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strange confidence in Eli going into the season

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  • Originally posted by Harooni View Post
    i think you misunderstand many of us dont care where he ranks either.
    Nice way of spinning your agenda. We all know you are stirring the pot. You never stated why you have confidence in him. All you did is say why he's not a HOFer, how he inconsistent, and not a top 5 qb.
    Last edited by Eliscruzzz; 06-19-2013, 03:41 PM.
    sigpicShould the Giants fire Gilbride....

    http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ONL7L...yer_detailpage

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    • Originally posted by gumby74 View Post
      Rivers certainly has been a shadow of his former self, but seriously? You're just ragging on the guy.
      how else can u explain throwing it away on 4th and long when there was coverage? He didnt even attempt to throw it to a target lol. i get dion that on 3rd, but 4th and long on ur last possession when ur down? i dunno that was very very weird.

      and, he really does play with stats on his mind it seems like it really does. not necessarily a bad thing at times, he may trying to attain a goal or something, but I've def noticed some precarious situations where his decision has been extremely odd...

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      • Originally posted by Morehead State View Post
        I don't see that as helping. Helping is teaching you kid to do the right thing and appreciate the opportunity that most everyone would love to have.
        That's me though.

        And I think they are good people as well. I just didn't like this behavior.
        The Manning's seized the opportunity and did what they felt was the right thing for Eli.

        In looking back do you think this affects people's perception of Eli and Archie (AL Smith aside)?

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        • and for me, its way different with eli making the mistakes hes made, and learning/progressing seadily over the years as opposed to rivers and this huge regresion. eli has had his share of moronic plays. but thats something thats improving over time, not regressing over time like rivers. if eli were making the mistakes he was making in succession, each on worse than the next, and continually getting worse, i'd say the same thing about eli as i am right now about rivers.

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          • Originally posted by RoanokeFan View Post
            LOL Eli has no mind of his own? Mom and Dad are to blame?
            I think he just trusted his pops.

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            • Originally posted by Roosevelt View Post
              I think he just trusted his pops.
              Me too, but I was making my own business decisions when I was 21 and I am relatively certain the money involved was a factor.
              “Never argue with an idiot. They will only bring you down to their level and beat you with experience.” MB Rule # 1

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              • Originally posted by RoanokeFan View Post
                Me too, but I was making my own business decisions when I was 21 and I am relatively certain the money involved was a factor.
                In what respect, advertising? You're not suggesting the Chargers would have been less generous than the Giants are you?

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                • Originally posted by repeatchamps View Post
                  His O-line was far superior to the Giants O-line for many years. The one season the Giants arguably had the better O-line for the first time over San Diego was the 12-4 2008 season. The last 2 - 3 seasons both O-lines have begun to deteriorate and it is debateable who's squad has been better. Don't throw sack numbers at me either because Eli is likely rushed to get the pass off more than Rivers has been overall. You can not factor in weather all you like but playing in San Diego's benign weather conditions 8 games every autumn/winter (not including any playoff games) is far more favorable to a QB than one that plays in northern NJ. Also they get to play in Oakland's benign weather at least once a season as well.
                  No SD line was worse than ours the last couple of years and its not even close. I'm going to throw sack numbers at you because they are relevant. He got sacked 48 times last year. I had Gates on my FF so I watched their games. The line was really bad.
                  Because of all of the effort and examination being poured into these predictions, the draft is a robust market that, in the aggregate, does a good job of sorting prospects from top to bottom.1 Yet despite so many people trying to “beat the market,” no single actor can do it consistently. Abnormal returns are likely due to luck, not skill. But that hasn’t stopped NFL executives from behaving with the confidence of traders.

                  http://fivethirtyeight.com/features/...eat-the-draft/

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                  • Originally posted by Roosevelt View Post
                    In what respect, advertising? You're not suggesting the Chargers would have been less generous than the Giants are you?
                    I have no idea, but I do know we spent a boatload to entice him and I am willing to bet there were negotiations going on outside the boundaries of the existing CBA well in advance of the actual maneuvering at the draft. I have always felt it was tacky, at best, but it's now history.
                    “Never argue with an idiot. They will only bring you down to their level and beat you with experience.” MB Rule # 1

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                    • Originally posted by Rudyy View Post
                      I didn't see it as a demand, he just didn't want to play for them. He asked them not to draft them and they did anyway.
                      That's not an option you have. If I have the option of drafting the #1 pick in the draft I have the rights to the best player available. He should be happy to have a chance to play football for a living.
                      Because of all of the effort and examination being poured into these predictions, the draft is a robust market that, in the aggregate, does a good job of sorting prospects from top to bottom.1 Yet despite so many people trying to “beat the market,” no single actor can do it consistently. Abnormal returns are likely due to luck, not skill. But that hasn’t stopped NFL executives from behaving with the confidence of traders.

                      http://fivethirtyeight.com/features/...eat-the-draft/

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                      • Originally posted by B&RWarrior View Post
                        No SD line was worse than ours the last couple of years and its not even close. I'm going to throw sack numbers at you because they are relevant. He got sacked 48 times last year. I had Gates on my FF so I watched their games. The line was really bad.
                        The Giants O-line in the same years you are referring to has been questionable at best in pass blocking. Sack numbers are irrelevant because Eli has the ability to get rid of the ball very quickly limiting sacks against. Meanwhile Rivers due to various factors takes way more sacks than Eli ever does under a similar pass rush to what Rivers has faced in the last couple of years you are referring to. As mentioned earlier in this thread, I have watched Chargers games on NFL ticket almost as much as I have Giants games and have done so since both guys became starters for their respective teams so I can make my own judgements/comparisons of their careers and I'm telling you without a doubt that over their entire careers Rivers has had the better O-line more times than not.
                        Over 7000 posts, advanced member, joined March 2002. 1st post (as anonymous) was the day after Super Bowl 35

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                        • Originally posted by fansince69 View Post
                          Every one loves to point out Eli's clutch games.... I am not arguing....but about half of those games... a comeback wouldn't have been needed If he had just been adequate in the first half
                          This is a frequent--on this board--statement regurgitated every time the issue of Eli's clutch factor is raised, and it is irrelevant every time. And just plain ridiculous.

                          Your statement can be raised about every QB comeback.

                          Yet do you say the same thing about Montana and all his comebacks? About Peyton and Brady) comeback ability? About Elway and Marino when they had thrilling comeback games? About Unitas? All of these QBs (and a few others throughout history) have been, and continue to be, praised by anyone you can think of--players, ex players, coaches, pundits, fans, HOF writer-voters--for their extraordinary "comeback ability". Which of these QBs would you say had their comebacks in games that they were more than adequate in the first half?

                          This ability is in fact highly regarded in the select few QBs who are good at it throughout their career. And Eli--only at mid career so far--is include in this select group. There's a reason for that.

                          Because all players are human. Because football is a team sport and sometimes other components come up short for a while. Because most pro football games have an ebb and flow to them. Because pro football is not like college ball where superior teams routinely play drastically inferior teams to vastly lopsided scores and total number of points can impact post season positioning.

                          And because of these facts of pro football life, it is impressive (and highly valued) when the QB can not only lead the team to overcome earlier deficiencies, but can do it repeatedly and can do it in big games as well.

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                          • Originally posted by giantsfan420 View Post
                            and for me, its way different with eli making the mistakes hes made, and learning/progressing seadily over the years as opposed to rivers and this huge regresion. eli has had his share of moronic plays. but thats something thats improving over time, not regressing over time like rivers. if eli were making the mistakes he was making in succession, each on worse than the next, and continually getting worse, i'd say the same thing about eli as i am right now about rivers.
                            A reasonable person could argue that Eli regressed last season.
                            Admit nothing. Deny everything. Make counter accusations.

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                            • Originally posted by RoanokeFan View Post
                              Me too, but I was making my own business decisions when I was 21 and I am relatively certain the money involved was a factor.
                              Were you a blue chip athlete from a famous family where everyone was telling you how great you were?
                              Admit nothing. Deny everything. Make counter accusations.

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                              • Rivers is Eli with a higher QBR , a more consistent arm, and worse in the clutch, and no rings.
                                Because of all of the effort and examination being poured into these predictions, the draft is a robust market that, in the aggregate, does a good job of sorting prospects from top to bottom.1 Yet despite so many people trying to “beat the market,” no single actor can do it consistently. Abnormal returns are likely due to luck, not skill. But that hasn’t stopped NFL executives from behaving with the confidence of traders.

                                http://fivethirtyeight.com/features/...eat-the-draft/

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