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  • 3rd and 1 with 3 minutes to play

    I am continually amazed at how we continue to call high risk pass plays on 3rd and short. With 3 minutes to go if we convert there the game is basically over. What do we do, we throw a pass down the sidelines to Nicks with a low probability of it being caught. Why not a short slant? Not understanding this philosophy???

  • #2
    Originally posted by eastbayblue View Post
    I am continually amazed at how we continue to call high risk pass plays on 3rd and short. With 3 minutes to go if we convert there the game is basically over. What do we do, we throw a pass down the sidelines to Nicks with a low probability of it being caught. Why not a short slant? Not understanding this philosophy???
    I feel the same way.

    However here is are philosophies behind throwing that on third and short:

    1) If they man up on the wide (which they almost always will on third and short) he's going to throw the Go route every time.

    2) Throwing that pass can either buy you an interception (basically a short punt), a TD, a reception and move the chains, a penalty and move the chains (this is why in today's NFL it's not considered a low percentage pass anymore) or an incompletion and punt. GB's entire offense is predicated on this logic (and obviously works very well ... note the difference with the replacement refs who weren't calling as many interference calls).

    3) This is a sight adjustment by Eli depending on the defense shown. It's not Gilbride calling it (a rather common mistake among posters here).

    I'm not a huge fan of it myself, but you can't argue with the overall results (the past 5 years that they've been doing this).
    I don't always root for the Cowboys but when I do I wear my pink Jessica Simpson edition Romo jersey. (yes I lost a bet)

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    • #3
      Originally posted by Kruunch View Post
      I feel the same way.

      However here is are philosophies behind throwing that on third and short:

      1) If they man up on the wide (which they almost always will on third and short) he's going to throw the Go route every time.

      2) Throwing that pass can either buy you an interception (basically a short punt), a TD, a reception and move the chains, a penalty and move the chains (this is why in today's NFL it's not considered a low percentage pass anymore) or an incompletion and punt. GB's entire offense is predicated on this logic (and obviously works very well ... note the difference with the replacement refs who weren't calling as many interference calls).

      3) This is a sight adjustment by Eli depending on the defense shown. It's not Gilbride calling it (a rather common mistake among posters here).

      I'm not a huge fan of it myself, but you can't argue with the overall results (the past 5 years that they've been doing this).
      I agree with this but whatever happened to going for the first down? It seems like 75% of 3rd and short plays the Giants have, they go for 7-10+ yards for whatever reason. I am a huge fan of getting the first down and extending the drive but the Giants don't seem to want to go by this philosophy.

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      • #4
        Originally posted by JB456 View Post
        I agree with this but whatever happened to going for the first down? It seems like 75% of 3rd and short plays the Giants have, they go for 7-10+ yards for whatever reason. I am a huge fan of getting the first down and extending the drive but the Giants don't seem to want to go by this philosophy.
        You don't get a first down if you complete a long pass on 3rd and 2?

        Based upon the Giants short yardage performance over the past several years, I'd say that we are probably more likely to get a first down on thrird and short with a long pass play than a running play . . . . .

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        • #5
          Originally posted by JB456 View Post
          I agree with this but whatever happened to going for the first down? It seems like 75% of 3rd and short plays the Giants have, they go for 7-10+ yards for whatever reason. I am a huge fan of getting the first down and extending the drive but the Giants don't seem to want to go by this philosophy.
          Part of it stems from how well you're running the ball.

          Part of it stems from the look the defense gives you.

          Part of it is trying to do something other than what the other team might be looking for.

          But I also like the idea of imposing our will on the other team and just rushing it down their throats. Unfortunately we're not that type of team anymore. Fortunately, we're still effective.
          I don't always root for the Cowboys but when I do I wear my pink Jessica Simpson edition Romo jersey. (yes I lost a bet)

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          • #6
            Originally posted by eastbayblue View Post
            I am continually amazed at how we continue to call high risk pass plays on 3rd and short. With 3 minutes to go if we convert there the game is basically over. What do we do, we throw a pass down the sidelines to Nicks with a low probability of it being caught. Why not a short slant? Not understanding this philosophy???
            I've argued this point ad nauseum. I'm not sure why Eli Manning continues to attempt longer passes when all we need is a few yards for a first.

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            • #7
              Originally posted by Roosevelt View Post
              I've argued this point ad nauseum. I'm not sure why Eli Manning continues to attempt longer passes when all we need is a few yards for a first.
              Better to throw into single-coverage long than into heavy-coverage short. Am thrilled that we have a QB who is confident at hitting the long-ball...

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              • #8
                Btw - aren't there a lot of Jets fans out there today who are upset with their team for getting too conservative towards the end of the game?

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                • #9
                  Originally posted by GMENAGAIN View Post
                  You don't get a first down if you complete a long pass on 3rd and 2?

                  Based upon the Giants short yardage performance over the past several years, I'd say that we are probably more likely to get a first down on thrird and short with a long pass play than a running play . . . . .
                  this.

                  our 3rd and short running game is putrid, it has been for years. and opposing defenses are playing to defend the short pass on 3rd and short, so it leave chances up top. im pretty sure they have hit at least 3 big plays in such situation including cruz's 80 yard TD vs. bucs, hixon's long reception last week vs. SF, and i think cruz's long TD vs the browns.

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                  • #10
                    Was anyone upset when he completed the 31 yard pass to Marty B on 3rd and 1?? Didn't think so! Hindsight is always 20-20!!
                    Last edited by DVision; 10-22-2012, 04:26 PM.

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                    • #11
                      You need to run the ball in that situation based upon clock mgmt, a new set of downs there basically finishes the game. Cruz is ending up short of the first down marker too often.

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                      • #12
                        Defenses scheme to stop short throws. They are more susceptible to long plays on 3rd and short.

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                        • #13
                          Originally posted by GMENAGAIN View Post
                          You don't get a first down if you complete a long pass on 3rd and 2?

                          Based upon the Giants short yardage performance over the past several years, I'd say that we are probably more likely to get a first down on thrird and short with a long pass play than a running play . . . . .
                          How about a short pass play? I agree we can't run worth crap, but going long is just rediculous. Going long is already a much smaller % completion in itself.
                          http://boards.giants.com/showthread....est-game/page6
                          http://www.coldhardfootballfacts.com/Articles/11_2554_A_brief,_fact-filled_history_of_the_NFL_passing_game.html
                          http://espn.go.com/nfl/story/_/id/8732732/is-new-york-giants-qb-eli-manning-worthy-hall-fame-espn-magazine

                          Entire Team Let Eli down today - NYG4l

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                          • #14
                            Originally posted by slipknottin View Post
                            Defenses scheme to stop short throws. They are more susceptible to long plays on 3rd and short.
                            That's all fine and good, but it's not a flow chart. Short of a busted coverage, shorter passes have a much higher % of completion than long ones.
                            http://boards.giants.com/showthread....est-game/page6
                            http://www.coldhardfootballfacts.com/Articles/11_2554_A_brief,_fact-filled_history_of_the_NFL_passing_game.html
                            http://espn.go.com/nfl/story/_/id/8732732/is-new-york-giants-qb-eli-manning-worthy-hall-fame-espn-magazine

                            Entire Team Let Eli down today - NYG4l

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                            • #15
                              If there's a chance for a big play, you take it. Especially with our QB and WRs. No play is 100% effective.

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