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August 5 Practice Notes - interesting comments about the O-Line

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  • #31
    Originally posted by Die-Hard View Post

    When the Giants start paying me several million dollars a year to make those decisions, I'll make those decisions. Until then, I'll continue to criticize until I feel that its not warranted. When you ignore the trenches, I'm going to have a problem with it.
    Fact is Reese filled more important needs two years ago and there was no one out there that was better AND affordable for us to sign this year. Considering we went 11-5 and made the playoffs for the first time in years last year I think Reese has done a very good job building a TEAM. You are not going to say who you would have signed because there was no one, not because they aren't paying you lol.
    LT (132.5) -> Strahan (141.5) -> Osi (65) -> Tuck (60.5) -> JPP (50) -> ???
    "Next man up"

    "I am a nasty football player, I get after people. That is something that I am very proud of. I am out there and I am physical every play, making sure that the guy across from me wants to quit." - Adam Bisnowaty

    Comment


    • #32
      Originally posted by giants_rock View Post

      In his defense though, if Beatty had stayed healthy for a few more years and the coaches had left Pugh at RT we might not be having this conversation right now.
      That injury was a killer. Especially when he didn't come back from it. He should/would have been the starting LT for a least a couple more years.

      Comment


      • #33
        Originally posted by DandyDon View Post

        That injury was a killer. Especially when he didn't come back from it. He should/would have been the starting LT for a least a couple more years.
        Agreed. I also think that they expected a few more years out of Snee

        Comment


        • #34
          Originally posted by IrishMike357 View Post
          Fact is Reese filled more important needs two years ago and there was no one out there that was better AND affordable for us to sign this year. Considering we went 11-5 and made the playoffs for the first time in years last year I think Reese has done a very good job building a TEAM. You are not going to say who you would have signed because there was no one, not because they aren't paying you lol.
          This year there were very few good options available, but in previous recent years, I, along with many others, felt like he didn't do anywhere near enough to make sure the OL was solidified. In 2016, he let the Titans jump up and grab Conklin, who by the way turned out to be an excellent RT. Then he let the Bears jump ahead in the very next pick and grab Leonard Floyd, whom he was apparently going to pick if he fell. We're talking about moving up a spot or two, not 20 spots. It would have cost him a late round pick, which he sucks at anyway, so why not get aggressive and go after the guys you need? This has been going on for years.

          Sure, he has hit on some very good picks, but when it comes to the OL, he's a passive idiot, and I'll say that for free. No charge
          The fact that an opinion has been widely held is no evidence whatever that it is not utterly absurd - Bertrand Russell

          Comment


          • #35
            Originally posted by Die-Hard View Post

            This year there were very few good options available, but in previous recent years, I, along with many others, felt like he didn't do anywhere near enough to make sure the OL was solidified. In 2016, he let the Titans jump up and grab Conklin, who by the way turned out to be an excellent RT. Then he let the Bears jump ahead in the very next pick and grab Leonard Floyd, whom he was apparently going to pick if he fell. We're talking about moving up a spot or two, not 20 spots. It would have cost him a late round pick, which he sucks at anyway, so why not get aggressive and go after the guys you need? This has been going on for years.

            Sure, he has hit on some very good picks, but when it comes to the OL, he's a passive idiot, and I'll say that for free. No charge
            What do you mean he "let" the Bears and Titans move up?

            To get the two guys that you are talking about, the Giants would have had to pay more than the Titans and Bears did. Would you have been happy with a move like that to get Conklin or Floyd? I sure wouldn't have been....

            Comment


            • #36
              Originally posted by TCHOF View Post

              What do you mean he "let" the Bears and Titans move up?

              To get the two guys that you are talking about, the Giants would have had to pay more than the Titans and Bears did. Would you have been happy with a move like that to get Conklin or Floyd? I sure wouldn't have been....
              I agree 100% with this.

              So far I am happy with Eli Apple. Floyd I don't believe was ever an option. Contrary to popular belief the Giants don't take LBs in 1st. They position is not weighted high in the first round.
              Never go to battle with the intellectually unarmed.

              Comment


              • #37
                Originally posted by Die-Hard View Post

                This year there were very few good options available, but in previous recent years, I, along with many others, felt like he didn't do anywhere near enough to make sure the OL was solidified. In 2016, he let the Titans jump up and grab Conklin, who by the way turned out to be an excellent RT. Then he let the Bears jump ahead in the very next pick and grab Leonard Floyd, whom he was apparently going to pick if he fell. We're talking about moving up a spot or two, not 20 spots. It would have cost him a late round pick, which he sucks at anyway, so why not get aggressive and go after the guys you need? This has been going on for years.

                Sure, he has hit on some very good picks, but when it comes to the OL, he's a passive idiot, and I'll say that for free. No charge
                Like I said in the past he fixed bigger issues. Between 15 and 16 he fixed the defense which was an infinitely bigger problem than the OLine. Again in the draft that year he went D in the 1st to help fix the teams biggest issue, the worst defense in team history. Considering the high quality of OTs on the board when we took Apple I doubt Conklin would have been our pick anyway, especially since 2015 Offense was ranked #6. Until last season there was not a need to fix the OLine, certainly not compared to our horrendous D.

                LT (132.5) -> Strahan (141.5) -> Osi (65) -> Tuck (60.5) -> JPP (50) -> ???
                "Next man up"

                "I am a nasty football player, I get after people. That is something that I am very proud of. I am out there and I am physical every play, making sure that the guy across from me wants to quit." - Adam Bisnowaty

                Comment


                • #38
                  Here are the top performers in camp so far according to Jordan Raanan. Outlines a few of the OL

                  http://www.espn.com/blog/new-york-gi...n-mix-to-start

                  Comment


                  • #39
                    Originally posted by Die-Hard View Post

                    I wouldn't have ignored the OL when it was becoming obvious that guys like Snee, Diehl, and McKenzie were near the end of their careers. He waited until they were on their last legs before attempting to draft/sign their replacements, which was the dumbest possible way to do it.

                    Is that ballsy enough for you? He's an idiot, and he's too passive in my opinion.
                    I couldn't agree more. I have felt all along that Reese was the problem, not Coughlin. Ignoring the OL and reaching for players is not a recipie for success.

                    ​​​​​​Odiggy is a total bust and Flowers seems to be tettering between below average and bust. You cannot have your GM continue to miss on draft picks, especially high rounders.

                    Comment


                    • #40
                      Originally posted by TCHOF View Post

                      What do you mean he "let" the Bears and Titans move up?

                      To get the two guys that you are talking about, the Giants would have had to pay more than the Titans and Bears did. Would you have been happy with a move like that to get Conklin or Floyd? I sure wouldn't have been....
                      It would have cost the Giants more to get either of those guys? The Titans moved from 15 to 8 to get Conklin, which is 7 spots. The Giants would have had to move up 2 spots.You wouldn't want to see the RT position set for the next 5-8 years(barring injury)? I sure as hell would have, especially when he gets named as a 1st team all pro as a rookie

                      Please explain your stance, because I'm obviously missing something. It seems to me that it would be less expensive to move up 2 spots compared to 7 spots

                      The Bears moved from 11 to 9 to get Floyd. The Giants were sitting there at 10. Again, I'm missing something, so please explain why moving up 1 spot is more expensive than moving up 2 spots

                      By the way, the Floyd pick was an example. I'm one of the few who was actually ok with the Apple pick, but the fact that Floyd was on their board and Reese sat there.......well, I just get tired of seeing it. Go get your guy. Dont give up the farm unless its a definite homerun and/or if its a position of dire need.
                      Last edited by Die-Hard; 08-07-2017, 08:25 AM.
                      The fact that an opinion has been widely held is no evidence whatever that it is not utterly absurd - Bertrand Russell

                      Comment


                      • #41
                        Originally posted by IrishMike357 View Post
                        Like I said in the past he fixed bigger issues. Between 15 and 16 he fixed the defense which was an infinitely bigger problem than the OLine. Again in the draft that year he went D in the 1st to help fix the teams biggest issue, the worst defense in team history. Considering the high quality of OTs on the board when we took Apple I doubt Conklin would have been our pick anyway, especially since 2015 Offense was ranked #6. Until last season there was not a need to fix the OLine, certainly not compared to our horrendous D.
                        The OL was ok until last season? Yikes....I wont even touch that one LOL

                        From what I recall in post draft articles/interviews, Tunsil was their main target for OL, followed by Conklin, so he most definitely was, at the very least, on their radar. We all know what happened with Tunsil.
                        The fact that an opinion has been widely held is no evidence whatever that it is not utterly absurd - Bertrand Russell

                        Comment


                        • #42
                          Originally posted by Die-Hard View Post

                          It would have cost the Giants more to get either of those guys? The Titans moved from 15 to 8 to get Conklin, which is 7 spots. The Giants would have had to move up 2 spots.You wouldn't want to see the RT position set for the next 5-8 years(barring injury)? I sure as hell would have, especially when he gets named as a 1st team all pro as a rookie

                          Please explain your stance, because I'm obviously missing something. It seems to me that it would be less expensive to move up 2 spots compared to 7 spots

                          The Bears moved from 11 to 9 to get Floyd. The Giants were sitting there at 10. Again, I'm missing something, so please explain why moving up 1 spot is more expensive than moving up 2 spots

                          By the way, the Floyd pick was an example. I'm one of the few who was actually ok with the Apple pick, but the fact that Floyd was on their board and Reese sat there.......well, I just get tired of seeing it. Go get your guy. Dont give up the farm unless its a definite homerun and/or if its a position of dire need.
                          My bad on the point about having to pay more than the Titans or Bears. Completely spaced on that one (dangers of pre-coffee posting).

                          I would not have been ok with using draft capital to move up to get either of those guys though. I wasn't really enamored of either, and we had so many holes to fill that we needed all of our draft picks.

                          Comment


                          • #43
                            Originally posted by TCHOF View Post

                            My bad on the point about having to pay more than the Titans or Bears. Completely spaced on that one (dangers of pre-coffee posting).

                            I would not have been ok with using draft capital to move up to get either of those guys though. I wasn't really enamored of either, and we had so many holes to fill that we needed all of our draft picks.
                            No worries, it happens to the best of us, especially on Monday

                            As far as using draft capital, in this case, I would have tried to get Conklin, particularly because our T situation has been so abysmal. It was a definite need, but Reese decided to rely on a 7th round pick in Bobby Hart instead, who has struggled, to say the least.
                            The fact that an opinion has been widely held is no evidence whatever that it is not utterly absurd - Bertrand Russell

                            Comment


                            • #44
                              Originally posted by Die-Hard View Post

                              This year there were very few good options available, but in previous recent years, I, along with many others, felt like he didn't do anywhere near enough to make sure the OL was solidified. In 2016, he let the Titans jump up and grab Conklin, who by the way turned out to be an excellent RT. Then he let the Bears jump ahead in the very next pick and grab Leonard Floyd, whom he was apparently going to pick if he fell. We're talking about moving up a spot or two, not 20 spots. It would have cost him a late round pick, which he sucks at anyway, so why not get aggressive and go after the guys you need? This has been going on for years.

                              Sure, he has hit on some very good picks, but when it comes to the OL, he's a passive idiot, and I'll say that for free. No charge

                              Not everybody is good at everything, unfortunately this is Reese's achilles.

                              I think Reese overall is very good GM, not great one. and that's fine; but the length that some folks here will go to to attempt to prop him up and revise history is ridiculous.

                              Comment


                              • #45
                                Originally posted by Die-Hard View Post

                                No worries, it happens to the best of us, especially on Monday

                                As far as using draft capital, in this case, I would have tried to get Conklin, particularly because our T situation has been so abysmal. It was a definite need, but Reese decided to rely on a 7th round pick in Bobby Hart instead, who has struggled, to say the least.

                                Come Week 1, Hart will be on the bench, so this discussion is moot.

                                Comment

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