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Phil Simms: "No, Eli Is Not One Of The Elites....."

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  • Originally posted by dezzzR View Post
    Simms cultists!!!
    I think I'm going to have T shirts made.
    The difference between me and the Eli Cultists is that I admit it.
    Admit nothing. Deny everything. Make counter accusations.

    Comment


    • Originally posted by Morehead State View Post
      Our defense held the highest scoring offense in NFL history to 14 points in SB 42. They knocked Brady on his *** 19 times. That SB had one of the greatest defensive performances in SB history. No offensive player carried that team.
      Or defensive .. individual player that is.

      TD catch and then THE catch. Tyree could have been mvp.

      Comment


      • Originally posted by dillyyo1972 View Post
        The whole team wasn't, but they all meshed during the run and during that time Eli showed that he could make any throw, in any condition with any game on the line.
        Eli didn't play well during the season. He had two of the worst games I've ever seen a QB have. The 4 pick game vs. Minn. and that Buffalo game where KG was afraid to even let him throw a pass later in the game.

        His performance in the playoffs was solid in that he didn't turn the ball over. His yards, TD's were right in line with his career averages.
        Admit nothing. Deny everything. Make counter accusations.

        Comment


        • Originally posted by gumby74 View Post
          In 2007 Eli wasn't stellar by any means during the regular season.
          Originally posted by dillyyo1972 View Post
          The whole team wasn't, but they all meshed during the run and during that time Eli showed that he could make any throw, in any condition with any game on the line.
          I you said Eli "carried" the team which is not accurate. In 2011, he certainly did the lions share of work. In 2007? Absolutely not.

          " Point I made was Eli carried that team more often then not through that season and runs they went on in the playoff"
          http://boards.giants.com/showthread....est-game/page6
          http://www.coldhardfootballfacts.com/Articles/11_2554_A_brief,_fact-filled_history_of_the_NFL_passing_game.html
          http://espn.go.com/nfl/story/_/id/8732732/is-new-york-giants-qb-eli-manning-worthy-hall-fame-espn-magazine

          Entire Team Let Eli down today - NYG4l

          Comment


          • Originally posted by Morehead State View Post
            Doesn't bother me at all that he's coddled. Whatever makes him play better. My point is that Phil was thrown to the wolves. Then when he tore up his knee, they discarded him. He had to claw his way back.
            Our coaches have been very careful with Eli.
            Don't recall Phil tearing up his knee, but maybe you meant the ankle in Buffalo. Anyways, the demise of Phil after that was due to Handley's ridiculous preference of Hoss over Phil. By that time the team was fragmenting and we entered into an era where greats like Rodney Hampton were just farts in the wind of NFL legacy.

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            • Originally posted by Cool Papa B. View Post
              "No, he is not one of the elites," Simms said in quotes distributed by CBS. "Because when I hear the word elite, I'm thinking about guys that can make unbelievable plays on the field by themselves. There are very few quarterbacks in that category.

              "So yes, Eli has been a tremendous team player. He has been MVP of the Super Bowl twice. I know that. But the way I look at it, the answer is no."

              Read more: http://www.nydailynews.com/sports/fo...#ixzz2C8Eaubto

              Here we go again.....

              What does it all mean anyway? Elite...not elite?? It's a subjective opinion made by people who know no more about sports than you or I!
              Marino was elite...he bombed in his one and only SB
              Montana was elite and was great at the comeback like Eli is.
              Favre thru more INT's than any QB in NFL history and he's a first ballot HOFer
              Peyton is considered elite, he's a first ballot HOFer won one SB with an MVP, but his performances and record in the playoffs is horrible!
              Brees has one SB ring with an MVP and the same year everyone was using the 25 INT's Eli threw as the argument why he's not elite and not in the same class as Brees............, Brees in the same season thru 22 INT's!
              It's the reason why I think it a stupid pointless debate. Nobody can look at the examples I gave and show any kind of definitive criteria for what makes a QB elite or not!
              Eli gave us those 2 SB rings....he earned every victory from the playoffs to the SB with his great performance and thats all that matters to me.
              Is Eli elite? who cares.....those Lombardi trophies belong to the franchise and the fans and they can't be taken away.
              "I'M ALL FOR IT!"

              John McKay, HC of the 1976 winless TB Buccaneers, when asked by a reporter, how McKay felt, about the execution of his offense.

              Comment


              • Originally posted by dillyyo1972 View Post
                Don't recall Phil tearing up his knee, but maybe you meant the ankle in Buffalo. Anyways, the demise of Phil after that was due to Handley's ridiculous preference of Hoss over Phil. By that time the team was fragmenting and we entered into an era where greats like Rodney Hampton were just farts in the wind of NFL legacy.
                No. Phil tore his knee up in a pre season game in (think it was) 1981. I also think it was against the Jets. He was laying in the endzone in pain while the crowd cheered.
                Its incredible what Phil had to overcome to do what he did later in his career.
                Admit nothing. Deny everything. Make counter accusations.

                Comment


                • Originally posted by Morehead State View Post
                  Eli didn't play well during the season. He had two of the worst games I've ever seen a QB have. The 4 pick game vs. Minn. and that Buffalo game where KG was afraid to even let him throw a pass later in the game.

                  His performance in the playoffs was solid in that he didn't turn the ball over. His yards, TD's were right in line with his career averages.
                  You are gauging Eli on stats and that's not the kind of great player he is. His greatness comes in his clutch play when it's mostly needed. He made throws in an environment like GB that were sick. You also seem to disregard some of the performances the D had that season.

                  Comment


                  • Originally posted by Morehead State View Post
                    No. Phil tore his knee up in a pre season game in (think it was) 1981. I also think it was against the Jets. He was laying in the endzone in pain while the crowd cheered.
                    Its incredible what Phil had to overcome to do what he did later in his career.
                    Ahh yes, I forgot about that injury. I think the culmination of his injuries in the early going was a definite hurdle, but i'm convinced they don't do what they did in the 80's without that D. Even an avg D and the Giants don't have rings. I don't really feel that way with Eli's teams because I think his D's have played avg even though I think they could have been better.

                    Comment


                    • Originally posted by dillyyo1972 View Post
                      You are gauging Eli on stats and that's not the kind of great player he is. His greatness comes in his clutch play when it's mostly needed. He made throws in an environment like GB that were sick. You also seem to disregard some of the performances the D had that season.
                      This is a problem that a lot of people have actually. Instead of assessing a player's play based on EVERYTHING (reg season, post season, etc), people like to take a handful of moments here and there. Using the same rationale that a lot of people here used to defend Eli, I can make the case that Sanchez is a great QB also.
                      http://boards.giants.com/showthread....est-game/page6
                      http://www.coldhardfootballfacts.com/Articles/11_2554_A_brief,_fact-filled_history_of_the_NFL_passing_game.html
                      http://espn.go.com/nfl/story/_/id/8732732/is-new-york-giants-qb-eli-manning-worthy-hall-fame-espn-magazine

                      Entire Team Let Eli down today - NYG4l

                      Comment


                      • Originally posted by gumby74 View Post
                        I you said Eli "carried" the team which is not accurate. In 2011, he certainly did the lions share of work. In 2007? Absolutely not.

                        " Point I made was Eli carried that team more often then not through that season and runs they went on in the playoff"
                        Technically I also said more often than not. I have not gone back and looked at any stats, but I remember woeful games by all sides of the ball. I also remember Eli playing big in many important games during that season. Maybe I'm wrong, but I still stand by the position that not many Qb's could have done what he did during those games without being elite QBs in NFL history.

                        Comment


                        • Originally posted by gumby74 View Post
                          This is a problem that a lot of people have actually. Instead of assessing a player's play based on EVERYTHING (reg season, post season, etc), people like to take a handful of moments here and there. Using the same rationale that a lot of people here used to defend Eli, I can make the case that Sanchez is a great QB also.
                          Not really because Sanchez has not brought home the golden egg or any egg really. He has not directly participated in all time great NFL plays to win SBs. Like I said 16+ pages ago, Eli is great but highly erratic. The fact that he could be great and so erratic is impressive in itself.

                          Comment


                          • Originally posted by dillyyo1972 View Post
                            Not really because Sanchez has not brought home the golden egg or any egg really. He has not directly participated in all time great NFL plays to win SBs. Like I said 16+ pages ago, Eli is great but highly erratic. The fact that he could be great and so erratic is impressive in itself.
                            Haha. So true.
                            http://boards.giants.com/showthread....est-game/page6
                            http://www.coldhardfootballfacts.com/Articles/11_2554_A_brief,_fact-filled_history_of_the_NFL_passing_game.html
                            http://espn.go.com/nfl/story/_/id/8732732/is-new-york-giants-qb-eli-manning-worthy-hall-fame-espn-magazine

                            Entire Team Let Eli down today - NYG4l

                            Comment


                            • Ah, a thread right up my ally! Too bad I'm late for the party though and missed so much fun.

                              Forgive me if this has been posted already but don't you think Phil simply meant that Eli is not very athletic and can't make things happen with his feet?
                              Torque it till it breaks, then back off a 1/4 turn.

                              Comment


                              • Originally posted by shane4177 View Post
                                Ah Simms himself is/was not elite either.......saw his career stats, nothing special.
                                His jersey was retired dude. What does that tell you?
                                Torque it till it breaks, then back off a 1/4 turn.

                                Comment

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