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  • Originally posted by Morehead State View Post

    Yes sir. On rare occasions, the "can" play 10 years. It's rare as I said. As a rule, RB's have comparitively short careers. QB's, OL, LB. DL, WR...even CB have longer careers...and generally by a lot.
    And even if a RB can stretch their careers, they general are reduced to role players for the last few years, making them expendable.

    As I said...that's why they are so poorly paid in the league.
    You are not showing the stats. I know that an average of 13 Qbs are taken in every draft. There is a n average of 22 RB taken. The failure rate is going to be inherently higher. Fort RBs

    You also mentioned that that Qbs last longer . The extreme length that so have played Breese Rivers. The Mannings Ben and Tom are only a hand full .Just as those RB I listed.
    You will try to use a hand full of QBs longevity as a standard but when I present a hand full of RBs. You dismiss it is rare.
    So again your failed logic is easy to poke holes in without much though process. I can go back in time as you can with QBs and show more. I could add more but you would dismiss a 700-800 yard season as a fall off. I would consider that productive.
    "Three things can happen when you throw the ball, and two of them are bad." Darrell Royal

    Comment


    • Originally posted by TEM View Post

      You are not showing the stats. I know that an average of 13 Qbs are taken in every draft. There is a n average of 22 RB taken. The failure rate is going to be inherently higher. Fort RBs

      You also mentioned that that Qbs last longer . The extreme length that so have played Breese Rivers. The Mannings Ben and Tom are only a hand full .Just as those RB I listed.
      You will try to use a hand full of QBs longevity as a standard but when I present a hand full of RBs. You dismiss it is rare.
      So again your failed logic is easy to poke holes in without much though process. I can go back in time as you can with QBs and show more. I could add more but you would dismiss a 700-800 yard season as a fall off. I would consider that productive.
      Come on my friend....i got you on the salary argument. Admit it. NFL teams don't value the RB position highly, yet you are making the argument that they are wrong?
      I'm not sure.
      Deny everything. Admit nothing. Make counter accusations.

      Comment


      • Originally posted by Morehead State View Post

        Come on my friend....i got you on the salary argument. Admit it. NFL teams don't value the RB position highly, yet you are making the argument that they are wrong?
        I'm not sure.
        I am saying they are wrong again I can use facts to show it

        The entire stop the pass and pass the ball mind set has become a gift for some and a nightmare for others. The Giants, NE , Denver and Baltimore have done well in this new millennium and a few have won 1 . The rest of the league is sucking wind. There are not enough QBs, Pass rushers Pass protection O-linemen and cover corners for the entire league,that can take you to and win the show to go around. What I see and it started a few years back . Some teams are removing them selves from a pass and live and die by the QB and pass rush mentality. With the parody the NFl has injected more teams should be able to win. It is still a select few. It is because of the Draft consensus of passing and stopping the pass. The way I see it some teams and last years playoff teams season's rushing stats show it . Running the ball 1st is going to be the new era.

        9 of the top 10 in the playoffs

        http://www.espn.com/nfl/statistics/team/_/stat/rushing
        "Three things can happen when you throw the ball, and two of them are bad." Darrell Royal

        Comment


        • Originally posted by TEM View Post

          I am saying they are wrong again I can use facts to show it

          The entire stop the pass and pass the ball mind set has become a gift for some and a nightmare for others. The Giants, NE , Denver and Baltimore have done well in this new millennium and a few have won 1 . The rest of the league is sucking wind. There are not enough QBs, Pass rushers Pass protection O-linemen and cover corners for the entire league,that can take you to and win the show to go around. What I see and it started a few years back . Some teams are removing them selves from a pass and live and die by the QB and pass rush mentality. With the parody the NFl has injected more teams should be able to win. It is still a select few. It is because of the Draft consensus of passing and stopping the pass. The way I see it some teams and last years playoff teams season's rushing stats show it . Running the ball 1st is going to be the new era.

          9 of the top 10 in the playoffs

          http://www.espn.com/nfl/statistics/team/_/stat/rushing
          "Running the ball first" will not be the new era if the NFL has anything to say about it. They have rigged the rules to favor the passing game for the last 20+ years.
          You essentially can't hit the QB unless you are less than a step away. You can touch his helmet. You can't tackle him below the thighs.
          You can't touch WR's after 5 yards. It is SO easy to throw the ball in this league. That is how you win. That is how you score.
          NOW..they won't let a RB lower his head at contact. It's not only becoming easier to throw it, it's getting harder to run it.

          The league used to be "run the ball and stop the run". Now it's "throw the ball and disrupt the QB".


          As I said, the league has adapted to it. QB's, LT's, cover corners and pass rushers are the highest paid players in this league. They all relate to the passing game. If you want to put your head in the sand that's on you.

          This is the new NFL and it's here to stay.
          Deny everything. Admit nothing. Make counter accusations.

          Comment


          • Originally posted by Morehead State View Post

            "Running the ball first" will not be the new era if the NFL has anything to say about it. They have rigged the rules to favor the passing game for the last 20+ years.
            You essentially can't hit the QB unless you are less than a step away. You can touch his helmet. You can't tackle him below the thighs.
            You can't touch WR's after 5 yards. It is SO easy to throw the ball in this league. That is how you win. That is how you score.
            NOW..they won't let a RB lower his head at contact. It's not only becoming easier to throw it, it's getting harder to run it.

            The league used to be "run the ball and stop the run". Now it's "throw the ball and disrupt the QB".


            As I said, the league has adapted to it. QB's, LT's, cover corners and pass rushers are the highest paid players in this league. They all relate to the passing game. If you want to put your head in the sand that's on you.

            This is the new NFL and it's here to stay.
            This is exactly right. All one has to do is go back and look at the gradual rule changes. The NFL knows that casual fans of the game only care about highlight reels and TD catches, and it's the casual fans that they've targeted.
            The fact that an opinion has been widely held is no evidence whatever that it is not utterly absurd - Bertrand Russell

            Comment


            • Originally posted by DarkSaint View Post

              He combined multiple words.. ah forget it. probably best for everyone involved.
              Oh wait......Is he suggesting that I am gay? Is that what that was? Just trying to figure out what makes these folks tick.
              Deny everything. Admit nothing. Make counter accusations.

              Comment


              • Originally posted by Morehead State View Post

                "Running the ball first" will not be the new era if the NFL has anything to say about it. They have rigged the rules to favor the passing game for the last 20+ years.
                You essentially can't hit the QB unless you are less than a step away. You can touch his helmet. You can't tackle him below the thighs.
                You can't touch WR's after 5 yards. It is SO easy to throw the ball in this league. That is how you win. That is how you score.
                NOW..they won't let a RB lower his head at contact. It's not only becoming easier to throw it, it's getting harder to run it.

                The league used to be "run the ball and stop the run". Now it's "throw the ball and disrupt the QB".


                As I said, the league has adapted to it. QB's, LT's, cover corners and pass rushers are the highest paid players in this league. They all relate to the passing game. If you want to put your head in the sand that's on you.

                This is the new NFL and it's here to stay.
                Elliot turned a 4 win cowboys team into a 13 win team as a rookie Fournette, helped the Jags go from last to first and to the ACCG as a rookie.

                Our offense already has a good passing attack that was victimized by a bad oline, no run game and highscool level play book.

                We won't just have a run game we have Eli, Odell, Engram and Shep.

                If we had drafted a QB we would be in the same boat as last year but with a different QB and coach. Teams wouldn't have respected our run game and would have dropped everyone in coverage and everyone would think the new QB stinks and we should use next year's top 3 pick on the next great QB again.
                ​​​​​​

                Comment


                • Originally posted by DarkSaint View Post

                  Elliot turned a 4 win cowboys team into a 13 win team as a rookie Fournette, helped the Jags go from last to first and to the ACCG as a rookie.

                  Our offense already has a good passing attack that was victimized by a bad oline, no run game and highscool level play book.

                  We won't just have a run game we have Eli, Odell, Engram and Shep.

                  If we had drafted a QB we would be in the same boat as last year but with a different QB and coach. Teams wouldn't have respected our run game and would have dropped everyone in coverage and everyone would think the new QB stinks and we should use next year's top 3 pick on the next great QB again.
                  ​​​​​​
                  Did he really? Do you think the play of the new QB might have had something to do with that? And maybe the fact that they lost their QB the season before also?

                  You DO know they were 12-4 when Romo was healthy the season before that......Right?

                  And BTW...They were 4-12 with a top 10 rushing offense. What does that tell you about the impact of the running game on winning?
                  Deny everything. Admit nothing. Make counter accusations.

                  Comment


                  • Originally posted by Morehead State View Post

                    Did he really? Do you think the play of the new QB might have had something to do with that? And maybe the fact that they lost their QB the season before also?

                    You DO know they were 12-4 when Romo was healthy the season before that......Right?

                    And BTW...They were 4-12 with a top 10 rushing offense. What does that tell you about the impact of the running game on winning?
                    4-12 without Romo and Elliot and then 13-3 without Romo but with Elliot.

                    Comment


                    • Originally posted by DarkSaint View Post

                      4-12 without Romo and Elliot and then 13-3 without Romo but with Elliot.
                      4-12 without Romo but WITH a top 10 rushing attack.
                      Deny everything. Admit nothing. Make counter accusations.

                      Comment


                      • Originally posted by Morehead State View Post

                        I'm talking about in today's game. As I said several posts ago, the era of Emmitt Smith and Walter Payton playing that long is gone.
                        Tiki was a physical freak. No one worked as hard as he did to be able to play like he did at the end of his career. But I think the lack of hits he took early in his career helped him later. He did play 10 years but he was only really effective for 6.

                        His career was really backwards from the norm. He best years were at the end of his tenure, not the beginning. he is an exception. That's why I think he's a HOF'r.

                        I just randomly clicked on 2010. that's a good year since it's still recent, but far enough gone to see where they ended up.
                        The names at the top of the rushing list..

                        Michael Turner
                        Steven Jackson
                        Arian Foster
                        Rashard Mendenhall
                        Chris Johnson
                        Ced Bensen
                        MJD
                        Adrian Peterson

                        Any of those guys have 10 years of effectiveness? Most had less than 5. It's just the nature of today's NFL.
                        You forgot to include Beastmode: 10,000+rushing yds, 90 TDs rush/rec & he retired for 1 yr otherwise his numbers would be close to 11,000yds & 100 TDs

                        Again, the great RBs will always play 10yrs at minimum & put up HOF numbers, right now there is no reason in the world to be thinking SB won't play 10+yrs & put up HOF #s & help the Giants win a SB or 2. A career ending injury is the only thing that can derail that.

                        Comment


                        • Originally posted by Morehead State View Post

                          Did he really? Do you think the play of the new QB might have had something to do with that? And maybe the fact that they lost their QB the season before also?

                          You DO know they were 12-4 when Romo was healthy the season before that......Right?

                          And BTW...They were 4-12 with a top 10 rushing offense. What does that tell you about the impact of the running game on winning?
                          The play of the new QB was because Elliot was getting 5ypc on 1st down! He rushed for 1000yds alone on 1st dn his rookie season! What QB, rookie or vet, is not gonna benefit from that & have a stellar season? How great was the play of that QB when Elliot was sidelined for 6 games? I saw him play like the game manager QB he truly is w/o a great run game to take the pressure off him.

                          I don't care how skewed the rules are towards the passing game, a great RB is a QBs best friend as he takes the pressure off that QB having to win the game solely with his arm on a week to week basis. For all of Brees monster passing stats, he has just 1 SB ring in 17yrs in the NFL. Last yr he threw just 23 TDs due to having a great run game & only a brainfart defensive gaff prevented NO from going to the NFCCG & possibly the SB. NO rushed for 2070 yds, 23 TDs & a 4.7 ypc avg. You gonna stand there & tell me that had nothing to do with them going from 3 straight 7-9 seasons to 11-5 & div champs?

                          Brees led the NFL in passing yds the previous 3 yrs & & threw 33, 32 & 37 TDs & all it got NO was 7-9 all 3 yrs that he was lighting it up threw the air.

                          Last yr he threw for his fewest amount of yds since 2010 & the last time he threw for under 30 TDs was 2007. Last yr he attempted under 600 passes for the 1st time since 2009 & yet still won 11 games, why, cuz he had a a very effective run game to take the pressure off him having to win every game with his arm & the defense heavily benefitted from having a clock eating ground game as they finished 10th after finishing 31st-32nd & 28th ranked the previous 3 yrs. An effective ground game helps out the QB & the defense, something the Giants have not had in 5+yrs.

                          Comment


                          • Originally posted by Parademon1 View Post

                            You forgot to include Beastmode: 10,000+rushing yds, 90 TDs rush/rec & he retired for 1 yr otherwise his numbers would be close to 11,000yds & 100 TDs

                            Again, the great RBs will always play 10yrs at minimum & put up HOF numbers, right now there is no reason in the world to be thinking SB won't play 10+yrs & put up HOF #s & help the Giants win a SB or 2. A career ending injury is the only thing that can derail that.
                            Absolutely fantastic example. Played 8 seasons at a relatively high level, a few bad seasons. Then season 9 came and he hit the wall...as most RB's do...even great ones. 1200 yards in his last two seasons (of play).
                            Deny everything. Admit nothing. Make counter accusations.

                            Comment


                            • Originally posted by Parademon1 View Post

                              The play of the new QB was because Elliot was getting 5ypc on 1st down! He rushed for 1000yds alone on 1st dn his rookie season! What QB, rookie or vet, is not gonna benefit from that & have a stellar season? How great was the play of that QB when Elliot was sidelined for 6 games? I saw him play like the game manager QB he truly is w/o a great run game to take the pressure off him.

                              I don't care how skewed the rules are towards the passing game, a great RB is a QBs best friend as he takes the pressure off that QB having to win the game solely with his arm on a week to week basis. For all of Brees monster passing stats, he has just 1 SB ring in 17yrs in the NFL. Last yr he threw just 23 TDs due to having a great run game & only a brainfart defensive gaff prevented NO from going to the NFCCG & possibly the SB. NO rushed for 2070 yds, 23 TDs & a 4.7 ypc avg. You gonna stand there & tell me that had nothing to do with them going from 3 straight 7-9 seasons to 11-5 & div champs?

                              Brees led the NFL in passing yds the previous 3 yrs & & threw 33, 32 & 37 TDs & all it got NO was 7-9 all 3 yrs that he was lighting it up threw the air.

                              Last yr he threw for his fewest amount of yds since 2010 & the last time he threw for under 30 TDs was 2007. Last yr he attempted under 600 passes for the 1st time since 2009 & yet still won 11 games, why, cuz he had a a very effective run game to take the pressure off him having to win every game with his arm & the defense heavily benefitted from having a clock eating ground game as they finished 10th after finishing 31st-32nd & 28th ranked the previous 3 yrs. An effective ground game helps out the QB & the defense, something the Giants have not had in 5+yrs.
                              He DID have a very effective run game....with a split backfield. which is how you win in this league.
                              Deny everything. Admit nothing. Make counter accusations.

                              Comment


                              • Originally posted by Morehead State View Post

                                He DID have a very effective run game....with a split backfield. which is how you win in this league.
                                The Giants haven't even had an effective run game with a split backfield in 5yrs.

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