[quote user="JPizzack"]
So, what happened to this bill when we had a repub in office for 8 years? or with a repub majority? Seems like it would have made it in somehow, no?</p>[/quote]
I think he's talking about the Privatizing Health Care bill which was under Bush...Democratic House/Senate never got passed...Obama was Democratic House/Senate for most of his first term as well....plus he would have out right vetoed that bill.
[quote user="Morehead State"]
The problem is that SS is not a retirement plan. You don't put in and then get it back. The money that goes in now, goes to retirees NOW. It isn't held for you. The surplus (as I said) is sent to the general fund to create the illusion of a smaller deficit. But the fund is now going back into the red and the $2.6T surplus accumulated since the early 80's has been spent and replaced by IOU's from the general fund back to the SS fund. Its a foolish shell game.</P>
Save your money Pizz..thats all I'm saying.</P>
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no i know exactly how it works...
but like daven said...i consider that money lost..but if i could keep what is taken from here on out, and maintain retirement myself....i totally could/ would</P>
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[quote user="byron"]] It all boils down to the two parties coming/working together to come up with plan "good plan"/laws that will work for the people they serve ....there has to be compromise and such for that to happen.... Its to left and right and its killing this country because the will to work together just isn't there ....the people of this country need these ****s tostop playing politics and get thisthing straightened up....[/quote]
Not in this case Byron....economically we are so far gone that there can be no compromise at this point, we can compromise elsewhere and at other times...but there are times throughout the course of history where one side must stand up and fight...the must not let what they know is wrong...and bad for EVERYONE happen...
this is one of those times...it's not fear mongering it's the truth at this point.
[quote user="JPizzack"][quote user="DavenIII"][quote user="JPizzack"]hell.****ing.yes
If someone told me I had to take all my SS money and put it into a retirement account.[/quote]</P>
at this point I'm willing to just give up on what I've payed into SS for 15 years....just so I don't have to do it for another 40...**** it they can have however many thousands (Tens of Thousands?) of dollars I've payed in...I don't care...I'm never getting it back anyhow....just let me stop paying..please.
[/quote]</P>
+1</P>
i forget what my last statement said, but it was a depressing total.</P>
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The GOP would do it in a minute. </P>
You don't get it. The more the Dem's can "give you" things, the more political power they have. The more they can convince you that you "need them". Thats why they will never allow you to take control of your own retirement by not giving them their SS payments.</P>
When the control of the lives goes back more and more to the people of this country, the less power they have to sell you on the notion that you need them.</P>
The essential difference between Dems and the GOP is simple. The GOP believes in people and the power that liberty can bring in economic growth and real justice. The Dems believe that the power of government should mitigate the power of the individual. In other words, the GOP believes in people and the Dems don't.</P>
And I was a Dem for most of my life. It took a while for me to see it. I was you when I way your age.</P>
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[quote user="JPizzack"]
no i know exactly how it works...
but like daven said...i consider that money lost..but if i could keep what is taken from here on out, and maintain retirement myself....i totally could/ would</p>[/quote]
the problem is, because the government spent the surplus (which they weren't supposed to do) there is nothing there besides what we put in pizz, If we stop paying now...Byron won't collect...
it's a ****ty situation...it was never supposed to get to that point.
[quote user="DavenIII"][quote user="JPizzack"]
So, what happened to this bill when we had a repub in office for 8 years? or with a repub majority? Seems like it would have made it in somehow, no?</P>
[/quote]
I think he's talking about the Privatizing Health Care bill which was under Bush...Democratic House/Senate never got passed...Obama was Democratic House/Senate for most of his first term as well....plus he would have out right vetoed that bill.
[/quote]</P>
Thats not what I'm talking about. I'm talking about a proposal to allow people voluntarily to have 10% of their SS payments go into a private fund. If my memory is right, it started under Clinton. But I could be wrong about the timing. Point is that you need 60 senators to do it.</P>
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[quote user="dezzzR"][quote user="JPizzack"]I would agree 100% to that....IF we didnt have to pay into Social Security.
I'm already in a high tax bracket. How much of my actual income am I supposed to live on? I already lose 39% in taxes, SSand deductions (some of which I myself choose to like life insurance, my medical insurances, 401k etc.). If i keep increasing my contributions (which btw, are not guaranteed growth), I can't really afford to live anything other than a paycheck to paycheck lifestyle.
Now, most regular bank/CU IRAs are guaranteed/insured. but 1) interest rates are absolute **** right now, and B) youre either taxed up front (roth) or at withdrawal(traditional).
So how do middle and midlowclass effectively plan for retirement? And god forbid you have kids! lol[/quote]Rich or poor, giving the gov 40% of what you make is ludicrous!
[/quote]</P>
lmao...learn to read dezz...i said i dont see 40% of my income because of taxes, SS, AND my own personal deductions like medical benefits, life insurance, and my 401k.</P>
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[quote user="Morehead State"][quote user="byron"][quote user="DavenIII"][quote user="Morehead State"]
The Repulicans offered a bill several years ago that would give a tax payer the option of having a part of their SS tax put in a fund that would be invested in safe funds. These accounts would be the property of the taxpayer and could be willed. They can't be confiscated by the government for any reason.</P>
The Democratic response was that the GOP wanted to throw old people in the street. You have just proposed the exact same program. There is hope for you.</P>
[/quote]
I remember that, I was so disappointed, I thought that bill was a step in the right direction, but Democratic fear mongering killed it
[/quote] It all boils down to the two parties coming/working together to come up with plan "good plan"/laws that will work for the people they serve ....there has to be compromise and such for that to happen.... Its to left and right and its killing this country because the will to work together just isn't there ....the people of this country need these ****s tostop playing politics and get thisthing straightened up....[/quote]</P>
The "compromise" the Dems want will still bankrupt the country. Just may take a year or two longer.</P>
The reality is that there is a fundamental difference in philosophy between the parties. It has been enhanced by the horrible condition of our fiscal house. There has to be a fight about this.</P>
Entitlements must be completely overhauled, but the Dems are only willing to nip around the edges.</P>
The basic disagreement is that the GOP doesn't think the government (in other words taxpayers)should be in the business of giving money to people who don't need it. The Dems do. The GOP wants a safety net for those who need it but not a cradle to grave entitlement society as the Dems want.</P>
As I said, this is worth fighting for.</P>[/quote] you what I'm in over my head here,I don't care about philosophies "no disrespect meant here" and sure there should be a fight, no good policy would come without one ...just get it done ...get going in the right direction and tweak things as you go make it better don't let it grow into a monstrous pig....There is no excuse for letting SS getting out of hand the way it is now ...they should have been tweaking that thing since it conception...whatever I bow out..
I remember being 17, and having no grasp of the economy or politics...just trying to finish school and go to college....and all this talk about "What will be done with the social security surplus??" and even abck then thinking to myself "oh god, if they are discussing this, we're already ****ed, arent we..."</P>
let that **** be, it's not yours!!</P>
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[quote user="Morehead State"][quote user="DavenIII"][quote user="JPizzack"]
So, what happened to this bill when we had a repub in office for 8 years? or with a repub majority? Seems like it would have made it in somehow, no?</p>
[/quote]
I think he's talking about the Privatizing Health Care bill which was under Bush...Democratic House/Senate never got passed...Obama was Democratic House/Senate for most of his first term as well....plus he would have out right vetoed that bill.
[/quote]</p>
Thats not what I'm talking about. I'm talking about a proposal to allow people voluntarily to have 10% of their SS payments go into a private fund. If my memory is right, it started under Clinton. But I could be wrong about the timing. Point is that you need 60 senators to do it.</p>[/quote]
Oh, well then I don't remember that I was definetly thinking about when Bush pushed for privatizing it during his second term, I wasn't as interested in politics during Clinton unfortunately, I think Bush admitted that his biggest mistake during his time as president was his inability to privatize SS.
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