Announcement

Collapse
No announcement yet.

This is the wrong draft for Giants to save their offensive line

Collapse
X
  • Filter
  • Time
  • Show
Clear All
new posts

  • #76
    Originally posted by Morehead State View Post
    Getting Brandon Marshall reduces our need for a good TE. at least for the two years he's signed for. The great thing about Marshall is his red zone play.
    He's going to be a huge addition to our offense.

    I'm guessing we just let the board come to us and pick the BPA, which would be a departure for JR in RD 1.

    Maybe someone will fall. Or maybe a QB will be there that we can't pass up, like Mahomes.
    If you want a red zone threat. TE michael Roberts is your guy. http://texanswire.usatoday.com/2017/...d-zone-threat/ caought 16 Tds on like 41 attempts i think it was and like 80% of his catches for first downs. Not the fastest guy. Throw it up he comes down with it kind of dude.

    Comment


    • #77
      Originally posted by bigpoppy View Post
      Because its fun to have strong opinions, even if you end up being wrong. Last year was the first year i got into the draft hype. Just enjoying all the possibilities. You know what they say every team wins the Super bowl in the spring. Especially Dallas. Every spring the media has them as SB champs. lol Its just our chance as fans to play GM and say what we think could/should might be done. No big deal. We enjoy discussing it. That's all. I try to keep it light.

      Only one opinion (mine lol)

      2 cents
      No where did I mention anything wrong w opinions. I said everyone thinks their opinion is the only answer. Once I hear that from someone I lose interest in whatever they're trying to say cuz of how close minded they sound. Im very opinionated on the draft and love hearing others opinions and support for their claims too. But the know it alls just sound juvenile and don't know how the draft works. Anything can happen
      2017 Draft Wishlist:
      1. Christian McCaffrey RB Stanford
      2. Raekwon McMillan ILB Ohio State
      3. Roderick Johnson OT Florida State
      4. Jordan Leggett TE Clemson
      5. Ryan Glasgow DT Michegan
      6. Chad Kelly QB Ole Miss
      7. Billy Brown WR Shepherd

      sigpic
      "Behold, the tailgate party. The pinnacle of human achievement. Since the dawn of parking lots, man has sought to fill his gut with food and alcohol in anticipation of watching others exercise."
      - Homer J. Simpson

      Comment


      • #78
        Originally posted by CRF11504 View Post
        Wrong, it's a mismatch passing offense. Optimally, you want 3 mismatch WRs plus a mismatch TE. That mismatch TE is missing still.
        Well I feel much better about my position now.......Thank you.
        Admit nothing. Deny everything. Make counter accusations.

        Comment


        • #79
          Originally posted by TAILGATIN' View Post
          No where did I mention anything wrong w opinions. I said everyone thinks their opinion is the only answer. Once I hear that from someone I lose interest in whatever they're trying to say cuz of how close minded they sound. Im very opinionated on the draft and love hearing others opinions and support for their claims too. But the know it alls just sound juvenile and don't know how the draft works. Anything can happen
          Oh you mean those guys. I just ignore them, or laugh at them the same way I ignore or laugh at skip bayless.

          PS nowhere did i mention that you mentioned... lol

          lighten up my friend! It's Friday!

          Comment


          • #80
            Originally posted by CRF11504 View Post
            Wow, you are totally wrong. The Giants do not have a single threat at TE. Not one guy that worries defenses.
            How am I wrong? I totally agree with that. That's exactly why I mentioned the Falcons. What part of saying OL is simply a more vital role than TE do you not understand? Did having one of the biggest threats at WR matter in the playoffs when Eli never had a chance to make a play to him because our OL got swallowed? Yes, I want an upgrade at TE... BADLY. But it all starts with OL, which opens up things for your RB, WRs and TEs. I wouldn't argue against TE being #2 or #3 biggest need, but won't agree that it's #1 (unless Flowers drastically improves in 2017).

            In the last 5 years 21 OTs have been drafted in the first round. Guess how many TEs have been drafted in the first round... 2. 21 to 2! Now, do you think it's because OT is a more important position, or do you think for the last 5 years every team has just already had a TE that defenses are scared of?
            2017 Mock Draft (Pre-combine / FA):

            Rd 1: OJ Howard (TE, Alabama)
            Rd 2: Tanoh Kpassagnon (DE, Villanova)
            Rd 3: Antonio Garcia (OT, Troy)
            Rd 4: Samaje Perine (RB, Oklahoma)
            Rd 5: Davis Webb (QB, Cal)
            Rd 6: Ahkello Witherspoon (CB, Colorado)
            Rd 7: DJ Jones (DT, Ole Miss)

            Comment


            • #81
              I want Bolles

              Comment


              • #82
                Originally posted by bigpoppy View Post
                Oh you mean those guys. I just ignore them, or laugh at them the same way I ignore or laugh at skip bayless.

                PS nowhere did i mention that you mentioned... lol

                lighten up my friend! It's Friday!
                You must've read into that wrong, in no way am I upset or trying to be rude.. cheers
                2017 Draft Wishlist:
                1. Christian McCaffrey RB Stanford
                2. Raekwon McMillan ILB Ohio State
                3. Roderick Johnson OT Florida State
                4. Jordan Leggett TE Clemson
                5. Ryan Glasgow DT Michegan
                6. Chad Kelly QB Ole Miss
                7. Billy Brown WR Shepherd

                sigpic
                "Behold, the tailgate party. The pinnacle of human achievement. Since the dawn of parking lots, man has sought to fill his gut with food and alcohol in anticipation of watching others exercise."
                - Homer J. Simpson

                Comment


                • #83
                  Originally posted by BlueSabbath View Post
                  I used the Falcons because they made it to the Super Bowl and came pretty damn close to winning. Why would I include a TE that only played the first half of the season?

                  The point I'm making is that TE is not our "#1 need". As I've stated, we definitely need an upgrade, but I'm pointing out a team being very successful without an elite TE. They do however have an incredible offensive line. Their OL kinda gives me some hope. Matthews was atrocious his first year (perhaps due to his ankle injury) but was a totally different player in year 2. Schraeder I don't think was even drafted and has become one of the top RTs in the league. When they added Mack, that also gave them one of the best OL in the league.

                  As for the Patriots... I remember reading at one point in the season their LT was rated in the top 5 and their RT was rated #1 in the league. So we can use Patriots as an example if you'd like.
                  Unfortunately, sometimes your #1 needs don't fall in line with what the draft presents to you. We can need a tackle all day long, particularly a left tackle, but there isn't really anyone most people think can realistically step into that role with any measure of confidence and do better than league bottom. Now that doesn't mean we can't take an OL high. I don't know who will be there, or how the Giants' board will shake out, but in very general terms, this isn't the best draft to be looking for your future blindside protector, regardless of need. A lack of true upper level talent is likely to push these lesser prospects up to more desperate organizations, while less important needs of ours happen to be a strength in quality and quantity in this draft, which helps push good talent down as needs get filled.

                  Look at Evan Engram, who is damn close of a prospect match to Eric Ebron, who went 10th overall to the Lions in 2014. Engram is projected as a 2nd rounder in this draft. That's what quality of a position in the draft can do to a player. By a general rule, I like the idea of riding the waves of strength through drafts. As another example look at a WR and RB deficient draft like 2013, where a gadget player like Tavon Austin got overdrafted at 8th overall, which is normally where you would only draft a WR or RB with a more prototypical skillset and upside. He's really not any different than Curtis Samuel in this draft, who is another highly effective, highly athletic gadget player that coaches scratch their chins figuring out how to use them. Why is Curtis Samuel a 2nd rounder, because WRs and RBs with more exceptional skillsets and more defined roles exist in this draft.

                  None of this is to say we can't draft an OL in the 1st. I just typically don't like spending hefty draft capital on perceived draft weaknesses, that have teams itchy to reach for out of necessity. It doesn't have to be TE either, but if there ever was a draft to pluck a TE out of, it would be this one. I'd also like to pick up a DE, a RB and a DB for those exact same reasons. I like the idea of leaning into positions with exceptional top end and/or depth of talent.

                  Comment


                  • #84
                    Originally posted by Onyxmeth View Post
                    Unfortunately, sometimes your #1 needs don't fall in line with what the draft presents to you. We can need a tackle all day long, particularly a left tackle, but there isn't really anyone most people think can realistically step into that role with any measure of confidence and do better than league bottom. Now that doesn't mean we can't take an OL high. I don't know who will be there, or how the Giants' board will shake out, but in very general terms, this isn't the best draft to be looking for your future blindside protector, regardless of need. A lack of true upper level talent is likely to push these lesser prospects up to more desperate organizations, while less important needs of ours happen to be a strength in quality and quantity in this draft, which helps push good talent down as needs get filled.

                    Look at Evan Engram, who is damn close of a prospect match to Eric Ebron, who went 10th overall to the Lions in 2014. Engram is projected as a 2nd rounder in this draft. That's what quality of a position in the draft can do to a player. By a general rule, I like the idea of riding the waves of strength through drafts. As another example look at a WR and RB deficient draft like 2013, where a gadget player like Tavon Austin got overdrafted at 8th overall, which is normally where you would only draft a WR or RB with a more prototypical skillset and upside. He's really not any different than Curtis Samuel in this draft, who is another highly effective, highly athletic gadget player that coaches scratch their chins figuring out how to use them. Why is Curtis Samuel a 2nd rounder, because WRs and RBs with more exceptional skillsets and more defined roles exist in this draft.

                    None of this is to say we can't draft an OL in the 1st. I just typically don't like spending hefty draft capital on perceived draft weaknesses, that have teams itchy to reach for out of necessity. It doesn't have to be TE either, but if there ever was a draft to pluck a TE out of, it would be this one. I'd also like to pick up a DE, a RB and a DB for those exact same reasons. I like the idea of leaning into positions with exceptional top end and/or depth of talent.
                    None of this really pertains to what I said. Someone said TE is our #1 need. I said I disagree. Nothing about who we will or should draft.
                    2017 Mock Draft (Pre-combine / FA):

                    Rd 1: OJ Howard (TE, Alabama)
                    Rd 2: Tanoh Kpassagnon (DE, Villanova)
                    Rd 3: Antonio Garcia (OT, Troy)
                    Rd 4: Samaje Perine (RB, Oklahoma)
                    Rd 5: Davis Webb (QB, Cal)
                    Rd 6: Ahkello Witherspoon (CB, Colorado)
                    Rd 7: DJ Jones (DT, Ole Miss)

                    Comment


                    • #85
                      Originally posted by CRF11504 View Post
                      I think thats an easy blame, an easy one-liner that you can throw out there and think you have all the answers, McAdoo said, via Newsday. I dont necessarily agree with that.

                      http://profootballtalk.nbcsports.com...s-eli-manning/
                      lol exactly thank you for showing the correct PC answer McAdoo gave. He's not going to say that Flowers and Hart sucked last year because they're both 23 and both could be potentially starting. that would be counter productive and bad coaching.

                      Comment


                      • #86
                        Originally posted by BlueSabbath View Post
                        How am I wrong? I totally agree with that. That's exactly why I mentioned the Falcons. What part of saying OL is simply a more vital role than TE do you not understand? Did having one of the biggest threats at WR matter in the playoffs when Eli never had a chance to make a play to him because our OL got swallowed? Yes, I want an upgrade at TE... BADLY. But it all starts with OL, which opens up things for your RB, WRs and TEs. I wouldn't argue against TE being #2 or #3 biggest need, but won't agree that it's #1 (unless Flowers drastically improves in 2017).

                        In the last 5 years 21 OTs have been drafted in the first round. Guess how many TEs have been drafted in the first round... 2. 21 to 2! Now, do you think it's because OT is a more important position, or do you think for the last 5 years every team has just already had a TE that defenses are scared of?

                        Or, if a TE gets open quickly in the middle of the field, then Eli doesn't have to hold the ball as long, which in turn helps the OL.

                        Ever think of that?

                        Comment


                        • #87
                          Originally posted by BlueSabbath View Post
                          If we skip on OT we will need the best edge rusher in the draft, a helluva 3 tech and yeah, we have to address TE and RB. Defense wins championships, but you need a serviceable OL. A good blocking and offensive threat at TE would do wonders for our offense.

                          Tough to say who could start over Flowers, at least in year one. I think Ram could definitely start ahead of him. I would say Cam as well but I'd be at 70% confidence on that. In year two I think both could and I would throw Garcia in there as well.

                          Another thing to consider in all this is can Flowers just get better? I mean, I thought he looked decent to start the season.
                          i think if the Giants go OL in the first that the player they pick would slide into RT right off the bat. I think the Giants want to give Flowers another chance at LT. i also think they may be weary moving a rookie to LT after what has happened with Flowers to start.

                          unless of course that rookie clearly outplayed Flowers, then i could see the rook starting. But my guess would be they jump in at RT and Fluker/Jerry/Hart battle for starting OG.

                          Comment


                          • #88
                            Originally posted by CRF11504 View Post
                            Or, if a TE gets open quickly in the middle of the field, then Eli doesn't have to hold the ball as long, which in turn helps the OL.

                            Ever think of that?
                            Of course. But which sounds better or more likely... a TE constantly getting open quickly in the middle of the field? Or having an OL that makes it to where Eli doesn't constantly have to rush to get rid of the ball.. which in turns helps WRs, RBs and TEs and reduces chances of turnovers. Sounds like an easy decision to me... and again, that's why there have been 21 OTs drafted in the first round compared to 2 TEs. It's just a more important position. If our OL problems don't get better, a player that can get open in the middle of the field quickly and constantly is gonna be exactly what we need. Let's hope defenses forget to cover the middle of the field when they play us.
                            2017 Mock Draft (Pre-combine / FA):

                            Rd 1: OJ Howard (TE, Alabama)
                            Rd 2: Tanoh Kpassagnon (DE, Villanova)
                            Rd 3: Antonio Garcia (OT, Troy)
                            Rd 4: Samaje Perine (RB, Oklahoma)
                            Rd 5: Davis Webb (QB, Cal)
                            Rd 6: Ahkello Witherspoon (CB, Colorado)
                            Rd 7: DJ Jones (DT, Ole Miss)

                            Comment


                            • #89
                              Originally posted by gibril28wilson View Post
                              i think if the Giants go OL in the first that the player they pick would slide into RT right off the bat. I think the Giants want to give Flowers another chance at LT. i also think they may be weary moving a rookie to LT after what has happened with Flowers to start.

                              unless of course that rookie clearly outplayed Flowers, then i could see the rook starting. But my guess would be they jump in at RT and Fluker/Jerry/Hart battle for starting OG.
                              I could see that. I guess it's just a matter of how long we want to carry the burden of inept OTs (assuming they don't improve this year). Also, even if a rookie didnt' start at LT game one, if Flowers continues to struggle, we'd have options. We will not be able to get passed a playoff level defense without our tackles improving a lot. Improvement at guard will definitely help too.
                              2017 Mock Draft (Pre-combine / FA):

                              Rd 1: OJ Howard (TE, Alabama)
                              Rd 2: Tanoh Kpassagnon (DE, Villanova)
                              Rd 3: Antonio Garcia (OT, Troy)
                              Rd 4: Samaje Perine (RB, Oklahoma)
                              Rd 5: Davis Webb (QB, Cal)
                              Rd 6: Ahkello Witherspoon (CB, Colorado)
                              Rd 7: DJ Jones (DT, Ole Miss)

                              Comment


                              • #90
                                Originally posted by BlueSabbath View Post
                                None of this really pertains to what I said. Someone said TE is our #1 need. I said I disagree. Nothing about who we will or should draft.
                                OL is a more important position, but its not any more of a need than TE is. We are horrific at both. We currently have replacement level players at TE and across different spots on the OL. The draft isn't a place to fill needs though. It's a place to acquire talent. If you want to fill a need in the draft, then your best strategy is to take the player most likely to fill that need. That actually would be TE in that case, seeing as how taking an exceptional TE prospect in the 1st would give you on average a better chance at a hit than taking a marginal OT prospect in the same spot. If in fact this is about filling needs. We just took an OT two years ago much higher than this and we're already looking again. There are very few guarantees when looking for a blindside protector. If anyone thought with any decent assurance that they could be a LT in a quick enough time to fill a need, they would be about 15-20 spots out of our reach.

                                Comment

                                Working...
                                X