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Anyone who thinks eli will not flourish in in a west coast offense....

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  • Originally posted by BeatYale View Post
    Maybe Eli's struggles with shorter, quicker passing was because there wasn't enough emphasis on it. Our offense was too vertical, and he developed muscle memory for that and just didn't have it for shorter passing because there wasn't enough repetition in practice and/or game day.

    Anyways, whatever the reason, I don't doubt that he can adjust to the west coast.
    btw, the picture in your sig is freaking hilarious ...
    http://boards.giants.com/showthread....est-game/page6
    http://www.coldhardfootballfacts.com/Articles/11_2554_A_brief,_fact-filled_history_of_the_NFL_passing_game.html
    http://espn.go.com/nfl/story/_/id/8732732/is-new-york-giants-qb-eli-manning-worthy-hall-fame-espn-magazine

    Entire Team Let Eli down today - NYG4l

    Comment


    • Originally posted by Rudyy View Post
      Oh, no..I was trying to talk in both past and present tense..
      I will take a Stab at answering the question. Right now, within the past two seasons he has been a shell of the franchise QB that won those SBs. A lot of it has not been totally his fault. With the steady decline of the O-Line and him taking hits and sacks like never before it sort of shocked him cause the whole time he has been he he has always enjoyed a very good line in front of him.

      After the break down of the line when it was evident he was going to be hit even when he was getting passes off he started to get jumpy and rushed out throws and with that it had an effect on his accuracy.. He started under and overthrowing and balls were coming out like wounded ducks.

      I think he can again get back to the franchise QB we all knew and loved if they can fix the blocking and give him the time he has enjoyed in the past... Let's see what Coach Mac can do about getting him some protection. Once he had that then we can all decide weather or not Eli had declined or not
      Football has been very, very good to us.
      After losing seasons 2013-15, the giants put up 11 wins in 16.. they are on way Back
      But for now we can console ourselves with this fact-

      # of Super Bowl victories since 1985:

      1-Chicago, St. Louis, Tampa Bay, Indianapolis, New Orleans, Seattle
      2-Washington, Green Bay, Pittsburgh, Baltimore
      3-San Francisco, Dallas, Denver
      4-New York Giants!!!
      5-NE
      Let's make it 5 in 2016 so we can be on a LINE NE again!!!

      ***Stat provided by "Schloss22"***

      Comment


      • Originally posted by miked1958 View Post
        I will take a Stab at answering the question. Right now, within the past two seasons he has been a shell of the franchise QB that won those SBs. A lot of it has not been totally his fault. With the steady decline of the O-Line and him taking hits and sacks like never before it sort of shocked him cause the whole time he has been he he has always enjoyed a very good line in front of him.

        After the break down of the line when it was evident he was going to be hit even when he was getting passes off he started to get jumpy and rushed out throws and with that it had an effect on his accuracy.. He started under and overthrowing and balls were coming out like wounded ducks.

        I think he can again get back to the franchise QB we all knew and loved if they can fix the blocking and give him the time he has enjoyed in the past... Let's see what Coach Mac can do about getting him some protection. Once he had that then we can all decide weather or not Eli had declined or not
        I don't want to take away anything for what Eli did for us at the end of the 2007 because winning that Super Bowl was the greatest experience I've had as a Giants fan. But it seems that people don't remember how Eli was playing back then. He still was prone to making mistakes in early 2007 and it was when Eli started to protect the football when things turned around for us. It wasn't as if he played some tremendous football out there, he simply play smarter and it was good enough for us to win.

        Comment


        • i def think he was tremendous in that playoff run in 07. he struggled mightily in the reg. season, but something clicked in the postseason. it wasnt simply "him playing smarter", dude was making tremendous throws. that gb game was epic. He didnt do anything really special in te TB game, but in the Dallas, GB, and NE games, he made tremendous throws that if they werent made, we dont win. and each game was on the road, another added road block for most teams/qbs. and the competition; TB, Dallas, and NE all fielded top 10 Defenses and GB's was like 11th iirc.

          That GB game, man what a game. Does eli have the most road playoff victories for a QB in NFL history? i want to say he does but am not sure on that...that could be a factor in his value/worth from the topic earlier,
          Last edited by giantsfan420; 01-18-2014, 07:58 PM.

          Comment


          • Originally posted by ThatNiCcA56 View Post
            I guess he's been "faltering" for years but has 2 rings. Sure buddy.
            Dear God, I cant believe the amount of acute tunnel vision in this thread. In your version of reality, the rings erase every and all mistakes and boneheaded plays that Eli ever made, and have basically granted him complete immunity from criticism and/or negative commentary of any kind.

            In the reality that normal people with 20/20 vision live in, the rings were a major high point for all Giants fans, and we'll always be eternally grateful for Eli's contributions to them. However, he still has played at a sub-par level for much of his career, including 2007, and for the money he makes and his years of experience, most feel that he should be playing at a much higher, more consistent level. Rings, MVP awards.....all in the past. They did absolutely nothing to help the team before or after he won them, so...

            Please explain how they can possibly be relevant to what the team does going forward, and how those rings and MVP awards should force the team to hold off from pushing Eli with actual competition in the form of another possible starting QB. Take all the time you need. Using the word "hater" in your response will earn you a 1 day ban. Fair warning!
            Last edited by Die-Hard; 01-18-2014, 08:35 PM.
            The fact that an opinion has been widely held is no evidence whatever that it is not utterly absurd - Bertrand Russell

            Comment


            • Originally posted by giantsfan420 View Post
              i def think he was tremendous in that playoff run in 07. he struggled mightily in the reg. season, but something clicked in the postseason. it wasnt simply "him playing smarter", dude was making tremendous throws. that gb game was epic. He didnt do anything really special in te TB game, but in the Dallas, GB, and NE games, he made tremendous throws that if they werent made, we dont win. and each game was on the road, another added road block for most teams/qbs. and the competition; TB, Dallas, and NE all fielded top 10 Defenses and GB's was like 11th iirc.

              That GB game, man what a game. Does eli have the most road playoff victories for a QB in NFL history? i want to say he does but am not sure on that...that could be a factor in his value/worth from the topic earlier,
              I think he is like 5-1 on the Road in playoffs not counting the two SBs which we were the Away Team for. He lost his first ever Road Playoff game at Philly. Then won @ TB, @ Dallas & @ GB in 07. In 2011 in won @ GB & @ SF..
              Football has been very, very good to us.
              After losing seasons 2013-15, the giants put up 11 wins in 16.. they are on way Back
              But for now we can console ourselves with this fact-

              # of Super Bowl victories since 1985:

              1-Chicago, St. Louis, Tampa Bay, Indianapolis, New Orleans, Seattle
              2-Washington, Green Bay, Pittsburgh, Baltimore
              3-San Francisco, Dallas, Denver
              4-New York Giants!!!
              5-NE
              Let's make it 5 in 2016 so we can be on a LINE NE again!!!

              ***Stat provided by "Schloss22"***

              Comment


              • Originally posted by giantsfan420 View Post
                i def think he was tremendous in that playoff run in 07. he struggled mightily in the reg. season, but something clicked in the postseason. it wasnt simply "him playing smarter", dude was making tremendous throws. that gb game was epic. He didnt do anything really special in te TB game, but in the Dallas, GB, and NE games, he made tremendous throws that if they werent made, we dont win. and each game was on the road, another added road block for most teams/qbs. and the competition; TB, Dallas, and NE all fielded top 10 Defenses and GB's was like 11th iirc.

                That GB game, man what a game. Does eli have the most road playoff victories for a QB in NFL history? i want to say he does but am not sure on that...that could be a factor in his value/worth from the topic earlier,
                Don't get me wrong I believe he played very well overall. Eli always makes tremendous throws in the game, the trouble is he also can make some boneheaded throws as well. So that's why describe the difference as him playing smarter.

                2007 was a season which Plaxico Burress was simply phenomenal. Eli benefited greatly by Plaxico, and the GB game was a perfect example of that.

                Again, not taking anything away from Eli.

                Comment


                • Originally posted by giantsfan420 View Post
                  i def think he was tremendous in that playoff run in 07. he struggled mightily in the reg. season, but something clicked in the postseason. it wasnt simply "him playing smarter", dude was making tremendous throws. that gb game was epic. He didnt do anything really special in te TB game, but in the Dallas, GB, and NE games, he made tremendous throws that if they werent made, we dont win. and each game was on the road, another added road block for most teams/qbs. and the competition; TB, Dallas, and NE all fielded top 10 Defenses and GB's was like 11th iirc.

                  That GB game, man what a game. Does eli have the most road playoff victories for a QB in NFL history? i want to say he does but am not sure on that...that could be a factor in his value/worth from the topic earlier,
                  I think he is like 5-1 on the Road in playoffs not counting the two SBs which we were the Away Team for. He lost his first ever Road Playoff game at Philly. Then won @ TB, @ Dallas & @ GB in 07. In 2011 in won @ GB & @ SF..

                  Actually Flacco has more Road playoff wins with six then any other QB but he has 4 Road losses. So Eli has the best percentage with a 5-1 record with a bunch if guys behind him at 4-1... Here

                  http://espn.go.com/blog/statsinfo/po...ecord-road-win
                  Last edited by miked1958; 01-18-2014, 08:42 PM.
                  Football has been very, very good to us.
                  After losing seasons 2013-15, the giants put up 11 wins in 16.. they are on way Back
                  But for now we can console ourselves with this fact-

                  # of Super Bowl victories since 1985:

                  1-Chicago, St. Louis, Tampa Bay, Indianapolis, New Orleans, Seattle
                  2-Washington, Green Bay, Pittsburgh, Baltimore
                  3-San Francisco, Dallas, Denver
                  4-New York Giants!!!
                  5-NE
                  Let's make it 5 in 2016 so we can be on a LINE NE again!!!

                  ***Stat provided by "Schloss22"***

                  Comment


                  • One thing I noticed in this video is he didnt shrug his shoulders even once. I wonder if that is a tic he developed int he pros. He shrugs his shoulders, or kinda rolls them, after every pass.

                    Comment


                    • Manning actually has a bad Home playoff record at 1-2 with bad losses to Carolina 23-0 & Philly 22-11 in that 12-4 season when Plax shot himself and we lost final 4/5 including the playoff game. The one Home playoff win was a dominating performance in 2011 vs Atlanta 24-2...

                      Here's a page that has all QBs and there Playoff Records...

                      http://6thring.com/nfl-qb-playoff-re...y-manning.html
                      Football has been very, very good to us.
                      After losing seasons 2013-15, the giants put up 11 wins in 16.. they are on way Back
                      But for now we can console ourselves with this fact-

                      # of Super Bowl victories since 1985:

                      1-Chicago, St. Louis, Tampa Bay, Indianapolis, New Orleans, Seattle
                      2-Washington, Green Bay, Pittsburgh, Baltimore
                      3-San Francisco, Dallas, Denver
                      4-New York Giants!!!
                      5-NE
                      Let's make it 5 in 2016 so we can be on a LINE NE again!!!

                      ***Stat provided by "Schloss22"***

                      Comment


                      • Originally posted by giantsfan420 View Post
                        i def think he was tremendous in that playoff run in 07. he struggled mightily in the reg. season, but something clicked in the postseason. it wasnt simply "him playing smarter", dude was making tremendous throws. that gb game was epic. He didnt do anything really special in te TB game, but in the Dallas, GB, and NE games, he made tremendous throws that if they werent made, we dont win. and each game was on the road, another added road block for most teams/qbs. and the competition; TB, Dallas, and NE all fielded top 10 Defenses and GB's was like 11th iirc.

                        That GB game, man what a game. Does eli have the most road playoff victories for a QB in NFL history? i want to say he does but am not sure on that...that could be a factor in his value/worth from the topic earlier,
                        another note on Road playoff wins. What people fail to notice is a lot of good QBs have BAD Road playoff records.. For example...


                        Marino 1-6
                        Farve 3-7
                        Romo 0-2
                        Montana 2-5
                        Peyton 2-5
                        Bree's 1-4
                        Rivers 1-2
                        Luck 0-2
                        Ryan 0-2
                        Vick 1-2
                        Hassleback 0-4
                        McNabb 3-4
                        Warner 1-2
                        Bradshaw 2-3
                        S. Young 0-3
                        Aeikman 1-3
                        Kelly 1-3
                        Elway 3-2
                        A. Rodgers 3-2
                        Brady 3-2
                        Alex Smith 0-1
                        Dalton 0-2

                        That's 22 really good QBs going a combined 28-68 on the road. Take out the 3 over .500 and it's a lowly 19-62
                        Lots of great names on that list.. Makes what Eli has done that much more astonishing

                        Haha Sanchez is 4-2 on road and Kap of SF is 3-0, Big Benn 3-1...


                        *** note we need Seattle to beat SF Sunday cause we don't want Kap thing Eli % wise at 4-0***
                        Last edited by miked1958; 01-18-2014, 10:55 PM.
                        Football has been very, very good to us.
                        After losing seasons 2013-15, the giants put up 11 wins in 16.. they are on way Back
                        But for now we can console ourselves with this fact-

                        # of Super Bowl victories since 1985:

                        1-Chicago, St. Louis, Tampa Bay, Indianapolis, New Orleans, Seattle
                        2-Washington, Green Bay, Pittsburgh, Baltimore
                        3-San Francisco, Dallas, Denver
                        4-New York Giants!!!
                        5-NE
                        Let's make it 5 in 2016 so we can be on a LINE NE again!!!

                        ***Stat provided by "Schloss22"***

                        Comment


                        • that is a good point roosevelt. how he's capable of making tremendous throws, and boneheaded ones all in the same game. and when he plays smarter, those boneheaded throws decrease dramatically.

                          but if we are gonna try to correlate that to eli's level of play, perhaps there can be factors external of him that raise the number of boneheaded throws. but thats a topic tats been beaten to death.

                          and miked, thanks for all the stats. yeah thats why i didnt want to say eli actually did bc i remember hearing how Flacco surpassed him last year. If theres one thing Mcadoo does, I hope he raises eli's consistency level the rest of his career. i know tis is gonna sound crazy, and i am an admitted "homer", but I truly believe eli COULD reach a level near or at peyton and tom. the reason i say that, is bc of the throws eli is capable of making. i believe eli has a lot of potential that could be untapped still, i've actually maintained this for some time now if one were to check my posts, but i believe eli hasnt even reached his "ceiling" yet. in 2011, he displayed that he could play on that level, but he hasnt sustained it since. My hope; Mcadoo is the guy to get him there. (Note-i know that is almost absurd to claim about eli, its my gut feeling. i dont know how that could anger some so pls keep the hatred to urselves)

                          Comment


                          • The greatest West Coast Offense of all time needed great players. We keep thinking McAdoo will be this savior. He's just an OC. No system works without grade A talent somewhere along the line. The Niners gave Joe a good line, and some of the best skill position players on offense ever. Eli has shown if we do the same for him he will rise to the level of the talent around him.
                            Because of all of the effort and examination being poured into these predictions, the draft is a robust market that, in the aggregate, does a good job of sorting prospects from top to bottom.1 Yet despite so many people trying to “beat the market,” no single actor can do it consistently. Abnormal returns are likely due to luck, not skill. But that hasn’t stopped NFL executives from behaving with the confidence of traders.

                            http://fivethirtyeight.com/features/...eat-the-draft/

                            Comment


                            • Originally posted by giantsfan420 View Post
                              that is a good point roosevelt. how he's capable of making tremendous throws, and boneheaded ones all in the same game. and when he plays smarter, those boneheaded throws decrease dramatically.

                              but if we are gonna try to correlate that to eli's level of play, perhaps there can be factors external of him that raise the number of boneheaded throws. but thats a topic tats been beaten to death.

                              That's a totally valid point.

                              Sometimes people use the excuse that if Eli were to hold the ball and take the sack (as opposed to an INT) then the fans would blame Eli for that. While I agree that some clueless people might think that, I've never once placed the blame on a QB for a sack unless a) I can see someone was open, b) he had time to scan the field, and c) the QB had a clear line of sight to that player.

                              I'm no football expert by any stretch but that just seems so obvious to me. Most sacks IMO, are not the fault of the QB - they are on the oline or the receivers for not getting open.

                              Comment


                              • Originally posted by B&RWarrior View Post
                                The greatest West Coast Offense of all time needed great players. We keep thinking McAdoo will be this savior. He's just an OC. No system works without grade A talent somewhere along the line. The Niners gave Joe a good line, and some of the best skill position players on offense ever. Eli has shown if we do the same for him he will rise to the level of the talent around him.
                                That is a good point. Here's to the coming year. Let's go Giants, let's get back on track.

                                Comment

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