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This is what separates Victor Cruz from Wes Welker

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  • #46
    Originally posted by Drez View Post
    That's the thing, posters like gmen8020 and myself who see Cruz as a dominant slot guy, but not a dominant outside receiver (or think that Nicks is a more dominant receiver), somehow get labeled as trying to discredit Cruz. It's complete nonsense.
    Exactly. I'll even go on record as saying that I thought Cruz could be a nice fit as a flanker in our offense last year, and I'll admit that my assertion didn't pan out.

    But the only reason I even entertained that thought, Cruz as more than a slot receiver, is because I know that outside receivers are more valuable than slot receivers. If you have a dominant flanker and split-end, it easily taxes a defense.

    Some people carry the misperception that because dominant slot receivers aren't as prevalent in the league, that they should be paid -- at the least -- on par with split ends. But basic economic valuable principles, i.e. supply/demand, don't apply to this situation too well.
    My body was sculpted to the proportions of Michelangelo's David.

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    • #47
      Originally posted by Hooligans View Post
      Victor Cruz is no different than Deion Branch......Branch was great back in the early 2000's and after a great Super Bowl (Branvh was MVP of the Super Bowl), he thought he was worth much more than the Pats were offering, so he went to Seattle.......and became a nobody......playing with Brady makes ANY receiver look much better than he might be......same thing with Cruz and Eli.......when Cruz leaves he will most likely go to a team with a lesser QB.......and his numbers will drop like a rock.
      lol

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      • #48
        Originally posted by Drez View Post
        Here's how I think it gets twisted. Poster A says, "Nicks has better ball skills/is better at physically beating a defender, making him better to play outside than Cruz." Poster B then says, "Why are you saying Cruz sucks."
        That's exactly what has gone on here about Eli.

        But there's no question that Cruz is one of the best WR's in the game today.

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        • #49
          Originally posted by Roosevelt View Post
          That's exactly what has gone on here about Eli.But there's no question that Cruz is one of the best WR's in the game today.
          That is not exactly what has gone on her with Eli. Some of that has happened, but it goes a lot deeper that just that.

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          • #50
            Originally posted by Roosevelt View Post
            That's exactly what has gone on here about Eli.

            But there's no question that Cruz is one of the best WR's in the game today.
            No, Cruz is a very good SLOT receiver........period....and unless he changes his " me first" tune very quickly, he will be trying to play slot receiver for the Jacksonville Jaguars and the Giants will have a very high 2nd round draft choice for the 2013 draft.

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            • #51
              Originally posted by Marvelousmik View Post
              Cruz
              Where are the 2012/2013 videos of those plays.

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              • #52
                Originally posted by Roosevelt View Post
                That's exactly what has gone on here about Eli.
                To an extent, not wholly. I've seen posts like "Drew Brees is great" followed by "Eli hater." That's extreme.

                But like Drez said, it goes deeper than how you make it out to be.
                My body was sculpted to the proportions of Michelangelo's David.

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                • #53
                  Originally posted by Hooligans View Post
                  No, Cruz is a very good SLOT receiver........period....and unless he changes his " me first" tune very quickly, he will be trying to play slot receiver for the Jacksonville Jaguars and the Giants will have a very high 2nd round draft choice for the 2013 draft.
                  Jaguars? Second round draft pick?

                  Whaaaaa?
                  My body was sculpted to the proportions of Michelangelo's David.

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                  • #54
                    Nicks uses his body A LOT better than Cruz. Posting up DBs is technique. Cruz doesn't have it.
                    This quote was just recently posted right before i made this thread. I agree that nicks is a better player on the outside and he plays more physical. The problem is that people tend to take things away from Cruz. For example, in the above quote it states that nicks is better at using his body than Cruz, but then the poster goes on to say that posting defenders up is a technique that Cruz doesn't have. Its one thing to say nicks does it better, but to say Cruz cant do it at all is discrediting him on something he is capable of doing.

                    Basically the main knock on Cruz on here seems to be that he can only make plays with his feet and he is not capable of playing "big". To be more specific, i remember someone saying that Cruz only relies on getting separation in order to make plays, where as nicks doesn't need to get separation because he can use his body. This argument has been brought up more than once. You don't have to look far to see that this perception of Cruz is false. Just watch the videos i posted.

                    And for the record, for my own personal reasons i would rather Cruz leave and we get a first round pick. Im not a huge Cruz fan. I'm just pointing out the truth
                    Last edited by Marvelousmik; 04-07-2013, 06:11 PM.
                    Don't take it personal, we're just debating.

                    ~Big Mike~

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                    • #55
                      So you started a thread to test the notions of one poster?
                      My body was sculpted to the proportions of Michelangelo's David.

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                      • #56
                        Originally posted by gmen0820 View Post
                        So you started a thread to test the notions of one poster?
                        I gave you an example and then stated that "This argument has been brought up more than once".


                        Come on, I cant always keep pointing out the obvious and giving examples. Just read what i type carefully and pay attention to what i highlight in bold. I highlight those words for a reason.

                        The purpose of this thread is to end the whole notion that cruz has to only rely on getting separation in order for him to make plays. And it looks like you all agree. If someone makes that claim again, feel free to point them in the direction of this thread.
                        Last edited by Marvelousmik; 04-07-2013, 05:23 PM.
                        Don't take it personal, we're just debating.

                        ~Big Mike~

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                        • #57
                          Originally posted by Marvelousmik View Post
                          I gave you an example and then stated that "This argument has been brought up more than once".


                          Come on, I cant always keep pointing out the obvious and giving examples. Just read what i type carefully and pay attention to what i highlight in bold. I highlight those words for a reason.
                          Oh, never mind then.

                          I guess that's the only one I've ever seen, especially since it seemed preposterous enough for me to dispute it immediately.

                          If it wouldn't trouble you, care to post another example?
                          My body was sculpted to the proportions of Michelangelo's David.

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                          • #58
                            Originally posted by gmen0820 View Post
                            If it wouldn't trouble you, care to post another example?
                            Although its not in these exact words, i asked a poster what steve smith at the age of 33 brings to the table that victor cruz doesnt.

                            the first thing that that the poster stated was "Toughness. The ability to make a catch in traffic with guys draped all over him." .

                            This is just another example of your typical cruz isnt tough enough to play "big" type of comment. I don't have that much free time to skim through all of the cruz threads. here is the link. http://boards.giants.com/showthread....aceable/page41

                            Maybe you might find more examples in there. I'm not purposely calling anyone out but these examples are all over.

                            Last edited by Marvelousmik; 04-07-2013, 05:55 PM.
                            Don't take it personal, we're just debating.

                            ~Big Mike~

                            Comment


                            • #59
                              Originally posted by Marvelousmik View Post
                              Although its not in these exact words, i asked a poster what steve smith at the age of 33 brings to the table that victor cruz doesnt.

                              the first thing that that the poster stated was "Toughness. The ability to make a catch in traffic with guys draped all over him." .

                              This is just another example of your typical cruz isnt tough enough to play "big" type of comment. I don't have that much free time to skim through all of the cruz threads. here is the link. Maybe you might find more examples in there. There all over.

                              http://boards.giants.com/showthread....aceable/page41
                              But this thread was started on the topic of Cruz's ball skills, not his toughness.
                              My body was sculpted to the proportions of Michelangelo's David.

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                              • #60
                                Originally posted by gmen0820 View Post
                                But this thread was started on the topic of Cruz's ball skills, not his toughness.
                                Lol im under the impression that you're just trolling me now. Surely you read everything i highlighted in bold. I'm going to call it here though. I got my point across.
                                Don't take it personal, we're just debating.

                                ~Big Mike~

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