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  • #46
    Originally posted by BigBlue1971 View Post
    these boards along with several media outlets are hyping the situation....i mean tweets this tweets that!

    but why let the guy walk? sign 'em now to a long term, whats the problem? lol

    if Reese doesn't sign Cruz before he becomes a fa hes gone imo!

    and get nothing in return!

    besides we don't need the distractions with this before and during the season!

    Honest question: Who is the Cruz negotiation distracting from what?
    “Never argue with an idiot. They will only bring you down to their level and beat you with experience.” MB Rule # 1

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    • #47
      Originally posted by RoanokeFan View Post
      Honest question: Who is the Cruz negotiation distracting from what?
      Not only that but if we weren't on pins and needles waiting for a Cruz deal...what else would we be talking about? We've already covered the free agents that have come in.

      Comment


      • #48
        Originally posted by RoanokeFan View Post
        Honest question: Who is the Cruz negotiation distracting from what?
        im just sayin the longer it goes the topic magnifies!

        maybe it wont turn into an "Osi" type circus but....i mean i just want a season where they can all concentrate on football and Cruz is signed!
        sigpic

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        • #49
          Originally posted by Rat_bastich View Post
          Not only that but if we weren't on pins and needles waiting for a Cruz deal...what else would we be talking about? We've already covered the free agents that have come in.
          These things take time. Now we have a new agent representing Cruz who has to read through the Giants' offer and come up with a counter offer. He, Condon, has also just been hired by Dumerville after that time limit farse with his old agent. Cruz is going to play here in 2013 one way or another. He is entitled to negotiate the best contract he can and that's what they are going to do.

          I am convinced Cruz will be signed long term by the Giants long before he hits UFA status. In fact, I'd be surprised if he weren't signed before training camp.
          “Never argue with an idiot. They will only bring you down to their level and beat you with experience.” MB Rule # 1

          Comment


          • #50
            Originally posted by BigBlue1971 View Post
            im just sayin the longer it goes the topic magnifies!

            maybe it wont turn into an "Osi" type circus but....i mean i just want a season where they can all concentrate on football and Cruz is signed!
            We all want it done, no question. But not being done at this point in time is really meaningless, especially given that Cruz now has a new agent who, fortunately, works well with Jerry Reese and is replacing what was really an unbending and unwavering former agent. Condon will know when he has gotten everything he can form Reese and then we will all, or most of anyway, be happy campers.
            “Never argue with an idiot. They will only bring you down to their level and beat you with experience.” MB Rule # 1

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            • #51
              Originally posted by slipknottin View Post
              what hype?

              Cruz will probably play this season under his tender offer. Then be a free agent next season
              This would be a bad and risky move. What is a first round tender worth, 2.6 Million? The value for slot receivers is set for what, between 6-8 million at most? So, if the Giants offered him a contract worth between 6-7 million (Speculation), Cruz would be losing out on about 4 million this year, a signing bonus right now and go into the season without any issurance policy against the possibility of getting injured and getting 2.6 million.

              So, is it worth the risk to make a potential 2-7 million (on a five year contract) with the possibility of getting injured and making much less? I think not.
              Last edited by JB456; 03-22-2013, 12:50 PM.

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              • #52
                Originally posted by JB456 View Post
                This would be a bad and risky move. What is a first round tender worth, 2.6 Million? The value for slot receivers is set for what, between 6-8 million at most? So, if the Giants offered him a contract worth between 6-7 million (Speculation), Cruz would be losing out on about 4 million this year, a signing bonus right now and go into the season without any issurance policy against the possibility of getting injured and getting 2.6 million.

                So, is it worth the risk to make a potential 2-7 million (on a five year contract) with the possibility of getting injured and making much less? I think not.
                Depends what his agent is telling him and what Cruz thinks he's worth. If he is just comparing numbers then maybe he expects to get at least what Wallace got. So why would he settle for half that

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                • #53
                  Originally posted by slipknottin View Post
                  Depends what his agent is telling him and what Cruz thinks he's worth. If he is just comparing numbers then maybe he expects to get at least what Wallace got. So why would he settle for half that
                  I really hope he doesn't think he will get more than 9 million a year (Probably 0 chance of this happening), hell Wes Welker got 6 million a year and he is widely considered the best slot receiver in the game. So, say the Giants gave him a lowball offer of 6 million, the difference over a 5 year deal is only 15 million and when you deduct 4 million from that (playing for the tender vs signing new Giants contract), the worst case scenario is a loss of 11 million less whatever salary he would be slated to get in the sixth year:

                  Here is a breakout:

                  Sign with Giants: 5 year 30 million dollar contract (note this is pretty low end estimate and the Giants probably offered more). After 5 years, 30 Million in the bank.

                  Sign tender and don't sign with Giants: 2.6 million + 5 year 45 million dollar contract. After 6 years, 47.5 million in the bank. This contract would be worth more over six years but there are several variables that need to be considered:

                  1) He gets injured this year and only collects 2.6 million and wants to salsa dance into a shark tank.
                  2) He plays scared this year and his value drops because he has even more drops than usual and doesn't want to risk injury. He might only get a slightly better contract than the Giants offered him and risked a lot to get that.
                  3) If he has a long career, he would be up for a new contract and signing bonus quicker if he signs the Giants deal.

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                  • #54
                    Originally posted by RoanokeFan View Post
                    We all want it done, no question. But not being done at this point in time is really meaningless, especially given that Cruz now has a new agent who, fortunately, works well with Jerry Reese and is replacing what was really an unbending and unwavering former agent. Condon will know when he has gotten everything he can form Reese and then we will all, or most of anyway, be happy campers.
                    Tom Condon is a well respected agent in sports and I expect Cruz values his opinion a little more as well!

                    hopefully all of 'em can work this out sooner than later.
                    sigpic

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                    • #55
                      Originally posted by appodictic View Post
                      If he really cared about the team he would get a deal done, so we could focus on other possible free agents and the draft. But at this point you have multiple people saying they will take a pay cut to sign him and he is STILL not signed. Boley left that was what 4 million, bradshaw was 3, canty was 8. ???, now Eli is saying he will take a cut, and still no deal? Come on man. We could have made a move on Welker or whatever, i bet welker has a better season then cruz this year anyway.
                      Canty and Bradshaw were post June 1st cuts..... you need to understand what you are talking about before you open your mouth champ.
                      Last edited by speed3freak; 03-22-2013, 02:03 PM.

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                      • #56
                        Originally posted by appodictic View Post
                        He is just fake. I wish I could find the article in sports illustrated but they interviewed him this off season, and we all "big blue pride" "we will be tough to beat" "giants pride" funny from a guy in an extended hold out situation. Squeezing Nicks out of money because, he got injured last season. He's about to pull a Steve Smith, bank on it. They are going to make him a solid offer and he's going to walk. If he wanted to play for the giants the deal would be done.
                        This is dumb. We will revist this when he resigns.

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                        • #57
                          Originally posted by appodictic View Post
                          If he really cared about the team he would get a deal done, so we could focus on other possible free agents and the draft. But at this point you have multiple people saying they will take a pay cut to sign him and he is STILL not signed. Boley left that was what 4 million, bradshaw was 3, canty was 8. ???, now Eli is saying he will take a cut, and still no deal? Come on man. We could have made a move on Welker or whatever, i bet welker has a better season then cruz this year anyway.
                          This is dumber.

                          Comment


                          • #58
                            Originally posted by darrin99 View Post
                            I'm actually hoping he refuses, and the Giants just release him. I really don't want to see him out there anymore.
                            +Double D is useless. He can't even drink and drive properly.

                            Comment


                            • #59
                              Originally posted by slipknottin View Post
                              Depends what his agent is telling him and what Cruz thinks he's worth. If he is just comparing numbers then maybe he expects to get at least what Wallace got. So why would he settle for half that
                              I would be very surprised if Tom Condon were only looking at the "numbers" although that will certainly be part of the process. Steve Tisch has alredy said it will be more than Welker got and I think that's an appropriate place to start. A good agent will not only negotiate the best deal but will give his client his best advice. That would include regular reality checks on Victor's actual worth right now.

                              Signing the tender, while a possibility, may not be the best avenue for Cruz to take. First, none of it is guaranteed. Second, as someone else pointed out, if, as I suspect, he will get a deal between $7 - 8 M over 5 or 6 years with close to half guaranteed, Cruz would lose between $3-4M in 2013. What does Cruz have if he plays under the tender and has a career ending injury in 2013, God forbid.

                              It's early in the process, Cruz is entitled to seek the best offer he can get the Giants to agree with. The Giants are entitled to not overpay Cruz based on whatever criteria they use to determine his value to the team. Somewhere in between the demand and the offer lies the answer. Except for the amount of money involved and the tender, this is no different than any employer/employee contract negotiation.
                              Last edited by RoanokeFan; 03-22-2013, 01:49 PM.
                              “Never argue with an idiot. They will only bring you down to their level and beat you with experience.” MB Rule # 1

                              Comment


                              • #60
                                Originally posted by slipknottin View Post
                                what hype?

                                Cruz will probably play this season under his tender offer. Then be a free agent next season
                                Cruz would take a risk with that approach. If he gets hurt he loses big time.

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