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ESPN, Herm Edwards Diss Eli

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  • Funny how anyone would claim that Joe Flacco is mediocre or average.

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    • Originally posted by Buddy333 View Post
      You realize that QB's don't actually play against eachother right?
      Yes they do, by stats but not physically.

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      • Originally posted by Diamondring View Post
        Yes they do, by stats but not physically.
        No, they do not play against eachother and when they do get on the field they play different defenses.

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        • Originally posted by gmen46 View Post
          Lord knows, I often have my own issues with Morehead's comments concerning Eli and his comments concerning some of pro-Eli posts.

          But you're being unfair here. Morehead's issue on this thread--and I totally agree with him--is that it is disgraceful to those Giants fans who feel compelled to trash Edwards personally and/or trash his professional career as a player and HC because Edwards had the gall to not name Eli as Elite.

          I disagree with Edwards' on-air pronouncement and his apparent need to insult Eli a tiny bit while denying his abilities. But for fans on this board to say nasty things about Edwards as a person or as a player and coach, simply demeans the "trasher", not the "trashee". And it does not make a good argument on Eli's behalf. I'm sure if he read those posts--supposedly in his defense--he would feel ashamed to be "defended" by those posters.

          I think that's all Morehead was saying.

          Now, on to my aggressive disagreements with Morehead concerning our different opinions about Eli's talents and worth to the Giants!!
          First of all, thank you for stating my position and my point so well. You are exactly right.

          Secondly, I like Eli just fine. I just don't think he's the all time great that several posters here think he is.
          Admit nothing. Deny everything. Make counter accusations.

          Comment


          • Okay, this thread is starting to get a little out of hand and i think its time i try my best to bring a little order "logic wise". Now i know there has been a lot of sensitivity on here lately so please don't take anything i say the wrong way. I am not taking shots at anyone here. I'm just calling out where you're wrong. That being said, lets look at the most bizarre statement thus far.


            Originally posted by giantsfan420 View Post
            whatd he do to win it? no where near what eli did...and in the reg. season both qbs played at near levels as well. so head2head in 2011 eli def outplayed rodgers

            Lets all take a deep breath.... I'm serious. Inhale and exhale slowly. Then take a look at the numbers


            Eli: 61.0% completions, 4,949 totals yards, 29 touchdowns. 16 interceptions, 92.9 qb rating

            Rodgers:
            68.3% completions, 4,900 total yards, 46 touchdowns, 6 interceptions. 122.5 qb rating.

            Eli had a heck of a season give him credit. However, the only category where Eli came close to Rodgers in that year, was passing yards. But IF nearing someone in PASSING YARDS Alone means you played around their level then Matthew Stafford and Cam newton are 2 of the best QB's in the league.

            And i know there is the argument about the numbers dont tell the whole story and all of that blah blah blah but lets keep it real. Rodgers looked like a grown man playing with kids during the 2011 season. Rodgers had one of the best seasons in NFL history, he was voted by many of the players as not just the best QB of that year but as the best player, and he won MVP.

            now I am not going to say you're wrong here. I am just going to give you the benefit of the doubt and say you made an honest mistake. I understand you're trying to defend ELi, and nothing is wrong with that. All i ask is not just you, but we all keep things in a sensible manner. At least make it debatable.
            Last edited by Marvelousmik; 02-18-2013, 11:18 AM.
            Don't take it personal, we're just debating.

            ~Big Mike~

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            • Whoa whoa giants420.

              Maybe in the PLAYOFFS Eli outplayed Rodgers, but not the 2011 regular season.
              Mood: WOOF!

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              • Originally posted by BuffyBlueII View Post
                Funny how anyone would claim that Joe Flacco is mediocre or average.
                I agree, I think Joe Flacco has been awesome since he entered the league

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                • Originally posted by Morehead State View Post
                  OK Buffy...You have been saying this thing about Rodgers for a while and you have to be called out. I get that he's our QB and all of that, but to say that Eli is far better than Rodgers in the post season is ridiculous.

                  Aaron Rodgers offense in the playoffs have averaged 30.1PPG. Eli's offense in the playoffs have averaged 19.8/PPG
                  Aaron Rodgers has 18 TD's and 5 Ints in the playoffs, Eli has 17 TD's and 8 Int's.
                  Aaron Rodgers Compl % in the playoffs is 66.1%, Eli's is 61.5%
                  Aaron Rodgers has averaged 289 yds/game in the playoffs, Eli has averaged 229 yds/game

                  The BIG difference between the 2? The Giants defense has given up 17 PPG in Eli's playoff games. The GB defense has given up 27.4 PPG in AR's playoff games.

                  If the Giants had given up 27 points in every one of Eli's playoff games, he would be 1-10 in the playoffs.
                  If Aaron Rodgers defenses had given up 17 points in every game..He'd be 8-0.

                  Eli had a great run in 2 playoffs and has been an outstanding post season QB, but Rodgers has been friggin lights out. Unfortunately, poor defenses have been his undoing.

                  This brings me to my next point. Here, someone brings up evidence and facts in order to support his claim in the rodgers vs eli in the playoffs debate.

                  Here is the counter argument to the quoted statement above. i will highlight the facts in bold and type the conclusion in blue.

                  (Rodgers and The packers offense has averaged better numbers than Eli and the giants offense in the post season. (Fact)

                  The Giants defense on average has given up a lot less points than the packers defense in the post season. (Fact)

                  Since Eli has won more playoff games he is better than Rodgers in the post season.)

                  This is the logic being used in order to counter the quoted argument.



                  The giants offense scored 20 points against the 49ers in the playoffs and Eli won.
                  Green bay's offense scored 31 points against the 49ers in the playoffs and Rodgers lost.

                  Here is the part most of you leave out.

                  The giants defense gave up 17 points.
                  The packers defense gave up 45 points.

                  I think the eli vs peyton, brees and brady in the post season argument is fine. i'm just not convinced that eli plays better than Rodgers in the post season.
                  Last edited by Marvelousmik; 02-18-2013, 12:14 PM.
                  Don't take it personal, we're just debating.

                  ~Big Mike~

                  Comment


                  • The problem is people try to say one QB outplayed another when in fact they don't even play on the same field or against the same defenses. Rodgers is incredible. Nothing he has done has prevented his team from winning. It's not like he threw a pick to end a post season game or just plain played poorly. If his team had a decent defense he win many more Championships.

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                    • Originally posted by Buddy333 View Post
                      Throw away the first season because he had all of 3 attempts. Throw away the first season for Eli as well. He has never had a season like the the seventh season that Brady was a starter. What did Welker do before he was playing with Brady? Check out he fall Moss started to take before playing with Brady. He made two rookie TE's look good, not the other way around. Also, the point was consistency. Not so much that he started out of the gate great. He started out good and got better and has matinee that status. He is consistent.


                      Originally posted by Flip Empty View Post
                      Your argument contains no merit because you keep changing it to suit.
                      Last but not least, I think this along with what morehead and buffy discussed about Rodgers in the post season is a great example of why topics tend to go on forever sometimes. just admit that the other person made a good point. show some sportsmanship. I'm here just reading through this thread and watching people straight up get destroyed, yet they're still replying back trying to hold on. And some of it makes no sense what so ever.

                      Lol its done. just give the person credit if they make a good point. I think it would make discussions a lot more thoughtful and interesting. But that's just me.

                      And for the record, Not that i really care or anything, but i think edwards exaggerated a bit on the Eli at the kids table comment. In my opinion a coach or former coach shouldn't take a shot at a player. And this is coming from someone who really doesnt care about media stuff.
                      Last edited by Marvelousmik; 02-18-2013, 12:45 PM.
                      Don't take it personal, we're just debating.

                      ~Big Mike~

                      Comment


                      • Originally posted by Marvelousmik View Post
                        Okay, this thread is starting to get a little out of hand and i think its time i try my best to bring a little order "logic wise". Now i know there has been a lot of sensitivity on here lately so please don't take anything i say the wrong way. I am not taking shots at anyone here. I'm just calling out where you're wrong. That being said, lets look at the most bizarre statement thus far.





                        Lets all take a deep breath.... I'm serious. Inhale and exhale slowly. Then take a look at the numbers


                        Eli: 61.0% completions, 4,949 totals yards, 29 touchdowns. 16 interceptions, 92.9 qb rating

                        Rodgers:
                        68.3% completions, 4,900 total yards, 46 touchdowns, 6 interceptions. 122.5 qb rating.

                        Eli had a heck of a season give him credit. However, the only category where Eli came close to Rodgers in that year, was passing yards. But IF nearing someone in PASSING YARDS Alone means you played around their level then Matthew Stafford and Cam newton are 2 of the best QB's in the league.

                        And i know there is the argument about the numbers dont tell the whole story and all of that blah blah blah but lets keep it real. Rodgers looked like a grown man playing with kids during the 2011 season. Rodgers had one of the best seasons in NFL history, he was voted by many of the players as not just the best QB of that year but as the best player, and he won MVP.

                        now I am not going to say you're wrong here. I am just going to give you the benefit of the doubt and say you made an honest mistake. I understand you're trying to defend ELi, and nothing is wrong with that. All i ask is not just you, but we all keep things in a sensible manner. At least make it debatable.
                        Aaron Rodgers played out of his mind in 2011. His was one of The Best ever regular seasons by a QB.
                        In the playoffs however, Aaron Rodgers collapsed against the #27 ranked defense and Eli Manning had one of The Best post seasons by a QB ever that year.

                        Aaron played at a higher level than Eli did during 2011 regular season but didn't even approach Eli in the postseason.

                        Comment


                        • Originally posted by BuffyBlueII View Post
                          Aaron Rodgers played out of his mind in 2011. His was one of The Best ever regular seasons by a QB. In the playoffs however, Aaron Rodgers collapsed against the #27 ranked defense and Eli Manning had one of The Best post seasons by a QB ever that year.Aaron played at a higher level than Eli did during 2011 regular season but didn't even approach Eli in the postseason.
                          Throwing for 260 yards and rushing for another 60 is collapsing? Lol. Also, the defense played great in the post season no matter what they where ranked in the regular season.

                          Comment


                          • Originally posted by Marvelousmik View Post
                            This brings me to my next point. Here, someone brings up evidence and facts in order to support his claim in the rodgers vs eli in the playoffs debate.

                            Here is the counter argument to the quoted statement above. i will highlight the facts in bold and type the conclusion in blue.

                            (Rodgers and The packers offense has averaged better numbers than Eli and the giants offense in the post season. (Fact)

                            The Giants defense on average has given up a lot less points than the packers defense in the post season. (Fact)

                            Since Eli has won more playoff games he is better than Rodgers in the post season.)

                            This is the logic being used in order to counter the quoted argument.



                            The giants offense scored 20 points against the 49ers in the playoffs and Eli won.
                            Green bay's offense scored 31 points against the 49ers in the playoffs and Rodgers lost.

                            Here is the part most of you leave out.

                            The giants defense gave up 17 points.
                            The packers defense gave up 45 points.

                            I think the eli vs peyton, brees and brady in the post season argument is fine. i'm just not convinced that eli plays better than Rodgers in the post season.
                            Of course you're not because it goes against your agenda. You are comparing games against 49ers in playoffs that are a year apart and with different QBs for 49ers. The pace of the 49ers game plan is different with Colin Kapernick at QB than it is with Alex Smith so it really is not all that comparable. You know this. You also know that playing against different teams and at a pace will call for different overall scores. You know a lot and make good points but try and keep your debate logical.

                            It really doesn't matter what the heck the debate is because the thing that does count is that Eli Manning is without a doubt a more successful QB in the post season than Aaron Rodgers is. It is hilarious that Aaron Rodgers collapsed against our defense in playoffs. I wish we could play against a garbage defense like the one we have because Eli would have a field day.
                            Last edited by BuffyBlueII; 02-18-2013, 01:00 PM.

                            Comment


                            • Originally posted by Buddy333 View Post
                              Throwing for 260 yards and rushing for another 60 is collapsing? Lol. Also, the defense played great in the post season no matter what they where ranked in the regular season.
                              The defense played better than they did all season but weren't great.

                              You can quote stats all you want to but anyone that watched that game knows how clear it was that Aaron missed some easy opportunities due to his "ELIesque" type of mistakes during that game. The level of poise that Eli Manning showed that post season is one that Aaron Rodgers simply did not exhibit. Joe Flacco exhibited this season but Aaron Rodgers didn't.

                              Comment


                              • Originally posted by BuffyBlueII View Post
                                Of course you're not because it goes against your agenda. You are comparing games against 49ers in playoffs that are a year apart and with different QBs for 49ers. The pace of the 49ers game plan is different with Colin Kapernick at QB than it is with Alex Smith so it really is not all that comparable. You know this. You also know that playing against different teams and at a pace will call for different overall scores. So, try and keep your debate logical.It really doesn't matter what the heck the debate is because the thing that does count is that Eli Manning is without a doubt a more successful QB in the post season than Aaron Rodgers is. It is hilarious that Aaron Rodgers collapsed against our defense in playoffs. I wish we could play against a garbage defense like the one we have because Eli would have a field day.
                                You clearly didn't watch he post season last year because the Giants defense was incredible.

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