a great RB. They are there, plain as day, in later rounds. Just as Kareem Hunt and Alvin Kamara were.

                      You don't hve to blow the #2 pick in the draft on them. They could have drafted Darrius Guice or a number of other backs in later rounds who could have an immediate impact. I agree that waiting until RD's 4 or 5 like JR did may be too optimistic. But they are there and you can draft them without "getting lucky".
                      And the reason he was not was in part because of a misguided view of the value of a running back. He was graded as a round 1 talent by the majority. There are many teams who took players in the first round that year that didn’t pick RBs that would love to have Kamara on their team over whoever they picked.

                      Again, there is a legit value argument in this discussion somewhere but it is complex and in no way does it give a conclusive answer that tells you to never take a RB high because you can always find them later.

                      the only thing that matters is getting good players. The value argument is always way overblown for all positions. Every year teams take OTs high because of “value” and the vast majority of them bust. If you can afford to take risks in the draft then making value your prime metric is fine but I don’t know of any teams who can honestly say they are happy to gamble in the draft with their upper round picks.

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                      • Cleveland to Johnny Manziel #1.

                        That worked out great for them.
                        "Don't cry because it's over. Smile because it happened." -- Dr. Seuss

                        Comment


                        • Originally posted by Morehead State View Post

                          Why spend the 2nd pick in the draft on a RB, when you can draft a guy like Michel at 34? You can have our QB of the future AND our RB.

                          I get that you disagree but can you cite examples of great RB's winning championships in today's NFL. I can cite plenty of great QB's who have.

                          I'll give you Marshon on a team that held Peyton Manning to single digits. Now who else?
                          Because Michelle went at 31.

                          This is why you can never have the mentality of passing on one player because you like another player that you "think" may fall. If you are wrong about that (or right about loving the player... I mean if you think he is great value at 34 why wouldn't a team at 32 or 33 think the same way right?) you would wind up screwed!

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                          • Originally posted by giants8493 View Post

                            Because Michelle went at 31.

                            This is why you can never have the mentality of passing on one player because you like another player that you "think" may fall. If you are wrong about that (or right about loving the player... I mean if you think he is great value at 34 why wouldn't a team at 32 or 33 think the same way right?) you would wind up screwed!
                            Of course i didn't realize we could have had Darrius Guice at 34. I figured he would go in middle of round 1. I would have much rather had Guice over Michel.
                            Deny everything. Admit nothing. Make counter accusations.

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                            • [QUOTE=Morehead State;n3119381]

                              With Odell, Engram and Shepard.....and the fact that there is only one football.......Why draft a RB at #2 when he is not going to get the carries....OR he IS going to get the carries and take the ball out of the hands of those pass receiving weapons?

                              Feeding Odell, Engram and Shepard the ball makes more sense. You can't do both. If you want a real balanced attack, someone is going to suffer. someone is going to be angry about being under utilized.

                              Given that I think we WANT a balanced attack, picking a guy like Barkley makes no sense to me. he needs to go to a team that is going to build an offense around him. Cleveland is the best place

                              You could not be more inaccurate. Having Barkley will make the Linebacker and safety play to a legitimate run threat. Eli is master of the play action, you cannot have play action without the threat of a legitimate run game. Barkley is a 3 down back this the defense cannot predict the play as they did when we put Vareen in the game.

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                              • Originally posted by Morehead State View Post

                                Of course i didn't realize we could have had Darrius Guice at 34. I figured he would go in middle of round 1. I would have much rather had Guice over Michel.
                                People drop out to early every year so even you like one player you got to take him you can't rely on a target like that being there.

                                I was really surprised guice fell apparently he was about to get into a literal fist fight..if a coaching style can deal with him he can run with that Blount like intensity which is a good thing for running backs ! Adrian Peterson talks about running angry and hershel walker used rage to fuel his entire career so hopefully guice does not realize this because he is on the redskins.

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