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Phil Simms: "No, Eli Is Not One Of The Elites....."

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  • Originally posted by Roosevelt View Post
    Simms got screwed by a bum of a coach. And too make matters worse, some of the fools on this board actually get off on that.
    we make the playoffs in 91 and prbly 92 with him at QB... If you look at the roster those years they were more talented than the 93 team that was only a win away from home field through out...We won with some ex broncos....Ray H..was a joke.

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    • Originally posted by alentown pa View Post
      we make the playoffs in 91 and prbly 92 with him at QB... If you look at the roster those years they were more talented than the 93 team that was only a win away from home field through out...We won with some ex broncos....Ray H..was a joke.
      You add those two years of numbers to his already impressive career the talk is different around here....Ah well i don't get into the whole comparison discussion ....These two QB's have given giants fans a lot to be proud of ...alone with some great football
      Last edited by byron; 11-21-2012, 12:24 AM.

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      • Originally posted by Drez View Post
        He's had Gilbride, Chris Palmer, and Mike Sullivan as QB coaches since being with the Giants, and now Sean Ryan. All of his previous QB coaches have gone on to become OCs in the NFL.
        You may disagree with me but I don't think any of those guys are worth a damn.

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        • Originally posted by alentown pa View Post
          lmao that's great Rosey, to bad it wasnt chris simms, you could of easily strong armed him
          You could have punched him where his spleen was.

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          • Originally posted by byron View Post
            You add those two years of numbers to his already impressive career the talk is different around here....Ah well i don't get into the whole comparison discussion ....These two QB's have given giants fans a lot to be proud of ...alone with some great football
            Thats probably the best thing to do because both these guys are NY Giants legends.

            IMO, if Phil Simms had started those two years he would have had the numbers to go to HoF and maybe won another SuperBowl.

            I know that Phil should have started over Hoss but I can't hold it against Hoss, he rose to the occasion when it was time.

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            • Originally posted by BuffyBlueII View Post
              You may disagree with me but I don't think any of those guys are worth a damn.
              I agree... as you pointed out, he has had lifetime coaches, Archie and Peyton, who are more impressive than Gilbride, Palmer or Sullivan.

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              • Originally posted by BuffyBlueII View Post
                I didn't intend to be "ungentlemanly" in my previous post comparing the SuperBowl performances. What Phil did in SuperBowl XXI was incredible. However, Eli did go up against a tougher defense in SuperBowl XLII and their head coach was Bill Bellichek.

                I wasn't trying to diminish Phil's 1990 season but folks really can't definitively state that we would have blown Buffalo Bills out in SuperBowl if Phil Simms had played the game. Jeff Hosstettler was the QB and he brought a different dynamic to the field. Yes, I like our chances against Buffalo Bills with Phil Simms as QB but I really don't know if we would have beaten them. I tend to think that if Phil were in that game that it would have turned in to a shoot out and I don't think we could have won that way against Buffalo Bills. However, we will never know.

                Heck, if Phil didn't get hurt in 1990, he and Eli's 2011 seasons may have been very close. Unfortunately there is no way to tell.

                I see your point in regard to the QB coach. However, there are not many QBs in NFL that can read defenses as well as Eli can. Also, Eli has not had a QB coach that is of note since coming in to NFL but I think the point you are making is that the entire field has been revolutionized in the time between Phil and Eli and that Eli has benefited from that. Okay, I can agree with that but lets be honest, Eli has basically had a QB coach since he was a kid in Peyton and Archie.

                Plexiglass was Eli's security blanket. He could chuck it to him and Plexiglass would snag it. I am sure that he relied on Plex being able to do that and as painful as it was for Plex to Cheddar Bob himself and mess up our run, it has made Eli become a better QB. However, Eli Manning's adaptability and ability to evolve his game is a great attribute that he has. With the exception of some of the games with Plexiglass, it is very rare that Eli has an off game and wins. That was not the case with Phil. He also had a security blanket that he could hit over the middle and be sure he would make the catch and that was Mark Bavarro.

                If one was better than the other is a debate that will go on more than likely till Eli retires but I think we can all agree that we are happy that neither one of our NY Giant QB legends ever had any off the field legal troubles or drama of note.

                I like debating with you Rosie, you are a very knowledgable NY Giants fan.
                yes we can say that with Phil we woulda easily handled Buffalo.

                let us reverse it......if Eli were out and Carr got us a hard fought win against a good team ,
                would it not be your contention that the victory would have been easier with Eli.

                Hoss was not S Young behind Montanna or A Rodgers behind #4.
                he was Tebow gettin' lucky.

                Phil had already won 10 games that year ...he was zoned , and would have kicked Buffalo's ice-bucket.
                Last edited by stormblue; 11-21-2012, 05:41 AM.
                due to the fact that I am from the Woodstock generation ...
                my opinions may be chemically enhanced and influenced by severe episodes of memory loss

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                • Originally posted by BuffyBlueII View Post
                  You may disagree with me but I don't think any of those guys are worth a damn.
                  Then who would be worth a damn if those guys aren't?

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                  • Originally posted by stormblue View Post
                    yes we can say that with Phil we woulda easily handled Buffalo.

                    let us reverse it......if Eli were out and Carr got us a hard fought win against a good team ,
                    would it not be your contention that the victory would have been easier with Eli.

                    Hoss was not S Young behind Montanna or A Rodgers behind #4.
                    he was Tebow gettin' lucky.

                    Phil had already won 10 games that year ...he was zoned , and would have kicked Buffalo's ice-bucket.
                    OK..Hold on here. Hoss was not "Tim Tebow who got lucky" He was a very good back up who went on tho be very productive in Oakland.

                    Having said that if you watch the replay of SB 25, he didn't play as well as some give him credit. He missed open receivers and was the beneficiary of a great running game and a great defensive game plan. He was far more a game manager in that SB than playmaker.
                    Admit nothing. Deny everything. Make counter accusations.

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                    • I'll always appreciate Hoss for doing a good job.
                      The defense was crzy in SBXXV. Sometimes only putting 1 or 2 down men on the D Line. Belichek was the genius behind it.
                      I was at the game with my son. A great day.

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                      • Originally posted by Morehead State View Post
                        OK..Hold on here. Hoss was not "Tim Tebow who got lucky" He was a very good back up who went on tho be very productive in Oakland.

                        Having said that if you watch the replay of SB 25, he didn't play as well as some give him credit. He missed open receivers and was the beneficiary of a great running game and a great defensive game plan. He was far more a game manager in that SB than playmaker.
                        stop nit - pickin' CC , i'm not crushing on Hoss, just pointing out that he was
                        merely a serviceable QB and i just strongly believe with Simms it would not have
                        come down to Scott Norwood 's "wide right".

                        ELI > Carr = Simms > Hoss.
                        due to the fact that I am from the Woodstock generation ...
                        my opinions may be chemically enhanced and influenced by severe episodes of memory loss

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                        • Originally posted by Morehead State View Post
                          OK..Hold on here. Hoss was not "Tim Tebow who got lucky" He was a very good back up who went on tho be very productive in Oakland.

                          Having said that if you watch the replay of SB 25, he didn't play as well as some give him credit. He missed open receivers and was the beneficiary of a great running game and a great defensive game plan. He was far more a game manager in that SB than playmaker.
                          How do you know Tebow got lucky? I watched him play in college, he has a lot of heart, not a lot of luck.

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                          • Originally posted by Cool Papa B. View Post
                            "No, he is not one of the elites," Simms said in quotes distributed by CBS. "Because when I hear the word elite, I'm thinking about guys that can make unbelievable plays on the field by themselves. There are very few quarterbacks in that category.

                            "So yes, Eli has been a tremendous team player. He has been MVP of the Super Bowl twice. I know that. But the way I look at it, the answer is no."

                            Read more: http://www.nydailynews.com/sports/fo...#ixzz2C8Eaubto

                            Here we go again.....
                            I want to know who is the most elite hot dog vendor.....

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                            • Originally posted by rebelfan1966 View Post
                              I want to know who is the most elite hot dog vendor.....
                              had guy who sold dirty water dogs out of the back of his station wagon for like 20 years at park by my house. He knew all the kids in town and their siblings. watched us all grow up. His name was Larry......and Larry was Elite.
                              "Measure Twice......Cut Once"
                              You couldn't be more full of **** if you were break dancing in a Port-a-Potty.......Kruunch

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                              • this page has a long way to go before it hits the 255 pages the "Ben is better than Eli" thread had. Courtesy of the legendary Giggles.
                                http://boards.giants.com/showthread....est-game/page6
                                http://www.coldhardfootballfacts.com/Articles/11_2554_A_brief,_fact-filled_history_of_the_NFL_passing_game.html
                                http://espn.go.com/nfl/story/_/id/8732732/is-new-york-giants-qb-eli-manning-worthy-hall-fame-espn-magazine

                                Entire Team Let Eli down today - NYG4l

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