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  1. #31
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    Quote Originally Posted by Eliscruzzz View Post
    your going to sit there and say he wasn't stuck behind Witten? Come on man you can't be that blind I know your excited about you team this year but you got problems at safety this year and you did nothing to fix that offensive line they are right the divison this year is between the Giants and the Eagles you guys are the over hyped team that is suppose to win every year but don't. they say you guys got better cause you got carr and claborne, which I think is ridiculous cause he's a rookie and we have a 1st round drafted corner Princ who will be better in his second year but yet you guys gett all the hype trust me giant fans know if there is one weak spot in your secondary then you will have some problems with the pass and carr play along side with flowers in K.C. so before you guys think he is the next Revis let's see how he does by himself and he also faced a lot of weak qb's in the AFC I think you guys are overvaluing Carr. you also said winning the SB means nothing this year it does when you bring back most of the team that won it and that won 6 straight at the end of the season. I know we were 9-7 but you were 8-8 also.
    1. I've already explained to you how Bennett wasn't stuck behind Witten in a different thread.

    2. Our problems at safety began once Barry Church went down with an injury-- he's healthy now. Also, we drafted a hard hitting/pass covering safety with some of the best measurables in the draft. He needs time transition, so there is also the signing of Brodney Pool (who was unfortunatley mentioned earlier in this thread)

    3. First, we hired one of the best OL coaches in the league with Callahan. We swapped the tackles on the O'line now that the very young (but very good) Tyron Smith is ready-- watch for the battles between he and JPP for years to come. Doug Free is back to playing his more natural position at RT, where he was phenomenal in 2009. On the interior, I'd like to say we've gotten healthy, but we're getting stuck with injuries again. A bit of a set back, but nothing permanent-- also we added Nate Livings, McKenzie Bernadeau, and UFA Ron Leary (who looks to be beastly, but has a degenerative knee condition). It may not be the strongest o'line, and it may be one of our weakest positions, but it won't be weak. It will be better than last year. I'd say we did a lot to help strengthening our O'line... what did you guys do to fix yours?

    4. Yes, we did get better. I personally am not expecting Claiborne to start right off the bat, but he contributes to the depth. A healthy Jenkins and Carr is a huge upgrade over Old Newman and Jenkins when he can't lift his arm above his head.

    And while Carr was considered the 2nd corner behind Flowers, Carr has consistently gotten better each year and last year was better than flowers. It's the reason why Detroit wanted no part in the match up between Calvin Johnson and Carr last year, and opted to have Megatron line up opposite flowers instead (he wasn't getting it done against Calvin) . Carr held his own against the best passing division last year, the NFCN. We don't need him to be the next Revis. We just need he and the new core of CBs to give Spencer an extra tick to get to the QB-- Don't forget about the guy opposit Ware.
    Last edited by Ntegrase96; 08-03-2012 at 11:30 AM.

  2. #32
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    Quote Originally Posted by JPP View Post
    I don't agree with this we lost our starting MLB and CB were lost. Like you began mentioning we really only had both Osi and Tuck healthy, or at least in Tuck's case playing better, late in the season. As well we lost both our 1st and 2nd round picks in camp to injury, Austin for the season, and with TT already out and Prince, who was the quality depth we added in case of major injury. After that sure you can dismiss our other injuries as just depth guys but after losing some starters and their quality backups our secondary was scary thin and one of many contributing factors to our mid-season losing streak. We did have WR injuries, though not major, but that isn't what opened up Cruz's spot he was getting a shot anyway after losing Smith and Boss,
    I consider the worst injuries to be to Osi and TT. I, myself, didn't see the Goff injury to be all that detrimental. Now if it had've been Boley or Kiwi, I'd be more understanding.

    Right, I get that you guys are getting players back... But to count Amukamara and Austin as losses seems a bit odd to me. They never took a snap with your team prior to that, so really what did you actually 'lose'. If that makes sense.

    That's like saying the Cowboys lost Bruce Carter last year.

    I thought Cruz got a shot because Hixon was done and the stunted growth of Barden because of injuries in the past. Not to mention, wasn't the first real action Cruz got because Manningham was out? I agree Cruz probably would have cracked the roster eventually, but the reason he got there so soon (presumably in time to save the season) was because of injuries to other players, no?

    Let me be clear, I'm not trying to be dismissive about the injuries... I'm just saying, all things equal, a lot of teams were in the same position and your injuries weren't as bad as a lot of people make them seem around here. There were a lot, yes. But I'd say they don't have the impact of, say a hypothetical team that lost a starting QB and Premier pass rusher... like the Texans. Losing Coe and other no names for CB depth sucks, but it just does not compare.
    Last edited by Ntegrase96; 08-03-2012 at 11:36 AM.

  3. #33
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    Quote Originally Posted by Ntegrase96 View Post
    I consider the worst injuries to be to Osi and TT. I, myself, didn't see the Goff injury to be all that detrimental. Now if it had've been Boley or Kiwi, I'd be more understanding.

    Right, I get that you guys are getting players back... But to count Amukamara and Austin as losses seems a bit odd to me. They never took a snap with your team prior to that, so really what did you actually 'lose'. If that makes sense.

    That's like saying the Cowboys lost Bruce Carter last year.

    I thought Cruz got a shot because Hixon was done and the stunted growth of Barden because of injuries in the past. Not to mention, wasn't the first real action Cruz got because Manningham was out? I agree Cruz probably would have cracked the roster eventually, but the reason he got there so soon (presumably in time to save the season) was because of injuries to other players, no?

    Let me be clear, I'm not trying to be dismissive about the injuries... I'm just saying, all things equal, a lot of teams were in the same position and your injuries weren't as bad as a lot of people make them seem around here. There were a lot, yes. But I'd say they don't have the impact of, say a hypothetical team that lost a starting QB and Premier pass rusher... like the Texans. Losing Coe and other no names for CB depth sucks, but it just does not compare.
    Yeah but like I said our starting MLB at that point we didn't even have Chase Blackburn, who was off teaching grade schoolers math. Just because he isn't an all-pro doesn't mean it wasn't a huge blow to the middle of our defense an area that was already weak.

    Austin to a lesser extent but it also really sucked for him to lose yet another year of football, but Prince for sure should be viewed as a detrimental loss. People were hoping he would get to make a bit of an impact and help rearrange our secondary a bit but instead as soon as he signs his deal he goes down so he can't even practise in training camp(what was left). When he was selected he was widely viewed as next in line and added a really quality depth piece in case of injury, well that didn't work out so well and instead Role had to adjust his position in the defence which he struggled with until later down the stretch. But for sure you can make the argument you never now if they would have been useful, but Prince was down the stretch, plus wasn't Bruce Carter already injured when you drafted him? If so not quite as comparable; already injured 2nd rounder vs losing both your 1st and 2nd rounders. It would be like me saying that if you guys lost Claiborne that it doesn't count as a major injury because he hasn't played, even though it would complete change things around on your defense. I realise the difference between a top 10 pick and 19th but it is no more ridiculous then your Bruce Carter comparison.

    Yea I think in those games yes he was slide up because of some banged up WR(which only goes to prove my point about the ridiculous amount of injuries we sustained) but arguing whether he would've/could've made the same impact if he got his chance a couple games later seems kind of pie in the sky so I'll just concede this because there is no way to prove otherwise.

    I didn't argue we had the worst injuries I just think they were in total some pretty devastating things we had to overcome, not just to make the playoffs but to win a Superbowl. And the Texans suffered their injuries pretty late in the season in a pretty weak division. Obviously we had so good fortune with everybody coming together when they did but in reality you could argue we were without our premier pass rusher for most of the season, between Tuck being out/banged up and Osi missing games. If we lost our QB like Houston we wouldn't have got anywhere but that doesn't mean our injuries weren't bad.
    Last edited by JPP; 08-04-2012 at 02:32 PM.

  4. #34
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    Quote Originally Posted by Ntegrase96 View Post
    and so was Tuck at times, but you never really lost any valuable player for long stretches.
    Beg to disagree, neck injury the entire season. The other injuries just piled on,
    groin, ankle, shoulder, back, and toe. Not to mention his pride took a huge ding,
    making him a shell of himself for most of the year. Right or wrong, he said "I suck",
    and he did when his head wasn't in it.

    That and players like Goff, who were just adequate. What do you get when your
    adequate players go down, most times you get way less than that because if you
    had anything better than adequate, they would be playing already.

  5. #35
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    Quote Originally Posted by JPP View Post
    Yeah but like I said our starting MLB at that point we didn't even have Chase Blackburn, who was off teaching grade schoolers math. Just because he isn't an all-pro doesn't mean it wasn't a huge blow to the middle of our defense an area that was already weak.

    Austin to a lesser extent but it also really sucked for him to lose yet another year of football, but Prince for sure should be viewed as a detrimental loss. People were hoping he would get to make a bit of an impact and help rearrange our secondary a bit but instead as soon as he signs his deal he goes down so he can't even practise in training camp(what was left). When he was selected he was widely viewed as next in line and added a really quality depth piece in case of injury, well that didn't work out so well and instead Role had to adjust his position in the defence which he struggled with until later down the stretch. But for sure you can make the argument you never now if they would have been useful, but Prince was down the stretch, plus wasn't Bruce Carter already injured when you drafted him? If so not quite as comparable; already injured 2nd rounder vs losing both your 1st and 2nd rounders. It would be like me saying that if you guys lost Claiborne that it doesn't count as a major injury because he hasn't played, even though it would complete change things around on your defense. I realise the difference between a top 10 pick and 19th but it is no more ridiculous then your Bruce Carter comparison.

    Yea I think in those games yes he was slide up because of some banged up WR(which only goes to prove my point about the ridiculous amount of injuries we sustained) but arguing whether he would've/could've made the same impact if he got his chance a couple games later seems kind of pie in the sky so I'll just concede this because there is no way to prove otherwise.

    I didn't argue we had the worst injuries I just think they were in total some pretty devastating things we had to overcome, not just to make the playoffs but to win a Superbowl. And the Texans suffered their injuries pretty late in the season in a pretty weak division. Obviously we had so good fortune with everybody coming together when they did but in reality you could argue we were without our premier pass rusher for most of the season, between Tuck being out/banged up and Osi missing games. If we lost our QB like Houston we wouldn't have got anywhere but that doesn't mean our injuries weren't bad.
    Yeah, Bruce Carter was already injured, but the thought was that he would recover mid season. I see what you mean by it not being the same. You obviously can't count on a guy that was already injured, whereas Amukamara wasn't injured and expected to make an impact. Still though, in my opinion, Amukamara was an unknown quantity that you couldn't really account for. It's not the same thing as losing a for sure starter. I think that losing Claiborne would be more comparable, however I won't feel like we 'lost anything'. Claiborne could end up being a bust and I, for one, am not expecting him to make a huge impact the way Mike Jenkins would if he were to be out for the year. But we may just see things differently.

    Don't get me wrong, I'm not saying that your injuries were a walk in the park. I'm saying in the grand scheme of things a lot of teams were beat up last year and it all seemed to balance out. Yes, you were beat up. But you were beat up in a forgiving part of the season as well. And no, the Texans lost Johnson in week 4, Williams week 5, and Schaub in week 10-- all for the season, and not exactly early.

  6. #36
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    Quote Originally Posted by OX1 View Post
    Beg to disagree, neck injury the entire season. The other injuries just piled on,
    groin, ankle, shoulder, back, and toe. Not to mention his pride took a huge ding,
    making him a shell of himself for most of the year. Right or wrong, he said "I suck",
    and he did when his head wasn't in it.

    That and players like Goff, who were just adequate. What do you get when your
    adequate players go down, most times you get way less than that because if you
    had anything better than adequate, they would be playing already.
    What are you disagreeing with? I said Tuck was banged up.

    That's true and is a very valid point. However, 'adequate players' are easier to replace. It works both ways.

  7. #37
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    Update: Brodney Poole, one of the guys to fail the conditioning test was cut, even though he, Felix Jones, and Andre Holmes all passed it a few days later.

  8. #38
    Quote Originally Posted by Ntegrase96 View Post
    What are you disagreeing with? I said Tuck was banged up.
    He was more than banged up; he was questioning whether he even belonged on the field and sounded like he was an inch from going on IR. Heck, he sounded like he was going to quit football. I was watching my favorite player unravel before my eyes.

    Then he found the inner strength when coach told him "Just give me everything you've got." And became the leader he was unsuccessfully trying to be since Strahan left.

  9. #39
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    Why, ShakeAndBake, do you care about media perception? Why do you want to be favored this year? Does it even matter? Another thing that annoys me is when people transfer the media praise about a team in to fan praise. None of us Cowboy fans predict greatness this year. I'm not sure where people get that from. We've been humbled enough the past several years, we're not as confident as you think we are. So yeah, don't pretend we thump our chests and make claims like Jerry Jones does (Which is his job, he has to positively market his team to the fans).

    Anyway, back to my original point. Why would you want to be praised and predicted to win it all in the off-season? How did that work out for Philly last year? How has it worked out for us in years past? It's a bad omen if anything. Be glad you get to fly under the radar.

  10. #40
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    Quote Originally Posted by Eliscruzzz View Post
    your going to sit there and say he wasn't stuck behind Witten? Come on man you can't be that blind I know your excited about you team this year but you got problems at safety this year and you did nothing to fix that offensive line they are right the divison this year is between the Giants and the Eagles you guys are the over hyped team that is suppose to win every year but don't. they say you guys got better cause you got carr and claborne, which I think is ridiculous cause he's a rookie and we have a 1st round drafted corner Princ who will be better in his second year but yet you guys gett all the hype trust me giant fans know if there is one weak spot in your secondary then you will have some problems with the pass and carr play along side with flowers in K.C. so before you guys think he is the next Revis let's see how he does by himself and he also faced a lot of weak qb's in the AFC I think you guys are overvaluing Carr. you also said winning the SB means nothing this year it does when you bring back most of the team that won it and that won 6 straight at the end of the season. I know we were 9-7 but you were 8-8 also.
    No, he wasn't 'stuck' behind Witten because he did get opportunities and whenever he got those opportunities it usually winded up as a negative play. If he truly was a great player or had the potential to be it would have become apparent in his stay with the Cowboys and it didn't.

    Various drops and one drop in particular vs you guys that went straight through his hands and bobbled it out for an INT for your team. Hopefully he can give us some of those. Go Youtube for "Martellus Bennett highlights" see how much you get back.

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