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  • #46
    Interesting!
    New York Giants Superbowl XXI, XXV, XLII, XLVI Champions!!!!!

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    • #47
      Originally posted by Sarcasman View Post
      Rosie makes a valid point; there is an absolute dearth of logic and rationality here.

      We have already declared off season victory by overrating our team as we so often do.

      So, the offensive line which was at least bottom third or worse (depending on your source) last year and to which virtually nothing has been done to improve it, is now magically a line that will learn how to run block and pass protect, even though it could do neither in an adequate way last year and the team's offense will immediately vault into the top 5 despite being closer to the bottom 5 last year.

      But not to worry because we will win games using the 2015 Denver Broncos formula. Our potentially tenth best defense last year is now comparable (based on what? I have no idea) to one of the top 10 nfl defenses of all time.

      So, you see it's simple. Minneapolis here we come!
      I get this and agree, in many regards

      But feel yiu may be a little too extreme in your dismissal of key aspects that do tie into the topic.

      Football is a game of matchup and dictation. Who can dictate to the other and who can then respond best. This is largely why matchup are so key because it is via believed matchups a coach feels he can exploit as the methodology of dictating the game flow and trajectory.

      Now you know I've been one of the loudest opining about the OL issues. I don't think fluker makes everyone block better.

      HOW EVER what I do think is plausible and even likely depending on the personal views, that with Marshall and the other additions, we will be better suited to respond to the way defenses challenge us.

      Last year we were unable to force opposing defenses out of the 2 high defensive look. It was our crux all year. That largely was due to matchups we could not exploit and were being exploited ourselves.

      I'm basically trying to say that if an offense can force defenses into expected looks and defensive philosophies due to th3 matchup issues we can present, it will have a trickle down effect on the OL.

      Think of it like 2011. The OL was pitiful much of the year but at the end, when we finally got a run game going, it opened up yhe dynamics of the offense and allowed us to strategically exploit specific elements that were not eligible earlier in the year when the run game was dead last. As a result the offense became more efficient as a whole OL included.

      I think it is possible we see the additions on offense enable an "opening up" of the dynamics we can exploit and I believe we will be much better equipped to present different challenges to the defense than we were able to last year which as a result will trickle down into a more efficient offense OL included. Sorry for length of post.

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      • #48
        I guess what I tried to say in a billion words as usual lol is that there are ways to improve the efficiency of the OL without actually improving the quality of its play.

        This is where scheme and strategy and matchup all come into play and if factored out/foiled out correctly by the coach and company, you can create a balance that enables the OL to appear as if it is playing at a higher level even if it isn't necessarily doing so.

        2011 was the example I cited: OL during regular season and postseason when the run game opened up.


        This is the cliffs notes of my prior comment lol.

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        • #49
          Originally posted by giantsfan420 View Post
          I get this and agree, in many regards

          But feel yiu may be a little too extreme in your dismissal of key aspects that do tie into the topic.

          Football is a game of matchup and dictation. Who can dictate to the other and who can then respond best. This is largely why matchup are so key because it is via believed matchups a coach feels he can exploit as the methodology of dictating the game flow and trajectory.

          Now you know I've been one of the loudest opining about the OL issues. I don't think fluker makes everyone block better.

          HOW EVER what I do think is plausible and even likely depending on the personal views, that with Marshall and the other additions, we will be better suited to respond to the way defenses challenge us.

          Last year we were unable to force opposing defenses out of the 2 high defensive look. It was our crux all year. That largely was due to matchups we could not exploit and were being exploited ourselves.

          I'm basically trying to say that if an offense can force defenses into expected looks and defensive philosophies due to th3 matchup issues we can present, it will have a trickle down effect on the OL.

          Think of it like 2011. The OL was pitiful much of the year but at the end, when we finally got a run game going, it opened up yhe dynamics of the offense and allowed us to strategically exploit specific elements that were not eligible earlier in the year when the run game was dead last. As a result the offense became more efficient as a whole OL included.

          I think it is possible we see the additions on offense enable an "opening up" of the dynamics we can exploit and I believe we will be much better equipped to present different challenges to the defense than we were able to last year which as a result will trickle down into a more efficient offense OL included. Sorry for length of post.
          I get it, I just don't see how a team that succeeded at dictating nothing last year is all of a sudden going to start dictating stuff this year. It's largely the same team and just as importantly, the same HC.

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          • #50
            Originally posted by Sarcasman View Post
            I get it, I just don't see how a team that succeeded at dictating nothing last year is all of a sudden going to start dictating stuff this year. It's largely the same team and just as importantly, the same HC.
            Very true and very good points. But football is so awesome imo bc of the element I'm gonna cite; it can sometimes only be one addition that changes the entire dynamics of the entire offense...now this doesn't just apply to positive improvement but also regression ie Randle leaving replaced by Cruz equals the assumption many myself included possessed going into the year was the dead dead wrong lol...

            I personally believe the Marshall addition is going to be so monumental to the offense Asa whole. That one dynamic that one addition is going to present a plethora of new dynamics and challenges for defenses. If Mac is worth his salt at all he should have zero issue creating a scheme that is more effective even with OL issues.
            This also holds true for eli.

            Now this is predicated on the notion the OL doesn't hav3 to be good even just better than last year. We can still be a bottom half OL imo and still b3 effective on offense it just can't be a worst lt in the league 3rd worst RT in league scenario no qb no scheme no matchup can overrid3 that except the individual lt and RT themselves....

            Which speaks to your point ultimately as well still I can't believe we get that poor of play next year if we do I'm gonna break lol.

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            • #51
              Originally posted by giantsfan420 View Post
              I have a lot of difficulty accepting the number of people who are unable to understand we had the worst tackles in all of football literally and the lt was by some margin.

              What that means and I'm guessing where the break down is occurring in the forming of their pov, is that on passing plays when the tackle play is crucial above all really (hence lt being highest paid position after qb) we are going to have hurries pressure and sacks regardless of the interiors level of play.
              If the interior pancake and drive their assigned target to the ground through the whistle, but flowers or Hart struggles, the play is going to be negated really.

              An ol is a unit which plays as a whole but all it takes is one of the links to break down to catastrophically disrupt a play. We had the lt and RT who conceded the most pressures hits hurri3s and had the shortest time on avg to deliver the ball.


              For me, this makes it so abundantly clear the relevance it has on a pass game and how the offense will suffer as a result

              Remember flowers shoving the reporter? There's a reason he was frustrated: he play was poor and he was dragging down the entir3 offense.

              Unrelated note I believe Mac and Co are trying desperately to keep his confidence up otherwise he will fully bust beyond any question ..
              Very well said!

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              • #52
                Originally posted by Sarcasman View Post
                I get it, I just don't see how a team that succeeded at dictating nothing last year is all of a sudden going to start dictating stuff this year. It's largely the same team and just as importantly, the same HC.
                Adding a TE/FB and a receiver that can chip a LB is a big step for improvement. If the theories that Fluker is not an upgrade in talent are true. More bodies that can hit someone to open up the running game will make a difference.

                Last year we did not have a FB. There were questions to how will Donnell respond coming of neck injury.
                Both were problems . The TE situation was just an all around blocking nightmare. Add the Whitlock situation, that is 2 pieces that that had an affect on the outcome of games. The rest of the Offensive blocking components , the staff knew what they had.

                The Giants don't have those questions so far this season. Reese has addressed some of the missing aspects to help move the ball on the ground. From what I see so far the most pressing issues in the much needed blocking help have been addressed so far in FA. Not big moves but moves the will make a difference . Now lets see what is added with the Draft.
                The power of accurate observation is commonly called cynicism by those who have not got it.

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