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Will Barkley have a better career than Tiki Barber?

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  • Originally posted by Morehead State View Post

    QB's are paid to win. Well obviously it's a team game and many components go into a team's success. But over the course of many years you can see the ability of a QB, who plays the most important position in all of sports, to help his team win football games.

    Over the last 6 years Eli Manning is 12 games under .500. Not ONE year or TWO years.
    I'm talking SIX NFL seasons.
    That is the definition of a losing QB. Very few NFL QB's, if any are 12 games under .500 over the last 6 years. At what point do we hold our current QB accountable for his inability to lead this team to victories?
    Good one but the real joke for the past several disappointing seasons is gone.

    2015 the Giants fielded one of the worst defenses of ALL TIME. The disastrous regular seasons from 2012-2015 were all on REESEís inability to put together a quality team. He was a heavily flawed GM who had the luxury of trying to assemble a football team without worrying about the one constant. QB. and he failed.

    it wasnít until 2016, where Reese was able to mask his pathetic drafts by signing all pro players. Thinking about one year and not worrying about the cap hell he was going to eventually put DG into.

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    • Originally posted by EliDaMANning View Post

      Good one but the real joke for the past several disappointing seasons is gone.

      2015 the Giants fielded one of the worst defenses of ALL TIME. The disastrous regular seasons from 2012-2015 were all on REESEís inability to put together a quality team. He was a heavily flawed GM who had the luxury of trying to assemble a football team without worrying about the one constant. QB. and he failed.

      it wasnít until 2016, where Reese was able to mask his pathetic drafts by signing all pro players. Thinking about one year and not worrying about the cap hell he was going to eventually put DG into.
      I have to find a pen so I can write down all these excuses. There are so many.

      NOW...It's JR's fault. That's a new one.
      Deny everything. Admit nothing. Make counter accusations.

      Comment


      • People don't realize how great Tiki really was. If he played longer he's probably top 3 all time. His YPA is in elite territory (yards per attempt: 4.7 yards) for his career. That's higher than Emmitt Smith and Walter Payton. They just got more touches than him in their careers. If Tiki got the same amount of touches and sustained those numbers he would be #1 on the all time list for rushing yards. Tiki was a legend.

        In his final year as a Giant he averaged 5.1 per attempt. In Emmitt Smith's career only once did he get over 5 yards per attempt in a season. Meanwhile he played behind one of the greatest offensive lines of all time. Same with Walter Payton, he only averaged over 5 yards per carry once in his career. Tiki averaged over 5 yards per carry in 3 seasons.

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        • Originally posted by Morehead State View Post

          QB's are paid to win. Well obviously it's a team game and many components go into a team's success. But over the course of many years you can see the ability of a QB, who plays the most important position in all of sports, to help his team win football games.

          Over the last 6 years Eli Manning is 12 games under .500. Not ONE year or TWO years.
          I'm talking SIX NFL seasons.
          That is the definition of a losing QB. Very few NFL QB's, if any are 12 games under .500 over the last 6 years. At what point do we hold our current QB accountable for his inability to lead this team to victories?
          He was 9-7 in 2012, so you mean last 5 yrs. 13'-17'

          And again, where was the OL/run game or good defense during that time span? Coincidently, the 1yr the D was stellar, we made the playoffs despite the O's inability to run the ball & put up 30pts.

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          • Originally posted by Morehead State View Post

            You and Moosedrool are the only posters who seem consumed by my post count. I actually have interest in it at all. Most of mine come in one thread where we chit chat all day.

            But keep coming back with specious arguments that have nothing to do with the topic being discussed. Makes me feel that since you have no counter argument, I must be on to something.
            Post 120 is on topic, rb, but not the topic you want to discus, Eli

            Comment


            • Originally posted by Morehead State View Post

              At what point do we hold our current QB accountable for his inability to lead this team to victories?
              Specifically, this season. It seems, on paper, many of the prohibitive factors preventing Eli from realizing success have been addressed. All things being equal, Eli now has the tools to adequately do his job.

              As far as leading this team to victories: it seems a little unfair to place that solely on any QB. Defenses, which they have little or no control over, often determine the outcome of a game.

              Comment


              • Originally posted by jjhall91 View Post

                Specifically, this season. It seems, on paper, many of the prohibitive factors preventing Eli from realizing success have been addressed. All things being equal, Eli now has the tools to adequately do his job.

                As far as leading this team to victories: it seems a little unfair to place that solely on any QB. Defenses, which they have little or no control over, often determine the outcome of a game.
                I agree with you but the factors that dislike Eli will never admit that much of last year was beyond Eli's control.

                Comment


                • Originally posted by G1.. View Post

                  I agree with you but the factors that dislike Eli will never admit that much of last year was beyond Eli's control.
                  It never ceases to amaze me how people can plainly see, last year, there was peripheral impact to Eli (OL, injuries to WRs, poor coaching, lack of RB, etc.) yet determine the majority of fault lies with Eli.

                  I admit, previous to last year, Eli did "fall down" on occassion when he had ample opportunity to succeed. People have the right and are justified in questioning his overall ability in recent years. However, last year was clearly a no win situation for Eli.

                  I'm hoping for the "old" Eli to return with the support he's now given.

                  Comment


                  • Originally posted by Glaw View Post
                    Tiki's last 5 years were awesome the 1st 5 nothing special except 2000. What an upside down career for a rb. Barkley should easily start out better, but will he be awesome in year 10 like Tiki, I don't know about that.
                    Thereís a lot of info packed in this post. One would be hard pressed to find this much info in all of MS 500 bazillion posts.

                    Good point, Running backs can last longer than 5 years (tiki is our prime example). Hereís to hoping Barkley has a career full of Tikiís career year.

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                    • For the last time, all great RBs play 10+ yrs, it's only the mediocre to flat out bad ones that last 4 or less yrs. It always amazes me when the ignorant posters apply this " avg NFL career of a RB is 4 or less yrs" to every RB that's drafted. How in the living hell could Emmitt Smith have run for over 18,000yds if his career was supposed to be 4yrs? Same for every single RB in the all time top 20.

                      There's been plenty of journeyman QBs playing in the NFL who played 12-15 yrs, is that what you wanted the Giants to draft? I'd rather get 8-10-11 yrs of productive football out of a great RB that will open up the overall offensive gameplan than 12yrs of mediocre play out of a QB. When all is said & done in Andy Dalton's career, he will always be known as a QB good enough to get you a 9-7 record & one & done in the playoffs.

                      Comment


                      • Originally posted by Parademon1 View Post
                        For the last time, all great RBs play 10+ yrs, it's only the mediocre to flat out bad ones that last 4 or less yrs. It always amazes me when the ignorant posters apply this " avg NFL career of a RB is 4 or less yrs" to every RB that's drafted. How in the living hell could Emmitt Smith have run for over 18,000yds if his career was supposed to be 4yrs? Same for every single RB in the all time top 20.

                        There's been plenty of journeyman QBs playing in the NFL who played 12-15 yrs, is that what you wanted the Giants to draft? I'd rather get 8-10-11 yrs of productive football out of a great RB that will open up the overall offensive gameplan than 12yrs of mediocre play out of a QB. When all is said & done in Andy Dalton's career, he will always be known as a QB good enough to get you a 9-7 record & one & done in the playoffs.
                        Itís just a stupid narrative those people with a personal vendetta against Eli were pushing before the draft. Now theyíre just foaming at the mouth once Barkley was drafted and realized the new GMís thoughts are in line with those here who have pushed to build around a QB instead of drafting the next Dalton.

                        They are salivating at the thought of Barkley having a 10 carry 15 yard game.

                        Comment


                        • Originally posted by Parademon1 View Post
                          For the last time, all great RBs play 10+ yrs, it's only the mediocre to flat out bad ones that last 4 or less yrs. It always amazes me when the ignorant posters apply this " avg NFL career of a RB is 4 or less yrs" to every RB that's drafted. How in the living hell could Emmitt Smith have run for over 18,000yds if his career was supposed to be 4yrs? Same for every single RB in the all time top 20.

                          There's been plenty of journeyman QBs playing in the NFL who played 12-15 yrs, is that what you wanted the Giants to draft? I'd rather get 8-10-11 yrs of productive football out of a great RB that will open up the overall offensive gameplan than 12yrs of mediocre play out of a QB. When all is said & done in Andy Dalton's career, he will always be known as a QB good enough to get you a 9-7 record & one & done in the playoffs.
                          In today's NFL? You couldn't possibly be more wrong. The fact that you cite a RB in Emmett Smith who has been out of football for almost 20 years suggests I'm right.

                          Can a RB play 10+ years? I guess it's possible. Can they play at a high level? No...no they can't. Even the best RB of our era, Adrian Peterson's last effective season was his 9th. And that is rare these days.
                          A QB can be effective for 15+ years. They can be at the top of their game at age 37, 38 etc......while all the RB's drafted with them are long, long gone.
                          Deny everything. Admit nothing. Make counter accusations.

                          Comment


                          • Originally posted by Morehead State View Post

                            In today's NFL? You couldn't possibly be more wrong. The fact that you cite a RB in Emmett Smith who has been out of football for almost 20 years suggests I'm right.

                            Can a RB play 10+ years? I guess it's possible. Can they play at a high level? No...no they can't. Even the best RB of our era, Adrian Peterson's last effective season was his 9th. And that is rare these days.
                            A QB can be effective for 15+ years. They can be at the top of their game at age 37, 38 etc......while all the RB's drafted with them are long, long gone.
                            If the right QB was picked. I didnít want Mayfield or Darnold. Rosen was the best QB in the draft, but I think the concussions scared a lot of people. Allen I think has a lot of upside.
                            Engage brain before speaking.

                            Comment


                            • Originally posted by Morehead State View Post

                              In today's NFL? You couldn't possibly be more wrong. The fact that you cite a RB in Emmett Smith who has been out of football for almost 20 years suggests I'm right.

                              Can a RB play 10+ years? I guess it's possible. Can they play at a high level? No...no they can't. Even the best RB of our era, Adrian Peterson's last effective season was his 9th. And that is rare these days.
                              A QB can be effective for 15+ years. They can be at the top of their game at age 37, 38 etc......while all the RB's drafted with them are long, long gone.
                              LaDanian Tomlinson played 11yrs & retired in 2011 after rushing for 13,684yds & 145 TDs plus another 17 rec TDs for a total of 162TDs. He rushed for over 1100+yds his 1st 8yrs in the NFL so plz stop with the "it's possible' crap. If SB can come close to those numbers that Tomlinson put up, he will be a 1st ballot HOFer & will help the Giants win a few SBs in the process.

                              Tiki last 3 yrs in the NFL were his best stat wise. He played 10yrs & retired while still in his prime. Frank Gore at age 33 rushed for over 1000yds 2 yrs ago in his 12th yr in the NFL, plz just stop with the BS excuses you keep making about RBs not being effective after 8yrs or so. Gore also rushed for over 900yds in 2015 & another 900+ last yr at age 34. Just stop!

                              Comment


                              • Originally posted by Parademon1 View Post

                                LaDanian Tomlinson played 11yrs & retired in 2011 after rushing for 13,684yds & 145 TDs plus another 17 rec TDs for a total of 162TDs. He rushed for over 1100+yds his 1st 8yrs in the NFL so plz stop with the "it's possible' crap. If SB can come close to those numbers that Tomlinson put up, he will be a 1st ballot HOFer & will help the Giants win a few SBs in the process.

                                Tiki last 3 yrs in the NFL were his best stat wise. He played 10yrs & retired while still in his prime. Frank Gore at age 33 rushed for over 1000yds 2 yrs ago in his 12th yr in the NFL, plz just stop with the BS excuses you keep making about RBs not being effective after 8yrs or so. Gore also rushed for over 900yds in 2015 & another 900+ last yr at age 34. Just stop!
                                How many times did those RBs make it to the SB???

                                It's so comical that you throw in "win a few SBs in the process" when the example you're using never even played in a SB...

                                You can't make this stuff up!!!

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